Latest / The SmallBizChat with Melinda Emerson / How to Grow Your Revenue with Retreats with Sheri Rosenthal

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How to Grow Your Revenue with Retreats with Sheri Rosenthal · The SmallBizChat with Melinda Emerson

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  Three, two, one, zero.
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  Ignition.
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  Lift off.
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  Ending small business failure.
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  Welcome to the Small Biz Chat podcast with the number one small business expert, Melinda
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  Emerson.
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  Melinda's goal is to end small business failure, and she'll give you the information
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  you need to succeed and live the life you dream of.
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  Now here's your host, the small biz chat lady herself, Melinda Emerson.
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  Have
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  you subscribed to the small biz chat podcast?
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  Well, it's time.
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  Every Wednesday, we offer listeners bite sized actionable tips to start and grow a successful
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  small business.
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  In just twenty minutes or so a week, you can get a ton of insight and resources to propel
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  your business forward.
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  Be sure to subscribe to the Small Biz Chat podcast today.
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  Welcome to another episode of the Small Biz Chat podcast, the show that is on a mission to
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  end small business failure.
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  I'm Melinda Emerson, your host, small biz lady, and America's number one small business expert.
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  Every week, we bring you powerful interviews, expert insights, and real world advice to help
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  you grow and scale your small business.
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  In today's episode, we're talking about one of the most exciting and impactful ways to expand
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  your business while creating unforgettable experiences for your clients.
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  How to grow your business with a retreat.
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  My guest, Sherry Rosenthal is CEO and Chief Retreat Strategist at Wanderlust Entrepreneur.
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  Sherri is a true veteran in the retreat industry.
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  For over two decades, she's helped more than 20,000 heart centered entrepreneurs plan,
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  price, promote and profit from transformational retreats around the globe.
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  She's also the CEO of Journeys of the Heart, a boutique agency that manages over a thousand
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  retreats worldwide.
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  So if you've ever dreamed of mixing your business with travel, this episode is packed
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  with insights you don't wanna miss.
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  And so for more information, you can head over to wanderlisentrepreneur.com.
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  Now, if you love the Small Biz Chat podcast, please take a moment and leave us a five star
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  review on your favorite podcast listening platform.
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  Your support helps us reach more small business owners and continue our mission to end small
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  business failure.
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  Now let me say this, if you don't like my podcast, please don't leave me a review.
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  But if you do, please show me some love because I wanna make sure that so many people get this
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  valuable advice that they otherwise would have to pay for it.
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  So now let me welcome my guests to the stage, Ms.
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  Rosenthal, so we can get this thing started.
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  So Sherri, tell us your background.
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  How did you get started in doing retreats?
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  Thank you, Melinda for having me on first and foremost.
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  So yes, I was a podiatrist before any of this, which is a foot doctor for those who don't
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  know.
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  And I had practiced for eighteen years and I was done.
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  And so I didn't know what I was gonna do next, but I sold my practice and everything.
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  And I went on a retreat with Damiguel Ruiz who wrote The Four Agreements, which Oprah made
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  famous as we all know.
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  So that was a life changing retreat for me, because I didn't know where I was going.
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  And within that retreat, my whole life changed and I became a retreat junkie after that.
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  It was, I could really see how powerful they were.
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  So for many years, I actually taught the four agreements and wrote a few books.
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  And then in 2014, started Wanderlust Entrepreneur where we train our heart based
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  entrepreneurs to do profitable retreats.
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  So that is how it all happened.
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  So tell me, why do you think that retreats are such a powerful business tool right now?
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  And what makes this the perfect time to host one?
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  Well, a lot of people are thinking right now that this is not a good time because of all the
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  turmoil and political divisiveness, but I feel that's exactly why we need to get our people on
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  a retreat because we need to get them to unplug, to get away, to be in community,
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  whoever their community is, and to be seen and heard and recognized and loved on.
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  And these are very much the times to do that.
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  And I feel like it's one more tool in our toolbox.
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  Like for instance, you could do private coaching with people, group coaching with
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  people, you could do live events from the stage Retreats are just a more intimate way of
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  interacting with your people.
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  Now I have been to many retreats.
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  I also have many friends who have hosted retreats and a lot of them don't make money
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  unless they sell their big ticket thing in the back of the room.
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  So can you help me understand like all of the revenue streams that you can build from a
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  retreat?
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  Because when I first hear about it, I cringe.
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  I mean, literally just sounds like an expensive way to lose your shirt.
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  So can you help me get over my fear of retreats?
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  Absolutely.
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  And you are 100% correct.
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  Most people make little to no money or lose money on retreats.
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  The reason for this Melinda is because they are not structuring their pricing correctly.
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  They're used to pricing a workshop or a live event from the stage.
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  It's a different pricing structure when you do a retreat because there's less people.
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  So the difference between one person not showing up in your pricing could mean the
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  difference between profit and loss.
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  So we have a specific way of pricing so that we know you're going to make money.
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  Then on top of that, you should be offering something at the end of the retreat because
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  think about it, Melinda, you just had this incredible experience with people they know,
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  like and trust you.
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  They probably love you by now.
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  They've had some wonderful transformations and you're gonna send them home into their life
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  with no help.
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  To me, that's abandonment.
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  You want to offer them something to continue the journey with you.
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  And so you can further help them along the way.
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  So you've got a price correctly and have that upsell at the end.
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  Okay.
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  So, all right.
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  So you already said that the biggest mistake is not pricing this thing right.
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  What are some of the other big mistakes that people make when planning a retreat,
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  particularly their first retreat?
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  Not just their first retreat.
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  Okay, so here's the thing.
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  One of the other bigger issues is around marketing, especially our heart based
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  entrepreneurs do not love marketing.
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  And so this is a big issue.
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  We want to make sure we give twelve solid months if possible to get that retreat filled
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  especially if it is international because people need to make time in their calendar.
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  If you're gonna do a five day retreat that is in country yeah they might be able to fit that
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  in but if you're gonna do a ten day trip, let's say to Bhutan or Thailand or you know,
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  somewhere more remote, you need to let them have the time to plan that in their schedule.
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  So this is very, very important.
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  We want to make sure that we have that proper time.
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  And in that time, do you actually have a marketing plan?
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  Not a throw spaghetti on the wall plan, meaning, oh, I remember I have a trip coming up
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  in six months.
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  I better do a few posts.
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  They really need to have a marketing plan.
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  All right.
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  So what, I mean, so what goes into the marketing plan?
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  I mean, is it a webinar?
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  Is it social?
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  Is it email?
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  Do you want new people?
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  Do you want people already in your community?
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  Give give me, I mean, you you saying, okay, I need a marketing plan.
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  Alright.
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  You know, they can go to chat right now and get one but talk, talk, talk to me about the the
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  nitty gritty here.
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  Like, what needs to go in this marketing plan?
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  Is it about affiliates and referrals?
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  Like like, what you know, how many channels do you have to use to fill this event?
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  As many as possible, I always say.
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  So if you've got affiliates, yes, by all means, because we all know that warm leads are better.
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  In fact, for retreat, the warmer the better, because I know for myself, I'm not gonna go
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  traveling with someone I don't know because
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  I don't know what that trip is gonna be like, what that person is gonna be talking about, if
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  they're aligned with my values, that is really important.
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  So your number one client for your retreat are the people on your list.
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  So they're your warmest leads and you wanna go for them.
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  So there's many ways of doing that.
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  And in your marketing plan, you can set aside time to do each thing in rotation.
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  So you might do, for example, an email blast with three to five emails.
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  Then you might say the next month that you're going to do a
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  webinar for your audience, telling them about the trip.
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  Who is it for?
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  What are they gonna get out of it?
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  Show them beautiful pictures, give them a chance to ask questions and book a call with
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  you so you can close them.
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  So that would be, let's say another thing you can do.
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  You might wanna do a challenge or something that has to do with that retreat.
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  So at the end of the challenge, they realize the retreat would be a good thing for them to
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  do.
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  Or Thanks
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  for listening to the Small Biz Chat podcast with Melinda Emerson.
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  Subscribe to this podcast wherever you listen to podcasts, and join us next Wednesday for
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  more fantastic information and
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  interviews.
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  Really fun.
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  You can find more sources and small business success strategies by visiting Melinda's
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  website.
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  Seeasyourownboss.com.
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  Thanks again for listening and we'll see you next week.
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  Social media posts.
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  Obviously, you're going to do that.
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  And you're going to try to stick with education based marketing as far as your posts, not like,
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  hey, I have a trip.
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  This is where I'm going because a lot of people don't understand that that retreat is a
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  solution for them.
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  They need to have more education on what is going on with them and how that retreat can be
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  the solution.
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  So it has to make sense.
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  Otherwise, they're gonna look at it and go whatever.
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  And you have to have a really scintillating retreat sales page.
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  And on that sales page, you really have to pull people in to the experience.
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  And one of the mistakes I see is that people build their sales page like a product or a
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  program.
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  No.
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  On a retreat page, you need to talk about the food and the venue and the activities and the
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  promise of the retreat.
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  Like what are they gonna walk away with?
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  So all of that needs to be on the page along with answering any objections that they might
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  have.
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  So if they're not familiar with the location, you have to educate them on the page like why
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  Morocco?
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  Well, here's why I'm doing the retreat here.
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  And I always recommend that the location align with what you are teaching, because then it
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  makes more sense.
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  I'll- I was about to say, I'm like, what?
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  Let me give you an example.
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  Okay.
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  So let's say you teach people how to speak from the stage.
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  You certainly can do that.
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  Like my nearest airports, Atlanta.
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  I can certainly have a retreat like a workshop in Atlanta for my people to teach them to speak
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  from the stage, but I could also bring them to Europe and rent an amphitheater and let them
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  speak in the energy of the ancient people, like really make it more experiential.
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  Or if you were doing a knitting retreat, I would consider taking them to New Zealand
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  during the time that they shear the sheep and do the natural dyes and clean it and put it on
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  the skeins and all of that.
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  So it becomes not just like, I've seen people do like a knitting retreat on a cruise and
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  that's okay.
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  But like to me, that's meh as we say in New York like, it's not to me creating value.
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  And you wanna create value because that is what's going to allow you to charge the correct
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  amount of money that you should be charging because you're building value on your retreat
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  sales page.
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  If you don't do that people will look at it and go well, I could do this myself and I don't
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  have the money or it doesn't seem worth it to me.
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  And that's the first thing they'll say is your trip looks too expensive.
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  But if they're telling you that you have a shitty, excuse me, sales page.
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  That's just telling it like it is.
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  You're able to taste the food, right?
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  So how can you, I'm get back to cruise ships in a minute, but how can you use a retreat to
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  really deepen your relationships and really retain your coaching clients and consulting
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  clients?
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  Isn't that one of the key things that you'll be doing?
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  Well, yes, because think of this, any other environment is not as intimate and delicious as
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  spending five days with you or seven or ten days or two weeks or whatever you're doing.
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  So it creates that kind of intimacy that you have with your people that they love, they
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  love.
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  Where can they get you alone?
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  And this is why you need to be making a good profit because you only have a small number of
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  people.
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  So you need to be paid properly for what you're doing.
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  So yes, this is gonna change everything.
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  And when they have those transformations, they're going to want to continue working with
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  you and they're gonna be your biggest fans.
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  I've been doing retreats on my own through my travel agency since 02/2003.
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  I am still friends with so many of the people that came on my retreats and many have become
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  your friends too.
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  So it's a special, special environment.
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  All right.
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  So not all retreats are made equal.
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  Right?
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  You know?
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  No.
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  Shearing the sheep in New Zealand sounds amazing.
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  But like, what are some ways that you could get your toe in this without bearing the full
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  financial brunt of it?
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  Are cruise ships a a way to go?
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  You know?
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  Instead of yeah.
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  I mean, obviously, you're not gonna necessarily sell out the cruise ship like Tom Joyner's
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  cruise, but I'm saying like, is there ways to piggyback on other things and still make it be
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  special for your people and what you're teaching or whatever?
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  You don't need to.
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  First of all, there are ways of dealing with putting a deposit down where you can start
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  selling your trip ahead of time basically before you have to put a deposit down, but you
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  have to have faith that you can fill the room.
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  Okay.
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  And that's just it.
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  I don't like the idea of big cruise ships because there's too much distraction from what
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  I wanna share with my people now.
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  I might do a barge and have my people take up the whole barge.
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  Or for example, this August, I'm doing a mastermind retreat in Croatia and I got 161
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  foot yacht that I, yeah.
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  Okay.
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  That's fabulous, Ms.
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  Sherry.
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  Oh
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  my gosh.
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  What's
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  gonna another speaker for that?
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  Just saying.
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  You could come along honey.
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  It's great really.
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  And, you know, it's just a matter of knowing that you can get the people that you need and
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  create a beautiful experience.
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  And if you're brand spanking new, would I go and rent a yacht that is not refundable?
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  No, I wouldn't do that.
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  But there's other things that you could do as a newbie, maybe you wanna do an Airbnb or
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  something that you could cancel, maybe a hotel that you can, you know, cancel.
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  You don't do a group booking.
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  You just take some individual bookings just so you have some rooms.
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  Let's say in a boutique hotel, something really cute and beautiful somewhere.
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  So there's lots of ways of getting around that so that you don't have to feel like you have to
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  sell your first and oldest child.
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  Alright, so what is the biggest difference between doing a domestic retreat let's say in
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  Florida or Arizona because I hear about those all the time, or, you know, taking people to
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  Jamaica, The Bahamas, Turks And Caicos, whatever, Mexico.
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  What is the key difference that you really have to understand about international versus
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  domestic retreats?
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  First of all, I always say when you take people out of the country, especially you are
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  responsible for them physically and mentally and spiritually, and it becomes a legal issue.
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  So one of the things we lean very heavy on is educating our clients on retreat legalities.
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  So for example, you have to have I call them death forms.
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  I know some people use waivers.
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  I'm not fond of little waivers.
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  Our international legal forms are six pages long and part of that's from being a physician
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  before you know.
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  So I know what it means that you have to protect yourself legally.
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  So there's things you could do.
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  You could be incorporated.
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  You can have your legal forms and you should have insurance for your retreat and the proper
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  insurance for that is actually tour operators insurance.
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  So this is something important, especially if you're going out of the country, because in the
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  country you might have your normal coaching insurance, which has professional and general
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  liability.
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  So if someone falls, you would be covered.
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  But once you go out of the country, your liability insurance no longer covers you, which
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  is why you need tour operator insurance.
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  And there's also seller of travel law in The United States.
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  There are four states that have that, which is Florida, California, Washington state and
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  Hawaii, which means when you package a retreat together and make it all inclusive, you could
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  be seen as a seller of travel without a license.
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  That's why I got my seller of travel license, my corporations in Florida back in 02/2003,
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  when I started doing retreats for that reason.
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  In Canada, there's three provinces, Ontario, Quebec and BC that have seller of travel law.
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  And in Europe, they have seller of travel law also.
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  So one of the ways we get away with seller travel is what people do when they have live
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  events.
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  They have a room block and the people have to buy their own room and their own food.
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  They pay for the event.
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  But in retreats, we like to make them all inclusive.
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  Well, once you start putting together food and room and activities transport from the airport,
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  this now becomes under seller of travel law.
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  So it's all of these little things that are very, very important to understand and to make
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  sure you have the legal forms to protect yourself.
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  Wow, that's something I really had no idea this seller of travel law.
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  And the four states that have it are Hawaii, Florida, California.
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  What was the fourth one?
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  Washington state.
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  Okay.
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  Interesting.
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  Yeah.
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  Well, big destinations that people go to.
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  I guess that's why everybody's starting to go to Scottsdale for stuff, but anyhow.
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  Well,
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  it's not just where your corporation is located.
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  It's if you're selling to anyone in those states.
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  Oh, wow.
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  Okay.
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  So it's not Wow.
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  Wow.
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  Okay.
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  So let's talk about logistics.
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  What is like the logistical details that are most critical that people, newbies especially
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  overlook?
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  Well, you wanna make sure obviously that your pricing is correct, that your legal forms are
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  there.
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  You wanna make sure you're marketing twelve months in advance.
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  You wanna make sure you've got a great venue that's supporting you And you have someone you
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  have access to for any questions or issues.
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  So you just want to make sure all your I's are dotted and your T's are crossed with everything
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  having to do with your retreat.
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  I always double check everything because you just never know.
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  It's crazy.
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  Once I had a retreat going to Egypt and I got to one of my hotels and they said, didn't have
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  a reservation there.
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  I had paid them in full.
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  What?
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  Yes.
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  And I had to pull everything out of my file.
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  So I make sure I have everything in paper just in case the internet is not working somewhere
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  remote.
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  And they had to do somehow or another, they lost a reservation and they had to give my
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  people all suites and top rooms.
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  Wow.
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  Wow.
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  Wow.
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  Wow.
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  That's crazy.
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  One of the things I know from just I have done two and three day conferences, never outside of
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  the country, but I have absolutely done them here.
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  Mhmm.
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  And what advice would you have for a retreat leader to stay energized and present and avoid
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  burnout during the multi day event?
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  Because I mean by day three, you're ready for people to get away from you at a retreat event.
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  I hear you Melinda, because I'm an introvert, believe it or not.
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  So for me, I have to have help.
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  You know, you always wanna make sure you have help, but some of the things I do is, for
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  example, if I'm doing a multi day event, whether it's like, for example, we just did, we
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  have over 5,000 people to our online retreat training event.
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  We just had in May.
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  I order all of my food ahead of time and have it delivered.
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  So I don't have to cook.
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  I don't do any of that.
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  I make sure I have support.
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  Most importantly, I think you're less exhausted when you're teaching what you love.
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  Always make sure that what you're doing is what you have in your heart and soul.
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  So that I think is first and foremost.
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  And I treat myself afterwards with lots of spa treatments and clothes shopping.
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  I'm here for the spa treatments, I do that too.
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  One of the things I do is I always stay an extra day in the hotel when everybody's gone
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  and just be like a guest in the hotel.
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  I do that too.
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  I don't leave when everyone else is leaving, I try to make sure that I give myself, you know,
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  just just the opportunity to relax in the room without the hair and makeup people with that,
• 25:48
  you know, just like I just I just need a day.
• 25:53
  Of nobody asking me for anything.
• 25:56
  Exactly.
• 25:58
  Perfect.
• 25:59
  Call and order my favorite food in that city and have it delivered and just be like, leave
• 26:04
  me.
• 26:04
  I don't even don't wanna leave this room, I just wanna be in this room and I just
• 26:08
  wanna Yes.
• 26:09
  Because it's a lot.
• 26:10
  It's a lot to spend that much time with people pouring into people.
• 26:16
  Can you talk a little bit about the programming of an event?
• 26:20
  Like what, how much content should you be teaching?
• 26:24
  How many hours should you be teaching at a retreat versus people having time on their own
• 26:32
  or people doing, know, everybody going on a tour or whatever.
• 26:36
  You know what I mean?
• 26:37
  Like how much content should you really be teaching during a retreat?
• 26:42
  That's the one question I wanted to ask you.
• 26:44
  Okay, as little as possible.
• 26:47
  So yes, this is why if you've aligned your location to what you're teaching, I would say
• 26:56
  you could do something in the morning, but the afternoon activities align with what you're
• 27:03
  teaching.
• 27:04
  So you're taking people out for an experience.
• 27:08
  Remember retreats are experiential.
• 27:11
  This is more than a workshop.
• 27:14
  This is a balls to bones experience.
• 27:20
  So you really want to have them.
• 27:24
  That's why I say like, if you're teaching how to speak from the stage, they will never forget
• 27:29
  that they were at that amphitheater.
• 27:33
  Or if you're teaching about essential oils, be there when they're harvesting tons of material
• 27:41
  to turn into an ounce of oil, like really have an experience.
• 27:47
  You don't have to even be doing the teaching wherever you're going.
• 27:50
  They could be an expert there sharing also.
• 27:53
  So you wanna make sure that there's a balance between learning and lounging.
• 28:00
  That is very important and sharing.
• 28:05
  So you might gather after dinner and have like a sharing circle and in the afternoon have some
• 28:12
  fun things, but maybe have two afternoons that are totally free.
• 28:16
  So people might work on whatever it is they're working on that week or just time for a spa
• 28:25
  treatment or something.
• 28:26
  So you wanna make sure there's a balance because what happens is if you overfeed people
• 28:35
  and then you make an offer at the end, they won't feel like taking it because they're
• 28:40
  stuffed already.
• 28:43
  So you wanna lead them to what's next after the retreat and you want room for that.
• 28:52
  Like they see how all of this happened.
• 28:56
  I completed while I was here and now I wanna continue.
• 29:00
  If you throw too much at them, it's like a fire hose, not a retreat.
• 29:09
  Now see, I've always had a very different philosophy on that.
• 29:13
  I've always been like, they paid their money, they're here, I'm gonna teach these people,
• 29:19
  right?
• 29:20
  Like that's always been
• 29:21
  But that's a workshop.
• 29:23
  That's a
• 29:24
  This is what we wanna distinguish because that's how most people think.
• 29:30
  This is not a workshop in a pretty place.
• 29:33
  This is a retreat.
• 29:35
  The word retreat means to go inward, to go within.
• 29:40
  So the model needs to be different.
• 29:43
  That's why we've got live events where people are on a stage.
• 29:47
  We got workshops where they're diving into like juicy content and they're gonna get shit done.
• 29:53
  Or we're gonna go on a retreat where we're gonna have a full out life changing, turn your
• 30:00
  head around experience.
• 30:03
  And each should be its own thing.
• 30:07
  So, all right, what is the minimum number people should try to recruit in order for their
• 30:15
  retreat to be profitable and manageable?
• 30:19
  Well, it really depends on what you're teaching and you personally, like for example, some
• 30:25
  people do very deep transformational, you know, personal growth work.
• 30:31
  If that's what I was doing, I'd max out at about 12.
• 30:35
  If I was doing like a business mastermind, if I had an assistant, I could do 20 people easily.
• 30:44
  However, if I wanted to work with a small number of clients very intimately, I might pick
• 30:49
  five.
• 30:51
  The thing is you have to take what you wanna net Melinda.
• 30:57
  Let's just use 10,000 because it's an even number.
• 31:00
  Okay.
• 31:00
  If you wanna net that 10,000 and you have five people coming, the price of the retreat is
• 31:07
  going to be a lot higher, right?
• 31:10
  Because we're gonna take that $10,000 We're gonna divide it by five.
• 31:15
  We're gonna put in $2,000 profit per person.
• 31:21
  Now, I had 10 people and I wanted to still net $10,000 then I would put in a thousand.
• 31:35
  So if you wanna make 50,000, then you have to divide it by the lowest number of people you
• 31:45
  think will come, not on your expected number of people.
• 31:50
  And that way you will always make the net you expect.
• 31:55
  So if you want 10 on the trip, but you would do five as a minimum, would price on five, not on
• 32:03
  10.
• 32:04
  And I would divide that 10,000 by five.
• 32:07
  And that way, every person above five, I'm making extra money.
• 32:13
  Got it.
• 32:14
  So you do your budget on five, but the stretch goal is 10.
• 32:19
  That's what you're telling me.
• 32:21
  Yes.
• 32:23
  And that will always get you making money.
• 32:26
  And that's what everyone does wrong.
• 32:28
  They price on the number of people they want.
• 32:31
  Yeah, it's normal.
• 32:33
  Yeah, I've done it.
• 32:34
  I've done it.
• 32:34
  I've done it too, but it's not, it won't work.
• 32:37
  No, it will not.
• 32:38
  No, it will not.
• 32:39
  Well, listen, Sherry, you have been so amazing.
• 32:41
  I'm gonna ask you one last question and then we're gonna wrap this up.
• 32:45
  Sherri, what is the best business advice anyone has ever given you?
• 32:52
  The best business advice I ever got was from my teacher, Damego Ruiz.
• 32:58
  He says, don't take anything personally.
• 33:01
  That means don't even take your business personally.
• 33:06
  Really?
• 33:07
  Really.
• 33:08
  And that way you always stay strong instead of weeping over every up and down in your
• 33:15
  business, because a business is a roller coaster.
• 33:19
  It's always going to be the economy changes, things change, employees come and go, you know,
• 33:27
  you evolve, it's never the same.
• 33:31
  And as an entrepreneur, we make decisions that don't always turn out the way we wish or hope
• 33:39
  they would be.
• 33:40
  I don't take that personally.
• 33:42
  I don't beat myself up.
• 33:43
  I made a choice the best one I could at that moment.
• 33:46
  I don't take it personally.
• 33:48
  I learn from it.
• 33:49
  I move on.
• 33:50
  That keeps my emotional state as constant as possible and stops me from beating myself up
• 33:57
  because I have no desire to do that to myself anymore.
• 34:03
  Wow.
• 34:04
  Well, think that and is really good advice.
• 34:08
  And I just wanna thank you again, Sherry Rosenthal, the Wanderlust Entrepreneur for
• 34:15
  being here with us today.
• 34:18
  For those of you who want to get her advice on how to plan, price, promote and profit from a
• 34:25
  transformational retreat, please head over to wanderlustentrepreneur.com.
• 34:32
  And thank you all so much for listening to this episode of the Small Biz Chat podcast.
• 34:37
  I'm Melinda Emerson, Small Biz Lady, your host.
• 34:40
  And I wanna let you know if you are struggling with sales, if you are tired of getting ghosted
• 34:48
  by your leads, well, I have a resource for you.
• 34:53
  It's our Sales Accelerator Bootcamp.
• 34:56
  It is six weeks of training that is gonna stop all the sales craziness in your business.
• 35:03
  No more feast or famine.
• 35:05
  I promise you, I am the last person that is gonna have to teach you how to sell.
• 35:09
  So if you're interested, I invite you to head over to smallbizladyuniversity.com/bootcamp and
• 35:18
  learn about our six week training on how to get your sales act together because I'm the small
• 35:24
  biz lady and I'm serious about everybody making money.
• 35:27
  Alright.
• 35:28
  Thank you so much for being here for another episode of the Small Biz Chat podcast and I
• 35:33
  will leave you with this.
• 35:35
  You never lose in business.
• 35:37
  Either you win or you learn.
• 35:39
  God bless everybody.
• 35:52
  Wherever you listen to podcasts, and join us next Wednesday for more fantastic information
• 35:57
  and interviews.
• 35:59
  You can find more sources and small business success strategies by visiting Melinda's
• 36:03
  website, succeedasyourownboss.com.
• 36:07
  Thanks again for listening, and we'll see you next week.