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Fake heiress Anna Sorokin's NEW GIG: A REALITY SHOW · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace, they eat crowd, they fall
0:13
Speaker 1: for it, and they're falling over themselves to go on
0:17
Speaker 1: vacations with her, or to lend her money to help
0:21
Speaker 1: her out because they believe she's sitting on a multi
0:25
Speaker 1: million dollar estate. I'll tell you what, when people smell money,
0:32
Speaker 1: it's just like dogs out in the dog parts, sniffing
0:35
Speaker 1: each other's rear. End they sniff each other out at
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Speaker 1: those at Manhattan high society parties, and I can just
0:44
Speaker 1: see them falling for Anna Delvi. Well, you know what,
0:50
Speaker 1: maybe they'll show Maybe they'll show up at her reality
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Speaker 1: TV series. From my understanding, I guess she's still on
0:58
Speaker 1: house arrest. This reality TV series is set in a
1:04
Speaker 1: Manhattan apartment, Oh like her apartment, where she hosts dinner
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Speaker 1: parties while serving out the rest of her house arrest.
1:14
Speaker 1: Now that is just what I do not want to see,
1:17
Speaker 1: a convicted felon having a dinner party in her apartment
1:24
Speaker 1: wearing her ankle monitor. Now, how did the whole thing start?
1:30
Speaker 1: I remember very well. Do you take a listen to
1:34
Speaker 1: Inside Edition, She claims she was a wealthy heiress from
1:38
Speaker 1: Europe worth more than sixty million dollars but it was
1:42
Speaker 1: a lie. An as Organ went to prison for two
1:45
Speaker 1: years for defrauding banks, hotels, and even her closest friends
1:50
Speaker 1: out of hundreds of thousands of dollars. Her trial drew
1:54
Speaker 1: international attention. This woman made national headlines posing as a
1:58
Speaker 1: wealthy woman. Now, the woman known as the SOHO Grifter
2:03
Speaker 1: is speaking to ABC's Deborah Roberts. This is the first
2:07
Speaker 1: time you've sat down for television interview. Why are you
2:09
Speaker 1: talking with us? Why not? I would like to show
2:14
Speaker 1: the world that I'm not this ungreedy person that they
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Speaker 1: portrayed me to be. You ask her who she really is?
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Speaker 1: Did she tell you Anna Saurkan is very complicated character.
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Speaker 1: You might believe that Anna Saurkan is a very gifted, clever,
2:29
Speaker 1: want to be businesswoman or a complete con artist. And
2:33
Speaker 1: there are many people in her wake who would tell
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Speaker 1: you that she is the classic con artist. Why can't
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Speaker 1: she be both? Why can't she be a great business
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Speaker 1: person and the ultimate scammer? I see her as both.
2:47
Speaker 1: Take a listen hour cut one from the Vanity Fair
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Speaker 1: special Scandalous. By twenty sixteen, Anna Delvi was a regular
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Speaker 1: in the NYC social scene, frequenting many popular downtown restaurants,
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Speaker 1: ours and clubs, with an extravagant lifestyle and a seemingly
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Speaker 1: endless supply of money. Delvie was an enigma that was
3:07
Speaker 1: made for the age of Instagram. Always at the right place,
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Speaker 1: with the right people, living her best life, but with
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Speaker 1: no apparent cause for her fame. With Me and All
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Speaker 1: Star panel to make sense of what we know right
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Speaker 1: now With Me Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red
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Speaker 1: Flags and hosted Today with doctor Wendy KCBQ. You can
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Speaker 1: find her at Wendy Patrick PhD dot com. Doctor Donna
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Speaker 1: Rockwell Special Guests joining US clinical psychologists in both Michigan
3:35
Speaker 1: and New York specializing in celebrity mental health on faculty
3:40
Speaker 1: Saybrook University. Jim Ellis with a Special Guests joining US
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Speaker 1: certified fraud examiner, former FED with the FBI. Don't mess
3:49
Speaker 1: with this guy, FBI agent twenty nine years now, Private
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Speaker 1: investigator at jk E Texas Private Investigator jk ET dot com.
4:01
Speaker 1: But first, I want to go to a woman I've
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Speaker 1: been dying to talk to. Rebecca Rosenberg with Fox News Digital.
4:08
Speaker 1: She's a crime reporter and author of a fantastic book
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Speaker 1: at any cost. Rebecca, who is this woman? Who is
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Speaker 1: this woman? Well, her family came from Russia, they moved
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Speaker 1: to Germany, and I believe her father was actually a
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Speaker 1: truck driver. She does not come from a wealthy family,
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Speaker 1: and she just invented this identity when she came to
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Speaker 1: New York. Now, her coming to New York was quite
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Speaker 1: a story. So Russian born moving to Germany, the child
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Speaker 1: of a truck driver. She ends up getting a job
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Speaker 1: or an internship that takes her to Paris. From there,
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Speaker 1: the position brings her to New York. I believe it
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Speaker 1: was montak and and she very simply overstate her visa,
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Speaker 1: which thousands of people do every year, but none do
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Speaker 1: it in the style of Anna Sorokin. Take a listen
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Speaker 1: to our cut six our friends at Inside Edition. Is
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Speaker 1: she in a courtroom or at a red carpet event?
5:17
Speaker 1: Anna Saurkin is accused of posing as an heiress to
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Speaker 1: live an extravagant lifestyle, but it's what she's wearing to
5:23
Speaker 1: trial that is making headlines. The twenty seven year old
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Speaker 1: defendant showed up wearing a form fitting black dress with
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Speaker 1: a plunging neckline and choker necklace. It's a look that
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Speaker 1: could backfire. Warren stylist don Karen Black dress definitely a
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Speaker 1: no no. A hypersexualize her. It makes her appear to
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Speaker 1: be like a seductress. The choker kind of shows to
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Speaker 1: me that she's trying to be overtly sexy. The more
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Speaker 1: sexy she appears to be, it hurts her. Sourkin is
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Speaker 1: so obsessed with her clothes she refused to enter the
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Speaker 1: courtroom because the outfit she was given to wear was
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Speaker 1: not up to her standards. The angry judge told her
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Speaker 1: this is unacceptable and inappropriate. This is not a fashion show. Wow, well,
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Speaker 1: you know what. It didn't work. She continued wearing designer
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Speaker 1: clothes to every single court appearance. But this goes way back.
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Speaker 1: Her desire for a lifestyle she could not afford started
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Speaker 1: in her teens. Take a listening to every Buddy, Jesse
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Speaker 1: Palm or a daily MAILTV Anna, who interned at a
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Speaker 1: trendy French magazine, reportedly managed to scam extended stays in
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Speaker 1: swanky Manhattan hotels, dinner at high end restaurants, and flights
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Speaker 1: on chartered jets to finance her lavish lifestyle and keep
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Speaker 1: the grift going. She allegedly built banks out of thousands
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Speaker 1: in cash. And that's not all. The fake heiress reportedly
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Speaker 1: fleeced her friend out of sixty two thousand dollars for
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Speaker 1: a world class trip to Morocco. But Anna went too
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Speaker 1: far when she attempted to take out a loan for
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Speaker 1: twenty two million dollars to finance a visual arts center
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Speaker 1: she called the Anna Delvi Foundation. In all, Anna reportedly
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Speaker 1: scammed a total of two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars,
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Speaker 1: and his double life began to crumble as hotels went
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Speaker 1: after her unpaid debts and banks began to investigate her
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Speaker 1: alleged assets. Prime Stories with Nancy Grace, Well, she's back.
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Speaker 1: Fank German heiress Anna Delvi is shopping a reality TV
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Speaker 1: series set in where could it be? Oh her apartment
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Speaker 1: since she's on house arrest, where she hosts dinner parties
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Speaker 1: and has sparkling conversations with her guests featuring her ankle monitor. Now,
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Speaker 1: for those of you don't remember, she is a young
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Speaker 1: woman who posts a fake German heiress named Anna Delvie
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Speaker 1: for years her real name and a Sorkin, and she
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Speaker 1: says her new reality series will provide a quote glimpse
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Speaker 1: of the real woman. Right, Okay, she's already given us
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Speaker 1: a lot of glimpses of the real woman. I remember
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Speaker 1: when she wouldn't come into court because she did not
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Speaker 1: like her outfit. Do you know how many times a
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Speaker 1: defendant would not have street clothes and have gail clothes.
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Speaker 1: And I kept in my office a suit, a blazer,
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Speaker 1: the works for the defendants to wear so they could
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Speaker 1: not get a continuance or a delay in their trial
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Speaker 1: by claiming they didn't have clothes. Oh, yes, you'll have clothes.
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Speaker 1: I'll bring them. It'll tell me about five minutes, Joe
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Speaker 1: to get in my office and bring it back down here.
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Speaker 1: A nice blue coat, I got it, Salvation Army. It
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Speaker 1: looks great on everybody. One size fits all. This woman
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Speaker 1: actually would not come into court because she did not
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Speaker 1: like her designer outfit. She actually had designers dressing her
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Speaker 1: for her jury trial. Well, she got convicted anyway, but
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Speaker 1: not on every account, I might add. While the working
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Speaker 1: title is apparently Anna Delvi's Dinner Club, the so called
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Speaker 1: reality show would watch Anna Delvi inviting guests over to
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Speaker 1: her New York City apartment where she is serving her
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Speaker 1: house arrest while they have quote candid, unscripted conversations. You
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Speaker 1: do know that all the reality series are scripted, right,
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Speaker 1: I mean they're not real. I know they're called reality,
9:46
Speaker 1: but they're not real anyway. What do we know about
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Speaker 1: Anna Delvey aka Anna Sarken. She pretended to be the
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Speaker 1: heir to a sixty million euro fortune and she ripped
10:01
Speaker 1: off about two hundred thousand dollars from Banks hotels. I mean,
10:06
Speaker 1: maybe it's just me, but to you. Doctor Donna Rockwell
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Speaker 1: joining US clinical psychologist Faculties Saber University. Doctor Rockwell, I
10:14
Speaker 1: don't know very many people except maybe Eloise that lives
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Speaker 1: in hotels. No, I guess we don't really know many
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Speaker 1: people who live in hotels. But it's very posh, isn't
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Speaker 1: it to do that? She might be a Eloise poser?
10:29
Speaker 1: I guess, But you know that makes her look really
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Speaker 1: unattainable and like she's got lots of money. So I
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Speaker 1: think people in her situation will do anything they can
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Speaker 1: to look like they're billionaires, not even millionaires. And Rebecca
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Speaker 1: Rosenberg joining us in Fox News Digital. Rebecca, she wasn't
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Speaker 1: just staying down at the Motel six. She was staying
10:51
Speaker 1: at very very expensive and luxurious hotels. Yes, she was
10:55
Speaker 1: staying at eleven Howard Street for a very long time.
11:02
Speaker 1: Racked up a bill the tens of thousands of dollars,
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Speaker 1: and that's where she lived here for a big chunk
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Speaker 1: of the times in New York. You know, it was
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Speaker 1: really interesting that she created this illusion that super rich
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Speaker 1: and super educated people fell for, and I guess you'd
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Speaker 1: call it New York society. Until she went and basically
11:32
Speaker 1: invited herself to be on a yacht in Abisa, and
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Speaker 1: then after everyone got off at the end of the vacation,
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Speaker 1: she and her boyfriend turn around and get back on
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Speaker 1: and stay for another week or ten days. I mean,
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Speaker 1: Jim Ellis, you're the certified fraud examined her former FBI
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Speaker 1: agent twenty nine years for beat's sake. When you commandeer
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Speaker 1: a yacht with a captain and a staff and all
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Speaker 1: the food and you're out at sea and the gas,
12:04
Speaker 1: that is a huge bill, a huge bill. And frankly,
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Speaker 1: you know, she probably could have been stopped and exposed
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Speaker 1: at that point if any of these people along the
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Speaker 1: way he lost money who got you enticed by her
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Speaker 1: story and had actually applied reason and common sense at
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Speaker 1: a certain point, things wouldn't have gotten as far as
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Speaker 1: as they did. Yeah, you know, that's really interesting. Wendy Patrick,
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Speaker 1: California prosecutor, author of Red Flags. You can hear her
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Speaker 1: on today with doctor Wendy CASEBQ. Doctor Wendy. I find it,
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Speaker 1: Wendy Patrick, I find it really interesting that the owners
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Speaker 1: or the people that had rented the yacht originally didn't
12:50
Speaker 1: go after her. Now they were are really really wealthy
12:57
Speaker 1: hamp Tonights. And I got to tell you something thing, Wendy.
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Speaker 1: I've been to the Hampton's a couple of times for
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Speaker 1: charity when I would be speaking to a group or
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Speaker 1: raising money somehow or other. That's the same, Wendy. I
13:15
Speaker 1: couldn't wait till I packed up my little rental car
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Speaker 1: and got out. I mean, I knew I was a
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Speaker 1: dog upstairs. I did not get in. That was not
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Speaker 1: where I was supposed to be. And these rich people
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Speaker 1: that got ripped off but didn't report it what they
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Speaker 1: didn't want to look stupid or what. Yeah, no, that's right, Nancy.
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Speaker 1: I'm like you. I'm more I'm more familiar with the
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Speaker 1: Hampton Inn, with the free breakfast. I'm stealing it. Go ahead,
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Speaker 1: So this is the This is the problem with the
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Speaker 1: super super rich, and it is a problem because financial
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Speaker 1: responsibility should be everyone's responsibility. But they probably either didn't
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Speaker 1: know where didn't care. Why do I say that, because
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Speaker 1: we've covered so many stories where you do have the
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Speaker 1: ultra rich that are scammed are defrauded by somebody like Anna,
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Speaker 1: but don't consider it in the balance to be worth
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Speaker 1: their while to pursue it, not realizing there may be
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Speaker 1: so many other victims that they might be preventing by
14:09
Speaker 1: putting it into it sooner rather than later. That may
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Speaker 1: be why they didn't say anything. I'm not quite sure
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Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenborg what her motivation is other than just living
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Speaker 1: the high life. But imagine the impact she could have
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Speaker 1: made being the daughter of a truck driver. I mean,
14:26
Speaker 1: I'm the daughter of a railroad worker and a bank teller,
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Speaker 1: and I know my parents were over time to send
14:32
Speaker 1: me to college, send me to law school, and so
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Speaker 1: much more. She actually has a brilliant mind. Yeah, but
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Speaker 1: I don't think that if she had been honest about
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Speaker 1: her origins, anybody, the people that she was trying to
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Speaker 1: hang out with the New York that they would have
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Speaker 1: really paid attention to her. We know she was born
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Speaker 1: in Russia, grew up in Germany. Her father worked in
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Speaker 1: a transport company and went and solved. At nineteen, she
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Speaker 1: left her parents and brother for Paris to pursue fashion.
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Speaker 1: She has only ever spoken very vaguely of her parents,
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Speaker 1: as she terms conservative. But while she's in Paris, she
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Speaker 1: takes on the name Anna Delvi and she shoots photographs
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Speaker 1: for a fashion art magazine named Purple. She only got
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Speaker 1: four hundred euros a month and she stayed financially dependent
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Speaker 1: on her parents, who would send her money pay for
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Speaker 1: her apartment. Then she had a breakup, headed to New
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Speaker 1: York and she went for a trip to Montauk and
15:38
Speaker 1: then Fashion Week, and that really did it. When she
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Speaker 1: was at Fashion Week, there was no suggestion she would
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Speaker 1: ever turn back. She went from boutique hotel to boutique hotel,
15:51
Speaker 1: always handing out CRISP one hundred dollar tips and putting
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Speaker 1: off bills with promises of wire transfer. Then never happened. So,
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Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenberg, I know we've got the one victim, Rachel
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Speaker 1: Delosa Williams, but that's two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars.
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Speaker 1: What about all of the hotels and all the other
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Speaker 1: people she ripped off. A lot of people didn't come forward,
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Speaker 1: and actually, Rachel Delosia is really interesting because at the
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Speaker 1: end Rachel actually couldn't get paid restitution because the jury
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Speaker 1: did not find Stoken guilty of ripping her off. That
16:34
Speaker 1: was kind of that was one of the charges they
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Speaker 1: did not convict on. Take a listen, our cut five
16:39
Speaker 1: be our friends at time. Prosecutor Katherine McCaw says the
16:43
Speaker 1: defendant has not a sent to her name as far
16:46
Speaker 1: as we can determine, also noting that Sorokin is Russian born,
16:49
Speaker 1: not German, though she could be deported to Germany no
16:52
Speaker 1: matter how the trial turns out, as she's reportedly overstayed
16:55
Speaker 1: her visa under the name Anna Delvi. She arrived in
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Speaker 1: New York with a high priced wardrobe and was known
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Speaker 1: for handing out one hundred dollar cash tips, reportedly saying
17:04
Speaker 1: at different points that her father was a diplomat, an
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Speaker 1: oil baron, or involved in the solar panel business, none
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Speaker 1: of which are the case. People who knew her said
17:12
Speaker 1: she often asked others to use their credit cards to
17:15
Speaker 1: cover cab and plane fares, and then failing to repay them.
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Speaker 1: Rebecca Rosenberg Netflix multi episode creation Inventing Anna. What is it?
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Speaker 1: It's a show based on her life story, so based
17:31
Speaker 1: on it kind of glamorizes her. I'd say her criminal
17:36
Speaker 1: activity in New York for which she was convicted and
17:40
Speaker 1: she sold her life rights to Netflix for them to
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Speaker 1: do the show. So this woman cons she cons big.
17:50
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut two from Vanity Fair.
17:54
Speaker 1: Prior to their departure, Davis's manager told her Delvi's bill
17:57
Speaker 1: in room charges were starting to mount and we're still unpaid.
18:01
Speaker 1: As a result, the hotel changed Delvi's room code and
18:04
Speaker 1: detained all of her personal belongings. To renew her visa,
18:08
Speaker 1: Delvi said she had to spend intervals of time out
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Speaker 1: of the country, so she decided to embark on an
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Speaker 1: adventure to Morocco. She invited her New York City circle
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Speaker 1: of friends. This trip was the quintessential example of the
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Speaker 1: lavish lifestyle that Delvey was known for, a private villa
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Speaker 1: with a personal butler, all for just a mere seven
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Speaker 1: thousand dollars a night. During their trip, Delvey, making one
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Speaker 1: excuse after another, chress Williams to pick up the tab
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Speaker 1: more and more frequently. Eventually covering costs for dinner and
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Speaker 1: expensive Moroccan dresses, a stark change from the days Delvi
18:39
Speaker 1: would pay for everything. Then one morning, Delvey was informed
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Speaker 1: by a hotel employee that they did not have a
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Speaker 1: working credit card on file. Delve brushed this off as
18:48
Speaker 1: an issue with her bank, but soon after Williams was
18:52
Speaker 1: pressured into putting down her credit card by hotel management
18:55
Speaker 1: staff and security members. Knowing something was not right, Williams
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Speaker 1: left Morocco a thank German aires who ripped off her
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Speaker 1: a victims to the tune of thousands and thousands and thousands.
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Speaker 1: Has apparently already signed on a production company called Butternut,
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Speaker 1: which actually has a little bit of credibility, run by
19:14
Speaker 1: a former Food Network president, Corny White, and MediaMogul Brand
19:20
Speaker 1: Montgomery of Wheelhouse Entertainment. Guys, I'm afraid this is actually
19:25
Speaker 1: going to happen. Butternut and Sorkin are currently shopping the
19:30
Speaker 1: project to platforms hoping it will be picked up. Now,
19:34
Speaker 1: remember Netflix, bit they paid Sorkin about three hundred and
19:39
Speaker 1: fifty thousand dollars to make a dramatization of her story,
19:43
Speaker 1: which ends her up in the cam. Sorkin has been
19:50
Speaker 1: coming in and out of her New York apartment, appearing
19:53
Speaker 1: at windows getting press. Sorkin says she's quite excited about
19:58
Speaker 1: the prospect of bringing together a curated group of friends. Jackie.
20:03
Speaker 1: For some reason, I don't think we're going to be
20:04
Speaker 1: invited a curated group of friends. Now. When I hear
20:09
Speaker 1: the word curate, I think of someone curating great art
20:16
Speaker 1: masterpieces for like the Metropolitan Museum of Art or the
20:21
Speaker 1: MoMA Modern Museum of Art. I just curating friends. What now,
20:28
Speaker 1: let me look at it again, curating a curated bringing
20:32
Speaker 1: together a curated group of friends, and other words, friends
20:36
Speaker 1: who won't blurt out anything about her conviction quote. There's
20:41
Speaker 1: nothing like the experience of bringing together a curated group
20:44
Speaker 1: of friends to share life stories and enjoy a great
20:46
Speaker 1: culinary experience life stories. I would love to hear her
20:50
Speaker 1: real life story about how she ripped everybody off with
20:53
Speaker 1: thousands of dollars. But let's not forget about the people
20:57
Speaker 1: that refleece out of good money. Is so called heiress
21:01
Speaker 1: Jim Ellis joining us former fed with the FBI. Have
21:05
Speaker 1: you ever seen anything like it where a person who
21:09
Speaker 1: is so obsessed with a lifestyle or getting money actually
21:15
Speaker 1: has alternate identities and scams and lies to even their
21:20
Speaker 1: closest friends. They're lovers, Oh absolutely. I mean in her heart,
21:26
Speaker 1: Anasauric is a con and she basically just cares about
21:32
Speaker 1: herself and she doesn't care what's left in her wake.
21:37
Speaker 1: And I've seen this through my career, both as an
21:40
Speaker 1: FBI agent and as a private investigator. People act the
21:44
Speaker 1: same way. I'm familiar with one con artist who dressed up.
21:48
Speaker 1: He's a Southern Baptist boy from Louisiana, and he dressed
21:53
Speaker 1: stuff like an Hasidic jew complete with clothing and makeup,
21:58
Speaker 1: so he could go vouch to other people in the
22:02
Speaker 1: Jewish community for himself. I mean that people will go
22:05
Speaker 1: to no ends to satisfy their greed, to satisfy their
22:10
Speaker 1: want for fame and power. How do you untangle a
22:14
Speaker 1: case like this well, I mean, obviously from a law
22:17
Speaker 1: enforcement perspective, you don't even know about it to somebody
22:21
Speaker 1: who reports it. I think the one thing that the
22:24
Speaker 1: Netflix show did a good job of, even if it
22:27
Speaker 1: partly is fictionalized, is the dog at work of the
22:33
Speaker 1: the investigative reporter. You can only tell so much online.
22:37
Speaker 1: You have to get out there and talk to people
22:39
Speaker 1: and get actual documents, and that's the only way to
22:45
Speaker 1: untangle the deceit that the con puts up. I'm thinking
22:48
Speaker 1: about her personality she goes to trial, she goes to trial.
22:54
Speaker 1: I want you to hear what the attorney said in court.
22:57
Speaker 1: Take a list and our cut seven our friends ay,
23:00
Speaker 1: she had to fake it until she can make it.
23:02
Speaker 1: Those words from the defendant's own attorney, who claims she
23:05
Speaker 1: never intended to commit a crime, but prosecutors call her
23:08
Speaker 1: a fraud and a liar who would do almost anything
23:11
Speaker 1: to prolong her life of luxury. This morning, the fate
23:16
Speaker 1: of an alleged scam artist is now in the hands
23:18
Speaker 1: of a jury, both sides wrapping up arguments for a
23:23
Speaker 1: case that's drawn international outrage. The style savvy defendant even
23:27
Speaker 1: turning heads in court wearing an animal print dress. She
23:31
Speaker 1: called herself Anna Delvi, a fashionable globetrotter who prosecutors say
23:35
Speaker 1: was pretending to be a high flying German heiress living
23:38
Speaker 1: a fairytale life of glitz and glam among Manhattan's elite. Wow. Okay,
23:44
Speaker 1: take a listen to her. Anna Sirokan, in her own
23:48
Speaker 1: words are cut nine from the BBC did you get
23:52
Speaker 1: a thrill from him. I mean, were you satisfied when
23:54
Speaker 1: you got away with something, when you achieved something, when
23:57
Speaker 1: you slipped under the radar and didn't have to pay?
23:59
Speaker 1: Was it fronting? Absolutely not, because in my head I
24:02
Speaker 1: never thought that I was cheating or getting away with anything.
24:05
Speaker 1: In my head, like any money that would borrow from them,
24:08
Speaker 1: they would be getting back. And I felt like they
24:10
Speaker 1: portrayed me is like someone who is very manipulative, which
24:13
Speaker 1: I don't think I am. And I was never really
24:16
Speaker 1: liked too nice of a person. I was never like
24:19
Speaker 1: really trying to talk my way and say anything. I
24:21
Speaker 1: kind of just told people what I wanted and like
24:23
Speaker 1: the either gave it to me or not, and I
24:25
Speaker 1: just moved on. But she taught them into what she
24:28
Speaker 1: wanted through lines. I mean, Donna rockwell, we really need
24:31
Speaker 1: to shrink. How can she take hundreds of thousands of
24:35
Speaker 1: dollars in luxury hotels, clothing that she got her friends
24:40
Speaker 1: to pay for, wreaking up credit cards she needs She'd
24:44
Speaker 1: never pay back hundreds of thousands of dollars in credit cards,
24:49
Speaker 1: all based on lines. I mean, she had to know
24:52
Speaker 1: that was wrong. She wasn't just faking it, fake it
24:55
Speaker 1: till you make it. She was outright lying for goods
24:59
Speaker 1: and services. Yes, she was outright lying. That's how we
25:03
Speaker 1: see it. It's interesting, you know, because a person who
25:07
Speaker 1: has early life narcissistic wounds, Okay, I see, I don't
25:11
Speaker 1: know what that means. What it means that someone is
25:14
Speaker 1: only really thinking about themselves. You said a narcissistic wound.
25:18
Speaker 1: What's a narcissistic wound? I know who narcissis is, but
25:21
Speaker 1: what's a narcissistic wound? When we're babies, if our mother
25:26
Speaker 1: or primary caretaker doesn't look at us and say, who
25:29
Speaker 1: is a pretty baby? Who is a pretty baby, we
25:31
Speaker 1: don't know that we exist. So without early life mirroring,
25:35
Speaker 1: meaning the parent or the caregivers looking at you, you
25:39
Speaker 1: know you're existing, You're smiling back, there becomes a deficit
25:43
Speaker 1: that develops in a person, and that is who becomes
25:46
Speaker 1: a narcissist or a self serving person in adulthood, and
25:50
Speaker 1: we probably know many of them in our own lives. However,
25:53
Speaker 1: in the context of same there's something called acquired situational
25:59
Speaker 1: narcissist them which means that the situations that we come
26:03
Speaker 1: into after we're a baby in other words, like Anna
26:06
Speaker 1: when she was in her nineteen and in her twenties,
26:09
Speaker 1: is enough to turn us into that kind of a person,
26:12
Speaker 1: meaning all for me and none for you. And how
26:16
Speaker 1: does she get away with that? She gets away with
26:19
Speaker 1: it because she's in denial, which is a psychological coping mechanism.
26:24
Speaker 1: So the only way that she can do these things
26:27
Speaker 1: is to not have a conscience, to not think about it.
26:30
Speaker 1: So she has a sense of acquired situational narcissism because
26:35
Speaker 1: of her situation, and then wanted more of it and
26:38
Speaker 1: more of it and more of it. And what people
26:40
Speaker 1: don't really understand about saying is that it is addictive.
26:44
Speaker 1: As heroine, the second we get a taste of the spotlight,
26:49
Speaker 1: most of us, we want more and more and more.
26:52
Speaker 1: And that's what happened with Anna. She was in denial.
26:55
Speaker 1: She was projecting anything that she was thinking about herself
26:58
Speaker 1: onto other people. She asked for what she wants did,
27:02
Speaker 1: as we just heard on the tape, she got it
27:04
Speaker 1: or she didn't get it, and she moved on. She
27:06
Speaker 1: did not have a conscience to think about is this
27:09
Speaker 1: the right thing? Am I hurting anybody? That's not how
27:12
Speaker 1: these people think. And it became more and more and
27:15
Speaker 1: more because theme is addictive, you know, Wendy passion. She
27:19
Speaker 1: may have justified it in her own mind, certainly, not
27:22
Speaker 1: defending her because this is irrational red, This is not reasoning,
27:26
Speaker 1: it's irrational. She was taking from rich people in the
27:31
Speaker 1: Hampton's I'm talking to, like thirty million dollar homes with
27:36
Speaker 1: you know, guesthouses that are bigger than our homes or apartments.
27:41
Speaker 1: She was taking from someone that could afford it while
27:45
Speaker 1: she overstayed on the yacht for a week because somebody
27:48
Speaker 1: else much richer than her was paying for it. So
27:51
Speaker 1: I wonder in her mind did she justify it that
27:54
Speaker 1: way only had it been a very short amount of time,
27:57
Speaker 1: or something over a weekend or maybe even a week.
27:59
Speaker 1: But out of time, the duration that this went on,
28:02
Speaker 1: there was no conceivable way in her mind that she
28:05
Speaker 1: possibly could have thought she would pay any of it back.
28:08
Speaker 1: You know, she may have faked it until she made
28:10
Speaker 1: it when she first got to New York, but when
28:12
Speaker 1: stealing money from others over that period of time, faking
28:15
Speaker 1: it is fraud. Hopefully that was a sound bite somebody
28:18
Speaker 1: used at her trial, because there's no other way circumstantially
28:21
Speaker 1: you can justify that many victims over that long period
28:25
Speaker 1: of time, and even now it's still all about her.
28:29
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friend Emily Mateless at the
28:32
Speaker 1: BBC cut ten. Why do you think so many people
28:35
Speaker 1: believed you then? What was it in your personality that
28:38
Speaker 1: could convince people? I don't know. I think like maybe
28:41
Speaker 1: believed I was smart and I was working on something
28:43
Speaker 1: that was that could have like a great potential and
28:47
Speaker 1: that would be successful. I don't know. I don't feel
28:50
Speaker 1: like it has much to do with my personality. I
28:52
Speaker 1: guess i'd like I really believed in myself and what
28:54
Speaker 1: I was doing. I don't know, It's it's hard to playing.
29:02
Speaker 1: I guess like people just see like I'm talented, and
29:05
Speaker 1: I was fokist, and I worked hard and I couldn't
29:09
Speaker 1: make them a lot of money. Rebecca Rosenberg worked hard
29:12
Speaker 1: at what. Every time I see a photo or a
29:16
Speaker 1: post of her, she's on a luxury trip or she's
29:18
Speaker 1: shopping at WHAT Well. I think I think her A
29:21
Speaker 1: lot of her victims wanted to believe in her success
29:24
Speaker 1: because it meant their success too. You know, if she's saying, Okay,
29:27
Speaker 1: I'm going to build this. Anna Delby Foundation in Manhattan
29:31
Speaker 1: for twenty two million. And you know one of the person,
29:35
Speaker 1: one of the people she'd do with the architect, Well
29:37
Speaker 1: for him, you know, he wanted to be involved in
29:40
Speaker 1: that big project, so he wanted to sort of believe
29:43
Speaker 1: the lie because it would ultimately help him. So I
29:46
Speaker 1: think a lot of it was people wanting to kind
29:49
Speaker 1: of believe it was true because there was an advantage
29:51
Speaker 1: to them. These are just some of the things. And
29:55
Speaker 1: I want to go to you on Jim Alice that
29:57
Speaker 1: we have uncovered falsify financial documents from international banks wait
30:03
Speaker 1: for it, totally approximately sixty million euros, securing a loan
30:10
Speaker 1: of one hundred grand after lying to bank reps from CTI,
30:15
Speaker 1: depositing countless bad checks and to other banks. I guess
30:20
Speaker 1: you know how you flow to check deposit a check,
30:24
Speaker 1: you would draw the funds, and then you try to
30:27
Speaker 1: short up from another bad account so that won't fall through,
30:31
Speaker 1: and then another You basically play ropa dope on banks.
30:35
Speaker 1: That was totaling nearly eighty thousand dollars. That doesn't include
30:40
Speaker 1: the money she conned off her friends, never paying them
30:43
Speaker 1: back deft of services almost a half a million dollars.
30:49
Speaker 1: I mean that's a lot of money. Jim. Oh, absolutely,
30:54
Speaker 1: it's a lot of money. And you mentioned it earlier.
30:57
Speaker 1: You weren't sure how she ever worked hard. She worked
31:00
Speaker 1: too hard in preparing all these fraudulent documents and passing
31:06
Speaker 1: all those bogus checks and coming up with stories that
31:09
Speaker 1: were plausible but yet not too specific. The life of
31:13
Speaker 1: a con is hard work, and they do it for
31:18
Speaker 1: the for the power, they do it for the money,
31:21
Speaker 1: they do it for the thing. I think she solved
31:23
Speaker 1: the banks as her potential savior. You know, you think
31:27
Speaker 1: of of like Elizabeth Holmes with Sarinos. You know, was
31:32
Speaker 1: she a genius or was she a scam artist? You know,
31:36
Speaker 1: if if, if Sorkin was able to produce all these
31:40
Speaker 1: phony documents and convince a bank to lend her twenty
31:44
Speaker 1: two million dollars. So why explain that to us, mere mortals,
31:48
Speaker 1: What do you mean, produce phony documents and convince big
31:51
Speaker 1: banks to learn her lots of money? Sure it happened.
31:55
Speaker 1: You know, she apparently was really adept in Adobe photoshop.
32:00
Speaker 1: I mean, she was taking documents and altering them to
32:04
Speaker 1: convince the bankers that she had Swiss bank accounts, that
32:08
Speaker 1: she had trust documents that she had lawyers and CPAs
32:13
Speaker 1: or accountants over in Europe, and it was going at
32:17
Speaker 1: least to a certain extent, probably until it hit the
32:20
Speaker 1: underwriting department, the people in the back of the office
32:25
Speaker 1: who makes sure everything's all the boxes are checked. It
32:29
Speaker 1: was it was painting a picture of her, of exactly
32:32
Speaker 1: who she was claiming to be. And I think if
32:35
Speaker 1: she probably she possibly could have felt that if she
32:39
Speaker 1: was able to land that loan, in her mind, she
32:43
Speaker 1: probably was going to pay all those people back that
32:46
Speaker 1: she had scammed prends. In her mind, it's and she
32:50
Speaker 1: may have, we don't know. She's kicking the can down
32:53
Speaker 1: the road. She's getting her next victim, and when that,
32:57
Speaker 1: when it comes time to pay them back, she'll work
33:00
Speaker 1: about that later. It's it's never ending. I mean, it's
33:04
Speaker 1: it's what brings down every Ponzi scheme in the end.
33:06
Speaker 1: And this wasn't a large scale Ponzi scheme. But you know,
33:10
Speaker 1: some of that money she scammed from from through those
33:14
Speaker 1: phony checks that she deposited with City Bank and the
33:17
Speaker 1: loans she got from um City National Bank, she used
33:22
Speaker 1: to pay some of her debts that to the hotels
33:26
Speaker 1: and other businesses so that she could stay afloat and
33:29
Speaker 1: maintain that illusion. Well, jem Ellis, I guess what you're
33:33
Speaker 1: saying is she would pay back the hotels to the
33:36
Speaker 1: extent that she could get them to allow her to
33:38
Speaker 1: stay there for even longer. I mean, what does it mean,
33:42
Speaker 1: Dakota check? Well, d Kaida check. And it's a lot
33:45
Speaker 1: harder nowadays than they used to be because the float,
33:50
Speaker 1: which is the time that the check is deposited into
33:52
Speaker 1: one bank and actually clears in the originating bank, it's
33:56
Speaker 1: so much shorter. But you you basically take it and
34:00
Speaker 1: you present it to a bank that you know is worthless.
34:04
Speaker 1: Ordered may appear it has funds, but by the time
34:07
Speaker 1: that check is presented for payment to the originating bank,
34:10
Speaker 1: and I'm sorry this is probably very very technical, there
34:15
Speaker 1: aren't any funds available. And from what I read, she's
34:19
Speaker 1: submitted one hundred and sixty thousand dollars worth fraud in
34:22
Speaker 1: the checks and she was able to get seventy thousand
34:25
Speaker 1: in cash out of it. That's not that's actually a
34:27
Speaker 1: really good turnaround on the scam crime stories with Nancy
34:42
Speaker 1: Grace Delvey's Dinner Club. That's what Anna Delby slash Sorkin
34:49
Speaker 1: is calling a reality series that she is hawking making
34:55
Speaker 1: money off her crime. Quote. Delvi's Dinner Club will reveal
35:01
Speaker 1: the actual woman behind everything we've read and watched about Anna.
35:06
Speaker 1: She is breaking her story in her own words, and
35:10
Speaker 1: we believe she will defy viewers expectations. Listen, I've been
35:15
Speaker 1: in the crime business a long time, in the TV
35:18
Speaker 1: business a long time, and that is absolutely a script
35:20
Speaker 1: written by some TV producer. She is breaking her story
35:24
Speaker 1: in her own words, and we believe she will defy
35:28
Speaker 1: viewers expectations. I bet she won't be inviting the prosecutor
35:32
Speaker 1: over for one of her curated friend groups and culinary delights.
35:37
Speaker 1: Can I just give you one more quote? The show's
35:40
Speaker 1: quote Esteemed guests will be encouraged to ask Sorkin about
35:44
Speaker 1: her criminal exploits, according to a press release, It will
35:48
Speaker 1: also focus on her experience living under house arrest in
35:51
Speaker 1: the East Village department she's been living in since her
35:55
Speaker 1: release from prison. Last Fault. You know what I want
35:57
Speaker 1: to hear about how she's turning her life around, paying
36:00
Speaker 1: back all her debts and all of her victims. If
36:03
Speaker 1: you don't believe me, when you don't know a horse,
36:06
Speaker 1: look at our track record, take a listen to our
36:09
Speaker 1: friends at GMA. Good Morning America. The courtroom drama played
36:13
Speaker 1: out late into the evening. At one point the jury
36:15
Speaker 1: appeared deadlock, the defense asking for a mistrial, but then
36:19
Speaker 1: the verdict, jurors agreeing with the prosecution that Anna Saurikin
36:23
Speaker 1: built her fairytale life on a foundation of theft and lies. Overnight,
36:28
Speaker 1: a New York City jury finding socialite Annasaurkan, a so
36:31
Speaker 1: called SOHO grifter, guilty on eight counts, including grand larceny,
36:36
Speaker 1: attempted grand larceny, and theft of services. Prosecutors arguing the
36:41
Speaker 1: twenty eight year old stole a quarter of a million
36:43
Speaker 1: dollars from banks, hotels and friends to fund a lavish lifestyle.
36:47
Speaker 1: The jurors obviously believed our point of view and followed
36:51
Speaker 1: our logic and acquitted her for the top charges. I'm
36:53
Speaker 1: sad and that she was convicted of some of the
36:55
Speaker 1: other charges. Sorkin was acquitted of two charges, including the
36:58
Speaker 1: most serious attack, paying to steal more than one million
37:01
Speaker 1: dollars from City National Bank. She now faces deportation and
37:05
Speaker 1: up to fifteen years in prison. Jee Rebecca resib joining
37:09
Speaker 1: us from fox Sties Digital explained the split verdict. What
37:13
Speaker 1: was she convicted on, ann on what was she acquitted.
37:16
Speaker 1: She was acquitted on trying to score this massive twenty
37:20
Speaker 1: million dollars loan, which was one of the top charges.
37:24
Speaker 1: That was the attempted grand larceny, and she was acquitted
37:27
Speaker 1: of stealing the number kind of buried, but around seventy
37:32
Speaker 1: thousand from Rachel Deloche. That was the trip that she
37:35
Speaker 1: invited her best friend at the time, Rachel delochean to
37:38
Speaker 1: Morocco where they stayed me seven thousand a night riad
37:42
Speaker 1: in Marrakesh, and at the end of the trip she
37:45
Speaker 1: stuck her with to bill. She persuaded her to put
37:48
Speaker 1: the entire trip on her credit card and she would
37:50
Speaker 1: pay her back. So those were the two main counts
37:53
Speaker 1: she was acquitted on, and then she was convicted in
38:00
Speaker 1: she was convicted in the chartered plane incident. Wait well wait,
38:04
Speaker 1: let me let that so Ken Rebecca Reisenberg, They chartered
38:08
Speaker 1: plane incident? What was that? So it was called blade
38:12
Speaker 1: as the company, and she persuaded them to fly her
38:17
Speaker 1: without paying up front to a Berkshire Halthaway conference in Omaha,
38:24
Speaker 1: and basically was like, I'll pay you later, and they
38:27
Speaker 1: thought she'd paid them later and she didn't. And that
38:29
Speaker 1: was about thirty five thousand dollars. It was a chartered flight.
38:33
Speaker 1: They chartered flight incident. Okay, so she ends up going
38:40
Speaker 1: to not just jail, but to Rikers. Is anybody on
38:44
Speaker 1: the panel familiar with Rikers? Okay, yes, just that reputation. Yeah,
38:50
Speaker 1: you don't want to go there unless you have to
38:53
Speaker 1: take a Listen to Anna Sarokin speaking to our friend
38:58
Speaker 1: Deborah Roberts at ABC. Now thirty years old, Sarakin says
39:02
Speaker 1: she's paid for her mistakes, her time behind bars, including
39:06
Speaker 1: nineteen months in New York's infamous Rikers Island jailed, some
39:09
Speaker 1: of it in solitary confinement. You're being held in Rikers,
39:13
Speaker 1: one of the most frightening jails in the country. What
39:18
Speaker 1: was that like for you? Were you terrified in a
39:21
Speaker 1: way that was therapeutic? I mean it's a therapeutic I
39:25
Speaker 1: for example, use the time, like to read a lot
39:27
Speaker 1: and to write. You've heard that, you've said that the
39:30
Speaker 1: prison is kind of a waste of time. Yeah, taking
39:33
Speaker 1: a person, stripping them off everything, putting them somewhere where
39:37
Speaker 1: they have pretty much very few opportunities to rehabilitate. So
39:42
Speaker 1: how is this supposed to help someone who already had
39:44
Speaker 1: to resort to life of crime? And that tells me
39:48
Speaker 1: right there that Anna Delvi aka Anna Strokin learned nothing
39:54
Speaker 1: from her time behind bars, Windy patric nothing. It also
39:57
Speaker 1: tells us that she is admitting that she was to
40:00
Speaker 1: a life of crime, which countradicts everything she said before
40:03
Speaker 1: the trial and even in some interviews after the trial.
40:06
Speaker 1: She knew because she wasn't working, as you pointed out
40:09
Speaker 1: several times, there was no way she was going to
40:11
Speaker 1: be able to repay these loans. But sitting through the trial,
40:14
Speaker 1: sitting in Riker's Island prison therapeutic you have to wonder
40:18
Speaker 1: whether she received special treatment. We don't know one way
40:21
Speaker 1: or the other, but it is very interesting that her
40:23
Speaker 1: attitude apparently hasn't changed. I'm sure she got special treatment
40:27
Speaker 1: because she had managed to convince everyone that she was
40:30
Speaker 1: a celebrity that deserves special treatment, you know, Rebecca rosen Burk,
40:34
Speaker 1: I'm not sure I understand the not guilty on the
40:38
Speaker 1: sixty grand she ripped off from Rachel Delisha Williams. What
40:42
Speaker 1: was the jury's thinking? Well, I spoke to a couple
40:45
Speaker 1: of jurors after the verdict, and they kind of felt
40:48
Speaker 1: that in the end, Rachel came out ahead, even though
40:52
Speaker 1: it was this like really stressful situation for her where
40:55
Speaker 1: she had put the payment for the trip on her
40:59
Speaker 1: work visa card and just you know, it was a
41:03
Speaker 1: sum of money that was greater than what she earned
41:05
Speaker 1: as a salary. But eventually, you know, she did, she
41:12
Speaker 1: did end up with I think her book advanced was
41:15
Speaker 1: three hundred thousand dollars. I don't know what she got
41:18
Speaker 1: paid from HBO. So I think that they just didn't
41:20
Speaker 1: feel that bad for her. But why because why did
41:23
Speaker 1: they not feel bad for Rachel Williams Because she was
41:27
Speaker 1: also using Anna stroke and you could say, like she,
41:30
Speaker 1: you know, it's sort of weird, like she's going out
41:32
Speaker 1: with Anna all the time and Anna's always paying for
41:35
Speaker 1: absolutely everything. You know, It's it's I personally wouldn't feel
41:41
Speaker 1: that comfortable if I was going out with somebody, even
41:44
Speaker 1: if they were much wealthier than me, with them footing
41:47
Speaker 1: the bill every time. So I think that was kind
41:49
Speaker 1: of their reasoning. Take a listen to what happens immediately
41:54
Speaker 1: when she walks out from behind bars ar cut fourteen
41:57
Speaker 1: inside Edition. You walked out of prison a free woman.
42:00
Speaker 1: Hid What was the first thing you did that brought
42:03
Speaker 1: me my phone? So I got on social media. She
42:08
Speaker 1: came out of prison and immediately sat down to do
42:10
Speaker 1: this interview with us, and immediately went on social media
42:14
Speaker 1: and immediately started to resume kind of a glamorous life.
42:17
Speaker 1: Surkin is now back in custody awaiting a hearing to
42:20
Speaker 1: see if she will be deported to Germany. The big
42:23
Speaker 1: question is will she be released. She could be in
42:26
Speaker 1: the next few weeks, and will she be deported. But
42:29
Speaker 1: whatever happens, there is no question in my mind that
42:32
Speaker 1: we have not heard the last from Anasaurikin. So the
42:36
Speaker 1: first thing she does is hot on social media. What
42:40
Speaker 1: does that tell you, doctor Rockwell, the same thing it
42:43
Speaker 1: tells you, doctor Gray, that she didn't feel bad about
42:47
Speaker 1: one thing through this entire event, that there's a lack
42:51
Speaker 1: of conscience, and that she was loving the spotlight and
42:55
Speaker 1: she couldn't wait to get back into it. As I say,
42:58
Speaker 1: it's an addiction. It makes the hormones flash in your mind.
43:02
Speaker 1: You have endorsed in. Your brain comes alive with your
43:06
Speaker 1: own image, and you love it. You salivate over it,
43:10
Speaker 1: and that's what happened to Anna Sorkin, Jim Ellis certified
43:13
Speaker 1: Fraught Examiner or now with his own firm JKE Texas
43:17
Speaker 1: dot Com, Jim shopaholics or people that get a thrill
43:22
Speaker 1: out of buying things. I think Anna Sirokan aka Anna
43:28
Speaker 1: Delvi got a thrill of some sort of this fake
43:33
Speaker 1: life she was leading. Do you think someone like her
43:38
Speaker 1: can turn over a new leaf or is this just
43:41
Speaker 1: who she is? Well, that's a good question. I mean,
43:44
Speaker 1: I always hope I didn't say what you hope. Jim Ellis,
43:49
Speaker 1: you investigated so many con guys, what do you think
43:53
Speaker 1: they don't stop? I mean, as you pointed out, she
43:57
Speaker 1: immediately got back on social media, And I agree with
44:01
Speaker 1: doctor Rockwell that it was for the endorphin rush of
44:06
Speaker 1: getting that hit, of getting that fame and putting out
44:08
Speaker 1: that projection. But I think it's also a certain aspect
44:12
Speaker 1: that that is rebuilding her stature so that she can
44:17
Speaker 1: now see where she can get her next meal ticket from.
44:23
Speaker 1: But who in their right mind would want to work
44:25
Speaker 1: with somebody that just got out of prison for defrauding
44:31
Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of dollars from the people she was
44:34
Speaker 1: closest to well, you know what, I may have an answer.
44:37
Speaker 1: Take a listen to my long time friend and colleague
44:40
Speaker 1: at ABC, Deborah roberts Our cut twelve now out on parole.
44:44
Speaker 1: Sorkin's documenting her freedom on social media, moving into a
44:48
Speaker 1: new apartment, shopping and dining out her new life, financed
44:52
Speaker 1: partly by a Netflix deal she signed while behind bars.
44:56
Speaker 1: It's said to be worth just over three hundred thousand dollars.
45:00
Speaker 1: Many people would find that very strange that you had
45:03
Speaker 1: gotten into trouble, you went to trial, you went to prison,
45:07
Speaker 1: and there's a Netflix steel around your story. I find
45:10
Speaker 1: it strange steal. So were you sort of milking your
45:14
Speaker 1: crime for the fame? No, definitely not. Do you feel badly?
45:17
Speaker 1: Do you have regrets? I feel like I'm just trying
45:19
Speaker 1: to deal with the consequences of my actions. I was young.
45:25
Speaker 1: I would not repeat my actions. I'm just trying to
45:28
Speaker 1: make the best out of my situation. The reality is
45:31
Speaker 1: Anna Sorkin was born to working class Russian parents. She
45:36
Speaker 1: grew up in Germany, moved to New York twenty thirteen
45:40
Speaker 1: and launched her roofs her scam, which included fabricating financial
45:45
Speaker 1: documents to back up proclaims of having millions and millions
45:51
Speaker 1: and trust funds to swindle banks, realtors, and people that
45:57
Speaker 1: believed they were her friends into paying for her lavish lifestyle. Okay, guys,
46:07
Speaker 1: if you want to watch Delvi's Dinner Club, have at it.
46:11
Speaker 1: I'll stick to the court transcript Nancy Grace Crime Stories
46:17
Speaker 1: signing off, goodbye friend,