Latest / Rooted & Real With Keenan / Midlife Wellness for Women: Finding Purpose, Balance & Resilience | Lisa Barwise
Transcript
- Keenan: All right, so Lisa, thank you so much Lisa Barwise: How? Keenan: for taking time out of your busy day to chat with me. And you are in Ireland? Lisa Barwise: Yes, I'm in Belfast, it's Northern Ireland, yep, but Ireland Keenan: Okay. Lisa Barwise: indeed, yeah. Keenan: Awesome. Well, thank you for coming on. And I ask everyone the same question to kick things off. And it's just what's what's your story? Lisa, how did you become who you are today? Lisa Barwise: well, that's a I don't know where to start with that one. I think the the story of what's brought me here in terms of what I'm doing right now is the usual story of you know, the ups, the downs, etc., right? And Keenan: Mm, for sure. Lisa Barwise: the one that's really driving what I do now really is all about this this sense of wellness from a completely holistic place. That's not just tick box wellness, right? Or marketing wellness or any of those sorts of things. I mean, I have every qualification you could possibly imagine in the wellness industry. everything from personal trainer, kettlebell instructor, I'm a naturopath, I'm a nutritionist, I teach meditation, all of these things. And even with all of that under my belt, I went through my own period of really struggle, right? Real Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: illness in there, real difficulty, real challenge. And as with all human beings, I believe that it's in those moments that we, yes, define ourselves, but we also can find our purpose and find our passions from it. And I think that last real struggle which I had, which was now probably a good three, maybe even four years ago, where I had really everything, you tick the box, financial challenges. I gained Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: a son that I had to look after. My godson came to live with us. I got chronic anemia where I literally could not get out of bed. I was so Keenan: Hm. Lisa Barwise: exhausted. to the point where we nearly lost the house, where he was only supposed to stay for two weeks and stayed two years, where I ended up fighting with his parents and having that, you know what was once a sisterhood friendship completely dissolve and shatter to all of those things. and in the midst of that, as I pulled myself back together, as you as we do as parents and and and you know, rebuilt my business, etc., I decided to write about it. I decided that what I needed to do was create a book. And I literally wrote a book in six weeks from that experience, from coming up with what I wanted to talk about, the journey that I'd gone on and giving language to feelings that I know that I wasn't the only one that was feeling. Keenan: Wow. Wow. So I mean how did this all like I mean, how did you know this was the right thing to do? It just seems like it's so it's such a big task, everything you're talking about. Writing a book. Lisa Barwise: Yeah. You know what? But those weren't the hard things. I think it's interesting. It's maybe the the ADHD brain because what I think is easy for me is not necessarily easy for other people. Like there's a joke that, you know, I can start a million businesses by lunchtime, but ask me to unstack the dishwasher and it's like, you know, I can't do that. So it's it's maybe Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: that sort of a thing in so much that what my creativity, what my my energy can, you know, put out when I'm interested, when I'm passionate, when I'm excited about the thing that I want to share and what I want to talk about, that is an easy or path. Like, you know, somebody even made the joke that I've written these two books now, but yet I still haven't published them on Kindle. They're still just e books because That's an extra step that my brain doesn't want to do, right? So it's interesting, you know. I can rebuild a website and create all these apps that I've created and all these tools and diagnostics and analyzing, you know, for wellness tools, and yet again, ask me to fill out a form that puts something onto Amazon where people can reach more of it. It's it's just one step too far. So I think that's it. I think it's like How did I know? It it does feel like bolts of lightning, right? I think Keenan: Mm, sure. Lisa Barwise: somewhere between intuition and serendipity and inspiration is where it lands, somewhere in there. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Okay. Yeah, for sure. So what would you say, you know, going back to the beginning, I mean, was this always the ideal path for you from the beginning? Lisa Barwise: Yeah, no, so I started out in, you know, my went to university for international business and languages, which is ironic because I now have an international business, but that's kind of funny. Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: But I did not think that that was gonna be what it was. And then it was through, you know, trying to figure out what I stood for, I think, Keenan: Mm. Lisa Barwise: like what was important to me throughout that journey. that really made me make those decisions. So even though I went from working in marketing, but then I was working in marketing for a wine and alcohol company and that didn't sit right with me. And Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: then I was working, you know, I was pulled to go and do work in in America where I worked with a human potential company and that was really good. And I spent a lot of time becoming a coach and developing coaching skills and working with people and their potential. And then the horrible things happened to that organization, right? So then you have to go by your gut and by your values. And then that in itself was a serendipitous moment, I suppose, because it led me to another path where it was like, okay, well, I'm gonna set up business for myself. So I set up business for myself. and that became an an a next thing. And then, you know, there has been times where out of necessity I've had to do things, get part-time jobs or or move house or do things like that. But ultimately Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: I still feel that one of my superpowers, of which I have many, I feel, is understanding intentionality, like living with intention. So Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: and that's not just mindful living. I think mindful and mindless aren't necessarily words that people can get behind because it seems a bit buzzy. Whereas intentionally means for me that I'm steering the ship, right? That I know enough about myself that I, you know, have done the work in terms of understanding my values and what's important to me and who I want to be in this world and then who I want to be as the parent in this world and as the business owner, etc. So that it's easy to run things through that filter, those filter of values to go, this is my next step, because if I intentionally want to continue on this path and uphold these values and be this person. That's what the decision has to be, I suppose. Yeah. Keenan: Yeah. Okay. So you I guess so you kinda had this self motivation, this sense of urgency to like, okay, this isn't working. I'm gonna go try this. And it maybe wasn't even like I'm gonna try. I'm gonna like put my Lisa Barwise: It I think mo I think every single decision came from I don't want the other thing more than I want this thing. Kinda, right? Keenan: Okay. Yeah. Okay. That's good. Lisa Barwise: I think it's like, you know, maybe like what our parents did or the jobs that we had. But I do remember one time when I was in a corporate setting, I used to work and as a business mentor and write business plans and work with startup businesses, but from a government agency, which really meant that it was a real tick box scenario and It started to get very admin heavy, very report heavy, and very little me interacting with people or training, which is why I took that job, because I like to teach and I like to train and I like to work with people. and I was doing everything that I possibly could at the time to still remain healthy and well because that was always a drive. Both of my parents had passed by the time I was 22 years Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: old, both from degenerative diseases that could have been. definitely helped or supported by better lifestyle choices. And I knew that that's definitely was not going to be the path for me. Right. But you know, when you are a single parent and you're rearing children by yourself, sometimes you make decisions because you're like, I have to, like I need this job, I need the money, I need the thing. So but there's always a time where that still becomes too much, right? That sitting behind that desk, I literally felt myself crumbling is the only way to Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: describe it. And I think I did a podcast before where it was like, why did I leave that job? It I just crumbled. I was a shell of myself again. I wasn't my you know, everybody was bringing in cakes and buns. They were living off energy drinks. They were coming in on their sick days. They were like Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: all of these things. And I was like, I don't want I don't wanna live like that. That's not who I want to be. And because I know where that path can lead, because I've seen it, right? So that's where I took a big That was a big left turn towards wellness. That's when I decided that I was gonna leave that job and train as a personal trainer. And within three months of leaving that position, although I was taking on some contract work that still kept me in the business plan side of things, I became a qualified personal trainer. I started teaching kettlebells, and within six months I had full classes teaching four Kettlebell classes a week. I had set up the studio, I'd bought the kettlebells, I was just, I completely did a 180 from here to here. And I loved that so much so that then my ladies who were in my community were like, we can't get booked in. There's not enough space. You you're gonna have to get your own space. And I'm like, well, I can't afford to set up my own space, you know, and I I I wasn't thinking about how how I would do that. And they were like, no, we'll back you, we'll figure it out. Right. So I was like, okay, so let's see if they would back me and if they would prepay me for memberships and classes or do donations towards certain pieces of equipment. So I set up a GoFundMe style thing, community page. And that's exactly what they did. I had, you know, about I think about six to eight different sponsorship packages of buy my yoga mats for me, buy, you know, What was the big ones? Yoga mats. I had most of the kettlebells that we could start with. And then people sort of bringing their own and leaving them in the studio, which was great. then I had people, I said, right, can you prepay me your membership now, even though it's not open? And they did that. So I ended up opening, you know, already with 20 or 30 members. And then we got them down to paint. They came and literally painted the walls. We had paint parties. I fed them, and then we had like loads of events and stuff that they were involved with. and then that studio stayed open for three years, right up until COVID, which was great because I had also built myself into a box. So Keenan: Hm. Lisa Barwise: although I loved the studio and I loved teaching, it got to the point where I was teaching up to 15 classes a week, of which some of those I was having to lead from the front of the room. And then I couldn't take a break because it was a membership led. So although I had other instructors, I had two other instructors, they needed to be paid. and then if I did want to take time off, I would have to pay for me, Josh, somebody to look after the dog, somebody to cover the classes. And it just got to the point where I was like, I can't actually take time off. I I can't, Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: how do I actually take time off from this? So I hadn't built it in with, you know, down time in there because obviously when people had holidays, they still wanted to come and train, right? So I created a monster, which was great. But then when COVID came, I'd already built half of my business online anyway. So a lot of the nutritional stuff, a lot of the the transformational stuff was all built into a my website. So I saw COVID as an opportunity for me to take everything 100% online, which is what I wanted to do you know, long term anyway. So it Keenan: Mm. Well. Lisa Barwise: was actually a bit of a blessing. so for Keenan: We should. Lisa Barwise: the first couple of months it was great. I sold all my equipment, made money from that. Keenan: Wow. Lisa Barwise: people need couldn't access equipment, you know, during that first stage. And then I just recorded loads of workouts in my living room for my existing clients and I kept them for a long period of time. And then I just created a new program. And 2020, 2021 was really successful for me because obviously people were at home, they were looking for at-home training, it made perfect sense. But then I burnt out, and then also I had a lot Keenan: I mean Lisa Barwise: of other financial issues because people would buy things and then not pay, and then you were chasing, and it just became very another challenge, right? Another difficulty. And then it was one of those questions of this doesn't feel right either, right? So how Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: do you make your business model work for you? and then there was just evolution, but then that's also when the financial crisis happened. So You know, everybody else started to not pay. So you know, business slowed down a lot because people were used to buying things online and then they were becoming more discerning. I decided that I was gonna spend time working in a charity instead because I thought this is my way of maybe giving back, etc. And I like the idea of being back in the world. but then they screwed me over as well in terms of paying me and financial issues. And you're like, is this really how this is? So It just became very challenging with all of those things to the point where I felt like I had to have a reinvention. I felt like I had to go like, well, it didn't, it I didn't choose it. It happened, right? So it was very much like if you're not gonna listen to your body, and if you're not gonna listen to the fact that you need to make changes, I'm gonna make you listen. And that was the Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: moment that I had. Keenan: Okay. Yeah, 'cause it seems like you either could have like sank and just gave up and like F this, like this is hard, or reinvent yourself and move forward. Lisa Barwise: And I think it really helped that at that time I did a I was gifted. I won a scholarship for a program with who's somebody who's now my mentor. And it was all about understanding how how you did online business changed, but also understanding trust and understanding Keenan: Okay. Lisa Barwise: all of that. Now, I also need to mention that in the middle of this, I met my person. So I had given up completely on on dating and putting myself out in the world, other than there I had one late one date left and I was like, you know what, this will be the last one because I'm not doing any more of this again. I've I thought this would be good to try to get me back to myself or or feel a bit of aliveness or a sense of all of that. Right. After looking after, you know, two teenage boys and one of them sleeping in my office here, which is why I couldn't do my business. so And that's when I met my person. So we've been together now nearly two years. he is the complete opposite to me in a lot of ways, and yet we're exactly the same, if that makes sense. So, you know, he is the more grounded, more realistic, more he's the one that I always say that in in in relationship there's always an accelerator and a break, right? There's always somebody Keenan: Yeah, sure. Lisa Barwise: that's maybe a little bit more up in the clouds and somebody's a little bit with their feet on the on the ground, and that should Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: work well, right? Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: Because it's literally, you know, I'm the one with all the ideas and the I let's do this and this is great and whatever. And then he goes, Well, what about this? You know, and he does it in such a gentle way that I don't feel held back or anything like that. It's very much just, you know, the right dollop of grounding that I need for a lot of things, right? So it's it's been very helpful as well in in terms of making it easier for me to go through that process of developing trust, figuring out what it is that I wanted to do, you know, what message I wanted to put out, like what what do I think the world also needs from what I've gone through? and then that's that's that all happened pretty much at the same time. Like Keenan: Nah. Lisa Barwise: and then the universe met me where I was at. I started getting new clients, I got a new car, I which I hadn't had a car for like two years, which sounds like a small thing, but I'd been driving since I was 18. And when you're self, you know, self-employed and when you were trying to get to the gym and you've got children and you're trying to get to like I just needed the car back, things like that that just really made it like, okay, this is this is me getting myself back to where I was. And it definitely felt like a reinvention. It felt like a stepping into a new era, stepping into this new way that I wanted to be in the world. Keenan: Yeah, for sure. So you mentioned finding your person. How important is that as someone's like taking their next steps or starting a business or entering a new era? How important is that to have that support and have that communication? Lisa Barwise: It's interesting that it's interesting because I have been I'd been single for quite some time before and I was okay with that. Like if anybody met me, I was like, you know, I'm okay with being single. It's it's not a big deal. because I had my son, which consumed a lot, I then had an extra bonus son, then I have I have a dog, then I have a house to run. At the time I had a part-time job and I was trying to get the business back on and I was writing the book and doing all of these things. So realistically on paper, I really didn't have time for a relationship. But Keenan: Sure, sure. Lisa Barwise: what I think it and it needs to be in the right way. Like I didn't go looking for it necessarily, even though I was dating, I was looking for more, I want to get out in the world and I want to experience more fun and more joy and more stuff out there in the world. That was my goal with dating. But The difference between dating and then deciding to have a relationship is different. And then also understanding that, you know, when you're both about to be 50, like which is what's happening, you know, in the next couple of weeks, it's different. It's a different dating dynamic because you're like not only adults, you're like like adults. Like you're like, you know, you've got a lot of responsibilities, you've got all of these different things, but yet you still don't feel like you know that you still feel like you're in your 20s or something, which is ironic. So I feel like what it's given me when it's the right person is just that sense of foundation, right? Keenan: I mean, yeah. Lisa Barwise: a feeling of they the there's a poem that I've once read about a thing called The Touch Tree, and the touch tree is like if you get lost in the forest. You should always choose a tree. and as you explore to try to figure your way out, always know how to go back to that tree. Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: So you might choose a path, figure out that, okay, that's not the right path, come back to the touch tree. And I feel like in a good, solid relationship that's supportive, that person becomes your touch tree. So as you're building something, as you're, you know, tr walking down new paths. To continue the analogy as you're being, you know, creating all of these things, you still need something to bring you back to the reality, but also bring you back to feeling safe, feeling like, okay, well, that path was not necessarily the best path. I need to go back to the touch tree. or that they actually help you to get out of feeling lost, right? They give you that sense of groundedness, that sense of connection. Keenan: For sure, for sure. So I mean, you also mentioned you like you had a community around you. You know, what that's how important is that? Lisa Barwise: Yeah. That was see, that's very interesting because that changed. So as soon as I went took everything online, yes, do I still have an online community? Yes. Do I have and it's interesting because my partner, he is not online at all. Doesn't even have a Facebook profile, doesn't have anything. Does listen to podcasts though, but doesn't have any of that. So when I talk to him about my friends or my whatever, he's like, Are these like real friends or people you just know on the internet? And when he says that, it does sound weird. To say it out loud that way, but I'm like, no, these people are my friends. Like I've had clients that have been with me from 2020, right? They took my program and now they're still in my programs, right? So they are been with me for that amount of time. They've come through every iteration of what I've created. And now they're now coaches and other mentors in in my other programs, right? So, but they're my friends. Like they are my friends. So whether I have met them in person, I've only met one. One actually came locally recently here and I was like, how dare you be here and not visit me? But we couldn't make it work. but yeah, it's they are my friends. So it is interesting to feel I still have that feeling of community and connection, but I'm probably s missing a lot of real life bodies right now because I do spend so much time with either my partner. my son or on my online communities and what I'm trying to do, right? But I think that happens through, you know, I think the key thing that I want everybody to take away from this is that life happens to us in seasons, right? There's a season Keenan: Sure, absolutely. Lisa Barwise: for everything. There's a season of growth, there's a season of healing, there's a season of parenthood, there's a season of maybe connection and partnership. So I think we try to do too much of everything all at once. and that's where we we, especially as women burn out, right? Is that, you know, sometimes if I list in my head everything that I need to do, or if I'm like thinking about like all the responsibilities I have, that actually, you know, overwhelms me. I can feel the emotional and mental load. I'm like, this is too much. But if I realize, okay, well, what's the season that I'm in right now? And understand that when you when you do that, you give yourself a lot of grace. You give yourself the permission to, you know, be that person in that season, right? And that might mean that you need to be more in a nurturing state, that you might mean need to be more in a still or going slower state, right? Or you might be in a go, go, go, get this done, push. We've got a cool thing that we're working towards, deadlines, book. Deadline, whatever that might be, and that's okay too, right? and I think that when we see those seasons and whether they're you consider them ups and downs, I don't anymore. I just see it as cyclical. Like I see Keenan: Well it Lisa Barwise: these as all like little, little circles that we've we've moved through, whether they're life cycles as well in terms of our age and and going through all of that, but also just the seasons of life, it That gives us a little bit more permission and a little bit more grace to just figure it out, right? As well. Keenan: For sure, for sure. Do you f and do you feel like you know, as people go through these seasons, it's either is it is it you can choose how you feel about being up and down, or is it more like that's you just kind of accept how it is? I mean Okay, yeah, for sure. Lisa Barwise: It's a little bit of both, I think, because I mean, it's like it's like it's not happening to you, it it's happening for you is the cliche, right? But it's hard it's Keenan: Mm. Yeah, for sure. Lisa Barwise: it's easy to say that and then hard to figure that out. So I think it brings me back to the word intentional, right? Is that Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: you can be in a certain stage of life. Right. So you can be in a certain stage of life where, for example, as women at this midlife age, it's perimenopausal, it's challenges. Maybe you're looking after you know, kids and teenagers who are also going through puberty to maybe looking after your elderly parents, right? There's lots of different hats, lots of different responsibilities. Keenan: Sure, absolutely. Lisa Barwise: And it can feel like life and things are happening at you constantly, like your curveball city. life life's it can be really challenging, right? But I think where intentionality is, is that there needs to be a steadiness of you in there, right? And I think Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: a lot of the time women by midlife they're starting to figure out what that means. It's maybe taken them a while because they would be more in the, you know, people pleasing or putting everybody else first kind of roles, etc. And they don't necessarily feel like they are a strong opposing intentional force against these things. And they just feel like they are literally drifting out to see, or they're drifting as with everybody. So as this pulls me in this direction, and this pulls me in this direction, and they don't necessarily feel that sense of strength or rooted or centeredness, right? With intentionality. It comes in two parts. You need that sense of self, first and foremost, like what I to spoke to earlier, which is like knowing yourself, know thyself in terms of like your values or what's important to you, or because it makes one, it makes decisions really easy, right? So Keenan: Mm-hmm. For sure. Lisa Barwise: if you're in an in a scenario where you are faced with I have to do this or this, if you've already done some of the work of knowing what's important to you about that. You can make the decision a lot quicker and and know comes out a lot quicker in those scenarios, right? And you don't just instantly people please. But also, then that that rootedness has to come from the intentionality, right? That you can still, you know, have a path in that, and you can still choose to not get pulled and pushed around because you know what way you're gonna navigate through that. So I mean, if I if you pick my recent curveball of life, which I was sharing to you, is that my son just broke his collarbone in two places as he fell off his pushbike and then he had to have surgery. Now, both of us are ADHD, both of us are highly sensitive empath you know, empathic feeling people. Like he even now will tell you that he can feel the bone and the the screws in his shoulder. He's that sensitive to things. Like he's like I Keenan: Mm. Lisa Barwise: can feel it kind of knit together is how he describes it. And for us to go through being in a hospital with the anxiety that we have, health anxiety specifically, which is ironic because I'm a wellness coach, but but also the thought of going under and anesthesia and all of that, that was the challenge, right? So Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: in those instances, I remind myself of what's important. So one, people with ADHD are amazing in a crisis. Like I become the steadiest, calmest person. Like he even said to me, You just, you just didn't waver. You were like, get this. And also I'm like walking up to the nurses, could you please help? He really does need some pain relief. He's finding it really hard to breathe. Could you get that pain relief sorted for me? And I will go and I'll ask. And I'll go and I'll follow up. And I'll do it politely, but I'm gonna make sure that he gets what he needs, right? So Keenan: For sure. Lisa Barwise: I'm the person you want in the corner because I will I will speak up. Right. I will say the things. I'm not gonna just, wait for the doctor. Nope, this is what needs to happen and it needs to happen now, but I'll do it politely. I'm not gonna make a scene. Right. And then I'll only crumble when you know I I d being the strong one isn't necessary in that moment. Right. And then that's when my adrenaline is like like wrecking me and I'm exhausted and I have to spend days like down later trying to deal with that. So the intention is. I know myself that in those times of crisis, I got me, because I've done this before. I'm a strong person. I also have a voice and I know how to speak and advocate for myself because I've had to do that for so long. And specifically in medical settings and in wellness and health center, I'm a really good advocate for that. So I'm the person that you want to have, right? But there is the consequence, right? There is the the the things later down the line where the adrenaline Like I ended up with like the next day I had to go to a a work thing and I ended up with like the worst headache ever. I was so tense because I was still pulling all of this up here, but I knew it, right? I knew what was happening because I know myself. So I'm like, okay, you just need to go and lie in a dark room for a little bit and just breathe and do some of your breath work exercises and just have a nap. Like you just need to go down for a bit and then Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Lisa Barwise: you can come back that you know and come back stronger. So That's where I think when we see things as life lives, right? Our job and our role, specifically as parents, but even more so if you want to hold the capacity of something. So whether you're doing a new lifestyle program, right, or whether you're running a business, right, you need to be able to hold a sense of capacity for that position, role, or responsibility, right? In order to hold capacity. Our nervous systems need to be be robust, is the best way, right? So we need to learn tools like nervous system regulation. And even more so in midlife, and definitely if you're a parent, is what I would say. So the goal of nervous system regulation is not staying calm all the time, right? Life will life. We can't live in a bubble. I'd love to live in a bubble. But we can't live in a bubble and we can't wait to things calm down. We can't wait till there's a quiet time. All of these things that we tell ourselves and fool ourselves into as adults. It's no such thing. There's no such thing. So we our role is to go from calm to stress to calm again. That's it. That's what nervous system regulation is in a little Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: kernel for you. And in order to be able to do that, we need Regulation tools, whether we find things that we like and enjoy to do ourselves, or we need to find a way to co-regulate, which is why I definitely enjoy the co-regulation that I get from my partner, because he's a very steady, you know. The best way to describe co-regulation is if somebody's beating a drum to their beat, right? And you're all do literally, if you go and are within their in their vicinity. You start to beat the drum at the same time, right? That's the best Keenan: Hm, yeah. Lisa Barwise: way to describe co-regulation. So as a parent, especially for smalls, and they run to you and they've scuffed their knee and they've fallen over and they come and they're do do your job is to bring them back down to the beat, right? Of the drum. And that's what co-regulation is. So especially parents, you'll notice that, but also it happens in in the workplace or it happens in your business or it happens in And whatever somebody says something to you that's like mean or you know or something doesn't go right or a financial thing happens that freaks us out, right? Or some safety thing happens, right? A policeman turns up at the door, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, right? That's the stressor in the environment. So in those moments, you need to figure out how to get that drumbeat back again so that you have full agency and full capacity to be able to make those decisions in that moment. And then when that scary stressor thing has moved beyond, you need to complete the stress cycle. So whether you're, you know, having a nap, very good way to do that. Whether you're doing breath work, which is another thing, whether you're doing I do EFT tapping, which is really great, go for a run, a walk, exercise, some description, really good way to get it out as well. So that's that's the tools that I've used. specifically in those things, but and those are the tools that I used to get out of my lowest of lows. But I believe that that that sense of agency is what and that sense of resilience is probably what gets me feeling like I got this. Like there's, you know, even when it's challenging, I got it. I may have to deal with the aftermath of it later, but in the moment I I have the resilience to bounce back to to make it work. Keenan: Yeah. So something you mentioned is knowing yourself. Like some people hear that and it's like I don't even know where to start with that. Lisa Barwise: Yeah, I mean, yeah, so doing, you know, it's sort of inner work as we call it, or introspection is another way, is is is really challenging if you haven't done it before. Because there is an inherent fear that all of us have, which is if we start to look inside, maybe we're not gonna see what we like, or maybe we're not gonna see anything at all. Those are the two things that we like freak out about. and Both of those are really true and valid, the actual, you know, concerns and fears about it. But what you gain from it can be so rewarding. And I'll give you the best place that I would always start, and where I generally start with some of my clients was I make it fun, right? So, first of all, in my community, we have a quiz, love a quiz, right? And it's not a personality quiz per se, it's a little bit of an archetype quiz. It puts people into four different warrior goddess archetypes, because I'm all about the warrior goddess brand. But any sort of quiz could work in this scenario, right? Because it starts to give you that sense of, yes, I have this tendency to do this, I have this tendency to do that. And then when you start to see the different tendencies and behaviors within yourself, you can start to identify strengths and weaknesses, right? Keenan: Mm, yeah. Lisa Barwise: And When you see both strengths and weaknesses, you're also not f fixating just on the weaknesses. You are like, okay, yes, I am very resilient already, or yes, I am good in a crisis or whatever, but I'm also, you know, not got great attention to detail or sometimes I can be a bit flaky or whatever that is, right? So the the next bit of work that I generally get people to do if they're gonna start just a little bit of inner work is on your values, right? So I have a It's a very small, it's actually the quest. so once you've gone through my quiz, each of my archetypes gets a quest because again, keeping it fun. and our seeker quest is the thing called the momentum map. And why I speak about momentum and intentionality is that a lot of us think that we suffer from motivation or a lack thereof, right? Why and they people always say to me, Why are you so motivated to do X, Y, and Z? Like, why were you motivated to do that? You seem like a very innerly motivated person. And I'm really, really not, right? It could be the ADHD, but I believe I'm a persistent person, but I don't know if I'm necessarily e motivated. I'm definitely not. But what I can get easily is a something called momentum. And momentum is your friend. So Keenan: Hmm. Yes. Lisa Barwise: momentum really is two parts. One, You gotta like know what's important to you. You gotta get things in line with the thing that actually drives you forward. And to have something be aligned, right? I'm breaking it down here, it has to be like aligned with your values. And values are just how do you want to live? It's no more deep than that. It's no more scary than that. It's literally what are the when I say a certain set of words, which ones of these words means more to you? And it can be anything from, you know. Community is a good one for me. Growth is a good one for me. But also there's things like fa we all think of family, but in a different way. Is it the protecting of the family? Is it the nurturing that's important? Right? Is it the growth part of family? Which for me that's it, right? I like to see people develop. Development is a really big value of mine. So Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: when you get to know those things, you begin to go like, that's really interesting, right? And you see it from a sense of curiosity rather than judgment or or or using it to like beat yourself up with a bit, right? You know, I wish I was more motivated. No, I'm actually just a very, you know, adventure is another one of my values, right? So I know if I don't get or feel a sense of adventure, I can feel very stuck, right? And then that stuckness means I lack motivation. So it's getting to know these sorts of words about yourself. So then that when you go to set yourself some sort of goal or an intention, that it's from an aligned place, not from the shoulds, the woulds, and the coulds, right? It's the, Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: okay, adventure is important to me. So I need to make sure that once every, which is what I do now, three to four weeks, we go on little road trips, right? Because one, I like nature, two, I like the sense of adventure. And three, I get a break, right? I get very restored from that, emotionally restored and mentally restored. So That makes that decision really easily, right? It's like, okay, well, if eventure is important to you, we need to make sure we schedule some of that. And then you don't judge yourself for, look at you, you need a break, you're not working hard enough. No, this is part of the program, right? This is why it's important. So then when you start setting these goals for yourself, so say for example, let's pick ones that people come to in my community, they want to lose weight, right? They want to drop 20 pounds, they want to double their strength. They want to overcome insulin resistance. They want to feel more like themselves, right? These are kind of things that they tell me. So rather than doing that out of shoulds, like why do you want to lose 20 pounds? Is it just because the internet tells you you should? Is it that you think something's gonna happen when you've lost that 20 pounds? Suddenly you'll feel a certain way or you'll, you know, whatever. So we break that down a little bit, and Keenan: Yeah. Lisa Barwise: then we try to work out, okay, well, rather than say to yourself you want to lose 20 pounds. Let's look at the goal from different avenues of your life. Your body, your finances, your career, your your business, all those sorts of things. So when it comes to your body, is there a is there a different goal that you would rather have that the 20 pounds weight loss would happen as an effect of that, for Keenan: Mm. Lisa Barwise: example? So generally then it becomes, well, actually, I want to be more fit. I wanna be able to climb these stairs. I want to be able to pick up my grandkids. I want to be able to do X, Y, and Z. So when you start to focus on that, that has more meaning, that has more juice in it, right? Than losing Keenan: Hmm. Yeah, for sure. Lisa Barwise: 20 pounds, right? Because as soon as the scale doesn't look like it's going down the right direction, your motivation's gone. There's no momentum there, right? We call that goals that fix never stick, right? So Keenan: Mm, yeah. Lisa Barwise: when you start to see the alignment of the goals, when you start to get deeper into what's underneath those a little bit by knowing yourself. Then the journey of going for the goals is how you learn about yourself. That's Keenan: Mm. Lisa Barwise: the key thing. So you've got a little bit of knowledge of those values. You've got an idea of why you want what you want. You're aligning your path towards those goals. And then as you build momentum towards those goals, that's when you learn about yourself. So, you know, you start to notice, okay, I really don't like running. Who knew? Thought running was a thing that I wanted to do because that's what's gonna get me fit, right? No, don't not don't like running. Is running the best way to get me towards my goals? Might not be. Let's check, you know, ask somebody like a personal trainer. Lisa, is running good for me? No, the answer is not. Not for this goal that you have. Let's do this instead. And then you figure that out, right? So I think a lot of the time we live in the land of should, whether that be a self-judgment or a judgment that we're Hearing from somebody in our family or on the internet or something like that. And I think that rather living in the shoulds, we should look at the, you know, well, what do we actually want? Right? What is important to us? and then momentum is literally, this is such a really easy way to get yourself momentum. Momentum is just progress honored. That's it. Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: So you gotta honor the progress. And in our communities, we do this with Victory Lane is what we call it when we honor island. We have our own island. it's it's it's an online program, but it's called the island because the idea is that it's set as the island of the masquera where Wonder Woman once lived. but there every single week we celebrate Victory Lane and we look for evidence. For Keenan: Mm. Lisa Barwise: evidence, progress honored. That's where we get the momentum. So everything from I'm not out of breath climbing these stairs. To when I get up off the sofa, I don't make the noise that I used to always make. That's a big one. I can touch my toes, I can lift, I can lift my own suitcase in the overhead locker. That was one of my things that I noticed. And I would have missed it had I not been being intentional towards what was important to me and noticing that strength was important. There's I would have just missed that as a really big marker of evidence. So that's how we do it. It's like And if you think of it more as like a as I said, like a quest, more like a momentum map plan, trying to make it a bit fun, it do can take that little worry, anxiety stuff away because it's just a bit more fun. It's just a bit more interesting. Keenan: Absolutely, for sure. So you kind of alluded to this, but what are you you know, as we're as we're wrapping up, what are you working on right now? What's going on for you now? Lisa Barwise: So I have written the two books now. So Unarmored, which is all about how to release armor weight, which is the emotional, energetic, and indeed ancestral weight that women specifically carry and they noticed in midlife, not just the physical excess of fat, for example, but like the heaviness of of midlife and what that looks like in this new stage of life. I then went and wrote Burned, which is like the origin story of Unarmored, which is like why do we have this armor weight? And that dives deep into female history, midlife rage, why we're so angry, suppression of women, but also good girl conditioning. And that's the book that we do a lot more inner work. That's looking at what we call inner activism in there. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: and that one was really fun to write. Well, no, that's not true. It was fun to write the ending of it. The middle of it was really horrific and horrible because I had to do a lot of research. And some of the things that you find, it was like, I it just yeah, even gives me the heebie jeebies now. it's not in the book. I had to go through that for you, everybody. I I filtered the information that you need to know, not put in all the the the stuff that I had to learn to find it out. but then from there I wanted to then create tools or things to actually help people. So it's not just here's the books, but like, how do I help you? So My main focus in life is wellness alchemy. So wellness alchemy is the triquetra of biology, psychology, and spirituality coming together. So, you know, it's not just I need to lose a little bit of weight or you know, or I have I wanna you know get stronger or I have hormone imbalances or anything like that. It's trying to find out where those interconnect, like why your exhaustion. could be because of the fact that you have a limiting belief, which we call a curse, of the I am not enough curse. So that means that you're constantly proving, you're constantly pushing, you're constantly overdoing. If you're in that proving state, then you're always very close to burnout. Burnout is the emotional exhaustion as well as mental exhaustion and physical exhaustion. So you you can't just say, go, go sleep more or whatever to try to overcome those, right? So it's that interplay between all of those. So then I wanted to create tools for that. So I'm currently creating a a really cool tool called the Weaver, which is going to be like an analytic tool to help people to figure this out. So that it gives us also one, the answer to why do I feel like this right now? Like so that stuff that we Google at three o'clock in the morning when we're awake and we're like, I don't you know, why can't I sleep? And that's normally that one. Or like, why have I got insomnia or why am I exhausted all the time, or why do I just feel like meh all the time or whatever? You can bring that to the decoder, and then the the weaver is gonna help you to figure that out, like what is going on. So ultimately, then you still have more agency and you have more data to then bring maybe to a practitioner or a physician or doctor, so that if there is something else you need to do. you know you've got enough of the information because it's like what you said sometimes we don't we're not present enough we're not intentional enough to even notice what's happening for us we don't Keenan: Right. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: listen to our bodies so I wanted to create a tool that helps you to have that conversation with yourself if that makes sense or Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: have that conversation with them which ultimately is going to help you to start tracking patterns and try to work that out as a holistic thing. So it's not just that, it could be you know also to do with your connection, your spiritual practice, your your sense of feeling purpose or passion, right? Which we talked about. but it could also be like you're missing, you know, nutritional deficiencies. You've got you're low on iron or you need more magnesium or something like that too, right? Keenan: For sure. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: and then from that, I've created a full collection to help people with all of that. So it could be I need help with my gut health, or I do need help figuring out why I have insomnia. Or it could be that I have lots of extra aches and joints pains, like as I'm getting older, what can I do about that? Right. So it's always very problem solution led as well. So that's the sort of thing that I'm doing over the next year. And it's gonna be very exciting because I finally feel like I've cracked what people need and how to actually help and support them with that. Keenan: Absolutely, for sure. Yeah, that sounds great. So we talk a lot about faith and mental health here. Someone hearing all this and they're thinking about therapy or just reaching out and they're kind of on the fence about it. What do you think they need to hear to kind of get them off the fence about starting therapy? Lisa Barwise: So I always see help or looking for help as a way for you to enrich yourself rather than that you are broken or there's something wrong with you, right? A lot Keenan: Hmm. Lisa Barwise: of us walk around every day, right, thinking we're broken, something's wrong with us, something's not right. And instead of like you know, seeking the help that we need, right? We decide that it's better just to bottle this up and just sweep it under the carpet and hope that it doesn't come to bite us on the ass later. I'm here to tell you it's always going to bite you on the ass because my ass sometimes is so sore from not dealing with those things, right? It is going to bite you on the ass. But you might not be the only one that will suffer from that, right? Your kids may suffer from it, your partner, etc. So I think that's important to say. But I know it's like like it's cliche to say that, for example, my son had broken bones. He went to the hospital, he sought help, right? When you feel like something's not right with you here or how you feel, why would we not instantly think that that's the same thing to go and get help with that? So that that's definitely thing that I would say, but also. There's a little bit of sometimes it's not about putting your problems or concerns into a box either, right? Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Lisa Barwise: And we need to look at ourselves as a whole. So I am not somebody who wants you to not go get medical help or not seek out the therapist. But what I'm trying to say is we need it, we need a village of people also. Keenan: Sure, absolutely. Lisa Barwise: help us just like they tell me it takes a village to raise a child. I think it takes a village to be human, right? We need that. And whether that's Keenan: Mm, absolutely. Lisa Barwise: a village of people who help you, who are your resources, who are good positive words. So you know, if you are spiritual, then you know seek out the help in that way too, right? there's you know the I don't believe that you know being spiritual or religious stops you from wanting to go to yoga. or learn breath work, for example. Or that if you are somebody who has you doesn't necessarily feel like they have any sort of spiritual practice or religious, that going and doing something that you think is a bit woo-woo is not going to benefit you. Like I sent somebody to a sound bath the other day, even though they've never done anything remotely woo, but I'm like, okay, well I can tell you the science behind how this is going to work. You can believe that it's woo and whatever way, it's still gonna work for you, right? You don't have to believe in something for it to work. Faith is a great tool for for healing, believing Keenan: Mm-hmm. Lisa Barwise: in whatever path is gonna help you to heal no matter what. But sometimes you don't even need that. Sometimes you can literally just rock up to the thing and just go, like a lot of the times, like my son would say to me, like I I was trying to help him with something, and I was like, If you just hum right now, I promise you it's gonna really help you. And he's like, that sounds so woo-woo and weird. I'm not gonna hum. And I'm like, there's nobody around. It's only you and me that know this. Just friggin' hum. Right. And it was like, because humming actually helps to calm your vagus nerve and help sell you, right? So he was having difficulty breathing. It was too much for that. And I was like, the only other thing I can get you to do is rub your ear or hum. Which one do you want to do? He was like, okay, I'll hum. And he hummed. And he was like, okay, it did help a little bit. And I was great, keep going. So it doesn't have to you don't have to have belief and whether it's going to help you for it to actually help you. Right. So Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Lisa Barwise: the the faith might come later, right? And and that's fine too. So that's what I would say for sure. Keenan: Sure. Yeah. Yeah. So how can people find you in what you do? Lisa Barwise: the best way probably is my website because that's the it's got the quiz, which is really cool. And you can also access my books there in my library. if you go to the warrior goddess saga, that's S-A-J S-A-G-A.com, the warrior goddess saga.com. you can start with the quiz, which is really cool, or you can find me on Instagram at the Warrior Goddess Saga. And I do weekly little readings there for each of the archetypes and we talk about wellness alchemy there. you can also access the book if you want to find out more about Unarmored. I also give two chapters away for free. So if you really are interested, I can give that link to you so you can stick it in your show notes and they can come and access that for free. I would happily give that to you. Keenan: Awesome. Well, yeah, I'll put all your info in the description so people can find it. thank you so much for such a good conversation and sharing so much wisdom. I really appreciate it. I think you know everyone else is gonna appreciate it as well. So thank you so much for everything today. All Lisa Barwise: Thank you. Thanks so much. Keenan: right, see ya.