Latest / The You Project / #1599 Singing For The King - Josh Piterman

Transcript

#1599 Singing For The King - Josh Piterman · The You Project

0:01
Speaker 1: It's halfs, it's Jumbo. It's Melissa, It's Josh. That's right,
0:06
Speaker 1: that's right, it's Melissa. Before we go and talk to
0:09
Speaker 1: the great man, let's talk to the great woman. Let's
0:11
Speaker 1: talk to the bloody life force of TYP, the blood
0:15
Speaker 1: that flows through the TYP veins the engine room. Hi,
0:20
Speaker 1: where have you? Everybody? Do you know how many people
0:24
Speaker 1: go to me? There's Melissa?
0:25
Speaker 2: All right?
0:26
Speaker 1: Where's Melissa? Are you all right?
0:28
Speaker 3: I am more than all right, thank you.
0:29
Speaker 4: I'm here.
0:30
Speaker 3: I've just been hiding in the TYP hammock.
0:32
Speaker 1: Have you just had your feed up, having a bit
0:35
Speaker 1: of a sabbatical. That's not true. You're working very hard
0:38
Speaker 1: behind this lens.
0:39
Speaker 3: Between that and the jacuzzi, just kind of, you know.
0:41
Speaker 1: Alternating hammock jacuzzi, hammock jacuzzi.
0:44
Speaker 2: Yeah.
0:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, it is very nice to see you back
0:48
Speaker 1: in the cyber studio, that is TYP. You've been missed.
0:52
Speaker 1: You are loved by the multitudes people. Everyone loved Tiff,
0:56
Speaker 1: of course, but they also love you because you were
0:59
Speaker 1: in the round floor. You were the you were the genesis.
1:03
Speaker 1: You were the beginning of this. So are you okay?
1:08
Speaker 1: I'm more than okay.
1:09
Speaker 3: Thank you. We've just been chipping it away at a
1:12
Speaker 3: few things behind the scenes. You would have been doing
1:15
Speaker 3: a wonderful job, have we? Yes? Yeah?
1:18
Speaker 1: And what do we call you?
1:19
Speaker 2: Do?
1:19
Speaker 1: We call you the BDM, the business development manager, the CEO,
1:22
Speaker 1: the head bossy bossy person, head bossy person. There is
1:29
Speaker 1: another name that won't get used on the show that
1:31
Speaker 1: the head bossy person will call her. Just steering the
1:36
Speaker 1: sst yp into into murky waters and choppy waters and
1:42
Speaker 1: then back out into the bay. Dear, Well, we're glad
1:46
Speaker 1: you're back.
1:47
Speaker 3: Thank you.
1:48
Speaker 1: Before we go to Josh, your dog sitting at the moment,
1:50
Speaker 1: which is one of your favorite things to do. How's
1:53
Speaker 1: your house guest?
1:54
Speaker 3: Look, he's great, Thank you. I fed him an early
1:57
Speaker 3: dinner so that he didn't interrupt this, so hopefully he
2:00
Speaker 3: settles right.
2:01
Speaker 1: Well, good, I'm glad. Hello, Josh, welcome back to the show.
2:05
Speaker 2: Good a heart, Good day, Melissa, lovely to be back
2:10
Speaker 2: on the show. What kind of dog have you got there?
2:12
Speaker 2: Between you? Hamming and Jacuzi.
2:16
Speaker 3: Just in the sun. He's a little multi sit so
2:19
Speaker 3: he's thirteen. His name's Hugo, but he thinks he's two,
2:22
Speaker 3: so nobody's told him, so he just runs around like
2:25
Speaker 3: a two year old?
2:26
Speaker 2: Which is is the one that do we call that's
2:28
Speaker 2: the one that's like varying types of pooh. That's a
2:30
Speaker 2: multi ship, isn't it.
2:32
Speaker 1: A multi ship? I've done many of them myself, but
2:35
Speaker 1: it's a different thing.
2:36
Speaker 2: I think we all think we all have there so
2:38
Speaker 2: many varying degrees And what are we four minutes into
2:41
Speaker 2: this podcast and we've already digressed here myself for that?
2:47
Speaker 2: You got to own your ship put in my hand.
2:50
Speaker 1: I don't think this sentence has ever come out of
2:53
Speaker 1: anyone's mouth ever before. What kind of dog do you
2:56
Speaker 1: have between your Yeah, like, for sure you were going
3:02
Speaker 1: to say legs, I'm like, well, no, Hammick and Jacuzzi.
3:05
Speaker 4: There it is no digress.
3:07
Speaker 2: But I'm not I'm not vile.
3:10
Speaker 1: No, Well you could have said between your legs, that's okay,
3:13
Speaker 1: Just that's where dogs often just put their head on
3:15
Speaker 1: your knee and just fucking live there when you're trying
3:17
Speaker 1: to concentrate when you're watching a bit of Netflix. Well, mate,
3:21
Speaker 1: welcome back. We appreciate you. I know you've come off
3:23
Speaker 1: the bench. This was short notice. You had a lot
3:25
Speaker 1: of more important things than me, and this and us today.
3:28
Speaker 1: But you you graciously accepted the offer and helped us out.
3:32
Speaker 1: So thanks. You and I have been hanging out a
3:35
Speaker 1: little bit. You and I've been chilling a bit, all right,
3:38
Speaker 1: more than a little bit. We're pretty much see you
3:40
Speaker 1: more than I see any of my mates. Okay, we've
3:43
Speaker 1: been hanging out a lot, a.
3:45
Speaker 4: Lot, Yes, and you've been helping me.
3:48
Speaker 2: You've been helping me a lot, hartsh I think listeners
3:52
Speaker 2: need to know that, you know, on a macro and
3:56
Speaker 2: micro level what Hahaps is a helper.
3:59
Speaker 4: He's very very good at helping people.
4:01
Speaker 2: And so you know, I feel like the journey I've
4:05
Speaker 2: had if listeners have come across me on the previous
4:08
Speaker 2: podcast of you know, playing the Phantom and the Phantom
4:11
Speaker 2: of the Opera here in London and Jean Valjehn and
4:13
Speaker 2: lame Is in London, and these sort of quite high
4:17
Speaker 2: pressure filled big roles in big musicals, the sort of
4:21
Speaker 2: the mecha of them on the West End. Yeah, they
4:25
Speaker 2: don't come as linear, easy journeys. They come with a
4:28
Speaker 2: lot of stories and a lot of ups and downs
4:30
Speaker 2: and struggles and writing the roller coaster and climbing the
4:33
Speaker 2: summit is never an easy task, and Harps has helped
4:37
Speaker 2: me to put those experiences into words and ways that
4:43
Speaker 2: I can share them in keynote presentations and keynotes with
4:47
Speaker 2: a twist, kenotes with the song, seminars, various stuff because
4:51
Speaker 2: you learn a lot of lessons, you know, experiencing those
4:53
Speaker 2: ups and downs of performance world like that. So thank
4:57
Speaker 2: you Harps, who've been a amazing help.
5:01
Speaker 1: Well, I said to you yesterday and this is true. Everyone,
5:03
Speaker 1: we caught up yesterday, and I've never had a better student.
5:08
Speaker 1: Maybe have had a few students who are good, but
5:10
Speaker 1: I've never had a better student. Because we meet and
5:12
Speaker 1: we talk and then I say, great, now go away
5:16
Speaker 1: and do this, and then you come back and everything
5:19
Speaker 1: I've asked you to do is done to the highest standard.
5:23
Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh my god. I'm so used to
5:26
Speaker 1: people not either not doing what I asked them to
5:29
Speaker 1: do at all or going essentially the dog ate my homework, right,
5:33
Speaker 1: but for you to turn up and do everything, you know.
5:36
Speaker 1: But so what we're talking about, you know, is Josh
5:39
Speaker 1: is going to do a little bit of corporate stuff.
5:41
Speaker 1: He's he's still the world renowned a stage performer that
5:46
Speaker 1: he is, and he's doing a little bit more of
5:48
Speaker 1: stage work or he's going to it's just a bit different.
5:50
Speaker 1: He's stepping into the keynote presenting and some workshops and
5:54
Speaker 1: a bit of mind stuff and a bit of soul
5:56
Speaker 1: stuff and a bit of human behavior stuff, and a
5:58
Speaker 1: little bit of who are we? How are we? And
6:00
Speaker 1: why are we the way we are stuff? You know.
6:03
Speaker 1: And it is interesting though, because you and I have spoken.
6:07
Speaker 1: We have quite disparate journeys and stories and lives, but
6:11
Speaker 1: at the same time, there's a lot of similarity. Like
6:14
Speaker 1: you're a communicator, I'm a communicator. You're on stage a lot.
6:17
Speaker 1: I've been on stage a lot. Your stages have been
6:20
Speaker 1: bigger than mine, that's for sure. But you know, the
6:23
Speaker 1: things that we have in common is that we want
6:25
Speaker 1: to create a good experience for people. We want to
6:27
Speaker 1: connect with people. We want to tell a story, you know,
6:31
Speaker 1: maybe inspire, maybe move people emotionally. So even though I'm
6:36
Speaker 1: the corporate speaker dude, and you're the you know, you're
6:39
Speaker 1: the singer, you're the stage performer, dude, it's not it's
6:43
Speaker 1: not light years apart, is it.
6:46
Speaker 2: No, Because the nuclears or where that seed of where
6:51
Speaker 2: my purpose and your purpose lives and what that seed
6:54
Speaker 2: is is very similar. How you go and plant that
6:56
Speaker 2: into the world might be in different spaces, but I
7:00
Speaker 2: say that, you know, I'm a storyteller, communicator, and I
7:04
Speaker 2: want to facilitate stories that enable people to feel the
7:08
Speaker 2: depths of what the human experience is. And whether or
7:12
Speaker 2: not I'm you know, telling that through my podcast or
7:15
Speaker 2: facilitating opportunities for others to tell their stories through my podcast,
7:18
Speaker 2: or whether I'm playing Jean Valjean or the phantom and
7:21
Speaker 2: embodying a character that enables you to feel deeply and
7:25
Speaker 2: connect with those characters. It's you know, the vessels can vary,
7:32
Speaker 2: but the purpose or the origin of that purpose is
7:35
Speaker 2: the same. I think we do have very similar perps,
7:38
Speaker 2: which is, you know, to communicate in ways that help
7:42
Speaker 2: people understand their own human experience and help them on
7:46
Speaker 2: that path and hopefully inspire them a bit. So there
7:51
Speaker 2: are some similarities. I want to say on the homework
7:53
Speaker 2: front that as an actor, I was a performer. You
8:00
Speaker 2: just can't be shit at doing your homework. Ultimately, I
8:03
Speaker 2: have a say in what I want to put out
8:05
Speaker 2: there on stage, but a director is guiding me throughout
8:07
Speaker 2: that experience and they're shaping everything and turning the knobs
8:11
Speaker 2: on everything. So every day you come back into a
8:13
Speaker 2: rehearsal room, you're expected to bring back what was worked
8:18
Speaker 2: on yesterday and the notes that were given. And so
8:20
Speaker 2: you become a professional taking direction, a professional doing your homework.
8:24
Speaker 4: Yes, and so I think I've just got very good
8:28
Speaker 4: at that.
8:28
Speaker 2: On the flip side, I don't like letting people down
8:31
Speaker 2: and I don't like upsetting people.
8:33
Speaker 4: And so the appeasa or plicator.
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Speaker 2: In me which is not always a part of me
8:40
Speaker 2: that I enjoy because that leads me down passing. You know,
8:44
Speaker 2: maybe in relationships and stuff that means that you know,
8:48
Speaker 2: I don't always express everything I'm feeling.
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Speaker 4: So I don't want to upset the other person.
8:51
Speaker 2: Yes, there's always account found that, but in this relationship
8:55
Speaker 2: between you and me, it makes me the good student,
8:58
Speaker 2: a little pad on the head, you're a good boy.
9:01
Speaker 1: Well, a big elephant staff I'm going to tell everybody
9:04
Speaker 1: right so, and it's no biggie, but so one of
9:06
Speaker 1: the things that I've done with hundreds of people who
9:09
Speaker 1: sit down and say to me, you know, I want
9:11
Speaker 1: to I want to get into professional speaking. I want
9:15
Speaker 1: to do some corporate speaking, or I just want to
9:17
Speaker 1: get better and speaking, or you know, I want to
9:19
Speaker 1: open that door and see where it goes.
9:20
Speaker 2: And so I.
9:22
Speaker 1: Essentially say to people, okay, come up with a couple
9:24
Speaker 1: of titles. Come up with two, three, four titles for
9:27
Speaker 1: what we would call a keynote. A keynote is just
9:30
Speaker 1: a presentation that you do to a group to inform, inspire, educate, connect, build, rapport,
9:35
Speaker 1: and lighten whatever. Right, And it's it's a pretty uh
9:40
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's most times professional speakers. It's really varied.
9:45
Speaker 1: But a lot of professional speakers have two or three
9:48
Speaker 1: key Comma keynotes that they wheel out and that's about it.
9:53
Speaker 1: And so they have three or four two or three products.
9:56
Speaker 1: And you know, like I've been at conferences where I
9:59
Speaker 1: have over lapped with or spoken with several speakers, many
10:05
Speaker 1: speakers in fact, that we've been on the same card
10:08
Speaker 1: multiple times. And so some of them I've heard six
10:11
Speaker 1: or seven times, and I've heard pretty much word for word,
10:14
Speaker 1: the same forty five minutes with the same inflections, the
10:18
Speaker 1: same stories, the same pauses, the same video at the
10:21
Speaker 1: same time. And it's okay, but it's very performative and
10:27
Speaker 1: you're a bit of a one trick pony, and there's
10:29
Speaker 1: not a whole lot of I guess in the moment
10:34
Speaker 1: kind of authentic connection because it's essentially a performance, and
10:40
Speaker 1: of course performances can, as Josh knows, can connect, but
10:44
Speaker 1: when you're basically say, the art of them.
10:48
Speaker 2: Yes, really, the art of what I do is when
10:49
Speaker 2: you're doing playing the Phantom or seven or eight times
10:52
Speaker 2: a week, he's trying to make it fresh for an
10:54
Speaker 2: audience who are seeing it for the first time. Yeah,
10:57
Speaker 2: and that's my duty. Director's judi is to Keith mincheck
11:02
Speaker 2: and within boundaries, and my judi is to try and
11:04
Speaker 2: push those boundaries so that it feels in new and
11:06
Speaker 2: interesting to me.
11:07
Speaker 1: But one hundred percent and the divergence for you here
11:11
Speaker 1: is that you are going to get on stage multiple
11:14
Speaker 1: times and basically do a different opera or do a
11:18
Speaker 1: different you know. It's like and I've said to you, sorry,
11:22
Speaker 1: different musical and like you might go to you know,
11:26
Speaker 1: Telstra on Monday next week and you do a keynote
11:30
Speaker 1: and you kill it, and then the conference organizer goes, Josh,
11:33
Speaker 1: that was awesome. Can you come back next week and
11:36
Speaker 1: do something different? And a lot of speakers. The answer
11:39
Speaker 1: is no, like I only know two songs and I
11:43
Speaker 1: sang them. So so I asked you to come up
11:46
Speaker 1: with ten. No, originally it was five. And then I
11:50
Speaker 1: said to another, so I said, come up with five
11:52
Speaker 1: titles for keynotes and five synopsis or five overviews. So
11:59
Speaker 1: in other words, it's the title of the presentation. Now
12:02
Speaker 1: write one hundred words or so about that or two
12:04
Speaker 1: hundred words. And then we met a couple of weeks ago.
12:07
Speaker 1: You turned up and you've done it and was ten
12:09
Speaker 1: out of ten. And I went, all right, good, do
12:11
Speaker 1: five more, and then also do three half day slash
12:15
Speaker 1: full day workshops that you might do. Because one of
12:18
Speaker 1: the things that people don't realize is if you are
12:23
Speaker 1: good at what you do, or they like you or
12:25
Speaker 1: connect with you, and they see you as a safe
12:28
Speaker 1: bet for their group and a good investment for their organization,
12:32
Speaker 1: they want to keep working with you. They don't want
12:35
Speaker 1: to take a risk on an unknown presenter, you know,
12:39
Speaker 1: they don't want to spend however many thousand dollars it is,
12:41
Speaker 1: and hope that this lady or that this bloke is
12:44
Speaker 1: good doesn't mean they're going to get you back thousand times,
12:47
Speaker 1: but it means if you kill it, they're probably going
12:49
Speaker 1: to get you back. And so having that diversity and
12:51
Speaker 1: having a range or in other words, having a menu
12:55
Speaker 1: of presentations and professional offerings under the banner of corporate work,
13:01
Speaker 1: you know, and also the the kind of the hell
13:05
Speaker 1: what's the word? The bloody the golden leg that you've
13:10
Speaker 1: got is that you can sing in the middle of
13:12
Speaker 1: your fucking presentations, which is very unfair to the rest
13:15
Speaker 1: of us who have no talent.
13:18
Speaker 2: Well, you did say that the important thing about these
13:23
Speaker 2: keynotes is that they're unique to you and you're sharing
13:27
Speaker 2: your unique story, and I sort of took that as also,
13:31
Speaker 2: I can share in a way that is unique to me.
13:33
Speaker 2: And songs are storytelling or a way to sell stories.
13:38
Speaker 2: So you know, I've got one of the ten presentations
13:42
Speaker 2: I've got now is run from what's comfortable live where
13:46
Speaker 2: you fear to live, and it's about stepping into fear,
13:49
Speaker 2: about stepping into discomfort. And I shared a story with
13:52
Speaker 2: you both yesterday where I'd always had a fear of
14:00
Speaker 2: singing on television, and the fear was big public failure
14:06
Speaker 2: and being embarrassed by stuffing up on television on live TV.
14:11
Speaker 4: Where you can't get it back.
14:12
Speaker 2: It winds up on YouTube or on social media and
14:16
Speaker 2: you have a big.
14:17
Speaker 4: Crack or whatever.
14:18
Speaker 2: And so I've sung a couple of anthems, but I've
14:20
Speaker 2: never sung a real song on live television. And so
14:23
Speaker 2: I had this opportunity via John Foreman, who some listeners
14:27
Speaker 2: might know. He's one of this country's great composers orchestral
14:32
Speaker 2: A's conductors. If you ever see Carols by Candlelight, he's
14:35
Speaker 2: always conducting the orchestra of Carols by Candlelight, amongst other things.
14:39
Speaker 2: And we did an album together probably twenty seventeen eighteen,
14:43
Speaker 2: and he contacted me and he said I was in Italy,
14:49
Speaker 2: in Tuscany on a bit of a holiday and he
14:50
Speaker 2: contacted me and said, hey, we're doing Australia Day Live,
14:55
Speaker 2: which is an annual concert they do on the fore
14:56
Speaker 2: Court Sydney Opera House. There's about eighty thousand people across
15:01
Speaker 2: the fore court there and along Circular Key and wraps
15:03
Speaker 2: all the way around and there's you know, the state
15:06
Speaker 2: government put it on. It's a fifteen to twenty million
15:09
Speaker 2: dollar budget or whatever else. And it's live on ABC
15:12
Speaker 2: or Channel ten every year and so there'll be you know,
15:15
Speaker 2: a few hundred thousand people watching, maybe you know international
15:19
Speaker 2: as well. Would you like to sing NESSA and drdmer
15:23
Speaker 2: which is the most famous aria, it's the Pavarotti aria
15:27
Speaker 2: or song. It's you know, and it just.
15:31
Speaker 4: Has that you know, massive note at the end you.
15:36
Speaker 2: Don't want to stap it up. So it's not like
15:38
Speaker 2: Gus out there and see bar bar black Sheep and
15:40
Speaker 2: not nasional people. It's seeing one of the most challenging
15:45
Speaker 2: songs ever with the City Sympody orchestra. And so I
15:48
Speaker 2: was like every part of me wanted to say no.
15:51
Speaker 2: Every single part of me wanted to say no. Because
15:54
Speaker 2: when you get an offer like that and you are
15:56
Speaker 2: you've imprisoned yourself in fear for that many years and
15:59
Speaker 2: set know to these opportunities or said yes and then
16:03
Speaker 2: got sick or whatever it is, you just feel that fear,
16:09
Speaker 2: That adrenaline kicks in and that fight or flight response
16:14
Speaker 2: kicks in, and you just want to do this these
16:18
Speaker 2: I was just say no, and somehow, for some reason
16:22
Speaker 2: I felt all that and just said yes. And for
16:26
Speaker 2: the ensuing month was October. So for the next three months,
16:30
Speaker 2: basically all I sung, all I practiced with my coach.
16:33
Speaker 4: All I did was ness and dormer.
16:34
Speaker 2: I lived and breathed ness and dormer to a point
16:37
Speaker 2: where it was impossible for that not to live inside
16:41
Speaker 2: my bones, my blood, my muscles, my nervous system. Even
16:46
Speaker 2: if everything went wrong, muscle memory would kick in in
16:50
Speaker 2: performance and I'd still sing it to a great standard.
16:55
Speaker 2: And that moment of before Steven out on stage, I
17:01
Speaker 2: remember I had some sort of mantras to myself, like
17:06
Speaker 2: I am free, I am calm, I am adventurous, I'm present,
17:12
Speaker 2: i am limitless. It's this sort of and I remember
17:18
Speaker 2: there's a sort of moment midway through the song with
17:22
Speaker 2: a choir kick in, just before the final part, the
17:26
Speaker 2: big ending, and then the final big note, and the
17:29
Speaker 2: choir is there, and I just looked around and went,
17:32
Speaker 2: I'm looking at a sea if people, and the backdrop
17:35
Speaker 2: is the Sydney Opera House and the fireworks about to
17:38
Speaker 2: go off, and I knew they're about to go off,
17:40
Speaker 2: and I fucking out, this is my life. This is
17:48
Speaker 2: the most wonderful thing in the world. I fifteen years
17:53
Speaker 2: ago had never sung a note, and here I am
17:57
Speaker 2: facing the Sydney Opera House singing one of the greatest
18:00
Speaker 2: years of all time on national television. Let it fucking rip, kid,
18:05
Speaker 2: and I just went blistic at the end, like and
18:09
Speaker 2: the fireworks kicked off, and it was and I held
18:12
Speaker 2: the last note for you know, twice as long as
18:15
Speaker 2: I've ever held it for. I went to town on
18:17
Speaker 2: it and it was a life changing moment. It literally
18:23
Speaker 2: changed my life because within months, a couple of months
18:27
Speaker 2: after that, I was over in London. The footage had
18:32
Speaker 2: been seen by Sir Cameron McIntosh Andrew Lloyd Webber and
18:35
Speaker 2: they were like, get this kid over, we need to
18:37
Speaker 2: see him for Phantom of the Opera. They gave me
18:40
Speaker 2: the role and I was playing Phantom of the Opera
18:42
Speaker 2: on the West End and from then on I went
18:45
Speaker 2: playing it from there for how many hundreds of shows
18:47
Speaker 2: played at the Sydney Opera House. I've got to go into
18:49
Speaker 2: the Opera House And it was just sort of looking
18:51
Speaker 2: back on that moment and going shit, if I didn't
18:53
Speaker 2: do that, sours, I wouldn't have done this indoors Yes,
18:56
Speaker 2: played in Melbourne. Then they got me straight back to
18:58
Speaker 2: play the leading Lambers are up in London straight after
19:03
Speaker 2: Phantom finished, and so that was a five year period
19:05
Speaker 2: of doing all these extraordinary things, or because I said
19:09
Speaker 2: yes to something that was so scary and it was
19:14
Speaker 2: full of fear and was full of discomfort, And so
19:18
Speaker 2: I just implore people you are always going to feel fear,
19:23
Speaker 2: But fear, as Craig says, is an optional, but courage
19:29
Speaker 2: is optional. And that was maybe the most courageous thing
19:34
Speaker 2: I ever did, was saying yes.
19:35
Speaker 4: It doesn't mean the work's not going to be It
19:37
Speaker 4: doesn't mean I.
19:37
Speaker 2: Didn't have to put in hours and hours and hours
19:39
Speaker 2: about some of the area before. But I've been the
19:42
Speaker 2: ten tenors. It's sung with so many times, but not
19:44
Speaker 2: solo and under those conditions. And yeah, so running from
19:49
Speaker 2: what's comfortable and living where I feared to live literally
19:52
Speaker 2: changed my life.
19:53
Speaker 1: I love it. And there's one keynote. Yeah, yeah, that's it.
19:57
Speaker 1: I would imagine this is a technical question. But the
20:02
Speaker 1: obviously the acoustics outdoors in the acoustics indoors are different
20:06
Speaker 1: like outdoors, there are no acoustics of sorts at.
20:10
Speaker 2: Concert like this, Speakers everywhere, and I was on a
20:13
Speaker 2: big catwalk along the catwalk there's fallback speakers roll all
20:18
Speaker 2: the way across like right, and I had in ears
20:20
Speaker 2: in it's like it's popping with sound. In fact, it
20:24
Speaker 2: felt amazing to sing out there that the sound that
20:26
Speaker 2: they create for you, right, it felt like a boomy
20:29
Speaker 2: concert hall. It was awesome.
20:31
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, Mike, you know how your mantra, what
20:34
Speaker 1: was your mantra again before you went out? What were
20:37
Speaker 1: you what were you saying?
20:39
Speaker 2: I am calm, I am infinite, I am present. Yeah,
20:46
Speaker 2: I think there's one of the often that's like I
20:48
Speaker 2: am love. You know, for me, that's just like state,
20:51
Speaker 2: don't contract, interfear, lead with your heart open, keep your
20:56
Speaker 2: heart open, keep your heart open because as a performer
21:00
Speaker 2: up you know this is making sound, but all of
21:03
Speaker 2: what's inside of you, your soul and your heart is
21:06
Speaker 2: actually what you what you're communicating.
21:09
Speaker 1: Min mind mantor would be don't fuck it up, don't
21:11
Speaker 1: fuck it up, don't fuck it up. You knew I
21:13
Speaker 1: was going to say that melisted you don't fuck it up.
21:16
Speaker 2: I don't about what what I've learnt about mantras in
21:21
Speaker 2: terms of communicating with yourself, the make it the positive
21:27
Speaker 2: not negative. It doesn't operate. It only hears the fuck
21:31
Speaker 2: it up. If you say don't it only hears the
21:33
Speaker 2: so you're beginning fuck it up up you don't so
21:36
Speaker 2: only working positives or only actually only work in present moment,
21:40
Speaker 2: not I will, I will, I am they now?
21:46
Speaker 1: So So that so doing that thing, that thing that
21:49
Speaker 1: you were scared of, and being courageous in that moment,
21:52
Speaker 1: you know, apart from the practical outcome of getting a
21:55
Speaker 1: phone call and going basically around the world and becoming
21:59
Speaker 1: a fucking superstar, which is awesome, but what did that
22:03
Speaker 1: do for you in terms of, you know, resilience and
22:06
Speaker 1: confidence and self awareness and self understanding and having a
22:12
Speaker 1: different perspective about your own ability and potential?
22:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, potential is like it's like talent, right, It's just
22:22
Speaker 2: a seed that's a beautiful looking seed. But if you
22:26
Speaker 2: don't plant it well and nourish at well and fertilize
22:30
Speaker 2: it and water and give it the sun it needs,
22:33
Speaker 2: it just ends up being a seed of potential. It
22:36
Speaker 2: just ends up being potentially wasted talent. So I've always
22:41
Speaker 2: been big on because I wasn't that talented to start with. Really,
22:44
Speaker 2: I had a little seed, but I work took us
22:47
Speaker 2: off the water and fertilize and feed and put the
22:52
Speaker 2: sun that needed to be on it. To make me
22:54
Speaker 2: the best I could be. What I struggled with was
22:58
Speaker 2: my own academic mind and getting in the way of
23:01
Speaker 2: what lives beneath that mind, that could talk me into
23:05
Speaker 2: it or out of it. And so what that opportunity
23:08
Speaker 2: gave me was just trust, trust of my own capabilities.
23:12
Speaker 2: That you know my mantra. Since then, there's many times
23:16
Speaker 2: just spent I'm capable. I am capable. I'm so fucking capable. Yes,
23:23
Speaker 2: And I can reflect upon those moments and go, what
23:27
Speaker 2: did you feel, what happened? What was the outcome. I've
23:30
Speaker 2: got a history bank there of going you're going to
23:32
Speaker 2: be okay, no matter what it is, it ain't going
23:35
Speaker 2: to be as big as that. And I've said to
23:37
Speaker 2: you guys, I've sat on tables with King Charles and
23:40
Speaker 2: some for him. I've done opening nights of big shows
23:42
Speaker 2: on the West End, and I've sung Boxing Day at
23:46
Speaker 2: the mcg and all subsequent things Final at Rod Labor
23:49
Speaker 2: Arena and all subsequent big, big performances, and nothing has
23:54
Speaker 2: ever felt as scary as that first one because and
23:58
Speaker 2: it's not that I don't get nervous, of course, you
23:59
Speaker 2: get a nerver, you know, the fucking line gets nervous
24:02
Speaker 2: before it's about to eat a zebra because it cares.
24:05
Speaker 2: So if I wasn't nervous, I think there's something worrying
24:08
Speaker 2: about it, because that's just me caring about it. But
24:11
Speaker 2: those stabilitating nerves and that that part of me that goes, no,
24:15
Speaker 2: don't do that, that fear republic failure, I don't. I
24:17
Speaker 2: don't get that like that anymore. It's more I can't
24:22
Speaker 2: wait to get out there knowing what I'm capable of
24:25
Speaker 2: sharing and that feeling because I wasn't really in life.
24:29
Speaker 2: You know, all these things that we achieve and all
24:32
Speaker 2: these things that we're striving for, they can be replaceable,
24:37
Speaker 2: but the feeling you can't replace. And that feeling is
24:41
Speaker 2: of transcendence, that amazing, blissful feeling where you're beyond your
24:47
Speaker 2: own self and you expand to this other level of self.
24:52
Speaker 2: And I love that feeling. And I know that the
24:55
Speaker 2: only thing that stops me from having that feeling is
24:57
Speaker 2: getting my own way. So it's taught me how to
25:01
Speaker 2: get out of my own way. Just step into that space.
25:05
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, tell I don't know if you can tell
25:08
Speaker 1: us everything you told me about sitting at a table
25:11
Speaker 1: with the king in Charles called kinghy and singing for him.
25:15
Speaker 1: But tell my listeners about that, because I loved that story.
25:22
Speaker 4: Yeah.
25:23
Speaker 2: So it was the Friday, I'm going to call it
25:27
Speaker 2: like that, sixteenth of March or something, twenty twenty. So
25:29
Speaker 2: I'll be playing the Fantom for you know, six or
25:32
Speaker 2: so months, and COVID was coming. You know, we sort
25:35
Speaker 2: of knew that was coming. But it was the Friday
25:38
Speaker 2: before the Monday that Boris called everything. Boris Johnson called
25:43
Speaker 2: everything closed. And I'd say that sort of like writing.
25:47
Speaker 2: At the top of a career, I get a In fact,
25:51
Speaker 2: so Cameron Macintosh gets a handwritten letter from the Australian
25:59
Speaker 2: High Commission asking that I be released for a night
26:05
Speaker 2: performance to perform for Prince Charles.
26:07
Speaker 4: Prince charleser, that's.
26:09
Speaker 2: A beautiful, hand handwritten letter, and it was for the book.
26:15
Speaker 4: It was a bush fire appeal.
26:16
Speaker 2: I think we all remember those hideous bushfires are twenty
26:19
Speaker 2: nineteen twenty. And as you know, King Charles is a
26:22
Speaker 2: big advocate for climate action, and so he was the
26:27
Speaker 2: keynote and the guest of honor and and so they
26:31
Speaker 2: plumped me on a on a table with him. I
26:36
Speaker 2: didn't get there until a bit a bit later through
26:38
Speaker 2: the main course because I was warming up and whatever.
26:40
Speaker 2: And so it was at the Mayor of London's place
26:46
Speaker 2: in this grand ballroom for some of the.
26:49
Speaker 4: Most distinguished guests.
26:50
Speaker 2: You could like, there's a song from My Fair Lady
26:56
Speaker 2: and it's the as Scott Gavotte and it's ever really
27:01
Speaker 2: duke and pr and it was literally like that every
27:06
Speaker 2: duke and and I was just like, this is ridiculous.
27:11
Speaker 2: How many you know? And news cameras and all this
27:14
Speaker 2: sort of stuff, and it was a.
27:15
Speaker 4: Big bloody deal.
27:16
Speaker 2: I was getting five fed on Channel nine back to
27:19
Speaker 2: Australia and so Adam Hills actually hosted it. He was
27:26
Speaker 2: the MC and so I performed a few songs and
27:31
Speaker 2: and it was awesome, and then just sat on a
27:33
Speaker 2: table like like just next to Prince Cho King Charts
27:38
Speaker 2: and just had chats about.
27:41
Speaker 4: He's like, you know, how do you go with all
27:45
Speaker 4: the pressure and all that. I was like, how do
27:47
Speaker 4: I go with the pressure.
27:50
Speaker 2: I'm just getting pressure on my performance, You're getting pressure
27:55
Speaker 2: on your existence And he goes.
27:57
Speaker 4: Oh, yes, different, very different.
28:00
Speaker 2: Well then he's like sort of talking about I sort
28:02
Speaker 2: of talked about that with him and dealing with external
28:05
Speaker 2: noise and studden we sort of had a human experienced conversations.
28:08
Speaker 2: Buddy awesome, but subsequently he's very overtly gay. P A
28:19
Speaker 2: was like lovely guy, but he just proceeded to get
28:25
Speaker 2: more and more drunk for throughout the night. And I
28:31
Speaker 2: was with my exit at that stage, D'm Charlotte, and
28:34
Speaker 2: he he just he would not allow her to be
28:38
Speaker 2: my girlfriend. He was just like a mate. Oh, your friend,
28:42
Speaker 2: your friend, you know, and like he sort of off
28:45
Speaker 2: started offering me these gigs, and he was touchy everywhere.
28:49
Speaker 4: Anything he said.
28:50
Speaker 2: Had to be like a hand somewhere, and yeah, I
28:54
Speaker 2: was just and he works for the king, and he
28:57
Speaker 2: was just so overtly affectionate touch you. But it was just,
29:01
Speaker 2: you know, there was gigs in Rwanda. It's like you
29:03
Speaker 2: can come in a couple of months and and so
29:04
Speaker 2: it felt like he was sort of setting me up
29:06
Speaker 2: to become you know, the King's you know, private entertainer,
29:11
Speaker 2: which would have been a gig. But then but then Rona,
29:15
Speaker 2: the old mate Roner kicked.
29:17
Speaker 1: In and the world, the world it's gone on to do.
29:22
Speaker 2: I forget his name, Scott, Scott I for anyway, it's
29:26
Speaker 2: it's a double barrel surname. Yeah, he's gone off to
29:30
Speaker 2: do other other things. So I don't have a I
29:33
Speaker 2: don't have a direct line to the king to Kse
29:39
Speaker 2: but you know, yeah, maybe I'll get to sing him again.
29:43
Speaker 2: Do you remember we just talked about pressure. I have
29:47
Speaker 2: a technical question. So with the the the style of
29:53
Speaker 2: music that that you're singing, the style of songs and
29:58
Speaker 2: that you perform, you step in to a.
30:05
Speaker 1: I don't know, an R and B band or a
30:06
Speaker 1: rock band or and collings on the door. Yeah, well
30:11
Speaker 1: there you go.
30:13
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I mean, of course you can, like once
30:16
Speaker 4: you understand.
30:17
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't sound like bon Jovi, because bon
30:18
Speaker 2: Jovi you sound like bon Joviy.
30:19
Speaker 4: But once you understand the mechanics of.
30:22
Speaker 2: The voice, and it is very technical, you understand what
30:25
Speaker 2: is going on in the human voice and how to
30:28
Speaker 2: alter it and whatever. All classical training is is a
30:32
Speaker 2: training that opens up the space at the back of
30:35
Speaker 2: the throat so that there's more breadth and width and
30:40
Speaker 2: richness and roundedness to the sound. Yeah, so no time,
30:46
Speaker 2: like it's just space, whereas rock singing there's no space
30:51
Speaker 2: at the back. It's really thin and like and the
30:54
Speaker 2: cords are like, it's all going out that way rather
30:57
Speaker 2: than opera that's operating. It's all space at the back.
30:59
Speaker 2: So that's I mean, that's a very it's an untechnical
31:04
Speaker 2: way of talking about the pharynx and the vocal tract
31:06
Speaker 2: and whatever. But you geek out on all of that
31:08
Speaker 2: and then you just learn how to manipulate that. And
31:11
Speaker 2: so I've got a really good understanding of the human voice,
31:13
Speaker 2: but with how it contains to everyday people. And we
31:17
Speaker 2: talk about this yesterday. This is one of my seminars,
31:19
Speaker 2: is that you have so much power if you know
31:24
Speaker 2: how to use your voice, and yet ninety nine percent
31:28
Speaker 2: of humans don't know how to use their voice. You
31:30
Speaker 2: have so much power speaking at a dinner party, speaking
31:34
Speaker 2: with your partner, speaking in a room of people, giving
31:37
Speaker 2: a presentation, giving a speech if you just know how
31:41
Speaker 2: to use your voice, and that I'm talking about pitch, rage, tone, cadence,
31:47
Speaker 2: or speed.
31:49
Speaker 4: Where it's resonating.
31:50
Speaker 2: You know all of these things, All of these nuances
31:55
Speaker 2: can pull an audience into you in a way that
31:58
Speaker 2: gives you all the power. And it's it's so easy
32:04
Speaker 2: to learn, and yet so few people know how to
32:08
Speaker 2: do that. It's a technical thing. It's a skill, a
32:11
Speaker 2: quiet skill. It's not just a talent, you know. Oh
32:13
Speaker 2: my god, he was wonderful. I felt his voice was great.
32:16
Speaker 2: And this isn't that like, it isn't a quiet skill,
32:18
Speaker 2: and it's something that literally I could feel like I
32:22
Speaker 2: can teach you anyone a few houts, Like it's not challenging.
32:25
Speaker 2: You just have to know what to do.
32:28
Speaker 1: And then there's that there's like what's happening with your voice?
32:31
Speaker 1: But then there's also I guess, knowing when to talk
32:36
Speaker 1: and not to talk, you know, like that kind of
32:39
Speaker 1: situational awareness as well.
32:43
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, that's fine because I've been talking straight to
32:45
Speaker 2: the last twenty minutes.
32:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you're doing okay. You're the guest. Now feel
32:49
Speaker 1: free to tell me to fuck off.
32:52
Speaker 2: Yeah.
32:52
Speaker 1: Is there any chance that you could sing a bit
32:55
Speaker 1: of something, whether it's like anything? I know, this is
32:59
Speaker 1: an I had, didn't I just sing the Living on
33:03
Speaker 1: a prayer for you? Well, I mean, feel free to
33:06
Speaker 1: say no because I feel like I'm I'm exploiting you. Uh,
33:12
Speaker 1: feel free to say no and we'll take this out.
33:14
Speaker 1: Could you sing a bit of something from Phantom or
33:19
Speaker 1: or whatever? Or Ness and Norma or anything.
33:23
Speaker 2: What does nice time shuts each sense.
33:34
Speaker 4: Darkness and weeks in the U shue sign to me
33:44
Speaker 4: the same sense abandon.
33:48
Speaker 5: The Wow, dude, Wow, that's buddy. How long did it
33:58
Speaker 5: did it take for you?
33:59
Speaker 1: Because you said fifteen years ago or fifteen years before that,
34:02
Speaker 1: you didn't even know that you could sing? Yeah, how
34:05
Speaker 1: did you? How did you even open that door? We
34:08
Speaker 1: spoke about this a bit last time, But when did
34:10
Speaker 1: you start to think, Oh, I'm a singer, not like
34:13
Speaker 1: I'm a guy trying to sing. I'm actually when did
34:16
Speaker 1: that happen?
34:18
Speaker 2: So? I never thought about singing growing up. It wasn't
34:24
Speaker 2: even on the radar. Couldn't be further from the truth
34:27
Speaker 2: of my existence.
34:28
Speaker 4: I was a very.
34:32
Speaker 2: Passionate, charismatic young kid who like to play sport and
34:36
Speaker 2: that was it. Footy, basketball, tennis, cricket like they were before.
34:42
Speaker 2: I like balls, and that's that's what I did. That's
34:47
Speaker 2: what I cared about. I was thinking about doing sports
34:49
Speaker 2: physio or maybe sports and medicine or something like that.
34:53
Speaker 2: And then I then I got into a little bit
35:01
Speaker 2: sort of role at a what's the end of whatever
35:05
Speaker 2: we do at the end of the school a speech? No, right,
35:09
Speaker 2: in year ten, and I had learned how to moonwalk
35:13
Speaker 2: that year because I got right into ax. So I
35:17
Speaker 2: did a little bit of that and then subsequently in
35:20
Speaker 2: year eleven did the same morve just trying to attract
35:23
Speaker 2: some attention and the school cafeteria and got a tap
35:26
Speaker 2: on the shoulder from the guy who directs the school musicals.
35:30
Speaker 2: He said, we're doing a musical called Fame.
35:32
Speaker 4: You do you ever heard of it. I'm like, no,
35:34
Speaker 4: you know, just like that's sort of sixteen year old.
35:37
Speaker 2: Like you know the type, and you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
35:40
Speaker 2: doing the stuff.
35:42
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I just he just said, well, this is
35:48
Speaker 4: this is what it is.
35:49
Speaker 2: You know, if you can come and then you know,
35:52
Speaker 2: as I often do, just came around and I said, okay,
35:54
Speaker 2: I'll go for that and got a roll on it.
35:56
Speaker 2: And I couldn't believe how cool is you know, when
36:01
Speaker 2: you when you are in a community in sport, that
36:04
Speaker 2: community is generally unless you're playing co co sex sports,
36:12
Speaker 2: it's just a bunch of bunch of blocks. Suddenly all
36:16
Speaker 2: these all these girls, and the girls I didn't know
36:18
Speaker 2: that were the theater girls, right, and the music girls.
36:20
Speaker 2: There's a whole bunch of different girls and I was
36:22
Speaker 2: the flirtiest kid going around. I'm like, oh my good,
36:25
Speaker 2: how many people are.
36:25
Speaker 1: Going to get kiss.
36:28
Speaker 2: And so I get to be front and center all
36:30
Speaker 2: that passionate charisma, you know, you get to literally you know,
36:35
Speaker 2: like what what what does? What does Maury Bolstein saying
36:39
Speaker 2: in Zoolander, hands are so heart right. Now we can
36:42
Speaker 2: take a ship in some tinfoil and self like Queen
36:45
Speaker 2: Elizabeth's arrings like I could. You could do whatever you
36:47
Speaker 2: wanted out there and to all your peers, They're like, yeah, Josh,
36:51
Speaker 2: Like so you're getting all this adulation, You're getting all
36:54
Speaker 2: the you know.
36:57
Speaker 4: Whatever, with the with the.
36:59
Speaker 2: Various girls you've met for the first time, and it
37:02
Speaker 2: just was the funnest thing in the world. Plus I
37:06
Speaker 2: was like, I'm creating this character. This is cool, and
37:09
Speaker 2: so I just sort of got into the world of it.
37:11
Speaker 2: And then that world led to like getting geeking out
37:14
Speaker 2: of learning about all the musicals and studying. All I
37:16
Speaker 2: wanted to do from then on was doing musicals changed
37:19
Speaker 2: my subject. In year twelve, all I was thinking about
37:21
Speaker 2: was playing the lead in the musical, which was Jesus
37:23
Speaker 2: Crist Superstar And I'm going to go off and study this,
37:26
Speaker 2: I still had no idea how to really sing. And
37:29
Speaker 2: then I had a really great singing teacher that was
37:32
Speaker 2: given that was I was told to go to in
37:34
Speaker 2: first year at UNI in Melbourne. I stat it in
37:37
Speaker 2: Ballarad and he was amazing. He just as I said,
37:44
Speaker 2: if you've got a really good coach who understands the voice,
37:47
Speaker 2: they can communicate like, that's what good coaching is. It's
37:50
Speaker 2: not giving you information you can't find elsewhere. It's speaking
37:54
Speaker 2: to you in a way that helps you to understand
37:56
Speaker 2: and you know that from your world.
37:57
Speaker 4: Of coaching and whatever. That's what good coaching years.
38:00
Speaker 2: And he talked to me in a way that I
38:02
Speaker 2: really understood for my voice, and it just in a
38:05
Speaker 2: year I went from a shit kicker to someone who
38:08
Speaker 2: could sing a fair bit. And in another year I
38:12
Speaker 2: became one of the sort of top two singers in
38:15
Speaker 2: the UNI. And by end of third year I was
38:19
Speaker 2: ready to go out there and work. And so I
38:23
Speaker 2: was very diligent. You know, they were going out and
38:26
Speaker 2: to pubs on you know, lost people. In my year,
38:29
Speaker 2: lots of nights of the week I was doing my scales.
38:32
Speaker 2: So I had that sportsman work ethic, but with great teaching,
38:38
Speaker 2: a seed some talent there, and a lot of desire
38:42
Speaker 2: to get better. I improved very very quickly, and then
38:46
Speaker 2: improved again sort of in the subsequent decade a lot
38:51
Speaker 2: as well, to a point where you go, by the
38:53
Speaker 2: time I'm in my early thirties, I'm playing leads in
38:56
Speaker 2: the West End.
38:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, incredible, incredible. Let's put that pause. Let's pause on
39:02
Speaker 1: the music stuff for a minute. I was fascinated when
39:05
Speaker 1: you and I sat down because I thought you were
39:09
Speaker 1: just an interesting dude who could sing great, which was well,
39:13
Speaker 1: I probably didn't really think that that much, but I
39:16
Speaker 1: had no insight into who you were beyond music and
39:20
Speaker 1: beyond I didn't have much.
39:21
Speaker 2: Insight into who you were beyond your gyms. Yeah, I
39:24
Speaker 2: knew of Harpers gyms. Yeah, I think we all know
39:26
Speaker 2: of that, if you know. I'm into fitness, relatively into fitness,
39:31
Speaker 2: and I had no idea about this whole other world.
39:34
Speaker 2: I think we don't like unless you ask questions.
39:38
Speaker 1: Yes, teacher, I sat down with you and we spoke,
39:45
Speaker 1: and I was and I'm not saying this to make
39:47
Speaker 1: you feel good, because I just wouldn't bring it up
39:49
Speaker 1: if it wasn't true. But I was so impressed with
39:52
Speaker 1: your curiosity about your understanding of human behavior in the
39:56
Speaker 1: human condition and psychology and spirituality and for loss, fear
40:00
Speaker 1: and stoicism and and you know, not a superficial kind
40:05
Speaker 1: of glancing kind of interest. It's like you are you are.
40:09
Speaker 1: You've done a very very deep dive and continue to
40:12
Speaker 1: do this deep dive on not only understanding others, but
40:16
Speaker 1: understanding yourself in the middle of others. What was the
40:20
Speaker 1: and anyway? And I came back and I rang Melissa,
40:23
Speaker 1: and I went I told her, and she's like, oh,
40:25
Speaker 1: that's cool. I go, no, No, you don't understand like he is, like,
40:30
Speaker 1: I can sit and talk. I can open all the
40:33
Speaker 1: doors because you know, and I mean this respectfully. You
40:36
Speaker 1: know when you sit with some people when you're like,
40:38
Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with all this shit, right, So I need
40:41
Speaker 1: to I need to rain it in a bit. I
40:44
Speaker 1: need to be careful. I need to be careful which
40:46
Speaker 1: doors I open or people think I'm a fucking lunatic, right,
40:50
Speaker 1: So I just you know, you open the door a
40:52
Speaker 1: little bit and you see them look at you quizzically,
40:54
Speaker 1: and I just pull that one shut and then I'll
40:56
Speaker 1: just open a let's open a cupboard door, not the
40:58
Speaker 1: bifold doors. And you know, but with you, like I
41:04
Speaker 1: was just I was impressed, as a dumb word, but
41:09
Speaker 1: I was I was intrigued by your intrigue, your curiosity,
41:15
Speaker 1: and your level of competence, confidence and understanding around all
41:21
Speaker 1: things human experience. Tell me about that, Tell us about that.
41:24
Speaker 1: Where did that come from? Because you've you know, you've studied,
41:28
Speaker 1: you've researched, and you've got a lot of hands on experience.
41:32
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, it's probably not disimilar to anyone who
41:36
Speaker 2: has had to look inside their own soul and learn
41:45
Speaker 2: some really, really hard truth about themselves. It comes not
41:50
Speaker 2: from a series of easy moments gifted to you, where
41:54
Speaker 2: you go, hey, here's this great book about the soul
41:59
Speaker 2: and stoicism or the human experience.
42:02
Speaker 4: Haven't read it?
42:02
Speaker 2: And you go, oh my god, Yeah, I can't wait
42:03
Speaker 2: to learn because anyone who is going through the experience
42:06
Speaker 2: obviously has that accent. It comes from crisis. It comes
42:11
Speaker 2: with crisis. It comes with looking in the mirror of
42:15
Speaker 2: your own soul and not liking what you see, and.
42:21
Speaker 1: What have you said that you didn't like?
42:25
Speaker 2: Narcissism in a toxic way, control like a controller, a bully.
42:35
Speaker 4: Wow, I saw parts of myself.
42:38
Speaker 2: That I couldn't bear to be and I couldn't bear
42:45
Speaker 2: someone behave like that to me, or that I had
42:49
Speaker 2: to witness that behavior, And that is extraminated. That is
42:56
Speaker 2: very good.
42:56
Speaker 1: Storry to interrupt. That is very good self awareness, dudent,
42:59
Speaker 1: that is very good. And it takes courage and humility
43:03
Speaker 1: to say those things about yourself that you just said.
43:06
Speaker 4: Well, we're not perfect.
43:09
Speaker 2: And the only way I've learned that we moved through
43:14
Speaker 2: perfection and rid ourselves of the shame of our imperfections
43:23
Speaker 2: is by opening up and being vulnerable about those things.
43:28
Speaker 2: Because I think that vulnerability is the antidote. You know,
43:35
Speaker 2: if you can own your stuff and have the capacity
43:38
Speaker 2: to openly express it and work on it, then you
43:44
Speaker 2: can free yourself of the shackles of your own shit
43:48
Speaker 2: and your own perfectionism. And so a narcissist who is
43:55
Speaker 2: a boy and a control freak who thinks they're perfect,
44:04
Speaker 2: it's it's the trap of all traps, isn't it, Because
44:06
Speaker 2: no one's perfect And if your perfectionism is leading to
44:11
Speaker 2: those sort of behaviors, you're not going to last very long.
44:14
Speaker 2: So I got in twenty fifteen, and that was the catalyst. Right.
44:19
Speaker 1: I was going to say, you will tell us about that, like,
44:21
Speaker 1: what did that? So you have that? To have that
44:24
Speaker 1: awareness is one thing, but then too, how does one
44:28
Speaker 1: work on that? Is that a conscious process is a
44:31
Speaker 1: very ug process. What does that look like?
44:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, so.
44:38
Speaker 4: It's firstly realizing that.
44:44
Speaker 2: Most relationships, in fact, all relationships are two way street,
44:49
Speaker 2: where at least fifty percent of what's happened is a
44:55
Speaker 2: result of your behavior in some way. If you're owning
44:59
Speaker 2: up things like narcissism and it's bullying and controlling. If
45:03
Speaker 2: you're a pure victim, and well then it's a different
45:05
Speaker 2: story altogether. But and some people are a victimis of
45:08
Speaker 2: domestic violence, of abinis and this doesn't this isn't. So
45:12
Speaker 2: you know, I'm the perpetrator here, not to say that
45:17
Speaker 2: my ex and shit put it out up and go.
45:19
Speaker 4: There were things that I do with it, but these
45:21
Speaker 4: were my tendencies.
45:22
Speaker 2: And so to actually go, hey, this is this is
45:26
Speaker 2: my stuff, and then you go, all right, how I'm
45:28
Speaker 2: going to work on that? You got? I went to
45:30
Speaker 2: a SiGe and I saw a therapist regularly, but meditation
45:35
Speaker 2: was the key, And a lot of people think that
45:38
Speaker 2: meditation is simply this thing to stay present, this this
45:43
Speaker 2: you know, tool to get rid of thoughts or whatever.
45:47
Speaker 2: I mean, no one's getting rid of your thoughts unless
45:49
Speaker 2: you're a fucking munk in a Tibetan monastery meditative for
45:54
Speaker 2: eighteen hours a day. And even then, I question, you know,
45:57
Speaker 2: if you have to travel to Times Square, whether you
45:59
Speaker 2: wouldn't start getting some thoughts cook. So it's not functional unthinking.
46:05
Speaker 2: So it's about understanding your thoughts and then understanding that
46:11
Speaker 2: there is one who is the thinker to the thoughts,
46:16
Speaker 2: the witness observing those thoughts and those feelings and those
46:20
Speaker 2: emotions and those actions and those behaviors, and our thoughts
46:25
Speaker 2: become our words, and our words become our actions, and
46:28
Speaker 2: our actions become our habits. And if those habits are narcissistic,
46:32
Speaker 2: bullying or whatever, they really hurt people, and they all
46:38
Speaker 2: come from a lack of self awareness.
46:41
Speaker 4: They all start with thoughts, thoughts about yourself.
46:44
Speaker 2: Thoughts. Ye, So I had to learn who I was
46:47
Speaker 2: beyond the thinking mind, and that took a lot of meditation.
46:51
Speaker 2: When I say a lot of meditation, I mean twice
46:56
Speaker 2: a day every day, for years practice as the practice
47:00
Speaker 2: of practicing certain diligence and dedication, and that that is
47:06
Speaker 2: the that is the work. You know, the work isn't
47:09
Speaker 2: I read the secret and now I've done the work.
47:12
Speaker 4: The work is.
47:15
Speaker 2: Every single fucking day, and the work never ends. And
47:19
Speaker 2: then you're then you're humbled by the fact that you're
47:22
Speaker 2: just a student of life.
47:24
Speaker 4: Then you see yourself.
47:26
Speaker 2: As you know, the drop in the ocean, and the
47:30
Speaker 2: entire ocean as a drop. You see, you see yourself
47:33
Speaker 2: as this whole universe. Yes, it is you, and you're
47:37
Speaker 2: as big as that because all of that is inside
47:42
Speaker 2: the molecular level of you.
47:44
Speaker 4: You're seeing.
47:45
Speaker 2: You're suddenly looking at this world at this quantum fucking level,
47:50
Speaker 2: and you see how important your life is and how
47:52
Speaker 2: fucking insignificant you are at the same time. And I
47:55
Speaker 2: think that was a huge wake up call to me,
47:59
Speaker 2: and so it just got me interested. So I ended
48:01
Speaker 2: up studying meditation, become a teacher. So if I pitcher,
48:04
Speaker 2: I ended up stud eating a lot of Yunian psychology stoicism.
48:09
Speaker 2: I just got interested in lots of things, and I'm
48:11
Speaker 2: constantly interested in lots of things, and things grabbing my attention,
48:16
Speaker 2: and you gave me a book that I'd never heard of, Yes,
48:21
Speaker 2: the forty eight Loads of Power, Laws of Power. I
48:24
Speaker 2: can't wait to read that. And that's some reading. And
48:28
Speaker 2: I'm constantly studying and wanting to grow. The other part
48:32
Speaker 2: of it is that what I was noticing is as
48:36
Speaker 2: I opened up the channels to my own authentic self
48:40
Speaker 2: and went deeper and deeper inside my own soul and
48:44
Speaker 2: went through the dark knight of that, I noticed that
48:48
Speaker 2: it opened up the characters that I was playing, And
48:50
Speaker 2: in fact, I began to start getting roles that were
48:54
Speaker 2: far deeper, that were far more complex, that asks me
49:00
Speaker 2: to be really vulnerable and go to some really dark places.
49:05
Speaker 2: You know. The phantom is not just a dude to
49:08
Speaker 2: sings music of the night. He's an abandoned boy who
49:11
Speaker 2: has a deformed face, who is a murderous, narcissistic, self indulgent,
49:19
Speaker 2: selfish tyrant.
49:23
Speaker 4: And I used Jung's.
49:27
Speaker 2: Idea of the archetypes to play him because he is
49:32
Speaker 2: a king in his shadow, is a magician in his shadow,
49:36
Speaker 2: he's a warrior in his shadow. He's a lover in
49:38
Speaker 2: his shadow. So he's an addict, he's a saddest he's
49:42
Speaker 2: a manipulator and he's a tyrant. And to go that way,
49:47
Speaker 2: I had to understand Jungian psychology to it and understand
49:50
Speaker 2: the shadow self to play, to lean into the shadow,
49:54
Speaker 2: and I just am fascinated with the world of the
49:57
Speaker 2: human experience, the human condition, understanding what it means to
50:01
Speaker 2: be human, and ultimately what I feel like the purpose
50:04
Speaker 2: of it all is is to help other people understand
50:07
Speaker 2: their human experience. And so, as I said at the start,
50:10
Speaker 2: whether my purpose is a storyteller, as a communicator is
50:14
Speaker 2: to help people understand that, and whether it's by having
50:16
Speaker 2: a podcast, having these sort of chats, by coaching people,
50:20
Speaker 2: or by stepping into characters that, through their artists free
50:25
Speaker 2: enable people to see themselves or feel things that haven't
50:28
Speaker 2: felt or need to feel.
50:32
Speaker 4: I have a lot of opportunity.
50:34
Speaker 2: To help people on their journey. And when your life
50:38
Speaker 2: becomes about helping others, not what you can get for others,
50:42
Speaker 2: then I go all right, I really start to step
50:45
Speaker 2: out of narcissism. It's like this becomes a world of
50:50
Speaker 2: service and giving rather than a world of purely receiving.
50:55
Speaker 1: What was that is so well articulated and thank you?
51:00
Speaker 1: As we wind up with the narcissism, the control, the bullying.
51:06
Speaker 1: What was the upside for that? Like, what were you
51:08
Speaker 1: getting from that? What was that doing for you at
51:11
Speaker 1: that period of time.
51:14
Speaker 4: It means that.
51:17
Speaker 2: You get to have everything go the way you want it,
51:21
Speaker 2: right what you think is and that's generally the easy
51:25
Speaker 2: road means you don't have to really compromise. It's not
51:28
Speaker 2: a relationship. That's not a relationships are all about compromise.
51:33
Speaker 4: So you get everything it's.
51:34
Speaker 1: My way or it's a dictatorship.
51:37
Speaker 4: It's a dictatorship.
51:39
Speaker 2: And when you start getting everything you want, the ego
51:41
Speaker 2: loves that. The ego is addicted to getting everything else.
51:44
Speaker 2: So you're constantly getting everything you want. But yes, well
51:49
Speaker 2: it's not about yeah, so so that was that was
51:54
Speaker 2: the benefit, But that was that's not a benefit, Yeah,
51:57
Speaker 2: because because those around you pulled away. So also, oh
52:01
Speaker 2: didn't have very many meaningful relationships. I didn't have depth
52:05
Speaker 2: to my relationships and there was no vulnerability in right issue.
52:08
Speaker 2: There's a lot of toxic positivity, but not vulnerability. So yeah,
52:12
Speaker 2: that's I much prefer my life now. But it's still
52:17
Speaker 2: as still student, like never stopped being a student. I
52:22
Speaker 2: mean Pavarotti said he was a student to the day
52:24
Speaker 2: he died of singing, and it was a pretty great singer,
52:27
Speaker 2: so to be become a better person. But I don't
52:33
Speaker 2: think they ever stopped. I hope it never stops.
52:35
Speaker 1: Well he was no Josh Pitterman, but like he was,
52:37
Speaker 1: all right.
52:38
Speaker 2: I mean, it's actually like there's a voice that I
52:44
Speaker 2: listen to. It just hap to sit down and listen
52:46
Speaker 2: to it and like that, like I'm transcended by voice.
52:52
Speaker 2: I think it's fun. And John Farnon is another one too.
52:57
Speaker 2: Something about that voice that like the they're the voice.
53:00
Speaker 2: I just think, I don't know, I can listen to
53:04
Speaker 2: fancy seeing that Beatles cover of Help just go fucking hell,
53:09
Speaker 2: Like I just I'm somewhere else.
53:11
Speaker 1: So well he was, I mean, obviously Australians love him
53:15
Speaker 1: and understand his ability, but he was like he could
53:20
Speaker 1: have been a global you know. I know he did
53:22
Speaker 1: all right, but he could have been a global superstar
53:24
Speaker 1: with that voice because he had to. He was.
53:28
Speaker 2: If I compare it to like you know, Steve Perry
53:32
Speaker 2: or bon Jovi or you know, like it's better voice
53:35
Speaker 2: than any of those or maybe Freddie Mercury, like Freddie
53:40
Speaker 2: Mner was a great showman and a great voice, but
53:42
Speaker 2: Fansi's voice was it was I sort of put up
53:46
Speaker 2: there as some of the great one of the greatest
53:48
Speaker 2: voices of all time. But on that point about could
53:52
Speaker 2: have been that if he was that would he have
53:55
Speaker 2: lost that sort of ossie, alaric and humble charm that
53:59
Speaker 2: also made him great, so awesome. I think whatever he
54:03
Speaker 2: was what is because he hasn't gone. I'm just don't
54:06
Speaker 2: seeing anymore. Yeah, I've seen him twice live and unforgettable
54:11
Speaker 2: inspiring moments. Is also very inspiring.
54:14
Speaker 1: Just performance.
54:20
Speaker 4: What she's been through.
54:22
Speaker 1: God, that's a weird thing. That's another topic for another comedy. Yeah,
54:27
Speaker 1: what's that called, Melissa? Is it like stiff body syndrome
54:30
Speaker 1: or something? Yeah, stiff person? Yeah, crazy. We love you.
54:36
Speaker 1: You're amazing.
54:37
Speaker 4: Tell people big chats. Yeah, all of them.
54:41
Speaker 2: Next time I jump on, can I trill you? Because
54:46
Speaker 2: maybe people have heard your story, but.
54:49
Speaker 1: People have been more story too much. But feel free.
54:52
Speaker 1: We'll do another one. I think we're booked for next
54:54
Speaker 1: week if you want to, if you want to take
54:56
Speaker 1: over the t y p Rains for one episode, fucking
54:59
Speaker 1: feel free, like you just.
55:02
Speaker 2: Make it a little bit more too way Street.
55:04
Speaker 1: No, No, you have to intro and outro the show, okay,
55:07
Speaker 1: and you need to up you're swearing a little bit.
55:10
Speaker 1: But you did pretty well today. The fuck quota was
55:13
Speaker 1: better than last time.
55:14
Speaker 2: I see. I swear much more in this podcast than
55:17
Speaker 2: I do on my podcast.
55:18
Speaker 1: Of course, I always say I open the fuck door
55:21
Speaker 1: and people come stumbling in. I've had people on this
55:24
Speaker 1: show who buy halfway through the show and they've never
55:29
Speaker 1: ever sworn ever on a podcast. By the end of
55:32
Speaker 1: the show, they're saying fuck every third sentence, and then
55:35
Speaker 1: they get off and they're like, that was quite liberating.
55:38
Speaker 1: I don't mind that. I'm like, right, yeah, how do.
55:42
Speaker 4: People connect to Welcome to the Fun Project.
55:44
Speaker 1: That's it. How do people connect with you? Find you,
55:47
Speaker 1: follow you listen? What's the name of your show, what's
55:50
Speaker 1: your website? How they follow you on socials?
55:53
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you can just go to Josh Pittman one
55:56
Speaker 2: T and one in in and one je and one
56:00
Speaker 2: agent Josh just in case you didn't have to spell
56:02
Speaker 2: that one, Josh Pittman dot com dot a you all.
56:05
Speaker 2: My podcast is Behind the Mask. It's at go behind
56:09
Speaker 2: the Mask on Instagram. TikTok and YouTube. You can watch it,
56:13
Speaker 2: you can listen to it, where all good podcasts are found.
56:18
Speaker 2: But yeah, start with that Josh Pittman and pretty much
56:21
Speaker 2: everything's there on on Instagram you can find you at
56:24
Speaker 2: all the o epics.
56:25
Speaker 1: Thanks Buddy, love you you mate, Thanks mat
56:28
Speaker 4: Mel, thanks for having me, guys,