Latest / Journey to the Fringe / We're ranking assholes (part 3 of 5)

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We're ranking assholes (part 3 of 5) · Journey to the Fringe

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From the unexplained to the mundane. Come join
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us on a journey to the fringe. Hello and welcome
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to Journey to the Fringe. Hey, we're behind you.
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No, never mind. We're here in our podcast areas.
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Just ranking assholes again. We got a lot of
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assholes ahead of us. It's so much fun. It is
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so much fun. And weirdly, like, a lot of episodes
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that, like, we're, I don't think we, like, think
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about our episodes as much as we should. Outside
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of, like, these are episodes that we've covered.
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Well, not like this. Yeah. Like, in this much.
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So it's, it's, I think it's a lot of fun. And
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especially, like. It's refreshing. This gives
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you guys, like, great things to go back to, too,
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and realize that we are just great podcasters.
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Like, just accept it. It's true. It's very true.
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So I'll remind you all because we're in part
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three of what is likely a five -part series,
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but I need to stop speculating on how many numbers
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because I've probably gotten it wrong multiple
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times in here. Anyhow. We are ranking every one
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of the people that we've covered in a asshole
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ranking based on a score out of 50, based on
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five different factors. Deception and fabrication,
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vibes, harm, grift, and legacy. We have started
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from the bottom. We're working our way up. We
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are at number 29 on the list. And Chelsea, are
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you ready for this? Taylor's 29. Yeah. Who is
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it? Who is it? Alistair Crowley. at season one
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episode 17. oh i have him at oh much well kind
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of lower than yours at 36. now crowley the self
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-styled great beast was a prolific occultist
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and founder of the lima His achievement was shaping
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modern esotericism and influencing generations
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of mystics, artists, and counterculture movements.
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His asshole factors come from exploiting followers,
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fabricating mystical results, and fostering manipulative,
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fault -like environments that often left adherents
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psychologically scarred. And that's probably
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the part I didn't put enough ranking into, is
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he probably did hurt quite a few people, but
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I gave him an overall score of 26. He has very
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high legacy. He is still talked about today,
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still taken seriously. And whenever we say with
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a K, it is because of Alistair Crowley, whether
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it be magic or demons or like... Demons with
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a K. With a K. But I gave him very low deception
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because I think he believed pretty much everything
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he was talking about. He got weird vibes. I got
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a six on vibes. He did have some harms. I gave
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him a four and he did have some grift, but that's,
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he got a 26 for me. He got the lowest on grift
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for me. And you know what? I still think he made
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some money from it. So I couldn't put him that
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low. I think that was his whole thing, actually.
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So I don't know why I scored him so low on Griff.
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Probably because I thought he should be higher
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on the others. But I gave him two low on legacies.
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So he could be up a couple notches on mine because
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you're right. He does still have a very high
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legacy. I'm not sure why I ranked him at a three.
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That's a fair point. He definitely doesn't seem
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like he should be at a three. No, that like is
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a name. Or if you say Alistair Crowley, there's
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a good chance people know who you're talking.
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yeah most people we say demon with an a and magic
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with a k yeah and everybody knows what we're
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talking about it's the alistair crowley experience
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so he could probably be ranked as a higher legacy
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than bruce jernan So yeah, I might rank him actually
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probably around the exact same as you if I were
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to kick him up some notches on the legacy because
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that was definitely a misnomer on my behalf.
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Okay. And of course, Copilot has put him at sixth
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on their list with an overall score of 42. You
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know, I don't disagree with that. No, and I do
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think this is somebody who could be ranked in
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so far of a spectrum. Yeah. No, I completely
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agree with that. Oh, and they didn't put down
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why. So we just got accepted. I think we just
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got accepted. It's up there. Yeah. Yeah. Well,
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that was quick. Okay. Next up, I have at 28,
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Jamie Spears. Season three, episodes 36, 38,
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and 40. And I really forgot that we did three
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episodes on Britney Spears. Yeah. It was a lot.
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Those were some fun episodes. Do you want to
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tell us who Jamie Spears is? I'm going to tell
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you who Jamie Spears is. I wonder how many people
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who didn't listen to Britney Spears were expecting
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that to be there or were wondering who Jamie
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Spears was. Spears is infamous for controlling
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Britney Spears' finances and autonomy under a
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conservatorship. His achievement was legal authority
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over one of the world's biggest pop stars, his
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daughter. His asshole actions include exploiting
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her career for profit, causing long -term psychological
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harm, and symbolizing systematic abuse of conservatorship
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law. I gave him overall a 27. Highest score being
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in Deception and Fabrication at an 8 and a 7
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in Vibes. But Harm and Griff were both at 5.
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Legacy's at 2 because I don't think this is out
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of the ordinary for the Hollywood community.
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Yeah. What was your total, sorry? 27. He's at
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29 for me. Okay. Legacy, very low because without
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Britney Spears, you wouldn't know who he was.
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And just overall looking at... who we're ranking
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I mean no and I I do think the outlier no and
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when you're talking about like conservatorships
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I don't think they're gonna ever call it like
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the Jamie Spears protocol or something like that
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it's not out of the ordinary for Hollywood unfortunately
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Yeah. Deception and fabrication. I mean, I gave
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it a five because there was some. I put it high.
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And this is the whole thing. These episodes weren't
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really about Jamie Spears. They were all about
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Britney Spears. Britney Spears, yes. So you don't
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know that much about him. But unfortunately,
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and this is like, even whenever you're looking
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at this outside of court proceedings, Jamie's
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a fairly private individual. I gave him a nine
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on vibes. Yeah. Six on harm. The only thing holding
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him back in my mind is it's one individual. Exactly.
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That's literally what I was just going to say.
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And I gave him eight for a grift because he,
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boy, did he ever take advantage of her. Yeah.
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So yeah. But again, it's limited to one person.
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So that's why I kept it lower. But it's a very
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extreme rift on that one person. I get that.
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Yeah, yeah. So I have him at 29. So yeah, I think
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we think very similarly about him as well. What
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does AI say you? AI says 16th overall with a
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score of 40. Okay, so... Based on how high they're
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ranking everyone. And again, didn't give me a
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description of it, but his highest scores were
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in vibes and harm, which makes a lot of sense
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from what we were discussing. Yeah. Yeah. I think
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that score, given how high they're giving the
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total for everyone, I think it is on par with
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us. Okay. Chelsea, next up at my 27th, and I
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think we're going to have to talk a lot about
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this one because I think I did a poor job of
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putting it in our spreadsheet. Yeah. And I think
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it's going to change how. What do you think I'm
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going to say now that I said that? For the next
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person? Yes. How you put it on our spreadsheet.
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I don't know. At 27th on my list, surprisingly
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enough, at 27 as a score. This is like the median
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right here. I have Admiral Bird and Kin. Oh,
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I was wondering where he was going to come up
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for you. And I'm really curious how you took
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that as well for how I wrote that. Well, why
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don't we read who he's about and I'll tell you
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what mine is. Because I keep screaming mine out.
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He's from season three, episode four. Thank you.
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You're welcome. Sometimes you get to know some
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things you don't. Admiral Byrd was a polar explorer
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whose expeditions were later mythologized into
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hollow earth lore. His achievements were genuine
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exploration and military service. His asshole
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factors come from how his name was co -opted
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and defabricated. Conspiracy narratives, though
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Byrd himself didn't exploit believers directly,
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but his grandson freaking did. And that's why
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I put and kin. i didn't actually pay attention
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to the end yes and i know that's likely where
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that came up and when i was trying to figure
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out who that was and i distinctly remember this
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guy because he wears such weird suits admiral
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bird's like relative who talks about him still
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and griffs off him could not find anything about
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him can't remember who he is trying to figure
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it out still but he showed up here Anyhow, I
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gave him a 27. Highest being Grift because of
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that family member. After that, Legacy because
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Admiral Bird comes up. Especially when you talk
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about Hollow Earth and Antarctica. Although those
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aren't the biggest conspiracy worlds, so they're
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not that big. It has to be one of my favorite
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stories. Yeah. Yeah. He scored highest for me
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in Legacy. He has a total of 17 for me. Yeah,
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and that's because you were only taking Admiral
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Byrd into account. I did not even... And I should
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have mentioned that. I didn't even read him.
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It's definitely there. I didn't even read it,
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though. Because was his grandson in our episode?
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I believe he was. I was trying to find it because,
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again, we've done two episodes, and I started
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listening to the Antarctica one, and I couldn't
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find him in there. So I think it was the Hull
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of Worth episode where he showed up. i can't
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remember and we don't know and i honestly i can't
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even remember what his name was because i was
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trying to find it and couldn't so it's no you're
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right actually now that i'm thinking about it
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somebody leaked his like put his journals out
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yeah yeah and then like he is somebody who goes
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around he does the tours with it and like his
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entire thing is unrelated to admiral bird so
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and he wears a three -piece suit he's very weird
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Oh, this sounds very, very familiar, but I don't
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remember. It's season three. Deception and Fabrication,
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I put at a five. And it's not because of the
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story. It's because of the spin on it now. Yeah.
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And the implications. There's nothing wrong with
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the story, as I'm sure he tells it. It's now
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the evidence towards something that it's being
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used for. Vibes are a two. I don't think he was
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necessarily an asshole. Harm? Meh, it's low.
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Grift? Meh, it's low for Admiral Byrd. Yeah,
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you're not taking into account and kin. Yeah,
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no, I was not taking into account and kin. And
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hey, neither did Copilot, because this is the
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second lowest on their list, and clearly somewhere
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where, as people in my life say, I need to communicate
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better. No, it's not. It was right there for
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me to read, so it's no fault of yours. Yeah,
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but also I could have actually just made it the
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kin, but I couldn't remember the episode, so
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I didn't put it that way. I wanted to make it
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like this is a group thing, but. It's not that
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low for like, he's low for me. He's not bottom
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of the list though, because of the lore. Yeah.
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And that, that person afterwards takes advantage
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of the lore and then raises the stakes. And that's
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why I get where you're coming from. Yeah. And
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co -pilot got the exact same interpretation as
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you. Cause it's the second lowest on their list.
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See, and I just didn't remember the like kin.
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having anything to do with it so if i would have
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remembered that and listened to the episode you
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very well could have been higher okay now next
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up on my list at 26 is ed walters of the golf
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breeze incident season 5 last year episode 50
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what was the score you gave him again ed walters
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got a 29 and 26 oh i have him at 29 nice wow
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tied 29 29 Walters claimed to photograph UFOs
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over Gulf Breeze, Florida, sparking a wave of
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sightings. His achievement was briefly convincing
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UFO researchers and media of his story. His asshole
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actions include staging photos with props, profiting
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from books and tours, and misleading communities
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with fabricated evidence. So overall, I gave
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him a 29, as we just said. high as being deception
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second highest being vibes and grift at seven
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and legacy i gave him a three because it is still
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somewhat remembered and especially he had those
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books and he did have some harm but not a lot
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i gave him a four yeah i'm pretty much right
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on par eight seven four seven three I'm 98363.
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Oh yeah, pretty much the same. We're a point
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off on most things. He reminds me a lot of Billy
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Meyer. Yes, but without the continued story.
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Yeah, without the higher harm and higher grift
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legacy. He's just like a shittier Billy Meyer.
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Although Copilot didn't give me a description
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of him, they put him at... 33 on their list with
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a score of 34 86677 so right basically the exact
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same thing we just said interesting this is the
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first one we all agree on yeah pretty much i'm
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noting it we all agree co -pilot gave ed walters
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a higher legacy that's about it okay and chelsea
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next up on the list at 25 and probably the most
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forgettable of the people we've covered just
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because It was in passing, and it's L .A. Marzulli.
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Okay, this is the one that I don't, like, I know
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L .A. Marzulli. What is he in? What episode?
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He's the Giants guy. Oh, season three, episode
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60. He's the Giants guy. So then he's high up
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there for Deception. Yeah. Let's give him an
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eight. Let's vibe him at... He's talking giants.
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Alay Marzulli is a Christian UFO theorist who
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promotes Nephilim and End Times narratives. His
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achievement is carving out a niche in biblical
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fringe circles. Asshole Factor comes from fabricating
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biblical UFO connections, monetizing fear about
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books, fear through books and DVDs, and misleading
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believers and pseudoscientific claims. With pseudoscientific
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claims. Have we done a full episode? No, and
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it was just when we were talking about the Afghan
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giant. Or the giant of Kabul. Is that what it
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is? He came up as the person who brought those
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stories forward. Kandahar. Kandahar giant. Thank
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you. He was the one who brought it forward on
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Coast to Coast AM. So we haven't fully covered
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him, but like he is just somebody who's willing
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to take anything and just run with it. So long
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as it fits his like Christian Nephilim area.
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Season three, episode 60. If I didn't say it,
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just making sure. gave him eight on vibes and
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eight on grift seven on deception four on harm
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because like this isn't something that's that
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yeah three on legacy because he's not gonna be
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remembered and we had trouble remembering who
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he was both of us Now that you say that, yeah.
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And he's forgettable to me because it's not something
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I'm like too interested in. We're not big on
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giants. I've heard his name over and over again.
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I will agree with your ranking. I do think he's
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lower on the harm. Yeah, giant people don't do
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that much harm. No. These are more people that
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you see just for the grift. Pretty much. Just
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for, you know, this is a niche nobody talks about.
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I'm an expert on it. I can get on coast to coast.
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I can write books because no one else is really
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doing it. Yeah. I fully agree with all that.
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Yeah. So I agree with your ranking on that one,
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actually. And yeah, this was one you did not
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rank, correct? Because you could not remember
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who this was. Right. Yeah. If I would have gone
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to the Giants... And it's funny because that's
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your episode, too. Yeah. I don't remember talking
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about them. Yeah. Copilot has him at 21 with
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a 37. 87787, so a fairly consistent 7 .5, I guess.
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Let's see if they gave me. They did not give
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me a description, and I think that's basically
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what I said. Yeah, I'm in total agree with what
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you said. I'm glad you remembered them. Next
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up, at 24, Chelsea, I have Robert Bigelow. Ooh,
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I think you have him a lot higher than I had
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him. Yes, but I think we're very easily going
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to talk about why. And he was actually lower,
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but I was reading a book where his name came
16:55
up a lot and I was like, oh, this makes a lot
16:58
of sense where I have grift way too low. So why
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don't you give us the description for him? Bigelow
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is a billionaire who funded UFO and paranormal
17:06
research through Bigelow Aerospace and the National
17:09
Institute for Discovery Science. His achievement
17:12
was bringing serious money into fringe research,
17:15
including Skinwalker Ranch investigations. His
17:18
asshole actions include exploiting believers
17:21
by controlling findings, creating paywalled mystique,
17:25
and skewing research towards sensationalism rather
17:29
than transparency. So, the reason he is so high
17:31
on my list. First off he is a billionaire so
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vibes just immediately get very high. He got
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an 8 on vibes. He got a 7 on grift and it might
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not seem like it because he's putting money into
17:44
paranormal research but he has been getting government
17:48
contracts through this including nids. Including
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likely he's getting money from To The Stars Academy
17:55
for several things that I've recently learned
17:57
about. But anyhow, he's in this for still a profit
18:01
in my mind, which is why he's still high on Korea.
18:04
He was also getting the government grants for
18:07
the aerospace technology that he was working
18:10
on. Yeah, for building those like expandable
18:12
tents in space, basically. And I gave him a very
18:17
high legacy because he's going to be remembered
18:20
in this community. Yes, absolutely. He has made
18:23
a mark on this community. I have him at a five
18:26
for legacy. He's not really done anything himself.
18:30
He's just kind of put the money. He hires people.
18:34
Yeah. Yeah. If I had money, I would probably
18:37
see myself doing the same thing. I remember the
18:40
episode. We had a little bit differing opinions
18:43
on it as well. You made some very good points.
18:46
that I didn't originally see, which kind of swayed
18:50
me in this as well. He's still fairly low to
18:53
me, though. And I do still have him low on harm
18:58
and deception. On deception, I have him as a
19:01
two. On harm, I have him a four. Yeah, I think
19:04
I have him very low on deception as well. I have
19:07
him at a two deception. But that doesn't mean
19:11
I don't. I think he likes the thing he's looking
19:14
at, but he needs to make a profit off it. So
19:17
that's where everything comes from. Yeah, no,
19:19
you're completely right. And I remember that
19:22
how the episode was going. And it's something
19:24
that I didn't necessarily consider in the research
19:28
that I was doing as well. Yeah. With the kind
19:33
of millionaire billionaire aspect to him. It's
19:37
something I don't really want to see and you
19:39
force me to see. Even in my numbers right here,
19:43
I didn't take that into account, unfortunately.
19:46
More for the fact that I don't want to because
19:49
of the implications that it does have. So if
19:52
I were to take it into account, he would be much
19:56
higher. And sorry, where is he on your list?
19:58
I scored him at a 22. 22, and what's that put
20:01
him at? 33. Okay. And you're actually even lower
20:05
than Copilot because Copilot has him at 28 with
20:08
35. Any explanation or no? Let's take a look.
20:13
Yes. Bigelow scores high in Grift and Legacy
20:16
for funding UFO research in Skinwalker Ranch.
20:18
His deception is moderate, more enabler than
20:22
Hoaxer. His vibes are middling, seen as eccentric
20:24
billionaire. He's held back by moderate harm
20:27
since his influence amplified nonsense but didn't
20:30
ruin lives. You all make very good points. And
20:33
it's not something that shows up in my marking
20:35
at all, unfortunately. It should. Yeah, I know.
20:38
Yeah. Yeah. Which is the same way I did my episode.
20:43
This is my first Bigfoot person, Chelsea. Hold
20:48
on. Who do I have to come up? There's one person
20:53
I still have fairly low that I'm surprised has
20:55
not come up. Is it the ketchup? It's Dr. Melbo
21:00
Ketchup, yes. I re -listened to the episode.
21:04
Season 5, episode 8. And I had to laugh because
21:07
I searched. Her name wrong and Ketchup came up
21:10
on the episode. I did listen to her. Ketchup
21:17
is a veterinarian and geneticist who claimed
21:20
to have sequenced Bigfoot DNA. Her achievement
21:22
was briefly gaining credibility in cryptid circles
21:25
by presenting her findings as scientific proof.
21:28
Her asshole action was publishing flawed, non
21:30
-peer -reviewed work and monetizing it, misleading
21:33
believers and damaging scientific discourse around
21:36
cryptids. Overall, I gave her a fairly high deception
21:41
and fabrication. Eight high fives, especially
21:44
once you start to get into the pushback era for
21:48
her. Six for harm, just because she has completely
21:52
damaged Bigfoot research. Seven for grift. I
21:57
don't know if she made money, and that's the
22:00
thing where maybe that should be lower. But she
22:03
went on so many podcasts about this afterwards
22:06
that I was like, she's really trying to monetize
22:08
this. And then I gave her a two for legacy because
22:12
I don't think this is going to be remembered
22:13
at all. But at the same time, Bigfoot people
22:17
are going to use this research as support for
22:21
their position for a long time. Position 23 on
22:24
my list, 31 overall for a score. Yeah, I ranked
22:27
her at a 34. I ranked her a little bit higher
22:30
on the deception and fabrication. I gave her
22:32
a 10. Yeah, that's fair. She was really, really
22:36
bad. For somebody who should know better. Yeah,
22:39
I scored her a little bit skewed as per what
22:43
you gave her on harm and legacy. And I realized
22:46
I probably need to maybe switch those around.
22:49
And sorry, I think I missed it. Season five,
22:51
episode eight. Yeah, I gave her a two for harm,
22:55
but I agree with you. I think she did a lot of
22:59
harm within the community is what you're thinking.
23:02
I was just thinking in general, she didn't hurt
23:05
anybody. But yeah, I would agree with that. And
23:08
therefore, I gave her a six for legacy. I'm going
23:11
to bring her down a couple. Still evening it
23:14
out at 34, I would say. But, I mean, she did
23:18
leave a lasting legacy on the fact of what she
23:21
did. She will. Bigfoot research will not be taken
23:24
seriously. And people within the Bigfoot community
23:27
are going to hold her up for a long time as this
23:31
research paper. You still hear it talked about.
23:34
No, and I agree. I probably scored it a little
23:36
low for legacy, too. She's a total asshole, though.
23:39
She's definitely a total asshole that belongs
23:41
on this list. Co -pilot, of course, gave her
23:44
a... Let's take a look. Oh, you know what? 34,
23:49
putting her at 32 on their list. Wow. Yeah, I
23:54
gave it a 31. We're all kind of in agreement,
23:57
and I have an explanation. Ketchum scores high
23:59
in deception for her flawed Bigfoot DNA study.
24:03
Her grift is moderate, monetizing through publications.
24:07
Her legacy is middling, remembered in cryptid
24:10
circles. Her vibes are middling, seen as defensive,
24:12
but not universally toxic. She's held back by
24:15
moderate harm since her claims misled but didn't
24:18
devastate. Yeah. So another one we all agree.
24:21
Pretty much. Yeah. Okay. Number 22, Chelsea.
24:25
Who do you got? Prepare yourself for this. Who
24:28
do I have at 22? Okay, I'm at my 22. Okay. George
24:32
Norrie. No. Season 4, episode 12. Okay. George
24:39
Norrie for me. I gave him a 32 overall. Why don't
24:41
you read your description and then we'll talk.
24:45
Oh, I just X'd out of my sheet. Okay, I'll do
24:48
it really quick and you can get it open. Nori
24:52
is best known as the longtime host of Coast to
24:55
Coast AM, the radio show that became the biggest
24:58
platform for UFOs, paranormal claims, and fridge
25:02
personalities. His achievement is keeping fringe
25:05
topics in mainstream circulation, giving airtime
25:09
to countless voices. His asshole factor comes
25:12
from platforming dubious claims without vetting,
25:15
profiting from sensationalism, and normalizing
25:18
pseudoscience for millions of listeners. yep
25:21
i gave him overall a 32 and he scored high in
25:27
three categories vibes i got bad vibes from him
25:31
i harm i gave him a seven and most of all he
25:35
is my highest tied for highest at a 10 grift
25:40
Because, man, is he always trying to make money.
25:43
Man, yeah. And he, yeah, I would agree that he's
25:47
high for the grift. I have him at a 10 for grift.
25:50
And... Oh, sorry. And last and most importantly,
25:53
I gave him a three for both of deception and
25:56
fabrication, because again, I do think he's lazy
25:58
and he's not actually making up the grift. He's
26:01
just accepting. Exactly. I put him at a three
26:05
for grift. And importantly, three for legacy,
26:08
because I think once he retires, people are going
26:10
to. I gave him three for legacy as well. He's
26:12
not making a mark on what he's doing. I think
26:15
a lot of people are getting really pissed off
26:17
with him. I also think he's on par as well. He's
26:22
taken over for Art Bell. Oh, hold on. Oh, you're
26:27
on my list, yeah. That's why you agree. How much
26:31
do you agree? On almost everything. Son of a
26:35
bitch. I gave him a two for deception and fabrication.
26:39
Yeah, because he's doing it himself. He just
26:41
is too lazy to stop people. Is he harming anybody?
26:44
Probably. It should probably be higher because,
26:48
well, they say they're the highest syndicated
26:51
talk show radio program or some shit like that.
26:54
But how many syndications are actually out there
26:57
nowadays that people are listening to? Grift,
27:00
I have it a seven. Yes. Legacy, I have it a zero.
27:03
And so to continue my train of thought, he's
27:06
coming off Art Bell. Yeah, people always will
27:08
remember Art Bell. Art Bell. they will not made
27:12
something memorable art bell didn't even want
27:15
nori to take over i don't think they got along
27:17
at all no deception and fabrication i put it
27:21
at two because i honestly think he has no interest
27:23
in the people that he has on the show and he
27:26
puts no real thought into the responses that
27:29
he's ever had they're all in agreeance no and
27:32
the only thing i know about him is he's conservative
27:34
yeah because Whenever he gets people on who have
27:37
anything that might be progressive, he shits
27:41
on them. And that's it. He had somebody on who
27:44
was like a vegetarian and he kept asking like
27:46
the stupidest questions. But when I was listening
27:50
to it, it's like he didn't even listen. He might
27:52
have had somebody give him some questions to
27:54
ask, but that's why he gets low on deception
27:57
for me because... he couldn't like what is he
28:00
deceiving like he has no interest in what he's
28:03
doing vibes too because he's boring as fuck he
28:06
told the same stories over and over again there
28:09
is nothing intrinsically interesting about the
28:12
man at all he burnt his throat on like a hot
28:15
hot pocket once and we heard about it forever
28:20
that was an entire like five episodes harm Two,
28:25
who is he harming? Grift, it's up there. Seven.
28:28
Legacy, zero. Thirteen. Everybody he harms is
28:31
over 70 years old. That's the thing. So, like,
28:34
it's not going to have lasting impact on society.
28:36
Here's the thing. He's low on my list, but not
28:39
because he's not an asshole. It's because he's
28:41
a boring asshole that doesn't... His impact is
28:45
pretty low. It's a very low impact. He doesn't
28:47
give a shit about anything. And the grift is
28:52
high. Like, he started that dating... app oh
28:54
god i forgot about that he has dr wallach on
28:58
that does nothing paranormal date yeah like the
29:01
grift is so high with that guy and that's literally
29:04
pretty much the only thing giving him points
29:06
on this total he has no personality he shouldn't
29:09
be hosting coast to coast am like he's just he
29:12
should retire yeah like if he had retired 10
29:15
years ago he might be okay to remember but we're
29:19
well past that yeah and that's what's making
29:22
him an asshole one mine is the lack of anything
29:25
at least the other guys scoring low on my list
29:28
have some sort of opinion and personality yeah
29:31
but he just he doesn't have it he doesn't have
29:34
it and that's that's where he got on mine just
29:37
due to that yeah co -pilot has this at george
29:42
nori is 31st on their list with 34 and they say
29:47
nori scores high in legacy for hosting coast
29:50
to coast am shaping paranormal radio That doesn't
29:53
make him an asshole, though. His deception is
29:55
moderate. He platformed hoaxers but didn't invent
29:58
claims. His vibes are middling. Scene is affable
30:01
but opportunistic. He's held back by lower harm
30:04
since he amplified nonsense more than causing
30:06
direct damage. Yeah, I think we're all in agreeance.
30:10
And while our scores are wildly off, I think
30:13
we're all in agreeance with who he is as a person.
30:16
Okay, Chelsea, next up on my list. At 21 is Richard
30:21
C. Holland. Season three, episodes five and six.
30:24
Now we're getting up there. Yeah. I have him
30:27
ranked at a 24. Ranked at 24 or score of 24?
30:31
His score is 24. Oh, okay. No, hold on. Hold
30:33
on. His score is 31. Yeah. Okay. I have 32. Perfect.
30:36
Yeah. Oh, perfect. We agree. Yeah. Now, why don't
30:39
you tell us about Richard C. Holland? Oh, yeah.
30:41
I guess I could tell you about him. Who was it
30:45
that he mentored? David Wilcock. He was talking
30:50
about Richard C. Hoagland the other day. Hoagland
30:53
is best known for promoting the face on Mars
30:56
and other speculative NASA cover -up theories.
30:59
His achievement was keeping space anomalies in
31:02
the public eye and inspiring curiosity about
31:05
Mars. His asshole actions include presenting
31:08
pseudoscience as fact, exploiting media appearances
31:12
and monetizing sensational claims through books
31:15
and lectures, misleading audiences for decades.
31:18
And this is one of those people where I had much
31:20
lower on the list until I re -listened to the
31:23
episodes. And I forgot what a big asshole Richard
31:27
Hoagland was. I remember him as being an asshole.
31:31
Yeah. He absolutely would take claims, make them
31:36
his own, and say he was the first person to ever
31:39
talk about anything. And his... I don't know
31:42
how, but he ended up with friends such as Carl
31:45
Sagan, one of the foremost astronomers of his
31:48
day, who he got to pretend to be giving ideas
31:52
to. So overall, I gave Richard Hoagland the biggest
31:56
thing he got. He got quite a few eights. He got
31:59
eight on deception fabrication because he stole
32:01
and also didn't really check his sources or care
32:06
about things being wrong. Eight on vibes because
32:09
he was an asshole. exactly the same three on
32:12
harm because there wasn't a big deal on that
32:15
okay eight on griff because he was making money
32:18
off it like a lot of money five on legacy because
32:21
at the end of the day i don't think he is going
32:24
to be remembered that much and his biggest claim
32:26
to fame is sidonia the face on mars And I don't
32:29
think it's going to be remembered that long.
32:31
Totally in agreeance with everything that you're
32:32
saying. I gave him a less of a legacy. The thing
32:35
with all these UFO grifters is what harm are
32:38
they actually doing other than just. Yeah. And
32:41
it's me, right? It's people who enjoy listening
32:45
to stuff like this, which I do. I will totally
32:48
give it to you. I love some of these stories
32:51
that I know are totally made up. Other people
32:53
probably don't know that they're made up and
32:55
they actually believe them. But I still like
32:58
the Serpo story. I'm sorry. I love Serpo, even
33:03
though it is Richard Doty. I don't know why.
33:06
It's definitely Richard Doty. But it's just things
33:09
like that. So I see no harm in it inherently.
33:12
If Richard Doty was only known for the Serpo
33:16
story, he wouldn't even make this list. I know.
33:21
He would be a lovable asshole. Here we are at
33:23
20 something in the 20s and like not even talking
33:27
about Richard Doty yet. He's not showing up for
33:32
a while still. I know it. Yeah, I had to go back
33:37
and listen to it. And I realized the deception
33:40
that Richard C. Hoagland was known for that I
33:43
completely forgot about. And the fact that he
33:46
had a high school degree. He had no background
33:48
in anything. and yet he still was like the scientific
33:53
person for so many people because he was a weird
33:58
manipulator and he got kicked off coast to coast
34:01
for a while And that is a very hard thing to
34:04
do. I forgot about that. Yeah. See, and if I
34:06
would have listened to the episode, maybe I would
34:08
have ranked him higher, but I didn't. But I'm
34:10
just going off my vibes on this one. And I totally
34:13
remember the vibes from the episode that he was
34:16
a total asshole. Yeah. And Chelsea, I think this
34:19
is going to be the last one we're going to do.
34:20
For my number 20, I have Stanley Tiger Romanek.
34:26
Season 3, episode 22. Where do I have him? Ooh,
34:29
I have him in the top 10. Wait, he's not in here.
34:38
Anyhow, Stanley Tiger was very well known as,
34:43
yeah, the first J3 documentary video done where
34:47
he put several alien face masks in windows and
34:52
they were not there. He very clearly made it
34:55
up and then he ended up having to go to jail.
34:58
Sorry. Did he go to jail? I can't remember. I
35:01
should really write this down. I think he did
35:04
go to jail for it came to light at the end of
35:07
the filming when the documentary was being released
35:11
that he was found guilty of pedophilia. Yeah.
35:15
Anyhow, with Stan Romanek, I gave him a 10 for
35:18
deception, 10 for vibes because man, those are
35:21
off. Yep. 8 for harm because he is like, it's
35:24
hard to not give somebody who is the pedophilia
35:27
charges high. Yep. But after that, I gave him
35:31
a two for grift because he couldn't take advantage
35:33
of it. And a three for legacy because it could
35:35
be forgotten for in the UFO community. Okay,
35:38
here's where we differ. Seven for vibes because
35:41
a pedophile is not going to be low for asshole
35:44
vibes. And I gave him a 10 for grift because
35:48
he went to elaborate means to falsify all of
35:53
this, to document all of this. He had puppets.
35:56
He had fake phone calls. He had the works. Well,
36:01
he did, but it was only for one documentary.
36:04
He never had the opportunity to fully grift.
36:07
And that's why he scored so low for me. The effort
36:10
was there. So he still scored very high for me.
36:14
No, he didn't. You're right. That's part of the
36:18
technicality of it. But I went with intent. Yeah.
36:23
Fair enough. So that's why he's high on mine.
36:26
I don't know why I still went lower on vibes
36:29
at a seven. That's still high. I went seven for
36:31
vibes. Cause he seems kind of like an idiot.
36:33
Yeah. Because maybe I went lower on vibes because
36:37
he presented all of this shit as fact and you
36:40
watch the documentary and it is. Oh yeah. This
36:43
is awful. Yeah. This guy definitely, definitely
36:47
made this up. It's like when you're 10 years
36:49
old, and you have the camcorder, which kids aren't
36:52
going to know what that even is. And you like
36:54
make up your own little thing like Gumby and
36:56
Pokey. Yeah. And it's like, you know, one of
37:01
these things that you're like, wow, this is so
37:03
good. And it's not good at all. And it just legacy
37:06
for. And the only reason it gets a four is because
37:09
literally they continued with production after
37:12
this guy was tried and convicted as a pedophile.
37:15
Yeah. And how bad it is. And Copilot does agree
37:20
with you. They put him at number five on their
37:23
list. Romanek maxes out vibes in Harundu's toxic
37:26
personality, exploitation, and criminal charges.
37:29
His deception is extreme with fabricated abduction
37:32
evidence. His rift was strong with books and
37:34
appearances. His legacy is weaker, remembered
37:37
mostly for scandal. He's held back by fading
37:39
influence. And with that, we're going to get
37:41
in the top 20 after this for me. We'll see you
37:45
guys next week. I've been Taylor, here with Chelsea.
37:47
We are Journey to the Fringe. Thank you all for
37:48
listening. We'll see you next week. Bye. Thank
37:52
you for listening to Journey to the Fringe. If
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