Latest / Bards and Barrels / S2 Ep. 2 - Becoming the Dungeon Master - Part 2

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S2 Ep. 2 - Becoming the Dungeon Master - Part 2 · Bards and Barrels

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Bards and Barrels, the podcast for Dungeons and Dragons players, new and old.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Phil Boone, and I'm joined by my friends and co-hosts Ross Struess and Brett Miller.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_00: We'll be exploring the world of Dungeons and Dragons in each episode, sharing our experiences, offering tips and advice for those who play and run this classic game.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: So whether you're a new player just starting out or a seasoned veteran looking to get a new perspective on things, Bards and Barrels has something for everyone.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: So sit back, grab a drink, and join us as we roll for initiative and embark on an epic adventure.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: There it is, the opening crack.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back, fellas.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: Phil, Brett, and Ross here in the studio tonight, and we are coming at you in season two here with the second part of our series on DMing.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's a small little nugget, so we had to break it up.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: A small nugget.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_02: Understatement of the season right there.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: So if you guys have been listening um along with us throughout our journey here, we hit on in the first season a little bit about a session zero, but we hit that kind of from a player's perspective and sort of a what is it type of scenario.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: We kind of want to help you approach this as a DM tonight and talk about how would you run a session zero?
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: So I think you're gonna hear a lot of the same things that we talked about in that episode, at least, at least a start.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: And one of those, and and I think it's it's almost crucially important now, like looking back, especially if you don't know your party, is that survey that we had from that episode.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: Uh we'll we'll share that again on this episode when we post it on Facebook.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_02: That way everybody can take a look.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: But it but it's just a way for you to get to know your party because that's really what a session zero is uh about.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like building some rapport with your with your party, getting to know them, they get to know you because this is gonna lay the foundation for everything moving forward.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: Ross, you bring up a good point talking about the survey.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: So we've talked about that tool before and how useful that is.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: On the DM side of the table, when you get ready for a session zero, what kind of prep work uh have you guys done?
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you have to do a little prep before session zero um based on your campaign, but not a ton.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's helpful to at least read if it's a short running campaign, read the whole thing once.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: Just skim through it real quick.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um so you have an somewhat of an idea of where in the world this thing is going.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: But if it's a long campaign, read the first little bit section, maybe.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so you have somewhat of an idea of how to introduce it to your players as you get started.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I do I do think if if you're like a long time DM, it it's gonna boil down to personal preference.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: You're probably gonna have a session zero when you start every campaign talking about the campaign itself.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_02: I would completely like if you're doing a pre-build, pre-printed campaign from Wizards, I'm probably reading through the entire thing.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: So by the time we hit session zero, I know the whole thing.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: If it's new players and I have to do more guiding for them, I'm probably still gonna read it ahead of time.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: But I could see also where you're just gonna know like the first little bit, or if it's your first time DMing, which this is really who this is for, you're probably not gonna have gone through the entire thing and understand it anyway.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I fall on that same camp as you rascal.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: I typically try to read through the whole thing, and I guess that is not a requirement.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like I for sure want to like put that out there.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: But one of the reasons that I do is that uh we like to do character creation or want to encourage character creation or at least tying backstories in, you know, creating relationships between party members during a session zero.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: And the more you know about the campaign, the more you can try to tie stories into locations or um deities or you know, just different pieces of the adventure.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, obviously not a requirement, but that's why I tend to try to read the entire adventure.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you don't have to be too detailed on knowing every specific thing.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: But if you know where the campaign's going and know those small details of, okay, this thing is really important.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_01: Don't necessarily mess that up with character recreation and leave the rest of it open-ended for your players to plug in and fit into that campaign.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it one of one of the things I want you guys to share a little bit about is this campaign that we are joining one of our friends, Matt, with a space campaign.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: So the importance of that session zero.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yes.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's a different, different type of campaign.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: And and I think that goes back to like having like like in this case, Matt knowing he had run it once, so that's a big help for him because he's he was able to kind of give us the gist of these are the things you need to know.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_02: For example, we didn't know if we could breathe in space.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: We didn't know that there were a bubble around, there's like a essentially a bubble of air or a bubble of magic around the ship that allows you to breathe if you fall off the ship.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like, those are things you need to know.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like gravity around the ship is relative, and you come back to the ship for a little bit.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: Like all sorts of weird things that we had no idea about, and that was great just to get us into the mechanics of that campaign.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, mechanics and backstory too, right?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like you're in space, where's your character from?
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because we're so used to finding somewhere in Fey Rune that our characters are from, it doesn't really apply.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: It could, but right.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that that kind of leads to if if if if this is your first time DMing, maybe don't choose something that has a lot of quirks to it.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: DD in space, although it sounds really freaking cool, I I would still highly suggest you start with with the essentials kit or the starter kit.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_02: Just because it's just gonna be that you're in the woods, you're fighting some goblins or something like that, you're not gonna have to worry about like space guppies and things like that, or or fighting vampires.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like they're like it's not just DD and space, but there's things like in Ravenloft or uh Eberron campaign setting.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: I was gonna say just now too.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was like there's a lot of quirks where it's like if you really want to dive into that, fine.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_02: I would read the whole book before you do that.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: So you know those quirks, but if you're not quite ready for that, keep it simple.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: Because you can rely on your experience, probably having watched Lord of the Rings or Game of Thrones, a lot of those medieval shows set you up for having a pretty good background to know how to DM a medieval type campaign.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're going to look for content too, there's just more content readily available using that just in general, too.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I one of the other pieces of a session zero that um, you know, I think will kind of lead us into the next area here, too, is getting to know how your party plays, what people's interests are.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, sure, some of that comes up in character creation, but what are other ways you can kind of you know figure that out about your party?
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I I think you hit the main one.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like if you know the type of person they are, and you're probably gonna have a general idea of the type of character they are.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: I like to talk a lot.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: I tend to play characters with high charisma.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: Go figure, right?
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like if you know that about a person, you can help lead them in a direction where they're gonna end up playing a character that they really like.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: The the caveat here is like you should also encourage players to like get out of that a little bit.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_02: Right now, I'm playing a rogue, a Haddazy Rogue that is not my favorite.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: Like, he has a great backstory, and I enjoy playing like him and his personality, but a rogue is not for me.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what I'm finding out.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: But that's okay because I'm trying something different, right?
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the session zero also is a great time to figure out what the players want from the campaign, and that could be like those the social encounters, the combat, you know, all those things, but also how long do they realistically think they can be a part of this campaign?
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: True.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Because if you're some of the players are only wanting to do it two or three sessions or like once a month, and other people want to do once or twice a week every month for a year, those are very different campaigns.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I would say, like, when you when you're asking them, like, what do you want out of the campaign?
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_02: Like you were talking about do you want social interactions or do you want this to be combat heavy?
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: I would say take that with a grain of salt.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, you want to start that way because that's what they initially want.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_02: But I think the three of us are a prime example of we always thought we were gonna be a combat heavy.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: We wanted to go in and swing swords, and and after you play for a while, you start leaning toward those social experience, uh, not social experiments, but those social interactions.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: But the point is like being flexible to do that with your party.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_02: Like, even though they start out saying combat, don't think you're gonna stick to that the whole way, kind of thing.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: No, but it's a great way to get get their feet wet into the campaign, sure, learn their characters a little bit as you first get started.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: And and that's how you're gonna get going.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like once they get their feet wet and you get your feet wet, you're gonna kind of settle into a flow and like you'll know how they want to do things, and then you'll get you'll find that back and forth.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I think those are all good points.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: Uh one of the pieces I like to interject into a session zero too as a DM are some uh what do you want to call them, nuggets about the campaign, right?
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: Almost almost a hook, not necessarily a hook, but there are certain truths sometimes that just need to be known about a campaign.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like kind of looking back to the Descent to a Vernus campaign that we played.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like if I would have if I would go back and do that session zero again, it would probably look a little different.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Because I don't think we necessarily talked a lot about how ninety-eight percent of the campaign was gonna take place in the nine hells.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah and it could have influenced some character decisions, possibly, at least minuscually, but some of the, you know, how do things work in the nine hells?
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: What you know, like all of those pieces, I think I probably would have given a little bit more away than what I did initially.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: I do think like in in that particular instance, I again this is gonna become from knowing your party.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: Once you get into it a ways, it's like you created a character for the campaign that you're doing, like sharing things that they like Ari being a fire genie that was not great in the nine hells.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: You couldn't do a whole lot of damage.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas Thorn, Paladin, doing radiant damage did some work, right?
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: But but the the good news in our case was like we got to a certain point where we knew we wanted to keep this going.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: So that that decision seems a lot more minuscule now because we're gonna go beyond the nine hells.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like it's like when you start this, like yes, give them the information to do their character creation, especially if you think this is gonna be a one campaign and that we're gonna create new characters and go to a different campaign.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_02: But if you think there's ever a chance that this will expand beyond that, that's where that freedom comes in.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_02: Like let them do what they want, share with them, they make the final decision.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, having the players know some of what's gonna happen in your campaign can really help their backstories develop in a way that fits the campaign and you can pull from better.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, like we were running Storm's King's Storm King's Thunder, and that's heavily focused on giants.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_01: With a little bit of background knowledge, you can have your characters have maybe they have some sort of history with the giants.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe uh one of the giants stomped through their village or killed their family, or you know, whatever.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: But then that leads to getting having a crutch to get them into the story, and you have an easier flow getting started.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: When it makes for more uh almost playable NPCs as well, because at some point in that campaign, they may come up against that giant, like in the space campaign that we're playing with Matt, he did that with our my character in the side quest that Brett and I did one episode.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: It was very much based on what I put in my background story.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: So just having you know things to be able to tie in like that can come out of giving some of those details up front.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think that plays well into our tailoring to your to your experience too.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_02: And going off of the the Lia's Araxis campaign we're doing, it's like it's like Isaac and I having two characters that have known each other.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like we came up with a lot of that backstory before we ever started.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_02: And so, like, like my my Haddazy and he has a I'm gonna mess this up and he's gonna be mad at me, a GIF.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: I think he says GIF.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if it's GIF.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's one of the two.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know now.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just like I'm sorry, Murgie.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_02: Please forgive me.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: But but uh uh Rhodie, who's my character, and Murgie, who is Isaac, like we had this cool thing where like they were in prison together and they have a ship together.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: So I was like, we came up with all of that in session zero.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: Had.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, had a ship.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: Don John has has taken the the proverbial trip, unfortunately.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: Well, before we transition into um how to run just uh any other session, do you guys have any final thoughts on a session zero?
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: I would say there's a lot of resources out there of tips and tricks for running a session zero.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_01: Just spend some time looking up information.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it'll give you a framework of what to walk through, some tips and tricks.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: And you don't have to do all of it.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um there's a lot of them recommend you do a lot.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_01: You don't necessarily have to do all of them, feel out what feels best for you and just try.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: I I think one of the things you'll figure out in the session zero, and I we may have hit on this a little bit, was like, are are you gonna meet virtually?
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: Are you gonna meet in person?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like logistics, right?
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like if you're gonna meet virtually, like you need to know are DD Beyond is slowly working their way toward a new virtual tabletop, right?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: They've just come out with the alpha version of maps, which certainly feels like we're heading down that road.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like, are you gonna play there?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: Are you gonna play in role 20?
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: Are you gonna play in Foundry?
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's called Foundry.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: Is like there's there's all these places you can play.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: You gotta work that out and know how they work before you hit session one.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: And does everybody have a computer to do different ones?
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_01: But are you gonna do it in person and can just maybe run off of a phone?
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's lots of little ways that you can do different things, but you need to know what your players can handle.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I think another thing that that we haven't hit on yet is like when when we were talking about in season one, like things from a player perspective, like we always centered that around you could do this with the basic rules, you don't need any of the books.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_02: I would say the flip side of that as a DM, it would benefit you greatly to have a copy of the core rule books.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_02: So the player's handbook, the dungeon master guide, and the monster manual, just as a way to get started because it just gives the availability of all the information to you.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_02: So if you don't know something, you do have the ability to go find it.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's not that you can't Google it, but it's just it's nice to have that book right in front of you and be able to look up those things.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I will say too, to the dungeon master guide, especially, there's and tables in there for like magical items and descriptions and all of that, which is very helpful if you're trying to describe something to players.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: So here's the thing with the dungeon master guide.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_02: So, unlike the player's handbook, where it's like it takes you step A to B, like here's how you create a character, here's how you do the basics of the game, and things like that.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: It's not overly intimidating.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot there, but it's not overly intimidating.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: The Dungeons Master's Guide is very intimidating because it's starts out the very first, and I Phil and I were talking earlier, like we don't know why they structured this book this way, but they start out with world building.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're going through part one and it's talking about here's all the planes that exist that may have nothing to do with the story you're running.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_02: All your deities, which you may have one player that has a deity that you need to know about, but it's gonna give you tables and tell you about all these deities.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: You don't need any of that.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you may need pieces of that, but you likely don't need most of it.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so you don't even really get into like how do you run the adventure and you know, playing NPCs until you get into the second part of the book.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're reading through chapter one, you're like, oh, I'm ready to do this, and you're like, crap, I'm not ready to do this anymore.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_02: It's very easily to get easy to get intimidated.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: And so much of being a DM is just accumulating knowledge and resources over time.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: Uh one of the things I like to do is save resources on Instagram or Facebook or wherever of tips and tricks from other DMs on how to store information and have it have it readily available.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like having a OneNote and having different tabs with like generic character names or locations or tavern names, having those handy, and you can just grab one and put it in when you need it without having to make up Bob's Tavern.
• 16:54
  unknown: Right.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Every third tavern.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: I hear there's good beer at Bob's Tavern.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: So that might be available.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Bob's best brew, baby.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I know so.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: One of the future episodes that we're gonna do is a lot about tools, right?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: We want to hit on some of those things that you can really use to make your life easier, to bring additional features to your game, and I think we can highlight some of those tools as well.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I know what I forgot about session zero is the teaser.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: At the end of a session zero, you have to play a little.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like everybody wants to roll those math rocks.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: It gets tagged rocks.
• 17:35
  unknown: Yes.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: It gets your players so like they're they're just like chomping at the bit, ready to start playing, and it gets them going.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: And then they they get excited about it, they leave the table and go work on their character more.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you may have spent four hours up to this point talking about nuggets and building characters.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I want to do something, I don't want to stop and then wait a week or even till tomorrow before I get to do something with this.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: So, Phil, how much of a teaser would you actually give?
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: I like to I guess I I fall into a trope.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: I like combat as far as a teaser goes.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: So typically that's a good way to start because it lets people kind of explore some of the features of their character too, though, to kind of learn what their basic weapons are or you know, cantrips.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that's probably where I would start.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: But uh, you know, I think there's plenty of use cases to start with a social scenario of you know, you have some sort of a patron or something like that that the group is going to and they're getting orders, or you know, there's a capture scene or a chase scene.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: I there are a lot of different options.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: I know I think Descent had something, it was that weird secret.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: Do you guys even remember it?
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: Remember that because it was kind of garbage, so we basically tossed it out and never talked about it again.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: But you were criminals, you did something part of a coup or something.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: And somebody knew your secret.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, like that.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't do that whenever it was.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_02: That mother trucker never showed up.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it was the Duke.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: You you killed her.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: It didn't matter.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_02: She was gone.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_02: She gone.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: We talked about that in the just in the room.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I think she did.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_02: You're right.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_02: You're right.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I would say if you're a little intimidated about doing like uh something at the end of that first session, take a deep breath.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's gonna be okay.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_02: Because, like you said, Phil, a lot of the the pre-written campaigns typically have a hook or something at the beginning to help you get through that.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_02: So you're basically running that campaign hook at the end of your session zero instead of the beginning of session one.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: One of the reasons I think it's really important too is I think I speak, I think I speak for all three of us that we enjoy creating characters, but that's not everyone else's favorite thing always.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: So if you did spend like two hours creating characters, you need to kind of give someone else a chance to do more than just create a character.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_02: So uh, but before we move on to the next thing, I I do have like a question for you because uh being a DM is like the cornerstone of having a session.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: You can't really have one if you don't have a DM.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: But what would you guys say to people who are out there who are on the fence about doing it?
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm gonna look at Brett because you've DM'd the least of us.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_02: And so, like, if somebody's super intimidated, doesn't want to try it, what would you tell them?
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I would say you've gotta just put yourself out there and try it.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um you don't have to commit to a full long-term campaign to try it and see what skills you have at it and where you maybe need to develop some skills or practice a little bit more.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um and just put yourself out there.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_02: I think if you if you have been a long time player, I would tell you you know more than you think you know.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think that's a barrier for a lot of people.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: And and we talked about this, I think we mentioned it in the last episode.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: Was like you you're not Matt Mercer, and that's fine from Critical Role, right?
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's like you don't need to know everything.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: So my suggestion would be you know more than you think you do, but find somebody to help guide you a little bit.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: Like have a former DM in your party who you can look at and be like, Did I do that right?
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: Or they can be like, Hey, you know, you have a good relationship where they can go, hey, do this next time because that will help you just keep you organized and it'll make more sense.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_02: And that that's how you do that.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: And also ask your players for feedback, especially those former play former DMs.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: Ask them for feedback afterwards.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_01: I feel I know you did that when we first got started.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how did that session go?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: What did you think of it?
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: I still probably should, to be honest.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like at this point, like instead, you kind of fall into patterns.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, you're right.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: And Matt's been doing it.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: He messages me uh sometimes after those sessions too, just to see how they went.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, I I think that's the best way to learn.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you're right.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: If if you're in a party and you offer to your DM that you are interested in DMing like a one shot or a couple sessions or something like that, I highly doubt they're gonna turn you down.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure they would take the opportunity for.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: couple week break.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: For sure.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, I just uh thank you guys for entertaining me.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_02: Because I I thought that was like an important thing to like let everybody out there know is like there are some bar just mental barriers for some people to like make that jump from from being the player to running the game.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: One one thing too I want to just interject into it is you know what worst case scenario you crash and burn.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, as long as you had fun and the players at your table had fun, who cares about the rest?
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: Honestly, like the rules are meant to be broken if everyone's having a good time and there's still you know some sort of structure even if it's not in the rule book it doesn't matter.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then chances are your players are going to remember their character and kind of the goofiness of what happened in that thing more than a little flub you made.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_02: And this is going to be the third time we've said this on an episode of the Bards and Barrels.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_02: But there's that line at the beginning of the dungeon masters manual that says that the rules are there as guidelines.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: So it doesn't matter.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: Go into it have fun with it.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: The DD gods are not going to smite you if you do a rule slightly different than it's supposed to be it doesn't matter.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_02: Just have fun doing it.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: Your players don't know the story.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's what you do.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly all right well I think that will probably wrap us for a session zero.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about a any regular week session.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: Session one plus what uh what does that kind of look like for the DM like you know look we can talk prep a little bit if you think you want to talk that route or even running the session.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: What does combat look like?
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean there's a lot in this part and I'm not sure we can even unpack it all in one episode but running a session.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_02: I I I think we need to talk about prep first because everybody's gonna be like I'm gonna read the next 30 pages of the campaign that we're running because I need to know that stuff because that's what's gonna happen.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: So guilty.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_00: And and Phil tell us how big of a mistake is that it's a mistake every time I do it and I've done it so many times because you make it through like two pages because party is always just it's a free will game.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: So it doesn't matter you can read the 30 pages to be prepped.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's helpful in case you know you skip like 25 pages.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_01: But sometimes you just smash walls down and go through a dungeon sideways.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: Save you some time even though you read all of that for mostly nothing.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's fine.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's all good right so this does tie back into something we talked about a little earlier though was like if you had read a considerable amount of your campaign or even the entire thing you know the gist of this storyline already.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: So typically what I will do because I know uh having probably written the recap I asterisk on that because sometimes the recap doesn't happen and I have to rely on players to tell me what the hell we did.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: But I generally know where you're at in the story.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_02: So my prep is going to be from here there's three possible ways you're gonna take this and there's always the fourth way that could be completely off the rails.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: So my job would be I need to at least have an idea of what those three ways are and then have something in mind in case you go completely a different direction.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: That's my prep the way that I've kind of started taking that on at um the bookstore here in town for the campaign that we're running is just to use like a note card and it has basically an outline right of hey this is kind of the order that I suspect things are going and that's all I have on it.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: And then everything outside of that I might have read through so I'm familiar with it.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: But then I just sort of know okay like we're here we're gonna go here oh they're not headed that direction right like that's probably out it just helps me keep I don't know structured throughout it and can keep me on track well enough to know where things are going.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: I would say if if you are the kind of person that feels like you need to read a chunk just to know like all the possible outcomes based on where you're at in a story.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: That's fine.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: If that's how you want to do things do it.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: Just know that most of the time three to four hours of prep is not necessarily required.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_02: If you're doing homebrew and you have to write some things that's a little different.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: But if we're talking running a pre-written campaign an an hour's worth of checking things is probably plenty most of the time.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_01: And if you read it through once you're probably good and then you just do that hour.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of it boils down to it's like when I read through it case in point and you guys didn't hear me say this, but like in the Curse of Strahd book, when I read through it the first time I did not read hardly anything about Castle Ravenloft because that's literally the end game.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of things in that story that will keep you from doing that until the end.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like glazed over that because I don't need that until we get a little bit farther down the road.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I did in Descent as well.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: And it did become pivotal at the end to read that chapter like a couple times.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: Like there are key moments right that things build to and that I think is different.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's might take a little more prep but to your point like that's the end game like if we get to that point we got to know and there are tons of different options that it can lead to so you just have to be a little more prepared in those instances.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: You do have to remember there may be an entire chapter in a book dedicated to one event that's gonna happen but a good dice roll means 90% of that chapter didn't happen.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: Already rolling amazing charisma rolls uh persuasion rolls and everything so it's like it's like that's just how the game works.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_00: So you got to be a little flexible and roll with the punches roll with the dice so to speak I see what you do ah there it is so in addition to prep running a session let's um let's just kind of talk through a rough outline of maybe what a session would look like or a recent session that we've played.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_02: So obviously step one gather your players if they're not already gathered.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh as a DM if you're playing in person you're probably doing a little setup for yourself with the screen make sure you have something to take notes on have pertinent books in front of you probably laptop one of the fun things that we've started doing is every week we do something that we picked up from Dungeons and Daddies um another podcast that you should get listened to but is we give a random fact about our character.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it continues to build the backstory that we started with and keep layering in new nuggets of our characters as players or potentially even a key NPC could have additional nuggets.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: So one thing I have done different and we've only done one of these and I think you're the only one that's answered me.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_02: But instead of asking for a fun fact I just asked a question.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like I wanted to know for my care for your guys' characters in the campaign we're running what is the thing you're most afraid of oh yeah.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like the facts give you backstory for you to play with the questions give me something as a DM that I can play with.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: I like that idea better because when you just give the players the free range to make up fun facts you never know what the hell you're gonna have to incorporate in your campaign.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: That's how you end up with awesome magical items.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: And Maxers over here trying to take over the world hey it's fine I just told Phil I had it and he agreed it's fine.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: He left me after a week after a week it wasn't that bad.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: But hey it was more than once but it's fine but then after our fun facts we get into a recap of what happened last time and that sometimes is done by the DM but sometimes they pass it off to a player and say what do you remember from last time can you give us a recap of what happened and that's also interesting to see the balance between what the DM knows is important and what the players think is important.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: I think I think uh giving another shout out to Dungeons and Daddies, I always thought something that would be fun would be like if you as a character had to do read like a journal entry that like recaps so it's like you're you're not just saying what happened but you're saying it from the perspective of your character.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_02: And some of that happens in Dungeons and Daddies when they do their recap they do it in very pop cultural ways which is great but I think it would be really cool like if it's like almost like you're hearing the internal dialogue of one of your players like how they saw the last session happen.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's fun it would be really fun too for someone that failed a bunch of like perception checks because there was like oh yes everyone else did some stuff and I was emptying my pockets dear diary yesterday sucked like from critical role if you just had grog repeating something of what happened the previous day oh man it would oh that'd be so good.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_00: It would it would take three hours to get through it probably after Asterisk got uh fell in the sticks.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah yeah and the memory wipe I don't remember much of yesterday I would suggest as a DM it's fun to do that um if you're gonna do that and ask your players to recap your sessions give them a heads up because not every not everyone takes notes and not everyone needs to take notes.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_00: Especially if it's been a couple weeks yeah it can get a little rough I can tell you from experience.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_00: Even as a DM sitting down to write a recap after a couple weeks can be a little rough so my recommendation if you're gonna write recaps would be to do it the next day or even that night if it's not already midnight.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah um I I think I did I've not written the recap there's notes somewhere hopefully I can find those hashtag don't do what Ross does.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: Well I definitely crit hit that monster and killed it in one shot.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: I believe it I don't remember there being a monster but sure I believe it.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: Why not?
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know the difference.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: Well I think that will take us basically up to gameplay so I think that's a good time to stop today and we'll save the rest of this DM topic.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: Breaking it up to section three I think we've got to so we'll push this out to our third session on DMing uh and you'll hear that one in a couple of weeks that's gonna do it for this episode of Bards and Barrels.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can listen to past episodes of the show anywhere podcasts can be found.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: Want to stand aloop and not miss the latest from us be sure to head over and give us a like and a follow on Facebook or Instagram at Bards and Barrels.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: We'll see you soon