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Too Busy To Meditate with Dr. Celeste Hamilton · Humanity Working

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: What am I experiencing right now?
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_03: Is my heart racing?
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_03: Am I feeling sad, happy?
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like where am I at?
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um and uh yeah, like you can do that literally before you like when you turn off your car, just sit there, take a few deep breaths, or in between a Zoom meeting, before you you, you know, click uh sign on to the next one, uh, take a few deep breaths or do that little check-in.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_02: Hi everyone, Paul here.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: If you're a regular listener to our podcast, you'll know we talk a lot about the need to take care of your well-being if you're going to be personally affected on a consistent basis.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: Many of us find this quite a challenge, and our excuse is well, we're way too busy.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_02: Now, one thing I've relied upon for a long time to help me deal with that challenge is meditation.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's typically a pretty short time commitment, and it can have some really profound restorative effects.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_02: Even though I've meditated since I was a teenager, I by no means consider myself an expert.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: Fortunately, my guest today, Dr.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_02: Celeste Hamilton, is an expert.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: And she specializes in working with and coaching super busy people on how to fit meditation into their lives.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: Whether you're new to meditation or have been doing it for years, I'm sure that like me, you'll learn a ton.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: Enjoy it.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: My background, I am a scientist by training.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_03: So I have a master's and PhD in uh actually exercise physiology in the area of um endocrinology, specifically osteoporosis.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_03: And I worked for probably seven, eight years in academic healthcare in that setting, um, running clinical trials in a hospital uh clinic, um, after which I, you know, completed my graduate studies and went on to work in uh medical affairs in the biotech industry in the same area.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_03: And um again, for probably, I think it was around seven, eight years or so.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_03: And uh that's when I made the shift uh to running my own uh meditation and and wellness business uh full time.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_03: And that shift came about as uh basically um, you know, it felt like a bit of a calling, if you will, for a few years.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_03: It was um, you know, stemmed from my own experience and existence of living life in the busy, if you will, and and wanting to thrive in the busy and look at ways I could support myself to do that um better.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_03: And so meditation was a really critical tool to help me optimize um not only my performance and kind of achieve uh kind of my next level of success, if you will, or the goals I wanted to achieve uh professionally, but also, you know, on a personal note, just in terms of my energy and feeling like I was could function in alignment and just my overall well-being, a meditation was something that, you know, is really a simple um practice, which doesn't take a lot of time.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_03: And it helped me optimize um what I like to say, kind of the six pillars of wellness.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I'm happy to elaborate on that, but you know, having kind of uh kind of a switch went off for me and I thought, wow, this is really um, you know, something that's been so powerful in my own journey.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_03: And I I really started to feel more called towards supporting others to uh be able to tap into it as well.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_03: So um, you know, along with other reasons of uh wanting to kind of start my own business and all that.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_03: So I I made I made a shift when the time felt right.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_03: And uh now that's my primary focus is helping, you know, busy professionals, whether that's in the corporate setting or entrepreneurs, really uh learn how to do uh busy differently, I like to say, because uh busy isn't going anywhere.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_03: It's just kind of learning how to thrive in it.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um busy can feel good or it can feel you know draining, exhausting, and kind of bad.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we we often talk uh Pellin Minds about this idea of shifting from a traditional work-life balance where you know, at least mentally you've envisioned like work on one side of it, life on the other side of it, um, to a world where you kind of understand the role that work does and should play in the context of your life.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm curious as you were in your previous role and as you moved into this new role, how has the way that work has fit, how has the way work fitted into the context of your life changed as you went from that old world to the world you sit in now?
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I I love the question and I love actually just um chatting about the concept of balance because I think our our paradigm around how we view balance is definitely shifting, especially um now uh where we're sitting kind of, you know, just coming out of the pandemic and everything, we've we've had a chance to kind of reflect on, you know, what's important to us and what we want to bring forward in our our life uh going ahead.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, I definitely um noticed a shift kind of before doing my own thing and after, and and how balance felt for me on both sides of that coin.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_03: But like you alluded to, um, my traditional view of balance kind of in the then, if you will, was uh similar to what you said.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: It's like you've got different compartments like work and personal and rest and play and family, and it's all like kind of segmented and and you show up in one and maybe it doesn't feel good and it drains you, and then you show up in another and it's uh feeling happy and fun and restful.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_03: And it's kind of like at the end of the day, you hope it all kind of evens out.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_03: Um but actually, as we all know, that doesn't really um have longevity or um you know to it.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_03: So what I've noticed is that just for my own um personal approach to balance now is really uh just stems from focusing on living in alignment with my own values.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_03: And by values, I mean like things that really drive me and light me up, um, you know, energize me, things that I'm drawn to, which may be status quo, may not be.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and it's really a personal thing.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_03: So when I'm really true to myself and what I really desire and and um feel like I want to partake in, that's when I find myself um, you know, not feeling drained or not feeling um, you know, like a have to or should to.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_03: It feels energizing and flowy, right?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_03: So it's I guess it's living in alignment with um values and first identifying what those are, and then also just honoring my own energy.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_03: And that's kind of goes along suit.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_03: It's like our energy shifts as we um, you know, engage with things that are in alignment with who we are and what we value, and as we engage in things that aren't.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: And so for me, um, there were elements of uh, you know, in my prior career and what I was doing in that environment that were not was not in alignment with um some aspects of of my value system.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I had to really step out to kind of appreciate what that was and understand um which components fit in.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_03: So I would say definitely my sense of balance has has changed over the years.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_03: Um and uh where it's sitting now is is definitely just more focused on um a really strong connection to understanding um my own, you know, feelings, beliefs, desires, and and tapping into and just really honoring um how I feel um in something as I'm going through it.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_03: I also just like to say like balance is feeling good as we're going about the journey.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_03: It can't just be, you know, this uh teeter-totter or balancing of a scale of good and bad, and somehow it works out.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's now for me, it's so important to um just just feel good as I'm going through um and uh experiencing whatever it is I'm I'm doing in my in my day-to-day.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you call out a very important point there that comes up a lot with people that we've been speaking to, which is that you do have to feel good about that journey.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: Otherwise, it's just A, not sustainable and B, kind of pointless, right?
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_02: If you spend 20 years of your life hating something in order to get somewhere, then you've just spent 20 years of your life hating something, you know.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: So it actually becomes a very important point as to what enjoying the journey of whatever your destination is.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I think a lot of us probably, you know, um, including myself, we've all been there where we kind of arrive at our destination, whatever that is, a goal, an achievement, or something you work so hard towards, like you're saying, and we get there and we still feel empty.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: We feel disconnected, we don't feel fulfilled, and we're like, well, I thought I wanted this thing for like the last five years or whatever it was.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: And that's because of our uh disconnection, if you will, along the way.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um, in terms of you know what we value and um, you know, feeling good, good within uh where we are in the present.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so you mentioned these six pillars of wellness.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: You want to talk us through those?
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: They're things that we all know, but what I usually share with people is, and I think we can all appreciate is that we have areas where we're really strong and developed, and then other areas where we maybe could develop a little bit more.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_03: And if we kind of are able to just expand in those um, you know, some of the areas that we haven't tapped into as much, we'll we'll be able to um, you know, feel or optimize our wellness overall.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: So nutrition, so making sure we're eating well to um support our physical body, getting enough sleep, um, you know, moving our physical body with through exercise.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, I would say most of us who are busy professionals, um, you know, we those are things that there's a lot of systems that exist for those, and we're kind of, I feel like we've got options and we may already have those things on lockdown, like the eating healthy and the exercise.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: And then where I find, at least for me and most of the clients I work with, and where I found in my own journey what I needed to develop further was um more the areas of mindfulness, uh, really being able to tap into gratitude and just ensuring um that we have strong social connection.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: And again, this is why the meditation is so critical for me, is that what I see is that the meditation, what the meditation has done, it's like this simple practice that really is the thread between all of those six pillars.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_03: So it's something that helps you just form a deeper connection to yourself, which allows you to then connect differently and interact differently with others, um, you know, be able to be more mindful in your day-to-day, be able to access, you know, kind of process and move through emotions or or burdens that we're carrying and therefore access, you know, more joy and gratitude and kind of secondarily be able to um just, you know, you're more aware of the decisions you're making about, you know, kind of, you know, what you're doing in your exercise or your eating or, you know, and of course, sleep, it helps a lot with sleep as well.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_03: So it's like this this thread that just can help you um amplify or expand or develop in in kind of each of those areas.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and then of course, um, there's always more you can do, but if you're gonna start anywhere, I always I always encourage people to start with something that's that's real simple, but it's gonna be extremely powerful in in making helping you shift in in multiple areas of of wellness.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_03: So, but yeah, I guess from my perspective, the you know, if you've if you find yourself kind of doing all the things uh that you know should make you feel happy and you're still not feeling happy, you're still feeling too busy or chaotic or whatever, it's like what what are some of those other pillars that maybe you're not as tapped into, like the mindfulness or the just real ability to feel gratitude?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_03: I know that's that's another one that's like, you know, some some of us are, you know, we are we are wanting to tap into it, but we we don't we don't really know how it's hard to feel it, it's hard to connect.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: And and all of that comes through um, you know, spending more time in stillness and with ourselves and really um enabling a connection between our intellectual experience of of life, um, as I like to say, um, bridging that with our emotional and and intuitive experience.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_02: So can you tell us a little bit more about the specific form of practice of meditation that you teach?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_02: Um and and basically what drew you to that form.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I practice and teach um a type of meditation which is called the one giant mind being meditation technique.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_03: So it is a form of meditation that helps um, you know, it helps you establish present moment awareness beyond your thoughts.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, uh a prior uh coach of mine recommended um this technique.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I checked it out and and it kind of just stuck with me.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_03: And and what I really liked about it was just a the the simplicity.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, it's the recommendation is to practice 20 minutes a day.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: And it's something that you can just once you once you learn, you can um, you know, tap into wherever you are.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like I used to do this at the office, sitting in my car, um, you know, wherever wherever I was.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's mantra-based uh meditation that's uh rooted in Vedic tradition, but it's uh the way that we actually teach it is um specifically uh with you know people who have hectic and busy lives um in mind.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's kind of presented and formatted um the learning uh in a more you know digestible um way that that fits for someone's lifestyle like that.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I think it's a great um option, not only because it's a transcending type of technique, which is foundational for any type of meditation practice, but um also just because of the simplicity and the way it's taught is is tailored for um you know someone who's ready to explore meditation, but may not be ready to go on like a 10-day retreat.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um explain what you mean by a transcending technique.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, sure.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: So just uh what I mean by that is it it just helps you um basically move into a state of uh conscious awareness beyond your thoughts.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_03: So different, your as you allow yourself to sit in stillness, you'll just notice that your your mind then um kind of goes through different uh levels of brainwave activation.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_03: And so when we what we're essentially aiming to do is kind of um, you know, calm our mind or get our mind to a place where we're able to just um you know activate our parasympathetic nervous system response.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_03: So we're kind of turning on the rest and digest uh system of our body, which allows everything to kind of come down to, you know, for your body to feel safe enough to restore vitality and and be in a place um where we're we're just um out of out of the the busy kind of active mind and into the more introspective um part of it.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: Another benefits that people see beyond sleep, because I think probably some of our listeners might think, well, if I just sleep for half an hour more, I'm gonna get that benefit anyway.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_02: Is that uh is that simplifying it too much?
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, they say that meditating for you know 20 minutes is as effective as like two hours of sleep or whatever.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's one of those things that is it's a practice that helps you turn on that, you know, parasympathetic nervous system response, which gives your body a chance to rest and restore, which is essentially what happens when we go to sleep at night.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_03: Our body is like, you know, building new muscle and and restoring and it has time because it's not it's not up and thinking and trying to deal with you know the different visual stimuli and things that are coming into our life.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_03: So um, yeah, it seems like one of those things that would be like one more thing to add to your to-do list and how am I gonna now fit in 20 minutes of meditation or 40 minutes of meditation, whatever it is in your day.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_03: It seems like, you know, it's still time that you have to spend.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: But I always find that if I'm if I'm feeling fatigued at all, just based on you know, whatever I have managing in my schedule, I always find that doing a meditation, like sitting for a meditation is much more um restorative for me.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: And you come out of it, you know, way less groggy or way less um kind of because you're not you're not going as deep into um you know the brainwave uh states as you would when you're sleeping.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_03: It's a it's a different um, you know, brainwave that you're out of it.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I can testify to that.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a absolute night owl, and this morning I had to be up at uh at 4 a.m.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_02: unfortunately, which meant not much sleep.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: And that 20 minutes of of meditation is basically why I'm able to talk to now without being completely due here.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: I would say that the two conversations that we've had with people that are, I would say, more resistant to things like meditation, or indeed any form of self-care, um, is number one, you're too busy for it, or number two, it's just not for them.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_02: In other words, that they're not wired that way.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_02: They um, you know, that's for that's for people who you know like to start their day in the lotus position or whatever, you know.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_02: So what's your what's your what's your take on that when you get that kind of initial, maybe people are somewhat aware that they need to do something and they don't know what that something is, but they're quite resistant to this, the even the idea of this.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so I mean, my first I'll tell you my take and then I'll tell you what I would how I would challenge it.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so my my take is that you know, busy is a state of mind.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: So it's we feel too busy to to take on anything else.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's simply a matter of us not feeling capable to meet the demands that are being placed upon us.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_03: And so when we meditate, we we get better at feeling more capable of meeting whatever is kind of facing us.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_03: We we kind of um, you know, in in times when we would normally kind of get triggered and and go into that sympathetic response, we we are then able to, you know, see it, observe it, and not get all self-identified in it.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, it it's I like to explain, you know, busy as kind of this state of mind, or if we're one trying to access calm and the chaos, it's it's really we feel that way when we're kind of straddling um the regret of the past and fear of the future, if you will, when we're when we're out of present moment.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: So if we are kind of all up in our to-do list or all the things that we need to like get to to arrive to, or if we're you know kind of reliving things that are maybe weighing on us or on our mind, it's it's like we we we feel like we're you know pulled.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_03: So um, you know, what I like to say is like that getting out of that comes from you know, connecting to the present moment, which is what meditation helps you do, and essentially prioritizing self.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_03: So if you're someone that's like too busy for yourself, actually the way out of it is to prioritize yourself.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_03: But um it's like one of those things that you can't just explain and expect the person to take to it.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: So usually the way that I would approach it, if someone is, you know, like I'm too busy for self-care or I can't identify with meditation because it seems like woo-woo or whatever, that's kind of like two different things for me.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I think if it's the too busy for self-care um element, I would usually ask someone, um, I would try and identify how they're feeling in the busy, because usually if someone is too busy for for themselves, it's like, well, actually, how are you feeling in that busy?
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: Like, is are you feeling good?
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like normally, if we're um, you know, too busy and not not feeling it like we're feeling drained or we're not doing things that we like desire, like when we're not prioritizing ourselves, we're actually not feeling good in the busy.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just a matter of like helping them see that.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I usually try to ask people, like, well, how actually are you feeling?
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_03: Are you living in a way that like feels good, or are you just running?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: And then it's kind of like, oh yeah, like actually I yeah, I'm not doing those things I like, or I'm not, you know, prioritizing myself, or I'm not, you know, I'm feeling disacted or whatever.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_03: So start with kind of asking that question so that they can kind of see that like it it starts with um self, I guess.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_03: I I, you know, we're so conditioned, I think, as I alluded to earlier, to kind of achieve and meet our career goals or meet our whatever we're going after.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_03: And sometimes when we get there, it doesn't, you know, we're just walking out the motions and we get there and we don't feel connected, we don't feel fulfilled, or we don't feel the way we thought we would.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_03: And um we can really shift drastically how we um feel and like from a point of fulfillment and connectedness when we actually shift um our framework of leading our life with self, followed by you know those that we love and are important to us, like putting time and attention on ourselves, giving time and attention our, you know, we only have so much of it.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_03: So it's like, where are you putting that?
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_03: So if you're putting it on yourself first, then your cup is filled up and you're you're showing up better for everyone else around you as well.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: And then it's like, who matters to you?
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_03: And are you giving them the time and attention that they need?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_03: And then it's like everything else.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_03: So then it's like career and all that, but we're our society doesn't function like that.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_03: We we usually lead with career or other um aspirations or things that feel more important than self, but at the end of the day, it's um, you know, it's it's critically important to if we want to find that feeling good in the busier, or if we want to find that fulfillment or happiness, it actually comes from kind of reframing, um, you know, starting to look at, well, actually, how are we how are we showing up in this busyness and and how does it feel?
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_03: And if it doesn't feel good, then what do we need to shift?
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: Billion Minds has taken over a dozen years of research into the habits of the most effective among us in this new world where work and life are merging.
• 21:58
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• 22:05
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• 22:14
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• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's billionminds.com slash L-E-A-R-N-M-O-R-E.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_00: Billion Minds, providing practical tools for our way too busy lives.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I like about what you said there is that you hear statements similar to what you just said there, Celeste, but it's very clear that you've internalized it, right?
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: So you've actually got to a point where you had one frame of reference, as it were, for your life.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_02: You had one way of thinking about your life, and you've now got a very different way of thinking about your life.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: Was that a was that, and it's not a bumper sticker statement, right?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's actually something that that you clearly live your life by.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_02: So was that a gradual realization, a sudden realization?
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_02: Was it something that sort of like intellectually you got you needed to do, but you hadn't internalized it?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_02: How did you get from where you were to where you are in terms of the way in which you even think about your own life?
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, um, it definitely uh comes through developing like through my meditation and and having continued to develop my practice and as well as you know, do mentoring with um, you know, the founder of the technique that I that I teach.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_03: I part of it is you know self-discovering and expanding, you know, your self-awareness and the ability to know it's one of those things is like you can hear things and they may or may not resonate, but then when you're kind of ready, then you it something clicks.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, it was I've always um led with my career and kind of been independent for everything.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_03: And and I had to do a lot of work myself on being open to having other people help me and letting other people in and forming, like, you know, seeing, you know, people for their contribution and you know, like I was very capable and able to do things.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_03: But so for me, I was peeling off a lot of layers of um just on that side of things.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_03: And then um, yeah, even I'd say like the biggest one I noticed recently, which kind of shifted it full tilt for me.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: Like I think I was pretty good at prioritizing self-care within um the realm of you know, still having career prioritized and other values prioritized.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_03: But um, for me, it's been uh where I've noticed that I haven't had it all figured out is in relationships for me.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_03: I just notice like different relationships suffering, like my prior marriage and even with my son, I felt myself having a lot of resistance to, you know, I wanted to be like working or doing something, and then I'd, you know, it'd be time to pick up my son and I'm a single parent.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, well, that's that.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I was kind of always wanting to be somewhere else than when I'm where I was.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I realized when I when I started to shift with making sure my needs were met, making sure my son's needs were met.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, for anyone that you know is in a relationship or has a spouse or kids, it's like making sure those people that are close to you, like that they're having, you know, the best of your your time and energy and intention um put on them.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_03: Then it's like all of those things are supporting you to then thrive in in everything else that's more, you know, in service.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_03: Or so for me, it was it was definitely gradual and it and it kind of I was way off with just everything like my job and and everybody else owned me.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: I I had no stake in it, and I had to start by first focusing on okay, let me get myself back on track and making sure my own needs are met, and then doing it kind of within the environment of you know my relationship setting.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_03: So it was definitely gradual.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I now I feel like you uh it's actually really um beautiful to hear you say that you're you're saying like clearly, I can see that you embody it, and I think like, yeah, I finally have because um, but it's it's been a journey.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: Are you looking to hone the skills you need to thrive as work and the rest of our lives merge?
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: If so, we can help.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: For the first time, Billion Minds has taken the program it offers to businesses and customize it for individuals in a program they call the Elements.
• 26:38
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• 26:43
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• 26:46
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• 26:50
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• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: So we talk a lot about personal effectiveness on this podcast, and we differentiate personal effectiveness from uh, for example, traditional measures of productivity or busyness, as you say, right?
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_02: Have you seen practical differences as to how effective and sustainably effective people are on a day-to-day basis?
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and if you have, do you have any examples you could share of people that had a certain level of effectiveness kind of coming into the relationship and now are a better spot?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_03: I think for effective leadership, we need to be able to um hold space for someone else.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: And when we are kind of at the point where we're not able to manage our own needs and we're too chaotic and rushing around and in the motions and too busy, um, we're not able to actually be present for for anyone else and to hold space for them.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: And so I've seen meditation just be such an effective, and and as you know, we can all appreciate an effective leader is someone that can actively sit there and listen to you.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_03: And and by hold space, I mean like really connect and hear you and meet you where you're at, wherever that is.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_03: And I found that I've been able to really transform my ability to do that through meditation.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: And I've seen that happen in others too, and and and um that are you know just on a meditation journey with me.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's um, and that comes from the developed self-awareness because the more the more you're able to understand yourself, the better you're able to uh kind of put time and attention into yourself and get your needs met.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_03: And then you have, you know, you by default have more space to help others.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_03: So I'd say, yeah, from a leadership perspective, um just I don't want to just say active listening because in in my mind it's really like a true, you can sit there and kind of be listening, but you can sit there and really be connected more.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_03: Um I I just feel it differently with when someone is really like their heart is heart center is open and they're connected to their emotional and intuitive um experience of life.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: You can you can feel that.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_03: And that's what I think um makes someone more effective in the workplace as well.
• 29:15
  SPEAKER_03: It's the way that they interact with, you know, their teams, their you know, line management, whoever it, whoever it may be.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_03: And I I can think of one, my last actually boss who I worked with.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I thought, gosh, he really like stood out around, you know, it and it wasn't like he was more productive or getting more stuff done.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_03: It was the way that he was able to interact and support his team.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_03: And he was very well, you know, developed, um, you know, in you know, meditation and those things.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_03: He was connected and knew himself.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I'd say that, and then I'd also say, like, in terms of effectiveness, like if you're it's just from a physical perspective, um, you know, what meditation does is it it restores, like, you know, if you're not sleeping, it's gonna help you sleep better and it's gonna help you rest better, it's gonna help everything all peel off layers of stress and fatigue that have been sitting there and continue to accumulate as we go through, you know, challenging aspects of our life.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's not only mentally restorative, but it's also physically restorative, which you know, when you pair those together, um, you become more effective by by default.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_03: And of course, there's all the the other um you know benefits of of meditation that improve effectiveness, but I I would say one from a kind of busy busyness or perspective, like the ability, the agility to pivot and just um shift, like what you're managing.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_03: I've I've found that really been fine-tuned for myself as well.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_03: And just it's like you're able to take something in and when you're uh take something in and not be self-identified with it.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_03: So usually we feel caught up in everything because we start to self-identify with the thought or the emotion that comes with it.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_03: So it's like, oh, you have to do this, you know, 10 more projects, and you're like, um, but if you're just kind of like when you're when you have a developed meditative practice, you're able to just kind of like the information comes in and you're just like, yes, no, moving on.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_03: It just flows through.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_03: So I feel like that aspect, the ability to kind of receive and allow information to flow through is really um fine-tuned through meditation as well, which of course is critical in any kind of um professional environment where you're having to pivot and adapt and um put out fires on a regular basis.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's very interesting you should mention it like that because one of the things that has struck us for some time now is the fact that you have this collection of effectively semi-high achievers in the work uh in the workplace who wear almost as a badge of honor some things that true like elite athletes, for example, would look at and think of as crazy.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_02: So I get by on three hours sleep.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, right.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_02: Well, show me uh show me an Olympic gold medalist that has three hours of sleep, right?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_02: Or I get or show me an elite chess player who has three hours of sleep, or whatever it would happen to be, right?
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: So um, and and you can take almost all of those aspects.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and we actually mentioned on a previous pod, um, imagine flipping that.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: Imagine uh, like, for example, an Olympic, somebody who's training for the Olympics and says, you know what I'm gonna do?
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna basically work myself into the ground every day.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna have any rest.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm, for example, gonna train at my sport for 22 hours a day.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_02: What are they gonna do?
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_02: They're gonna break down, right?
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_02: They're gonna physically break down or they're gonna mentally break down.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_02: And they know that.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so embedded in the minds of elite performance athletes that rest and recovery and increasingly taking care of the mind as well as taking care of the body is all essential for peak performance.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: And yet, still in the workplace, culturally as much as anything else, there's this vision in some cases that, yeah, that's that's for other peak performers, but not for this peak performer.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's a very, it's a very strange thing, isn't it?
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_02: The fact that we know scientifically, we know what is associated with peak performance.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: And then we many of us ignore that in the workplace.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's like exhaustion and struggle are seen as like markers of success.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_03: It's like, oh, well, I'm struggling more or I'm busier and like that makes me better because I've got less sleep and whatever.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, the way I kind of like to think about um that, I think it's great you brought it up because um, and I and sleep is such a good example for that too, because you know, there's so many views on what what's the optimal amount of sleep, right?
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_03: But the way I think about any of these things um for wellness is just, you know, yes, your body is capable of doing crazy amazing things to survive.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like you can go ahead and not eat and sleep for three hours a night, and you'll probably be able to like knock out a lot of the stuff, and maybe you'll make some errors that you wouldn't have otherwise made because you're tired.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_03: But it's like imagine what you could do if you really optimized your you know physical well-being.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_03: So it's to me, it's like do get the basics and enhance those even more, and and you're gonna see yourself like again have longevity in it and and be just reach an even greater level of success.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_02: So for some of our audience, hopefully they'll be listening to this and going, yeah, I guess I probably should check this sort of stuff out and start and start thinking about this more seriously.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um for people that are really right on the embarking on this journey, um, and for whom maybe parts of the last few minutes have felt deeply unfamiliar, um, what would you say would be like a baby step that an absolute, absolute beginner could do right away, whereby hopefully they see some sort of result that would encourage them to explore further?
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_03: I would say ditch your checklist and it's time for a check-in.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_03: Because so what I mean by that, I'm I'm just joking around, but um really just taking a quick moment um throughout your day, like whether it's you know midday or before you go to sleep or whenever it whenever it is that you can, you know, decide you're gonna set an intention to do it, but just to create a moment, uh, you know, to pause, uh, to really just check in with yourself and and where you're at.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_03: And um to me, it's it's less about you know doing more things and more about again, where are we at?
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_03: Like, how are we feeling while we're doing this?
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_03: And what do we need to thrive as we're going through the journey?
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_03: So it could be um as simple as just, you know, a check-in and asking yourself a couple of questions, like, how do I feel in this moment?
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what do I need right now to feel vibrant or energized?
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_03: Or how do I want to be showing up right now?
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_03: Am I showing up that way?
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like, do I need a nap?
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_03: Do I need to eat?
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_03: Do I need to um, you know, go on a date night with my spouse?
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what are my needs um being met right now?
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_03: And how can, if they're not, how can I honor what I need, whatever it is?
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I and we're we're really conditioned to just push through and kind of push our needs aside and and just keep going for the sake of whatever it is we're focused on doing.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_03: But if we are able to just bring, um, you know, just allow ourselves to do a little check-in um every so often, and you could even just set a little alarm on your phone to be like, bing, like, uh, okay, it's lunchtime.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_03: Like, where are you at?
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, you know, did you finish the stuff?
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_03: Did you do what do you need?
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_03: Or, you know, because every day is different, and and we need to really start to just pause and tune in so that we can um take a moment to honor where we're at and and uh really try to to make time to do that.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_03: So that's one thing.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_03: And uh my other recommendation, of course, everything starts with the breath, and that's a huge part of how why meditation is so helpful.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_03: So even if if you know, maybe meditation's not for you yet, um I I believe it's uh will be helpful for anyone who tries it, but if it's still a little bit, you know, not there, just simply pausing to take a few deep breaths, like just closing your eyes, putting your hand on your heart, and breathing in through your nose, you know, so that you're activating your diaphragmatic response and and by default your that parasympathetic response, and just taking, you know, that takes a few seconds to take a few deep breaths with your eyes closed to just pause and slow down.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_03: And again, it's kind of like, what am I feeling?
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_03: Or how am I, what am I experiencing right now?
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_03: Is my heart racing?
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: Am I feeling sad, happy?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like, where am I at?
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and uh yeah, like you can do that literally before you like when you turn off your car, just sit there, take a few deep breaths, or in between a Zoom meeting before you you, you know, click uh sign on to the next one, uh, take a few deep breaths or do that little check-in.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_03: It's something that we don't have to make it this big thing that we have to fit into our schedule.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_03: It's like literally can take 30 seconds to to just take that time.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, talking about making it a big thing.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_02: I know a common misconception people have is that that in order for this to be successful, you have to completely empty your mind.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then they end up with this battle where they're trying to empty their mind and then something pops in it, and then they think they've failed, and then they think they can't do it.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_02: So can you just talk very briefly about that?
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, for meditation with respect to meditation, that that's a huge one.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I I um yeah, it is is not about um controlling the mind or controlling our thoughts or erasing our thoughts from our mind.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's getting to a place where we can um just allow ourselves to essentially observe our thoughts and just be with them.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_03: So part of what meditation, I think we often have this, um, as you alluded to earlier, uh, this uh vision that meditation needs to be this destination where we're sitting in like, you know, in lotus position on the top of a cliff overlooking an ocean, we're like, you know, so zen and calm.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_03: But actually, in reality, I like to describe meditation as a processing tool.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: And it it's it's something that often during the process um feels uncomfortable because what we're doing is we're getting used to sitting with ourselves, we're getting used to actually facing whatever's going on in our internal landscape.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_03: And um, when we're busy and in in the the go, go, go, we don't, we're just pushing that down.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_03: So when we actually stop, that can feel really uncomfortable, can show up as agitation, a lot of racing thoughts, um, just kind of um emotions that are, you know, crying, whatever it is, it can difficulty breathing, it can show up in different ways.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_03: And and what it's actually just telling you is is that needs to be processed.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_03: Your body needs time to kind of allow that to surface and release from your energetic body.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_03: So it's actually, you know, meditating is not about what happens when you're in your closed eye experience, it's about how that translates to your open eye experience in life.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_03: So if you can just kind of shift the need for to have preferences or expectations about having a perfect or uh, you know, a preference about what your meditation should look and feel like, it's really just more about being uh getting comfortable with sitting with discomfort, whether it's thoughts or agitation or whatever it is.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_03: It's just allowing it and observing it and um you know letting it letting it release from your your energetic body so that you feel lighter and and more replenished and vitality is restored.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_02: So this is a very important part of your life now.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, where do you see your your life going forward?
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_03: Oh gosh.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_03: That's a big question.
• 41:35
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so I think I'm a true believer that arrivals in the here and now, although I do have um plans for myself.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_03: And I what I truly love um doing is is speaking about meditation and teaching meditation and empowering others to integrate it into um their lives, um, especially busy professionals, because you know, that was me.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_03: It still is me, and it's been such a transformative tool.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_03: So I I hope to um be able to just continue to support more people um in finding that and and building an understanding of how it can really um be supportive for them and helping them, you know, take them one step further on their journey.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_03: And and yeah, just um, you know, as I learn and grow, I love to um share my learnings um with others.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_03: So I like to, you know, I'll continue to create courses which are um an expression of uh the things that I've embodied and learnt along um my journey that I found um helpful.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_03: And uh yeah, maybe one day turn that into a book or something, but definitely it's a it's a focus for me on continuing to um support people with with meditation, particularly in the in the corporate setting, um, as well as and um yeah, just just be be a coach and support um and uh someone that can connect um to anyone who's is feeling called to explore that in uh in their life at this at this point.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we'll have links in the show notes for folks that want to get in touch and want to learn more, but thank you so much.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: It's been super helpful, and I know a lot of our listeners will have learned a great deal.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks a lot.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_00: The Way Too Busy podcast was presented and produced by me, Matt Neal, and was brought to you by Billion Minds.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to get in touch with us, tweet us at Rising Billion or email us at WayToo Busy at Billion Minds.com.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: Billion Minds, creating practical tools for our way too busy lives.