Latest / Roast the Post Podcast / Woodwind Instructor: The Copy-Paste Conservatory

Transcript

Woodwind Instructor: The Copy-Paste Conservatory · Roast the Post Podcast

• 0:01
  Hey everyone,
• 0:01
  welcome to Roast the Post,
• 0:03
  the story behind the bullet points.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Paul Austin Muneer,
• 0:06
  and I come at job postings from the world of organizational
• 0:09
  design and servant
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: leadership,
• 0:11
  which means I can't help reading these things like little
• 0:14
  x-rays of how a company
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: actually operates,
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_01: the structure,
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: the expectations,
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: and the hidden assumptions they might not even realize they're signaling.
• 0:23
  Each week,
• 0:24
  Jen and I take a real job posting and pull it apart piece by
• 0:27
  piece.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes the role is clear, coherent, and well thought out.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: Other times,
• 0:32
  the posting is basically a structural cry for help dressed up
• 0:35
  in corporate
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_01: optimism.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_01: If you're a job seeker,
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: we'll help you understand what's really being asked of you,
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: not just what's written.
• 0:43
  if you're a job seeker seeker hr leaders hiring managers or
• 0:47
  anyone crafting these
• 0:48
  roles this is your chance to see how you're posting reads
• 0:52
  outside your own walled
• 0:53
  garden and what candidates infer from the gaps the
• 0:56
  contradictions or the hidden
• 0:58
  expectations one of us brings a job post the other has not seen
• 1:02
  we break it down
• 1:03
  section by section and at the end we each give it a grave no
• 1:07
  alignment needed just
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: honest perspectives from two different angles
• 1:14
  So I had a reminder set in my phone for this afternoon to
• 1:19
  change my windshield
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: wipers,
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: which I haven't done yet.
• 1:23
  And I had a reminder set in my phone to change my windshield
• 1:26
  wipers because we went
• 1:27
  through like a wicked snowstorm about a week ago and we were
• 1:30
  driving home and it
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: was not fun.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, oh, my windshield wipers really suck.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: Winter problems.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: And did you do it?
• 1:41
  mean tentatively i'm going to do it going to if that counts
• 1:46
  it's in the calendar i
• 1:48
  mean in victoria it you we have to because of the rain like
• 1:52
  it's just raining all
• 1:56
  the time it the weekend was just very wet and it hasn't stopped
• 2:02
  yet it's just
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: boring yeah
• 2:05
  yeah yeah well speaking of pouring um i found a fun post for us
• 2:09
  this week and this
• 2:11
  is something that i don't think either one of us would have had
• 2:14
  on our 2026 january
• 2:16
  bingo card but i found a job posting for a part-time woodwind
• 2:20
  instructor a woodwind
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: instructor okay
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: And for the folks at home,
• 2:29
  like Jen and I kind of like to have fun and use our rotating
• 2:33
  host hot seat to kind
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: of like screw with each other a little bit.
• 2:37
  So this is a part of my ongoing journey to make Jen go,
• 2:40
  what the fuck is he doing now?
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_02: No, this is what you're going to get is revenge.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's what you're going to get.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: No, right.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: Mutually sure destruction.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_01: Forgot about that part.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's okay.
• 2:54
  So we have a post to roast is for a part time woodwind
• 2:57
  instructor here in Toronto.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: Shall we get started?
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_02: Let's do it.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, so this is a part time freelance role.
• 3:11
  And I'm going to start by reading off exactly what was written
• 3:14
  in the job description.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: And for the folks at home,
• 3:17
  we have started putting the job ads on the Substack post that's
• 3:22
  attached to this
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: video and podcast or whatever.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: So if you want to kind of like follow along and you're really interested,
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: hit the link in the show notes.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: You can go load it up there and kind of follow along with us as we go.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: Summary for part-time drums instructor.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, wait, what?
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: They wrote drums instructor,
• 3:41
  but it was part-time woodwind instructor is what we're actually
• 3:44
  hiring for.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 3:49
  Our school is growing and we're looking for a dynamic and
• 3:52
  seasoned woodwind
• 3:53
  instructor to join our talented roster of music teachers to
• 3:57
  educate and inspire
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: students of all ages,
• 4:00
  levels and abilities at our downtown music school and recording
• 4:04
  studio located at
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: Street and Street in Toronto.
• 4:09
  Address removed so that we don't name and shame because that's
• 4:11
  not what we're all about.
• 4:13
  We expect you to be knowledgeable about a wide variety of
• 4:17
  musical genres in
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: addition to your specialty in drums and percussion.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_01: Whoops, I think that's another oopsie.
• 4:29
  And take great pride and care in the execution and delivery of
• 4:32
  your lessons.
• 4:34
  You're the perfect blend of professional performer and educator
• 4:37
  who views music
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: education and your own professional development as a lifelong pursuit.
• 4:43
  If you work well with a team and are looking for a school that
• 4:46
  cares deeply about
• 4:47
  creating a dynamic and uplifting learning environment for both
• 4:51
  their students and
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: instructors,
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: we want to hear from you.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: responsibilities and duties.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: Create an inspiring and positive learning environment for all lessons,
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: classes,
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: bands,
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: and workshops that you instruct.
• 5:05
  Follow instructions and memos from school director and
• 5:08
  administration staff.
• 5:10
  Attend all staff meetings and occasional one-on-one discussions
• 5:13
  with the school
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_01: director,
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: openly sharing your feedback and suggestions regarding school procedures,
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: programming,
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: school supplies,
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_01: and new equipment purchases when asked.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_01: Take daily attendance,
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: making lesson notes,
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_01: and assigning student homework using MyMusic staff scheduling software.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_01: Create structured,
• 5:34
  customized lesson plans and goals for each student to keep them
• 5:38
  consistently
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_01: engaged and motivated.
• 5:41
  Be flexible and quick to modify your lesson plans and approach
• 5:45
  as needed based on
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: feedback you receive from your students,
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_01: parents,
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: school admin staff,
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_01: or school director.
• 5:53
  I'm going to pause here because that's a chunk of stuff we'll
• 5:56
  carry on afterwards.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Anything stick out?
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Did anything kind of make you go, hmm, what's going on there?
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: Other than perhaps the, what are we hiring?
• 6:04
  Yeah,
• 6:05
  other than the confusion behind what it is that they're
• 6:08
  actually instructing.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's an important call out in and of itself though, right?
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like review, edit, read your job postings.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: This is, it's a copy and paste job.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: They've copied and pasted.
• 6:22
  And I don't know if you if we're going to get to clarity in the
• 6:25
  posting itself,
• 6:26
  whether or not it is actually drums or are you certain based on
• 6:30
  how it reads that
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: it is woodwind?
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because right now it's interchangeable.
• 6:36
  So,
• 6:37
  you know,
• 6:38
  90 percent of the time,
• 6:39
  60 percent of the time,
• 6:41
  it turns out to be woodwind.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll just see.
• 6:45
  um so yeah I would say just review edit obviously for
• 6:50
  efficiency you're gonna have
• 6:51
  templates and everything but like you gotta slow down and just
• 6:55
  read it this would
• 6:56
  be this is just already really confusing and hilarious I'm
• 7:00
  thoroughly enjoying this
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_02: um the thing that stood out to me a couple of things one is um
• 7:06
  know they're asking for someone who's seasoned so with that
• 7:11
  being said to me
• 7:12
  obviously that means that you're more experienced and curious
• 7:15
  as to what the pay
• 7:17
  would be to reflect the fact that they're looking for someone
• 7:20
  who is seasoned and
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_02: whether or not they're even posting um the salary
• 7:26
  We discussed this in a previous episode,
• 7:29
  but it is now a legal requirement in Ontario.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: And also,
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: too,
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: for listeners,
• 7:33
  I feel like we are really talking about a lot of Ontario based
• 7:37
  jobs for some reason
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_02: that just comes up.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: They're just more I guess they're just easier to find.
• 7:44
  But I'm going to be working on and I think Paul will be to
• 7:47
  bringing a little bit of
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: diversity into geography.
• 7:52
  um but yeah so season to me means that you have more experience
• 7:55
  so the page should
• 7:56
  reflect that so that's what i'm going to be looking for um they
• 7:59
  talk about uh you
• 8:02
  know providing feedback when asked i thought that was really
• 8:08
  interesting um like
• 8:10
  you can give feedback but only when we solicit it otherwise
• 8:13
  shut your mouth shut
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_02: your woodwind instrument right like
• 8:20
  shut your flute hole shut your flipping flute hole um so i just
• 8:26
  wonder what kind of
• 8:27
  culture that is right like and maybe they don't mean it
• 8:30
  explicitly like that but it
• 8:31
  reads that way it's like when we ask you provide feedback
• 8:35
  otherwise don't so i
• 8:36
  thought that that was a little bit interesting other things
• 8:39
  like attending staff
• 8:39
  meetings this is a part-time freelance role so i wonder what
• 8:42
  the compensation is
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: like
• 8:44
  um for that i'm assuming that you will be paid for attending
• 8:49
  the staff meetings but
• 8:50
  curious as to what that looks like so those are my initial
• 8:52
  thoughts yeah that's
• 8:54
  that's a really good point because this is a um this is a it
• 8:58
  strikes me as a very
• 8:59
  contractor type role yeah like i i don't think that the person
• 9:03
  who joins in this
• 9:04
  capacity uh is going to be directly employed by them and that's
• 9:10
  you know in in this
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: in this space that's that's not crazy
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Because the amount of work that you're doing,
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: the lessons that you're giving and whatnot is going to be so variable.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like one week or one semester,
• 9:24
  you might have three classes where you're fully booked and
• 9:28
  things are good.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: Another semester, you might have nothing.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like you might have nobody,
• 9:33
  no students sign up or enroll for that particular course or
• 9:37
  class that you're
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: teaching.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: So saying to the business,
• 9:40
  you must employ these people directly on a part-time
• 9:44
  contractual basis and take on
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: the burdens that go along with that,
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: that would be a lot.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: I could see where that would put some businesses,
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: private education businesses,
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: in music,
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: in serious financial difficulties.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not crazy to me that the contractor thing is what this is.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: I also wondered when I was reading this,
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: If they use like a kind of a job placement agency or service or whatever,
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: if they just outsource the whole thing and say,
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_01: you write the job descriptions,
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: this is kind of what we need,
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: go to town,
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: paste it.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I wonder if what we kind of found here was a copy and paste job,
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: as you said,
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: but from an agency.
• 10:28
  from a placement agency of some sort because this really seems
• 10:31
  to me to be the
• 10:32
  whole like we're moving too fast because we have 10 billion
• 10:35
  different things to do
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_01: and we have like 5,000 clients and whatever and you know copy paste,
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: copy paste,
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: oh geez my thumb was on like alt instead of control.
• 10:45
  This is interesting because I wonder if maybe you're making me
• 10:48
  think that what if
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: they did use an agency,
• 10:50
  the school used an agency in the past and they have some saved
• 10:53
  job postings and to
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: save some money,
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: they're like,
• 10:56
  we're just going to copy and paste the one that they gave us
• 10:58
  because I feel like an
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_02: agency
• 11:01
  would not make a mistake like this i i feel like it's literally
• 11:06
  what they do and so
• 11:08
  it would be rare to see a mistake like this being made so i
• 11:11
  feel like this mistake
• 11:13
  is um the schools but yeah maybe so many assumptions this is
• 11:17
  what this show is all
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_02: about a whack load of assumptions
• 11:22
  it's true let's uh let's carry on so the the next bullet point
• 11:25
  and again this is in
• 11:26
  uh responsibilities and duties so the next bullet point is
• 11:31
  provide periodic
• 11:32
  progress updates for students or administration upon request
• 11:36
  write clear and
• 11:37
  concise lesson notes creating recordings professional music
• 11:40
  charts and other
• 11:41
  relevant supportive materials for students admin staff and
• 11:45
  substitute teachers when
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: necessary
• 11:48
  Communicate with administration and students in a timely manner
• 11:52
  when attendance,
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: scheduling,
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_01: or other issues arise so that problems can be resolved quickly.
• 11:58
  Prepare students for end of term school concerts,
• 12:01
  performances,
• 12:02
  and competitions.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: And finally,
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: must be able to work weekday afternoons,
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: evenings,
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: and weekends on a set schedule to be determined upon employment.
• 12:13
  And we'll take a break there because we're going to go into a
• 12:17
  fairly lengthy section next.
• 12:19
  So like short intermission,
• 12:21
  but what,
• 12:21
  did anything stick out there for you?
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_02: Not really.
• 12:26
  I think about my son who's eight and takes drum lessons and
• 12:30
  what that looks like
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: and who is communicating to us.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: Is it the actual school itself or is it the teacher?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: And 90% of the time it's the teacher.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: He's the one letting us know if he's sick, if the class is cancelled.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: At this point, we text each other now.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: So I feel like that that seems reasonable and it seems in line.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think the it was the last part, the schedule to be determined.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_02: I'm wondering if that's because,
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: like you had mentioned,
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: if this is a contract freelance type role,
• 13:05
  this person is likely employed somewhere else or has a couple
• 13:09
  of these types of
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: gigs.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_02: And so they might there's a willingness,
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: it sounds like,
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: to work around that person's availability.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: So
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: So far, so good.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: I would guess that that's kind of the case,
• 13:24
  because you've got a couple of different factors that are going
• 13:26
  to be playing into
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: the schedule here.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: You've got, number one, the availability of the instructor.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: That's probably the most important one.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: Number two, you've got the demand side from students, right?
• 13:40
  Are you going to be able to fill a class of students on a
• 13:45
  Wednesday at 3 p.m.?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: If it's an adult class,
• 13:50
  sure maybe um but if it's a class for like teenagers maybe not
• 13:54
  because they'll be
• 13:54
  in like school school right so you got to kind of work around
• 13:58
  all of that stuff and
• 14:00
  then there's probably another part to it where it's like you
• 14:02
  know we'll figure out
• 14:04
  the schedule um together and then we'll we'll go fill the class
• 14:07
  like you say that
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: you're available
• 14:10
  tuesday three till five you know thursday seven till nine
• 14:15
  saturday like 11 a.m till
• 14:16
  1 p.m okay cool then that's when we're going to offer our
• 14:19
  classes and see if we can
• 14:20
  see if we can fill them up right i think that's a fair point
• 14:24
  too yeah absolutely
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: So next section is qualifications and skills.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: Bullet points as always.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: Exceptional listening and verbal communication skills.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: Detail oriented and strong organizational skills required.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: Outgoing and confident personality in teaching private lessons,
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_01: bands,
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_01: group classes and workshops.
• 14:49
  Proven track record of high student retention in previous
• 14:53
  teaching positions.
• 14:55
  The ability to double on multiple woodwinds with one instrument
• 14:58
  being your primary focus.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: More evidence for this is actually woodwinds.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, okay, yeah.
• 15:06
  Able to teach a variety of styles from classical to jazz or
• 15:09
  rock and anything in between.
• 15:12
  Ability to read music and write charts using software for
• 15:15
  students at an advanced level.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: A team player with excellent written and verbal communication skills.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: Excellent creative problem-solving abilities and a can-do attitude.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_01: Post-secondary diploma or degree, at least five years of experience.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: Experienced,
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: outgoing,
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: and confident in teaching adults,
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_01: children,
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: and teens in private lessons,
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_01: group classes,
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: bands,
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: and workshop settings.
• 15:44
  Ability to prepare for university,
• 15:47
  college,
• 15:47
  or RCM additions up to ARCT level.
• 15:52
  Adept and experienced at teaching lessons online at the school
• 15:56
  and have a quality
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: at home set up to teach through Zoom when required.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: As an independent contractor,
• 16:03
  you will be responsible for submitting your invoices to the
• 16:06
  school office that are
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_01: processed on a monthly basis.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: Secondary teachable instrument of piano is required for this role.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: bit longer.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: Wait a minute.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: We're throwing in another instrument.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: So we've got the woodwinds, we've got drums, we've got piano.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_01: I hear you,
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: but being able to teach on piano,
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: it's not that crazy for what this is,
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_01: especially when you consider that they're throwing in,
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_01: we want you to be able to do university print and ARCT,
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: whatever the heck it is.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_01: That kind of says to me that this is more for a trained musician.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of trained musicians,
• 16:53
  especially when they're in orchestras or they're playing
• 16:57
  woodwinds or whatever
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: else,
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: they can play piano.
• 17:00
  Because that's one of the instruments that you kind of learn
• 17:03
  when you're learning
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: to read music and write music and do staging and compositions and stuff.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: So it seems like a lot to us, but it's not that crazy.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that's actually, I think, a pretty good separating question.
• 17:15
  Because that question is going to kind of hive off people who
• 17:21
  are self-taught
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: enthusiasts,
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_01: which it doesn't sound like that's what they want.
• 17:25
  It sounds like what they want is classically trained folks who
• 17:28
  can do like the
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_01: high-level prep,
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: which to me kind of also says,
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: they said private lessons.
• 17:34
  We're doing private lessons,
• 17:35
  and that means that the price point for these lessons is going
• 17:38
  up.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's no longer just you're taking a class for 40 bucks a week.
• 17:42
  It's we're helping you prepare for your audition to Juilliard
• 17:46
  or something.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: And the piano thing,
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: too,
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: is interesting because I think,
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: like you said,
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: when you're talking about preparation for universities,
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: things like that,
• 17:54
  a lot of times piano is used as the accompanying instrument for
• 18:00
  those types of
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_02: situations.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_02: So it does it does make sense.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_02: And most musicians I know can play a ton of different instruments.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's just kind of what they do.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: So.
• 18:11
  yeah i would say so based on that section they do they do talk
• 18:14
  a lot like it's
• 18:15
  mentioned in a lot of different ways seasoned advanced five
• 18:18
  years experience like
• 18:20
  they're they're looking for someone more experienced um they
• 18:23
  mentioned that the way
• 18:24
  that it's written those qualifications that you listed i feel
• 18:28
  like it's quite
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_02: repetitive they're saying a few things
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: a couple of times, like confident, outgoing, all that is repeated.
• 18:39
  So far,
• 18:40
  though,
• 18:40
  I guess,
• 18:41
  and maybe maybe it's going to touch on a little bit more.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know anything really about the school.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_02: And it doesn't seem that exciting.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_02: It just seems like, you know, a gig, a part time gig could be anywhere.
• 18:56
  There's no differentiator so far,
• 18:58
  but maybe there's going to be more information.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this very much strikes me as something that you're going to do
• 19:06
  you know kind of part of your week um so if you're what i kind
• 19:10
  of think this is
• 19:11
  perhaps a little bit geared towards is uh music teachers who
• 19:16
  are uh who are not
• 19:19
  full-time employed by a board they might be employed on like a
• 19:23
  part-time basis or
• 19:24
  they might be on the supply list or something else but they
• 19:27
  have like lots of
• 19:28
  experience or sometimes there are teachers who are kind of um
• 19:31
  they're kind of
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_01: retired but not really
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: And they just supply.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it sounds like this is kind of geared for something like that.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: But you're right.
• 19:41
  There's not a ton about the organization and what they believe
• 19:44
  in this post so far.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I guess because it is a contract position,
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_02: so really it's,
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_02: it's not that important,
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: uh,
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: the,
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: like the cultural aspect or what,
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: you know,
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: like a job posting should make you want to go,
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: oh,
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: cool.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: I'd love to work there.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so far, this is not that.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but again, it's a contract position and it's part time.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe it doesn't need to be that.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: I mean,
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: that kind of does bring up that thought,
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: right,
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: of like,
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: when is a job just a job?
• 20:19
  Like,
• 20:19
  you're always going to want to be engaged by your work and find
• 20:23
  it valuable.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: But when is that line where it's like,
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: I want to fully buy into the mission of this organization and,
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: enter into that social contract where it's like,
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: they take care of me and I take care of them.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: I suspect that that line doesn't really exist for anybody when it's a
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: six-hour-a-week contract gig.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_02: Although that being said,
• 20:43
  it would be interesting to know their kind of like employment
• 20:47
  model at this place.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like is everyone a contractor?
• 20:50
  Do they have full-time people beyond I'm assuming the
• 20:53
  administrative type roles?
• 20:55
  That would be really interesting because then it would also
• 20:58
  indicate whether or not
• 20:59
  there was potential future potential for a full-time employment
• 21:04
  opportunity,
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_02: but maybe there's not.
• 21:07
  yeah yeah the the job post did mention that uh you would you
• 21:11
  would be asked to give
• 21:12
  feedback to the school director at various points so that
• 21:16
  suggests that there is
• 21:17
  like some kind of core staffing capability um but whether or
• 21:21
  not there are there
• 21:22
  are established pathways uh for contractors to kind of get into
• 21:26
  the organization
• 21:27
  and um and build those bridges who knows who knows it's so like
• 21:33
  you mentioned
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: earlier it's difficult because
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: you got to fill the classes, right?
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like you just, if you don't fill the classes and there's nothing,
• 21:42
  how can they still pay you right so yeah it is it's a tough
• 21:46
  it's a tough model um
• 21:47
  built on i think just part-time freelance contract work yeah
• 21:52
  yeah and i i wonder
• 21:54
  too like that now that you bring that up um i wonder too what
• 21:57
  the model is around
• 21:58
  the the one-to-ones and the private tutoring and the uh the
• 22:01
  admissions prep that
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_01: type of stuff because like you you you i can't imagine
• 22:07
  that that is something that is like really concretely scheduled
• 22:14
  and bucketed.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like,
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_01: I don't see there being enough demand to be like,
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: we're going to do university prep for Johnny at 3 p.m.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: every Wednesday and for Susie, you know, every Thursday at 11 a.m.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: ahead of time.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I wonder if that's where the whole Zoom setup thing kind of comes in,
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: where it's like,
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: all right,
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: We're going to basically build as the school,
• 22:38
  we're going to build a sales model to go out and market and
• 22:42
  sell these services.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then it'll be more like a referral type system where,
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_01: the parents pay us or the students pay us the school.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then we kind of filter that off to you on the back end.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: And,
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: we take our commission,
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: our piece of it,
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: and you figure out everything else,
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: like set up your own timetable,
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: set up your own like Zoom schedule.
• 23:01
  I wonder if there's some of that that goes along with this
• 23:04
  alongside kind of that
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: formal class thing.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I wonder what's to stop someone from saying to the family, like,
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_02: hey,
• 23:13
  let's cut out the middle person and we'll do this on the DL and
• 23:19
  it'll be a lot
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: cheaper and you just pay me directly.
• 23:21
  I mean,
• 23:21
  I think it would be sketch to have someone like the teacher say
• 23:26
  that to you.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: You might be a little bit taken aback,
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_02: but I just wonder what the benefit is to the student,
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: to the family to go through this specific school,
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: right?
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like instead of just doing it,
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_02: like just cut them out completely because I'm sure it's not cheap,
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: so.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder how sketched that actually would be.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: So think about your own experience, right?
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like your son's taking drum lessons, percussion lessons.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm sure that there's like a cost to that that's not nothing.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: If the teacher said to you,
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_01: like,
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm setting up,
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: like if they came to you directly and said,
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to set up like a little studio space in my garage.
• 24:05
  It's over on,
• 24:06
  you know,
• 24:06
  Alphabet Street,
• 24:07
  like over here,
• 24:08
  you know where it is.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of the neighborhood.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: On Woodwind Drive.
• 24:12
  yeah on woodwind drive it's it's safe and whatnot and um this
• 24:17
  is the price and oh
• 24:18
  by the way the price is like you know half off would you be
• 24:21
  like okay yeah i for me
• 24:25
  i i totally would because i guess we've established the
• 24:28
  relationship uh with the
• 24:29
  teacher i would be there right like right now we just sit
• 24:32
  outside of the classroom
• 24:34
  and wait for it to be over depends on the location but if it
• 24:37
  were more convenient
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_02: in the long run, I wouldn't be sketched out at all.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_02: I would actually be grateful.
• 24:44
  This actually reminds me of when our son was in daycare when he
• 24:48
  was really little
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_02: and we didn't have a babysitter at all.
• 24:52
  And so one of the daycare workers who we really liked,
• 24:57
  we were kind of like planting the seed.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: We're like, you know, if you know of anyone, wink, wink,
• 25:02
  who might be interested in doing some babysitting because we
• 25:06
  didn't know if we were
• 25:06
  allowed to solicit and apparently you're not and one day when
• 25:13
  we brought our son
• 25:13
  home in his backpack there was a little note that she'd slipped
• 25:16
  in with her phone
• 25:16
  number and so she was our babysitter for for a while and it was
• 25:23
  great but again
• 25:25
  like I think you kind of have to like test the waters and
• 25:27
  everything to see and and
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: all of that being said we could be
• 25:31
  discussing a huge faux pas in like the music world where it's
• 25:35
  like you absolutely
• 25:36
  can't do that like maybe you need the name of the institution
• 25:39
  as part of your
• 25:40
  submission papers that you like prepped at who knows you could
• 25:43
  be saying something
• 25:44
  that's like so so not what anyone would do but i would i would
• 25:49
  totally do it if it
• 25:51
  made my life easier then um and it was still safe for for my
• 25:56
  son then absolutely i
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_02: would do it yeah
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: So people who are listening at home,
• 26:01
  if you are in the music space and we are just talking out of
• 26:05
  our butts and we're
• 26:06
  like doing the absolute worst thing in the world and we're like
• 26:10
  the death of the
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: ethics in your profession,
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: write in and tell us.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, please.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: Because we're just regular people and we're like,
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'd save a hundred bucks a week by doing like private lessons.
• 26:23
  And we would then we'll do a,
• 26:25
  maybe we need to build in a corrections corner.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:28
  for all the times that we just say the wrong thing and we need
• 26:32
  to learn how to shut
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_02: our flute holes.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: We'll get a dunce cap, but we'll come up with a fun name for it.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_01: So moving on, we've got the next section is preferred skills.
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_01: A little bit short, which kind of surprised me.
• 26:49
  Ability to lead an ensemble in a variety of instrument
• 26:53
  configurations and music styles.
• 26:55
  Strong presentation skills and prior experience in conducting
• 26:59
  workshops and master classes.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: Experience with sound editing and recording is a plus.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: Experience with metal music is a plus.
• 27:11
  Like metal metal music like is that type like woodwinds or is
• 27:17
  it like heavy metal?
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: I would assume it's software because it was capitalized.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, OK.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: It must be some kind of music software then.
• 27:28
  Something that,
• 27:29
  you know,
• 27:30
  people who are in this industry would probably know.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_02: And are like shaking their heads right now.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: It's interesting.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: What, three bullet points?
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: I wonder why it's separate.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's a separate heading than the one that we were just talking about.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like, why isn't that just incorporated all in one?
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_02: That's weird.
• 27:47
  yeah because you preferred skills like this section you would
• 27:50
  think that that would
• 27:51
  be the place to be like you know you need um you need five
• 27:54
  years of experience
• 27:55
  leading the orchestras or groups or bands or whatever um you
• 27:59
  need like x y and z if
• 28:01
  you have this kind of accreditation for music teaching like
• 28:04
  you'd think that it
• 28:04
  would be in here but yeah it's just it's kind of a reiteration
• 28:08
  of stuff that was up
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: earlier in the job post
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's the,
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: the layout,
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: the format of it is a little bit weird to me,
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_02: but otherwise nothing else stood out.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: And kind of a tip for the folks at home,
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: like when you're writing job posts,
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_01: job ads,
• 28:26
  the more that you can format and structure the written
• 28:31
  advertisement to make it
• 28:33
  scannable and easy for people who are reading it to kind of
• 28:37
  like get a picture of
• 28:38
  what this is all about and go to different sections to look at
• 28:40
  different things,
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: the better off the job ad going to be.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: When you kind of bury things all together,
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_01: like it's a story or a piece of prose or something,
• 28:50
  you're making it more difficult for people to actually figure
• 28:53
  out the job ad and
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: the structure of the job and what they need and what you give them.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_01: So like bucket stuff and use headings like kind of appropriately.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_01: They're your friend, really.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 29:05
  I think it might be interesting to throw together a couple of
• 29:07
  like templates and
• 29:10
  throw them up in show notes at some point about what that could
• 29:13
  look like.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think that there is,
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_02: I think there's an assumption that there's a specific type of template,
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_02: but I think that that's a little bit archaic now.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_02: And there are other ways of putting together a job posting that,
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: like you said,
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: makes it a lot easier to scan.
• 29:28
  And like the too long,
• 29:30
  didn't read part,
• 29:32
  and then you go into it a little bit more.
• 29:33
  like what are what is it that you want the person to know right
• 29:36
  off the bat about
• 29:38
  this job about us so yeah so carrying on we'll go through the
• 29:46
  remainder of the job
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_01: ad there's not that much left over benefits bullet points casual dress
• 29:54
  environmentally focused company collaborative and friendly work
• 29:59
  environment
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: and they do list pay.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: We'll get into that towards the end.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: Job type,
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_01: part-time independent contractor position,
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: part-time hours per week,
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_01: targeting five to six hours per week.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_01: Schedule Monday to Friday is available.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_01: Weekend availability is a plus.
• 30:21
  We're specifically looking for Mondays at the moment with the
• 30:24
  opportunity to expand
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: to other days.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_01: And then there are some follow-up questions and instructions to submit.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_01: So application questions, this is kind of interesting.
• 30:36
  These are supplemental questions that they want you to answer
• 30:39
  when you submit the
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: job ad to the email address that they leave.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_01: Question one, which instruments do you teach currently?
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_01: And question two, what genres do you feel comfortable teaching?
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then it goes into education again, experience again.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you talked about, they want a bachelor's degree, it's required.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: And they want five years teaching experience, which is preferred.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: And the location is listed as in person.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: So that's kind of summing up the job.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_02: So they list that stuff again, like one more time after that?
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_01: but I really wonder if,
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_01: because it's just copy and pasted,
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: it's written exactly the same as it was before.
• 31:21
  I kind of wonder if the job ad platform has like a whole bunch
• 31:26
  of required fields
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_01: that you have to fill out.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: And then when they were going through,
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: they were like,
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: oh,
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_01: we already had this up here,
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: but we can't actually hit the post button until we fill in the field.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_01: So let's copy and paste.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_02: That's totally what it sounds like.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one thing to point out is that those are benefits.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's a really loose and generous term.
• 31:49
  for benefits and um if you're listening you wouldn't have
• 31:55
  caught this if you're
• 31:55
  watching you would have seen that I laughed because Paul when
• 31:58
  you said casual dress
• 31:59
  you did a little shimmy and that was hilarious casual dress uh
• 32:06
  and it helps that
• 32:07
  you're wearing like a Hawaiian shirt too so really really
• 32:10
  leaning into that
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it's January 12th.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, right now I'm just trying to manifest some damn warmer weather.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: I think in BC,
• 32:21
  we're going through what they call an atmospheric river and it
• 32:25
  sounds really cool,
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_02: but it's,
• 32:28
  like just wet it's just wet anyway so casual dress those
• 32:32
  benefits those benefits
• 32:34
  are hilarious to me because they're not benefits but i get it
• 32:37
  um this makes more
• 32:38
  sense to me the way you describe if it is on a platform where
• 32:42
  you're you know like
• 32:43
  you copy and paste the whole job description and then you have
• 32:46
  to fill out other
• 32:47
  parts you're like oh dang i already put this this in the body
• 32:51
  i'm just going to
• 32:51
  repeat it and there's there would be a section for benefits and
• 32:54
  it's a contract
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: position so you're like hmm let's think what
• 32:57
  what are some of the benefits casual dress so it's a little bit
• 33:00
  funny it's also
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_02: interesting to me that it said um it talked about like flexibility in in
• 33:06
  collaborating on building what those hours would look like but
• 33:09
  then it says that
• 33:10
  they have mondays available but then they also say they want
• 33:13
  five to six hours so
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: they're asking someone to work five to six hours one day a week
• 33:20
  That changes things a little bit for me versus spreading out
• 33:23
  like a couple of hours
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: throughout the week.
• 33:26
  That might make it difficult for someone who wants to
• 33:28
  supplement their income by
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: taking on something like this.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that that's just a little bit interesting.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_02: It seems contradictory to what it is that they were posting.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: It's unclear for sure.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's unclear for sure.
• 33:40
  Yeah,
• 33:40
  but they do mention like there's opportunity to potentially
• 33:43
  expand on those hours.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_02: So it does.
• 33:46
  I feel like there are a lot of question marks,
• 33:47
  but I also feel like the people who are
• 33:49
  experienced in this kind of work and in this kind of field are
• 33:54
  a lot more like down
• 33:57
  with this like they they're they're picking up what the people
• 33:59
  are putting down it
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_02: isn't that like
• 34:03
  we're thinking too hard we're thinking too hard about it for
• 34:07
  sure yeah yeah what
• 34:09
  about you what were your thoughts on that we we definitely you
• 34:12
  and i we definitely
• 34:13
  overthink sometimes about like specific wording when we're in
• 34:16
  the midst of job
• 34:17
  posts but i mean that's half the point right like a part of
• 34:19
  what we want to do is
• 34:21
  um uh is to to give people who are writing job ads uh and
• 34:25
  creating um these roles a
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_01: little bit of an outside perspective and some context
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, I found it a little bit inconsistent towards the end too.
• 34:36
  And as we're kind of going through it,
• 34:39
  I'm also thinking about the kind of the...
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_01: kind of the nature of the work,
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_01: like where it says in person,
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_01: and that's probably just a dropdown that you have to select.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, what's the closest one remote in person, blah, blah, blah.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because it seems clear that they do want in person classes to be taught,
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_01: probably group classes are a big part of their revenue model.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: So that's a must do.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_01: But then we're also talking about this private tutoring.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_01: And there was that kind of throw in there saying,
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_01: you know,
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_01: you must have your own setup at home and be able to do Zoom,
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: right?
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: So there's obviously something in here where it's like,
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_01: you're going to be teaching classes remote.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_01: And my mom,
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: who's very musical,
• 35:30
  like she tried to get me to learn instruments when I was a kid
• 35:34
  and whatnot,
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_01: didn't stick.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Disappointment.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: But she takes harp lessons and it's remote.
• 35:44
  So she's on Zoom like I think once a week or whatever with her
• 35:50
  full-size floor harp
• 35:52
  SPEAKER_01: doing a lesson over Zoom.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I grew up in the country where high-speed internet,
• 35:59
  not really a thing but there's still some kind of format where
• 36:02
  they've got that
• 36:03
  figured out and it's still like it seems to work so maybe this
• 36:07
  is becoming more and
• 36:08
  more of a thing in like music education I don't know but that
• 36:12
  does seem it seems
• 36:13
  weird to me that it's like yeah in class and oh you need to be
• 36:16
  able to do like zoom
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: remote remote from home
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, interesting.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_02: You also made me think about the format itself.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_02: Who are they trying to find and where are they finding them?
• 36:28
  Where is the candidate meeting the,
• 36:33
  I guess,
• 36:34
  employer in this case,
• 36:35
  in air quotes?
• 36:37
  Because I could see this being a really good little one-page
• 36:41
  poster that you put at
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_02: coffee shops that have open mic nights and things like that,
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_02: like community boards.
• 36:47
  community boards I think you would find someone because there
• 36:49
  are people who are
• 36:51
  out there just maybe this isn't the their full-time job but
• 36:56
  yeah side gig they have
• 36:57
  all the qualifications they're seasoned they're advanced all of
• 37:00
  that stuff would be
• 37:02
  a good way I think it would it would almost like come across
• 37:05
  better in that format
• 37:07
  than it does in whatever platform it is that you found this on
• 37:10
  so I think that
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_02: that's interesting as well
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: Let's talk about the salary because they do post a salary.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's wages.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: So they post an hourly range on this.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_01: I would not have gotten this right whatsoever.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm very curious to see how close to the mark you land.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think this job is worth an hour?
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think they advertised it as?
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_02: You know,
• 37:36
  this is the part that makes me the most nervous because I've
• 37:39
  never once gone
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_02: anywhere.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: Not even once.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_02: So as we were talking about this and we're talking about salary,
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_02: I was thinking back to my days of when I was like freelancing type stuff,
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_02: not in music,
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_02: but yoga.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_02: I was a yoga teacher and so paid a rate per class.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_02: But this was back in the day.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_02: And at the time it was pretty,
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_02: it was a pretty generous hourly rate or not hourly rate,
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_02: but per class.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_02: And the class was like an hour and a half.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to go ahead and guess like 50 to $60 an hour.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's my guess based on that,
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_02: based on something that has nothing to do with music whatsoever,
• 38:23
  just purely based on the only thing I can like touch on that's
• 38:26
  remotely potentially
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_02: similar to it.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_01: You were in the ballpark.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_01: You were in the ballpark.
• 38:32
  So they they listed 35 to 50 an hour with the kind of the
• 38:38
  qualifier that it depends
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_01: on like your individual qualifications and the type of lesson taught.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_01: So like that that kind of goes back to that whole
• 38:49
  is it a group class is it a workshop is it you know like the
• 38:53
  admissions prep for
• 38:55
  university is it private tutoring i'd imagine they have some
• 38:58
  sort of like sliding
• 39:00
  scale of fees or something or like some kind of compensation
• 39:03
  rate card maybe that
• 39:04
  they use for contractors it was it was quite clear that it's
• 39:08
  like really depends on
• 39:09
  what you bring to the table and what you're doing which i kind
• 39:12
  of liked um what did
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_02: you think
• 39:15
  Oh,
• 39:15
  I,
• 39:15
  I,
• 39:16
  man,
• 39:17
  I,
• 39:18
  before I read through this,
• 39:20
  uh,
• 39:21
  I was thinking like a hundred bucks an hour.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:25
  but i mean i know nothing about this industry other than like
• 39:31
  i've had friends who
• 39:32
  have uh taught music lessons like casually and um i kind of
• 39:37
  sort of know a little
• 39:38
  bit about like the uh the private academy business model um but
• 39:42
  other than that i
• 39:42
  know nothing about it so i was like how much would i value an
• 39:46
  hour of my time for
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_01: teaching a creative thing and i was like
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: 35.
• 39:54
  I was,
• 39:54
  I mean,
• 39:54
  yes,
• 39:55
  in the ballpark,
• 39:56
  but I doubled that at like 60,
• 39:58
  50 to 60 bucks.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think like this is when I was teaching yoga and like I said,
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_02: 50 bucks a class,
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_02: this was back in the day.
• 40:05
  So it's surprising to me to see a figure like $35 an hour when
• 40:10
  this was what aging
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_02: myself here,
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_02: like maybe 20 years ago.
• 40:15
  uh at 50 bucks a class uh so it's interesting to me to to hear
• 40:20
  35 an hour i just
• 40:23
  feel like that's not very much but uh they've got a range in
• 40:27
  there and it's an it's
• 40:28
  a decent range so and they're posting a range they're posting
• 40:32
  dollar signs to like
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: a value which is great like that's a huge plus so yeah yeah
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_01: And another thing to kind of call it for the folks at home,
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_01: it's easy to forget,
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_01: but this is the compensation.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: So the revenue side of that is more.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: I would guess,
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_01: if I had to,
• 40:52
  that the per seat fee or unit of hour kind of revenue that
• 40:58
  comes into the school is
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_01: probably double.
• 41:00
  what they've advertised so they're probably bringing in um
• 41:04
  between 70 and 150
• 41:06
  depending on the type of uh the type of instruction that it is
• 41:10
  and like there's
• 41:11
  overhead in the middle right like you're running a music school
• 41:13
  you've got all your
• 41:14
  overhead you've got all your other stuff that you have to pay
• 41:16
  for so of course
• 41:17
  you're not going to be able to give every single dollar that
• 41:20
  you charge for you
• 41:22
  know a spot in a class out to the instructor it's just it's not
• 41:25
  going to work that
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_01: way um that's why the economics of the gray market
• 41:29
  work out so well where it's like the instructor might say would
• 41:32
  you like um private
• 41:33
  lessons in my garage for half the price kind of why that can
• 41:38
  work at all right yeah
• 41:40
  yeah safety not guaranteed i'm trying to find my receipt for
• 41:45
  seb's drums because i
• 41:47
  want to know i actually don't even know how much it is and i
• 41:49
  cannot for the life of
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_02: me
• 41:52
  find it um so i don't know how much we pay for my son's drum
• 41:57
  lessons because they
• 41:58
  just take it out automatically um so i have no i'm gonna i'm
• 42:01
  gonna message you
• 42:02
  afterwards and let you know because i'm curious to what it is
• 42:05
  that they're what it
• 42:06
  is that they're charging yeah what's the spread overall uh
• 42:11
  overall what did you
• 42:12
  think of this uh this job post what's your score out of 10 how
• 42:15
  would you rate it
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's interesting.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_02: This is a very different one because it's for a whole different thing.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's a contractor, it's part-time.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think it had the information it needed to have.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_02: It was a bit jumbled up.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_02: It had those hilarious mistakes of like, is this drums?
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_02: Is this woodwind?
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_02: We think it's woodwind.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's leaning towards that.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_02: And it tells us nothing about the organization, right?
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_02: Like, and maybe, maybe it doesn't matter.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like you said, a gig is a gig.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but
• 42:48
  I feel like it was lacking it had a few mistakes it was jumbled
• 42:51
  up everywhere I
• 42:52
  don't know to me this is like a five it's again what does that
• 42:56
  look like on a
• 42:57
  really cool one page poster on a community board I think it
• 43:01
  would actually do a lot
• 43:03
  more heavy lifting in that environment so I think it's like a
• 43:06
  five it's not I'm not
• 43:08
  applying I packed my woodwind up I'm retired so I won't be
• 43:13
  applying anytime soon
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: what about you
• 43:16
  And what,
• 43:16
  before we talk about what I thought,
• 43:18
  what would you do differently?
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_01: What would you do to make this better?
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_01: Because you're right,
• 43:25
  there are definitely some deficiencies in how this post was
• 43:28
  structured and we don't
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_01: have the full context,
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: but what would you do differently?
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_02: I would get the role correct.
• 43:38
  making sure that it was the right instrument like imagine if it
• 43:42
  is for drums and
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: then it wastes like it's just it's wasting someone's time but you know
• 43:47
  multi-faceted musicians maybe it doesn't matter so i would make
• 43:51
  sure that i got
• 43:52
  that right um i would try to sell the organization a little bit
• 43:56
  like why why this
• 43:58
  place why this institution versus a different one um i would
• 44:03
  try to include
• 44:04
  a few more benefits like is there potentially opportunities for
• 44:09
  them to access
• 44:10
  space um a couple times a week or whatever monthly like a few
• 44:14
  hours every month
• 44:15
  that you can use the space for what you need to do to jam to do
• 44:19
  whatever like what
• 44:20
  are there there have got to be more benefits than casual dress
• 44:23
  like it just it's
• 44:25
  lacking so i think sell me a little bit more on the institution
• 44:28
  beef up the
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_02: benefits i know it's a contractor role but you can still do better um and
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_02: Have it just be a little bit more logical,
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_02: sensical,
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_02: even maybe including some testimonials of the place might be nice to see.
• 44:48
  But just dress it up a little bit more,
• 44:50
  make it a little bit like beef it up.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I was a little bit more generous.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that this was about a six and a half out of 10.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it was structured fairly well.
• 45:03
  Like they got all the basic points that you would need for a
• 45:07
  contract role kind of in there.
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was pretty succinct.
• 45:10
  They posted a range,
• 45:11
  which they actually said how much the job is worth,
• 45:16
  which is the law now.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: However, lots of companies are not doing it yet.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_01: Granted, it's been the law for two weeks now.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_00: at this point, but still.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I thought the structure was pretty good.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_01: Similar to you,
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_01: I thought that the opportunities,
• 45:33
  the things they really kind of missed on were talking more
• 45:37
  about the organization.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: And for me,
• 45:39
  it was actually kind of more specific to not really the
• 45:42
  organization and what it
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: stands for,
• 45:44
  but what what the the student body was really all about like
• 45:49
  are we talking about a
• 45:51
  school that's focusing on adult music education because we want
• 45:56
  adults to be like
• 45:57
  fulfilled and to be happy and to you know keep them keep their
• 46:01
  cognitive abilities
• 46:03
  sharp as they age like is it is it that or is it students like
• 46:08
  kids who want to be
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_01: professional musicians and
• 46:11
  we're passionate about bringing like the best of the best of
• 46:14
  the best we absolutely
• 46:15
  want every graduate to go on university and to be successful
• 46:19
  performers is it is it
• 46:21
  that because you're you're going to attract different um
• 46:24
  different types of talent
• 46:25
  and an instructor based on those things right like the
• 46:28
  organization's mission is
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_01: probably not going to be a huge factor
• 46:33
  this but the the mission of music that they believe in and why
• 46:37
  they believe in it
• 46:38
  that's potentially pretty powerful and they didn't really tell
• 46:41
  that story at all
• 46:43
  that's kind of the basis of my criticism on the on the
• 46:46
  organizational stuff and the
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_01: missed opportunity for employer branding I also would have liked it
• 46:52
  more had they talked about uh the the revenue model more
• 46:58
  because it's there's
• 47:00
  there's stuff in there that is like it kind of gives a hint
• 47:05
  about what the school
• 47:07
  does to make money like how its classes kind of function
• 47:10
  whatever but i i would
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_01: have i would have liked more
• 47:12
  because you know you and i talked about that um that kind of
• 47:15
  gray hole if you will
• 47:17
  where it's like yeah you know there's this opportunity that you
• 47:21
  know maybe the
• 47:22
  schools um kind of private tutoring or prep clients can just
• 47:27
  kind of like quietly
• 47:28
  become the private tutoring or prep clients of the instructors
• 47:32
  especially if they
• 47:32
  decide that they want to kind of part company and if it's a if
• 47:36
  it's a contractor
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_01: relationship
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_01: there is very little that the school can do to prevent that.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_01: If they're an actual employee,
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: then yeah,
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: yeah,
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_01: there's stuff that you can do to restrict that type of behavior,
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_01: solicitation and whatnot.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_01: But if you're a contractor, no, like there's nothing to do about it.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_01: So if you go into it as the business,
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: as the school with that knowledge,
• 47:57
  you can kind of start to structure the pathways where you're
• 48:01
  adding value as the
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_01: school,
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: but you're allowing the instructors to kind of function in that way.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_01: And if it was me,
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_01: just from the business side of it,
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'd be looking at a model where it's like,
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_01: okay,
• 48:13
  can I actually become like a lead generation service for
• 48:17
  private tutoring?
• 48:18
  for the instructor rather than like try and keep everything to
• 48:22
  myself can i instead
• 48:24
  be a platform and say hey you know i've got 20 students who you
• 48:28
  know over the
• 48:28
  course of the next year seem like a fit for you um do you want
• 48:31
  to interview them
• 48:32
  and you know if you if you decide to do something with them or
• 48:36
  we get you like
• 48:36
  matched or set up we'll take a one-time fee take a finder's fee
• 48:40
  like i've been
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: looking at stuff like that
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's really cool.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_01: Because it creates incentive, right?
• 48:45
  Like it creates the alignment of incentives that serves both
• 48:48
  parties a little bit better.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_01: And it kind of eliminates those things where it's like,
• 48:53
  SPEAKER_01: under the table,
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: we're going to do this thing because we can.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm sure it happens, right?
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_02: It absolutely must happen.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_02: I think that what is the revenue model is always an interesting,
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_02: that's an interesting story to share as well.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know why it would have to be secret.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, make it explicit, explain how it works.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_01: Well, shall we leave it there?
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_01: I think we can consider this post roasted.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 49:23
  Glad you could spend some time with us on Roast the Post,
• 49:26
  the story behind the bullet points.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_02: If today's episode helped you make sense of the hiring landscape,
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_02: or at least feel less alone in navigating it,
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_02: don't forget to subscribe.
• 49:35
  You can find us on YouTube or follow the show on whatever
• 49:38
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• 49:39
  SPEAKER_02: with your sanity.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_02: We're always looking for interesting job postings to break down.
• 49:43
  So if you've got one,
• 49:44
  whether it's surprisingly good or impressively confusing,
• 49:48
  send it in.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_02: Listener submissions keep things spicy.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_02: Follow that link in the show notes for more.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks again for listening.
• 49:55
  Catch us next time when we take on another posting that
• 49:57
  definitely has something to say.