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From Wall Street to Building Change with Tina Larsson · Better Together

• Shawn Sundsvold: Hey everyone, I'm Sean Sunsvold and I'd like to welcome you to another episode of the Better Together podcast. As always, I'm joined by Kelly Sunsvold, my partner in both business and in life. We started this podcast to share the real stories behind building a business, the wins, the stumbles, and the persistence it takes to chase something you believe in. Today, our guest is Tina Larson. She's the co-founder of the Folsom Group and the author of Living the High Life, How a Smart Co-op and Condo Owners protect themselves and their investment. We'll talk about her journey from Wall Street analyst to co-op reformer, how she built the only business of its kind in New York City, and what she's learned about leadership, entrepreneurship, working and running a business with your spouse, and staying the course even when the path ahead wasn't clear. So Tina, welcome to the show. Thanks for being here. I know you've survived a little bit of snow up there in New York here the last few days. Tina Larsson: I have. Thank you so much, Sean. And nice to meet you, Kelly. Great to be here. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Great to meet you too. Shawn Sundsvold: So let's start at the beginning. You know, what first opened your eyes to the problems happening in your own co-op and what made you say, need to do something about this. Tina Larsson: Yes, that's a great question. And so I never take no for an answer. Okay. Doesn't matter what people tell me. Okay. And I hate status quo. So in New York city, if you own, it's called a co-op, but in many places or a condo in many places of the country, it's called an HOA or a COA just for background. So it's an apartment building where the person own the people in the building. They own their apartments. That's basically the commonality. The legal structure doesn't matter. We own a co-op. We didn't pay attention. Mark, my husband, or my life partner and business partner, I, we said, this board is doing a terrible job. Why are they wasting so much time? There are tons of lawsuits. Nothing is going right. ⁓ they don't even communicate with us. So spoke some of our neighbors and we all ⁓ a coup. Ha Shawn Sundsvold: You Kelly Sundsvold: Woo! Tina Larsson: So we took over the board. dramatic. So took over the board ⁓ and new board, they didn't know what to do. They weren't like, okay, so now what? ⁓ And didn't know anything about running buildings, et cetera. And I didn't either, but I have always been into statistics and comparing numbers. Kelly Sundsvold: you Tina Larsson: So I said, I'll volunteer to the finance committee and I'll see if I can find any savings. And in the first three years, we were able to save our building $340,000. I know, and it's millions by now, but we stopped counting at 2 million because then we already had our own business. But $340,000 is actually 10 % of the annual costs in our building. Kelly Sundsvold: my gosh. ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: Wow. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Shawn Sundsvold: Wow. Tina Larsson: So when I was out networking, said, nobody wants to meet another financial advisor in New York. Everybody's like, you know, I got someone. So I started telling people, introducing myself, Samtina Larsson, and I helped my co-op save $340,000. And all of these people said, ooh, can I introduce you to my board? Shawn Sundsvold: You Kelly Sundsvold: Nice. Tina Larsson: And where's this history? I said, well, during those three years, we also learned that boards of volunteers, don't have time. They're doing this on their free time. have a ⁓ ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: There you go. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: have another specialty. They might be an attorney or a media person or something else, Running building is not their expertise. And then don't have the time, they have families, they have hobbies. ⁓ There's no they're gonna fit this in. And then they don't have the support because they hire a property manager and a property management business ⁓ run ⁓ ⁓ business is that they need to have ⁓ many buildings one property manager. ⁓ I don't know about you, that's like running ⁓ businesses, if they run eight buildings. So don't know about you, ⁓ but me, running one business is keeping me pretty busy. ⁓ So don't have time either. ⁓ So was someone that needs to that void. ⁓ So started a business. ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Nice. Well, that's awesome. That's awesome. So of backing up a little bit and I'd heard that you have a pretty extensive Wall Street background. What skills or mindsets from that time period really helped you be able to step into the world of real estate and reform, I should say. ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah, that's great. Tina Larsson: Yes, from the finance background? So it was my ⁓ skills. I was analyzing on Wall Street, was analyzing businesses for purpose of investing my clients ⁓ money the stock market. ⁓ So, many, years ago, one of my favorite statistics teacher, said to me, he said, you have a knack for statistics. And that stuck with me. went like, ⁓ I can do this. You know, people praise you, you're like, ⁓ I'm good at that. ⁓ okay, let's do that. So it was ⁓ And then it also... Before Wall Street, I worked in the hospitality industry. So there's a lot of project management involved in that. then when started working for a finance company, it was a small, fairly new ⁓ And there a bunch of guys, a bunch of ⁓ young, 30 old Wall Streeters who ⁓ we'll just hang up our own shingles and start our own company. But they didn't really, were not very good the organizational skill. aspects of it. So I had implemented a lot of systems for them that I also used in my practicality of is not how this not the best way to do things we should find a better way ⁓ and think that that expertise that experience also brought added to me being to save money and ⁓ help other ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. love how like, know, when you're when you have a career, right, in one place and you're able to bring those skills to another place, it gives you such confidence, right? You to do the job well. And as you you you started this company with your husband and it's the only company in New York City that does what you guys do, which I think fantastic and very unique. What what do you think made between you guys, what do you think made it work for you two that nobody else could seem to figure out? Tina Larsson: A lot of patience. I think that everybody thinks that this is something that's needed. Everyone who's ever served a co-op or condo board feels that this is needed. But I think that they didn't really visualize how it could be done. then they didn't stick with it. We are turning 12 years ⁓ month. And we have the three years that we work with our own building. I mean, we have done this for 15 years. We just didn't give up. And I think that this, really a multiplier. ⁓ it's several items and not only one item. It's, yeah. And have spoken. Especially in the very beginning when we started 12 years ago, we spoke with a lot of people who said, ⁓ this guy is trying to do exactly the same. Or someone else who said, trying to do this little niche within that scope of what you're trying to do. ⁓ And actually a lot of consultants that are very specialized. So there energy consultants. Well, the energy consultants might provide a fancy report because they have engineers, mechanical engineers. We're not engineers. We're practical business people who, if then happens to be a sidewalk to be repaired because of ⁓ what they're on, we are actually familiar. ⁓ We have with working with sidewalk repairs. So ⁓ yeah. Great question. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah, it's interesting. Kelly and I, we've been married for 22 years and we've now been working together in the business the last three and a half years. just the amount of, I think you said it, patience and communication you have to figure out because then it's not just conversations about like... Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Shawn Sundsvold: you know, home life, right? Or getting kids to where they need to go and those type of family logistics. There's now, we have these business conversations that we have to figure out how to have too. you try to make it where the two sort of don't overlap, right? Because you've got the business conversations and the personal conversations that have to stay separate, right? Tina Larsson: Yes, but don't you find that it's very efficient? You cut out, you can't have any office gossip because that doesn't exist, right? So you cut that out. every time I used to come home and complain about my colleagues or my work or my salary or whatever, we do that anymore, right? ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Yes. Wait. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Tina Larsson: We might complain that we don't have enough new clients or that the pipeline or something else, but we're complaining about the same thing. It's not like one person is sitting there and going like, ⁓ why is she complaining about that again? I don't care about her company. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. There's so much truth to what you just said. I hadn't thought about it that way from the sense of like it is a very different. You don't have the politics that you bring home because you are the company and ⁓ conversations a lot different. And what's something that you've Shawn Sundsvold: Ha Kelly Sundsvold: kind of put in place or something that works really well in your partnership maybe you've had to learn to navigate. Tina Larsson: What I've learned to navigate, well, we cut out the waste, right? Is that sometimes, ⁓ always think about ideas. I always think about, maybe not about business. ⁓ I ⁓ present, ⁓ if we a date night, sometimes ⁓ I get ⁓ most brilliant in the middle of date night. And I just to talk about it because it's such a brilliant idea. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Uh-huh. Yes! Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: And I think that that's something that I just really need to ⁓ of that I shouldn't be so gung-ho. Kelly Sundsvold: I mean, I think there's a time and there's a place, but ⁓ those brilliant ideas, especially if you two are in the same team, you don't want to lose that momentum. And if you have something exciting, I know I've been there, Sean's been there, ⁓ you you want to share it almost in real time. Like I have this idea and ⁓ know, I think it's ⁓ I've joked on this podcast before about, you know, times and boundaries. We've had to say, OK, hold on time out. I don't want to talk about this client right now. I want to continue watching my show on Netflix. And so, you know, there's times and places for everything. And so sounds like you guys kind of go through similar, similar things. Tina Larsson: Yes, we do. And some and and I think that it's not always. I mean, don't you feel like that, Kelly, that sometimes at date night we come up with a brilliant idea and it's perfectly fine. And then sometimes Now I'm content concentrating this and I ⁓ OK. I'll put up I'll get my pen and paper. ⁓ I'll get ⁓ get my ⁓ me just open my chat. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. Kelly Sundsvold: 100%. Yes, yes. ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: ⁓ yeah. You know, as, as you guys got started, you know, one of the things we talked about in our initial call was that your business was met with a lot of resistance when you got started those early years. What helped you and Mark stay committed, you know, to that and moving forward when it wasn't easy and it might've been easier to walk away. Tina Larsson: So it's in my nature. If you tell me it can't be done, I'll show you how it's done. So I think that that's a little bit me. But we were also committed and we saw that the finance industry was changing. Shawn Sundsvold: You Tina Larsson: we didn't with everybody trading on their own accounts and they're all trading on Coinbase and they're all multi billionaires because they bought Bitcoin when we didn't, you know, and that, ⁓ the finance industry has changed, the demographics has changed. It appears to us that junk... Kelly Sundsvold: Yes. Tina Larsson: younger generations, and I'm not talking super young, I'm not talking 18 year old, I'm talking like by now they're 40, have ⁓ your age, ⁓ ⁓ like... ⁓ to pick up the phone and be in a conversation with their advisor. It seems to, and I'm not the age to do it for, that used to be the case, that everybody was on the phone and they want personal advice, they wanted to talk to their attorneys, their CPA, their financial advisor. Whereas we have seen that that was kind of shifting to them being perfectly fine with just having an app. we saw it shifting. ⁓ And we didn't really know how we would fit in there. At the same time as we were very determined. ⁓ think that it was just because we were two people, ⁓ were very persistent. We were doing a lot of networking. We still do a lot of networking. But we have assistants, we have a whole team. And nowadays very active on LinkedIn. So we get a lot of... Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: There's a lot of networking going on on LinkedIn and yes, so I don't have a good answer. ⁓ ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah, persistence. Yeah, I can definitely tell that from from your personality just right out of the gate. ⁓ know, I love that you said that, you I don't take no for an answer. know, ⁓ is good. So kind of back to those first few years, what were some of the growing pains that you had and how did you get through them? Shawn Sundsvold: Mm. Tina Larsson: So property manager is day-to-day operation of a building. The board the decisions and then they act on them. Property managers act on them. So it's kind like the CEO of a company has a great big idea and then the CFO and COO they need to implement it. ⁓ Okay, ⁓ so kind that relationship. The property manager, see themselves as their trusted partner. they but we handle that. You don't need them. ⁓ We will that. We will reduce your expenses. We will get your projects done. since then, so 15 years ago, there was not a whole lot of project management going on because property managers at the time, didn't, they, that was just in their ⁓ property management. Since then, they have all set up, or many of them have set up property project management divisions and they charge extra fees for that. So the clients that hire us now firms, ⁓ boards that don't, they feel that their property manager is busy enough and they don't really want to work. They want a third party. ⁓ they hire us for that. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Shawn Sundsvold: and Tina Larsson: But so clearly that portion of our business, there's demand for it because all the property management firms or many of them have set that up. they realized that that was needed too. ⁓ ⁓ the beginning, they just said, no, you don't need them. So we couldn't go to the... Initially, we thought, ⁓ we'll go to the property managers. One of them will hire us, white label us, and we will do all the work for them and will make them look really good. And that about... Shawn Sundsvold: Hmm. Tina Larsson: one phone call and then we realized that that's never gonna happen. So we need to reach the board members. Shawn Sundsvold: Hmm. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: There are three million New Yorkers who own an apartment. Shawn Sundsvold: Wow. Tina Larsson: Every single of those three million potentially be in a position to us to their port. Kelly Sundsvold: well. Shawn Sundsvold: Wow. Tina Larsson: So that's been our strategy. Shawn Sundsvold: And it's a great strategy, yeah. Tina Larsson: But Allah... Shawn Sundsvold: Maybe. Tina Larsson: the last few years we've done since COVID, we started being active on LinkedIn, we improved our website, all the good stuff that you do. I've been ⁓ a hundred trying to get message out there. I wrote the book. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Yes, yes. Yep. Shawn Sundsvold: Yes. And I, and I'm curious, you know, that is a question because like you, sent me a copy of the book. It was a fantastic read. It's got a lot of very, very good information for, you know, condo and co-op owners to understand how the processes work. And I think that was the biggest thing I took away from it as somebody, you know, as a, as a first time reader of it. What, what was it that really prompted you to, to write that book and to share all that information? Tina Larsson: I wrote a book. Great question. So what happened? Why did I write it? I wrote it because I had put it down on my piece of, on my five year goal. I said, I'm going to write the book. And I actually put it down for April 1st. And that's when I started writing in 2022. So what prompted me to write the book, besides I put it down on a piece of paper, was that Our goal has always been to provide, since we started this, to provide boards with the resources and tools that they need to succeed, whether it's the support that we provide or whether it's resources that we provide. Okay, tools, et cetera. So operate what's the ⁓ worst opposite? It's reactively. what's the absolute worst case scenario of that? That is ⁓ the collapse the... condo in Surfside, Florida in 2020. That 2020 or 21? I haven't read my own book in a while. that condo collapse is the ultimate worst case scenario. So this book is a guidebook on how to take an owner or a board member from this is we're not going to do this. These are all the steps we're going to do to operate proactively so that to prevent any disaster. And it doesn't have to be that disaster, a disaster. ⁓ ⁓ I work with an edit. For full disclosure, I worked with an editing team because initially I said, want to, ⁓ target, they said, what's your target audience? I said, New York City co-op in Condeau board members. said, no, Kelly Sundsvold: Heh. Tina Larsson: It needs to be the 66 million Americans who own in an HOA. So, okay. Shawn Sundsvold: Hmm. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah, I mean, there's if you can scale and make it repeatable, I mean, why not go to other cities, you know, Philadelphia, Boston, that's not too far from you. So on that, like, what do you wish more ⁓ and condo board members understood about leadership or financial responsibility? Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: do I wish that ⁓ and Condo owners, I just wish that they understood more what a big responsibility it is for five, seven, nine board members who step up and do this on ⁓ free ⁓ I mean, they're making multimillion decisions for roof repairs and facade repairs and elevator replacements. in their regular life, of them have never made ⁓ decision. Their biggest decision is whether ⁓ buy a car or to buy a vacation, right? ⁓ and so many people, if they buy a car or vacation, ⁓ who dependent, who depends that, right? So now they're making this decision on a hundred apartment. a building with a hundred apartments, is 150 residents and it's their investment. ⁓ of the things that we always do, and I people all the time, and ⁓ one the ⁓ goals the book was for ⁓ owners understand how complicated is so that they take a proactive approach and volunteer their time to the board. And one of the things we always tell board, we say, go out and recruit, get as many board members as you can who are not currently board members, because if they sit on the board for one year, they're going to realize what a big job it is. Shawn Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Yeah, and that was something, you know, again, just kind of going back to your book and all the information that's in there. You give a lot of strategies of, you know, how to help. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Shawn Sundsvold: you if you like, if somebody wants to become a board member or a board leader, you give a lot of good strategies in there of how to help build your team, right? And then how to get things done. there was just so much good information on there. And, know, again, just lots of years of experience, I'm sure coming down and, know, in talking about that. as yeah, just a fantastic, you know, ⁓ of information in there. Tina Larsson: Thank you! I might have to make a clip out of this and put it on my ⁓ Shawn Sundsvold: welcome to, like I said, was just, was, was just ⁓ been somebody who's never been that situation. Right. I felt like I could walk away and at least have the basics of understanding that, you know, when you're sitting on the board, on the board of a co-op or something like that, it really is a business, right? It's not just a building. You really have to treat it like a business. Tina Larsson: mean, it's still a building and it's still your home and it's still, but is a business. ⁓ ⁓ about it, if you ever go to a local restaurant, Shawn Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Tina Larsson: The owner is always there. Shawn Sundsvold: Mmm. Tina Larsson: Now you have a board who meets once a month. That's when I meet once a month. then the property manager is supposed to act on their decisions. And person walks the building once a maybe. But they're pretty never seen. Can you imagine running a restaurant? mean, the restaurant would be out of business in two minutes. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah, exactly. When we were in New York the weekend, ⁓ had the opportunity to go to two different restaurants. Both of them were local. ⁓ one of the criteria we give is, you know, find something local. And you're absolutely right. We had ⁓ owner come up or at least the general manager ⁓ up and there was a vested interest of like, ⁓ did you think of the food? Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: You know, have yours has your service been good, you know, like there was there's inquisitive and curious questions, you know, and it always ends with a you know, thank you so much for for dining with us Tina Larsson: ⁓ you ⁓ take ownership ⁓ ⁓ that's not always ⁓ easy for boards since they are have a full-time job. Kelly Sundsvold: Exactly. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah, yeah, kind of on that line of, you know, going from, you know, that ownership idea, right? You know, what kind of, what had to change in your mindset when you decided to go from being an employee of somebody else's company to being an entrepreneur and running your own? Tina Larsson: So my old boss, he was a great mentor. And I was very lucky to have him as my mentor. So when I finished college, or actually, I started working there as an unpaid intern during college. And in the beginning, he treated me like anybody else, and I had a lot of initiatives. I said, we've got to do this better, or we've got to do this. And he was like, OK, go ahead. Whatever you want to do. then one day, every year I said to him, ⁓ company, ⁓ year he gave me the company's ⁓ And I got them in an envelope, check, like this. And year I said to him, can you tell me why? ⁓ I care what's in it. I want to know why. ⁓ And can I do better? and they had no idea how to run a company or how to that time and it was they might now. So I to force him every year. I'd twist his arm to get him to give me ⁓ a and it was two sentences. And then think it was year three or year four he said, you know what, there is one thing you could do better. He said, if you want to grow within this firm instead of treating yourself as an employee, that you are an owner. and it changed everything for me. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah, just the mindset shift there. just it really wow, that's good. Tina Larsson: Yeah. I started reading a lot of personal development books and I started reading leadership books and taking seminars and stuff. ⁓ he said that, he made me think. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's good. Looking a little bit more at your resiliency. When the path wasn't quite clear, what kept you going? Tina Larsson: What kept me going when the path wasn't quite clear is that just really felt that these people need to be helped. Kelly Sundsvold: you Yeah, was really focused. ⁓ Tina Larsson: I mean, was my calling. It was my calling. I have to help everyone. No, have to help every board. Not everyone, every board. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Every board. Yes. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: Yeah, and it was just, just, I'm not so sure that I felt initially that it was my calling. I think that that kind of grew on me as I realized how invaluable the resources that we provide are. I actually, not that, in the last few weeks, I went into Claude and I said, how do we know that someone else is not gonna do this or whatever I said. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Tina Larsson: And he wrote this long thing about how great we were and we were absolutely invaluable. I'm like, I like this guy. Kelly Sundsvold: Right? ⁓ my gosh. Shawn Sundsvold: He's hired. Tina Larsson: Yeah, he had like bullet points as all the different value that we provide that is... That nobody can ⁓ can provide that. ⁓ okay. Shawn Sundsvold: Yeah. I'm curious, you you've you've got you and Mark have had the company for a while now. What's been one of the proudest moments that you've had, you know, since you've started your company? Tina Larsson: ⁓ there's so many, one of the proudest moments. We helped boards... so let me give you ⁓ one example. So ⁓ ⁓ many who have called us with the same concern. but this one is very specific. what they said to us, we're so worried that we're gonna get into legal trouble. We need to do these repairs. We have leaks. need to do these repairs. But the owners were worried that they're gonna sue us or we're that they're not gonna allow us to get this done ⁓ and it to be done. Shawn Sundsvold: and Tina Larsson: So we organized and we set up a strategy of how we ⁓ going to handle all of these different repairs. But we didn't really have a clear... ⁓ is not the final version. This is the first draft, right? After first draft, we said ⁓ we to have... And we had some pictures. had... This is what we initially thought and this is how bad it really is. And then held the Zoom call, an owners meeting. ⁓ ⁓ it in a way that every single owner afterwards said, ⁓ do we send the money? Kelly Sundsvold: Mm. Tina Larsson: Yeah, because it needed to be funded, of course. mean, repairs, it's expensive, it needs to be funded. ⁓ so that's a very proud moment. And they were, ⁓ board was very, they were so relieved. They were like, ⁓ you. Kelly Sundsvold: Yes. Yeah. So for anyone listening who's kind of in that messy middle or starting or trying to scale something, what would be your advice? Shawn Sundsvold: awesome story. Tina Larsson: middle. messy middles are always difficult. ⁓ Take ⁓ Consistency action. And take on matters. if you write down, this ⁓ is your list. know that when I started, had a list. I had listed where this is the longest the screen can be. ⁓ Kelly Sundsvold: Yes. Yeah. Tina Larsson: During COVID, I actually took a focus class. and I read a really good book. can't remember the name of it. ⁓ ⁓ said, ⁓ write three goals. ⁓ list gonna have three items on it. ⁓ You potentially also have three personal items, but three items. ⁓ These the big ideas ⁓ you're accomplish today so that focused on it. Because if you have 20, you're not gonna focus on it. And so that's one. Be focused. Take action. Take the long list. Scratch out all the things that don't actually, it's never gonna make you any money. it's not gonna make you any money or it's not gonna make any difference in your life, and five years from now you're gonna look back at it say, why was that in my list? ⁓ it. And then on what really matters and take the action and be consistent. I post on LinkedIn. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah. Tina Larsson: every single lay and have done so since 2020 and we get 80 % of our business from LinkedIn. Kelly Sundsvold: That's amazing. LinkedIn is a powerful tool for anybody in business who is trying to, especially that B2B space. Tina Larsson: Yeah, and didn't get LinkedIn. It me a while to... I thought that it was a resume, but that's not what it is. Kelly Sundsvold: Yeah, yes, yeah. Tina Larsson: Yeah, but you understand that as marketers, so. Kelly Sundsvold: Mm-hmm. Shawn Sundsvold: Definitely, definitely. Well, this has been a fantastic conversation. Tina, how can people find you and learn more about the Folsom Group or your book, Living the High Life? Tina Larsson: I'm going to give you one resource because that's where you can find everything about me. And that is our webpage and our website is www.thefalsengroop.com. I have to say that because I don't want anybody to go to Falsem Group. It's Falsen Group it has resources. has, you can actually download our free chapter, the first chapter for my book there. And has my LinkedIn. handled so you can log into all my socials and it has tons of free resources that you can download. free. Shawn Sundsvold: fantastic. Well, Tina, thanks so much for the time and the insight and just sharing your experience. This has been a really, really fun conversation. again, thanks for being here and taking the time today. Tina Larsson: Thank you, both. Kelly Sundsvold: Thank you.