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Transcript

Recapping The Biggest Wild Card Headlines & Chaim Bloom’s Presser · Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: Hello, everybody, and welcome to another edition of Cardinal Territory.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: Jim Hayes alongside Kyle Gibson and Lance Lynn. And, guys,
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: the postseason is here, and that's fun. So let's start
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: with our on-deck segment presented by Fox 1. By the way,
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: the NLCS, NLDS, and World Series available on the Fox
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: One app. All right. Yankees beat Boston last night 9-2.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: A lot of Cardinal adjacent news out of that one
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: because Sonny Gray started for the Red Sox, won 18
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: games in the regular season, was phenomenal this year. And
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: he got yanked by Chad Tracy after four and two-thirds
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: after the game Sonny admitted that he was disappointed, that
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: he felt like the team should have believed in him.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: He pointed out that when it comes to facing an
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: order second, third time, he was like the best in
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: the American League in that, but he was shamed. So
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Lance is smiling, so that makes me want to call
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: on him first. Lance, Sonny, four and two-thirds, thoughts?
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:29
  Speaker 3: That's the way to say it is that's Sonny's way
• 1:31
  Speaker 3: of saying goodbye. And there's really no other way to
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: say it. I think he was kind of talking about,
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: you know, wherever the season or wherever he might go
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: after this year. But when you yank your ace in
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: a playoff series, you kind of feel like you don't
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: have faith. That's the way the player will take it.
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: It feels panicky probably in the rest of the clubhouse.
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: It is playoff time. Everyone says, okay, You've got to
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: win the game, so it doesn't matter, blah, blah, blah.
• 1:59
  Speaker 3: But you don't have anyone in your bullpen that's better
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: than Sonny Gray in that situation, in my opinion, until
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: maybe the ninth. But that's the world we live in.
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: When you're behind in a series, you unload the bullpen
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: as fast as you can because that's what they think
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: they should do. But you have an ace, the 18-game winner.
• 2:22
  Speaker 3: Sometimes you've got to ride them.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: Kyle, your thoughts on this. To me, like every game
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: is different, right? So maybe you see something, you're like, look,
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: it's dire straits for us if they keep piling on runs.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: But you are talking about Sonny Gray, who pitched as
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: well as anyone in baseball, and he had thrown 70-some pitches.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: How do you explain yanking?
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: I didn't see Chad Trace's comments after the game. but
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: you don't really explain that one other than you went
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: to your bullpen at the time that you thought. I
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: wonder if Sonny's thoughts would have been a little different
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: if it was Aroldis Chapman that came in the game.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: That was the only thing that I kind of thought
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: that the Red Sox could have done and maybe be
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: able to explain that away. One of the best closers
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: in the game never got in the series. If there's
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: ever a time to use him You use him right there,
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: and you make sure he gets that last out, and
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: then the next however many outs he can, and your
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: team has a chance to hopefully take the lead by
• 3:34
  Speaker 2: the time he's out of the game. Other than that,
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: I think we saw what a couple teams have done
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: with their ace. Christopher Sanchez was allowed to ride through
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: how many storms yesterday in a must-win game for the Phillies. Now,
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: I don't know the comparison between the Phillies' bullpen and
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: the Red Sox' bullpen. Obviously, they had used Deron. for
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: 30-plus pitches the day before. But Mattingly decided he was
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: going to let Sanchez do this. He was going to
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: ride or die with this Cy Young guy. And what,
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: Sonny's going to finish in the top five in Cy Young,
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: maybe the top– I don't even know where he's going
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: to end up, but he's going to be in the
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: top five, and you let him go. He's got swing
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: and miss stuff. He knows how to make pitches, and
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: you let him go. There's just– there's no other way
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: about it. in my mind, unless you bring in chat.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: So the Phillies bullpen has been crappy. One other thing
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: about Sonny that was out there on social media, I've
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: seen the dirt on the neck before mixed with rosin,
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: although the camera angle did make it look like it
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: was tacky, sticky. Lance, is there anything to Sonny Gray
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: putting a substance on his neck? Because If the other
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: team doesn't say anything, to me, there's probably nothing there,
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: but just your thoughts on all the stuff out there
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: about what it possibly could be.
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: Well, if anyone has ever picked up Rosin, Sonny is
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: more Rosin than any human being I've ever seen in
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: my life.
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: True story.
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: He also is the dirtiest person at the end of
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: a uniform for a pitcher I've ever seen in my life.
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: He just grabs dirt. Sometimes in the dugout, he's sitting
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: on the ground. like he is a special person in
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: all categories that he goes. So what you got was rosin, dirt, sweat,
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: everything and anything possible that is out there on the
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: mound besides him just rolling around on the dirt and
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: being a four-year-old kid playing in dirt. That's what Sonny
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: does when he plays baseball. He's just nonstop. There's really
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: no other way to say it, and that's how he moves.
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: So if you ever grab dirt, rosin, and sweat and
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: put it anywhere– It's going to clump up. There's really
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: no other way to say it. And Sonny's always looking
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: for moisture besides licking his fingers. And sweat's one of
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: the better moistures to have. So that's just part of
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: the game. And you're looking at– that's just what happened
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: that night.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: So you think it's a nothing burger too, Kyle?
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: Absolutely nothing. He grabs dirt all the time. He does
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: have a ton of rosin. And– You can look back
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: to his time probably anywhere, right, with any team. But
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: I know with the Cardinals, that's where Sonny always got
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: his sweat. You know, he didn't want to lick his
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: hands because rosin doesn't taste good, okay? So he didn't
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: want to lick his hands, and he had a lot
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: of rosin. You can probably see before every inning he
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: loads his hand up because he sweats a ton, right?
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: And that is the only way to keep your hand dry.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: So he sweats a ton. He grabs dirt. But he
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: just wants the tip of his two fingers to have
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: a little moisture to Because being dry, like to the
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: point of slippery, is not good. Then when you get
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: a little sweat on the tip of your fingers with
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: the leather on the ball, now you got a little
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: bit of tack with the rosin and sweat. It's just
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: in the same spot because he takes the dirt and
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: rosin and he rubs it on his neck. These two
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: fingers from the rosin, every time I pitched, would have
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: like a dark.
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: Coating on it because when the rosin and the sweat
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: mixes and dries and mixes and dries, it looks like
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: a dark gray residue. That's all that was on his neck.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: So the Red Sox got.
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: Well, hey, and dirt doesn't taste good either, Jim. You
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: should know that from the playgrounds you were growing up.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: I remember that.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, dirt is bad. I don't know what spider tack
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: tastes like either, but Also, that's clear.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: Spider-Tac's clear. Spider-Tac is not pine tar colored.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I'm just saying, look, you leave it up to two pitchers.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: You have two pitchers on the dais. They're going to
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: get to the bottom of it. I appreciate it. One
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: thing that's tougher to get to the bottom of is
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: the Red Sox in disarray. They got boat raced by
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: the Yankees, and after the game, our buddy Wilson Contreras
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: said something, and I was like, where have I heard
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: that before? So Wilson Contreras... said basically after the game
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: that one of the problems for the Red Sox is
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: they have data. They have all the computer stuff. He said,
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: the data is here to help us, but you need
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: experienced and veteran guys to win games. That's part of
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: the quote. And I'm thinking, boy, Lance and Kyle have
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: said that, boy, for a long time on this podcast.
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: What do you think when you hear a guy who
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: just got bounced in a playoff like Wilson point to
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: that as one of the problems that the Red Sox
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: have had to deal with.
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: I'm going to start here because I think that this
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: goes hand-in-hand with Sonny being pulled. Somewhere in the data
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: thing said that you should go to a fresh.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: Arm or a new look, blah, blah, blah.
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: But Wilson's telling you, the computers, the analytics telling you
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: what to do, how to do it, and all that
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: is all fine and dandy to have in front of you.
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: But players win games... And if players don't know how
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: to use that stuff to how they work, what they
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: do things, and then if all your young guys are
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: playing to the data, then they're not playing the game.
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: They're playing to a spreadsheet, to a piece of paper.
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: And then the game will pass you by, will speed
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: up on you, and you'll get your ass kicked. And
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: that's what happened.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: And after the game, Wilson was asked, right? And about
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: Sonny getting pulled anyway.
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: What?
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: He just said, I'm not talking about it because you
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: know that Wilson's a really emotional guy. But he's also one,
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: if he has some complaints, he's going to let you
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: know about it too. He's a truth teller. He's a
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: truth teller. Tell me about Wilson being the guy that's
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: going to say what maybe the rest of the clubhouse
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: is thinking.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, Wilson, he understands playoff baseball, and playoff
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: baseball at As much as we want to say it's
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: the same game, it's not. Data and analytics and making
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: all of these calculated decisions over 162 is a decent
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: way to do things. I still think there's a human
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: element that has to be brought into it, but the
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: data is meant for large sample sizes. We do this
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: 30 times, 40 times. It's going to work out in
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: our favor. When you're in a one-game scenario, you don't
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: throw it out, but it has to be your starting point.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: Wilson understands this and Wilson understands. Now you have your
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: starting point. Now you go play the game and the players,
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: your best players have to win the game for you
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: in the playoffs. Um, and I just think he understands
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: that very well. I don't think, um, I, I wasn't in,
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: in the hitters meetings with St.
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: Louis.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: So I don't know that side of Wilson. He didn't
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: strike me as somebody who was just anti data and
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: anti information. Um, he just really believes that at the
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: end of the day, if you want to win in
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: the playoffs and he alluded to this, I believe when
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: they asked him about the offensive numbers and how they
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: didn't score, he said, you have to execute, you got
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: to play the game and that's how you win. And
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: he was really proud of what the team did to
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: fight back into it and went on a great run
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: and get themselves into the playoffs. But at the end
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: of the day, players have to win the game in
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: the post season and you have to execute and get
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: things done. Um, And sometimes the analytics, you know, it
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: doesn't go in your favor, but if you throw your
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: best players out there in the postseason and you let
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: your talent take over, I think that's probably a pretty
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: good way to do it when it's a one-game scenario.
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: So more on Wilson, Lance. My experience with him is
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: that he's always looking for the edge, right? An emotional guy,
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: but I'm not going to say the word you would say,
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: but He certainly likes to F with the other team
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: mentally if he thinks it's going to give him advantage.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: So he homers last night to cut the Yankee lead
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: to one. And he slow jogs around the bases. I mean,
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: slow jogs. And the announcers are like, yeah, there's, you know,
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: he's slow jogging. I don't know what that's about. I'm
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: thinking because the Yankees, because the Red Sox were kind
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: of stale, in my opinion, when I'm watching, they look
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: kind of unenergetic. They So what do you do? You
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: try to create a spark. And I think that's what
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Wilson was doing. Would you agree with that, that that's
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: kind of the M.O. for Wilson?
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and most likely he was probably wanting someone to
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: chirp on the Yankee side, specifically that pitcher or catcher,
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: to spark his guys too. But, you know, if those
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: things don't happen, then it looks worse than it is.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: As a teammate and a player on your side, when
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: a guy does that, you know what he's doing. It's like,
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: he's trying to show you that he's not scared of
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: anything and he'll do whatever he wants. So let's go.
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: And on the other side, you don't want to give
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: him anything to ignite his fire any more than it
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: already is. Um, so that's, that's what it, I mean,
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: both sides know that. So, um, Wilson, Wilson has a
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: way to be a very tactical person um and i
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: don't know if he sometimes means to do it but
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: he does it in a way that he can get
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: under your skin if you allow him and when you
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: would go into series against him let him let him
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: do his his things as a as an opponent you're
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: like man they're they're stupidity a little bit let him
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: do his stupid his antics his stupid antics is what
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: he used to say when he was against us and
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: you would let him do them and then it would
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: fizzle out by the end of the series but If
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: you acknowledge the antics, they'll come more, more, more, and
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: they will let him have a good series. And as
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: a teammate, you want to embrace his antics so he
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: just balls. So that's the beauty of the game. If
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: you're with him or against him, he can have totally
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: different effects on your dugout, and you need to allow
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: him to do his thing as a teammate, and you
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: also need to allow him to do his thing as
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: an opponent, because the more you want to stop it,
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: the more that it gives him fuel.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: Now, Kyle, I think you're a very rational person, but
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: I think you have a little edge to you. I think,
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: but on the mound, you had a little edge to you, right?
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: How would you react if someone slow jogged after taking
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: you deep?
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: I think because of the first game, you know, just
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: kind of rolling them. And then, you know, having the
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: lead already, it was a solo homer. It's not a
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: lead-taking homer. Probably more like, you know, just kind of
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: looking at him like, okay, you know, what are you
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: doing this for? You know, this isn't really– you can't
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: let that affect you is what I would try to,
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: you know, get at in that moment. You know, I
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: think what Lance said is spot on. Wilson's trying to,
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: you know, always show confidence because he is always confident,
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: and he's trying to make sure he, you know, lets that, uh,
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: fill the dugout, you know, with, with that confidence, that
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: positive energy. And at the same time, I think, you know,
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: there's a real thing that if he can get the
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Yankees focused on negativity and mad at him and not
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: positivity and not, you know, staying in their own bubble,
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: like Lance said, you know, he's got a chance to
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: maybe disrupt a little bit of the momentum that they had. And, uh,
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: unfortunately for the Red Sox, it didn't work.
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: All right, Lance, you played for the White Sox. Uh,
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Last night, the White Sox rolled Houston 7-3 in advance.
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: And I did not have on my bingo card. And
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: by the way, I hate when people say I didn't
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: have it on my bingo card. But Eric Fetty and
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: Jordan Hicks combined for four scoreless, hitless innings with six
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: strikeouts between them. What did you make of the White
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Sox performance during the wild card?
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: No, I think when you go and you beat Houston,
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: no matter what kind of year they've had, they've got
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: playoff caliber pedigree. So when you beat them in a
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: 2-0 series, that's huge. I mean, that's just good stuff.
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: There's really no other way to say it. They've put
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: together a young, exciting team, and they sprinkled in guys
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: like Fetty and Hicks along the way to start the
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: year and all that stuff that can give them quality
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: innings and do the things they want what they need to.
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: I mean, everybody forgets Fetty the year before for the
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: White Sox was one of the big trade deadline acquisitions.
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: And then last year he struggled. So, I mean, they've
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: got guys that can get out at the big league
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: level and they've found a home. Sometimes when you get
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: a band of misfit toys and they can find a home,
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: South side of Chicago is a good place for a
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: band of misfit toys to find a home. There's really,
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: and that's what they, I mean, and that's, they, the
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: fans in Chicago, like, When I was there and played there,
• 17:09
  Speaker 3: they liked me. I was a little bit of a
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: misfit toy when I showed up in Chicago. They embraced
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: me and let me be me, calling people names and cursing,
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: coming off the mound. Sometimes when you find your place,
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: you play better. There's no other way. Then when you
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: leave said place, you don't play as well because you're home.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: I think Fetty's at home in Chicago. There's really no
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: other way to say it. Hicks has been kind of
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: trying to find his place since the day he showed
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: up in the big leagues when everyone was trying to
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: tell him how to live his life. So in Southside Chicago,
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: they're not going to tell him how to live his life.
• 17:44
  Speaker 3: They're going to tell him to show up and pitch
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: and get out. So I'm not surprised by those guys
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: having success because they have stuff and they have had success.
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: Sometimes you just need to find your home, and there's
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: multiple different ways to find it in the big league level. And,
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: you know, the Chicago's put together a different version of
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: a playoff team than anyone would probably call a playoff team. But, man,
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: what they did, in Houston and, you know, and what
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: they've done all year, surprise people is because they've put
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: together a group that no one thought could do it,
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: but they, they've got, um, they've got character. That's for sure.
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: And South side, Chicago character, uh, character plays, plays up there.
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: Jim, which part, which part wasn't on your bingo card,
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: the white Sox winning or Hicks and Fetty doing what
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: they did, because I'm pretty sure the white Sox winning
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: was as about as close to the free space on
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: my bingo card as as it could be i thought
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: like and then had i seen their post-game celebration interviews
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: before the series it would have been my free space
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: those kids are confident and they knew exactly what they
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: were going to do going in there there was no
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: doubt there was no surprise no like man so happy
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: they like there was a confidence in those kids so
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: which part did you not expect.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: The house Fetty did so bad when he was at
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: Cardinal that there's no way he could get out from
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: the big leagues. That's what he did this last year.
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: Typical Homer. Man, he's not any good because he can't
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: get out in a Cardinal's uniform the last time he
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: was here. That's what it was. Fetty was an all-star
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: in Chicago before we traded for him. And he came
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: over here and just didn't get it done. And then
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: he's back here.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: Well, he went overseas. He went overseas and he developed
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: a really good sweeper.
• 19:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Then he couldn't locate him with the Cardinals. And Hicks
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: was a guy who's always had fantastic stuff, just hasn't
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: been able to harness it. But I'll be honest, I
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: forgot Hicks was on the White Sox. And now look
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: at the box score, I'm like, good for those two.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: So when I have him on my bingo card, just
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: another way of saying I might not have expected it.
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: He didn't even know who was on the roster, so
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: that's why he didn't have it on his bingo card.
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: He didn't even know who was on the roster.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Jim, can I ask a follow-up question? Sure. Okay. Lance,
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: with your time in Chicago, you were pretty open about
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: some of the issues with the process. what do you
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: see that's different in this group? Is it just a
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: different group of players that are young and quality players
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: coming up? Or do you see something actually being done
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: different in that Venable might be doing different with that group?
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: So I had Tony when I first showed up and
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: then he got sick and then we went to Pedro
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: Griffel and I'm going to be honest with you. The
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: wheels fell off all the way around. There was, there's
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: no other way to say it. There was, it was, there's,
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: just what it was. I think you're seeing Will come in.
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: Will can get the young guys to listen and do
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: what they need to do. He can get the older
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: guys to buy in and do what they need to do.
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: I think the front office saw kind of the wheels
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: fall off there with the coaching staff and what they
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: had going on after Tony left and Tony's staff left
• 21:00
  Speaker 3: that year. They were the two years when they lost
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: all the games. And then you bring in Will Will
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: played in the big leagues. He's been on staffs and
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: organizations that had a plan and had a way of
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: doing things. And I think he, with the front office,
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: have created a program, a way of doing things from
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: the top to bottom that is translating and these kids
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: can understand. And then they're adding veteran-ish pieces around, the Fettys,
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: the Hicks, they're getting guys that can that know how
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: to play the game a little bit, too, that are
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: fun guys. Fetty's a fun guy to have around for
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: a young staff, you know, or whatever. So, like, you're
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: getting guys like that, too. And the next thing you know,
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: you just start breeding confidence because guys come up, they
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: know what's expected. I think for a time there in Chicago,
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: it was– and when we played against them in Minnesota, Kyle,
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: I remember they had all these guys, G Alito, Cease,
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: all these guys. It was, hey, just go play and fail. Like,
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: you'll learn to play at a big league level and
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: fail it instead of teaching them how to do things
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: the right way. And I think what happened was that
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: turned into, with Tony showed up, it was we expected
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: to win, and then it got too much for him.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: And then they went back to, hey, let's develop, let's
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: let these guys be themselves. And then that backfired again
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: with the coaching staff there because there was no accountability.
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: And it was all the older players' fault because what
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: they were trying to do. get done and get people
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: to listen to wasn't being backed by the coaching staff. Um,
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: now you have backing from top to bottom is there's
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: really no other way to say it. Um, and it's
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: fun to see a team do a trend, like a
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: turnaround that quick. And Will's got probably the number one, uh,
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: person that needs all the credit for that because we've all,
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: we've played against Will. Everybody knows Will character. You're seeing
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: a team take, take over his, his character and it's
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: good stuff.
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: So, They lost, what, 121 games a couple seasons ago.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: It is a remarkable turnaround. I'm going to throw my
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: story out here, Kyle, just because I love it. Back
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: when Lance was a White Sox player and Joe Kelly
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: was in the bullpen, I had set up to interview
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: them together for the Cardinal pregame show, which is always
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: fun because Lance is a delight. Joe Kelly was a delight. Anyway,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: the players are out stretching. They're already stretching. I go
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: to the PR guy. Hey, have you seen Lance? No.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: He looks scared. No. What about Kelly? I don't think
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: he's come in yet. Anyway, I don't know if the
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: team already had hit BP, but no one knew where
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: these guys were. It reminded me of one of the
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: outposts in the movie Apocalypse Now where there was no
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: one in charge, and it was just players running the show.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: All right, let's move on. and talk about the San
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: Diego Padres.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: That's the joke on you, though. That's the thing is
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: I didn't know you were there until you texted me.
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: No one ever talked to us about doing a pregame
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: with you.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: I had texted you.
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: You texted me, but none of the other people did.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: And Joe, Joe's Joe.
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: Joe's Joe. So the Padres embarrassed the Cubs to move on.
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: The Padres were 50-53. on July 23rd. Kyle, I'll ask
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: you this. I don't know how close you've been following
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: the Padres, but a bunch of their guys, Tatis, Merrill,
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: all of a sudden started hitting. They got a really
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: good bullpen, and the turnaround happened quick. I remember when
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: the team was first purchased by the new ownership group.
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: They couldn't win a game, and then they couldn't lose
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: after that. What kicked in?
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you said it right there. Between Merrill, Tatis, Machado,
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: you've got all-stars, Bogarts, You've got all-stars that really weren't
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: hitting up to snuff in how they wanted to perform.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Sheets has been having a great year. He's been hitting well,
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: if I remember right. But the guys that needed to
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: hit well for this team were not. The reason they
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: were 53-50 was because their pitching staff is so good.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: And I think that can show you what a good
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: pitching staff can do. It keeps you in the ballgame.
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: And it gives you consistency day to day. Then when
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: your offense takes off like it does, now when you're
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: constantly giving up two or three runs, you will win
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: so many ballgames that way. And that's what they did.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: And they kept it rolling in the postseason here the
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: last couple days. You know, the bats that are supposed
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: to be coming alive are really coming alive for this team. And,
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: you know, I've said it maybe even last week, right? Hitters,
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: when they hit, they get very, very confident. And you're
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: looking at a Padre team that is as confident as
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: they can be right now, because the guys that are
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: supposed to be doing really well and hitting man, they're
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: mashing the ball.
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: Guy like that piece. I looked early in the season.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: He had like two homers. All of a sudden I looked,
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: he's got 25, you know, that guy's going to hit
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: at some point, Lance.
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah. There's a point, um, in a good team situation
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: where you need your players to play to the back
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: of their baseball card. And that's what happened. Um, and
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: you can do anything you want, but there's a time
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: that they've got to show up, and that's what they did.
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: You kind of expect them to do that all year.
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: The fact that they were a 500 team without those
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: guys not really doing anything close to what you expect
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: them to do just shows you how good of a
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: team they kind of put together anyways, and then when
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: your superstars become superstars, that's when you become a team
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: that is just a pain in the ass to handle,
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: so They've got a good balance of star power. They've
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: got a good balance of extras that know how to
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: play the game. They know their job. They know how
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: to get the runner over, get the runner in, play
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: good defense. And then they let those three, four guys
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: win the game when it's their time, and then they'll
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: shine when they need to, like Sheets did last night.
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: So they put together a good team, and they pitch.
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: And that's why they are where they are and where
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: you expect them to Sometimes it doesn't matter how you
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: get there, Jim. You learn a little bit about yourself
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: on the journey, though, and they learn that they don't
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: have to rely on their stars at all times to
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: still be a good team. So sometimes you need that
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: to form a great team and a playoff run team.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: So it might be in their favor that their stars
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: didn't dominate to start the year, so the rest of
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: the guys got some confidence to carry. And now the
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: stars and the rest of the team can work together
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: to win it all.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: So George just put those numbers up for Tatis, right?
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: You know, 830 OPS. George, I don't know how easy
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: it is to just click to the splits, but I
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: guarantee the pre-All-Star and the post-All-Star splits for Fernando Tatis
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: and Manny Machado are night and day. And you're going
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: to look and see, what do we got here? That's post-season. Oh,
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: he's going to do a live right as we go.
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: I guarantee those guys, you're going to see a complete turnaround. Oh,
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: here you go.
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: So what do we got for August and September.
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, Tatis at 337. 337 in September, October, and
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: 260 with 10 homers. I mean, he just crushed it.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: A 900 OPS, and it's probably a 1.0 OPS in
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: September for Tatis. I mean, that's what they needed to
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: do to get in, you know? And those guys did it. So, George,
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: you're the man. Thanks for doing that.
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I also think what Lance said about teams
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: coming together where sometimes, like, the stars like you– lance
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: if you don't carry then it's up to me to
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: ask better questions so i feel like there's some of
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: that with this podcast.
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: That's a different story if you have to carry it
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: we're fucked.
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: That's probably true all right yeah it is let's talk
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: about the uh nlds the alds and get your predictions
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: so we got padres brewers we got white socks guardians
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: we got uh The Dodgers facing either Atlanta or Philly.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: That series is fun. And you got the Yanks and Tampa.
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: So of those matchups, who do you see going forward?
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: I'm going to start with you, Kyle, because you wanted
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: to do these predictions. So now you go first.
• 29:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, had I been writing up the script
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: for Monday, it would have been probably the first thing
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: we did is give our playoff predictions. But, Jim, you
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: wanted to talk Cardinals first, so I understand.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: I think in the AL, I've got Tampa going to
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: beat New York. Tampa's got something right now with those
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: AL East teams, and I think that they're going to
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: keep that going here in the postseason, so Tampa, I
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: think it'll be a good series, but the pitching for Tampa,
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: I believe if they can quiet down the Yankee bats,
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: that series is going to go well for them. The
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: next one, man, A & L Central matchup. Cleveland had
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: been playing very, very well, but I think these games
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: in Houston are going to do the White Sox a favor.
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: The White Sox struggled a little bit down the stretch,
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: allowing Cleveland to overtake them in the Central series. I
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: think this bit of confidence for the White Sox is
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: going to be good. And I've got the White Sox
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: going to win a game in Cleveland. And then they
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: might take care of business in Chicago and win three
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: there and just be done with it. And then on
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: the NL side, I really– I think the Phillies winning
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: that game yesterday allows them to be set up with
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: a strong bullpen. And I don't know if they've named
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: their starter yet, but I've got the Phillies winning today.
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: and then if they can avoid using Wheeler, I don't
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: know if Wheeler's starting today, if they can avoid using Wheeler,
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: then I think that gives the Phillies a real chance
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: against the Dodgers to be set up to win a
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: game in L.A. and then take that series. It's a
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: little bit of a heart pick right there.
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: A little bit of a heart pick. It's projected Nola
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: versus Ray Kerr. Aaron Nola versus Ray Kerr tonight.
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: If needed, Wheeler will come out of the bullpen. I
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: would almost guarantee that, if needed. Because I think if
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: you can go Nola, Wheeler, Duran, and just close that
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: thing out, that's what they're going to do. If you
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: can get a lead and not have to do that,
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: and Wheeler starts against LA, I like their chances to
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: take a game and do that series. Man, San Diego, Milwaukee,
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: that's so tough. Because I think I want Milwaukee to
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: do it. Milwaukee, after all they've gone through the last
• 31:53
  Speaker 2: couple years, being the division champ and now just kind
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: of faltering, I hope Pat Murphy and their processes can
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: get it done. And if they can quiet those Padre bats,
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: I have no doubt that Milwaukee will be able to score.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to go a heart pick there and
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: pick Milwaukee.
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: I like that.
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: Lance, who you got? I think the Phillies will win tonight.
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: I think they'll lose to the Dodgers. I think the
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: Padres are going to beat the Brewers, so it's going
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: to be Dodgers-Padres.
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: In the CS.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: Oh, man, electric.
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: I think the Yankees beat the Rays in this series,
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: and then I think the White Sox beat the Guardians,
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: so we're going to have Yankees-White Sox in the CS
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: for the American League. Wow.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: For the record, I got the Brewers beating the Padres,
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: White Sox beating the Guardians. No one asked you. I got,
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: I feel, but read the contract. I got to give
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: my picks. I think Tampa's going to beat the Yanks.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: And I think the Dodgers move on as well. MLB
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: on Fox, by the way, is streaming on Fox One.
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: And the postseason is here. And we have your front
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: seat to the wildest walk-offs, lights out pitching, and clutch plays.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: All playoffs long. Stream each NLDS and NLCS games. Live
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: on Fox 1. Then the 2026 World Series. Live on
• 33:15
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• 33:19
  Speaker 1: Never miss a moment. Stream it now. Start your Fox
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: 1 three-day free trial today at fox1. com. Before we go, gentlemen,
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: I did want to ask you a little bit about
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: what the Cardinals are doing. So, Heinblum had his wrap-up
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: press conference yesterday. And we'll just spend a minute or
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: two on this. But Heim basically said, look, we don't
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: consider it a success except for, one, we kind of
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: have a better idea who our core players are. And
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: we have enhanced the minor league system. So going forward,
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: we feel like we're in a pretty good place. Do
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: you agree with that, Kyle Gibson? Do you think that's
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: a fair assessment?
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think, sure, every
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: team's goal is to win and make the playoffs, regardless
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: of what you're stating as a rebuild. Do I think
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: they wanted to win more games? Yes, for sure. But yeah,
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: I think I agree with what Jaime said and what
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: they're trying to do. Lance did bring up an interesting
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: point last show about if they would have kept those
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: guys and I got a couple of nice back and
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: forths on social media regarding that comment. But, yeah, I mean,
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: I agree with Haim.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Lance, I'm going to read you this tweet that I
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: wrote down. This is what Haim said. In my view,
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: there's nothing that happened this year that should tempt us
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: to lose focus on our goals, which is work for
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: the long distance. Look, I think they've done– you did
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: bring up some great points, but I think they've done–
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: what they set out to do. Now, if they kept
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: Sonny Gray, they probably would have let him pitch more
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: than four and two-thirds, and maybe there's a different outcome.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: But I do think it's fair to say that they
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: were up front with what they were trying to do,
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: and I think they accomplished that. Where it goes from here,
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: anybody's guess.
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think what they set out to
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: do to start the year and rebuild. But here's the
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: thing is, if you were– we don't– the core– are
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: all going into arbitration or under contract. So here's my
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: thing is, what do we say when we're still in
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: this for the long haul? So we're in it for
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: the long haul. All these guys are two or three
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: years away from being free agents and all that. So
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: then they're not signed, and then we're not saying we're
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: going to add around them because they're in their prime
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: and they're in the cheapest they're going to be. So
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: I'm kind of now confused by that comment on what
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: that actually means. of the long haul. It's the long
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: haul after Walker, Burley, Herrera, and Mason are free agents
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: and gone. And if that's the long haul, this is
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: going to be a tough, tough couple, three years, because
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: they're just going to let those guys, they're going to
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: trade them away and not add anything around them. So
• 36:14
  Speaker 3: if you're telling me you know the core, then you
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: know Burley, Herrera, Walker, Mason are your core, and then
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: you want to add around them with big league talent,
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: why you still have them for less than free agent dollars. So,
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: I'm kind of confused after those comments, even more than
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: I ever have been, to be honest. That doesn't really
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: give me a direction at all. That doesn't give me
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: a direction at all. That actually tells me you're going
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: to punt some more and we're going to trade these
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: guys away.
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: That comment of nothing this year changes our thoughts. How
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: exactly did he say that?
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: Walker Burley of the pitching staff Riley O'Brien should change
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: how you view next year because you have nothing on
• 36:57
  Speaker 3: the books except JJ.
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: Alright, so I'm going to read that again.
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: You can go get five, six free agents to be
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: a playoff team without hurting any of your future, which
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: is your farm system.
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: Okay, I'm going to read you exactly. In my view,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: there's nothing that happened this year that should tempt us
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: to lose our focus on our goals. I said long term,
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: but they did say that A rebuild takes more than
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: a year, so that was my words. But he also
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: said this, so maybe this is context. Now we can
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: more easily see a court that has a chance to
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: be together for a while.
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: Three years, so you've got to go get free agents
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: to go around them.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I kind of look at it, I wonder if
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: they're waiting on some of these sort of pitchers.
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: That's another foot in, half foot in, half foot out thing.
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: Pretty much telling you we don't see enough to spend
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: money so we're not going to. But we have a core,
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: so come watch.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: I think we talked about this last time. I think
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: we talked about this last time. If they're going to
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: do a deep run and really be consistently a top
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: team in the Central, they need a couple starting pitchers.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: The one front line, right? They need a front line.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: So is that comment kind of waiting on a couple
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: of these starters, I wonder, and seeing if they have
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: one internally before they go sign one? I don't know.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: I'm not sure.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: We don't even know if there's going to be a
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: season next year. I think there will be at some point. But, look,
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: if you're Heim, you don't want to put all your
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: cards on the table. You don't want to telegraph which direction,
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: especially when there's uncertainty. I get that. I get that.
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 38:41
  Speaker 3: You've got to payroll $ 60 million next year. If there's
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: a floor, they're going to have to go to 160,
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: so they're going to have to spend $ 100 million if
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: they want a ceiling. So they're going to have to
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: spend money.
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: Hey, if that's the case, this is probably going to
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: be a playoff team. If they spend that $ 100.
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: Million right, this is a team. And you should be
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: able to spend $ 100 million no matter what because you're
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: the Cardinals and you have $ 160 million payroll. That's my problem. Yep. Hey,
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: we're going to have $ 60 million payroll. We're going up
• 39:15
  Speaker 3: and we're going to go get the people to go
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: around our core because we know who they are now.
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: And if it's not there, it's not there. But that's
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: what we're going to try to do. But that's why
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: I'm on the couch because I like winning and no
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: one else does and they don't like to pay for it.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: Well, gentlemen, both you guys gave me a lot to
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: think about and that's going to do it for this
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: edition of Cardinal Territory. We'll see you next time for
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: the next episode and hopefully that one won't suck.