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Be Different or Be Dead: Roy Osing's Journey to a Billion · Unstoppable Success Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Unstoppable Success Podcast, where we spotlight visionary leaders who have mastered the art of growth, purpose, and powerful connections.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Jacqueline Strawminger, connector, high performance coach, and creator of the Leap to Your Success Framework in Two Steps to Yes.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: Each week we dive into bold insights, real conversations, and powerful strategies to fuel your growth, deepen your relationships, and ignite transformational momentum.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: And why?
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because you were meant to be unstoppable.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's leap into the podcast.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Well, hello, everybody, and welcome to another amazing episode of Unstoppable Success.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Jacqueline Strominger.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: And as you know, on this podcast, we hear from amazing leaders who have been in the industry, who have walked the walks, done the talk, and they are going to help you be that unstoppable success.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: And today I have the most amazing guest on, Roy.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: And actually, I should have confirmed your last name.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, Singh.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, sing a song.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, sing a song.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: It's an easy way to remember.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: That is a great way to remember.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: I like that.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let me tell you a little bit about Roy.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: So, first of all, he is actually the only guy who took a startup internet company to a billion in sales.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: He is an author and executive leader who delivers practical and proven audacious, unheard of ways to prove and produce high-performing businesses and successful careers.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: He is a former president, CMO, and entrepreneur with over 40 years of successful and unmatched executive leadership experience in every aspect of business.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: And he has taken a company basically to from you know early stage to a billion in sales.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm actually going to say, and now it's over a billion.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: And as I said, he is the host of his own podcast.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: And he has also has an amazing book series, Be Different or Be Dead.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: So Roy, welcome to the podcast.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you very much.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'm honored to be here.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so Roy, what we were talking before the show, you know, one of the things that, you know, having success.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: And as you have shared, you know, we have to be, we have to find ways to be different.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd love for you to share, like you were given an opportunity.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: So how did you start out being different?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Or at least even maybe making yourself be seen differently.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I mean, it it it all it all comes down to context.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm a context guy.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: I I'm not tactically driven.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: I don't chase AI or social media just because it's sexy and it's a kind of G Wiz silver tool.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_02: What I try and do is create uh a strategy around what you want to be when you grow up, and then look at how all of those other things, tools, fit within that.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: So when we had the challenge of basically uh growing a business in a new technology space called IP or the internet, um, the first thing, and I was asked to lead the team and the cause, uh, the first thing that we did is figure out all right, where where do we want to go?
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: How are we gonna win?
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so um I looked around and was not able to find any uh strategic planning tools that that served me at all.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_02: And for the simple reason that they were all focused on the efficacy of the strategic direction.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, what I wanted as a leader was I wanted advice, I wanted suggestions is how to execute.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, because results, and for all you people out there, okay, it's not about leadership.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's about getting results, okay, by mobilizing the hearts of mind and of people.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_02: And if you want to tag that as leadership, go ahead.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_02: But at the end of the day, in those positions, we're paid to drive results.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so my challenge was revenue, revenue, top line revenue, right?
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: So I had to figure out a way how to move it up.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: So I created what I call my strategic game planning process that was um it was imprecise because you can't perfect imperfection, right?
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_02: It was imprecise, but we got it done and we allowed it allowed us to get keep our feet moving and get going.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_02: And so the strategic game planning process was a process that allowed us to get going quickly and start to mobilize people, right?
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: And and it it was it's really simple.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's created by answering three questions.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: The first question is how big do you want to be?
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's how much revenue do you want in 24 months, not five years.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: Five years done never shows up.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: Five years is crazy, right?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: You can't execute a five-year strategy.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: You execute in the moment, okay, with with just about right guidance that you're creating in an imperfect world, right?
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: So that's the first second question is where are you gonna get the money?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's called who do you want to serve, right?
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: This is all about identifying customer groups that have the latent demand to actually get you the revenue.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_02: Third thing is what do they crave?
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: This is really important, right?
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: If you want to be successful and you want to be unstoppable, you have to figure out what your target market craves, not what they need, because the need space is really competitive because everybody's in it, tends to be price price sensitive.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: Why would you want to compete there when all that's gonna happen is that you're gonna be driven into a commodity?
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: Cravings, on the other hand, are created by emotional triggers.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: We buy on the way we feel.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's an emotionally driven transaction.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: Now, the interesting thing there here, Jacqueline, is that nobody competes in that space.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_02: They're too busy trying to figure out how to reduce costs and satisfy customer needs.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: Dumb.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: Crazy, right?
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: Get cravings done, price insensitive, boom.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_02: Third question is how are you going to compete and win?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: This leads to the differentiation piece, okay, which I believe is the most important issue for businesses and organizations today.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: How to be different is what you said.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: Expressed generically, it's about how can I differentiate myself from other competitors in the space in a way that people care about.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I had to create my own differentiation tool called the only statement.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, we're not going to be better, we're not going to be best, we're not going to be number one, we're not going to be the market leader, because that's claptrap.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: You can't, you can't measure that.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's absolutely useless.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_02: And for all you guys out there that think universal selling propositions and brand promises are what you need, it's they're not what you need.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_02: Because all that is is narcissism.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's your view of you.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: The only statement says we are the only ones who.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: The whole be different journey is about strategic context, okay, that drives actions, that drive performance, and it's based on differentiation, and it's based on varying ways that that I figured out how to execute in a real simple way.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't use textbooks.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_02: I put the textbook down, Jacqueline.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I advise people, okay, I see, I see you have an MBA.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: Good for you.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, now you need to put that down.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well done.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_02: You told me that you can think.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_02: Now, what I want you to do is I want you to put that thought uh capability um to a different use.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: And it's all about being different, execution, hiring for goosebumps, killing dumb rules, uh getting rid of claptrap, all the simple things that we did that drove a billion dollars.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: And so, is there one simple silver bullet?
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: You can tell by my answer.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely not.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: There's a whole bunch of simple things that you can do.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: The light fires in people within a strategic context, right?
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: Manage the performance and see where you go.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: You may not get a billion, you don't need to be going for a billion.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: You may just want to double or one and a half times.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's okay, just get it going.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and the thing is, I guess the question is, did you start out wanting to go to a billion, or did it start out like a million?
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: And then it was like, well, now let's try to go here, right?
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: The the whole yeah, that's a really good question.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: And no, we didn't.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, we started out by saying we understand that the potential was significant.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: And so for year one of the plan, and I can't remember the numbers, that was a while ago.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_02: But for year one of the plan, we were audacious.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_02: We set a goal that we had no idea how we were going to achieve.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_02: And the reason I'm gonna mention this is it's so important.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and I call it the I don't know innovation process.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, innovation is driven by what you don't know, not by what you know.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: If you know how to get the revenue, then what motivation do you have to do anything differently, to be innovative and creative, right?
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: In your role as a leader.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: There's no there's no motivation at all.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_02: But if you don't know how you're gonna get from where you are to what you've defined as your your 24-month growth target, you have no choice.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, you must be innovative, and it drives that process.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_02: And so, so every every time out we would set ourselves a goal, we had no idea how to get.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: And the whole the whole raison d'etre of the organization was to figure it out.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: Figure it out on the run.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: This wasn't a matter of equations or predictive modeling, etc.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I'm at 50 million, we're gonna double revenue, okay, in 12 months, and we have no idea how to do it.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: Let's figure it out.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: And guess what?
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: If we come out, if we came in at 95, did we fail?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_02: No, because if we did an equation, it probably would have suggested 60.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_02: And if we hit 60, we go, oh, nice.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: No, not when the not when the potential in this case might have been 95.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: And so be really careful.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: Textbooks promulgate things like predictive equations and formularizing everything.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, I get that because I went through it, my degree's in math, but I've never solved a differential equation to solve a business problem.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, never have.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: I just I laugh because it's like it because because not to like because I think it's so important just to say that too, because maybe if you were in a different profession, it would be totally, you know, it would be, you know, maybe in on the engineering space or maybe on the computer space.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: But sometimes the things that we learn in school today are not necessarily the things that you're going to need to actually um use to run your business, but it does help you critically think.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it helps, yeah, it gives you a bit of a logic structure.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, certainly that's what it did for me.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, but the problem we have in business today is people think that's the end result, as opposed to believing that it's a means to an end.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: And there are other things, okay, that are more important.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like they don't they don't teach the only statement at university, and yet it was instrumental in driving business success to a billion dollars.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'm the only one that writes about it because it worked for me and I created it.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: And some people don't believe it, by the way, but you know, it's been proven over and over and over again.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_02: And so, I mean, the problem I have is the learning process, of course, is important.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not denigrating it.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just saying, okay, good for you.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: Now let's let's let's take on some new knowledge.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, stuff that actually works in the real world.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: Because when you tell me that your set of assumptions are wrong, I look at you and my eyes glaze over.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I go, what?
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_02: Is that what you're spending time on?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_02: Trying to legitimatize and and and and prove your assumptions when you should be out figuring out how frontline people can execute execute your imprecise vision better.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: You should be figuring out how to cleanse the inside of your organization from friction that pred that that prevents value delivery.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: That's what you should be doing.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: But instead, you're trying to do more studies on your assumptions.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, help me.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's crazy, actually.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like stuff, you know, it's amazing what people will be doing and the analysis that they are trying to do to actually move their business.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I want to actually go back to this statement.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Well, two things.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Number one is, and I'm gonna go back because first of all, I love this that that statement, the only one's statement.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: That is it really is the the to me, I look at that as the quintessential where you've taken the you know, you you you can use that to embody the core values that you want to have within your company, but you're the only the you know that your company or your business is the only one who, as you said, either does whatever you're gonna do or helps our customers feel a certain way.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's so many um great ways to use that as the differentiator between you and what you want to do and a competitor.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: I I absolutely love that.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: Well, look at it, it's not it's not about what you want to do, it's not about what you think you have, it's not about what you think your core strengths are.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_02: If you follow the process, okay, and I'm mindless about this, you have to follow the pro.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: There are no shortcuts.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: And so the part of the process is all about defining the customer groups that you want to serve and getting a deep understanding as to what they crave.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_02: It's not what you think you can do for them, it's what they crave.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: And now the question says, how can you play into the cravings in a way that no one else does?
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: So the cravings basically drive your definition.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_02: Let me give you an example.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: I just did a um, I just did a uh an engagement with a company that that thought they were in the lawn cutting business, right?
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: They thought they were in the landscaping uh space.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: And uh you call them homeowners' associations.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_02: In Canada, we call them strata corporations.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: We did a they were doing work for them and they were having difficulties because there was it was so competitive, they were losing business, they weren't growing, and so they came to me and asked them.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: So I took them through this process.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, when we got to talking about who you want to serve, we got them to focus on, in your case, homeowners' associations.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: And then the next question is what do they crave?
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that was an interesting conversation.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: They didn't crave lawn cutting, they didn't crave painting.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: What they craved was a single point of contact that was available to the Strata Council or the Homeowners Association Council, 24 by seven.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_02: And they needed a broad range of services from that single point of contact.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, it had nothing to do with what the company thought they were good at, it had to do with cravings drives the formulation of the only state.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: And so we came up with this only statement, which I thought was the coolest thing.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_02: I finally got them to it.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: I knew what it was before we started, but we had to let them kind of you have to let them get there, right?
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: They have to they have to buy they have to buy into it, right?
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_02: I know, I know.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: And so so this is this is what they came up with.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: This company um only statement was that they are the only service partner who delivers tailored property development solutions for homeowners associations.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: Property development solutions, right?
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: In other words, that empowered them, right, to go beyond what they were now doing.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: Now, property development needs to be explained, and part of the process, I call it unpacking the only statement, is to define what you mean by these various phrases and words, because unless you explain them, it's hard to get people to understand.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_02: But what this did is it allowed them through the partner network that they had to package deals that involved lawn cutting and painting and sewer maintenance and road, uh road cleaning in the winters, you know, all this kind of stuff.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I know the CEO very well, and I keep in touch with him.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: I says, How's it going, Matt?
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: He goes, Oh my god, you wouldn't believe it.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_02: I said, Are you the only one that does what you do?
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: And he says, Yeah, and it's becoming a problem.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm getting so much business.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: I said, Yeah, that's good, right?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: So the point here is you don't start off with with what you think you are, because that's basically narcissism.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's a narcissistic view of differentiation, and it's a huge problem today.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: Be guided and comforted by the cravings that you define.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_02: And that's where I want you to spend your work.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: Do you really understand what they crave?
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: What are the emotional triggers that that client group, okay, have when making a transaction or engagement decision?
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's the space that you have to go to, and that's what informs the construction of the only statement.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so now my question to you is because I love this, I absolutely love it.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: So have you formulated a set of questions or a rough outline as to what people need to ask of their customers so they can pull out the craving?
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah, yes and no.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, uh have I have I have I uh formulated a a workbook?
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: What I what I try to do is impress upon them what it means and the intent, and suggest that they go talk to these customers, go have a conversation and be guided by the conversation.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like you don't walk out and say, Jacqueline, sorry, what do you crave?
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_02: What what do you desire?
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_02: What do you lust for?
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: What is your absolute unbelief a Ruben sandwich right now?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just kidding.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: Well, so what we're gonna try and do is package the Ruben into the service experience, you know.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: But a lot of these people don't talk, okay?
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: And so the leaders that I talk to, and and the process is simple.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_02: I just get the the leadership team for that business in a room, and we create the strategy.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_02: We don't have subject matter experts, we don't have data mongers with AI tools crunching data.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's like the leaders in the room.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: All right, what you need to do is, and you got you got uh, you know, 10 minutes to think about it, because look at you're always going to be wrong.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_02: This is a world of imprecision, not a world of precision.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me what you think.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's your business.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me what you think your customers, those homeowners associations, crave.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_02: At the end of the day, what keeps them awake at night?
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe this is part of the workbook thing.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: What keeps them awake at night?
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know?
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: You I think you do.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: Let's let's just play with that.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_02: And and what came out of the conversation was yeah, single point of contact, constant availability, follow-up, simple stuff.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: Not and it's the stuff that makes you angry whenever you deal with a business today, anyways, right?
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: Try calling a call center and tell me if that was a delightful experience or it just pissed you off.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I you can tell the effect on me.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, and yet the and yet, and tell me about the the FAQ AI algorithms, okay, who claim to provide better customer service.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: Don't think so.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_02: And so let's be reasonable.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_02: Let's let's first of all understand what we mean by desires and separate that from needs.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so we have a good conversation about that, and then then I just probe them.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_02: I just probe them.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: And and sure that you also, yeah.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_02: But the other point I want to make to you, it's a draft.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_02: The only statement is always a draft.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: And the reason the reason for that is how can anything be permanent in a world that's changing so fast?
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: How can anything be permanent in a world where customers' cravings, right?
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_02: And it change.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: You so you have to pick what you think is just about right.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: I call it just about right planning, and check out my blog.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_02: There's a ton of stuff on my website about getting it just about right, and start executing.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_02: Learn on the run.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: I call it planning on the run.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's just learn as you go and adjust.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: Learn as adjust.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and it's actually you, so you and I have a very similar philosophy.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: I call it measure, monitor, and adjust.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: We're always measuring and monitoring and adjusting, and that you always have to evolve whatever that statement is.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: But there's two things that that are that I think that really come out of also what you're saying is I mean, obviously, you know, nothing's set in stone.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: You always have to be able to be nimble and be able to, you know, learn.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Number one.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: But number two is that you have to also be in contact with your customer and to listen to them and ask questions of them because you won't know what they're craving unless you actually ask.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you can assume, but you know what that word does, right?
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, so we don't want to do, we don't want to assume that, but you to know what that is, you have to open your mouth.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: So part of it for me is what I did, and it worked like a damn is I made it a necessary ingredient of the performance management process.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so let me give you an example.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: Salespeople were held accountable to not just sell, and I completely redid that because flogging products is not the way to unstoppable success.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's short-term at best, and it's just another expression of supply-driven narcissism.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_02: So I just didn't do it.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_02: I completely revamped the sales process.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one of the things that they were measured on is I call them gaining, learning customer secrets.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: A secret is something, as you know, that you don't tell very many people.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_02: You reserve your secrets for people you trust, right?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_02: All right, so now we're getting somewhere.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_02: So what I wanted is I wanted these salespeople to have intimate relationships with their clients.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_02: Now I know that sounds kind of weird, but the reality is that's what I wanted them to do.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: I want to, and and the return for that was figure out what, and I called them secrets, cravings.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: Figure it out.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_02: And they were held accountable.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_02: I would go in the workplace and I'd say, okay, let's keep this simple.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: I want you to have a cravings manual on your customers.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so I'd I'd I'd call you in, Jacqueline, I'd say, hey Jacqueline, let me see your manual.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the first few times you didn't have a manual, but after a while you had a manual.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: Was it perfect?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know, probably not.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_02: But the reality is, is you spent time probing, getting to know the client, right?
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_02: And and recording.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the important thing.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_02: It's not about making friends.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's not.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's about getting information that you can use, again, go going back to my context, that you can use strategically, right, to win business and grow revenues.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_02: Because make no mistake, at the end of the day, that's what we as leaders are paid to do.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: We're not paid to make friends.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: We're paid to get the right levers in place to drive top-line revenues, at least I was.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I was paid on the basis of that, as was everybody on my team.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so figuring out a way to integrate these things into established systems was key.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so the performance management system for me was was brilliant because I just integrated it all there.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: And and walking through the workplace at first was kind of awkward for some people when I asked them.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, even an audit, okay, audit has clients, they're internal customers, right?
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: When I'd asked them to see their their cravings manual, uh first of all, they didn't believe I would ever do it.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but it only took once to ask the question.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_02: And then suddenly they started thinking about okay, who are my internal clients?
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: What makes them happy?
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: What triggers emotion?
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's strategic as hell, right?
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I guess I was just thinking about it.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_00: That's so so I'm I'm curious.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: So where did this all come from for you?
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well, first of all, I'm a I'm a weird guy, right?
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: I love it.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_02: I I'm guided.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: I have a I have my leadership philosophy, if you want to put a tag on it, uh, is leadership by serving around.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's my own tag.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: It's not leadership by management, management by wandering around, like it, like a lot of people.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's not about servant leadership, it's a spin on that.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's leadership by serving around.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's all based on embedding yourself with people and asking the question, how can I help?
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, how can I help?
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: The strategy is to unblock things that are impeding what?
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_02: Execution.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: So it's mindless.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: So what I wanted to know is okay, walking through marketing, walking le wandering through through sales or wherever is, okay, how can I help you?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_02: If I can figure out a way to connect at that level, people are happy because their jobs are easier, and I'm happy because what I call viscosity of the deliver value delivery system goes up, which means you know, inputs versus output process is effectively improved and the customer gets value quicker.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: And how is that translated?
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah, revenues.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, revenues.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: And so I tried a lot of things.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: I was one of these guys that was a lot, I tried stuff, right?
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_02: I listened to people and I would try and kind of like turn it into a bigger concept.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: So when people talk to me about the inability to recruit the right people, I started thinking about recruitment generally, and how can I hire people that actually care about human beings as opposed to floggers, right?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: People who actually were born with this I love humans gene.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_02: And why is that important?
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: Because customer relationships are all about caring, right?
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's where the hiring for goosebumps came.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: Because it occurred to me that it's all about learning, getting inside your head, and you're and finding out the experiences you had where you actually cared about someone else.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I would say to you, I'd say, Jacqueline, look at do you love people?
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, you would say, and I would took I took part in interviews all the time.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_02: So you got the president of the company in a panel interview with people who are applying for a customer service job.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that was intimidating, but it also carried the message that this is important, right?
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: So I'd say, Oh, yeah, do you love people?
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, you would say, Of course, Roy.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: So then I would then say, Okay, Jacqueline, tell me a story that would show me how much you loved people.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_02: And this is what separated the the wheat from the chaff, okay, because the people that were playing a mind game with me gave me a terrible, superficial story that left me feeling like a fish, and I escorted them out.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_02: But the people, okay, that really did believe it and have the ability would give me a story that was rich in emotion and caring.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: I gave me goosebumps.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_02: That's where the title came from.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: Hire.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: I hire that person, and if I had to teach them the job, I did.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: Because you can't teach people to love humans.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_02: You can't.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_02: You can teach them to smile.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_02: Hi.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and we all know what that's called, right?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_02: It's all the grinning thing, but you can't teach them to love humans.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so a lot of those things I just tried.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, just like killing dumb rules.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_02: Killing dumb rules was was a really good program, and it totally cleansed the inside of the organization.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_02: And the the idea was simple get rid of the things that piss customers off.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_02: And don't tell me that you don't have any of those rules, because you do.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, god, right.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, we had so much fun in the workplace.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so I I just started doing stuff like that, and and it grew.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: And and you know what?
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_02: Eventually, eventually, other people like my direct report team, they started coming up with the weird stuff too.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so it just because it was like a virus, uh, but a good virus that spread, and you know, eventually we got to the ability.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: So, Roy, I mean, a a lot of a lot of it, you know, things that you are sharing, it's there's something that you have done that I also really want to make sure everybody understands.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: You use these things, they're on the side of your head.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_00: They're called ears, and they you really listen.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's not, it wasn't you, um it wasn't you trying to pontificate something that you've read onto other people, but in actuality, it was you listening to other people so that you could create the things that were going to make that team sing and work well together, or what was going to help bring out the best in other people, which is so important.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, just even hearing you talk about you know interviewing, right?
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, telling the story about you know, caring for somebody else or some like something that shows that you that you care, something about the character, and and you said this you can train somebody, and it's I think this is really quintessential.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: You cannot teach character or values, you can train somebody for a job, but you can't train them on the character or the values that they have, and if those values don't and their character does not align with what you want as a company or what you know the that's going to align with that, the only ones whose statement that you've come up with.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: They're not ready to adjust.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: And you you I mean, the reality is true differentiation, okay, in the world is created by caring.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, that you take whatever product you want.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_02: I don't care what it is, I don't care what the technology platform is, I don't care about any of that.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, if you don't have a culture, okay, of people that actually give a damn about human beings, you will not be successful.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, people will go and find people that they like to do business with.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_02: You have to like and want and desire to do business with you if if you're gonna be unstoppable.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so there's a huge part of that.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_02: And for me, it was it was a matter of defining um a culture and values set around that principle.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, a lot of people call it heart-led, blah, blah, blah.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_02: It's not heart-led because sometimes people get caught up in that as that's the end result.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's not the end result.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's how can I use heart-led to drive revenues, right?
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that gets lost, and I have to keep repeating that.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, it's not about being different for the sake of being different, it's about being different in a way other people care about.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like I'd say to people, like, I really don't care about the color of your hair.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_02: I don't care about your pronouns, I don't care about any of that stuff.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you want to define that as be different, get out.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's not what I'm talking about.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: I want to know what you're going to do that is super special and unique in a way that other people care about.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: I want you not to be a narcissist.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so hard these days.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's so hard.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we have a population of narcissists, and they're being taught to I mean, just check TikTok out for God's sake.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's crazy, anyways.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I just that's just go, woof, woof.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you got to get back to some basics.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_02: Let's exist.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: We exist to serve others.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's what business is all about.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: You want to be unstoppable?
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: You be the best server in the world.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_02: Be that, be the only server that does something.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, this is good.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: I could actually write a couple blog or blog articles about this.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_02: You're doing a nice job pulling stuff out of me here.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's good.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: I love it.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: But that's so true.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, you know, and I and you think about what differentiates like, you know, I always say the good, the bad, and the ugly, right?
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, what's going to differ?
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's like how you ended up making somebody else feel.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: If you can, and if at the end of the day, it's you know, to me, it's like, okay, I I can't wait to find, let's just say the credit card company that goes back to using phones and having people answer the phone on the first call.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my God.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_00: Because as you said, like, you know, I'm that person.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you know, like and listeners, I'm like making the face of like and and trying to like go operator, operator, operator, or representative, representative.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we we all none of us like it.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody likes it.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody likes it.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: But yet it's like become this norm thing.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so I I I have become the of uh I've made this tendency of like anytime I'm picking up the phone to call somebody or to call a a a company or something like that, and I'm you know, to walk through something.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: By the time I get to them, I always have to stop myself and say, I am so sorry, but I hate your system, and I have to say this because otherwise I'm gonna be a complete ass, and I don't want to be an ass because that's not who I am, but I feel sorry for you because I'm sure people just want to get to you and they have to go through whatever.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, and by the way, yeah, it's you know, it's it's it's uh yeah.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_02: My diagnosis is that people talk about serving, okay, but they behave in terms of cost management.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_02: And so all you're running into is the classic, yeah, I mean, I we really want to exceed expectations, but it comes with a price tag, and I'm gonna manage the hell out of the costs.
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, why do you think people are using or outsourcing call centers all over the world?
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's because unit costs are lower.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then they try, they try and fool us by saying, you know, we exist to serve customers.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_02: There's one person that I know of, or that I knew of, a guy by the name of Tony Shea, who was the CEO of uh of a company in Las Vegas.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, unfortunately, he's no longer with us.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but he set up a company with a call center and he called it a loyalty center.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and everybody thought that he did he wrote several books around this whole notion of delivering Zappos.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_02: That was a company.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_02: He delivered, he he would deliver service through this call center, which he called delivering happiness and a loyalty center.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_02: And so the the objective was really simple.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_02: It would dazzle the customer, my words.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_02: He had different words, uh, and everybody thought he was crazy.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_02: Well, uh, guess what?
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_02: Eventually Zappos to Bezos in Amazon for a billion dollars.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_02: So if you want to talk about monetization of the whole notion of happiness and caring, there's an example, right?
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_02: But nobody does that.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: He's the only example.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_02: Everybody talks about having a cuss a call center that's that's that cares about you know an experience with customers, but it's all bullshit, they don't do that.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I my gimmick is different because I know exactly where you're coming from in that.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_02: I I because they have the power, right?
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_02: If if you don't treat these reps right, you're gonna be done and you're gonna have to go through it again.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_02: So my my phrase is thanks for taking my call.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I just leave it at that and go on, right?
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because they know, like frontline people, frontline people want to serve you, they want you to be happy.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_02: It's not their fault, it's a leadership issue.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_02: And so I trust my best not to.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_02: But we're talking about we're talking about differentials and and so forth.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_02: And and one of the things I love to talk about on podcasts is this is this whole notion of of brand promises, because that tends to be the tool these days, right?
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_02: That people are taught to use to express themselves as being unique.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_02: So let me give you an example of a couple of brand promises that I just think are hilarious.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_02: Here's the first one.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: This company claims they are the earth's most customer-centric company.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_02: So the brand promise is they will be, they are, the most customer-centric company on the earth.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_02: How believable is that?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_02: How about this one?
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_02: This one is the world's most refreshing beer.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_02: So these companies actually believe that these promises create a unique differential experience in the minds of customers.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a joke, but this is what they're being taught.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_02: This is the this is the kind of like opposite perspective to the only statement.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_02: What this says is it's first of all, it's narcissistic as hell.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: And secondly, it shows you it's based on aspirations.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not saying that aspirations have no value, they do, but not in a competitive claim.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_02: You want to be really specific to cravings, etc.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_02: To say that you're um the Earth's most customer-centric company.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_02: Come on.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, who's gonna believe that?
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not even gonna tell you who it is.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_02: You you will you would okay, just go and Google after brand promises, examples, and you'll find this one and you'll you'll giggle because it's uh it's kind of funny.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: And and this other one is uh is kind of neat.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's the most reliably familiar dining experience anywhere on earth.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_02: Again, very, very famous company.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_02: So this is this is the issue out there, and unfortunately, the people that suffer from thinking like that are customers.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_02: People like you and I, right, whose expectations are raised.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_02: This is going to be the most wonderfully consistent experience on the planet.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_02: And we go in and we're disappointed, and we go, huh.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_02: Shame on them.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: Shame on them.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_02: The only statement is my solution to cutting through that because that's not the space we play.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_02: We are led by cravings and driven to stand alone.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, never said that before.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_02: That's a good quote.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: I would normally ask you to text it to me because I'll forget it when it wouldn't.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_00: No, but guess what?
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give you the recording of this and so you'll actually know it.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the it's I can talk to you for hours about this, and and and it's making me even think about, you know, and and it could actually be a whole different subject, which is uh, you know, the the whole um survey uh survey culture that's come out.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, we need to get your survey of a of the service of how well we did, and then you actually pay the employee based on the survey that you got.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: So the employee says, please make sure that you give me a a a five or you know, out of one out of five so I can get paid properly.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, like back ass word, right?
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's a whole cultural thing.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's that's that again, it's not their fault.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_00: No, not their fault, but again, but the again top leadership, like it's it's exactly that.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, what we know what we want to know is, and and this is because people are driven to behave that way with us as customers, is because they're afraid.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, they've been punished, okay, by leadership by getting certain numbers, as opposed to coached to do better.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so it all comes back.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: It all comes back to those people who are trying to lead from their office who have never talked to customers, don't talk to employees.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_02: They actually think the frontline people are at the bottom of the organization as opposed to the top.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's like all of that stuff, and unfortunately, it translates into behaviors like that um that are being exhibited, and and it's simply not their fault, not the individual's fault.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's not um, yeah, it's crazy.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_00: All right, so Roy, tell our listeners how they can get more of you, um, learn more about you, connect with you, hire you if they want to, so they think you you can help them with their statement.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, um, I've got a website, be different or be dead.com.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, so go and and and check it out.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I blog very, very regularly on my stuff around Be Different Or Be Dead.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and check out the blog and please subscribe.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you want to know more about hiring for goosebumps or killing dumb rules or strategic game planning, go to the blog.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: There's also I try and make the blog as detailed as I can.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, sometimes I repeat because people learn different ways.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so I'm trying to be flexible enough to do that.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you'll also find a page on my seven books, describes what they are, and you can check that out.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I've I've got on my homepage uh actually my podcast, which is called Audacious Moves to a Billion.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's actually embedded in the in the homepage, so you could you can check that out if you want.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I think my favorite part of my website is my quiz.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a be different or be dead quiz, right?
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_02: If you could check that out, it's intended to have people do a self-assessment as to where they sit on the be different or be dead continuum.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_02: Are they claptrap and narcissists, or are they really be different and starting to think about cravings and that differentiation piece?
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_02: And it's kind of fun.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_02: You get to rate yourself and and and the um and the machine calculates your number.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_02: You can do that individually, you can do that with your team.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of fun, it's kind of team building, so you can check that out.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um and uh recently I just introduced a new part of my blog called Standalone Saturday.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_02: So, whole this whole idea is just take a real laser focus on differentiation, and I'm calling it standalone, okay, and using that as the theme.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: So it talks about why it's important, what are the sorts of things that you can do, and it's strong language, right?
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's hard hitting, right?
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_02: It condemns you if you're a part of a crowd.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I just call you out, right?
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: We'll see how that works out.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_02: So you can check that out.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_02: And lastly, yeah, lastly, I have a email, roy.osing at gmail.com.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_02: And to your point about only statements, it's it's just simply my way of saying I'm I'm here.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm here for you.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: Uh if you have a question, if I can help you anyway, please just reach out and I'd be happy to do that.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so yeah, I get people saying, hey Roy, I heard John Blah Blaine, here's my draft only statement.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think?
• 44:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's a wonderful question.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so I use that as a way to kind of like develop relationships, extend my tribe, and hopefully eventually we make a difference.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_02: Helping people think differently, get out of the crowd, get out of the herd, you know, be special in a way that other people care about, put the textbook down, all those kinds of things that I talk about.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_00: I absolutely love it.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: So, listeners, I am sure you have gotten a lot out of this podcast and are on your way to unstoppable success.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Chaplin Stumager.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: Please do me the favor, go to Olive Royce his website.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_00: If something today lit a fire within you, sparked a new idea, or gave you the extra push forward, please don't keep it to yourself.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_00: Share this episode in podcast with a friend, colleague, or fellow hype keeper.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_00: Be sure to subscribe with you.