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Gone Girl: Red Flags + Dating Safety with Justin Smith · Giving Pain Purpose with Lyndsay Soprano

• Lyndsay Soprano (00:01.862) All right guys, red flags. What are those? Right? We've got fire and weather warnings. We've got parking restrictions. We've got dangerous surf at the beach, all hazards. And in our current dating space where we have apps to swipe left and swipe right and make instant decisions on somebody that we might want to have a relationship with. Those instant decisions are based only on these few little things in a profile and a picture that may or may not be the person that you're going to meet on the other side, right? So it's dangerous relationships that are put in front of us all day long. We don't, and they're easily ignored warnings about these dangerous people. So what are the reasons for this? Why do we ignore our gut sometimes when we just know this is not the right decision, not the right food to eat, not the right dude, not the right gal? Why don't we follow that and we ignore it? Why do we ignore early signs? But what if the signs aren't visible to you? You know, like what if you had no idea who this person is and that they are just manipulative and sneaky and gross humans? The unknowns though of a new relationship can be exciting and adventurous, right? Shiny and new, we're in our honeymoon phase, right? He's so hot, she's so hot. Great, good for you. And now you're laying in a trash bag on the side of the road in Montana. and a deserted road because you're not paying attention to those red flags, right? So as we heard last week on our episode with Heather Rivette, romance fraud, exposing a predator, we learned firsthand about the dangers of dating in the documentary on Amazon Prime about what happened to her and many other vulnerable yet hopeful, excited women. And this doesn't just happen to women, guys, men are affected as well, because bitches be cray. Justin Smith (01:31.15) Okay. Okay. Lyndsay Soprano (01:59.964) We are crazy people. You've listened to me long enough that you know that I am totally batshit at sometimes, right? And if there was only a better way to feel confident and informed about dating safely, so you don't end up in that trash bag, there is. There's a better way. So today we're gonna talk about red flags, manipulative behavior, narcissism, abusive behavior, know, a little bit of that slow creep of toxicity that kind of Justin Smith (02:00.366) Okay. Okay. Lyndsay Soprano (02:29.618) oozes in, you don't really notice it until it's so bad that your body is dying. Emotional abuse and PTSD, gaslighting, my God, that covers all of the above, and an app that can help you steer clear of all of that before it's too late. So without further ado, I would like to introduce you to my guest, Justin Smith. Hey, buddy, what's going on? Justin Smith (02:53.469) Not much after the introduction. feel like I could go do a triathlon. That was great. I appreciate it. Lyndsay Soprano (02:59.912) Well, you're kind of a stud and that's what we're gonna talk about today. So Justin is the creator of the app Cray dating safety, which he created after his wife of eight years who embezzled money from him, manipulated him, alienated him from his family and children and much more. And also was abusing him as she tried to gone girl him. After nearly dying in March of 2024, Justin made it his life mission to make sure that he experienced what he experienced never happened to other people. So Justin, if it's okay, I'd like to start first for those that don't know what Gone Girl is, a quick explanation of that, and then we'll tackle about what happened with your Gone Girl wife, and then let's take it from there. Justin Smith (03:42.89) Yeah, for sure. And you know, it's funny, I loved the movie before this happened to me. I haven't watched it since, but maybe at some point down the road, once this is a little more in the rear view mirror, but It's basically a movie about a woman who years in advance plots to ruin her husband's life. And she's very methodical about it. She even writes out in a book, whole fake diary about how abusive he is that he's, it's not really what he's like, but, you know, she had this revenge plot and, know, when she finally executes it on him, needless to say in the movie, his life is absolutely ruined and destroyed. Lyndsay Soprano (04:23.164) Yeah, and it's nuts. If you don't like Ben Affleck as I don't, you can still watch the movie because it's a perfect role for him. The book is really, really good. So whether it's the book or the movie, but it's a good preface for what we're getting into. All right, so let's take it from there in regards to what happened with your cray cray. Justin Smith (04:41.486) Yeah, so, partner of eight years married two and a half at the time. And, one day she violated the marriage and a very, you know, anti values of what she had instilled in the marriage. and then took off with our son for a month to another city, just left. And, you know, in the, in the. chaos of it all, trying to figure out what happened. I checked myself into a treatment center for 60 days to kind of recover from what happened because I lost 40 pounds. I had a blood pressure of 180 over 120 for two months. My resting heart rate was a hundred beats per minute. And what's crazy is when I was there, I kept telling everyone I felt like she gone girl. That was the only way I could describe it. And what's crazy, I don't know if I told you this yet, but She had gotten use of the house while I was in treatment. And when I got back in, just like in the movie Gone Girl, she left a book behind. And that book was our newlywed's book where we answered questions about our marriage or each other. And in it, it asks, what's your favorite movie or book? What do you think she listed as her movie or book? Lyndsay Soprano (05:58.846) Shut up. Gone girl. Justin Smith (06:00.91) Gone Girl. I have a picture of it. Go look at my LinkedIn. That is her handwriting in our newlywed's book. And it was like such like a poetic moment because I came into the house talking about it like it was Gone Girl for two months straight. And just like in Gone Girl, there was a book left behind by her as kind of like a, you know, a fuck you. Look at this great thing I did. All this how much I thought this all out. Lyndsay Soprano (06:21.747) Yeah. Justin Smith (06:27.048) And, it was left behind right there with Gone Girl mention in it, which was just crazy. It literally like, I started laughing because it was just like, you know, like this can't be real. Lyndsay Soprano (06:32.018) That is nuts. Right? Like the laugh like, I'm crazy. I'm losing my mind kind of a laugh. Like how is this actually my life right now? Justin Smith (06:45.962) Yeah, I mean, because this was someone that everyone in her life and in my family believed was this sweet, kind, never-could-hurt-a-fly kind of person. But all the decisions she make after she blew up the marriage, I would equate to me feeling like I was on the operating table, like paralyzed, and she was doing surgery on me knowing that I could feel all of it. You know, it was just God awful. Lyndsay Soprano (07:10.79) Yeah, and I mean, stuff like that, when you're talking about just the PTSD of things that come like, everything is ripped away from you. Everything that you thought was true is no longer true. that is insane to even think. Like, everything that I'm doing right now, everything that I've heard, everything that I've read, everything that's been behaved around me and my children and my family is a complete lie. Justin Smith (07:37.667) Well, and that's the worst part. So I went to treatment and when I had that realization, I was like, my God, this bitch is in my house with my kids for two months and I'm locked in here. Like, my God. So that, you know, that was a big piece of it that was terrible. And then I started trying to diagnose her because I was like, I had grown up in psychology. My dad was a psychologist. worked in a test publishing company for most of my adult life. Lyndsay Soprano (07:45.33) Right? Yeah! Justin Smith (08:03.214) prior to this. So I grew up in it and like, I should have recognized a crazy person because I grew up in psychology, you know? So I started diving into all the signs and symptoms of major cluster B personality disorders, because that's where it felt like it was headed of who she was. And that's when I started coming up with the app, because I started realizing that red flags that I missed are actually in a way signs and symptoms of some of these disorders. Lyndsay Soprano (08:09.396) Yeah Justin Smith (08:31.724) And then I started adding in some risk, you know, type things to look at or manipulation or deception pieces. So it isn't just about is the person crazy or treating me in a crazy way, but it's also, are they deceiving me? Are they manipulating me? Are they trying to gain me as a person for financial gain? so I tried to really sort through all those issues on her. And as I was doing it, it just made sense that like, Holy shit, I could make this product for other people. So other people don't have to deal with what I dealt with because I almost died. you know, and I'm a strong person. Like, you know, my therapist tells me I'm a strong person. Yeah, but no. Lyndsay Soprano (09:11.22) At least that's what I hear on the streets. That's what we give them 250 bucks an hour for is to tell them that you're doing great, Justin. You're just fantastic, Lindsay. In fact, I'm doing that right after we're done with this. I go straight to therapy and it's not because of this episode. Maybe a little bit. We don't know yet. It's still a little early in this in the show here. But man, I mean. Justin Smith (09:23.073) You Yeah, you know. Lyndsay Soprano (09:35.296) So what are the big hitting things that she did? Like it's about your family is involved, your kids are involved, and I know that we've got a little bit that we can't get dive too deep into that. But at a high level, all of the gaslighting that she did, all of the hiding, I mean, you're talking about things that affected the custody of your kids and your family and all of that. And then we're gonna get into your app. Justin Smith (09:54.026) Yeah, she, to, show you the type of trickery she used, I had let her into the house for two months while I was in treatment, like I mentioned. And on the day I left treatment on the flight home, I got a text that she filed an emergency motion with the courts. Lyndsay Soprano (09:58.728) Good word. Justin Smith (10:10.676) lying that I was abusive, a drug addict, and that she should get use of the house. And they granted it to her on the day I was leaving treatment after being locked in there for 60 days. So I got, you know, this, my excitement to finally be let free and come back to a normal life and get back into it. And she stole that away from me. And the worst part of that is that was the last summer before my daughter went to college. Lyndsay Soprano (10:27.55) Right. Justin Smith (10:35.872) So I missed out on those three, four months because all it was this game to my ex wife and she just wanted to win and win the house and then give a shit about the impact on my kids. Lyndsay Soprano (10:46.012) Yeah, yeah, how are they doing? High level. Justin Smith (10:50.086) it's been a struggle rebuilding the relationship. first of all, because my daughter loved my ex-wife, you know, my ex-wife leaned very heavily into building that bond as a manipulation tactic because I had one full custody of my, two older children from the previous marriage. And as soon as I won my daughter back and was intent on rebuilding that relationship, she jumped in and tried to make it this whole female bonding thing. And so I really missed out on a lot in terms of rebuilding that before she went to college, because once they're gone, all the image they have in their head is that snapshot of what it was like before they left and not what the things that have happened and the, you don't fill them in on all that. And to make matters even more worse, wife number two met wife number one, when I was in treatment, because I missed my daughter's graduation because of it. Lyndsay Soprano (11:31.848) Mm-hmm. Justin Smith (11:47.618) And that's when they began plotting together. And wife number two convinced wife number one to move down to Florida again and essentially steal my middle child from me. So I am now in the courts with a custody fight on that because an armed guard was hired by certain people to inhibit me or prohibit me from getting my son back, who I had full custody of. His mom had only been moved down for a month at the time. So it's now 15 months later and I'm still trying to sort that through the courts because apparently you can have a document that says you have full custody. can call the police because an armed guard is there and they say, sorry, it's a civil matter. It's like, what the fuck do mean? There's an armed guard taking my son from me. How is this a fucking civil matter? Lyndsay Soprano (12:31.366) Yeah, exactly. and you know, just, all of that, what happens from something so simple as a swipe left or a swipe right, right? When we get into these relationships and where everything seems to be going well, and then you're just, life hits you, like it did you. the, what is that? The trickle down effect, right? Which I hate that line, but that's probably why I didn't remember it right off the bat. Justin Smith (12:53.486) Yeah, and I feel like also if you pick the wrong partner Lyndsay Soprano (13:00.04) That trickle down, man, it hits everything. It hits your family, it hits your friendships, it hits your health, it hits your business, it hits everywhere. Because trauma hits everybody so differently and affects us so much. I mean, it's insane. Justin Smith (13:16.746) They exit the relationship in a lot different ways. mean, my partner exited the relationship by taking a can of gasoline and just dowsing everything as she left and throwing a match on it because she was so upset that she didn't get to the three year mark because had she gotten to the three year mark, our prenup would have given her $300,000. So, thankfully, yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (13:28.595) Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (13:40.638) What a dummy. Justin Smith (13:43.054) Thank, she didn't make it that far, but you know, that was another one of the data points. Looking back, I was like, holy shit, because she had fought so hard on the prenup to get these massive numbers. And then after we did the prenup, she kept pressuring me to sign over the house and to her name too, because it was only in my name. And so looking back on it, it's like, well, no wonder she was pushing on these issues so much because all along. Lyndsay Soprano (13:45.341) Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (14:05.416) No kidding, she was trying to take your entire life away from you. Trying to take your entire fucking life away from you is what she was doing. Justin Smith (14:14.412) And the sad thing is, since this blow up, I've had to create boundaries with my family and they have pretty much taken the parts of me they want and disposed of the body, which is crazy. Lyndsay Soprano (14:27.762) I'm so sad to hear that. I know you were talking about your parents still supporting them in ways that we can't talk about on air. We talked about them in hidden spots where you guys can't hear. But my gosh, it's the betrayal and making you feel crazy. gaslighting is insane to me. I don't understand the manipulation, questioning. Like we question ourselves. Am I losing my mind? My ex-husband did this to me. Justin Smith (14:38.595) What? Lyndsay Soprano (14:56.98) Absolutely gaslighted me and it made me feel like I was losing it like something's wrong with me and it was I mean I'm not gonna say that I didn't play any part in the issues in our marriage because I'd be a liar if I had said that but Man, man, it got super cray in our in our marriage and I was scared. I was fearful I have PTSD issues from it. I there was all kinds of things that happened in that relationship that stick with you You know, I mean, they're wounds, they're scars, they're there, and we're doing the best that we can here, certainly on the Pain Game Podcast, about how we can try to fix them or at least heal from them. And I know that you've done some things in order to try to help heal your body, your soul, your spirit, all that. What are a few of the things that you've done that have been in your mind, you know, I mean, helpful for you? Justin Smith (15:22.958) In terms of processing the trauma, I would say EMDR is great. I don't know if you know that, that's a, it's amazing technique. I strongly believe in dbt also, because dbt teaches you that there's a lot of meaning that we place onto events. That is us. It's all us. It's our story. We're putting on it. So I feel that was helpful for me. and I think CBT was helpful too, to help understand where I was going wrong in terms of. Lyndsay Soprano (15:52.358) Mm-hmm. yeah, we do. Justin Smith (16:21.452) the difference between the circumstances and the outcome of my situation and being able to analyze it backwards from the outcome I want, you know, I forget the different terms, but the actions bring results, thoughts bring action, circumstances bring thoughts. And so that's the core component of CBT. So if you are getting a different result than you want from the circumstance you're in, it's because one of your thoughts or your actions is off. And so you just backward reverse engineer it. And so just learning to gain different perspectives on my situation and different ways to process the pain of what I went through. I would even say ketamine therapy was helpful too in helping me with depression. I did that for six treatments, maybe eight treatments. having that to process trauma through that lens was helpful too. Lyndsay Soprano (16:53.577) Hmm. Lyndsay Soprano (17:16.274) Yeah, I inject ketamine once a week. In fact, yesterday was my ketamine night. And the things that I have learned and opened up, some of it's been a little frightening. Some of it has been, holy moly, that's amazing and powerful. And that wasn't as bad as I thought it was. Or, shit, I didn't even know that even happened. There's been some interesting windows that have opened and doors that have closed in my ketamine process. So I definitely am a team ketamine in that regard. But you also do a little bit of community service in regards to like adopting a homeless group in Tampa, right? That's awesome. So good. So good. Justin Smith (17:51.792) Yeah, so I used to go on nighttime walks because I suffer from insomnia due to all my trauma. I'm now on like five, six sleep meds to be able to stay asleep or try to. Lyndsay Soprano (18:06.514) Yeah. Justin Smith (18:07.746) I was in downtown area and I'd be going on this area called the river walk and I'd see these homeless people sleeping there freezing and winter on the, you know, the hard cold cement and it's right juxtaposed next to one of the richest zip codes in Tampa. And it just ate me alive walking through there. And I started thinking about my situation, everything I've been through. And I realized like, if I didn't have money, I would be those homeless people. Like if I didn't have the luxury. of coming from a good family and having savings. Like I would be literally where they are. Cause those are people have suffered a life crisis and, you know, didn't recover cause they didn't have the means. And I had read this book by the woman's name, but it's the power of choosing. And in it, she does this experiment on rats and, she tests to see how long they will all last swimming in a barrel before they give up. And it was all widely different times. And so she's like, that's weird. Let me, let me do it one more time, but this time I'm going to pick up a rat and I'm going to hold it for 10 seconds. Then I'm put it back in the water. And when she did that, all the rats lasted the exact same time. And she's like, what the hell? This is really strange. I wonder why. And so they thought around thinking about it and they believed that it was the hope. Having hope, a belief in your mind that you might have a positive outcome gave people enough ability to try their hardest. Lyndsay Soprano (19:04.014) not. Lyndsay Soprano (19:18.526) Right. Justin Smith (19:33.9) to get out of that water. So that's how I looked at it with the homeless. was like, I want to be that hand that picks them up and holds them and lets them know they're seen and heard. And I see them. I went up to a homeless guy on the river walk one night after I had this realization and I looked at my wallet and all I had was a $50 bill. I was like, I guess it's this motherfucker's best night. So I walked over and I gave it to him and I said, hi, what's your name? Lyndsay Soprano (19:57.844) You Justin Smith (20:04.45) And he looked at me like, what the fuck? Mark? Yeah. And I said, hi, I'm Justin. I hope you have a good night. And as I walked off, someone else walked up and gave him money. And that was like my first, like sign from the universe that I was headed in the right path. So then I went out and I bought a bunch of, air mattresses and all sorts of other stuff for them. So they wouldn't be sleeping on the cold floor and just really dove into it. So I've been doing that about 15 months now. Lyndsay Soprano (20:06.354) Yeah, I'm a person? Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (20:15.698) Lyndsay Soprano (20:29.332) I love that. That's great. Yeah, talk about soul food. know, doing things for other people is, well, I'm a gifter. It's part of why, I have a love-hate relationship with it because I love giving so much, but then what ends up happening is a lot of that giving, I don't give back to myself. so I end up, and everybody that's listening to this show knows, I end up being the one on the bottom of the. of the ladder and everybody else is climbing to the top while I've been supporting them. And so I've been trying to flip that switch over the past year or essentially year and a half. And it's hard work because it comes from such a good place, but I know how bad it is for like me. But in those particular circumstances, it's so beautiful to do that. Cause like here in Los Angeles, we've got Skid Row, right? Right next to Beverly Hills, right next to the, you know, Hollywood Hills. Like we've got all of this homeless population. Justin Smith (21:17.661) Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (21:24.348) in Los Angeles and so much money surrounding it. anyways, we're not talking about homelessness on the show, but today. But thank you for doing that and I applaud you for it because that's such a sweet anecdote for the episode. Justin Smith (21:27.726) Well, there was something I realized much like you, I'm a giver. like taking care of people and doing nice things. And I realized while I was in treatment and afterwards that that's how I got exploited by people. So I had to channel it into a good avenue of giving and helping others. Lyndsay Soprano (21:45.715) Yeah. Justin Smith (21:57.312) and then limit it in every other way to more appropriate boundary setting with other people. Because you end up feeling resentful afterwards, you know, like, I did all this, like, why are you still being a dick to me? You know, like Lyndsay Soprano (22:03.432) Yeah, well said. Lyndsay Soprano (22:09.169) Yeah, I have an ex-brother-in-law who is just that person and if you're listening, you aren't, bite me. Justin Smith (22:17.13) Hahaha! Lyndsay Soprano (22:18.974) So anyways, all right, so let's get into your app. So we've got this app called Cray and let's get into the scoring, let's get into how it works and so let's talk about it. Justin Smith (22:28.654) Sure. So Cray is, it's a dating safety app, but I like to couch it as a self-improvement app because it's really about helping people become better daters. It's two free parts. There's the Cray score, which is the red flags in the relationship. You answer questions about your partner's behavior and it will give you a report at the end that gives a score and gives a recommendation on whether you should consider leaving the relationship or not. and then it outlines what are the major red flags, what are the moderate red flags and other red flags. And it even goes into detail down in the bottom and explains why each red flag matters in terms of the happiness and health of the relationship and how it might affect the outcome of it. so then there's the schemer score, which is basically another set of questions, but it's checking for deception, manipulation, those kinds of things. It's not so much how crazy is the relationship, but more, you being exploited or. deceived. And then there's two other research tools I put in there that are the catfish check, which is a phone number lookup to see if the phone number is a fake phone number or being used for fraud, see who owns it. And then the background check, which is a legal history lookup in the state of your choosing to see if they've been arrested before. Lyndsay Soprano (23:43.837) which I love and to piggyback when I started the episode with Heather Rovet, who was last week, this guy that she had been involved with with all these other women who he just completely screwed, he had been in prison. He had had done all this time, but he was using a different name. was using a different this, that, know, all these different names and all these different platforms, not just on. Justin Smith (23:57.582) you Lyndsay Soprano (24:07.604) heterosexual but on homosexual websites as well. like, so, I mean, he was just like hitting everybody that he could and devastated so many people's lives. And the first person I thought of was her when this, and then of course, you know, my other girl that I was talking to you about. But so how does it work? So you download the app and you sign up, cause I did it yesterday. And cause we turned this thing around really quickly for you guys today, by the way. Justin Smith (24:11.598) Okay. Lyndsay Soprano (24:33.893) So I download the app and how does it work? So I download the app, I put in my information and then what do we do? Justin Smith (24:39.854) it will ask you, you'll select which one of the tests you want to do, whether it's the Cray score or the Schemer score. It'll ask you if you want to do just a quick one, which is 10 questions, the medium one, which is 35 and then the full, is 78. the 10 is the, yeah, there's a lot because there are a lot of different ways that people can, you know, negatively impact a relationship, whether it's being. Lyndsay Soprano (24:54.963) Whoa! Lyndsay Soprano (25:05.395) 78 holy shit Justin Smith (25:07.898) Everything from unkind and conflict to a house arrest ankle monitor to DUIs to grooming to, you know, it's just all, there's so many different ways that these people come in and, you know, entry points to come at someone with their craziness. So I wanted to be thorough and make sure I covered as many of the bases as possible, but give people also the option of, know, do I want to just look for the worst ones because I just want to check to make sure, you know, the worst are not true. Lyndsay Soprano (25:34.588) Yeah, like I'm not going to end up in the trash bag on the road in Montana. Yeah. But okay. Yeah. I don't think any of us want to be chopped up into little bitty pieces and put into a trash bag on the side of the road. However, like if we could step down a notch and be like, just need a normal dude or a normal chick to live my life with and have a good time and have kids or not have kids have dogs like I did, you know, and I find it so sad. Justin Smith (25:38.657) Yeah Lyndsay Soprano (26:03.93) that these are the conversations that we're having when all we're trying to do is find love and all we're trying to do is find somebody to hang out with and be their best friend. Like it makes my heart hurt for and thank God I'm not dating anymore. And I swear to God, if when my husband kicks the bucket or I kick the bucket, well, I'm not gonna be dating if I kick the bucket, but you never know I might come back. I would never start dating again. Absolutely not. Justin Smith (26:07.316) No. It's. Lyndsay Soprano (26:31.924) Absolutely not. I don't want to have anything to do with it. told my sweetie I'm like I'm moving to Italy and I'm buying a big piece of land and I'm gonna get like a hundred wiener dogs. That's what I'm doing. Justin Smith (26:42.713) But it's true. mean, that's the downside to love is, it's an emotional thing. I mean, you know, it's easy for us to overlook some of these red flags because we're getting flattered or, know, the person's, you know, gassing us up in such a way we've never been gassed up before, or, you know, they're taking us on trips or. Yeah. Lyndsay Soprano (26:46.395) I know. Lyndsay Soprano (27:00.788) We're love bombed like nobody's business. Yep, yep, absolutely. Oh man. Justin Smith (27:06.072) So that's, that's the tough thing. And, you know, I feel like too, the problem is with online dating that most of the people who go online dating are people who don't have a support system or another network to date through. And so there's a lot of people ready to take advantage of those people on the dating apps because they know they have that advantage over them. And they know that those people are lonely and looking for attention. Lyndsay Soprano (27:30.004) Yeah, for sure. also everybody on your dating apps, could you please choose better pictures? That is my public service announcement for this episode. OK, so how do I know? I went on one for like a hot minute, like many, many years ago, and I was like, oh, my God, this is how you want to show yourself to the world. Justin Smith (27:44.588) It is surprising. Lyndsay Soprano (27:58.854) I feel like that's a red flag just in of itself. anyways, so okay, so how do, when we download the app and we start getting engaged, how does the app know who these people are? We have to obviously provide contact information of some sort. does it pull from our contacts from our phone? How does that data get into the app? Justin Smith (28:21.872) Yeah, so it links with your address book just so that people and I did this kind of for multiple reasons, but some of it is usability because if you're in an abusive relationship or something like that, you know, like you want to make sure you're. doing the assessment on the right person or that the name, you you're not going to use some other person's name and get confused or, know, I mean, I would hate for someone to choose partner a because the report was, you know, good on them and bad on partner B and they got the names mixed up, you know, it'd just be, yeah. But, know, that's speaking of which that is one of the great things about that too, is if you are having to choose between two people, this is a great way to. Lyndsay Soprano (28:51.891) Oof. Justin Smith (29:01.624) filter them through objective criteria. Cause sometimes it's really hard to make that decision if you you've met two people and they're kind of at the same time and you're not sure which, you know, one to go with. Lyndsay Soprano (29:14.792) Yeah, Frank. I don't know which one of you to choose, but this one's got 25 more red flags than you, so you're the winner, buddy. Justin Smith (29:23.726) Well, I mean, if you're a beautiful woman who gets a ton of attention, you have guys thrown at you all the time. It gets, I'm sure it gets pretty hard to pick which one's the right one. Uh, you know. Lyndsay Soprano (29:32.614) I would assume so. I've not been into that situation where I had to pick from a million men, but you know, it is what it is. Well, I don't even have a type. Like if you look at a picture of all the dudes that I've dated or the ones I've married, none of them look the same. None of them have the same, none of them are the same even remotely. So there's, I don't think that there's any formula for what this one over here needs. That's for sure. So when you, when you, Justin Smith (29:39.03) Me either. Lyndsay Soprano (30:01.788) When you go into the app and you're like, okay, I wanna access your contacts, right? Because that was the first step that came in in the app, right? The first thing that I thought was, are all of these people gonna get some kind of a notification? That was the first thing. I know, and I don't know why, but that was the first thing. Is that fear that comes up? Because we're like, my God. Like, I can't even imagine if somebody got an alert, like, you've just been notified on the gray app. So there's none of that from a... Justin Smith (30:02.734) No. Lyndsay Soprano (30:29.044) from a protection, I this is all about safety, right? So protecting our data and protecting us from, protecting us when we're looking for these people and these red flags. So all of that is covered within this app. We don't have to worry about any of that at all. Justin Smith (30:45.531) Yeah, it's all private. This is not T app. It's not going to be a public forum for people to post their partners' reviews or anything like that. Lyndsay Soprano (30:55.026) Yeah. Justin Smith (30:55.326) And, actually to speak to that point, we're building the web version of the app currently, and it will use a different structure for the context where you can change the name to something else or, you know, have the phone number in there, but it'll, it never goes to that person. It's just a way to organize the data and link an assessment to a person so that we have a structure behind it that makes sense. Lyndsay Soprano (31:01.432) okay. Justin Smith (31:19.694) at some point, I'm sure we'll do, some sort of data analytics on the results and gain some insight about people's behaviors. But, at this point, it's like, you know, when you create the database, you have to choose certain fields for the, keys and all that. It's just how it goes. Lyndsay Soprano (31:35.484) Yeah. in my, so like I always have when, when, when I kick the bucket, everybody knows in my life that you go to my contacts, the only people that you need to make sure that you let, let anybody know that something has happened to me is everybody that is on my top level of love and support in my life has some kind of weird ass nickname in my phone. So. Like, it's just ridiculous, some of the names that I have for people in there. if I wanted, but if I wanted to look up some information, let's just say I'm my ex-husband, for example, which I'm very intrigued to do, by the way. So his name is in my phone, his phone number's in my phone, and I just select him, and then somehow, someway, your database, your app is able to find out what this dude has been up to. Justin Smith (32:25.989) So I want to clarify, it does not research a person unless you buy the catfish check for the phone number or the legal history lookup for the person's name. It doesn't go outward and look for any sort of information. All it uses is your internal understanding of that person. Lyndsay Soprano (32:34.716) Okay. Okay. Okay. Lyndsay Soprano (32:46.086) Okay. Justin Smith (32:46.24) and answering questions about that person's behavior. So then you can build kind of a behavior profile and use that to understand is this person safe and are they exhibiting a lot of red flag behaviors. Lyndsay Soprano (32:49.288) Got it. Okay. Profile. Lyndsay Soprano (32:58.036) Okay, that thank you because that totally that's the piece that I was missing And how that works. So, okay, so that makes total sense. That's so amazing Justin Smith (33:07.234) And the the reason behind that, I want to clarify for your audience. people do something called impression management. And what that means is on social media or the first three to four dates or the first six months, you're meeting their representative. You're not meeting that person. And that's why scanning their social media would not be useful or fruitful in this type of situation. Because everyone posts what the life they want you to believe they have, not the life they live. You know what I mean? So it'd be junk data. Lyndsay Soprano (33:38.844) I do. I absolutely do. am. Please, ladies and gentlemen, stop telling me what grade your kids are in. Just stop it. I guess I'm doing PSAs all through this episode today. That's my next one. No, because it's true, because it is, that's what social media has done. It's like, this is the life that you guys think that we're leading, but nobody's talking about all the dark and twisty me literally on my hands and my knees climbing to the bathroom because I can't walk kind of days. I'm posting up stuff like, we're in Mexico, we're in Italy, you know? Like that's gonna show like great. Yeah. Justin Smith (33:54.124) Ha ha ha. Justin Smith (34:15.47) Look at my great dinner. Lyndsay Soprano (34:20.072) Don't you love this shrimp scampi? Yeah, so, okay, so that's good. God, this is so interesting. I love this. You've got, you're sitting on a fricking, you're sitting on something pretty amazing. Good for you. Yep. Justin Smith (34:22.606) What's up? Justin Smith (34:31.502) Well, I copyrighted it and trademarked it too. So no one can do this. because I realized that, you know, no one's created a product that, you know, can help people. And this is really truly the only way, because the way I like to talk about it is imagine someone 18 years old going to college who is now in this open field of getting to date whoever they want as much as they want. Lyndsay Soprano (34:39.694) Nope. Justin Smith (34:56.702) And you know, for being honest parents, we don't do a great job of teaching our kids everything to look out for because we can't, we don't have the time. They're not at a point yet where they even want to hear that kind of feedback on dating. so that's why I'm very strongly going for the college market. I'm trying to bake this into orientation for colleges because I can catch people literally as far upstream as possible before any of the dating trauma happens. And so if I can catch them at that point, I can save so many people from trouble. Lyndsay Soprano (35:28.692) And as we talked about on our meet and greet, I had some fairly horrific trauma happen to me my freshman year in college, and it was in a frat house. And that is that age bracket where you have the world as your oyster. Nothing has really put you down yet. You just graduated from high school. You've got the world in front of you. And now it's time to get a little drinky on and, you know, go hang out in the sororities and frat houses. And it is a very scary place to be. But back then, I mean, we were talking about it, like we had pagers. We landlines, that's for sure. So we didn't have this kind of technology in front of us, but we also didn't have dating apps in front of us. We also didn't have all of these other places where we can get catfish, where we can't. It's really like... Justin Smith (35:57.774) you Okay. Lyndsay Soprano (36:20.288) my gosh, this girl's daughter has a son. Like you were mentioning, the network of hooking up within your own normal communities of people, which is kind of how it was for us in the 70s and the 80s and 90s, right? Well, now it's like, it's a fucking free for all. You can find somebody on the other end of the planet at two o'clock in the morning that wants to have sex with you. That is scary. So thank you for starters for putting something like this together. I am sad for you. Justin Smith (36:23.949) yeah. you Lyndsay Soprano (36:49.352) that it took what happened to you to get to this place. But I feel the same way about my journey with it took all of this bullshit to get me to where I am right now. And I love it because now you and I are helping so many people today. And I am so proud to have you here today with me for sure. So, okay. So what's coming up next with you? You're talking about we're doing the the web version of it. And I love that you're targeting the audience of the college people because that is. But then we've got that other side of the scale where you've got widows, you've got divorcés that are 50, even in their 60s, right? That are also incredibly vulnerable, because now we're using, they're not as tech savvy perhaps, and that is... Justin Smith (37:24.248) They're not gonna recognize AI. Lyndsay Soprano (37:41.766) You mean A1 sauce? our Secretary of Education in the United States of America said? For all of the world to say? No, it's not A1, you idiot! Justin Smith (37:53.355) Thanks Yeah, it's getting, it's getting scary, honestly, because I feel like this next phase is going to be even scarier with AI built in and image bots. Lyndsay Soprano (37:57.863) It is! Lyndsay Soprano (38:01.96) We gotta like buckle up guys. We gotta buckle up. We're up for a ride. I think for the next decade of who knows what. And you're gonna be here to help us. And I'm so happy to have you here. Justin Smith (38:14.19) Well, and that was the goal. Yeah, that was the goal. mean, you when I was in treatment and I was at my worst, I mean, you look, start looking for purpose, you know what I mean? And mine was I can either let this destroy me cause it almost did, almost died, or I could use it and make lemonade out of my lemons and turn it into helping other people and healing that pain through that. So, uh, that was an important turning point for me for sure. Lyndsay Soprano (38:43.666) Yeah, and I love it. And it's similar to mine with this where we give pain purpose. That was a really weird phrase to come into terms with because what else am I going to do with this? alternative to me not doing it and being the way I am no matter how bad I feel where this morning I was crawling on the ground to get to the bathroom. You wouldn't expect it talking to me right now, but I couldn't walk this morning, right? This is part of it. But you fucking show up, man, and you bring it. Justin Smith (38:54.808) Yeah. Justin Smith (39:03.742) No. exactly. That was, that was my issue. mean, that's one of the benefits of working on this business. I was, you know, by myself for 18 months, my whole family abandoned me. Like I had no one. Lyndsay Soprano (39:11.232) And the alternative is sitting on your couch watching Netflix and eating bonbons and feeling sorry for yourself. And I mean, the bonbons part is great, but the rest of it is bullshit. Justin Smith (39:31.702) And it was either sit around crying or work on a business of helping people. So I poured myself into it for 18 months while all these people who supposedly love me are talking shit on me and saying, I'm doing nothing. I'm crazy. I built an amazing product that's going to help people. So. Lyndsay Soprano (39:31.753) baby. Lyndsay Soprano (39:36.158) That's right. Lyndsay Soprano (39:48.284) Yeah, and I wonder what their cray scales are. What are their scores? Can you imagine you do it on your parents? They're like, whoa, I had no idea my parents were this crazy. Well, my gosh, this is wonderful. Thank you so much. Is there anything you'd like to leave our listeners with before we hit the dusty trail? Justin Smith (39:56.987) Ugh, yeah. I'll wait till other legal... Justin Smith (40:08.782) I would say just spell that and give yourself grace in recovering from trauma. I mean, you know, it's not always, you know, steps forward. There's going to be some steps back and, you know, give yourself grace in that, you know, it's, it's a long process healing from trauma and, know, it's not an overnight thing, but as long as you're still working on it and approaching it in a healthy way, you'll get through it. Lyndsay Soprano (40:10.002) Besides choose wisely. Lyndsay Soprano (40:16.424) Mm. Lyndsay Soprano (40:34.78) Yeah, I love it. Thank you so much. This has been great. I knew we were gonna have fun today. You can find this Cray guy. His website is Cray.app, C-R-A dot A-P-P. And you can go there, you can learn everything about the app, download it, it's free. Some of the services are paid like he mentioned, but it's super easy to find Cray app. It's on Google as well as iOS. Justin Smith (40:38.018) You're welcome. Justin Smith (40:54.254) It's the same thing as Google. Lyndsay Soprano (41:02.244) and I don't know anything about Android, so I cannot speak to that platform at all, but it's on it. He's on Instagram as well. Exactly. Don't even really know what's happening here. I can't even use Google Maps for crying out loud. It's always upside down. Give me a break. He's on Insta at Cray.app as well. You can find him on LinkedIn and all the places. We will be sharing it in social media and show notes and our email marking and all that, so be sure to sign up for that. And we already have our merch store launched. So you guys need to check out our merch store. We've got all kinds of things going on here at the Pain Game Podcast. And I'm so happy, Justin, for having you here today. Thank you so much. It's been awesome. Justin Smith (41:40.827) Of course, thanks for having me, Lindsay, I appreciate your audience taking the time to listen to my story. Lyndsay Soprano (41:42.524) You got it. Right on. Thank you so much. You are exclusively invited to share this no sooner date better VIP pain journey together. Let's get to the heart of how to heal with you and Justin by my side. Please follow the pain game podcast wherever you digest your podcast content. We will be there. Visit us at the pain game podcast dot com and follow us on all the socials. Thanks for listening. My little VIPs catch you on the other side. That was fun. Justin Smith (42:14.417) Yeah.