Latest / Authentic Living / David Somerfleck – Digital Marketing Specialist

Transcript

David Somerfleck – Digital Marketing Specialist · Authentic Living

0:01
Welcome to authentic living with Roxanne, a place where we conscious conversations about
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things that really matter in our lives.
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And now here's your host, Roxanne Derhodge.
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Hi, everyone.
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It's, Roxanne Duhach.
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Thanks for tuning in again this week.
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This week, I have, David Summerflick, and he's a digital marketing expert, something that I
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can literally say.
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I pull my hair out about often, not, you know, and feel like I've learned probably a a tip of
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the iceberg and what's needed since I've started my business.
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So, David, thank you so much for going on today.
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You're very welcome.
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So I'm gonna tell you a little bit about Davis background and, how we're gonna spend our time
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today.
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So, David, he's worked, he has 20 years experience in digital marketing and project
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management.
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He helps businesses, and owners accelerate growth in business.
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He's worked with 100 of business owners from multinational CEOs, college presidents to
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advertising agency owners, tech start ups, law firms, restroom chains, and retail outlets.
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His goal is to get more customers for you, and he can do that in in many ways.
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So so, David, what got what got you what's your background?
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What got you involved in in digital marketing?
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We'll basically, my career with digital marketing, basically, What happened with me was
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I went to college to be a writer or a journalist.
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I have a degree in English with an emphasis in creative writing.
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I had done some freelancing internships while in college, and my first job out of college was
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working for several newspapers.
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And I very quickly saw that, even back then there was a pecking order that you needed a
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master's degree to really, get, you know, high paying positions with major newspapers So even
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though I've always loved creative writing, I saw very quickly that there wasn't gonna be
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much future in it unless I had a master's.
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And I had just finished a BA.
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So I started studying digital marketing back in the nineties, when the internet was still very,
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very young.
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And I found that there were a a a a a great number of businesses that really needed someone
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who could come in and just do everything.
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And so I started doing that freelancing while I was working as a writer and editor.
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And then I slowly changed from that, got into editing, and then I was a teacher, a para
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professional, a teacher's aide, then I was a college professor.
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Then, I was a college administrator.
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And during all of that time, I either worked freelancing for clients as a solo consultant
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And then after working as a college administrator in between, I would go and work
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for different marketing agencies.
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So over the course of 20 30 years, I've worked for more marketing agencies either as an
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employee or as a contractor than I could ever count.
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And I also was a volunteer for SCOR, which if, your listeners are not familiar with SCOR, is a
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division of the United States.
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Small business administration.
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So I was a certified, business mentor for them for off and on, almost 10 years.
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And I also volunteered as a business mentor for another nonprofit.
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So one day I just tried to do an assessment of how many people I spoke to and nobody knew.
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And I realized that it had to be several hundred people over the over that duration of
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time.
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And I realized, you know, what?
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I need to give myself credit for the work that I did, the people I helped.
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There were many businesses that got in touch with me and said, hey.
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Look.
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Because of your help, because of your help, you turned our business around.
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You literally saved me 1000 upon 1000 of dollars.
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You saved me years of stress.
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You've saved my business.
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Now we're profitable.
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And I just started collecting those testimonials and putting their pictures up on
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my website.
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And I just said, you know what?
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I need to give myself the credit for what I have.
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I had, this is my I had 2 startups as well.
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1 was a mediation nonprofit.
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Then I opened my own digital marketing agency in Denver with my wife.
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Now I'm older.
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I'm semi retired, and I just decided, look, named the the due individual practice what it
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is.
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It's me.
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I'm a digital marketing specialist.
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DMS also happens to be my initials.
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My favorite color is blue.
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So I just looked online one day and just said, I've gotta get that domain name.
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Dml.blue.
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That's me.
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It's what I am what I do.
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I like the color blue.
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It was perfect.
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So that's how I'm at where I am now.
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So, I've never met a business owner that I couldn't help, but I have met a lot of business
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owners who were resistant to change.
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Which is a big difference, or business owners who were not a good fit.
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So now I look specifically for business owners who need and want accelerated growth and can
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scale for that.
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So I handpick who I work with typically one pot one client per quarter, and that's enough for
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me at this phase where I'm at.
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So tell me, I know that, for me with my business, what became really important and, and
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also in writing my book, And, when I speak, keeping my voice is very, very important.
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Yes.
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Right?
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And sometimes, you know, as an editor, as a writer, you can appreciate it.
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Like, I remember, using one editor, who was completely out of alignment of what my voice
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was.
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She was actually changing my voice.
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Yes.
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And not really seeing how that was impacting my voice out there in my in my worlds of
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authenticity.
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She was she was ready.
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She I I, you know, And, of course, to to put it politely, we we didn't get along so well for
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for a very short period of time, and and I went on to someone else.
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So I I found that very, very interesting, but when you work with people, how do you kinda vet
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them out in reference to
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That's critical.
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Whether a good fit for you because
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That's yeah.
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That's that's critical.
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I can't say that enough.
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As a matter of fact, I just answered a question just like that.
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There's a website called Quora quora.com.
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Yes.
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And every once in a while, I'll go on Quora, and I'll answer questions.
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I'll try to include a video if I can.
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Then, depending on what time of day or night it is and and everything, what my wife is doing.
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But authenticity is critical.
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I can't say that enough.
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I'm still discovery, my own true voice, and who I am and how I've changed because we get so
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used to this paradigm of going to work, taking orders, and then fulfilling those orders.
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And there's someone overseeing you, the supervisor, the project manager, in my case,
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this the company CEO.
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I worked for a marketing agency once it was very, very small.
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There was the company CEO and then there was the director of marketing.
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And that was it.
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That was the chain of command.
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And, but I remember he was a very, very smart, very, very, educated, gifted person, but he had
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this habit of shouting profanities and using racial epithets So as you could imagine, that
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would make things a little bit uncomfortable at times.
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Now I learned a lot from working there.
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Both positive and negative, but it that was one experience where I had to get my own voice.
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And I remember at one point just saying, look, don't use that language around me, but on a
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larger a larger scale, how do I vet my clients?
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I basically really require that we have at least at least 1 or 2 serious, conversations on
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an adult level about business objectives and business goals.
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If If I responded to every phone call that I got in every email, literally, it would consume
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every hour of my live educating potential clients on why they should care, what is SEO,
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what is web design, how do I do everything myself for free?
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You get all of these questions.
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And you could try to be a nice person and help them all.
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But literally you would have no clients, no money, no income, and no time.
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So I require at least 2, maybe 3 phone or Skype conversations before I really take them
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seriously.
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And the way I look at it is, look, if you and I can't have 1 or 2 conversations for 15, 20
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minutes, how can we work together?
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Mhmm.
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How could we possibly achieve business objectives if you can't focus long enough to
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talk?
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Now I don't know about you, but from my perspective, it's extremely common to get phone
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calls.
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I had one person call me up out of the blue.
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And this is when I listed my public phone number on my company website.
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Right?
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So they could call me directly on my phone.
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And I would get phone calls such as how much is a website.
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Mhmm.
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Well, how much is a car?
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It depends on what your business objectives are.
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Right.
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I don't know if you have goals in life or not.
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Right?
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And it sounds like a silly question, but many people who would call me, they didn't know what
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I was talking about.
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When I would say, what are your business objectives?
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Well, what are you talking about?
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I just want a website as cheap as I can get it, and you're not gonna be done.
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It's not like they're ordering a stack of business cards.
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There's no connection to achieving goals.
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So I learned from that experience.
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First of all, I don't put my public phone number up anymore.
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I put my Google voice number I would probably say I probably get about 40 or 50 calls per day
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where people call and hang up, call hang up all day long.
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But, yeah, I require at least 2 or 3 phone conversations or Skype calls to see if we're a
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good fit for each other.
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And after that second or third call, maybe we'll talk about budget, but budget is
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secondary to having objectives.
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And that's really, really key.
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It's very easy today to go online and say that your company CEO and not be one to say that
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you're something and you're not.
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And it's still today to this to this day surprises me to go in.
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That people will do that.
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But if you have ever seen that TV show catfish
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Mhmm.
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Yes.
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Yes.
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I have.
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To some extent, I get people doing that because they're dating, but look, at some point,
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they're either gonna meet you or they won't.
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And if they're not gonna meet you, then what's the point?
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Mhmm.
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Mhmm.
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Aren't you be cruel when you show some male models photo?
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But you don't look like that.
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That's not who you are.
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Aren't you be cruel to the other person?
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Are you are you being inauthentic?
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How are you ever gonna have an adult relationship like that?
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And yet, how many people do it?
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You know, uh-uh, the, you know, I think there was a study done by Facebook that they said
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something like 60% or more.
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Of accounts on Facebook were from people who are not real people.
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They're either duplicates or scam or spam.
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Pages.
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Businesses that were no longer in operation that weren't real.
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People who would show photos celebrities or cartoon characters or male models or whatever.
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So there's a lot of in all authenticity, a lot of phoniness out there.
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And I think it's just the nature of the internet, you know.
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So as an individual and as a business owner, it's really important to find your true voice
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you know, who you are, what you want to be, what you aspire to be, who you wanna
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legitimately help, and who you don't want to waste your time with who you can't help.
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It's not that they're bad people.
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It's just I can't help you if you will be honest.
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Or forthcoming, or you say something silly that's were completely ridiculous.
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Like, my budget is $200, and I wanna be number 1 of Google.
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That's not gonna happen.
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You know?
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So does that, you know, now as far as my end, I have a workbook on my site that I offer for
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sale that basically walks people through various steps.
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You purchased the ebook.
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It helps you get clear on what your objectives, should be and could be when working with a
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digital marketer such as myself.
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So I sell that on my website.
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Let me try turning this down and see if this helps.
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Any I don't know if you're hearing any back.
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No.
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I I'm not hearing anything at all.
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Hopefully, I'm clear also.
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Yes.
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But but those are some of the things I do to try to facilitate more effective and clear
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communication.
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So if
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you're a startup
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Yes.
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Then and you have no real business objectives, it's it's kinda tough, right, because if I I
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think back to when I started my business, you know, I, obviously, I'm I'm like you.
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I'm kind of mid career.
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So I'm a psychotherapist.
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I've been a a corporate consultant for years.
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And then I went off and I started to, I wrote a book and started to write and train and coach
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on the book.
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So but, again, not really having a plan back then other than I knew I wanted to continue
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what I was doing, but in a different way.
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And has have the credibility obviously coming into it.
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What I see a lot of out there is a lot of people don't have the credibility.
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But they're they're promoting a lot of things and to your point eventually, you know, the
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guy's gonna have to or the girl's gonna have to see who she's dating.
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So that speaks to that authenticity in being in line because if I'm saying I'm a mental health
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and wellness specialist and you look into my background, You should be able to tell if I'm
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authentic relatively quickly on Google.
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Would you agree with that?
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Yeah.
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I think there are a lot of self help gurus on the internet.
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You know, I say I'm a digital marketing consultant.
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But that encompasses many different tools.
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And just using Facebook as an example, If I go into Facebook, primarily what I do is I check
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forums to find technical specifications, to ask a technical question or get help with a
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technical issue.
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I would say almost every time that I log into Facebook.
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I will see an ad for a new, guru person or some guru expert.
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I'll help you get a 1,000,000 referrals for, you know, amount or what have you.
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And I'm sure you see that as well.
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Sure.
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And you just have to practice a little critical thinking You know, it does this sound
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reasonable?
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Does this sound even realistic?
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In most cases, it's about having what I call adult mature conversations with people.
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What are you really trying to do?
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Why are you trying to do it?
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What have you tried to do so far?
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How's that been working for you?
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You know, if I were to talk to, let's say a psychotherapist, so let's say you wanted to be
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number 1 in Google.
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I would say, okay.
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You know, how long have you been in operation?
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What have you tried before?
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What were for you, what has not, why do you think that is?
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Basically a little psychotherapy, only without the experience.
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But I would try to ask
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digital psychotherapy, David.
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Right.
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I would try to ask probing questions that would try to identify.
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Is this real to you?
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How important is this to you.
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And I I think in a lot of cases, people see as, like, I'll go to Amazon to see how much a
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camera might be.
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Right?
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So by the same token, somebody will wake up in the middle of the night and have an idea for a
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business or something.
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And they can't go to Amazon and look up how much a website might be.
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They're not going to go to Google and look up typical digital marketing budgets.
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So they'll just call us the first person they can find and just say how much.
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There's no context.
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So it doesn't mean that, you know, that there's any, bad feelings or or anything like that.
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It just means we're not a good fit.
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You're looking for a a low ball price that you may or may not act on.
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I'm looking for people who have very specific business objectives they want to accomplish
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that are very, very important to them.
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So that open communication, trying to build a true voice, authenticity is very, very
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important.
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It's difficult.
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It's difficult.
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It was difficult for me to learn, you know, who to stop talking to, whether it was in dating,
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whether it was as an employee, whether it was as a subcontractor starting my own business.
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It was very, very important to realize, look, some people just aren't good for you.
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Stay away from them whether that's for dating or for business.
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If somebody wants to talk to me for 5 hours, but they have no intention of ever working or
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or resolving a problem.
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That's not realistic.
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It's not a smart use of my time.
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The same way with dating and and all these other analogies that we could come up with.
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Does that kinda answer the question?
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Oh, absolutely.
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Because, I mean, at the end of the day, like, I mean, you can get people, you know, putting up
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something in on Wix for free to being able to have a state of the art But I know can runs
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1000 and 1000 of dollars, but it's kinda like, you know, I always say, like, what is the image
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that you're trying to project out there?
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And and and so website is just a flat con concept on on a on a screen if you have
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anything behind it.
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Yeah.
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Let me give you 2 examples.
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I was a mediator.
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So, I was a trained certified mediator where I would resolve court just I went, resolved a
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court dispute that was scheduled to be on Judge Judy.
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And, yeah, I was very surprised when they showed me the letter from the Purdue and
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everything.
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And I just said, look.
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You can go on there and be a television celebrity and be known as, you know, this type
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of person.
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Or we can resolve it right here and now without the drama.
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But anyway, I'd I've spoken to a lot of lawyers and there's a lot of pushback from them.
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And I don't really know for sure why.
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I think some of it has to do with the nature of being a lawyer being argumentative and
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defending or fighting, one or the other in court.
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But There were 2 lawyers that I spoke to recently.
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There was one lawyer who said that he wanted to start his own solo practice.
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And we talked on the phone twice.
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The first time we spoke for at least an hour, the second time we talked for at least another
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hour, And after the second time I spoke to him, I just said, look, you he had a Wix website.
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His problem was no one could find him online.
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If you looked up a lawyer in his city and his state, he would never show up.
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And I just told him, I said, look, your lawyer, your smart guy, you're educated.
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What do you really expect for free?
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Do you really think that these people are gonna put you at the top of Google for free?
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And then you're gonna get a 1,000,000 phone calls overnight for free.
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Come on.
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Let's get real.
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They give you an empty template that looks like a million others, and it's your job to fill it
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in.
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And if you don't know what you're doing, then you're gonna get out exactly what you put in, a
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big doughnut.
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And I asked him, how many referrals have you gotten from it?
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None.
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How how many 1000 of dollars do you think you've lost over the course of the 3 or 4 years
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that you've insisted on having that?
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He said, well, I don't know.
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Could be tens tens of 1000 of dollars, probably 70, $80.
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But he was insistent on never investing a penny in his solo practice.
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Now after probing a little bit deeper, I realized that the reason for that was because
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he also worked for a much larger established older firm, what we call a legacy law firm.
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They would get all the referrals through court referrals in networking, none of their clients
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came through the Internet.
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So they were all older people getting all the referrals through the the court system.
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They didn't care about the internet.
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They didn't take it seriously.
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It was a fad to them.
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So he had the same mentality.
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So I just said, look.
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I wish you a lot of luck.
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I can't spend any more hours answering questions trying to cajole you to give a
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blankety blank about your business.
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If you don't, I wish you well.
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Have a nice day.
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God bless.
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Hung up.
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Never heard from him again, and I knew I wouldn't.
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There was another lawyer I spoke to who contacted me, because she had a Wix website
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too.
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Same problem.
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She was losing tens of 1000 of dollars in potential clients every day because nobody
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could find her in Google search.
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And at that particular time, I was very tired.
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My wife was going through a radiation therapy for cancer.
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I was stressed out, and I was tired.
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And I just said, ma'am, I'm happy to answer any questions you have.
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So she asked me all kinds of technical questions.
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I answered them.
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About an hour later, she was said, I'm exhausted.
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I'm more confused now than I ever was before.
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I don't know up from down.
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I'm just gonna keep what I have.
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And if it means I end up losing my practice and I have to go work at Starbucks and so be it, I
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can't get a grip on this.
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I said, okay.
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Well, you know what?
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I'm too tired to argue with you.
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If you wanna talk again in the future, give me a call.
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So that that's interesting, right, because you know,
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not sad.
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Yeah.
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Not having a vision.
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Right?
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Like like I said, you know, you go out there and you and you you think if I'm not searchable
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or or positioned to be found, how am I gonna get business in this day and age?
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Like, I mean, that's a tough thing.
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Right?
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Because, yes, and I know, and I want you to talk I want you to talk about the frenzy about
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being on everything.
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Because that's the other thing that I've I've seen it myself.
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I've been there themself.
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I should be on this and that and that and really kind of how you guide people to decide.
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So let's say you have the strategy, you know, you know, you wanna I wanna be the top keynote
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in mental health and wellness in in, you know, North America, how do you kind of approach
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like, you know, because everybody says you should be on everything, Instagram, and and
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Snapchat, and
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No.
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LinkedIn, and Facebook, and blah blah blah blah blah.
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So how do you so can you tell my dizziness?
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I've obviously, I'm gonna be truthful.
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I've been there.
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Sometimes I get back there again when I think, oh my god.
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I haven't been doing this or that.
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How do you guide someone like that when they think they should be doing everything to have a
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digital footprint?
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You cannot be all things to all people.
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The only business that I can think of that has successfully tried to do that was Walmart.
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Walmart tries to be all things to all people.
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And even they don't succeed, there was a period of time where Walmart's revenue was dipping
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very, very low.
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Kmart went out of business.
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And there will be more, big mega retailers that go under very soon as well.
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So You can't be all things to all people and you can't do everything yourself.
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You've heard the expression.
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No man is an island.
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One of the biggest issues that I see business owners doing.
25:53
In fact, I'd say the number one issue is spreading themselves too thin.
25:57
Trying to do everything themselves.
26:00
And what happens is you know the answer.
26:02
They end up doing, many, many different things poorly.
26:07
Rather than 1 or 2 things really, really well.
26:11
You know, I can't do everything myself.
26:13
I don't have time.
26:14
And, I don't try to be number 1 in Google Nationally for digital marketing.
26:22
The reason for that is that there are other people doing the same thing I am.
26:26
Let's get real.
26:28
And they're going to be not necessarily more experienced, but there are people who are more
26:34
experienced than me, certainly, but most of them are most of them are companies.
26:42
Let's put it that way.
26:43
They're larger, more corporate companies.
26:45
So their pockets are gonna be much deeper.
26:48
They can spend 20, $30 per month on advertising because they're going to charge $10 or $20 per
26:55
client.
26:58
I don't try to be number 1.
26:59
I target specific cities or or demographics.
27:05
Typically those in the state of Florida.
27:08
Just because I can't work with everybody, and I I'm not I can't.
27:14
I'm not gonna be number 1 in Google for that.
27:16
So that's where the expression Niching comes from, n I c h I n g.
27:21
Where you pick a niche and work for that.
27:24
If you can, it doesn't work for everybody.
27:26
You know, it would be like me saying, pick a city and state, and say I'm only going to work
27:33
with pizzerias in this city and state because I love pizza.
27:37
Now I may love pizza, and I do.
27:40
But that's not a good demographic because our pizzeria is going to be willing to invest 2 or
27:48
$3000 if I can explain to them that they could make back $30 just a few months later.
27:56
Most of them won't do it.
27:58
They just won't.
27:59
They'll push back on it because they're low usually very small operations.
28:04
They've got a handful of employees.
28:05
There's push back on that.
28:09
It's but you can't be everywhere all at once.
28:12
What I recommend my clients do is pick 3 or 4 social media outlets and just focusing on first
28:21
producing really good quality, engaging content first.
28:25
That's difficult enough.
28:27
Then get on a schedule and editorial calendar and produce it on a regular recurring basis.
28:34
Then what we do is repurpose material.
28:38
And if for anybody listening doesn't know what that is, that would mean, let's say, for
28:43
example, I wanna write a blog post, and we're gonna call it 6 reasons why digital marketing
28:49
is great for a new business.
28:51
Right?
28:51
As an example.
28:53
So I'll write that blog post.
28:56
I'll include a lot of links to scholarly journals and research.
29:01
In that article.
29:02
I'll make an infographic, diagram showing the 6 reasons.
29:09
I'll include that in that blog post as well.
29:12
Then I'll also make a brief video going over that infographic image, right, Now in my blog
29:18
post, I'll include the image.
29:20
I'll include the video.
29:22
I'll include a downloadable PDF.
29:25
Okay?
29:26
Maybe I'll do a podcast on that as well.
29:28
Maybe even a series, right, or the podcast on each one of the 6 reasons.
29:34
Now this gives me a lot of content.
29:36
Yeah.
29:36
Yeah.
29:37
That's all associated that can all link back to itself.
29:41
That I can now distribute on Facebook, which reaches over 2 billion people a day.
29:47
I can, post it on, LinkedIn.
29:50
And specifically use certain hashtags.
29:54
I can post it that or different elements of it on Twitter, and I could do it once a week.
30:00
Or maybe even once a month.
30:02
So there, I've already come up with a lot of content.
30:04
Now imagine if I stick to that edit editorial content for 6 months, Imagine the backlog of
30:11
content that I'll have.
30:14
Right?
30:14
And then you get on a schedule where you submit that content once a week same day, same time.
30:21
Now you're training Google that every week at the same day and the same time, this person
30:28
releases content.
30:29
So we need to index their site and do it more often.
30:32
Does that make sense?
30:34
Absolutely.
30:34
And I that's you know, if anything I've learned about, my podcast, like, I've been doing it now
30:41
for about a year and a year and 3 months,
30:44
Yeah.
30:44
It's
30:45
it's out every Thursday at 11 o'clock.
30:48
You know, and and you can see the traction based on the metrics that I see that's coming
30:52
back.
30:53
It's being watched.
30:54
It's being watched by the right or at least I think that's being watched by the right people,
30:59
at the senior executive level, who are interested in mental wellness.
31:05
And now it's kinda okay because credibility, right, like credibility and What is the
31:10
content?
31:10
What are we talking about?
31:12
My brand is authenticity, but it's really about the more authentic we are, the better people we
31:17
are, and whatever we do.
31:18
That's right.
31:19
And it's and and you post that content to your website.
31:22
You post it to your YouTube channel.
31:25
You share it.
31:26
So you've got content for every video I mean, how many places are there to share videos, you
31:32
know, audio?
31:35
Blog posts.
31:36
So that gets you out.
31:38
And then if you use different hashtags or change things around in terms of what you write
31:43
a little bit every time you share it.
31:46
And if you can if you can, stay focused on that for about 6 months or so.
31:53
Inevitably, you see the tide slowly begin to turn.
31:58
So it's really about, I I've heard this this word repurpose a Right?
32:02
Like
32:02
Yes.
32:03
People talk about it so much that's
32:05
We don't mean that we all.
32:06
Yeah.
32:06
Yeah.
32:07
Exactly.
32:07
Because if you're if you're if you're producing content, like you said, like if it's an hour or
32:12
2 hours a week.
32:14
And you you see all the different modalities of which, you know, visual auditory you know, like
32:20
you said, graphics, all those things from one piece of content, you know, so what happens
32:26
you're saying is when you put it out across the platforms, Google starts to recognize that this
32:31
person is, being consistent, or is it that they're seeing the same kind of, themes.
32:38
What is it that Google looks?
32:39
It's it's both, but also if you use hashtags for your area of expertise.
32:46
Right?
32:47
So if you're a psychotherapist, you wanna include psychotherapy, wellness, related
32:53
hashtags.
32:54
Mhmm.
32:55
And every time you repost it, try different hashtags now is that necessarily the best use
33:03
of your time?
33:05
No.
33:06
Maybe it might be seeing patients.
33:09
Right?
33:09
Right.
33:10
And then and then outsourcing that to an individual or agency who knows what they're
33:15
doing, and we'll do that for you on a reliable consistent basis.
33:19
Now there, that's your marketing division of your practice.
33:23
Mhmm.
33:24
Mhmm.
33:24
Right?
33:26
So That basically means that, you know, repurposing is is basically doing that on a
33:35
regular recurring basis, getting that word out and focusing maybe on 3 or 4 top level social
33:42
media platforms.
33:44
You know, Facebook reaches over 2 billion people per day.
33:48
But if you post on there, it doesn't mean that 2,000,000,000 people are going to see what you
33:52
post or that 2,000,000,000 people are gonna start calling you.
33:56
And most of them won't be a good fit for you.
33:59
A lot of people are gonna be people in other countries that you may or may not be able to
34:02
reach.
34:03
There're gonna be people who have issues that you don't wanna treat or can't help.
34:08
You know?
34:10
But it's easy enough to add it, but I've They're they're different.
34:13
LinkedIn is more of very surgical to reach specific people who are more professional.
34:19
Mhmm.
34:20
Facebook is more scattershot.
34:22
Twitter is more for very brief focused conversations.
34:26
So you kinda wanna go with that.
34:29
Pick, what is it?
34:30
Pinterest is more for people who specifically look up images related to a search.
34:37
So would people who are seeking psychotherapy necessarily go to Pinterest to for images of a
34:42
psychotherapist or images of stress or things like that.
34:46
I don't know.
34:47
It's possible you could still reach people But for me, I'd probably look at LinkedIn more.
34:53
Right.
34:54
And that's per that's pretty much where I kind of hang out because with the speaking and the
34:58
training, you know, the practice not so much because I'm my the growth, projection for me is
35:04
more on the speaking and training, and wanting to spend my time doing more of that.
35:09
And obviously, the the decision makers that could do that would be mostly on on LinkedIn.
35:15
Right.
35:16
And now now all of that being said, a marketing division of a company or a practice, you would
35:22
always want to include what I call boots on the ground.
35:25
I grew up around a lot of military people, so I use military terms and analogies at times.
35:31
But I would like in that to say, look.
35:35
We've got our marketing division online.
35:39
Now a boots on the ground division would be giving presentations.
35:43
I love as you know, I love to, be a guest on podcasts.
35:50
But I also love to give presentations in person, because that tells me I'm reaching
35:57
people who are serious who want to be there.
36:02
They may or may not end up working with me.
36:06
But they're serious and committed enough to come to this presentation.
36:13
So you still wanna give a presentation to people who are non hobbyist, but really serious
36:18
about their business who have a need and a want to change things.
36:23
Using marketing, not seeing it as a hobby or something, but I would say I probably have
36:29
about an 80 or 90 per set return on investment when I give a presentation in person because
36:35
usually people who come to this wanna hear what I talk about.
36:40
And I tried and I try to get people in passion and interested.
36:45
You know, what I called giving a blankety blank about your business.
36:49
You know, being deliberate and proactive as opposed to being a passive observer.
36:57
You know?
36:58
And I and, you know, the reason I stopped volunteering for score, talking to so many
37:04
business owners, was that honestly, it it it began to take up all my time, but it also
37:11
became very, very depressing.
37:14
Because every single time that I talked to somebody, the problems were always the same.
37:20
The problem was always the same.
37:22
I can't get enough customers, but I'm trying to do everything myself.
37:27
So the solution always is do you want help?
37:34
And 99% of the time the answer was no.
37:41
I have to keep trying to do everything myself, or I'm addicted to this poverty mentality that
37:46
I could never afford it.
37:49
Or that just not something that that I do.
37:51
It's for other people.
37:53
So dealing with I don't know how many phone calls and emails it was per day just in line
38:01
with that.
38:02
Just was, like, I can't I can't take this anymore.
38:05
You know, I just reached a point where it's just too depressing, but I realized, look, I
38:09
know all the problems that you're gonna come at me with.
38:12
And I know what the solution is.
38:15
And people always say, oh, wait.
38:16
You hear my problem.
38:17
My problem's gonna be different.
38:18
Wait.
38:19
Do you hear my situation?
38:20
You don't know.
38:21
But when you win all it down, it's always the same.
38:26
You're trying to do everything yourself.
38:28
You're not empowering people to help you.
38:31
And you're not taking a stand.
38:33
You know, if you watch these reality TV shows with Gordon Ramsey where he goes in and he
38:38
helps people with their restaurants or or bar rescue where he helps people with their bars.
38:43
There's a million shows like that.
38:45
I saw one on Amazon where the the expert helps people with their farms.
38:50
And it's always the same.
38:52
Stop trying to do everything you want, everything yourself, rather, work with a
38:56
professional list of what they tell you.
38:59
But there's always pushback.
39:01
But it's so true, but I guess the dilemma that I you probably hear a lot, and I know I've been
39:06
there.
39:06
And I've been I'm around entrepreneurs all the time.
39:09
When they're starting off.
39:10
Yeah.
39:11
Right?
39:11
The the, you know, you become the guy with every hat, but then eventually there comes a
39:15
point.
39:15
You're so right where you realize you can't do it all.
39:18
I can't I can't I can't create the service.
39:20
I can't see the clients.
39:21
I can't coach.
39:22
I can't speak.
39:23
I can't train.
39:24
Yeah.
39:25
And be able to to be able to keep, you know, the podcast.
39:28
Obviously, I have to do them, but somebody else takes care of everything else.
39:32
I do them and somebody else takes care of everything else.
39:35
With social, how what do you suggest?
39:37
Do you when you work with your clients, do you, suggest strategy and then they go out and they
39:42
find a firm that doesn't, or is that part of your business that you do?
39:47
Well, 1st of all, it comes down to time management.
39:51
I know someone who had a podcast for several years, and it was a very, very good referral
39:58
engine for him.
40:00
And, he wanted to spend more time with his family and more time running his business.
40:05
So you just hired someone to do the podcast for him.
40:09
And they still run the same commercials.
40:10
He still gets referrals through it.
40:13
It still gets more and more leads all the time.
40:16
So, you don't have to do anything.
40:19
You choose.
40:20
You know that.
40:21
Mhmm.
40:22
Because it's a psychotherapist.
40:23
You know that we make decisions whether it's conscious or not.
40:27
And, so what do I tell clients who contacted me with problems First, I have to get them to talk
40:36
about the problem and realize it either is a problem.
40:40
Yeah.
40:42
And then that takes the majority of the time.
40:46
Tell me what you've done, you know, what's worked for you, what hasn't worked for you, if
40:51
it hasn't worked for you, why do you keep doing the same thing over and over?
40:56
What does that feel like for you to make it real?
40:59
It has to be tangible and visible for them.
41:01
The pain must be real.
41:03
Then if that's the case, then I'll say, what would you what would you do if someone could
41:07
take that away.
41:09
You know, if you're not getting enough leads right now, you're not getting enough phone
41:12
calls, what would it feel like if you got 1 or 2 phone calls per day from people who wanted
41:18
legitimately to work with you.
41:20
Would that be enough?
41:22
Or would that be worth to you?
41:24
You know, There was a website I made a long time ago for a kitchen and basement remodeling
41:30
person.
41:33
And I'll never forget.
41:34
He was a very nice person, and I made the website for him.
41:38
There was no competition locally because none of the other remodelers had decent websites.
41:43
So he immediately shot to the first page of Google.
41:46
He started getting phone calls every day.
41:49
And he panicked.
41:51
And and he wouldn't respond to phone calls.
41:54
He wouldn't respond to emails.
41:56
And I called him up, and I said, Jim, What are you doing?
42:00
He said, well, I'm too busy working, at Home Depot and working on my own stuff.
42:06
So I said, alright.
42:07
Well, you know what?
42:09
Have a nice day.
42:11
A few months later came and he didn't wanna pay to renew the site.
42:16
He let it go.
42:17
So all the work that we did was for nothing because of this inner dialogue.
42:23
He didn't he wouldn't he wouldn't respond to phone calls, and I can't tell you how many
42:29
small business owners have been in that position that I worked with, nonprofits, that I
42:35
I've tried to help, where they would get phone calls from people seeking help, but then it
42:41
would like, well, what do we do now?
42:44
Somebody just donated a $100.
42:46
Uh-oh.
42:46
What do we do?
42:48
And so what I tell them is to take it seriously to really get medieval and deliberate on this.
42:58
And look at it as something that could potentially support a family that this is real.
43:04
You know, your husband or your wife or your family is counting on you to pay the rent.
43:09
Do you wanna go back and work for someone who is abusive?
43:13
Or go work at a 9 to 5 that's running you ragged, and you're still not making enough to
43:19
pay the rent.
43:21
How and so you try to make it real to them that they care enough to be like, okay.
43:26
What do I have to do, David?
43:28
Right.
43:28
Right.
43:29
Tell me if you tell me what to do, I'll do it.
43:33
And, you know, I like to show bar rescue because, the main character is an older man who
43:39
became very successful in the later on in life.
43:43
So naturally, I like that.
43:45
Right?
43:45
He's not bald, but you did not you can't have everything, but I remember him saying once
43:51
sometimes he had to break people down in order to build them back up because it was so much
43:56
resistance and pushback that they don't wanna do the things that you could help them.
44:02
Right.
44:02
And, of course, if he came into the equation and said, look.
44:06
I've got 30 years experience I could help you change this.
44:09
I can make people come in and spend more money and give you more business.
44:12
All you had to do is do what I tell you.
44:15
Well, if he if that were the case, it wouldn't be a show.
44:17
It would be a drama.
44:19
And for my own circumstances, if that were the case, It just it's not that way at all.
44:27
And you know that when you treat people as a psychotherapist, you spend the majority of your
44:31
time going through all this resistance and pushback.
44:34
No.
44:35
I'm not going to be honest.
44:37
I'm not gonna let you help me.
44:40
So that's authenticity, but it's also getting real and just cutting through the BS and the
44:48
excuses.
44:49
At the end of the day, we only have ourselves to look in the mirror.
44:54
You know?
44:55
And I've I've gone through that where you know, I started my own digital marketing agency with
44:59
my wife and, my own mediation company.
45:03
And there were times when I had to look in the mirror and just say, look, I don't know if
45:06
we're gonna make it this month.
45:07
I really I honestly, I don't know.
45:10
I just don't know, and it wasn't until I got honest about who I was choosing to work with
45:18
and how I was presenting myself that things slowly began to change.
45:23
So if I were to meet you in a networking group, now I don't say I'm a digital marketing
45:27
consultant or digital marketing specialist, I see I'm a business growth expert or business
45:33
growth consultant, and people who want to ignite growth in their business will hire me.
45:39
If you're not interested in growth, I'll wish you well.
45:43
We can, you know, have some some pleasantries, but we're not gonna be a good fit.
45:48
And surprisingly enough, there are a lot of businesses a lot of business owners who will
45:52
say that they don't wanna grow.
45:54
That they can't handle it.
45:55
They can't scale for
45:56
growth.
45:57
Scale up, yeah, accordingly.
45:58
Right.
45:59
I talked to a lady who owned a a secondhand clothing store and she also sold retail
46:05
clothing and jewelry there.
46:07
And she was complaining to me about her free Wix website or Weebly or whatever it was, and
46:13
nobody was finding it online.
46:14
She wasn't getting any orders, and I looked at it, and I could see all the problems right
46:18
away.
46:19
And I just asked her, just out of curiosity, if if I could get 2 or 3 new people calling you or
46:26
coming into your store every day, would that be something you would want?
46:29
What would that be like?
46:30
And she's like, oh, no.
46:32
We couldn't handle that.
46:33
I'd have to hire someone new.
46:34
I'd have to hire somebody.
46:36
I don't wanna do that.
46:37
Isn't that what business growth is?
46:38
Like, isn't that why you go on an I would I I I would think that that most business owners
46:44
would want that to be a problem because, you know, it's hard to get.
46:47
Yeah.
46:48
But that was her response.
46:50
Yeah.
46:50
Yeah.
46:50
And then and then the little voice in my head said, Dave, why are you talking to her?
46:55
Yeah.
46:56
Tell her have a nice day and go on about your business.
47:00
So I typically will set aside Tuesdays Thursdays to talk to new clients.
47:07
And what I'll do is I'll stack them so they get 15 minutes, and we'll stack as many as we can
47:14
fit into a Tuesday or Thursday.
47:16
And in those 15 minutes, I just try to cut through all the BS and all the noise and just
47:21
say, I just wanna know, is this real to you?
47:25
I don't want people to suffer.
47:26
I don't want people to feel pain, but if there's no pain, I can't help you.
47:31
Because you won't be doing you won't be willing to do what's necessary.
47:36
So do people have to work with you, in blocks of time?
47:39
Like, a couple months at a time based on, business strategy and growth.
47:45
Like, do
47:46
Typically, it, yeah, it depends on what their even though the problems are almost always the
47:52
same, sometimes the solution is a little bit different.
47:56
Sometimes the solution shorter or faster or quicker depending on where they are in stages.
48:01
So, for example, if a lawyer were to call me up say, look, Dave, I really wanna get new
48:07
clients.
48:08
That's a priority for me.
48:10
I'm not playing around.
48:12
I'm more than happy to invest you know, $3000 if that means getting 1 new client per month.
48:19
Because for a lawyer, again, if a lawyer gets 1 new client, That new client could be worth
48:25
anywhere from $10 to $30 on up for them.
48:28
Right?
48:30
So if I tell a lawyer, look, I could guarantee you're gonna get at least one new lead every
48:34
day after I work with you.
48:36
Right?
48:37
I can guarantee it because I know I'm gonna take them to the top of Google or I won't work
48:42
with them.
48:44
Right?
48:44
So if if that person were to say, yes.
48:48
I'm ready to commit.
48:50
I don't have an issue paying this amount.
48:52
I don't have an issue with you creating a beautiful custom site.
48:56
I don't wanna be in control.
48:57
I don't wanna second guess you.
48:59
I don't want the website to have a picture of a puppy dog on it or some silly thing like that.
49:04
I can work a lot quicker.
49:08
It's a lot easier for me to work with that person because there's less resistance.
49:13
You know?
49:15
So you know, another example, I remember working for a nonprofit government agency.
49:20
And, we spent several months working together This is for a government agency.
49:26
Okay?
49:27
After several months, the person that I corresponded with said, look.
49:32
The purse this person on the board of directors loves puppy dogs.
49:39
They want you to have a puppy on the front page of the website, and they want you to have a
49:43
rotating glowing logo.
49:46
And they want you to change the colors because their six year old son prefers this color.
49:51
And I just said, you're kidding.
49:52
Right?
49:53
And he said, oh, no.
49:55
This is what we want.
49:57
And I just said, look, I gotta be honest with you are hundreds of pages for your site in the
50:01
newsletter, the murder, everything else.
50:04
I'd have to gut everything that I've done.
50:07
Start all over again,
50:09
and it would not look professional.
50:11
I can't do that
50:13
as well.
50:13
So people people get off track about why why they're doing maybe because they didn't know
50:18
what they wanted at the beginning.
50:20
Yeah.
50:20
And that's my fault.
50:21
Yes.
50:22
Yeah.
50:22
Again, that goes back to me vetting them more carefully and saying, how serious is this to
50:28
you?
50:30
What does this change represent to you?
50:33
What would it be to you to get this?
50:35
And, again, if I were to go back in time and do that with this government organization, I would
50:39
handle things very differently.
50:40
I would require several conversations first to see if there's really serious, find out what
50:47
their budget is, or is not who's in control, who are the key people involved, And are they
50:52
all in communication?
50:53
I need one central person to work with, not 3 or 4.
50:57
I can't have any second guessing.
50:59
Once I start working, we have to work in a professional way.
51:04
We can't keep making changes over and over again.
51:06
Now they don't know that.
51:08
So it's up to to the service provider, like you and I, to show them the boundaries and rules
51:15
with how we work.
51:16
You can't have someone being disrespectful or rude or evasive with you.
51:21
So I can't work with somebody who's gonna constantly change the mind.
51:25
And that's a very common problem with digital marketing.
51:29
So that's, I know we were almost at time, but I was curious if you can talk a little bit about
51:35
SEO.
51:36
Sure.
51:36
I know that's I I know that's a huge topic for, you know, but just to to speak to what it is
51:43
and what people should consider.
51:45
Absolutely.
51:46
You know, about SEO and, you know, like wanting to be ranked accordingly based, what were some
51:52
basic things they need to consider when they're developing a strategy, working through a
51:57
business strategy, those types of things.
51:59
Okay.
52:00
You get out what you put in, so you need to have a business voice and identity and
52:07
structure.
52:08
Again, I gave many examples during our conversation of companies that would reach
52:14
number 1 in Google But then once they start getting more phone calls and emails, they don't
52:20
respond because they're not scaled appropriately.
52:22
They're not organized.
52:23
You don't wanna be in that position.
52:25
It's a waste of time and a waste of whatever money you invest.
52:28
And if you think that these free do it yourself empty template generator things are going to
52:34
make you number 1 in Google.
52:35
They won't.
52:36
They're, in my my feelings are that they're a horrible waste of time and really in a moral
52:42
way to to conduct a business.
52:44
You're taking advantage of people who don't know better.
52:46
So I really object on it on a moral and ethical level.
52:52
But people are attracted to it.
52:53
And they go to, like, moss to a flame, and then they don't get any results and they're angry
52:58
and resentful.
52:59
And then they would call me and want me to do some magic and do it for very low prices.
53:03
It doesn't work that way.
53:05
SEO stands for search engine optimization, and it basically means getting to the top of Google
53:11
search results.
53:12
So that you can get more phone calls and more emails and have greater visibility.
53:17
Now that's not for someone if you're not prepared to handle the increase in phone calls
53:25
and emails.
53:27
When I lived in Denver, Colorado, I was number 1 in Google for a period of time for several
53:33
months without spending a penny, but I'm also a very experienced developer and programmer.
53:39
So I was able to do I was getting on average a phone call or an email from a new prospect
53:44
about every 15, 20 minutes.
53:46
I'm not I'm not exaggerating that.
53:51
Most of the people who contacted me wanted a price just a flat rate price.
53:58
Without giving me any information, what they wanted, what their needs were, anything.
54:02
Just give me a set price, or they would call and just say, I need a price.
54:07
And I would just answer, you know, how much is a car.
54:10
I don't know what you want.
54:11
I don't know what your objectives are.
54:12
So you've gotta be clear about what your objectives are.
54:15
What your business goals are, why you want these.
54:18
And if you could reach that that level, could you handle a new phone call or a new email from
54:25
someone every 15, 20 minutes.
54:28
How would you deal with that?
54:32
SEO is is a lot of work.
54:35
It's a lot of work.
54:37
Not all of it is pleasant or fun.
54:40
There's Google Analytics.
54:42
There's a thing called Google Console.
54:44
There's Google Tag Manager.
54:46
You have to be an experienced web developer and have some experience in in design and in
54:53
programming in order to know where to put the right tags in the right terms and the right the
54:58
right links.
54:59
If you don't know these things, then you can learn yes, but it would typically take 4 to 5
55:07
hours probably every day for at least several weeks to get up to speed.
55:13
I started in the mid nineties And guess what?
55:17
Google changes their algorithm every couple of months.
55:22
Facebook changes their there's their way of doing things every of the months now.
55:27
So unless you have that time and energy to study programming in SDO, not just programming,
55:34
but web design, and whatever you're using, whatever tools you're using on top of Google
55:40
Analytics and tag manager and console, it's a lot.
55:44
Mhmm.
55:44
So what I tell people is, look, what is one new client per day worth to you Is that worth
55:52
investing?
55:53
Is it worth investing on average?
55:56
2a half from $3000 in order to get back double or triple that a few months later.
56:03
If the person's answer is no, then the business should be worked on more.
56:10
Right?
56:11
If their answer is yes, then you wanna work with a professional who knows what they're
56:16
doing, and you can typically judge that by looking for testimonials from from people you
56:22
can verify real photos or real people, not models.
56:26
With phone numbers, you could call references, educational credentials, professional
56:31
affiliations, and background.
56:34
Mhmm.
56:34
Sure.
56:36
That would be my answer to that.
56:38
It's about scaling and prioritizing.
56:41
It's it's much easier to speculate than it is to do the hard work.
56:47
And it's not always pretty.
56:48
It's down and dirty.
56:50
And you know, you can do things for 6 months and not see the tide turning yet.
56:56
But if you keep at it, usually around at that point, you start to see things change.
57:00
When I work with small business owners through SCOR and as a freelancer and as a agency owner
57:07
of my own, statistically businesses will begin to make more profits at around the 5 year mark.
57:16
The majority
57:17
From inception to 5 years.
57:20
Statistically, according to the US Small Business Administration, typically at that 5
57:25
year mark, that's when they begin or they shouldn't begin making more profits and having
57:31
a lot lower, loss of debt because they've learned so for a business owner, usually, you
57:39
can't really do much to help them until they're five years of age because they don't have the
57:44
money to invest.
57:45
If I talk to a startup owner or a new business owner and say, look, can you invest $2000 in
57:52
order to get more referrals.
57:54
Most of them would bulk at that.
57:56
There's no way everything has to be free or super cheap.
58:00
And you're saying 2 to 3000 per month or 2 to 3000 generally.
58:04
Typically, it's 2 to 3000 one time, and then you usually pay maybe around a $100 per month
58:11
to keep it maintained to make sure you're not gonna get malware.
58:15
You're not gonna be hacked that your site is being backed up on a daily basis.
58:21
That you get help updating the site with all the social media channels that you have a plan
58:27
connected to the site.
58:29
Right.
58:29
So so you would typically be paying that to get help to maintain it and build it.
58:35
Mhmm.
58:35
Post your podcast, for example.
58:37
You know?
58:38
So, typically, most individuals can't really do much for you under below that amount.
58:46
They just can't anything below that amount is like, come on.
58:49
You know, I they have bills to pay.
58:51
If you were to go to an agency, most agencies won't even talk to an individual business owner
58:57
unless your budget is some will do something for 5000, but most can't do for under $10
59:04
because they have employees, a lease to pay, and utilities, and benefits, and so on.
59:10
Legal issues as well and have a lawyer on retainer.
59:12
They can't do anything for less than that.
59:14
So, you know, that's where the bigger corporate companies would go to an agency and the smaller
59:20
business owner would go to someone like me.
59:22
And I'd say, look, I'm semi retired.
59:24
I can work with one person per quarter, and I'm very happy with that.
59:28
Right.
59:28
Right.
59:29
I could dedicate myself to that person, whereas the agency can't.
59:33
So those are the differences.
59:35
If that makes sense.
59:36
Oh, it makes a lot of sense.
59:37
This is, you and I could probably talk for a couple of hours about this because there's so
59:42
much, to learn from it.
59:45
This has been a very, very insightful David.
59:49
And I guess the one thing that I'm getting is just about Knowing knowing why you're doing
59:54
what you're doing and investing, your monies or your time where it's gonna count is are 2 of
1:00:02
the the main things that I've kind of pulled out from today.
1:00:07
Yeah.
1:00:07
I agree.
1:00:07
You have to be very surgical and very measured.
1:00:11
You know, if you're a parent and you have children, you know, that you can't do
1:00:14
everything all at the same time, and you know how they will just wear you down physically, if
1:00:20
not mentally, very quickly.
1:00:22
So you have to pick your battles.
1:00:24
Right.
1:00:24
Right.
1:00:25
What do you stand up for?
1:00:26
What what do you let go?
1:00:28
Yeah.
1:00:29
And it's kind of the same way with business.
1:00:32
But a business you've got to grow, you've gotta make more money.
1:00:36
If you've ever seen shark tank, it's like, Kevin O'Leary says on shark tank, If you have
1:00:41
more debt, then you have revenue coming in.
1:00:44
If you're not operating in a profit, it's not a business.
1:00:46
It's a hobby.
1:00:48
Mhmm.
1:00:48
You have to be able to support a family, and that's where it gets real.
1:00:54
That's where it gets real.
1:00:55
And those are the people I wanna work with.
1:00:57
You know, I I need to be able to support my family.
1:01:00
I need to be able to put food on the table, pay the rent, pay the lease, pay for my employees,
1:01:06
I'm willing to do whatever is reasonable or logical to get get from here to there.
1:01:13
So, David, where do where can people read you?
1:01:15
Is I'm sure you're gonna have a lot of people that are wanting more information that are
1:01:19
listening, to the podcast today.
1:01:22
Sure.
1:01:22
Where where can they what you know, if they wanted to work with you, where can they reach
1:01:26
you?
1:01:26
And, do you do consultations like you said that people might be able to, access?
1:01:33
Absolutely.
1:01:34
My business website is d like David, m like Martin, s like Sam, So it's dms.blue, like the
1:01:43
color blue.
1:01:43
So dms.blue.
1:01:45
If you go to my website, you can see a very quickly on that front page, everybody's welcome
1:01:52
to schedule a free 15 minute phone consultation.
1:01:57
This is it's not a game.
1:01:59
It's not silly time.
1:02:00
It's not for spammers.
1:02:03
It's real.
1:02:03
I'll talk to you about serious business concerns and just see initially if we're a good
1:02:08
match for each other.
1:02:09
If we are, then I will schedule another phone consultation that will be either for the same
1:02:15
amount of time or maybe a half hour after 2 or 3 consultations, then I'll decide, okay.
1:02:22
We're a good fit for each other or you know, no.
1:02:25
We we probably aren't.
1:02:28
You can also go to my website and email me as well.
1:02:32
And I'm always happy to answer a few questions to get the ball rolling and try to help.
1:02:37
Okay.
1:02:38
Awesome.
1:02:38
Also, I should add, you can call my Google Voice phone number at 424 David01.
1:02:46
That is a voice message line.
1:02:49
So people who have to leave a legitimate voice message, identifying themselves and telling me
1:02:55
what you want help with and and so on.
1:02:58
If you call it trying to be funny, it's just not gonna take it.
1:03:01
So it's important to say these things, especially when you're using the internet and
1:03:06
reaching a broad audience.
1:03:07
For sure.
1:03:08
Well, thank you again, David, for taking your time.
1:03:11
This has been, very helpful for me as I kind of progressed but for everyone listening, I think
1:03:17
it's, again, it's congruence.
1:03:19
It's about being authentic and really thinking about how is it that I'm what is it that I'm
1:03:23
showing the world out there?
1:03:25
In reference to what my business is.
1:03:27
And if you're not if you're clueless, like, I can be, could say that 5 years ago, I was, to
1:03:34
get the right help.
1:03:35
That's the one thing I spent a lot of money, with the wrong people getting the wrong advice,
1:03:43
before I kind of got to where I needed to and still continue to make different choices, on an
1:03:47
ongoing basis as I've grown my, speaking business.
1:03:51
So thanks again for tuning in.
1:03:52
As you know, I'm a mental health and wellness specialist, and I do keynotes training and
1:03:57
executive coaching if you'd like to get a hold of me.
1:04:00
I can be reached at roxannedurhodge.com.
1:04:04
So take care, and we will connect with you again next week.
1:04:07
Take care, David.
1:04:08
Bye bye.
1:04:09
Thanks for tuning in to authentic living with Roxanne, creating the space for positive,
1:04:15
healthy change.
1:04:16
Roxanne is a key speaker, psychotherapist, and coach to work with Roxanne, visit
1:04:22
rocksandirhaj.com/blueprint.
1:04:26
We'll you next time.
1:04:28
An authentic living with Roxanne.