Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Tot-girl left for coyotes by dad? Are bone remains of American tourist Robyn Gardner? Help us ID Little boy!

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Tot-girl left for coyotes by dad? Are bone remains of American tourist Robyn Gardner? Help us ID Little boy! · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Climb Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel
0:09
Speaker 1: one thirty two. The boy was found here on the beach.
0:13
Speaker 1: How he ended up here and what happened to him
0:15
Speaker 1: still a mystery. That a child is approximately three to
0:17
Speaker 1: five years old. He's about three feet tall. He has
0:19
Speaker 1: brown eyes and dark black hair. Investigators still can't say
0:23
Speaker 1: what happened to him, who he is, or how he
0:26
Speaker 1: got here. But he knows this kid, whether it's a
0:28
Speaker 1: family member, a friend, daycare provider, a teacher, a next
0:31
Speaker 1: door neighbor, guide, the grocery store that's seen this kid
0:34
Speaker 1: come in. Somebody somewhere here has seen this child. He
0:37
Speaker 1: was found naked. What's unusual is that no one has
0:40
Speaker 1: reported him miss missing, at least not that they've been
0:42
Speaker 1: able to determine at this point. They've been talking to
0:44
Speaker 1: the Center for Missing and Exploited Children and they have
0:47
Speaker 1: no reports of a child gone missing that matches this description.
0:52
Speaker 1: At this hour, police desperately trying to identify a child
0:57
Speaker 1: who has washed up dead on the beach. Repeat. A
1:02
Speaker 1: little boy between three and five years old, naked body
1:06
Speaker 1: has washed up on Stewart Beach in Texas. I Meancy Grace.
1:12
Speaker 1: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us.
1:16
Speaker 1: The child's body was discovered naked and already decomposing on Friday,
1:21
Speaker 1: but as of right now, no identity on this little boy.
1:26
Speaker 1: How can that be? How can a child, a little
1:28
Speaker 1: boy between ages three and five, be missing and nobody
1:33
Speaker 1: knows about it, be dead and no one knows about it?
1:38
Speaker 1: Can we get a cause of death? Can we get
1:40
Speaker 1: an identity on this child? How bad is the decomposure?
1:43
Speaker 1: Will it make it impossible to determine who this child is?
1:47
Speaker 1: If you can get d n A, you've got to
1:48
Speaker 1: have something to match it too, in order to figure
1:52
Speaker 1: out who is this boy and what happened to him?
1:57
Speaker 1: Joining me is Joseph Scott Morgan, death investigator and professor
2:02
Speaker 1: of forensics at Jacksonville State University. Also with me, Crime
2:07
Speaker 1: Online editor and reporter Lee Egan, writer Crime Online, Jody Jamieson,
2:13
Speaker 1: and Alan Duke joining me from l A straight out
2:16
Speaker 1: to Jody Jamison, I want to first start with how
2:20
Speaker 1: the body was found. For those of you just joining us,
2:23
Speaker 1: a little boy's body has just washed ashore on a
2:27
Speaker 1: Texas beach. We want to help identify this child and
2:30
Speaker 1: find out what happened to him, Jody, what do we
2:33
Speaker 1: know about how the body was found? So all we
2:35
Speaker 1: know right now is that he was found about twenty
2:40
Speaker 1: ft from the water. He was naked, but he wasn't
2:43
Speaker 1: very decomposed. Um they said the most trauma to the
2:46
Speaker 1: body was from the surf from the sand, so there
2:49
Speaker 1: wasn't that much trauma. Not that much trauma. But the
2:51
Speaker 1: child is dead. Where the trauma come from? Was the
2:56
Speaker 1: child killed and thrown into the water. Did the child
3:00
Speaker 1: drowned somewhere? And it was, But that doesn't make sense
3:02
Speaker 1: to me, to Alandu, Why would a child drown under
3:07
Speaker 1: innocent reasons? And no one ever reported. The boy is
3:11
Speaker 1: thought to be no older than five years old. To
3:15
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, I was trying to figure out how
3:19
Speaker 1: he was found. He was actually found around five thirty
3:22
Speaker 1: in the afternoon. A forensic sketch artist has been brought
3:26
Speaker 1: on board to try and do a recreation of what
3:29
Speaker 1: the boy may look like. I want to talk to you,
3:32
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, you're the death investigator. What we can
3:36
Speaker 1: learn from this body? Can I just talk to you
3:39
Speaker 1: one moment, Joe Scott about what we already know. We
3:42
Speaker 1: know that if a child has drowned innocently fell off
3:46
Speaker 1: a cruise ship, fell off a family boat into the water,
3:50
Speaker 1: and they couldn't save him, there would be a coast
3:53
Speaker 1: guard announcement, there would be a search for the child.
3:56
Speaker 1: That is not what happened. The circumstances are are troubling
4:00
Speaker 1: at best, Nancy. We've got, uh, not just the body
4:05
Speaker 1: of a small child, but we've got the naked body
4:08
Speaker 1: of a small child. What in the world is a
4:10
Speaker 1: child doing floating around the water out there without clothes on?
4:13
Speaker 1: Uh and uh in kind of a kind of an
4:16
Speaker 1: isolated area by himself. Uh. And there's there's really no
4:21
Speaker 1: evidence around. What's really gonna be a major clue here
4:26
Speaker 1: is what is the medical examiner going to come back
4:28
Speaker 1: with on this particular case. There's all kinds of things
4:30
Speaker 1: that could have happened, Uh, a kind of head trauma.
4:34
Speaker 1: Maybe we would look for things like a prompt injury
4:37
Speaker 1: from a boat. Uh. Lord only knows what's going on.
4:39
Speaker 1: And I think that as time goes by, medical examiner
4:42
Speaker 1: is going to give us more information. You know, no offense,
4:45
Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morrigan, but I'm looking for more from you beside,
4:48
Speaker 1: the Lord only knows what's going on. That is true,
4:52
Speaker 1: and that's a given in every scenario. But we have
4:56
Speaker 1: been given the brains to figure out a few things
4:59
Speaker 1: on our own, Joe Scott. And let's start with the
5:01
Speaker 1: fact that this child has not reported missing. Let's start
5:04
Speaker 1: with the fact that no drowning has been reported. Okay,
5:08
Speaker 1: Let's start with the fact that the body it's already decomposing,
5:11
Speaker 1: so that gives me a timeline. Let's go with the
5:14
Speaker 1: fact that he's naked, as you pointed out. So all
5:18
Speaker 1: that together is telling me homicide. A child doesn't fall
5:23
Speaker 1: into the water naked, not get reported missing or at sea,
5:29
Speaker 1: and then wash up by innocent reasons. Now, is anybody
5:34
Speaker 1: on this serious program right now that disagrees with that?
5:38
Speaker 1: Can you think of any scenario, any innocent scenario, Joe
5:43
Speaker 1: Scott Morgan that says innocent scenario? No, No, And I
5:48
Speaker 1: think one of one of the things that my mind
5:51
Speaker 1: kind of flies to with this is this, is this
5:52
Speaker 1: a body of a child that has been dumped? Uh,
5:55
Speaker 1: you know, and why would why would the child be new?
5:58
Speaker 1: This is one of the things that's death investigators we
5:59
Speaker 1: would look for if someone could have stripped the body
6:01
Speaker 1: and dumped the body as a result of some kind
6:04
Speaker 1: of homicidal event. Taking the taking the clothing, because this
6:08
Speaker 1: whole's evidence, doesn't it where the child is from, what
6:11
Speaker 1: the child endured? Uh? What? What? What was the child
6:14
Speaker 1: subject to? They've attempted to strip away any layer of
6:16
Speaker 1: evidence or identifications that the child might have on the Remember,
6:19
Speaker 1: you know, small child is not going to be easily identifiable.
6:22
Speaker 1: They don't have permanent teeth, particularly at this age. There's
6:25
Speaker 1: a real good chance that we're not gonna be able
6:27
Speaker 1: to do fingerprints. Let me go to Jody Jamison, Jody
6:30
Speaker 1: a for music. Sketch artist has created an image of
6:33
Speaker 1: the boy and police are hoping to use this to
6:35
Speaker 1: try to ide him. What do we know about the sketch?
6:39
Speaker 1: He's about um, three or five years old. He's about
6:41
Speaker 1: three feet tall. Um. They say he might be Hispanic.
6:45
Speaker 1: He has black hair and brown eyes, full up eyelashes.
6:48
Speaker 1: He's cute little thing. But that's about all they help
6:51
Speaker 1: on him so far. What do we know about the
6:53
Speaker 1: area where he was found? To you leave egan joining
6:56
Speaker 1: me from crime online? What do we know about that area?
6:59
Speaker 1: Nothing else found, No evidence whatsoever except for this little boy.
7:02
Speaker 1: He was found off of Seawall Boulevard, Galveston Island. It's
7:07
Speaker 1: kind of a remote area. Um, that's pretty much all
7:10
Speaker 1: we know. There was no evidence found with him, just
7:13
Speaker 1: just his little body that washed the shore. To Allen Duke,
7:16
Speaker 1: I want to go over the discovery of his body.
7:19
Speaker 1: I'm still not clear on who found the child's body.
7:23
Speaker 1: Galveston police say it was somebody just walking down the
7:26
Speaker 1: beach on Friday evening, just taking an evening stroll on
7:29
Speaker 1: the beach in an area that's not heavily trafficked. Spotted
7:33
Speaker 1: the body floating in the surfing called nine one one.
7:35
Speaker 1: And this is what a police detective in Galveston told
7:39
Speaker 1: reporters over the weekend as they released this sketch that
7:43
Speaker 1: they put out to the public hoping that someone would
7:45
Speaker 1: identify this boy. Absolutely so. The child is approximately three
7:49
Speaker 1: to five years old. He's about three feet tall. He
7:52
Speaker 1: has brown eyes and dark black hair. Hair is about
7:55
Speaker 1: three to four inches in length. Um. The child weighed
7:57
Speaker 1: about if we had to, There's a slender build, probably
8:00
Speaker 1: about thirty pounds. He's a pretty skinny kid. Um, but
8:04
Speaker 1: that's that's what I as farn As description he's currently
8:07
Speaker 1: he does appear to be of Hispanic origin. UM. So
8:10
Speaker 1: we're not exactly sure exactly where, but there definitely is
8:13
Speaker 1: some Hispanic within know influx or influence rather um in
8:17
Speaker 1: there for missing children and boat uh that overturned through everything.
8:27
Speaker 1: Absolutely yeah, absolutely, I mean as soon as as we
8:30
Speaker 1: got out there, we started searching our own missing person database.
8:33
Speaker 1: We contacted every agency in the surrounding county, in this
8:36
Speaker 1: county and surrounding counties, We talked to every federal agency
8:39
Speaker 1: we could. We talked to the Center for Missing and
8:41
Speaker 1: Exploited Children to see if their database could show up anything.
8:44
Speaker 1: And of course we contacted the Coast Guard to see
8:46
Speaker 1: if one that they had had any reports of missing
8:48
Speaker 1: people and to to alert them so that if they
8:50
Speaker 1: did get any reports of any overturned boats and overboards,
8:53
Speaker 1: any missing people, um, that they would they would key
8:56
Speaker 1: in on on any any kind of child that might
8:59
Speaker 1: might fit that description. Body knows this kid, whether it's
9:01
Speaker 1: a family member, a friend, daycare provider, a teacher, a
9:05
Speaker 1: next door neighbor, got at the grocery store that's seen
9:09
Speaker 1: this kid come in. Somebody somewhere here is seeing this
9:11
Speaker 1: child to Jody Jamison joining us. Jody, I'm looking at
9:18
Speaker 1: the police sketch and they've done it in color. Now
9:22
Speaker 1: what we're seeing is a little boy with brown hair
9:27
Speaker 1: and brown eyes. But yet, Jody, that doesn't miss match
9:32
Speaker 1: anyone that is missing in Texas or the US. We've
9:37
Speaker 1: seen this in the past, when bodies are found and
9:40
Speaker 1: the child has been murdered, the parents don't report the
9:44
Speaker 1: child missing for obvious reasons. What are police saying about
9:49
Speaker 1: who this child might be? At this point, all they're
9:53
Speaker 1: saying is that they are um looking at every possibility.
9:57
Speaker 1: The fact that he was twenty miles from the surf,
10:00
Speaker 1: that doesn't mean anything to them because the tide rises
10:02
Speaker 1: and faults. The fact that he was naked doesn't mean
10:04
Speaker 1: anything to him because they've seen drowning victims thrown up
10:07
Speaker 1: on the beach naked. How they're clothes pulled off of
10:11
Speaker 1: them within ten minutes. So at this point they're they're
10:14
Speaker 1: saying nothing. They're being very vague as they're continuing to
10:17
Speaker 1: look for what could possibly have happened. We know that
10:21
Speaker 1: the boy's little body was found lying in the sand
10:24
Speaker 1: on Galveston Island around five thirty in the afternoon. This
10:28
Speaker 1: is according to police, an unidentified caller contact to police
10:33
Speaker 1: after seeing quote an object near the water and discovered
10:37
Speaker 1: it was the body of a small child when they
10:40
Speaker 1: got closer to inspect it. Now we know the Galveston
10:44
Speaker 1: p D has contacted one of the most experienced forensics
10:48
Speaker 1: artists in the nation and that is how they came
10:51
Speaker 1: up with this drawing. It's by Lois Gibson, and many
10:55
Speaker 1: people in the let me just say crime finding community
10:58
Speaker 1: know her name very well. She rented the sketch of
11:01
Speaker 1: the child. The little boy is three ft paul. He's
11:04
Speaker 1: got a very slender bill with dark brown hair, brown eyes. Again,
11:10
Speaker 1: he's between three and five years old. Now, the Galveston
11:13
Speaker 1: p D have searched databases for missing children through local
11:18
Speaker 1: and federal agencies, but have found nothing. Joe Scott, what
11:22
Speaker 1: does that mean? That means that no one is looking
11:26
Speaker 1: for a child that fits this description. Uh. The other
11:29
Speaker 1: issue is how are they going to get this child identified?
11:33
Speaker 1: If there's no dental records and there's no fingerprints to
11:36
Speaker 1: be done, that's gonna lead us back to d n A.
11:39
Speaker 1: But still, if they can, which I don't doubt that
11:43
Speaker 1: they can. Uh. If they can harvest some d DNA
11:46
Speaker 1: from this child's remains, and they successfully uh create a
11:52
Speaker 1: chain that they can examine. Who are they going to
11:55
Speaker 1: compare it to? So it's it's incumbent that the public
11:58
Speaker 1: come forward in state that they know of a child
12:01
Speaker 1: that is missing or this child actually resembles somebody that
12:03
Speaker 1: they know. Anyone who is familiar with this child, please
12:08
Speaker 1: call the tip line four zero nine seven six five
12:12
Speaker 1: three seven seven six four oh nine seven six five
12:17
Speaker 1: three seven seven six or four oh nine seven six
12:21
Speaker 1: three tips T I P S. I want to pause
12:25
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Speaker 1: A three year old little girl absolutely gorgeous. As a
14:22
Speaker 1: matter of fact, the photo of her, I'm pretty sure
14:25
Speaker 1: she's wearing a little dress that I had for Lucy
14:28
Speaker 1: on Palm Sunday about three years ago. This little girl
14:33
Speaker 1: is so precious. The moment I saw her, I felt
14:37
Speaker 1: that she was just looking out at us, asking for help.
14:41
Speaker 1: The little girl's name is Sharon spelled s h E
14:44
Speaker 1: r i N, and she went missing. This is a
14:48
Speaker 1: story her father tells. He says that at three a m.
14:53
Speaker 1: Sharon wakes up and she refuses to drink her milk.
14:59
Speaker 1: To punish his three year old child for not drinking
15:02
Speaker 1: her milk, according to him, he sends her outside on
15:07
Speaker 1: the other side of the fence to stand under a
15:09
Speaker 1: large tree in an alley. Um The alley is known
15:15
Speaker 1: to be infested with coyotes. Now I've looked at their home,
15:20
Speaker 1: their home, the whole neighborhood looks like a lot of
15:24
Speaker 1: rich people live there. This is not out in the
15:26
Speaker 1: middle of nowhere. This is a spot in Texas where
15:32
Speaker 1: it looks like a gated community on a cul de sac,
15:35
Speaker 1: and then there are trees around it. If you look
15:38
Speaker 1: at it from above, like an aerial view. When I
15:41
Speaker 1: first saw it, I'm like, no way or their coyotes
15:44
Speaker 1: around this crib, around this McMansion. But when I look
15:47
Speaker 1: at it aerial style, I can see that there are
15:52
Speaker 1: trees and other undeveloped areas where the coyotes might live. Okay,
15:56
Speaker 1: back to what the father says. He says he sends
15:59
Speaker 1: them be out there to stand alone at three a m.
16:02
Speaker 1: As punishment for not drinking milk. He then decides to
16:07
Speaker 1: do the laundry. He turns neat neck at three am,
16:12
Speaker 1: he says, He goes back out to see Sharon in
16:14
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes, and when he goes back out, she's gone
16:20
Speaker 1: a frantic search in sues. I want to go now
16:24
Speaker 1: to Dave mac joining me, Syndicated talk show host Dave,
16:29
Speaker 1: it's taken a sudden turn the search for the missing body,
16:33
Speaker 1: hasn't it. It has um. They have yet to confirm
16:38
Speaker 1: that they have found the girl, but they're certainly serious
16:41
Speaker 1: thoughts in that direct. Okay, let me just break it down,
16:43
Speaker 1: because I don't know what you just said. A toad's
16:45
Speaker 1: body has just been found down a culvert not too
16:49
Speaker 1: far away from this now, Unless you guys know of
16:53
Speaker 1: another missing little girl. If I were a betting woman,
16:56
Speaker 1: I would put money on her body has been found.
17:00
Speaker 1: That's what I know. Lee Egan. Where was the body found?
17:03
Speaker 1: She was standing in half a mile away from family home.
17:07
Speaker 1: I thought, sure if they found anything else with her.
17:09
Speaker 1: Police about saying yet obviously, Um, it's her. I mean,
17:14
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna put it out there. They're waiting for
17:16
Speaker 1: the off topic. Let's go into the facts as we
17:18
Speaker 1: know them. Justice got more good death investigators joining me.
17:22
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, what do we know about the discovery of
17:24
Speaker 1: this body? I mean, it's her, Joe Scott. Yeah, I'd
17:27
Speaker 1: have to think that it is Nancy. And this is
17:29
Speaker 1: what I do know. Uh, the body, the body as
17:33
Speaker 1: yet has been unidentified, but into my way of thinking
17:37
Speaker 1: as a as a form of death investigator, uh, this
17:40
Speaker 1: body has been taken and hidden. Uh you know this,
17:44
Speaker 1: This child's body did not just accidentally wind up in
17:47
Speaker 1: the culvert and in this in this hidden area out
17:52
Speaker 1: of sight, and it took someone to come along and
17:54
Speaker 1: actually seek this body out and find the body in
17:57
Speaker 1: that specific location. Right now, we don't know what the
18:01
Speaker 1: cause of death is. That's not being released, and this
18:03
Speaker 1: is going to be a key piece of information to
18:05
Speaker 1: find out how this little child was brought to their end.
18:09
Speaker 1: When you hear culvert, Justice Scott Morgan, what what do
18:15
Speaker 1: you take that to mean? It means to me, Nancy,
18:19
Speaker 1: that this is out of sight, it's secluded, it's blocked
18:22
Speaker 1: away from common vision. It's not something that you would
18:25
Speaker 1: just see walking down the road. Somehow this child wound
18:29
Speaker 1: up in this location where they were hidden from view.
18:33
Speaker 1: And this is gonna be key if the investigators are
18:35
Speaker 1: gonna be pressing hard on this particular point because something
18:39
Speaker 1: has happened to this child to bring her to this end.
18:41
Speaker 1: I don't think that this is gonna have so much
18:43
Speaker 1: to do with Code's as it does other people. A covert, guys,
18:48
Speaker 1: is like a pipe, one of those big round pipes.
18:51
Speaker 1: They go under the road, so water will go under
18:55
Speaker 1: the road, as opposed to over the road, a tunnel
18:58
Speaker 1: carrying a stream or open dry under a road or railroad. Um,
19:03
Speaker 1: a watercol a watercourse, a conduit. It's a stream or
19:07
Speaker 1: a drain. That's what a culvert is. Now tell me something.
19:12
Speaker 1: Dave Max, indicated talk show host, I doubt very seriously
19:17
Speaker 1: that coyotes and that fifteen minute window. The father's telling
19:21
Speaker 1: us would have taken her and dragged her to a
19:24
Speaker 1: watery underground pipe. That did not happen. That is not
19:30
Speaker 1: what happened in this case. And this child was murdered.
19:35
Speaker 1: She did not get dragged off by coyotes. Nancy. The
19:38
Speaker 1: story that the dad tells from the very or the
19:40
Speaker 1: adoptive father tells from the very beginning, is one that
19:42
Speaker 1: makes it out for of course, for all benefiting him
19:45
Speaker 1: and what he's trying to sell, the bill of goods.
19:48
Speaker 1: The bottom line is none of what he says makes sense.
19:51
Speaker 1: None of us as a parent would do what he
19:53
Speaker 1: did or could justify it in any way, shape or form.
19:56
Speaker 1: And the reason her body was found two weeks later
19:59
Speaker 1: in a culvert is because she was stashed there so
20:01
Speaker 1: she couldn't be found. Another thing we know. Following up
20:05
Speaker 1: on what Dave McK is saying, Joe Scott Morrigan, what
20:08
Speaker 1: can you tell me about a mystery trip somebody in
20:11
Speaker 1: that home goes on. They take a trip at around
20:14
Speaker 1: three to four o'clock in the morning. And I think
20:18
Speaker 1: the way they're proving this, Joseph Scott Morrigan is through
20:21
Speaker 1: surveillance video from other homes in that high class neighborhood.
20:26
Speaker 1: The cameras are catching, uh, this vehicle that belonged at
20:30
Speaker 1: this home traveling away from the home, and what they
20:33
Speaker 1: believe is the car may have been gone for an
20:36
Speaker 1: extended period of time and then returned back. If you
20:39
Speaker 1: remember from our earlier conversation, our good friend Karen Smith
20:42
Speaker 1: had mentioned that one of the things the police might
20:44
Speaker 1: be looking at here is that they're going in after
20:46
Speaker 1: the chip, the chip in the car that will actually
20:49
Speaker 1: tell the police where this car was going, what was
20:52
Speaker 1: going on this sort of thing as far as tracking
20:55
Speaker 1: tracking of this vehicle, This is a big question for me.
20:58
Speaker 1: Where was the car going? Is Sharon's body inside of
21:02
Speaker 1: this car? Was she still alive at that time or
21:05
Speaker 1: at some point in time was she killed? Maybe she
21:07
Speaker 1: was killed in the vehicle and then placed in the
21:09
Speaker 1: secluded area inside of this culbrit As you previously mentioned,
21:12
Speaker 1: it was a maroon Accura SUV. We believe may have
21:18
Speaker 1: been owned by the Matthews family. That's Sharon Matthews family.
21:23
Speaker 1: I want to talk about this maroon Accura. I guarantee
21:27
Speaker 1: you in this neighborhood, Alan Duke, everybody on that street
21:32
Speaker 1: has got surveillance cameras and burglary alarms, burglar alarms, the works,
21:38
Speaker 1: and if they have one camera trained on the front
21:41
Speaker 1: porch or the front yard, it's gonna catch very easily
21:44
Speaker 1: an suv going by four o'clock in the morning. Alan, Yes,
21:48
Speaker 1: but as we've seen in other situations, you can have
21:51
Speaker 1: really good security camera video, yet you're unable to see
21:54
Speaker 1: who is actually inside of those vehicles. I'm thinking of
21:58
Speaker 1: the miss Wait, wait, let me get it. Let me
22:01
Speaker 1: understand that she did somebody report the Family Accurate missing,
22:04
Speaker 1: because I haven't heard that. So are you saying somebody
22:07
Speaker 1: else could have can stolen the Family Accurate suv, used
22:12
Speaker 1: it for one hour and brought it back secretly. Is
22:15
Speaker 1: that your theory? Ally, No, it's not my theory. But
22:17
Speaker 1: you don't know who's in there, the wife, the husband,
22:20
Speaker 1: or or maybe don't wife was asleep, right, so we
22:25
Speaker 1: don't know. But my point is the security camera video.
22:27
Speaker 1: Security camera video can raise questions, but doesn't necessarily show
22:31
Speaker 1: that the father was the one driving that car. It's
22:35
Speaker 1: you can only look at it and and and just
22:37
Speaker 1: surmise what it is. It's kind of a guess. Joe
22:40
Speaker 1: Scott am I either crazy one or is it Alan Duke?
22:44
Speaker 1: Because out of that family, the children can't drive. One
22:48
Speaker 1: of them is three and one of them is four.
22:51
Speaker 1: All right. The mother says she's asleep the whole time.
22:54
Speaker 1: The father agrees. That leaves one person that can drive
22:57
Speaker 1: the car and the father unless the coyotes did it.
23:00
Speaker 1: Some interesting conversations going in between the police and the
23:02
Speaker 1: parents right now. Somebody got in that Maroon Accurate that
23:05
Speaker 1: belongs to that family at four a m. Now, how
23:09
Speaker 1: do they know that, Joe Scott, I don't know that yet,
23:11
Speaker 1: but that's what police are saying. Somebody drove the family
23:15
Speaker 1: Accurate and police are asking for neighbors and area businesses
23:19
Speaker 1: to check their video to see footage of a Maroon
23:22
Speaker 1: Accurate SUV the one owned by the Matthews family. They
23:27
Speaker 1: police believe left the home between four and five am
23:30
Speaker 1: the day the little girl goes missing. I think they're
23:33
Speaker 1: gonna get digital information, and they probably already have it
23:37
Speaker 1: because if the person who took her body to where
23:39
Speaker 1: it went had a cell phone with them, I mean,
23:42
Speaker 1: like the air in Hernandez case, they were able to
23:45
Speaker 1: follow his exact footsteps because of the pings on the
23:48
Speaker 1: cell towers. They probably already have that information and they're
23:51
Speaker 1: probably closing in to Dave Max, indicated talk show host,
23:56
Speaker 1: joining me, did the family go to the vigil for
24:00
Speaker 1: a little Sharon? No? And the entire community came out,
24:04
Speaker 1: but they didn't. Why did I misunderstand these so called punishment?
24:08
Speaker 1: Why would you order a three year old child to
24:10
Speaker 1: stand outside by a tree at four o'clock in the morning.
24:14
Speaker 1: Three o'clock in the morning. He was just trying to
24:16
Speaker 1: come up with something, Nancy, that sounded right to him.
24:18
Speaker 1: You gotta remember, he didn't report her for five hours,
24:20
Speaker 1: and somehow, in his jacked up brain, it made sense
24:23
Speaker 1: for him to say that at three o'clock in the
24:25
Speaker 1: morning he tied her to a tree and then did
24:27
Speaker 1: laundry and didn't think to notify anybody that coyotes might
24:31
Speaker 1: have taken her away five hours earlier. Dave mac this
24:34
Speaker 1: is their adoptive child, and Sharon has had a very
24:40
Speaker 1: difficult life in those three short years. What do we know? Well,
24:44
Speaker 1: we know that that when she came to this family,
24:46
Speaker 1: she was malnourished severely. She had some mental handicap of
24:51
Speaker 1: some type. I don't know the extent. We know that
24:53
Speaker 1: she was not her first or her thirty six months
24:56
Speaker 1: of life were tortured and tiring, exhausting, and led to her.
25:00
Speaker 1: We know that she was malnourished, and we know that
25:03
Speaker 1: she had all sorts of developmental problems because of the
25:07
Speaker 1: way she was treated in India. Her birth parents left her.
25:12
Speaker 1: Her second set of parents abandoned her as well. She
25:16
Speaker 1: came to the US and she would sit at the
25:19
Speaker 1: adoption agency and there was an employee there, and when
25:22
Speaker 1: the little girl would see the employee show up for work,
25:25
Speaker 1: she would be waiting for hours on the steps and
25:28
Speaker 1: she'd run to that employee and call her nanny. She
25:31
Speaker 1: was so desperate for love. She came to America to
25:36
Speaker 1: have a better life, to find a family that loved her.
25:40
Speaker 1: And now she's dead. And I will absolutely not rest
25:44
Speaker 1: until I see justice in the death of Sharon Matthews Nancy.
25:50
Speaker 1: In the last few hours, a major development on this story.
25:53
Speaker 1: It seems Wesley Matthews is changing what he's told police,
25:57
Speaker 1: and according to Richardson Police Sergeant Kevin Perlick, that change
26:02
Speaker 1: has resulted in a new felony charge against Matthews, a
26:06
Speaker 1: charge of injury to a child, and he has now
26:11
Speaker 1: been arrested. Let's listen to Richardson, Texas Police Sergeant Kevin.
26:17
Speaker 1: This afternoon, we were contacted by Mr Matthews along with
26:19
Speaker 1: his attorney. They had agreed to come in and speak
26:22
Speaker 1: with us regarding our Sharon Matthews case. When they came in,
26:26
Speaker 1: they provided us with some information that was contrary to
26:30
Speaker 1: what we had previously been told regarding her disappearance. Once
26:34
Speaker 1: we were finished, the decision was made that we would
26:36
Speaker 1: elect but I'm sorry, decision was made that we would
26:39
Speaker 1: arrest Mr Matthews on the charge of injury to a child.
26:43
Speaker 1: It's a first degree felony punishable by five to ninety
26:46
Speaker 1: nine years. How this came about just for him calling
26:51
Speaker 1: you all agree? Yes, for the most part, it was
26:54
Speaker 1: voluntary on his part where they offered to come in
26:56
Speaker 1: and speak with us, and that's what they did. They
26:58
Speaker 1: came in and spoke with our investigators and sat for noon,
27:00
Speaker 1: and it's been an ongoing conversation for quite some part
27:03
Speaker 1: of the day. Because it is still a continuing, ongoing investigation.
27:07
Speaker 1: I can't get into the exact details as far as
27:10
Speaker 1: what he told us, but what he did tell us
27:12
Speaker 1: was contrary to what we had been previously told back
27:15
Speaker 1: on October seven, when Sharon first came up missing. Okay,
27:18
Speaker 1: so this milk story not true anymore? Is that not
27:21
Speaker 1: the same story that he gave you to day? Well,
27:23
Speaker 1: there was some contradictions to what he told us, And
27:26
Speaker 1: again I can't go into the exact details of what
27:28
Speaker 1: it is because it's still an ongoing investigation, but it
27:33
Speaker 1: was not what he had told us originally. Its injury
27:36
Speaker 1: to a child. That means any injured this role. It
27:38
Speaker 1: is your believed, yes, but we have not made any
27:40
Speaker 1: type of positive identification of the body that we found yesterday.
27:44
Speaker 1: We're still waiting to get word back from the m
27:46
Speaker 1: e's office, and once we get word from them, we'll
27:49
Speaker 1: have a positive identification. Yes, the first charge that he
27:55
Speaker 1: had was endangerment and this one is now actually injury
27:58
Speaker 1: to a child. The first one was a second degree felony.
28:02
Speaker 1: This one is now a first degree felony. Miss Matthews
28:07
Speaker 1: was not with him. Um, we have been in touch
28:10
Speaker 1: with her. That contact has been to try to make
28:14
Speaker 1: identification of the body that we found yesterday. UH look
28:19
Speaker 1: at some of the clothing, UH provide the dental records.
28:22
Speaker 1: But as far as answering any questions about what may
28:24
Speaker 1: have taken place or what she had told us previously.
28:28
Speaker 1: We have not had any type of cooperation in that
28:31
Speaker 1: regard actually been cooperating with the tear where you were
28:34
Speaker 1: just trying to reach out to get that. They have
28:39
Speaker 1: been in touch with us and they are working on
28:41
Speaker 1: the dental records and right but no further details have
28:46
Speaker 1: been provided to us regarding what may have happened on
28:52
Speaker 1: His bond has been said at one million dollars, so
28:54
Speaker 1: it is possible that he could bond out again. He
28:57
Speaker 1: is in custody here at our Richard City jail right now.
29:00
Speaker 1: I do not know when he will be booked in,
29:03
Speaker 1: but we're awaiting that. In today's difference in in the
29:06
Speaker 1: account of some differences, is there any change to what
29:10
Speaker 1: Cinny was doing sleeping at the time, Well, again, that
29:13
Speaker 1: would be some details that we really can't get into,
29:15
Speaker 1: but I can tell you that because this is an
29:17
Speaker 1: ongoing investigation, you're likely to see some some additional work
29:21
Speaker 1: being done on it. There's the possibility that there may
29:24
Speaker 1: be additional arrests, and there may be some modifications to
29:27
Speaker 1: some of the charges that you see right now. Does
29:30
Speaker 1: this new information from a sleep nut up with some
29:33
Speaker 1: of the investigation. Even right, we have been able to
29:36
Speaker 1: kind of go through what we've what we know as fact,
29:39
Speaker 1: match that up to some of the stuff that we're
29:41
Speaker 1: now being told. And in that regard, yes, we've been
29:44
Speaker 1: kind of able to connect some of the dots, but
29:46
Speaker 1: there's a lot more work to be done yet before
29:48
Speaker 1: we can say we have a good grasp of everything
29:50
Speaker 1: that took place. And now, in a stunning twist, the
29:55
Speaker 1: latest in the search for American teen beauty and honor
30:00
Speaker 1: grad Natalie Holloway where we last left off and the
30:05
Speaker 1: search for Natalie Holloway is that bones human remains had
30:11
Speaker 1: been found at a dig based on information received from
30:15
Speaker 1: a confidential informant there in Aruba. Take a listen to
30:20
Speaker 1: a renowned DNA expert, Dodger Kolkowski. When we actually took
30:25
Speaker 1: the DNA extract and ran it through this screening process,
30:30
Speaker 1: it came back positive. It came back human. You gotta
30:32
Speaker 1: be kidding, No, I'm not. You say those are human bones.
30:36
Speaker 1: There's human DNA and these bone samples. Yes, as to
30:39
Speaker 1: which one of the four is human? Are all of them?
30:42
Speaker 1: That's where some additional testing is going to need to
30:44
Speaker 1: be done. So these are human bones. Human there's human
30:49
Speaker 1: mitochondrial DNA and these bones, and that I think is
30:52
Speaker 1: fairly significant. Yeah, I wouldn't expect the nation. And there's
30:57
Speaker 1: even a more interesting aspect here. The test we ran
31:01
Speaker 1: right now is designed to screen in a very broadway
31:04
Speaker 1: just look to see if there's any human mitochondria there.
31:07
Speaker 1: It's really interesting because not only does it align perfectly
31:10
Speaker 1: to our standard reference sequence that we use in MITO,
31:13
Speaker 1: there are no differences to the reference sequence. The reference
31:17
Speaker 1: sequence was actually built on a European Caucasian DNA sequence.
31:22
Speaker 1: Of the fact here is that that's the that's the
31:25
Speaker 1: ancestry that we're questioning. Yeah, you caught me, boss, I
31:34
Speaker 1: never expected all of these dominoes are tipping over the
31:37
Speaker 1: right way, telling us that we need to proceed forward
31:40
Speaker 1: with some testing. There's a possibility though, that there could
31:43
Speaker 1: be somebody else there is we have a potential to
31:46
Speaker 1: now test these this bone sequence, the mitochondrial DNA sequence
31:51
Speaker 1: against Natalie's mother and perhaps even make a match there.
31:54
Speaker 1: There are still avenues in which this testing is going
31:57
Speaker 1: to yield a result that may not be Natalie, but
32:00
Speaker 1: there's definitely pointers in the direction right now that tell
32:03
Speaker 1: us that there is a possibility it could be heard.
32:05
Speaker 1: Everyone's hopes were raised that this could finally be the
32:10
Speaker 1: end of the search for Natalie Holloway. Until this, as
32:15
Speaker 1: you're well aware, Beth submitted a DNA swab for comparative testing.
32:22
Speaker 1: This is a graphic representation of the sequencing work that
32:26
Speaker 1: we did on Beth's sample, and so what we're looking
32:30
Speaker 1: at here is the comparison of Beth's profile against the
32:33
Speaker 1: profile that we already had from the combined bones. As
32:37
Speaker 1: of right now, we have the results of that sample.
32:40
Speaker 1: But this profile right here, it's not a match to Beth.
32:44
Speaker 1: It's somebody else. So we're not at the Tobolows investigation.
32:49
Speaker 1: We notice somebody human. One of these bones is definitely human.
32:53
Speaker 1: We know that, and if not three four of the bones,
32:57
Speaker 1: you know they all could be. We just have to
32:58
Speaker 1: have a couple more pieces of information and then I
33:01
Speaker 1: can give you the truth of the matter. Out to
33:04
Speaker 1: Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host, You and I covered
33:10
Speaker 1: the case of a missing American tourist, Robin Gardner in Aruba.
33:18
Speaker 1: She had gone down there in a friend capacity with
33:23
Speaker 1: the guy she met on the internet. He wanted to travel,
33:26
Speaker 1: she wanted to travel. So they go down there together,
33:29
Speaker 1: not romantically linked, but they went down there to spend
33:33
Speaker 1: time together and to just get out of town to
33:36
Speaker 1: go have a good time together as friends. She was
33:40
Speaker 1: never seen alive. Now, how does that factor into the
33:44
Speaker 1: search for Natalie Holloway, Dave mac Nancy. The bones that
33:48
Speaker 1: were found that were determined to be female European descent
33:53
Speaker 1: that ended up not being that of Natalie Holloway could
33:58
Speaker 1: very well be the bones of Robin Gardner. So her
34:01
Speaker 1: sister has agreed to a DNA test to try to
34:05
Speaker 1: prove or show whether or not what has been found
34:08
Speaker 1: actually belonged to the thirty five year old went missing
34:11
Speaker 1: in two thousand and eleven. You know, I know that
34:15
Speaker 1: Robin went missing in two thousand eleven. I know that
34:19
Speaker 1: I remember when it all occurred. And her family has
34:25
Speaker 1: been tortured ever since she went missing. It's one thing
34:31
Speaker 1: to read about it, it's one thing to hear about it,
34:35
Speaker 1: But take a listen to Dave Holloway. Well, if it's
34:39
Speaker 1: not Natalie, it's somebody else. And I think that um
34:41
Speaker 1: and I've said this before, John has had somebody's bones
34:45
Speaker 1: on that island, and either the a Reuben Police or
34:48
Speaker 1: the FBI has got to get involved. I mean, something's
34:51
Speaker 1: got to give. I mean, you just can't just have
34:54
Speaker 1: human remains and no one do anything. I mean, I'm
34:59
Speaker 1: I wish I could do more, but I mean one
35:01
Speaker 1: of those two agencies have gotten get him, got to
35:03
Speaker 1: get involved, or either the Dutch have got to get
35:06
Speaker 1: control of the situation that somebody's got to investigate it.
35:10
Speaker 1: There very well could be another family out there that
35:13
Speaker 1: is missing a loved one whose bones that those belonged it.
35:18
Speaker 1: It's very very important for somebody to do an investigation
35:24
Speaker 1: to get down to the bottom of how did you
35:26
Speaker 1: come up with these human remains and whose are they?
35:29
Speaker 1: They're gonna have to man up and um they're to stop.
35:37
Speaker 1: What do you mean stop just stop stop on looking
35:45
Speaker 1: for Nataline? I think are I think this is probably um,
35:54
Speaker 1: probably the end. Um. I mean, we've searched all over
36:01
Speaker 1: the island. We just about ever ready to every lead
36:04
Speaker 1: that's possible. I don't know that there's anything else we
36:08
Speaker 1: can physically didn't Again, this human bone found in a
36:14
Speaker 1: Ruba during an investigation into the disappearance of American teen
36:19
Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway on her senior trip was tested and although
36:24
Speaker 1: it is of a woman of European descent, it is
36:27
Speaker 1: not Natalie Holloway. New DNA testing, however, could conceivably link
36:36
Speaker 1: this bone to a missing Maryland woman. Robin Gardner. Her sister,
36:41
Speaker 1: as Day just told you, Danielle says she's willing to
36:46
Speaker 1: submit DNA for the test to just Scott Morgan. How
36:50
Speaker 1: would that work? Well, you know, it's interesting that the sister,
36:54
Speaker 1: as soon as this came out that this was not
36:56
Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway, the sister says, look, I'm here, I'm ready
36:59
Speaker 1: to falling to her. One of the things they're gonna
37:01
Speaker 1: do is do what's referred to as a buckle mucostal swab,
37:05
Speaker 1: and that means, in simple terms, they're just gonna swab
37:07
Speaker 1: her gum to get a sample of her DNA, and
37:10
Speaker 1: then they're gonna do what's referred to as a familial
37:12
Speaker 1: DNA testing. My biggest problem with this case and Nancy
37:17
Speaker 1: is that this bone sample, which we've seen pictures of
37:20
Speaker 1: that was allegedly provided by Gabriel. This bone sample, just
37:24
Speaker 1: the physical appearance of it is old. It's decayed, and
37:29
Speaker 1: I'm really curious as to how this bone has been
37:32
Speaker 1: treated in the laboratory when they were attempting to harvest
37:37
Speaker 1: Natalie Holloway's DNA or alleged DNA that turned out not
37:41
Speaker 1: to be her. Is there enough sample left to compare
37:44
Speaker 1: and that's gonna be very compelling in this case moving forward. Well,
37:47
Speaker 1: they had enough to extract to determine it wasn't Natalie Holloway.
37:51
Speaker 1: What makes you think they wouldn't have enough to compare
37:53
Speaker 1: to robbing Gardner's DNA through her sister. Well, this is
37:57
Speaker 1: the problem sometimes, Uh, These tes us that they can
38:00
Speaker 1: conduct on an unknown sample can be rather destructive in
38:04
Speaker 1: the lab. And there wasn't a lot of bone to
38:06
Speaker 1: work with in the first place, Nancy. I am just
38:08
Speaker 1: hoping that special care was taken with the initial sample,
38:11
Speaker 1: with that initial piece, that bone fragment that they had.
38:14
Speaker 1: We're not talking about a huge piece of bone here, Nancy.
38:16
Speaker 1: We're talking about a small area, and I'm just hoping
38:19
Speaker 1: that it was handled appropriately and that they're going to
38:21
Speaker 1: be able to harvest DNA that's in there for this
38:25
Speaker 1: particular case, Jo Scott, Isn't it true that when you're
38:28
Speaker 1: testing DNA that you can extrapolate, Like I know, you
38:34
Speaker 1: can't recreate it, but somehow in the lab that can extrapolate.
38:38
Speaker 1: If you have a small amount of DNA, they can
38:41
Speaker 1: use that very small amount. But is it is it
38:44
Speaker 1: in fact possible that the DNA can be used up
38:48
Speaker 1: in testing. It's it's not so much that it can
38:52
Speaker 1: be used up as much as it can be compromised
38:54
Speaker 1: to a great degree. And you're right about this, this
38:57
Speaker 1: magnification that takes place. What they're gonna do is it's
39:00
Speaker 1: a it's a replication that they'll do. They'll take one
39:02
Speaker 1: strand and then they'll begin to replicate it in multiple
39:06
Speaker 1: times and will create an entire testable strand. But again,
39:10
Speaker 1: back to what I was saying, I'm just hoping that
39:12
Speaker 1: they haven't completely compromised a sample. And that's what this
39:15
Speaker 1: whole thing is gonna hinge on Nancy. Uh. And it's
39:19
Speaker 1: it's just it's it's uh, it's heartbreaking that that both
39:23
Speaker 1: of these families are having to endure this. I just
39:25
Speaker 1: hope that the sample will have been treated with care.
39:28
Speaker 1: Uh that that that that it deems necessary to Dave Max,
39:32
Speaker 1: indicated talk show host, explained to me the circumstances under
39:36
Speaker 1: which Gardener, Robin Gardner went missing in Aruba, and to
39:40
Speaker 1: my understanding, she is one of four Americans to go
39:43
Speaker 1: missing there and just very recent years what happened with
39:47
Speaker 1: Robin Gardner. Robin Gardner went to uh Aruba with her
39:52
Speaker 1: friend on a vacation. They were last she was seen
39:55
Speaker 1: leaving a hotel or a restaurant rather at four o'clock
39:58
Speaker 1: in the afternoon. A court into her companion Mr Jordan Oh.
40:03
Speaker 1: They were going to go snarkeling, and that's where he
40:06
Speaker 1: claims that she got caught up in a stronger current
40:09
Speaker 1: underwater and was drug out to see He then made
40:12
Speaker 1: his way back to shore, where he reported her missing
40:14
Speaker 1: at six pm. So four pm they leave the restaurant.
40:17
Speaker 1: Six pm he and asks that she's missing. You know,
40:21
Speaker 1: the whole thing doesn't hold together for me, his whole story.
40:24
Speaker 1: But again, he is not a suspect. He has not
40:27
Speaker 1: a person of interest. Let me make that clear. I
40:31
Speaker 1: want to go back to a Reuben police. Do we
40:34
Speaker 1: really think they can solve anything Joseph Scott Morgan anything
40:39
Speaker 1: at all? No, I wouldn't. I wouldn't trust him to.
40:44
Speaker 1: I wouldn't trust him with anything. To be quite honest
40:47
Speaker 1: with you, and the way they're they're not that sophisticated
40:50
Speaker 1: their ability to handle crime scenes and the process of
40:53
Speaker 1: the evidence and where does that evidence go to be processed.
40:56
Speaker 1: I have a lot of questions about their capabilities. So
40:59
Speaker 1: moving forward, now they're gonna get slammed with one more
41:02
Speaker 1: big case. I don't know how this is gonna be handled.
41:04
Speaker 1: And I agree with you, Nancy, this idea that she's
41:07
Speaker 1: been washed out to see it doesn't hold water from
41:09
Speaker 1: me either, uh, and that that she would be washed
41:13
Speaker 1: out and suddenly there would be these other remains that
41:16
Speaker 1: are found. As we have said in the earlier conversations
41:19
Speaker 1: between you and I, there were other missing people on
41:22
Speaker 1: that island. It's it wasn't just Natalie Holloway. It was
41:25
Speaker 1: other missing people that are out there. And it's really
41:28
Speaker 1: curious that we found or that they found other human
41:32
Speaker 1: remains at that site that did not belong to Natalie Holloway. Yeah.
41:36
Speaker 1: I mean it begs the question, Joe Scott, it is
41:38
Speaker 1: not Natalie, who is it? I mean, take a listen,
41:42
Speaker 1: this is what a Reuben police have to add to
41:45
Speaker 1: the whole scenario. Listen to them now, what about the bones,
41:50
Speaker 1: the animal bones? What kind of animal was it? Do
41:53
Speaker 1: you know? Just animal bombs? Okay, not human books. Is
41:58
Speaker 1: there any reports or anythling you can give us about
42:00
Speaker 1: the bones, No, you have nothing. That enforcement we don't
42:04
Speaker 1: desk give reports of the third party. Can we look
42:08
Speaker 1: at them the bones. We've got to get any question
42:14
Speaker 1: of doubt and we got up the bulls. We we
42:18
Speaker 1: go us. Okay, this is what's what's happened. That was
42:23
Speaker 1: the Aribon police are saying these bones are animal bones,
42:28
Speaker 1: but they haven't had those bones long enough to have
42:30
Speaker 1: them properly tested. So you know, I have my doubts,
42:33
Speaker 1: and I think what I will do is have the
42:35
Speaker 1: bones tested myself to make sure that they are non
42:39
Speaker 1: human or exactly what they are. I mean, Alan Duke.
42:42
Speaker 1: That's all they've got to add. Hey, guys, after you
42:46
Speaker 1: found a human body and you figured out it is
42:50
Speaker 1: a one of European descent, and you figured out it
42:54
Speaker 1: wasn't Natalie, Hey, I bet you messed up the chain
42:57
Speaker 1: of custody. You really screwed up. That's basically what they're saying.
43:01
Speaker 1: They've done nothing. They've been sitting with their thumbs. Well, okay,
43:06
Speaker 1: never mind about where their thumbs are. But they've done
43:08
Speaker 1: nothing except throwing taking pot shots at people that are
43:13
Speaker 1: trying to solve the case. Well, the police chief in
43:17
Speaker 1: a Ruba seemed like a perfectly nice man, but he
43:20
Speaker 1: never bought that it was anything other than dog bones,
43:23
Speaker 1: or at least animal bones. And so he had them
43:26
Speaker 1: in a baggy and he handed them back to Dave
43:30
Speaker 1: Holloway and said, look, I'll give you these their dog bones,
43:33
Speaker 1: but keep in mind if you take them, they can
43:35
Speaker 1: never be used in a ruby in a court of
43:37
Speaker 1: law because you've broken the chain of custody, as if
43:40
Speaker 1: they ever would be used in ruben a court of law.
43:44
Speaker 1: I mean they've done nothing. I mean, help me out,
43:47
Speaker 1: Dave mac. They put this guy in jail for five
43:50
Speaker 1: months trying to build a case they actually could build nothing,
43:54
Speaker 1: even though every account of Robin Gardener is that she
43:57
Speaker 1: was a woman who would not even go underwater. She
44:01
Speaker 1: didn't want to mess with her hair and her makeup.
44:03
Speaker 1: And on top of that, I mentioned earlier off the year,
44:06
Speaker 1: this guy wears a tupee. He wears so many different
44:08
Speaker 1: types of tupa's that it's tough to identify him on
44:11
Speaker 1: CCTV because he's constantly changing them. But you know what,
44:14
Speaker 1: his tupai was still in place after he claims that
44:17
Speaker 1: he had been snorkeling with her and he was panicked
44:19
Speaker 1: because she got drug out to see a woman who
44:22
Speaker 1: wouldn't go underwater all of a sudden is snorkeling and
44:24
Speaker 1: a dude that wears a tupe and it's perfectly on
44:27
Speaker 1: on his head like and perfectly dry. A little problem there,
44:31
Speaker 1: as if I remember the case correctly, she had had
44:35
Speaker 1: her hair done um and it had cost a lot
44:40
Speaker 1: of money and she did not want to get her
44:42
Speaker 1: hair wet. Do you remember that, Dave mac I do?
44:45
Speaker 1: She had extensions and it was a big deal. Her
44:48
Speaker 1: longtime boyfriend actually talked about that. That was one of
44:50
Speaker 1: his biggest suspicions because she not that she was vain.
44:53
Speaker 1: She was just proud of the amount of time that
44:56
Speaker 1: went into the extensions in her hair. Um. She was
44:58
Speaker 1: very particular about the a way she looked about her makeup,
45:01
Speaker 1: her hair and everything being just the way she wanted
45:04
Speaker 1: it to be. That's why she didn't even go below
45:06
Speaker 1: the waist. You know, she did not go underwater. That's
45:09
Speaker 1: why this is such a big deal. Back to Alan, Alan,
45:14
Speaker 1: what more do we know about the testing that's going
45:16
Speaker 1: to go down on these bones that were found in Aruba. Well,
45:21
Speaker 1: the doctor in the US did as modern testing as
45:26
Speaker 1: you can, the microchondrial, DNA testing, everything that could be done,
45:31
Speaker 1: and concluded that it wasn't Natalie Holloway. So I would think, now,
45:35
Speaker 1: Joe Scott correct me, But isn't that all digital stuff?
45:38
Speaker 1: So if they've already done the test once on those bones,
45:41
Speaker 1: they've got the digital profile built, so they don't have
45:44
Speaker 1: to do more testing. Let's just have to see if
45:46
Speaker 1: it matches this woman's family, right. I would hope that
45:49
Speaker 1: they that they would, and I would hope that that
45:51
Speaker 1: the fellow that was doing the testing on behalf of
45:54
Speaker 1: the Holloway family would would see that would see the
45:57
Speaker 1: benefit uh in in trying to help solve another case,
46:00
Speaker 1: and that he would render this over to to someone
46:03
Speaker 1: else to test it or to at least examine it.
46:06
Speaker 1: I think that that's gonna be very important as opposed
46:08
Speaker 1: to trying to go back and harvest another sample from
46:11
Speaker 1: a bone tissue, from denuded bone tissue that's that's already
46:14
Speaker 1: pretty well compromised. Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend,