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05: Caring for the Caregiver · Still Caring

0:03
Abby Fox (Intro): Welcome to the Still Caring Podcast,
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presented by Stillwater Medical.
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Joe Akin (Intro): Here, community is at the heart of healthcare.
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Katon Lunsford (Intro): Through honest conversations and shared experiences
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Abby Fox (Intro): we explore what it means to care for our health—
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Joe Akin (Intro): and each other.
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Katon Lunsford (Intro): Because better health takes a village
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and you're part of ours.
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Joe Akin (Host): Hello, I'm Joe Aiken and I'm glad you're part of this conversation.
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Today, I'm joined by Laurie Hunter.
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Good morning, Laurie.
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Glad you're here.
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Lori Hunter: Good morning.
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Thanks for having me.
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Joe Akin (Host): bet.
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This is part two of a very personal story.
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In our last episode, her husband Vance shared his journey through
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cancer from the patient's perspective.
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Today we're gonna shift the lens to the caregiver.
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Vance has been battling aggressive form of prostate cancer facing repeated
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emergency situations and living, living with constant uncertainty.
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But this didn't start there.
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Years earlier, a routine gallbladder surgery turned critical, and Lori
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found herself at his bedside as he fought for his life in the ICU.
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This has not been just a one moment of caregiving.
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It's been years of showing up, navigating crisis after crisis and carrying a weight.
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Most people never see at one.
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At one point, Vance said to me, that was Lori's journey.
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So today, that's what we're here to understand.
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Lori, thank you so much for being here.
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Your willingness to tell us the story, your story from
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the caregiver's perspective is going to help a lot of people.
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Lori Hunter: Thank you for having me, Joe.
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Uh, I, I hope I can, uh, give some insight on some things about a
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caregiver.
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Joe Akin (Host): Oh, I, I know you can.
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So, so let's, let's start with, with the journey.
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What, what has the journey been like for you?
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Lori Hunter: Uh, which one?
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Uh, there's been a few with Vance Hunter, from the, the life support to the
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broken ribs on, from motorcycle rides.
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Um, he's had a few, um, episodes in the hospital since we've been married.
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It's been, it's been tough.
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The, um, You know, you just, the worry and, um, This is both Vance and
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i's second marriage and, it's a, we have a really, really strong bond.
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I think I was too young in the first marriage and, It was
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nothing like it is with Vance.
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So I'm real protective of him.
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He's protective of me.
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And then when these things happen, um, I just go into mama bear mode, I guess, um,
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with his journey.
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One of the first big episodes was, um, Vance.
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We were on a business trip.
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We made a weekend of it, And we were in Texas, uh, Houston Way,
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and on our way back, he started having severe pain in his abdomen.
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Uncontrollable and he's got a pretty high-threshold of pain.
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So, it, was really concerning.
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We ended up stopping at some little hospital in the middle of Texas.
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I can't tell you where it is even anymore.
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They admitted him for pain management And this hospital only
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had ultrasound on Thursday, so we had to wait till Thursday to get him.
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Scene.
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It was a, it was a gallbladder stone.
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we flew him back home to Tulsa, had Surgery.
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He, popped a clamp and bled out, had to go back into surgery.
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And because of that, they had to give him blood and he had to go to the ICU.
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That was just protocol.
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The next day, he still had.
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Low, blood numbers.
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So they gave him more blood and platelets and plasma, and he had a reaction to that.
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It's called trolley.
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And he went into full pulmonary arrest and had to be intubated and was on the
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ventilator for one reason or another.
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They couldn't wean him off of it for 11 days, And then three more
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days in the hospital after that.
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So that.
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The only time I ever left the hospital was he, they took him for a scan
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and they told me it'd be an hour.
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So I ran home and got clothes.
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I spent that entire.
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A hospital stay with him watching his oxygen numbers.
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I didn't watch the tv 'cause I didn't, he was in a state of twilight almost.
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We could, wake him, but not completely.
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they kept him that way so he wouldn't pull the ventilator out.
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People would come in and, and he would get very emotional
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'cause he could still hear them.
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And so I just really had to lock it down and, um, not allow visitors caused,
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caused some conflict, but um, you know, I just felt like I needed to protect him.
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So Mama bear, I guess is how it affected me.
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I just go into protective mode.
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Joe Akin (Host): Right, so, people in these situations, obviously they see
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the patient, but they rarely see you.
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They rarely see the caregiver.
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are people missing about what you carry with you every day?
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Lori Hunter: I tried to think of how I would answer that.
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just protection.
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That's, that, that was my biggest thing, and that's still when he has his episodes
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now, I just, you know, you just wanna protect him because he's laying in a
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bed helpless, can't do anything, and, and you just want to do what you can to
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protect them and manage people after that.
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Joe Akin (Host): So, it Is it, would it be safe to say it's kind of like a,
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a light switch going off in your head?
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You just change modes and you go from
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Lori Hunter: A hundred percent.
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah, Laurie.
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Lori Hunter: Absolutely.
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Yeah.
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And in fact, you know, we both have very busy schedules and to try to
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schedule in a hospital stay you'll never get it done, but everything
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falls away when this happens.
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And you just take care of what has to be done.
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Joe Akin (Host): So, we had that, those emergencies, And then fast forward
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into the prostate cancer and everything we talked about in advances episode.
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So these are ongoing, it's not just a one-off, like I said earlier.
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So walk me into one of those emergency moments, and I know you say you go
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into Mama Bear, but what really is going through your mind when You
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know that Vance has to get to the er?
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So he's not there yet, but you know, he is gotta get there.
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What, runs through your minds in those moments?
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Lori Hunter: Vance and I are very different in the
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way we handle emergencies.
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I'm not gonna say he's pessimistic, but he is.
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What if, what if I don't get there?
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What?
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You know?
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And I'm like, what if you do?
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I kind of slow.
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Everything kind of slows down for me and I just.
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Try to figure out what the next steps need to be.
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And he does too, but he does it in a little bit more of a panic, and I
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understand he's the one going through it.
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usually we're not together.
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I mean, there's been every scenario in this bleeding situation with Vance.
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More times than not, we haven't been together when it starts.
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I mean, you sat there and took care of him while I, until I could get there one
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time, which I'm forever grateful to you.
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And that was our first meeting that I remember and, and I'm
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just so grateful for that.
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That meant a, a huge amount to both of us.
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It's just getting him there.
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These are emergency situations to get Vance in and get him treated.
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Once he's there, I sort of calm down because I know we just gotta get this
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done And then he'll get home and usually the next day he goes back and gets on
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his tractor and takes care of cows.
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Uh, I mean, it's that simple.
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It is so urgent to get this care.
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But once it's done, it's done.
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I mean, he's sore and it's, it's an ordeal.
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But, um, I think I, I calm, especially once he's in and he, I mean, he has to
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deal with all the pain And the treatment,
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Joe Akin (Host): right,
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Lori Hunter: and I think the, the calmer I can be, the better it is for Vance.
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Joe Akin (Host): right.
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Yeah.
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And that, And that totally makes sense.
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But you, know, in my talk with Vance, he mentioned the, what if, and you kind
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of did, but in a, in a different way with Vance and I were talking about.
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It's the what if, based around the scans And the checkups in those moments when
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you, when you guys are going in to, get another checkup to make sure that You
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know the numbers are what they need to be.
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He, talked to me about what he's going through in those moments, but
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what's it like for you sitting beside him as he and you are waiting for
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those critically important results?
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Lori Hunter: I'm nervous for him because I know what it does to him and I know how
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it affects him physically to to worry.
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I.
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am forever
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I'm not gonna anticipate anything negative until it's in black and white,
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And then I'll deal with that, that, that's kind of how I manage it, because
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I just can't, I'm not gonna deal with.
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A bad diagnosis until I got one and I haven't had cancer.
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So I, I can't begin to tell you what he's going through.
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I can see how it affects him, but the way I have to process it is
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I can't go there until I'm there.
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah.
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Kind of optimism is your superpower in these situations.
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Yeah.
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Lori Hunter: Yeah.
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And he, and, and, you know, he works in a, a very,
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Pipeline construction, high pressure, things blow up.
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You know, he's gotta always be one step ahead of the what ifs with
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safety, and that's just how he's wired.
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It's not a bad thing, but This is how I'm wired.
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And maybe that's why we are such a good pair is Because we
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Joe Akin (Host): contrast.
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Yeah.
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Lori Hunter: Yeah.
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Joe Akin (Host): so what?
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Do you carry emotionally that you often, that you don't often say out loud to him?
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Lori Hunter: probably my what ifs, you know, I can't fathom him not being here.
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He is, he is my person.
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He is my rock.
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I also.
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Don't want him stressing.
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I, wish that I could help with that.
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all I can do is just be calm, because the more you say, I mean,
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you don't tell a woman to calm down.
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You, you don't tell Vance Hunter to calm down either.
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Nobody wants to hear
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that, but that's what you want for them, is to just find a way
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to just calm down and, and it, and when it's bad, then we'll deal with
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Joe Akin (Host): right.
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So, Lori, after one of those really intense moments when
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things finally settle down.
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How do you decompress?
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In other words, what do you do to care for you to help you recover?
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Lori Hunter: Well, when he was on life support, I think I went a year
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after that because it was, it was over a month after he was out of the
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hospital before I could leave him alone.
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The.
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Propofol is what he was on, and it just gets in your body and it
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takes a while to get out and he, he was just so emotional and just.
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Almost childlike and not mentally, but I mean physically, just I couldn't leave
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him
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Joe Akin (Host): care required.
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Lori Hunter: the care.
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And I think that whole ordeal, I think I probably had a little touch
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of PTSD after that for maybe a year.
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And I finally just sort of like, you gotta snap out of this.
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And started doing things to help me get out of it.
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Now how I decompress.
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Once he's in there getting treated, my worry stops going away.
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I start worrying about his, his psyche, but I know he's getting treated and
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I know when This is done, it's done.
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Like I said, he's usually out on the couple days later.
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Um, I.
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just drop it there kind of in the hospital because my relief is the
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nurses are taking care of him and doing what we gotta do to get through this.
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Once, he's treated, the catheter has to go in.
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Once that starts, I know we're, we're on the, on the downhill.
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Joe Akin (Host): this, ties back into something Vance had mentioned
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last time, but it was trust in the staff because I don't think you
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could relax like that if you didn't trust them that they could do it.
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Lori Hunter: absolutely no, that, the Stonewater Medical
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Center staff is spot on.
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They've, they've always been wonderful.
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Not just the er, but up on the floor too.
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He's been there too, and it's, it's just been a, good experience.
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Yes,
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Joe Akin (Host): as good as a bad experience can be, I.
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Lori Hunter: as good as the bad?
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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As far as care, no complaints.
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Joe Akin (Host): Well, that's good, but what could people around you do
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after those moments that would actually help you, the caregiver recover.
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Lori Hunter: Uh,
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whew.
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I don't know.
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I don't take help.
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Well, Joe, um,
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I mean, while it's happening, feed the dogs, bring the packages in.
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Joe Akin (Host): It's, it's all the things in life that keep
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going while your life stopped,
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Lori Hunter: exactly, yeah.
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Check on the kids,
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah.
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it, you, you forget or, people that aren't in the moment, forget.
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That while you're away from home and doing ev, everything else in your life
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that was already on auto is still going.
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And that That is where they can help.
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That's why so many times after an event, people go to, you know, bringing
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you food, but there's food, like you said, there's packages, there's kids
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that, there are a lot of things.
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So, yeah, that, that really resonates with me.
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Lori Hunter: Yeah.
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Well, when he was, when he was on life support, I had a huge amount of friends.
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One was the, she was the general manager of McGill's on, 61st then, but now she's
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the owner brought me food constantly.
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I had another friend that brought me food and, they didn't come to
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visit because it's a horrible time to visit somebody when they're in the
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ICU, unless you've been called in.
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it is just not a place to hang out.
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Um, but I was just forever grateful of that.
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I, bet I didn't eat one meal, maybe two meals from the hospital food.
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Not that it was bad, but it was just, it was just more comforting, you
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know, And that was a nice gesture.
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Snack boxes they sent me.
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I, I just really had a set of friends help me out there.
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Joe Akin (Host): Hey.
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Ever feel like you stopped being a spouse and became, you know, just a caregiver?
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Lori Hunter: Yes.
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I think probably that month that he couldn't be left alone probably was the
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most, because he needed so much help.
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Uh, just.
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Day-to-day things, and he was emotional all the time.
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While as that medicine was purging from his body, I could say I probably felt
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more like a caregiver than a spouse then.
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Yeah.
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Joe Akin (Host): So when, when you're shifting between two dramatically
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different roles in that relationship,
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how, do you protect the relationship itself?
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Because it's, it's so dramatically different in those moments.
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Do you have any
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Lori Hunter: I just
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Joe Akin (Host): any thoughts on
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Lori Hunter: tolerance.
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Just tolerance.
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I don't know how to answer that really.
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I think it's just tolerance.
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We have such a strong bond.
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I'm not saying we've never, never argued, but I have no trouble telling
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him exactly how I feel about something.
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He struggled with it a little bit more than I do.
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But, um, I think that's just the way we've come into this marriage and, I don't know.
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I've forgotten the question
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now.
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Joe Akin (Host): That's okay.
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It, it was how, how?
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You, how do you care for the relationship?
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You know, the, the marriage, if you will, because you're jumping between roles
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and they're so dramatically different.
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But yeah, I, I hear what you're saying.
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It's, it's difficult, but you, lean on the relationship And the trust
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you guys have with each other,
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Lori Hunter: Yeah, you just have to lean on on your relationship.
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The whole thing is difficult.
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Joe Akin (Host): right.
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Lori Hunter: I can't imagine being a caregiver like that
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for a child or long-term never ending in the hospital care.
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'cause we were, that was a three week ordeal for us and
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it was pretty, pretty brutal.
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I don't think it affected our relationship negatively in any way.
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Once he's back, he's back.
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And that's the same with these episodes, but it, it just ravages
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his body with stress to go through these, bleeding episodes post-cancer.
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And, you know, if I could help him in any way, it would be helping manage that.
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Joe Akin (Host): In preparing for this, the thing I kept getting from people
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that have been in your situation was There are so many people that say, let
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me know if you need anything, and you, don't really know how to, deal with that.
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'cause, you know, after the 10th, 12th, 14th time of, of someone
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saying that, because you're in such an emotional situation, sometimes
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you go, yeah, yeah, whatever.
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But you, kind of address this, but what would actually help it?
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I mean, This is strange, but is there something else that they
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could do that really could help?
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Lori Hunter: Things that actually help are, as I mentioned, check on
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the dogs and bring the packages in.
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Just drop off of snack box, drop off something at the hospital,
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especially if it's an extended stay.
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Um, I've had people just drop me little things that just tell me they love me And
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that it is just, it just means so much.
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Um, my personal opinion, a hospital is not a place to visit, especially in Vance's
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case, in all of these situations because.
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When he was on life support, I didn't want anybody seeing him like that.
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We didn't feel he was going to die after we got intubated.
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We just knew it was gonna be a long journey to get him through this,
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and I didn't want him emotional.
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Every time somebody came in, he would get emotional.
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So I.
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Told people to stay away, hurt a lot of feelings, but I was protecting vans,
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and it's the same when he is in the er.
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I mean, he's got a catheter, three-way catheter in and he
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don't wanna see anybody, you know, he barely wants me there.
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So I just don't feel like coming to the hospital for a visit is a good scenario.
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Vance's case, helping is.
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Go feed the cows, you know, go make sure the cows have water.
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Those kind of things that, Those are the, the biggest, but the words
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of support, they mean so much.
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They really do.
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Joe Akin (Host): Laurie, This is really helpful because most people
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sincerely wanna help, and just like you said, we just don't always know how,
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and it's conversations like this with you that give us.
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Just such better, clearer path and understanding of, you know, how do we
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show up for, for the caregivers for you.
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So we close every episode with what we call a challenge to care.
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So if someone listening right now knows a caregiver, what would
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you want them to understand?
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Lori Hunter: we're struggling too.
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You know, we're, we're not the patient, but we are, we are struggling
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And we are dealing with time and, and emotions just like the patient.
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And, um, don't take anything personal.
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If, if, you know.
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If something doesn't feel warm and fuzzy because we, we are in protective mode.
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you know, I did offend a lot of people when I wouldn't let 'em
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come to the hospital, and I'm sure it'll happen again, but it's just,
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that's protection and, and, um, just understand the caregiver is caregiver.
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They're not just a gatekeeper.
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Joe Akin (Host): Right.
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Yeah.
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So don't do what you can to not put them in the position that
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they have to be the gatekeeper.
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Lori Hunter: Right.
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Right.
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And they're stressed too.
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They,
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah.
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Lori Hunter: they probably had less sleep than the patient
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because the
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Joe Akin (Host): Good point.
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Lori Hunter: bed, right.
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah.
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Lori Hunter: up doing for 'em.
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Joe Akin (Host): Yeah.
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Well, Lori, I, sincerely can't tell you how much we appreciate you doing this.
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Your perspective is one we just don't hear about often enough, and I know
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This is gonna mean a lot to a lot of people, And then to everyone listening.
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Think of someone in your life who's caring for a loved one right now and
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reach out today and remind them that they're not alone, because better health
23:33
truly does take a village, and caregivers are a critical part of that story.
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Thank you so much for listening to Still Caring.