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In-Person Sales: The Marketing Strategy You Might be Overlooking with Lauren Domagas · If I'm Being Honest: Straight Talk About Book Publishing & Promotion

• 0:10
  Sayde: All right, welcome back to If I'm Being Honest, Straight Talk about Book Publishing and Promotions.
• 0:16
  Sayde: I'm your host, Sayde Walker, and today I have with me Lauren Domagas, an author and independent publisher, whose debut novel, Songs for Mahalia, released earlier this year.
• 0:27
  Sayde: Songs for Mahalia is the first book in a collection of stories Lauren is writing and publishing.
• 0:34
  Lauren: Yes, yes, that's correct.
• 0:35
  Lauren: So the this one, Songs for Mahalia, um, it's the summer anthology.
• 0:40
  Lauren: So it has a lot to do with themes of like being in a small town, coming of age, um, motherhood, daughterhood, Filipino heritage, of course.
• 0:49
  Lauren: Um, and so it's the summer anthology.
• 0:52
  Lauren: And so after that one is going to be fall, so there's going to be a little bit more uh different themes, maybe a little bit darker, more mysterious, and then afterwards winter and spring.
• 1:01
  Lauren: So um, I'm really excited for that.
• 1:04
  Lauren: And fingers crossed that those books come out soon and we can still be self-publishing together.
• 1:10
  Sayde: So awesome.
• 1:11
  Sayde: So we met Lauren at the San Francisco Writers Conference, which was a few years ago.
• 1:17
  Sayde: I think it was maybe even uh there was some time between meeting you at the San Francisco Writers Conference and when we actually started working together.
• 1:24
  Sayde: Um and, you know, just a little plug for the San Francisco Writers Conference.
• 1:30
  Sayde: We attend a lot of conferences throughout the year.
• 1:32
  Sayde: That one continues to be above and beyond one of the most valuable that we table at.
• 1:38
  Sayde: We get to meet lots of authors, there's agents there, there's uh, you know, publishers, there's self-publishing assists and editors.
• 1:44
  Sayde: It's just a fabulous, fabulous conference if you're in the area and can attend that.
• 1:49
  Sayde: Um, and so you were there.
• 1:51
  Sayde: And I'm I'm curious to hear how you ended up at the San Francisco Writers Conference and kind of what was your uh ambition in attending that?
• 2:01
  Lauren: Um, I will say that I've kind of known about the San Francisco Writers Conference for a little bit before that, but I just didn't have anything to pitch.
• 2:10
  Lauren: And so earlier that year, I had finished um working on songs for Mahaliya, um, got it polished uh to the point where I was like, okay, I think this needs to get out into the world.
• 2:22
  Lauren: Um, and so mostly just I I mean, I I lived in the Bay Area, so it was very convenient to go there.
• 2:30
  Lauren: It was like one of the best like writers conference that um had a really high like literary agent to writer ratio, which is always really important.
• 2:38
  Lauren: Um, and so it just kind of felt like the right timing at that point um to get the book out there and to be able to um uh pitch it to to everybody.
• 2:50
  Lauren: So it there's mostly timing.
• 2:52
  Sayde: Yeah, for sure.
• 2:53
  Sayde: And then what was your decision to independently publish, right?
• 2:59
  Sayde: Because a big piece of that writer's conference, and I think of of really every first-time author's journey is sort of that uh, you know, goal of landing a publishing deal.
• 3:11
  Sayde: Um and so at some point, you know, you made the transition to independently published, or maybe that was always your journey.
• 3:18
  Sayde: I'd I'd love to hear how you ended up there.
• 3:22
  Lauren: Yeah, um, I don't think I made the decision.
• 3:26
  Lauren: I I think it was mostly the industry made the decision for me.
• 3:31
  Lauren: So yeah, like I before the writers' conference, I was prepping everything.
• 3:36
  Lauren: Of course, you have that big dream of being traditionally published.
• 3:39
  Lauren: And so I was prepping um my query, my pitch, um, had printed out samples of my books I could hand it out um to agents whenever one would come acros uh across my path.
• 3:52
  Lauren: Um, and so I was really like, that was the goal to be traditionally published.
• 3:56
  Lauren: Um, and so I went in on a couple of one-on-one pitch sessions to literary agents um and basically walked out with the same feedback, which was this sounds interesting.
• 4:09
  Lauren: Your songs from Mahaliya sounds like an interesting project.
• 4:13
  Lauren: It looks good.
• 4:14
  Lauren: I don't know if I can take it on, and more so I don't know how we would market it because Songs from Ma'halaya is a bit of a weird project.
• 4:23
  Lauren: It's it's short stories, um, but like the stories are not necessarily all related to each other.
• 4:31
  Lauren: Some are.
• 4:32
  Lauren: Um, it is about Falcino heritage, but it's also stuff beyond that.
• 4:37
  Lauren: Um, it's not memoir, but there's like personal touches in there.
• 4:42
  Lauren: Um, and also it's not poetry, but there's some poetic kind of um elements in there.
• 4:49
  Lauren: Um, and so they just didn't wouldn't know where to put it in a bookstore, what shelf and category to put it in, what genre to put it in.
• 4:58
  Lauren: So it just was a good project, but like it all came down to how it would be marketed.
• 5:03
  Lauren: Um, and so I was a little bit, of course, I was a bit disheartened about it, but the bit of knowledge and seed of knowledge that they all gave me was this is probably a self-published project because it it sounds like it could be a great self-published project.
• 5:21
  Lauren: And so I was sad about it, but just kind of in that moment really made the quick transition to be like, well, I I believe in songs from Mahali.
• 5:32
  Lauren: I believe that it's um meant to be out there and shared, but I and I don't really care as much as how it's gonna get out there.
• 5:42
  Lauren: I just want it, I believe in it so much.
• 5:44
  Lauren: And so um, even in that same afternoon, attended, I think, a seminar with Joel.
• 5:50
  Lauren: Um uh he was teaching about self-publishing, or he was either on a panel or something talking about the process, and I learned about that, went up to your guys' booth afterwards, was able to pick up the books in hand and see like the that it was really great quality and I still could get a really good product out of it.
• 6:08
  Lauren: Um, and so I that was how the decision was made was that I I just believed in it and wanted it.
• 6:16
  Sayde: I love that.
• 6:17
  Sayde: Thank you for sharing because and I'm just gonna tell you what I love about that.
• 6:21
  Sayde: I love that you believed in your book and in that collection of stories so much that it wasn't worth it to go, okay, how do I make this more marketable to a publisher?
• 6:34
  Sayde: It wasn't about like, you know, and you're right, when you are crossing a lot of different genres and a lot of different potential readers, that does make marketing the book a little more challenging because what box do you fit in?
• 6:50
  Sayde: And so instead of going, okay, I will rewrite this into one box that might make it more uh appealing to a publisher, you went, No, this is my art and I love it and I want it out there and and I want to, you know, um, I want to hold on to the integrity of this.
• 7:08
  Sayde: And I say this all the time, and I'm sure I have said it on this podcast, this is my favorite thing about self-publishing and independent publishing is, you know, when writing is your art, um before the before the invention of print on demand, before it became much easier to get a book out into the world without a publisher, when writing is your art, there was no way to really share that with people.
• 7:36
  Sayde: It was such a different, it's such a different medium than if you paint a picture or you, you know, photograph wildlife and then you can print those photographs out, you can take them to your local farmer's market, you can, you know, sell directly to customers and you can share your art in that way.
• 7:51
  Sayde: When it was writing a book, you were kind of stuck, right?
• 7:54
  Sayde: It was like, well, you would have to get this traditional publishing deal, which, you know, they're very hard to get now, but they were always hard to get.
• 8:00
  Sayde: And so how could you share that with people in a really beautiful professional um manner?
• 8:07
  Sayde: You know, it was kind of you there just there wasn't that, there wasn't an avenue for that.
• 8:12
  Sayde: And now we have that.
• 8:14
  Sayde: And that's what I love about you know the independent publishing space is it's a way that you can share your art in its truest form with you know, with the world.
• 8:26
  Sayde: So I really love that.
• 8:28
  Sayde: Um, so so thank you for sharing.
• 8:30
  Sayde: So then, you know, we started working together.
• 8:33
  Sayde: Um, I don't totally remember when, but it was shortly after the San Francisco Writers Conference.
• 8:39
  Sayde: And, you know, we we started working on your book.
• 8:41
  Sayde: We went through editing, we went through, you know, interior layout, book cover design, um, and then kind of walking you through setting up your author business, right?
• 8:52
  Sayde: Like through Amazon KDP, through Ingram Spark, getting those print-on-demand distribution channels uh set up.
• 8:58
  Sayde: So what during that process, what did you, what was the most unexpected element of that for you, or what did you find most surprising about the self-publishing, um, the self-publishing path that you weren't weren't really expecting?
• 9:16
  Lauren: Um, I honestly was surprised with how much I loved it.
• 9:20
  Lauren: I was like, I I mean, I I have had creative projects before.
• 9:26
  Lauren: I've done like film videos and like also my writing.
• 9:30
  Lauren: And so I've always had kind of an element of being in charge or be leading that like creative vision.
• 9:38
  Lauren: Um, and so I and so when you like listen to how traditional publishing is told is is talked about, you hear a lot of writers saying, like, well, I didn't have like a hand in the book cover design, or they edited it so much that I don't know if it's really my story at the end of the day.
• 9:56
  Lauren: Um, and so what I really loved about the self-publishing process was that I could implement all the things that I had learned about like um how to execute a creative project, like visually how we wanted it to look, the experience that we wanted the reader to have, um, and kind of carry that out.
• 10:16
  Lauren: And I also very much enjoyed the collaborative process of it.
• 10:20
  Lauren: Um, because when you're working on your book alone, you think like, oh, this is my baby, and like nobody else can touch it.
• 10:27
  Lauren: But I I love being able to learn from like your expertise or like um learn from like the the editors that you worked with and also be able to improve my writing and make the product even better than what I could have done alone.
• 10:41
  Lauren: So I really I don't know.
• 10:43
  Lauren: I just I love that like I had a hand in the creative process and that my voice mattered in it.
• 10:50
  Sayde: Now, talk to me about I love that, and thank you for sharing again.
• 10:54
  Sayde: Um, and we had so much fun working on your project, and I'll just say like Lauren was, you know, like gold star client because he always showed up to meetings prepared and with feedback that was constructive and usable and and ways that we could improve on, you know, particularly like when it came to the artwork that's on the cover as well as some of that artwork that's inside the book, right?
• 11:15
  Sayde: Because it's a really custom, beautiful layout.
• 11:18
  Sayde: It is such a beautiful book.
• 11:20
  Sayde: Um, but you know, certainly there are there are always pieces of self-publishing that you can do yourself versus hiring a company, you know, and Joel and I talk about this a lot on this podcast, it's on our blog.
• 11:34
  Sayde: Um, when you choose to self-publish, there's there's a few different routes that you can go.
• 11:39
  Sayde: You know, you can you can do it all yourself, you can go and hire your own freelancers that you find on, you know, Behance or Fiverr or whatever, uh, or you can hire a self-publishing assist company, which is what we are.
• 11:52
  Sayde: And that's, you know, obviously the route that that you went, but I'm curious kind of what what led you in that direction versus trying to figure it all out on your own.
• 12:02
  Lauren: Um I would say that I saw it as an investment.
• 12:09
  Lauren: Like it wasn't just that I was investing into this project, but I I was investing in knowledge.
• 12:15
  Lauren: And so I of course you can do it all on your own, but it's not as powerful as talking to some experts who have done it for a while.
• 12:24
  Lauren: And I wanted I wanted that feedback.
• 12:28
  Lauren: I wanted to know what made something successful, why like like getting your thoughts on like what made a cover successful, why why we should go with this um layout, um, and then also being able to choose from different layouts on what you know what worked and what didn't.
• 12:46
  Lauren: And so I mostly saw it as like, yes, I'm spending money on like making this project come alive, but like I'm mostly like investing in the knowledge so that I can learn for years to come on different projects and hopefully take that on with my take that on with me in my creative journey.
• 13:06
  Sayde: Yeah, awesome.
• 13:07
  Sayde: I love that.
• 13:07
  Sayde: So now you your book is published, it's been out for a while, a few months anyway.
• 13:12
  Sayde: Um, and I have noticed that you are diving into marketing, which is a whole different territory.
• 13:22
  Sayde: There's so many elements of this when you are an independent author.
• 13:25
  Sayde: There's the writing, and then there is the actual production of that book that you get to manage and be as involved in as you want.
• 13:32
  Sayde: And then there's of course getting the book out into the world, which I think for a lot of people is the the hardest or the most overwhelming, or the or where maybe they feel they have the least amount of of knowledge, right?
• 13:47
  Sayde: How do you how do you go out and talk to people?
• 13:49
  Sayde: Now you had a platform before you started this, because I you know you had a newsletter and you were on social media.
• 13:56
  Sayde: So kind of talk to me about your author platform and uh and how what your strategy was as you kind of built that.
• 14:07
  Lauren: Um, well, I would say that my um my I don't know, it's hard to say.
• 14:14
  Lauren: Like my author platform was I was still building it over time.
• 14:18
  Lauren: I thankfully had had some experience with marketing um through because I had done jobs in social media and graphic design.
• 14:27
  Lauren: Um, so there was a little bit of knowledge going into that on how to what it meant to kind of not only tell people about a product, but more so talk about like the message that you wanted to show, like, um, and also your personal brand, because now I'm a personal brand, um, which is kind of interesting to think about.
• 14:47
  Lauren: Um, but it's not just about the book, it's also about like telling people about me and what's important to me as a writer.
• 14:52
  Lauren: Um, so it's I would say that like right now my my marketing strategy is in-person events, right?
• 15:04
  Lauren: Like, as much as like I find it powerful to be online and to share with like a vast majority of people, um, I think that it's even more powerful to be in person because yeah, like it's been like um very interesting to see people and the kind of difference on how much they want to support you when they're like, oh, you are a real person.
• 15:25
  Lauren: Like and I'm gonna be able to do that.
• 15:26
  Sayde: And you're here and I'm talking to you and I'm getting to know you and having a connection with you, and then here's your book.
• 15:32
  Sayde: Oh my gosh, absolutely.
• 15:34
  Sayde: I so tell me what are some of the in-person events that you've that you've done so far?
• 15:39
  Lauren: Yeah, so I was, I think my first ever in-person event was a uh actually it was a small, it's a small maker's market at like a local coffee shop.
• 15:49
  Lauren: Um and that's been really fun.
• 15:52
  Lauren: But I was at um also Filipino Fest because my book is about Filipino heritage.
• 15:57
  Lauren: Um last week I was at Asian and anime market and um also BIPOC Bash.
• 16:04
  Lauren: Um, I will say that probably the Asian and anime market was probably my most creative reach because um I I don't I don't think my book is a demographic for anime viewers, right?
• 16:18
  Lauren: Um like I think like most of the people at that market were uh like uh teenagers, but it's but somebody has to take the teenagers to that event, and it's usually their moms, um, which has been a large part of my demographic, is like uh women in their um like 30s or 40s with a like teenager because the book has so much to do with like motherhood, daughterhood.
• 16:43
  Lauren: Um, and um, so yeah, so that was probably my most creative reach, but also I think it just worked because I I sold a lot of books that day.
• 16:52
  Lauren: Um, and people were really excited about it, you know.
• 16:56
  Sayde: That is awesome.
• 16:56
  Sayde: So, what how have you what how have you found these events?
• 16:59
  Sayde: Kind of how are you how are you plugging into them?
• 17:03
  Lauren: Um it's been kind of mostly just going onto Instagram and seeing what the algorithm shows me.
• 17:11
  Lauren: Um, and that way the algorithm can be pretty powerful.
• 17:14
  Lauren: Um, and just seeing what opportunities are out there, it's almost overwhelming um with how many opportunities there are.
• 17:21
  Lauren: I I ran across like the Asian and anime market through that, the Filipino Fest, um, and kind of just cold email people because I was um I was very much past the deadline of being a vendor there, but because I I feel like I've done a pretty good job of perfecting my cold email to people at this point, that people are giving me more of a chance than they would be if it was any other person, I would say.
• 17:50
  Sayde: Yeah, that is that's really great.
• 17:52
  Sayde: So then when you're at these events and you're selling books directly to people, are you are you, you know, is there any other kind of follow-up?
• 18:01
  Sayde: Are you building like um, you know, an Instagram following or your subsec following or any anything like that?
• 18:08
  Lauren: Yeah, so I've tried a couple of strategies and it's been interesting A, B testing what works the best and what is also the most sustainable for me, like financially as like a small business author.
• 18:20
  Lauren: Um, part of it that I've learned is that like people don't want to invest in you unless you give them something free or give them something of interest.
• 18:29
  Lauren: So at the Asian and anime market, part of that was like, hey, do you want a free sticker if you have if I'll give you the sticker if you sign up for my newsletter?
• 18:37
  Lauren: And that's how I bumped up my newsletter to how many people, and also like, or give me a follow on Instagram.
• 18:43
  Lauren: Um, and so it's a little bit about like I I think about this with what I've learned in marketing, it's mostly about a funnel, right?
• 18:52
  Lauren: So you're starting off with like the widest majority of people, like just anybody who will listen to you, and then you funnel that down to people who are interested about your product, and then you funnel that further down into like people who are willing to buy your product and funnel that further down into like your long-term like fans.
• 19:14
  Lauren: Um, and so uh like my marketing strategy is kind of like have like creating the easiest path downward into that funnel and gathering as many people um as possible because of course not everybody that you run across in a mark, like a market or a festival is going to say yes to you.
• 19:34
  Lauren: Um, but you want to create as little of obstacles downward so that they can become your like dedicated fan base.
• 19:44
  Sayde: No, I think that makes so much sense.
• 19:46
  Sayde: And so I love that.
• 19:48
  Sayde: That's just you know, I I'm it's reminding me of on the weekends in the summertime, I manage a farmer's market and I have this brand new vendor that has shown up this summer and they do like 3D printed stuff.
• 20:01
  Sayde: I don't know, like fidgets and stuff, stuff my daughter goes nuts for.
• 20:05
  Sayde: And they have every Saturday, they have a new freebie that is like follow us on Facebook.
• 20:12
  Sayde: And then if you show them like, yes, I'm following you on Facebook, then you get their little, their little free Totchke thing.
• 20:18
  Sayde: Um and I have been watching them build their business over the last, it's only been like eight weeks and how they're you know, grow how much they've grown on Facebook.
• 20:27
  Sayde: And so you're you're right, having something that you can give people for free that kind of attracts them to into your space, whether or not they stick around, it's still it's still an entry point.
• 20:38
  Sayde: And then what kind of follow-up are you doing, if any, you know, as you're building your newsletter subscribers?
• 20:45
  Sayde: Um, I I mean, I assume that eventually down the road there will be more books and you'll be able to kind of announce that and have, you know, and that'll be really exciting.
• 20:54
  Sayde: But um, you you are you participating in the kind of digital landscape at all?
• 21:00
  Lauren: Um not as much right now.
• 21:04
  Lauren: I think like with like learning what's been really interesting about this process is that not only that I'm a published author, I'm now a small business.
• 21:14
  Lauren: So it's kind of been like in some ways overwhelming, in some ways rewarding um to learn about all aspects of like the small business.
• 21:23
  Lauren: So trying to dedicate some time towards that.
• 21:26
  Lauren: Um but right now, like in terms of like my project plan and viewing out the next couple of months, it's going to be in-person events because I I want that, like the human interaction and also like people are more willing to have word of mouth when it comes to in person events.
• 21:42
  Lauren: Um, that's going to be really important.
• 21:45
  Lauren: And then I think as I move outward into the rest of the year, I would love to do kind of a like mini documenting series on what this process has been like because I think it can be so overwhelming.
• 21:59
  Lauren: For people who want to do um indie publishing or want to um market themselves and how do they do that in this writing realm?
• 22:09
  Lauren: Um and so I I just know that if before all this, I would have loved to see that series more like from the actual author.
• 22:19
  Sayde: Um and so I think it just could be helpful for absolutely kind of now that you've gone through, you know, and you're at the other end, what would have been helpful for you at the beginning?
• 22:27
  Sayde: Like what sort of content would you love to engage with?
• 22:29
  Sayde: I think that's that could be really helpful for so many authors out there.
• 22:33
  Sayde: And that's one of the things that we're always trying to do with this podcast is reach, you know, new authors, writers, wherever you are really in your writing publishing journey with information that is helpful, you know, not like plugging it into Chat GPT and what does Chat GPT say, but like what are the real people doing and and what has been successful and what has not been successful.
• 22:57
  Sayde: And so I love hearing about the in-person events.
• 22:59
  Sayde: And it also sounds to me like you enjoy that, right?
• 23:02
  Sayde: And that's such a huge piece of sustainable marketing.
• 23:05
  Sayde: Do the things that are also filling your cup back up that you are enjoying, that are, that are successful, that are selling books.
• 23:14
  Sayde: You know, if that's your end goal is to sell books, or if your end goal is to grow your newsletter base or whatever that may be, you know, making sure that your effort to reach that goal is also something that you love to do.
• 23:28
  Sayde: Because if you're standing at a table and you're like, oh my God, I hate talking to people, you know, that's gonna come across, right?
• 23:34
  Sayde: That energy is gonna come across and people are gonna be like, okay, I don't know what what that's about.
• 23:38
  Sayde: And it's one of the things going back to my farmer's market that I'm kind of always coaching people on is like, you have to be friendly, you have to get off your phone, you have to like engage with them.
• 23:47
  Sayde: Um, otherwise they're not gonna, you know, they're not gonna want to approach your table.
• 23:51
  Sayde: So I think that's really, I think that's really smart.
• 23:54
  Sayde: And if it's working for you, you know, just just keep going.
• 23:58
  Lauren: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:59
  Lauren: I I agree with that completely because that's the thing, is that there's so many ways to market yourself.
• 24:04
  Lauren: And do you think that you have to do it all or you have to be this like big book influencer?
• 24:10
  Lauren: But in reality, it's like you can be successful like in whatever way you do it.
• 24:14
  Lauren: Like I think even like, I don't know, if you're a teacher, like you love teaching about writing, like that's a way to market yourself too, you know?
• 24:21
  Lauren: Um, or like doing like little book talks at like local libraries.
• 24:28
  Lauren: Really?
• 24:28
  Lauren: Yeah, there's so many ways that you could market yourself.
• 24:32
  Sayde: So have you tried anything that you didn't like or that didn't work, or that you're like, nope, I won't, I won't be going back to that, or are you still just kind of testing the waters when it comes to marketing?
• 24:45
  Lauren: Yeah, I'm t I'm mostly testing the waters.
• 24:48
  Lauren: I don't think I've come across things that I particularly dislike.
• 24:54
  Lauren: I think right now it's mostly about like the 80-20 rule of like what is going to be the most effective for like the like a small amount of time, because like I said, like there's just so little time in the day and so much to learn about and so much to do.
• 25:11
  Lauren: And I I'm just mostly kind of focusing on like how can I reach people that care about my book?
• 25:16
  Lauren: Um, and also how do I make sales, you know?
• 25:20
  Lauren: Um, and so right now has been the in-person events.
• 25:25
  Lauren: I am still um still working on cold emailing um people.
• 25:32
  Lauren: I think right what would be interesting for me to do in the future is talk like link up with more like bookstagrammers, book talkers, um, people who have a built audience um for people who love books and people who have have the same audience as mine, like uh that read my kind of books.
• 25:51
  Lauren: Um that's something that I'm very interested in.
• 25:53
  Lauren: I think I've been I'm trying to get over the um putting myself out there um anxiety.
• 26:03
  Lauren: Yeah.
• 26:04
  Lauren: Um, because I I think I could do well in person, but when it comes to digital online, I'm always afraid of somebody perceiving it as, oh, who is this random person emailing me right now?
• 26:15
  Sayde: You know?
• 26:15
  Sayde: Yeah, I think that's a great point because when you're in person, they can tell that you're obviously real and you're genuine and you really care about this.
• 26:24
  Sayde: And it's hard to break through that when you're just cold calling or kind of reaching out to random influencers, um, that yeah, or podcast hosts or you know, things like that.
• 26:33
  Sayde: That's that's definitely more tricky.
• 26:35
  Sayde: Um, now I recall seeing on Instagram a few weeks ago that you got songs from Mahalia in some bookstores or in a bookstore.
• 26:43
  Sayde: Yeah, is that true?
• 26:44
  Sayde: Okay, so talk to me about that.
• 26:46
  Sayde: How did that how did that come about?
• 26:48
  Lauren: Yeah, so it was um also an in-person interaction because I've been like messy, like again, cold emailing books stores, and some have been interested, and it was some just kind of fizzled out.
• 27:01
  Lauren: Um, but I was walking around um my city in Salt Lake, um, and just realized that I had walked past a bookstore.
• 27:10
  Lauren: And I was like, okay, I'm just gonna take a chance, you know, like who knows what could happen.
• 27:16
  Lauren: Um, and so just went up to the went inside, went up to the uh the bookstore owner and was like, hey, do you uh stalk local authors?
• 27:25
  Lauren: And he was like, Oh yeah, I do.
• 27:27
  Lauren: And um, this is kind of the process for it.
• 27:30
  Lauren: We reviewed the books just to make sure that um it's like appropriate.
• 27:35
  Lauren: Um and so I gave him a free copy of my book.
• 27:39
  Lauren: Um, and he uh uh gave it to one of his workers to review it.
• 27:45
  Lauren: Um, and the uh worker said, like, yes, we'd love to stock it.
• 27:50
  Lauren: And also I have been, I read the book and I love it.
• 27:55
  Lauren: The writing is so good, the writing is so rich, I love the characters and everything, and I'm gonna talk about it to kind of everybody who comes in.
• 28:03
  Lauren: And so that's kind of what I mean by like the in-person interaction and having like a built audience that like really has your back is that like once people believe in your product, they're willing to like go out of their way for you, right?
• 28:19
  Sayde: They're your little like book warriors.
• 28:21
  Sayde: I love, and I I want to emphasize this.
• 28:24
  Sayde: I love that you were walking around Salt Lake City and you walked past the bookstore and you were like, oh hey, what if I just because that local piece of marketing is hard work, like it is legitimate hard work, right?
• 28:38
  Sayde: You kind of have to hustle, but it's also so often overlooked.
• 28:43
  Sayde: And uh uh there's a new book out, think, oh my gosh, it just came out, Penny Sanzaveri's new book, um, uh Think Local, Sell Global, where she just has a bunch of tips on how to sell your book locally.
• 28:57
  Sayde: And don't overlook that.
• 28:59
  Sayde: That is your that is your community.
• 29:01
  Sayde: If you want your book in bookstores, go to your local and regional bookstores and tell them you're a local author.
• 29:09
  Sayde: They're much more likely to carry your book than you know, a national chain that that may find it in the Ingram database, but probably is not even looking for it.
• 29:21
  Sayde: But when you can walk in and introduce yourself and show your product, and then particularly when you've invested, you know, money for sure, but also creative energy into making sure that that final product is beautiful, is professional, is gonna meet all of the industry standards that a bookstore wants to see, that's that's gonna go above and beyond for that, you know, because if you had walked in and had, you know, an unedited book that was printed on Amazon, no offense to Amazon, but bookstores and Amazon are not friends.
• 29:55
  Sayde: Um that's a big thing I've heard.
• 29:57
  Sayde: Have an ISBN number, you know, you didn't have your uh book title on the spine because you designed your cover yourself and you didn't know that that was a thing.
• 30:07
  Sayde: Like all of those pieces that would be very easy to, if you were doing this yourself, to just not know.
• 30:13
  Sayde: Um, you know, and you walk in with that book, they're gonna be like, no, we can't, you know, we can't stock this.
• 30:19
  Sayde: It's it doesn't meet our, it doesn't meet our standards.
• 30:21
  Sayde: But when you when you do invest in a team that can do that for you, or like you said, just the the knowledge base and like learning these things as you go to make sure that your end product is really professional, that will go, that will go a long way.
• 30:36
  Sayde: So I I just feel like I tell my authors all the time, just go into the bookstore, just go into the library, introduce yourself, show them your book, show them that you're a real person, you know, particularly if it's a bookstore that you shop at, right?
• 30:52
  Sayde: And then, you know, strategy number two, if you have, if you do get your book in a bookstore, rally your team, your friends, your family, whomever, to go and buy the book at the bookstore, support the bookstore, support you as the author, and show them that there's an audience for this.
• 31:10
  Sayde: You know, that can be that can be really huge.
• 31:14
  Lauren: Yeah, exactly.
• 31:15
  Lauren: Like I would say, even like at uh the Asian and anime market, one of the um people who went up to me, they're like, Oh, I really want to read this.
• 31:23
  Lauren: Is it at a library?
• 31:24
  Lauren: And I was like, you know what?
• 31:26
  Lauren: If you request the book to be at your local library, it has a much easier time getting in.
• 31:31
  Lauren: Yeah.
• 31:31
  Lauren: And so I think even like small movements like that can be a huge point of getting your book out there.
• 31:39
  Sayde: Absolutely, absolutely.
• 31:40
  Sayde: And then it's at your local library.
• 31:42
  Sayde: I'm imagining that, I'm assuming that a lot of these events that you've been doing are somewhat localized to the Salt Lake area.
• 31:50
  Sayde: Um, and so, you know, that's another piece is like you're not having to fly across the country to go to Comic-Con or whatever.
• 31:57
  Sayde: It's what is happening here that I might have, you know, that that might share an audience with me.
• 32:03
  Sayde: Um, that's just thinking localized is so valuable, especially at this, especially at this stage of the game.
• 32:10
  Sayde: And it's so rewarding because you you get to you get to be a part of those sales and those interactions and get to know your audience face to face, which is really very rewarding.
• 32:24
  Sayde: And I cannot stress that enough that you know, when you all of this is happening online and you're trying to build your newsletter base, that's great too.
• 32:30
  Sayde: I am not knocking that, but those those are just names and emails, and it's not it's not quite the same as like an in-person interaction.
• 32:41
  Lauren: Yeah, absolutely.
• 32:42
  Lauren: Like I think I've learned a lot that like I used to think my demographic was um probably like girls in college, like about like 21 to 24.
• 32:53
  Lauren: But what I'm learning now is that my demographic is much older than I realized.
• 32:58
  Lauren: Um, and so that's been actually very powerful to learn and like knowing how I need to shift and like kind of making um plans on like, okay, so my demographic is like women in their 30s to 40s.
• 33:13
  Lauren: Um, where are these women hanging out?
• 33:15
  Lauren: You know, uh it's not like they're like younger girls might be like at like a specific location.
• 33:22
  Lauren: Maybe these moms are at like a wine bar, you know, and maybe I should host like a a a book night at the a wine bar, you know.
• 33:30
  Sayde: Um and that's information about your audience that you can't get from Amazon sales.
• 33:36
  Sayde: You know, people who are buying your book online, and I know it is available everywhere books are sold online, but you don't you you don't get any of that customer data the way that you do when you're selling in person, which is really powerful.
• 33:48
  Lauren: Yeah.
• 33:49
  Sayde: Yeah, that's awesome.
• 33:50
  Sayde: So um let's talk about the next the future of of your uh business.
• 33:58
  Sayde: And you know, you've you've mentioned this, this is like, okay, this is like having a small business, which it is.
• 34:02
  Sayde: And I think that when authors think about it and approach it like that, they can, you know, they can be more successful.
• 34:08
  Sayde: Um, because definitely you got to take on all the aspects of running a small business.
• 34:12
  Sayde: And so with that, you mentioned in the beginning, this is a collection, this is the summer book, and that there are more to come.
• 34:19
  Sayde: So, where are you in the process of that?
• 34:21
  Sayde: And do you have are you finding time to write while you're busy running your small business?
• 34:27
  Lauren: Um, I would say like the last two months, I have been focusing on more so the business aspect of it.
• 34:33
  Lauren: Just kind of wanted to put my full force into that.
• 34:37
  Lauren: But I think like in a week or two, I I really need to re-strategize, re-strategize my time just because I'm a writer.
• 34:47
  Lauren: I can't let go of that, you know.
• 34:49
  Lauren: Like, of course I'm a business owner and a writer, but like I'm a writer first and foremost.
• 34:53
  Lauren: So I think in the next couple of weeks, I'm going to be focusing more so on writing and incorporating that into my schedule.
• 35:01
  Lauren: Um, and so it's hard.
• 35:04
  Lauren: I have, I don't know, sneak peek.
• 35:07
  Lauren: This is I have two books I really want to focus in on writing.
• 35:10
  Lauren: And if I write them at the same time, that's great.
• 35:13
  Lauren: Um, but yeah, the second book that I want to write is um, of course, the fall anthology and coming up with that.
• 35:20
  Lauren: And I'd love to release that um next year, but we'll see.
• 35:24
  Lauren: Um, but the other book I want to write about is um more so this like small town kind of something wrong with the small town, like a kind of mystery-oriented, but also like exploring Filipino heritage um and the like the effects of like um like colonialism from the Philippines and how that affected the Filipino um diaspora.
• 35:52
  Lauren: Um, so it's uh there's some horror elements, some mystery, some magic um involved.
• 36:00
  Lauren: And so I've been this has been a book in my head since like actually this was like my senior project back in college, and so it's evolved over the years, and I just really would love to work on it.
• 36:12
  Lauren: Yeah, so that sounds fabulous.
• 36:14
  Lauren: Yeah, so that's very exciting.
• 36:16
  Sayde: So, where can folks go to find you, go to find your books if they wanted to, you know, kind of follow along on your journey?
• 36:22
  Sayde: Where would where should we send them?
• 36:26
  Lauren: I am Lauren Demagus on everything.
• 36:28
  Lauren: Thankfully I got all like usernames under that.
• 36:32
  Lauren: Um, so LaurenDemagas.com, LaurenDemagas on Facebook, at Lauren Demagus on Instagram.
• 36:38
  Lauren: Those are the main platforms that I use to communicate with everybody.
• 36:41
  Lauren: Um, I will say uh sign up for my newsletter because I give updates on where I am um on my publishing and writing process.
• 36:50
  Lauren: And I also do uh cool, like free quiet writing hours that anybody who writes can join in um as well as run um online classes.
• 37:01
  Lauren: So yeah, follow me on those platforms.
• 37:04
  Lauren: I send all the information there.
• 37:06
  Sayde: Awesome.
• 37:06
  Sayde: And we'll make sure that all of the links are in the show notes wherever you're listening or watching this uh this podcast, which reminds me if you've enjoyed this interview, uh if you would like to hear more interviews like this, if you just enjoy kind of the nitty-gritty, honest advice when it comes to book publishing and promotion, be sure to like and subscribe and follow along on our podcast anywhere that you listen to or watch your podcasts.
• 37:30
  Sayde: We're on all of them.
• 37:31
  Sayde: Um and we like to, you know, we like to have conversations like this where we can hear what's working, what's not working, what you know, what was what surprised you in your journey, what advice would you have for other authors, all of that, because there's a lot of them out there that are trying to sift through the noise.
• 37:48
  Sayde: So um definitely like, subscribe to our podcast.
• 37:51
  Sayde: And thank you so much, Lauren, for agreeing to come on and and share your journey.
• 37:55
  Sayde: I know um it's I I don't play favorites with my authors because that wouldn't be that wouldn't be fair, but um working with you was always such a pleasure.
• 38:06
  Sayde: Like I said, just you know, you were really prepared um for every interaction and every meeting, and your your feedback was always so precise.
• 38:14
  Sayde: And, you know, if definitely um if you ever did release any kind of tutorials or videos on on how to how to do this for the first time as an author, you know, we would also love to share that with our with our authors because um I think that you were that sort of poster child of of making the process really smooth on the production end because uh because you were always um just you were just always on it, you know.
• 38:42
  Sayde: There was never any of that, I don't know, I'm not quite feeling it feedback, which I love, and I will, you know, I'll take and be like, okay, how do we get, you know, how do we get you to feel it?
• 38:51
  Sayde: Uh, but when but when you can be really specific and uh in you know evaluating text and evaluating artwork, and it it's just it was fabulous to work with you.
• 39:01
  Sayde: And um, I'm so I've been just enjoying kind of watching your journey unfold on all of the channels and you know, seeing that you're also having fun and being successful in the marketing, I think is really, really great.
• 39:13
  Sayde: So again, just thanks so much for being with us today.
• 39:16
  Lauren: Yeah, thank you so much.
• 39:18
  Lauren: And I I've loved working with you guys, it's been really great, and so I really appreciate it.