Latest / Karl and Crew / Biblical Minimalism with Joshua Becker & Redeeming Time with Family with Dan Seaborn

Transcript

Biblical Minimalism with Joshua Becker & Redeeming Time with Family with Dan Seaborn · Karl and Crew

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  S1: Broadcasting from Chicago, across North America and beyond. It's Carl
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  S1: and crew.
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  S2: Come as you are an experienced guide, overcome what seems
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  S2: impossible and live as you never imagined.
• 0:14
  S1: Start your morning with a laugh.
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  S2: Cold spaghetti's. Great. Okay.
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  S3: Okay, I disagree. I guess not. No, certainly it is not. No. Okay. Well, man,
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  S3: I'm going back.
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  S2: To my bachelor days. I guess I thought cold spaghetti
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  S2: was universally loved.
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  S4: I've never been known for, like, high levels of coordination.
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  S4: That's just. It feels like.
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  S2: I've never been known for high levels of coordination.
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  S1: Delivering the truth daily.
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  S4: If it were possible to have every worldly gain available
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  S4: and you're forfeiting your soul. There's no amount of gain
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  S4: that would make it worth it.
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  S5: Our own way never ever works. Because it's apart from
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  S5: the life source, which is God.
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  S6: For me, growing up, love was always conditional and can
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  S6: be taken from you. Christ's love can't. And he went
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  S6: to the cross with my mind and my heart that night.
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  S1: Now from the call of Hope Studios, this is Carl
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  S1: and crew.
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  S2: So my wife and I talk about radio.
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  S4: Ah, that makes sense. I mean.
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  S2: Like, a.
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  S3: Lot.
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  S5: It is your job.
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  S6: I could see that. Yeah.
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  S2: You know who starts the conversations?
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  S4: Your wife.
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  S2: Thank you very much.
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  S4: Exactly.
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  S2: Everyone could have guessed that one.
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  S4: Yeah.
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  S2: My bride is my silent coach. Silent to you.
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  S4: Okay. I was like, so what does she do? Like
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  S4: a Morse code or hand gestures?
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  S2: Oh, she does hand gestures, but she's always got ideas.
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  S2: And one of the insights that she had, and we're
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  S2: going to tackle it this week for sure, is that
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  S2: some of our time redemption issues revolve around medicating pain, anxiousness,
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  S2: Crises that were going through unresolved relationships, she said. Bob,
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  S2: I want you to know that there's a lot of
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  S2: people that fall into a black hole of who knows what.
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  S2: But the reason is, is that there's pain and it's
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  S2: a way of medicating it.
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  S4: Yeah.
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  S2: And sometimes that's all you can do. What, you're nodding
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  S2: like crazy in there.
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  S6: I absolutely see it. I mean, it literally is the
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  S6: black hole. And you're sucked in and you feel like
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  S6: you have absolutely no way out and you're gripping and
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  S6: you're losing that grip really fast.
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  S2: Yeah. And it's. And let's be real here for a moment, guys.
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  S2: I mean, that's when you have pain. Sometimes TV is
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  S2: a friend. Let's just be real.
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  S4: Yeah.
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  S3: 100%.
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  S5: Sometimes food is a friend.
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  S2: Yes.
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  S6: That's it.
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  S5: And I think that that can become not redeeming time
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  S5: because I mean snacking. Yeah. You gotta go have a meal.
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  S5: You could take some time apart from that meal, but
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  S5: sometimes you can get just stuck snacking and then snacking
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  S5: and snacking. And before you know it, you've been sitting
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  S5: there eating a bag of chips for a half hour.
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  S2: You know, you know what's funny about that? I've never
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  S2: usually been that guy. Yeah, but I, I become that
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  S2: guy on one thing.
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  S5: I know what it is.
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  S2: No, you don't, I don't.
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  S3: Are you sure?
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  S5: I think so.
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  S2: What is.
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  S5: It? Uh, the peanut butter pretzels.
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  S2: That could be. But I've got one worse than that.
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  S3: Worse than that?
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  S6: Yeah, sardines, but no cheddar bunnies.
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  S3: What?
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  S5: Annie's cheddar.
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  S3: Cheese.
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  S4: Cheddar bunnies.
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  S2: Yeah.
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  S3: That's like.
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  S4: Toddler food.
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  S3: Oh. Oh. Oh.
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  S4: Wait. What? Hello? What?
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  S5: Okay, you just told the grown man that's like toddler food.
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  S2: Yeah, that's that's what she just did.
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  S6: Well, maybe.
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  S4: Maybe.
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  S2: Should I give her grace on this one? Or should
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  S2: I blast her with something I can't even know? It's.
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  S2: You know, I do not like the bunny bunnies. I
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  S2: like the square Cheez-Its ones, but I'll eat the cheddar bunnies.
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  S2: But to me, the cheddar bunnies have way too much
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  S2: cheese powder on them, and they get goopy. Like when
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  S2: you're reaching with your.
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  S3: Hands and your.
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  S2: Fingers. Have you ever gotten layers of that cheese stuff
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  S2: on your fingers?
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  S3: You, like, scrape.
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  S2: It off with your teeth?
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  S3: Yeah, yeah.
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  S6: Yeah. Nothing like a handprint.
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  S3: From a.
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  S5: Toddler.
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  S6: With cheeses on.
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  S3: There. No, I mean, I'm not.
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  S2: Offended by that because I see other grown men. In fact,
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  S2: I reach for there were like two boxes of these
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  S2: things left and me and a dude collided and and
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  S2: we're reaching in, and I yielded to him and he goes,
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  S2: all I need is one. I go, all I need
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  S2: is one. So he seriously cleared the shelf there.
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  S4: Buds for life now.
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  S3: Yeah.
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  S2: So no, I'm a sucker for those things, okay. And
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  S2: they're cheddar bunnies, but mine are like, they're the Cheez-Its, man.
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  S2: They're Cheez-Its, but they're healthy.
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  S4: Okay. Are they in the shape of a bunny?
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  S2: No, they're in the shape of a Cheez-It.
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  S5: But they're the same.
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  S2: Same.
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  S3: Brand. Brand.
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  S4: Okay. Got it.
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  S3: Got it.
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  S2: Toddlers. Sorry, man. Never do it physically when I want
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  S2: to emotionally smack her upside the head for that one.
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  S4: I mean.
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  S2: It's okay, it's fine. It's fine.
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  S4: They're like the goldfish family.
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  S2: I mean, no, they are. They are.
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  S3: The goldfish.
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  S2: But I used to be able to eat goldfish. Those
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  S2: aren't they, Pepperidge farm? Yes. Yeah. So you give me
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  S2: a Pepperidge Farm when I found out there's all kinds of.
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  S2: So they bundle it up in a great package. Yeah,
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  S2: but what's inside that sucker are dyes that kill mice.
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  S3: There are.
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  S4: No.
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  S6: I'm serious. I know you used to be just.
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  S2: It's one of the worst foods you can get are
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  S2: those things.
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  S3: But they're so.
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  S5: Cute. I hear cheddar bunnies are a great side for
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  S5: chicken dinosaurs.
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  S3: You know what? I'm gonna smack.
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  S2: You for sure. Her. I'll give grace to you. Get
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  S2: no grace at all. You're getting no grace at all.
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  S4: And I just.
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  S2: Smack you upside the head. What'd you say? Super dad.
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  S6: I said in a juice box.
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  S2: Okay. All right. I see how this is gonna go
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  S2: here today.
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  S6: We love you.
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  S2: No you don't. No you don't. You're lying through your teeth.
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  S2: Terrible man. Oh, man. This is rough in here today, people.
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  S2: I'm glad I'm secure in Christ Jesus, my Lord.
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  S5: Amen.
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  S4: Take.
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  S6: Take my cheese bunnies and leave. Forget you.
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  S4: Super diet's on.
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  S2: It. You know what? I love him so much. I
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  S2: would if I had a box of cheese bunnies right now.
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  S2: I'd be out of here. I love those things. They
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  S2: are the. You know what else is good in the
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  S2: Annie's line? The Annie animal crackers?
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  S6: Oh, yes, you're.
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  S2: Right. Annie's animal crackers are the best.
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  S5: Didn't we start this by talking about something serious?
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  S2: Yeah, we did. Well, where were we at? Where were we.
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  S5: At?
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  S2: Oh, no. We're talking about something very serious. Yes, and
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  S2: it's about when people beat you up emotionally and you
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  S2: feel like you're in a cave, you'll reach for things
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  S2: like that and yourself. And what? On a serious note,
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  S2: when you feel like you're kicked in the teeth or
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  S2: you've got some relational roadblock going on or something feels
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  S2: like total loss, that can be one of the biggest
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  S2: black holes of time wasting going, man, it really can.
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  S5: Absolutely. I've said those statements of, you know, when I
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  S5: when I'm just completely done and exhausted, like I, I say,
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  S5: I just need to go turn my brain off. And
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  S5: that's not always a healthy thing sometimes, like we talked
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  S5: about with drew Dick yesterday, you know, sporting events or
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  S5: Alex McFarland yesterday, sporting events, you know, they're good to
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  S5: go to rest recharge. But I would I would want
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  S5: to go and turn my brain off and just not
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  S5: function with anything for a while. And that's not healthy.
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  S2: Yeah. No, it's so my bride's head's up for us
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  S2: is a good one, guys. The fact is, and my
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  S2: heart goes out to you, you feel like, Carl, I
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  S2: am wasting time. I know it, but I feel like
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  S2: I'm medicating pain. And you know what we're going to do?
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  S2: Ali's got a great conversation with the man coming up here,
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  S2: a moment that this is going to be in his
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  S2: wheelhouse for sure. So we're going to get after that.
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  S2: You guys ready to rumble?
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  S4: Ready to do.
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  S1: She's a choreographer extraordinaire and everything is Greek to her.
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  S1: Super Di is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
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  S1: on Moody radio.
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  S4: It's so easy to get sucked into things where time
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  S4: passes quickly and you look up from maybe from your phone,
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  S4: from a screen, from something else, from a sporting event.
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  S4: And time has passed much more so than you had intended.
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  S4: Unredeemed time, Carl often says, flows to our weakness. I'm
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  S4: not sure who is the originator of that, but Carl's
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  S4: the one who I hear it repeated the most.
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  S5: I've only heard Carl quotes it, but I've only heard
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  S5: it out of his mouth.
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  S4: Got a special guest joining us this morning. His name
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  S4: is Dan Seaborne. He founded Winning at Home, an organization
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  S4: that produces media resources, hosts events to encourage marriages and families.
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  S4: You know, we just were talking about how so often
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  S4: when it comes to unredeemed time, people can immediately feel like, oh,
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  S4: I'm just lazy. I'm just not good with time. I'm
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  S4: not disciplined. And when we think about our sinful tendencies,
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  S4: there's some truth to some of that. But a lot
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  S4: of times, pain can drive us to not want to
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  S4: face the thing that's staring us in the face. And
• 9:32
  S4: so we slip into habits that kind of fritter away
• 9:36
  S4: our time. Speak to that a little bit from your
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  S4: work and from your perspective.
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  S7: Well, first I would just say, do you guys know
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  S7: me really well or something? It's like, are you taking
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  S7: a cheap shot here? No, I, I think most of
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  S7: us experience this. It's common. It's normal. Especially like from
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  S7: my perspective, I come from a long line of warriors.
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  S7: We're we're just gifted at it. And so when you
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  S7: have that in your DNA, it's part of who you are.
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  S7: Then your mind gets absorbed with things. The best thing
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  S7: I think we need to do, number one, is take
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  S7: a look at your week. Just look at your week
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  S7: right now. How much time if you reflected back and
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  S7: and spent time pondering it, how much time have you
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  S7: wasted on something that you honestly don't have a ton
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  S7: of control over? And for me, when I do that,
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  S7: like sometimes that happens for me at night and I
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  S7: just pause a moment and say, okay, Jesus, I need
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  S7: to renew my mind right now. It's going down a
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  S7: bad rabbit hole and I don't want it to go there.
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  S7: So guide me and help me in understanding that you
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  S7: don't want this for me in my life. So I
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  S7: think if we get that bigger picture of God doesn't
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  S7: want you to spend your time wasted on things that are,
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  S7: you know, don't have a lot of purpose and are
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  S7: actually discouraging for you. So I would just say, first
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  S7: of all, do a little self-evaluation and go, how much
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  S7: time am I spending doing this? Because if it's wasted time,
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  S7: you need to just own that.
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  S4: And it can kind of become like the numbing effect. Like,
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  S4: I mean, I've, I've caught myself doing this, you know,
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  S4: there was a challenging situation relationally. And I found myself,
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  S4: I was frustrated in my own heart and mind. And
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  S4: so I just kind of reached for my phone and
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  S4: opened an app and just kind of was scrolling. And
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  S4: in an instant I realized like, I was, it was
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  S4: a coping mechanism. I didn't really want to feel the
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  S4: discomfort of that emotion. And so it was kind of
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  S4: that numbing. I just want to turn off my, my brain,
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  S4: which can feel in the moment, like it kind of
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  S4: shuts that thing down, but it doesn't really lead us toward,
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  S4: toward healing.
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  S7: No, that's right in my mind goes to Proverbs 19.
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  S7: I was looking at that this morning. It says in
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  S7: verse eight, the one who gets wisdom loves life. Now,
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  S7: on surface level, we hear that and go, oh, yeah, sure,
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  S7: it makes a lot of sense. but when you're in
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  S7: a tough spot, when you're dealing with hard emotions or
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  S7: maybe difficult things in your family work life, um, it's
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  S7: really hard to go. HMM. What's the nugget of wisdom
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  S7: I'm gaining here? Because you're just in a painful spot? Yeah.
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  S7: And I think that one of the things that I've
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  S7: been trying to do is when I'm in that spot saying, Lord,
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  S7: what are you teaching me here? I, I there's a
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  S7: nugget of wisdom. Maybe I'm missing because I don't do it.
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  S7: All right? Because like you, Ali, last week I had
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  S7: a situation that I was in. There was just some
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  S7: incredibly hard things, and there was a lot of injustice
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  S7: happening in this scenario. And it was really upsetting me,
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  S7: like upsetting me enough that I was I was losing
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  S7: control in a couple of situations, and I just had
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  S7: to get stepped back and look at it from a
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  S7: different angle and go, God, what are you teaching me here?
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  S7: And then after doing that, I was able to see
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  S7: it from another perspective. So quite often it's adjusting. Our
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  S7: perspective will help us live in that spot a little
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  S7: better with wisdom.
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  S4: Dan Seaborn, founder of Winning at Home with us right now.
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  S4: You know the name of your ministry. Winning at home.
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  S4: The the the irony and maybe the reason behind the
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  S4: name you can tell me is that many people can
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  S4: feel like that's where they're losing some of those greatest
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  S4: battles and time redemption, certainly being at the top of
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  S4: the list. I mean, usually our time spent outside of
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  S4: the house is kind of, uh, dictated by our work
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  S4: responsibilities or other commitments. It's when we come home, we relax,
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  S4: and that's what we feel like is the time that's ours,
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  S4: and then we can get into trouble. Is there any,
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  S4: I mean, any correlation between winning at home to what
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  S4: I just described that often that's where we feel like
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  S4: we lose some of those battles.
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  S7: Well, you perfectly lead me into something I learned in
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  S7: my own life because I even though we're called winning
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  S7: at home, sometimes I'm guilty of winning at home. And,
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  S7: and I saw myself going home and doing the very thing.
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  S7: And like when my kids were little that my dad
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  S7: did with me, he would be very frustrated with me.
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  S7: Very irritated with me. Arrive home in a in a
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  S7: bad mood and I started looking at my own life
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  S7: going oh my goodness, I'm coming home with the same
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  S7: attitude and spirit that drove me nuts when my dad
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  S7: did that and I saw that in myself. And so
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  S7: what I did was I put this little note on
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  S7: my light switch at work because I was like, I'm
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  S7: going to redeem my time at home with my kids.
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  S7: I got a window here. It's passing quickly. So I
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  S7: put this little note on my light switch at work
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  S7: and I wrote on the note, pray before you go.
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  S7: Like I literally, I'm, I'm turning around. I'm in my
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  S7: office right now. I'm turning around. I can see it
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  S7: on my light switch. So I did this pray before
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  S7: you go. So when I would leave my office at night,
• 14:26
  S7: I would kneel. I would turn the light off and
• 14:28
  S7: I would pray, God, help me go home and bring
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  S7: joy and fun and happiness because I only get a
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  S7: few chances to do this with my kids, and then
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  S7: they'll leave home. And I want to set a great example.
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  S7: So I literally started doing that. I didn't tell my family,
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  S7: this is what's funny. So the second day of doing that,
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  S7: I walk in the home. I'm so jovial, I'm so happy.
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  S7: I'm like, hey, how's everybody doing? And my wife literally
• 14:52
  S7: met me at the door and said, are you having
• 14:54
  S7: an affair? You seem really happy lately.
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  S8: I'm like, wow, no, what do you mean?
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  S7: She's like, you're coming home different? And I said, well,
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  S7: I put this little note on my light switch because
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  S7: I want to redeem this time. I've come home and
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  S7: had a bad attitude and upset the kids. And I said,
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  S7: I don't want that memory for my children when they
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  S7: grow up, so I'm going to change that. And she
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  S7: literally grabbed me by the face and she said, don't
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  S7: ever stop doing that. That's a gift to us. And
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  S7: I haven't I've been doing it over 30 years. I,
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  S7: I kneel when I leave my office, and I pray
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  S7: that I will take joy into my home. And that's
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  S7: a critical thing I think we all can do. That
• 15:30
  S7: is a way to redeem those moments we get with
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  S7: our family.
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  S4: Dan Seaborn with us coming up, let's talk about some
• 15:35
  S4: more strategies that can help you redeem the time that
• 15:38
  S4: you do have with the people that you live with.
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  S4: Maybe you are single and have a roommate. Maybe you're
• 15:44
  S4: in a season of living alone, but you gather with
• 15:47
  S4: loved ones or friends from church. How can we win
• 15:51
  S4: at home more with our guest Dan Seaborn coming up.
• 15:54
  S1: Helping you take the next step in your walk with Jesus.
• 15:58
  S9: God longs for us today to seek him and ask
• 16:02
  S9: him to move in ways that we never could.
• 16:04
  S1: You're listening to cast and crew.
• 16:06
  S4: Well, you walk into your front door after a long
• 16:09
  S4: day at school, or a long day at work, and
• 16:12
  S4: everything in you wants to kick back and to relax.
• 16:16
  S4: But a lot of times that's where we can start
• 16:18
  S4: to lose some of those battles. The the scrolling, the
• 16:22
  S4: binging on different TV shows or different things that don't
• 16:25
  S4: really rejuvenate us or, or draw us closer to the Lord,
• 16:29
  S4: but can just fritter away hours after hours. Dan Seaborn
• 16:33
  S4: with us right now from winning at home. A lot
• 16:36
  S4: of times our relationships can suffer. People who we love
• 16:39
  S4: the most when we are not redeeming our time, there's
• 16:43
  S4: a cost. Speak to that a little bit.
• 16:45
  S7: Well, we have to ask ourselves, what do we want
• 16:47
  S7: to be remembered for? We all can default to lazy,
• 16:50
  S7: I sure can. We all can default to just thinking
• 16:54
  S7: our own way. And certainly I'm really big and we've
• 16:56
  S7: talked about it here before. I'm really big on staying
• 16:58
  S7: healthy and making sure we do the things that we
• 17:00
  S7: personally need to do to stay healthy. But in these
• 17:03
  S7: windows of opportunity, uh, as a single person, as a
• 17:07
  S7: married individual, whatever your scenario is, look at your life
• 17:11
  S7: and go, what do I want to be remembered for? If,
• 17:14
  S7: if you paint a picture about me at the end
• 17:17
  S7: of my life, what do I want to be remembered
• 17:19
  S7: for and for me, I have to evaluate and go.
• 17:22
  S7: So that means I'm going to be involved. I'm going
• 17:24
  S7: to ask how my kids are doing. I'm going to
• 17:25
  S7: stay involved with my wife in a relationship. I'm going
• 17:28
  S7: to connect with them on a daily basis. This is
• 17:30
  S7: tiring stuff. This is stuff that takes effort and energy.
• 17:35
  S7: But if it's what you want to be remembered for,
• 17:37
  S7: if it's a lasting legacy you want to leave. Then
• 17:40
  S7: you have to be intentional about it, and it's a choice.
• 17:43
  S7: So I literally texted that to someone today. I said
• 17:46
  S7: to them, life is a choice and it's a daily choice.
• 17:49
  S7: And I think us evaluating as I started out at
• 17:52
  S7: the beginning saying, look, what do I want the people
• 17:56
  S7: in my life to say about me in my final days?
• 17:59
  S7: Or if I am past and I want to live
• 18:01
  S7: in such a way to earn that reputation, repetition creates reputation.
• 18:05
  S7: That's a big theory I live by. If I repeat
• 18:07
  S7: something over and over and over, my family's going to say, oh,
• 18:11
  S7: that's who you are. Well, I want to make sure
• 18:13
  S7: what I'm repeating is something that is a lasting, beautiful legacy,
• 18:17
  S7: and it's a choice, and we must make it daily.
• 18:20
  S4: You know, you've shared your story more extensively with us
• 18:23
  S4: when you've we've had you on at other times, but
• 18:26
  S4: give us a little bit of your background because, you know,
• 18:28
  S4: it'd be easy for someone to listen and think, oh, well,
• 18:31
  S4: you know, this guy's done a ton of studying on this.
• 18:33
  S4: He's just got it nailed. And obviously nobody's perfect. But
• 18:37
  S4: some of these lessons have been learned the hard way.
• 18:40
  S4: Give us a little bit of your story.
• 18:42
  S7: Pain. The lessons have been learned through great pain when
• 18:45
  S7: I started winning at home. I remember, you know, just
• 18:49
  S7: saying to the Lord, can I please, like, get my
• 18:51
  S7: kids raised and all that be done so that I
• 18:54
  S7: know things are good before I start talking about these things?
• 18:57
  S7: And I felt like he just laid on my heart. No,
• 18:59
  S7: I want you to share your pain. I want you
• 19:00
  S7: to share your hurt, your, your struggles. And certainly I've
• 19:04
  S7: been through that with wayward kids with very difficult relationship
• 19:08
  S7: with my father. You know, I know my brother listens
• 19:10
  S7: to the show. He's listening right now. And he has
• 19:12
  S7: a lot of those memories in his life as well.
• 19:15
  S7: And we both reflect on the fact that God used
• 19:18
  S7: these very hard situations to get us to a place
• 19:22
  S7: to understanding his love, the depth of his love, his
• 19:24
  S7: goodness to us. That verse I read to you earlier
• 19:27
  S7: from Proverbs chapter eight, it finishes with, but those who
• 19:31
  S7: have knowledge will prosper. When we hear prosper, we immediately
• 19:35
  S7: run to, oh, I'm going to be loaded. I'm gonna
• 19:38
  S7: have lots of stuff. No, no. Prosperity and prospering in
• 19:42
  S7: the biblical sense is anything that draws me closer to Christ.
• 19:46
  S7: The pain that someone's facing today, the the difficult stuff
• 19:49
  S7: that you might be going through is actually an opportunity
• 19:52
  S7: to know Jesus deeper. So that means you're prospering in pain.
• 19:56
  S7: And we don't like to hear that in the church.
• 19:59
  S7: We don't like to hear that followers of Christ go, oh, no, no,
• 20:02
  S7: I just want to speak peace and everything's wonderful. Well,
• 20:04
  S7: in reality, my pain has brought me to a place. Honestly,
• 20:08
  S7: why you today have me on your show is because
• 20:11
  S7: God has allowed me to go through some stuff to
• 20:13
  S7: know him deeper, and because of that, he's given me
• 20:16
  S7: the opportunity to share who he is and the depth
• 20:19
  S7: of his love for us. So somebody listening today in
• 20:21
  S7: a really tough spot, you need to know this is
• 20:23
  S7: a prospering moment for you. And I'm not being creative
• 20:26
  S7: with my words. I'm telling you what's happened with me
• 20:28
  S7: in life. A little kid growing up in a difficult home,
• 20:31
  S7: having gone through hard circumstances with a really godly mom,
• 20:35
  S7: but a dad who didn't set a great example. I'm
• 20:38
  S7: okay because I'm God's kid and he's showing me I
• 20:41
  S7: can prosper even in difficult stuff.
• 20:43
  S4: And by the power of the Holy Spirit, I, you know,
• 20:46
  S4: I mean, that's he's redeemed your situation and allowed you
• 20:50
  S4: to live differently than maybe what was modeled for you. Right?
• 20:53
  S7: That's all it is. And I haven't done it perfectly.
• 20:56
  S7: You know, if you took my four adult kids, ages 40,
• 20:58
  S7: all the way down to 30 and said to them, hey,
• 21:01
  S7: was Dan a perfect dad? They would look at you
• 21:03
  S7: and go, are you kidding? No, I have flaws. I
• 21:06
  S7: have issues in my life. But the beautiful part is
• 21:09
  S7: all of us, all of us by the redeeming power
• 21:12
  S7: of the Holy Spirit, as you just said, without that
• 21:14
  S7: we got no chance. But with that, there's no circumstance
• 21:18
  S7: anybody's in right now that God can't fully redeem. We
• 21:20
  S7: talk about redeeming time. How about redeeming our life by
• 21:24
  S7: knowing he is the resurrector? He is our hope. He
• 21:27
  S7: is our truth. So today, if you're in a difficult
• 21:29
  S7: spot with your family and feel hopeless, you're normal and
• 21:33
  S7: God wants to come alongside you. Don't forget he came
• 21:36
  S7: for the brokenhearted. He's there for you today.
• 21:39
  S4: A good reminder from Dan Seaborn, our guest. Text winning
• 21:43
  S4: to 805 557898. Just that one word winning 800 555, 78, 98.
• 21:51
  S1: Tune in whenever you like. Check out the Cast and
• 21:53
  S1: crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 21:56
  S2: Marking time is an interesting thing. You know, marks time
• 22:01
  S2: really well.
• 22:03
  S5: What do you mean by marking time?
• 22:04
  S2: Talking about living with an eye toward a moment in
• 22:09
  S2: the future?
• 22:10
  S5: Okay.
• 22:10
  S2: All right.
• 22:11
  S5: Yeah.
• 22:11
  S2: You know who does that really well?
• 22:14
  S5: Who?
• 22:15
  S2: Kids.
• 22:16
  S6: I, I thought you were going to say that.
• 22:17
  S4: That was my thought. Yeah.
• 22:19
  S2: How is that true?
• 22:21
  S4: Well, because kids are always looking forward to what's coming.
• 22:24
  S4: And so whether it's a vacation that they know they're
• 22:27
  S4: going to be, you've told them that you're going to
• 22:28
  S4: take them to Six Flags or to Disney and they
• 22:31
  S4: are counting down the days. And then birthdays obviously are
• 22:34
  S4: such a big deal to kids. The minute they turn six,
• 22:37
  S4: they can't wait to turn seven and then they can't
• 22:39
  S4: wait to be a teenager. They're 12. They want to
• 22:41
  S4: be 13. They're 15. They can't wait to drive. So
• 22:44
  S4: there's they are very forward thinking because in, in a
• 22:48
  S4: healthy childhood, there's lots it feels like there's so much
• 22:51
  S4: to look forward to.
• 22:52
  S5: That's true.
• 22:54
  S2: And a lot of that marking of time really changes
• 22:58
  S2: how they live in the moment. Not always, but sometimes
• 23:01
  S2: it changes how they live in the moment. Sometimes the
• 23:03
  S2: anticipation of a time that's coming causes them to not
• 23:08
  S2: get sleep right.
• 23:10
  S5: Oh my goodness. I mean, it's like a kid on Christmas.
• 23:13
  S5: You don't you don't sleep before Christmas, man. You just
• 23:16
  S5: stay up and you wait and you wait and you wait.
• 23:18
  S4: Kid on a road trip. Are we there yet? Are
• 23:20
  S4: we there yet? Are we there.
• 23:21
  S5: Yet? Yeah.
• 23:22
  S2: So we're talking redeeming time all week long here. And
• 23:26
  S2: I was doing some study on this whole issue of time.
• 23:31
  S2: And if you look at the the scriptures. You find
• 23:33
  S2: something super interesting that we've never talked about before.
• 23:38
  S4: Okay.
• 23:39
  S2: And it is that Jesus himself was repeatedly saying, my
• 23:45
  S2: hour has not yet come.
• 23:47
  S4: Yes.
• 23:49
  S2: And that word for hour is hurrah! Hurrah! And it
• 23:54
  S2: is a fixed time that is coming. And Jesus lived
• 23:58
  S2: with his entire life, marking time for that hour when
• 24:04
  S2: it was to come. And then Jesus, at one point
• 24:07
  S2: in the Gospel of John, says, my hour has come to.
• 24:11
  S2: Fascinating thing. Well, you look at that. You begin to
• 24:15
  S2: search the scriptures and go, boy, is there any call
• 24:18
  S2: on our life to do the same thing. Well, check
• 24:22
  S2: this out in Romans chapter 13, verse 11. He's talking
• 24:27
  S2: about the need to love one another. Love your neighbor
• 24:31
  S2: as yourself. And he says this. Verse 11, besides this,
• 24:36
  S2: you know the time that the hour has come for
• 24:40
  S2: you to wake up from sleep. For salvation is nearer
• 24:45
  S2: to us now than when we first believed. This is
• 24:48
  S2: the Apostle Paul telling the folks in the letter to
• 24:52
  S2: the Romans. He's saying, listen, you know what's going on.
• 24:57
  S2: You know the time. Now, the word there for time
• 25:01
  S2: in the original language is Karen. So it's two uses
• 25:05
  S2: of this. And then it uses the hour has come
• 25:09
  S2: for you, which is hurrah. So he's saying this season
• 25:14
  S2: of opportunity is right now that the hour, the very
• 25:20
  S2: moment this this opportunity, this season is right now in
• 25:25
  S2: this hour for you to wake up from your sleep.
• 25:30
  S2: Anyone else pumped by that?
• 25:32
  S4: Wow. So, okay, so besides this, you know, the time
• 25:35
  S4: he's not saying, you know, the time as in it's
• 25:37
  S4: 6:04 a.m. central time.
• 25:39
  S2: No, it's really cool. It's kind of like it's it's
• 25:43
  S2: a word very similar to Kyrgios. It's Karen and it
• 25:46
  S2: means this season of opportunity. But because of the season
• 25:52
  S2: of opportunity that you're living in the hour, the hurrah,
• 25:56
  S2: your time has come to wake up.
• 25:59
  S5: Wow I like that.
• 26:02
  S2: How cool is that.
• 26:04
  S5: What do you think that means for us today as
• 26:05
  S5: we just hold on to that? How does that help
• 26:07
  S5: us live today?
• 26:08
  S2: You know, that's a great question. I think at the
• 26:10
  S2: end of the day, what Paul's telling this great audience
• 26:14
  S2: that he's writing this letter to is that there's there's
• 26:18
  S2: a day coming that is soon. And because of its
• 26:28
  S2: Souness making up words here because it's coming so soon.
• 26:34
  S2: Now is the time, the season of opportunity when we
• 26:38
  S2: need to be fully awake.
• 26:40
  S4: Wow.
• 26:42
  S2: How cool is.
• 26:42
  S4: That? And then to immediately follow it up with for
• 26:45
  S4: salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed.
• 26:49
  S4: I mean, that is true every single day. Every single hour.
• 26:55
  S2: Yeah, it's it's really awesome. I got up early this
• 26:58
  S2: morning just going, all right, Lord, redeeming time. What are
• 27:02
  S2: some of the unseen nuggets that we can find in
• 27:05
  S2: the scriptures? And this is a big one. So Jesus
• 27:08
  S2: himself was marking time up to the hour when he
• 27:12
  S2: would take our sins to the cross, rise from the dead,
• 27:15
  S2: and get victory over sin and death. And Paul's grabbing
• 27:20
  S2: that same language saying, hey, because this hour is coming,
• 27:27
  S2: this This time when you're going to stand before God,
• 27:31
  S2: let this time, Karen, be a golden opportunity for you
• 27:38
  S2: to live wide awake. That's a mind blower.
• 27:44
  S5: There it is. And it's it's convicting. It's encouraging. It's
• 27:48
  S5: encouraging because, hey, we're getting closer to being with our Lord.
• 27:52
  S5: We're we're one day closer than we were yesterday. It's
• 27:56
  S5: also convicting because it's, hey, we're one day closer, which
• 27:59
  S5: means we have one day less than we did yesterday.
• 28:02
  S5: Let's use that time because it is going away.
• 28:06
  S2: I guess what we find in Scripture is the best
• 28:09
  S2: theological argument for redeeming time is understanding that there will
• 28:15
  S2: be a time when our hour will be there, and
• 28:20
  S2: we live in a season. Karen of time opportunity right now,
• 28:24
  S2: and we need to redeem every chunk of it. We
• 28:28
  S2: can't be asleep.
• 28:29
  S4: You know, it's interesting that when people oftentimes when people
• 28:33
  S4: receive some sort of diagnosis, um, that makes them really aware,
• 28:38
  S4: hyper aware of their mortality. Yeah. Sometimes doctors even will
• 28:43
  S4: give a timeline like this is the expected amount of
• 28:46
  S4: time based on what condition you have. And you often
• 28:52
  S4: hear how much perspective shifts. There's a high profile guy.
• 28:57
  S4: I got to look him up, but he's been circulating
• 29:00
  S4: a lot on social media.
• 29:01
  S2: Ben Sasse.
• 29:02
  S4: Yes, yes. Because of the way he is approaching what
• 29:08
  S4: is expected if the Lord doesn't intervene, the the expected
• 29:12
  S4: end of life for him.
• 29:13
  S2: Yeah. I mean.
• 29:14
  S4: Have you seen some of these.
• 29:14
  S9: Clips?
• 29:15
  S2: Oh, I've seen them all. Ben Sasse is one of
• 29:17
  S2: the most inspirational figures for how to finish. Well, when
• 29:21
  S2: he got the word. I think he's got bile duct
• 29:24
  S2: cancer or something like that. And I don't and you know,
• 29:28
  S2: he'll get on these podcasts and say, I've got a
• 29:31
  S2: death sentence. Yeah, I'm going to die. And then he
• 29:34
  S2: goes into a theological treatise about the security that he
• 29:39
  S2: has in Jesus Christ, and how he wants to redeem
• 29:43
  S2: every moment until he goes home to be with God.
• 29:46
  S2: It's it's a pretty epic display of this very thing
• 29:50
  S2: we're talking about.
• 29:50
  S4: Yeah. He's just just looking him up. He's a former senator,
• 29:54
  S4: a pancreatic cancer, and he did pancreatic cancer. He did
• 29:58
  S4: a really high profile 60 minutes interview and a lot
• 30:00
  S4: of little clips from that. But he's been really living
• 30:06
  S4: now that he's dying, dying in public. I'm just reading
• 30:08
  S4: some of the clips that are out there. It's yeah,
• 30:11
  S4: I think it's worth looking at.
• 30:16
  S2: Yeah, it's a beautiful thing when you start marking time,
• 30:20
  S2: knowing our hour is nearer than we think. Ah! Hurrah
• 30:26
  S2: is coming sooner than we might imagine. And then Paul says,
• 30:31
  S2: we live in a season now, this time this Karen
• 30:35
  S2: to be fully awake. So the. The natural takeaway is live.
• 30:41
  S2: Knowing this end is sooner than we imagine. The hurrah
• 30:45
  S2: moment is coming and we now live in a season, Karen,
• 30:50
  S2: where we can really redeem these moments. Living in the
• 30:54
  S2: present with an eye to the future. What a powerful thing. Well,
• 31:00
  S2: this whole week on redeeming time, we're tackling. Really? What
• 31:03
  S2: are we going to let loose of? What are we
• 31:05
  S2: going to say no to and model in the way
• 31:08
  S2: we've been given ours to you and young thunder's up today.
• 31:11
  S2: His heart poured out straight ahead.
• 31:14
  S1: This is curl and Crew on Moody radio.
• 31:18
  S4: Talking time redemption this morning. And as a team, we've
• 31:21
  S4: been sharing with you. What is that thing that the
• 31:23
  S4: Lord is showing us that we want to tighten up on?
• 31:27
  S4: What's the black hole of time in young Thunder so
• 31:30
  S4: graciously agreed that today he's up.
• 31:33
  S5: Yeah. And I have two things that seem small, but
• 31:38
  S5: when you add all the time together that it takes
• 31:41
  S5: out of my day.
• 31:42
  S2: Two.
• 31:42
  S5: Two things. Uh, so the first one is score watching
• 31:48
  S5: on sports games. I don't sit down and watch a
• 31:51
  S5: basketball game. Last night there was a playoff game, and
• 31:55
  S5: I didn't sit down and watch three hours of the
• 31:57
  S5: playoff game. But what I did while I was doing
• 32:00
  S5: other things was I kept pulling up Google and updating
• 32:04
  S5: to see where the score was. And so while I'm
• 32:07
  S5: doing other stuff, I'm taking a break to go refresh
• 32:10
  S5: Google and take a look at the score. And I
• 32:12
  S5: did the same thing with the Cubs game that was
• 32:14
  S5: going on last night. Thankfully, they were so bad I
• 32:16
  S5: didn't have to keep up too bad with them. Uh,
• 32:18
  S5: but but I was checking the scores and I noticed
• 32:22
  S5: that I do that quite a lot.
• 32:24
  S2: You told me you got carpal tunnel from it, so. Yeah,
• 32:27
  S2: it's a lot.
• 32:28
  S5: Basically, I, I really do take a lot of time
• 32:32
  S5: out of my day checking sports scores and I'm distracted
• 32:36
  S5: if I'm doing something else. The other thing is phone
• 32:40
  S5: games right now. I'm not sitting there for three hours
• 32:45
  S5: at a time on a phone game, but I do
• 32:48
  S5: a little bit of a phone game over here while
• 32:50
  S5: I'm doing something else. Yesterday or two days ago. My
• 32:53
  S5: wife called me out on it because I was looking
• 32:55
  S5: around for my car keys, but I was also on
• 32:57
  S5: a phone game while I was looking.
• 33:00
  S4: Multitasking.
• 33:02
  S5: A little multitasking, and and she said, are you a
• 33:06
  S5: little distracted over there? And I looked down and I said,
• 33:09
  S5: I don't know what you're talking about. And I put
• 33:10
  S5: my phone in my pocket. Liar, liar.
• 33:13
  S2: Pants on.
• 33:13
  S6: Fire.
• 33:15
  S2: And so she's a good woman.
• 33:16
  S5: Oh, she's a great woman. And she's, she's very helpful
• 33:19
  S5: at making me realize that I might be doing something
• 33:22
  S5: that's not super helpful for me. And she's right. And,
• 33:25
  S5: and so those two things. They're not bad things, but
• 33:30
  S5: they are things that take up way too much of
• 33:32
  S5: my time. And so what I'm doing from now on
• 33:35
  S5: is I have two set times of day that.
• 33:40
  S2: To score, watch.
• 33:41
  S5: Not to score watch. This is for the phone games.
• 33:43
  S5: I have two set times of ten minute intervals that
• 33:46
  S5: I can go and I can play games. So 20
• 33:48
  S5: minutes a day at two separate times I can go
• 33:51
  S5: play phone games, score watching. I want to be more
• 33:56
  S5: disciplined in this one because this one can take more
• 33:59
  S5: of my time and is a little more obtuse. So
• 34:03
  S5: I want to check a score one time in the
• 34:08
  S5: middle of a game. Otherwise I can't check it until
• 34:11
  S5: I know the game is over.
• 34:13
  S10: That's hard.
• 34:13
  S5: And so that is going to be my goal going
• 34:17
  S5: forward is, hey, if I recognize the games on right now.
• 34:20
  S5: I can choose to see where it's at in that moment,
• 34:23
  S5: but if I check it, then I'm done until I
• 34:26
  S5: know the game is over.
• 34:27
  S9: Yeah.
• 34:28
  S2: You know, first off, really cool, right?
• 34:31
  S4: Oh yeah.
• 34:32
  S2: Oh cheers for young thunder here. That's really self-aware. For starters,
• 34:37
  S2: a couple of thoughts come to mind. Number one, it's
• 34:40
  S2: amazing how much we underestimate we're playing games or looking
• 34:47
  S2: at scores. And I'm talking for me too. I don't I've.
• 34:51
  S2: The one thing I did was I had a buddy
• 34:53
  S2: tell me years ago, do not put games on your
• 34:57
  S2: phone and I never have.
• 34:59
  S5: It's a it's a good piece of advice.
• 35:01
  S2: He just told me. He said, Carl, it is an
• 35:04
  S2: absolute sink hole. Yeah. So I've never put. Can you
• 35:08
  S2: believe it? There's one area of Victory Alley for your
• 35:11
  S2: buddy Carl. I've never put games on my phone because
• 35:15
  S2: I would use that sucker. Guaranteed. But what's interesting here
• 35:20
  S2: that I wanted to mention, it's not just time redemption.
• 35:23
  S2: It is an issue of focus. Brain scientists have concluded
• 35:28
  S2: if you're doing a deep. Let's just say let's just
• 35:32
  S2: say you're writing on. Let's just say you're writing a book, Jonathan,
• 35:35
  S2: and you're working on a manuscript for a book or
• 35:38
  S2: message prep and. And you're doing message prep, but the cubbies, man,
• 35:42
  S2: they're playing a Saturday game and you're wrapping up some
• 35:45
  S2: things on message prep. Brain scientists. I know this is
• 35:48
  S2: going to sound hard to believe, but and I'll pull
• 35:51
  S2: the stats, but there's universal agreement on this one takes
• 35:54
  S2: 25 minutes to engage back into that deep level of work.
• 36:00
  S2: When you interrupt it for something like that. 25 minutes.
• 36:06
  S4: Wow.
• 36:07
  S2: Isn't that something?
• 36:08
  S5: It is crazy, but it's also just real. And and
• 36:13
  S5: when you're trying to multitask, especially doing two things at
• 36:17
  S5: the same time. I can play this little phone game
• 36:19
  S5: while I'm looking for my car keys. Do you know
• 36:21
  S5: how much slower I go while I'm walking around the
• 36:24
  S5: house looking for my car keys? Because I'm looking.
• 36:26
  S2: To run into door jambs with your forehead.
• 36:29
  S5: So we could say that I'm still doing a good
• 36:32
  S5: thing by looking for my car keys, but I've slowed
• 36:34
  S5: myself down exponentially by distracting myself while I'm doing it,
• 36:38
  S5: which means I'm wasting time. I could be redeeming that
• 36:41
  S5: time by finding my my car keys five minutes quicker
• 36:45
  S5: than it would have taken me if I, you know,
• 36:47
  S5: if I didn't have my phone in my hands.
• 36:49
  S2: Now I want to cheer for you because I really
• 36:52
  S2: thought I knew what you were going to share today. Ah,
• 36:55
  S2: what I thought. I thought it was video games. But
• 36:57
  S2: has God given you a measure of victory there?
• 36:59
  S5: Well, I think it's a fair point. Well, okay, let
• 37:01
  S5: me say this. I have multiple areas of my life
• 37:04
  S5: in which I can.
• 37:06
  S9: Oh. I'm sorry.
• 37:07
  S5: No. It's okay.
• 37:08
  S9: I wasn't.
• 37:08
  S2: Trying to bust.
• 37:10
  S9: You out.
• 37:10
  S5: No, no, no. It's okay. It's all right. It's not
• 37:13
  S5: a big problem.
• 37:14
  S4: I'm adding to your list.
• 37:15
  S5: I'm fine to add the this. Well, no. Okay. I
• 37:17
  S5: because I, I'm okay with saying it because I know
• 37:20
  S5: as Ali shares either tomorrow or Friday. Carl, you shared yesterday. Yeah, I,
• 37:26
  S5: we all have areas that we need to work on
• 37:29
  S5: that are not the ones that we shared. And so
• 37:31
  S5: I'm okay with saying that I have another area to
• 37:34
  S5: work on there that I didn't mention. Uh, and, and
• 37:38
  S5: I want God to do the work.
• 37:39
  S2: You're a good man.
• 37:40
  S5: Thank you.
• 37:40
  S2: I love you. Hot dog.
• 37:42
  S5: No shame. I feel no shame about it.
• 37:45
  S2: You're doing great.
• 37:46
  S5: I've got another area that I got to work on that.
• 37:48
  S5: That the Lord will work on me. And I'm just
• 37:49
  S5: not sharing it right now. Well, I mean, that's fine.
• 37:51
  S2: Yeah. And I, I shared, I shared, uh, scrolling on
• 37:56
  S2: X and going down those bunny trails. But the fact is, I,
• 38:01
  S2: there's plenty of areas.
• 38:03
  S5: Mhm.
• 38:03
  S2: I'm trying to pick and let you.
• 38:05
  S9: Off the hook here, and.
• 38:06
  S4: I just want to let you go.
• 38:07
  S2: How about if I just.
• 38:08
  S4: I'm sharing one. So you're not going to get me.
• 38:12
  S2: I'm not gonna I'm not going to say, oh, you
• 38:14
  S2: must be getting victory in that other area.
• 38:18
  S4: You get one and one only.
• 38:20
  S2: I was certain Jonathan had a. Yes, I've got video
• 38:24
  S2: games totally won over.
• 38:27
  S5: No, I don't have it. Completely won over. That's okay.
• 38:30
  S5: It's all right. You know what? It's totally fine. I'm
• 38:32
  S5: not ashamed by it at all. Believe it or not,
• 38:37
  S5: Jonathan is not one area away from perfection. Believe it
• 38:40
  S5: or not, man.
• 38:41
  S2: Oh, see, that's what I. That was my assumption.
• 38:44
  S5: Yeah, yeah, I know, I know.
• 38:45
  S2: Is that you were just one victory from score watching
• 38:50
  S2: away from total perfection.
• 38:52
  S5: That was the only thing I had left. But no.
• 38:54
  S2: See, I should have known better.
• 38:55
  S5: You should.
• 38:55
  S2: Have known. Yeah. I'm sorry for that.
• 38:58
  S1: You're listening to Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
• 39:02
  S4: Well, if you were to go into my home, there
• 39:04
  S4: are two places where clutter tends to gather. One is
• 39:09
  S4: by the back door where everybody comes in when we
• 39:13
  S4: go in through the garage. Backpacks. Shoes. The other is
• 39:18
  S4: by the front door.
• 39:21
  S5: Right at the entrances.
• 39:23
  S4: The entrances where kids drop off the books and backpacks
• 39:28
  S4: and everything kind of ends up in a little bit
• 39:30
  S4: of a pile. It's the battle against clutter in your home,
• 39:34
  S4: but we want to live uncluttered lives across the board
• 39:38
  S4: our homes, our workspaces, our cars, and our faith. Can
• 39:43
  S4: your faith become cluttered, too? We have a special guest
• 39:46
  S4: coming up.
• 39:47
  S1: Want to hear that again? Just download the Kernel and
• 39:50
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 39:53
  S2: So we talk a lot about different principles. And one
• 39:57
  S2: of the great principles that we find, especially when it
• 40:00
  S2: comes to spiritual disciplines and spiritual activity, is that sometimes
• 40:04
  S2: less is more. Right?
• 40:05
  S5: Oh, 100%. Yeah. Sometimes we complicate things with just so much.
• 40:10
  S5: We have to get rid of some of that stuff
• 40:11
  S5: and find what are the core things that are going
• 40:13
  S5: to make this well. Simple doesn't always mean bad, no.
• 40:17
  S2: And when it comes to spiritual disciplines, oftentimes we think,
• 40:21
  S2: oh man, I. The busier I get out here doing, doing, doing.
• 40:26
  S2: Sometimes the greatest spiritual disciplines are sitting and listening to
• 40:32
  S2: the counsel of God as he begins to illuminate through
• 40:36
  S2: the power of the spirit. All the teachings in the
• 40:38
  S2: scriptures 100%. I think we got a man with us
• 40:41
  S2: right now that will resonate with this. Joshua Becker. He's
• 40:45
  S2: founder and editor of Becoming Minimalist. He's got a new
• 40:48
  S2: workout called uncluttered Faith, Own less, Love more, and make
• 40:53
  S2: an impact in your world. I mean, this guy's been
• 40:55
  S2: all over the place. He's a writer to Forbes magazine.
• 40:59
  S2: He's appeared on CBS Evening News, focus on the family,
• 41:03
  S2: a lot of different podcasts. He's with us right now. Joshua,
• 41:07
  S2: how'd you get into this minimalist thing anyway?
• 41:10
  S11: Well, I discovered minimalism 15 years ago. I was in
• 41:15
  S11: my mid 30s, my son was five years old and
• 41:19
  S11: my daughter was two and. Crazy story. We were going
• 41:23
  S11: to do our spring cleaning. We were living in Vermont.
• 41:26
  S11: I offer to clean out the garage. My five year
• 41:29
  S11: old son, as any five year old son would want.
• 41:32
  S11: Didn't want me cleaning the garage. He wanted me playing
• 41:35
  S11: catch in the backyard.
• 41:36
  S2: Yeah.
• 41:37
  S11: I think we all know how that story goes. I
• 41:39
  S11: start working on the garage. It takes me hours. I
• 41:42
  S11: start complaining to my neighbor, and she's the one who
• 41:45
  S11: introduced me to minimalism. She said, you know, that's why
• 41:49
  S11: my daughter is a minimalist. She keeps telling me I
• 41:52
  S11: don't need to own all this stuff. And I remember
• 41:56
  S11: looking at the pile of things in my driveway I'd
• 41:58
  S11: pulled out of the garage. I see my five year
• 42:01
  S11: old son swinging alone on the swing, set in the backyard,
• 42:04
  S11: and suddenly realized that all the things I owned were
• 42:07
  S11: actually taking me away from the things that do bring
• 42:10
  S11: me happiness and meaning in life. So that was the
• 42:12
  S11: start of my journey 15 years ago.
• 42:14
  S2: Oh, okay. Joshua Becker, my guest right now. All right.
• 42:18
  S2: Let's get really honest here, because we've got many tens
• 42:23
  S2: of thousands of people listening to you right now. Build
• 42:27
  S2: a case for this, because a lot of people look
• 42:31
  S2: at minimalism and maybe it's been poorly represented as kind
• 42:35
  S2: of scorched earth, no decorations, nothing much memorable, pretty sterile.
• 42:42
  S2: What is biblical minimalism?
• 42:46
  S11: Biblical minimalism is the recognition that God's kingdom is more
• 42:54
  S11: important and more valuable than anything this world can offer. Boom!
• 43:00
  S11: That is the story of the parable of the Great Furrow,
• 43:03
  S11: the parable of the great treasure. You know, if you
• 43:06
  S11: look at those stories in Matthew 13. The man discovers
• 43:10
  S11: the treasure. The merchant discovers the pearl and the in
• 43:14
  S11: between part is. The man sells everything he has so
• 43:18
  S11: that he can buy the field. The merchant sells all
• 43:21
  S11: his other goods so that he can take hold of
• 43:23
  S11: the pearl. Biblical minimalism is realizing that we can't have both.
• 43:29
  S11: We can't hold on to the world's kingdom and God's
• 43:33
  S11: kingdom at the same time. Our hearts aren't big enough,
• 43:37
  S11: so it's not about owning nothing. It's about being intentional
• 43:41
  S11: and focused, realizing that everyone's minimalism is going to look
• 43:45
  S11: a little bit different from anybody else's. But I think
• 43:48
  S11: it's about constantly asking the question, what do I need
• 43:51
  S11: to own in order to fulfill what God has called
• 43:54
  S11: me to do? And what is everything that's just distracting
• 43:57
  S11: me from meaning and purpose and significance in the greatest
• 44:02
  S11: kingdom the universe has ever seen?
• 44:04
  S2: Is your contention that our stuff of the West is
• 44:08
  S2: in the way of the abundant life in Christ. Is
• 44:11
  S2: that fair?
• 44:12
  S11: That would be exactly the case that I'd be trying
• 44:15
  S11: to make. You know, the the perfect illustration of this
• 44:18
  S11: is Mary and Martha in Luke chapter ten, where Jesus
• 44:21
  S11: shows up with his disciples. Martha starts running around doing what?
• 44:25
  S11: Taking care of all of the things, the possessions, the stuff,
• 44:28
  S11: the preparations. Mary just sits quietly at the feet of
• 44:32
  S11: Jesus and listens and Martha starts complaining. Jesus says, Mary
• 44:37
  S11: has chosen what is better. It will not be taken
• 44:39
  S11: from her. The average American spends two hours a day
• 44:44
  S11: on their physical possessions, but spends just ten minutes a
• 44:48
  S11: day focused on their spirituality and their walk with Christ.
• 44:51
  S11: I think America is Martha, and Jesus is inviting us
• 44:54
  S11: to something better.
• 44:55
  S2: How in the world do you live in a world
• 44:59
  S2: full of stuff? It's so countercultural to be a minimalist.
• 45:04
  S2: How do you do it?
• 45:06
  S11: Well, I think it starts with the realization that the
• 45:09
  S11: gut offers us something better. I think, you know, even
• 45:12
  S11: if you didn't want to go down that road, I
• 45:14
  S11: think once we just start to recognize how much money
• 45:18
  S11: we waste buying things we don't need, how much time
• 45:22
  S11: we waste taking care of things we don't need, how
• 45:24
  S11: much energy and focus, how many life giving benefits we
• 45:30
  S11: discover by intentionally owning less stuff. I think that's how
• 45:35
  S11: we begin to counteract the the cultural lives that we
• 45:38
  S11: see 5000 advertisements we see every single day telling us
• 45:43
  S11: that more is better, that we should keep buying more stuff.
• 45:46
  S11: And I think that once we see through those falsehoods
• 45:49
  S11: and see the the greater potential in our lives, at
• 45:52
  S11: least it's the mindset that helps us begin to overcome
• 45:55
  S11: some of those cultural assumptions that we all grew up with.
• 45:58
  S11: And I've been told since the day we were born.
• 46:01
  S2: Joshua, there are a lot of people listening right now
• 46:04
  S2: who really do get it. They know that there needs
• 46:08
  S2: to be editing, there needs to be curating. These are
• 46:11
  S2: words that we've heard from folks that we've had here
• 46:14
  S2: in the past. There needs to be a ruthless elimination
• 46:19
  S2: of stuff for the sake of our own mental clarity
• 46:23
  S2: and our spiritual vitality. How in the world do we
• 46:26
  S2: move practically from where we are today? And when I
• 46:31
  S2: say today and where we are, I'm talking about the West.
• 46:33
  S2: We have collected so much stuff. In fact, I had
• 46:37
  S2: a I had a gazillionaire friend of mine tell me,
• 46:40
  S2: he said, you know what? It's not great having the
• 46:42
  S2: kind of wealth I have because with every new thing
• 46:45
  S2: that I buy a boat, a house, I've got more
• 46:49
  S2: insurance policies, I've got more things to maintain, to monitor.
• 46:55
  S2: How in the world do we win this battle? Give
• 46:57
  S2: us some practical steps here.
• 47:00
  S11: I think a lot of people hear about minimalism. They
• 47:04
  S11: hear about decluttering and they're like, you're right, I need
• 47:08
  S11: to own less stuff. And what our minds tend to
• 47:12
  S11: do is we tend to rush to like the hardest
• 47:15
  S11: thing that we would ever have to get rid of. Oh,
• 47:18
  S11: I need to go through my garage. I need to
• 47:20
  S11: go through my basement. Or how would I ever get
• 47:22
  S11: rid of sentimental items? Or how would I get rid
• 47:24
  S11: of my books? And I think the best first step
• 47:28
  S11: is to realize that we don't have to get rid
• 47:31
  S11: of the hardest things first. That decluttering is a little
• 47:36
  S11: bit like building up a muscle. And so let's just
• 47:39
  S11: start in easier places. I think duplicates is a great
• 47:44
  S11: place to start in our home. Like we all have
• 47:47
  S11: extra towels and spatulas and shoes and coats and linens
• 47:52
  S11: and hammers and golf clubs sometimes. And just like we
• 47:56
  S11: can get rid of some of these duplicate items, we
• 47:58
  S11: can start freeing up some space. We can start sensing
• 48:02
  S11: the calm and peace that comes from bringing intentionality into
• 48:06
  S11: our possessions. And I think that that motivation and that
• 48:10
  S11: momentum eventually carries us through some of those harder things
• 48:14
  S11: that we'll need to declutter.
• 48:15
  S2: You must have heard some stories. You've been at this
• 48:18
  S2: for 15 years. You shared a little bit about your own.
• 48:22
  S2: In fact, let me just ask you, were you pretty
• 48:25
  S2: minimalist even before you went into decluttering your life? Or
• 48:30
  S2: where were you at when you started this journey?
• 48:33
  S11: I was as typical a middle class American as you
• 48:38
  S11: could possibly be. I mean, I was I was a
• 48:41
  S11: youth pastor at the time, so I wasn't making a
• 48:43
  S11: ton of money, but enough money and yet who never
• 48:47
  S11: seem to get ahead financially. It seemed like every pay
• 48:51
  S11: increase that came along, we just bought more stuff and
• 48:54
  S11: filled more rooms with our home and two streams of
• 48:57
  S11: discontent in my life. Before I found minimalism, I was
• 49:00
  S11: discontented with my finances that I couldn't get ahead, that
• 49:03
  S11: I wasn't giving the way I wanted to be giving
• 49:07
  S11: living as generous as I want it to be. And then,
• 49:10
  S11: as I discovered that Saturday morning, just the focus of
• 49:13
  S11: my energy and time were being spent on things that
• 49:16
  S11: didn't actually matter in the long run until someone introduced
• 49:20
  S11: me to minimalism and something clicked and started to make
• 49:23
  S11: sense to me.
• 49:25
  S2: There's a lot of people that find a lot of
• 49:27
  S2: comfort in the stuff that we have to pry it
• 49:30
  S2: out of their hands. And I've, you know, done enough
• 49:33
  S2: of this to understand that hoarding isn't so much about
• 49:36
  S2: the collecting of stuff. It's really the protecting of pain.
• 49:40
  S2: How do you deconstruct stuff and not really put yourself
• 49:47
  S2: on tilt? Is it an opportunity then to let the
• 49:50
  S2: Lord draw near there?
• 49:52
  S11: Yeah. Well, you know, it's very fascinating. In Luke chapter 12,
• 49:56
  S11: Jesus tells this famous story of the. The man who
• 49:59
  S11: builds the barn has a successful crop. He builds the
• 50:02
  S11: big barns and then retires. And God says that was
• 50:06
  S11: a foolish way to spend your money. And today your
• 50:08
  S11: life will be taken from you. And then Jesus goes
• 50:11
  S11: into two different teachings. He teaches about greed. He says,
• 50:17
  S11: be on guard against all kinds of greed, and life
• 50:19
  S11: is not found in the abundance of possessions. And then
• 50:22
  S11: if you look at the chapter again, he goes immediately
• 50:25
  S11: into talking about worry. He says, therefore, do not worry
• 50:29
  S11: about what you will eat and drink and what you're
• 50:31
  S11: going to wear. And look at the birds and look
• 50:33
  S11: at the flowers. And it's interesting when you think about it,
• 50:37
  S11: that Jesus would the same teaching would be greed and worry. Uh,
• 50:43
  S11: because in a lot of ways, greed and worry result
• 50:47
  S11: in the same thing. They both result in us keeping
• 50:52
  S11: more for ourselves than we need. And I think that
• 50:55
  S11: when we begin to release that when we begin to
• 51:00
  S11: just collect the manna that we need for the day
• 51:03
  S11: and be generous with what is remaining. We discover both
• 51:07
  S11: the pathway to overcome greed in our life and the
• 51:10
  S11: pathway to overcome worry. We find more lasting security in
• 51:14
  S11: Christ than we could ever find in accumulating money and
• 51:18
  S11: possessions for ourselves.
• 51:20
  S2: Love it. My guest right now, Joshua Becker. He's the
• 51:23
  S2: author of a brand new book. He's got some dynamite ones,
• 51:26
  S2: by the way. Things that matter, the minimalist home, the
• 51:30
  S2: more of less and now uncluttered faith own less, love more,
• 51:35
  S2: and make an impact in your world. Okay, so you,
• 51:39
  S2: you talked about duplicates and, you know, it's funny about that.
• 51:42
  S2: I have I'm an old carpenter from way back, but
• 51:45
  S2: I have two hammers that are very similar. And the
• 51:48
  S2: minute you said that, boom, they're both really good quality hammers.
• 51:52
  S2: They're like Vons, which are wood handled hammers, which are
• 51:56
  S2: quality hammers. I can give one away. I don't need
• 51:59
  S2: both of them. There is something about even leveraging the
• 52:03
  S2: stuff you have for the good of someone else. Isn't
• 52:07
  S2: that a good start with your duplicate stuff?
• 52:09
  S11: Absolutely. I believe that generosity is both the byproduct of
• 52:15
  S11: minimalism and the the very lifeblood of it, that when
• 52:20
  S11: we intentionally own less, we find opportunities to give away more.
• 52:25
  S11: And the more we give away and recognize the need
• 52:28
  S11: in our community of people around us, the more motivated
• 52:32
  S11: we become to give away more. We discover the Care
• 52:37
  S11: Net Pregnancy Center in Burlington, Vermont by. As I mentioned,
• 52:40
  S11: my son was five, my daughter was two, and we
• 52:42
  S11: just had a basement full of baby stuff and maternity
• 52:46
  S11: clothes and crib and highchair. And we were done with
• 52:50
  S11: that phase of life. And I think when we discovered
• 52:53
  S11: the need in our community, it like the number of
• 52:56
  S11: trips we went down to the basement to grab boxes
• 52:59
  S11: and bins of things to donate motivated us to own
• 53:02
  S11: less and it's a great feeling. It's a great feeling
• 53:05
  S11: to give, isn't it?
• 53:06
  S2: Yeah, I love it. It really is. You know, the
• 53:08
  S2: premise of owning less help us get around that corner
• 53:13
  S2: because I think a lot of us think, okay, declutter,
• 53:15
  S2: but what do you mean when you say own less?
• 53:19
  S11: I define minimalism as minimalism is the intentional promotion of
• 53:26
  S11: the things I most value in life by getting rid
• 53:30
  S11: of anything that distracts me from it. And so there
• 53:33
  S11: are items that I need in my life. And these
• 53:37
  S11: are going to look different from person to person and
• 53:39
  S11: family to family. A carpenter is going to own something
• 53:41
  S11: different than a writer, a teacher, an architect, a homeschooling
• 53:45
  S11: mom of six compared to, you know, great grandparents, or
• 53:49
  S11: moving into senior living like someone who lives in the country.
• 53:53
  S11: Someone lives in the city. Like even our spiritual gifts
• 53:56
  S11: are going to change. Yes, we need to own in
• 53:59
  S11: order to accomplish that. It's just that in America, like
• 54:03
  S11: we own so much stuff, more stuff than has ever
• 54:07
  S11: been owned in human history. Our houses are three times
• 54:10
  S11: as big as they were 50 years ago, and still 18%
• 54:15
  S11: of us rent. Off site storage and a third of
• 54:17
  S11: us can't park in our garages. And so I think
• 54:20
  S11: that the optimal amount of possessions for almost everybody listening
• 54:25
  S11: is going to be less than we own today. And
• 54:29
  S11: so discovering what that means and what that looks like,
• 54:31
  S11: and all the opportunity and potential and benefit of living
• 54:35
  S11: it out, living out exactly what Jesus called us to
• 54:37
  S11: concerning money and possessions.
• 54:39
  S2: I love it. Um, okay, so let's just break this down.
• 54:43
  S2: A commitment to owning less and settling in, going God
• 54:46
  S2: is enough. I get that getting rid of duplicates. Where
• 54:50
  S2: do you go after you've got rid of duplicates? How
• 54:52
  S2: do you begin to weed through this stuff?
• 54:55
  S11: I always encourage people to declutter. The easiest lived in
• 55:01
  S11: space in your home. So like you can take a
• 55:04
  S11: clean sweep, take a box or bag and just walk
• 55:08
  S11: around your home and get rid of anything and everything
• 55:10
  S11: that you know. You don't need all easy decisions, low
• 55:13
  S11: hanging fruit, and then go declutter your living room or
• 55:17
  S11: go declutter your bedroom or even your car and just
• 55:21
  S11: ask the question, does this need to be in my
• 55:24
  S11: living room? Does this serve the purpose of my living
• 55:27
  S11: room or my bedroom? Um, and take out everything and
• 55:31
  S11: anything that doesn't need to be there. Start noticing some
• 55:33
  S11: of that calm and freedom and then move to the
• 55:37
  S11: next hardest space and the next hardest space. The the
• 55:40
  S11: bathrooms and the clothes closet and the kitchen and the
• 55:44
  S11: eventually you get to the basement and the garage and
• 55:47
  S11: the attic and the home office. But start in easier
• 55:49
  S11: spaces where you can experience some of these benefits right away.
• 55:53
  S2: You know, was dawning on me. Joshua. I wonder if
• 55:56
  S2: what you're selling isn't minimalism. It's maximalism. I wonder if
• 56:01
  S2: what you're promoting here isn't more from life. And the
• 56:04
  S2: way you get there is through having less.
• 56:08
  S11: You are absolutely right. I love it. It is. It
• 56:11
  S11: is a realization that there is an opportunity cost for
• 56:16
  S11: everything that we buy, everything that we own, that we
• 56:20
  S11: live finite lives with a finite amount of money and
• 56:24
  S11: time and energy. And the best thing we can do
• 56:28
  S11: is focus that time and money. Time and money and
• 56:30
  S11: energy on the things that actually matter in the long
• 56:34
  S11: run and for eternity, than just what the world tries
• 56:37
  S11: to tell us to spend our money on.
• 56:40
  S2: Yeah, I got to tell you guys, I did a
• 56:41
  S2: deep dive on some of these books that he's written.
• 56:44
  S2: They're so well done. Here's the proof. As an author,
• 56:46
  S2: I can tell you this they're so well done that
• 56:48
  S2: these things have some of them have been published a
• 56:51
  S2: few years ago, not this most recent one that I'm
• 56:53
  S2: going to tell you about a few years ago. And
• 56:55
  S2: they're like really high on the Amazon bestsellers list. That's
• 56:59
  S2: how well this guy is being received. His most recent
• 57:03
  S2: work guys. Yep. Uncluttered faith, own less, Love more and
• 57:08
  S2: make an impact on your world. Here's what I want
• 57:11
  S2: you to do because we're going to get you a website. Uh,
• 57:14
  S2: just text the word more. One word more MORE to
• 57:18
  S2: 805 557898, more to 805 557898.
• 57:27
  S1: A basketball mom who's mastered the dad joke. Ali is
• 57:31
  S1: in the crew. It's Carl and crew on Moody radio.
• 57:37
  S2: Bottom of the hour on a Wednesday. Guess what? The
• 57:41
  S2: people are cheering. You can hear em across the globe.
• 57:44
  S12: Ha ha.
• 57:48
  S2: Or deep breathing. One of the two. But it's time
• 57:52
  S2: right now.
• 57:53
  S1: Making herself laugh no matter who joins her. It's time for.
• 57:57
  S1: Allie thinks it's funny.
• 58:00
  S4: You know, from time to time, we talk about, uh,
• 58:03
  S4: aspects of our life. Past jobs. I know that, Carl.
• 58:08
  S4: You used to, uh, have a paper route.
• 58:10
  S2: Yes, I did, yeah.
• 58:11
  S4: You took that dog sled team out, and.
• 58:14
  S2: Not all the time in the winter on. Well, probably
• 58:18
  S2: three out of five days.
• 58:19
  S4: Is really such a cool thing. One of my favorite
• 58:23
  S4: jobs when I was younger, I actually had a job
• 58:25
  S4: as a shop window mannequin. Would model those.
• 58:28
  S2: Clothes did not. That's a great job.
• 58:31
  S4: Yeah.
• 58:31
  S2: So they were you know, this isn't a joke right now.
• 58:34
  S4: This is. Yes, it's part of the joke.
• 58:35
  S2: Oh, okay. I thought you suck me in. I thought
• 58:38
  S2: that was a cool thing.
• 58:40
  S4: Window shop. Window mannequin. So, you know, they whatever outfits
• 58:43
  S4: were trending. I'd have to, like, put on that special
• 58:46
  S4: outfit and just, you know, shop window mannequin. It was
• 58:49
  S4: a great, great job. Held that position for a long time.
• 58:56
  S6: I don't know if that was funny or Carl. Oh.
• 59:01
  S2: That's one of the best ever.
• 59:03
  S5: That was good.
• 59:03
  S4: The best part was that you're like, really?
• 59:05
  S2: You know, I mean, I, I, you got me.
• 59:08
  S4: I know it's hard to know where I'm like, where's
• 59:10
  S4: the joke? Where's the reels? Because you really were a paper.
• 59:13
  S2: You sucked me in. Yeah, I did do a paper.
• 59:15
  S2: So I thought you were a you were one of
• 59:17
  S2: these girls that stood in the window, did the thing,
• 59:19
  S2: and then walked away. Yeah, I held that position for
• 59:22
  S2: a long time.
• 59:25
  S4: Oh, boy. Good grief. Next up, there was a, uh,
• 59:30
  S4: a robbery.
• 59:32
  S13: No, no.
• 59:32
  S4: An unfortunate robbery. But nobody was.
• 59:34
  S2: Nobody was there. Fortunate robberies.
• 59:37
  S5: For the robbery.
• 59:38
  S2: I guess.
• 59:39
  S4: I mean, nobody was injured in this in this robbery. Uh,
• 59:43
  S4: the the thief, he he fled the scene, as many
• 59:47
  S4: times they do, and Fell into a wet cement.
• 59:51
  S13: Oh, no. Yeah.
• 59:52
  S4: Which was great. Helped the police. Yeah. Turned him into
• 59:54
  S4: a hardened criminal.
• 1:00:00
  S6: Wow.
• 1:00:02
  S4: Text jokes to.
• 1:00:03
  S2: Outstanding.
• 1:00:04
  S4: Text jokes to 805 5578, 98. Jokes to 805 557898.
• 1:00:14
  S13: That's good.
• 1:00:15
  S14: Hold that position for a long time.
• 1:00:17
  S13: He's still laughing. The first punchline?
• 1:00:20
  S14: Hardened criminal.
• 1:00:21
  S4: As long as.
• 1:00:21
  S2: I love you, rehearse the punch lines. Those are so good.
• 1:00:25
  S2: Those were exceptional. Ali. Come on.
• 1:00:27
  S4: It's great to have you back, everybody. Last. Last couple
• 1:00:30
  S4: rounds of jokes.
• 1:00:31
  S2: Oh, I bet it's been rough without me being here.
• 1:00:34
  S4: It's been. It's been a struggle. We had some.
• 1:00:36
  S5: We had fun.
• 1:00:38
  S4: You guys.
• 1:00:38
  S2: I mean.
• 1:00:39
  S4: It was at my expense.
• 1:00:40
  S2: Your silence is murder.
• 1:00:42
  S4: Silence. Crickets. Text jokes to 805. 5578. 98.