Latest / Silver FM 100.6 / A decision coach's approach to making hard decisions

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A decision coach's approach to making hard decisions · Silver FM 100.6

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Speaker 1: The last time Antonio May's heard from his son, it
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Speaker 1: was in a note the sixteen year old left in
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Speaker 1: the family's garage.
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Speaker 2: He told me he was don't make me proud.
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Speaker 1: Antonio Junior left home to join a protest in Seattle.
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Speaker 1: A week later, he was shot and killed.
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Speaker 2: There.
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Speaker 3: I mean some arethmaid justice from my son.
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Speaker 1: from NPR.
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Speaker 4: You're listening to Life Kit from NPR. Hey, it's Maryelle.
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Speaker 5: Normally my intros for episodes come together pretty quickly, but
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Speaker 5: for some reason I got in my head about this one.
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Speaker 5: I was trying to drum up an anecdote for you
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Speaker 5: a time. I was struggling with a big decision.
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Speaker 4: I was like, do I.
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Speaker 5: Talk about health stuff? Nah, too personal for this one.
0:49
Speaker 5: What about a breakup? Yeah, let's not drudge all that up.
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Speaker 5: What about my friend's breakup? I had someone in mind,
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Speaker 5: but they definitely listened to this podcast and they would know,
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Speaker 5: and Practices at NPR.
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Speaker 4: Asked him to brainstorm with me, and.
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Speaker 5: He pointed out the obvious irony here, I can't make
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Speaker 5: a decision about this episode, which is about decision making. See,
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Speaker 5: sometimes you get stuck in your head trap between all
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Speaker 5: the options, and you just need an outside perspective.
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Speaker 4: That's the job of people like.
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Speaker 5: Tony Editors and people like Nell McShane Wolfheart. If you've
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Speaker 5: ever agonized over a decision, maybe for days on end,
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Speaker 5: you've gone back and forth a million times, looked at
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Speaker 5: every possible angle, until you finally threw up your arms
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Speaker 5: and yelled into the ether.
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Speaker 4: Somebody just decide for me. Nell is that person.
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Speaker 5: She's a professional decision coach and has been for more
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Speaker 5: than a decade.
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Speaker 2: Well, I invented the job.
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Speaker 6: Actually, I've just always been the person that friends and
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Speaker 6: family came to for very straightforward advice. And if someone,
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Speaker 6: even a perfect stranger, starts telling me about their problems,
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Speaker 6: my brain just goes right to work figuring out what
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Speaker 6: it is that they should do. And eventually my best
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Speaker 6: friend said, very kindly, stop telling me what to do.
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Speaker 2: Maybe other people want to hear this, and it turns
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Speaker 2: out that she was right.
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Speaker 5: Nell specializes in helping people make big, potentially future shifting,
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Speaker 5: fork in the road decisions.
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Speaker 6: I'd say there's about four main categories. A lot of
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Speaker 6: career stuff like should I take this job, offer a
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Speaker 6: lot of location things, romantic relationships, should I break up
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Speaker 6: with this person very very big topic of discussion around here,
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Speaker 6: and should I have a kid?
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Speaker 5: Nell is very clear about what she is not, as in,
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Speaker 5: she is not a therapist or a behavioral scientist.
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Speaker 2: So I only do one thing.
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Speaker 6: I offer a single session in which I help somebody
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Speaker 6: make a big or a small decision.
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Speaker 5: She says, an hour is usually all it takes to
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Speaker 5: find an answer, no matter how big or complicated the
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Speaker 5: decision may seem.
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Speaker 6: I have found in general, most people know, but they
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Speaker 6: don't know that they know.
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Speaker 2: You know.
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Speaker 6: Sometimes it just takes talking to a complete stranger or
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Speaker 6: a third party or a coach to help pull them out.
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Speaker 2: Of it and get them on their way.
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Speaker 5: On this episode of Life kit Less Debating More Decision Making,
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Speaker 5: reporter Andy Tagle is going to talk with Nell about
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Speaker 5: how to understand your personal relationship with risk taking, how
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Speaker 5: to make speedier decisions, and how to deal with any
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Speaker 5: post decision regret.
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Speaker 9: You know, for me, personally, I find them often plagued
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Speaker 9: by indecision, even when the stakes are virtually nonexistent. You
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Speaker 9: know omlater, pancakes, which podcast do I start on my run?
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Speaker 9: A collar shirt or a plane tea? You know what's
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Speaker 9: going on there exactly. Nel can you speak to the
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Speaker 9: role of regret in our lives, whether it's real or imagined.
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Speaker 6: Oh, regrets so powerful. I mean, the decision making business
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Speaker 6: is really just the regret minimization business. You know, everyone
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Speaker 6: is trying so hard to avoid that really really uncomfortable feeling.
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Speaker 6: And because my big thing is about getting people to
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Speaker 6: make decisions faster, especially omelet versus pancakes or whatever something
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Speaker 6: like that, you know, we just have to accept that, yes,
5:15
Speaker 6: occasionally we will regret our choice, and it's inevitable, but
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Speaker 6: you are going to regret it so much more if
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Speaker 6: you spend half an hour deciding on that particular breakfast,
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Speaker 6: or if you spend a year trying to figure out
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Speaker 6: if you should go to grad school, or three years
5:31
Speaker 6: deciding if you should get engaged. I have just found
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Speaker 6: that people regret the time they have lost deciding so
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Speaker 6: much more than the occasional decision that they made too hastily,
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Speaker 6: you know, So in general I would say that we
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Speaker 6: can eliminate a lot of regret by just moving faster.
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Speaker 9: The pain of lost time hurts more than the pain
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Speaker 9: of regret.
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Speaker 6: Usually, yes, many many more people regret taking too long
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Speaker 6: to make a decision than making a decision too quickly.
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Speaker 9: What if you feel the opposite. You know, if you're
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Speaker 9: going to a decision coach, then you're probably dealing with
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Speaker 9: intense indecision. But if you feel like you jump too
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Speaker 9: quickly to make a decision, how can you slow down?
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Speaker 9: I often don't want to deal with the discomfort of
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Speaker 9: not knowing, so making a decision in the short term
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Speaker 9: feels good, but then I'll regret not thinking through it more.
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Speaker 6: I would say that, in general, I would not encourage
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Speaker 6: people to decide more slowly. And I've found in general
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Speaker 6: that the amount of time you spend making a decision
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Speaker 6: does not really correlate with the quality of the decision itself.
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Speaker 6: You know, like after a certain amount of time, more thinking,
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Speaker 6: more googling around for articles, more soliciting opinions from friends
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Speaker 6: and family, is not adding anything to the decision. Actually,
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Speaker 6: it's just making the decision harder, and it's making your
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Speaker 6: life worse. And I often recommend that people who struggle
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Speaker 6: with indecisiveness, you should take the amount of time that
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Speaker 6: you think you need to make a decision and cut
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Speaker 6: it in half.
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Speaker 9: What now is describing here is the difference between two
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Speaker 9: different polls of decision makers, maximizers and satisficers. These are
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Speaker 9: the terms often used in psychology circles. If you're a maximizer,
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Speaker 9: you might be more likely to suffer indecision because you're
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Speaker 9: the type that seeks the best possible outcome chase perfection.
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Speaker 9: That's not a bad thing, but it often means spending
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Speaker 9: a lot of time spinning your wheels, deliberating and considering
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Speaker 9: every option. Research has shown that maximizers can and do
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Speaker 9: make good choices. One study found they tend to land
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Speaker 9: jobs with higher starting salaries, for example, but maximizers are
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Speaker 9: also found to be less satisfied in those roles. Higher
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Speaker 9: rates of maximization have also been correlated to higher rates
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Speaker 9: of regret and social comparison. Satisficers, on the other hand,
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Speaker 9: find contentment with the good enough option, hence the contraction
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Speaker 9: of the words satisfy and suffice. They make decisions that
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Speaker 9: meet their basic requirements, but without always considering all the
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Speaker 9: information available, which means they might sometimes be hasty and
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Speaker 9: miss out on better opportunities, but are also more likely
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Speaker 9: to be happy with whatever choice they make. Nell's take
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Speaker 9: and take away one is to aim for the best
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Speaker 9: of both worlds, make smart decisions promptly based only on
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Speaker 9: the relevant data available to you, not what ifs or
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Speaker 9: a bunch of outside opinions. Then, to minimize regret, separate
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Speaker 9: that choice from the outcome that follows.
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Speaker 6: We are just taking our best possible guests at the
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Speaker 6: time with the information that we have.
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Speaker 2: Sometimes that thing is not going to work out.
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Speaker 6: It turns out your new boss is a micromanager, or
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Speaker 6: it turns out that your new apartment has rats. I mean,
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Speaker 6: take your choice, and those things are things that it
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Speaker 6: was impossible to know when you are making the decision.
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Speaker 6: So I think people who feel less regret are people
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Speaker 6: who are able to say, Okay, I made the best
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Speaker 6: decision I could with the information I had at the time,
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Speaker 6: and this outcome I couldn't know it in advance.
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Speaker 9: Let's talk about, then, how to make good decisions quickly.
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Speaker 9: Let's talk about what that process might look like with
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Speaker 9: your clients. Can you spell that out? I know the
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Speaker 9: first step is understanding your values right absolutely.
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Speaker 2: These are two exercises I give every client.
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Speaker 6: Anybody can do these at home and just use them
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Speaker 6: as like a shorthand for making your decisions. First is
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Speaker 6: to make list of your values, not you know, moral
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Speaker 6: values or you know, corporate values, whatever they are, but
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Speaker 6: just like the things that make your life good on
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Speaker 6: a daily basis. So mine includes never setting an alarm clock,
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Speaker 6: being able to wear sweatpants all the time, being in
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Speaker 6: warm weather, like these kinds of things. So make the
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Speaker 6: list of your values, try to put them in order
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Speaker 6: of importance if possible, and then when you're making a decision,
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Speaker 6: you can literally go down the list and see which
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Speaker 6: one of your options checks more boxes on that list
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Speaker 6: of values. That's often an easy way to figure out like, oh,
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Speaker 6: this decision is right for me, it's more in line
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Speaker 6: with who I am. The second exercise is to imagine
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Speaker 6: yourself in the future. Now, I will say that everybody
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Speaker 6: hates doing this exercise, like they really struggle with it.
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Speaker 6: I also struggle with it it. You know, humans are
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Speaker 6: very bad at picturing what they want in their future.
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Speaker 6: But I would say, sketch out one year ideal life,
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Speaker 6: five years ideal life, ten years ideal life, and then
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Speaker 6: you can just take the options that you're deciding between
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Speaker 6: and see like, okay, option A. Can I draw a
10:06
Speaker 6: straight line from this option to the life that I want?
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Speaker 6: Or is it more of like a wavy line, like, oh, well,
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Speaker 6: I could take this job and do that for a while,
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Speaker 6: and maybe that would get me into this company, and
10:17
Speaker 6: then I could try and start this project. Then I
10:20
Speaker 6: would eventually get to this part and I could start
10:21
Speaker 6: my own business. That's a very wavy line. But there's
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Speaker 6: often an option on that list where you can draw
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Speaker 6: a straight line. If I had to make this choice,
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Speaker 6: I can get much closer to the future that I want.
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Speaker 2: Just do that one.
10:33
Speaker 9: Could you give us an example of what that might
10:35
Speaker 9: look like?
10:36
Speaker 2: Sure? Yeah.
10:37
Speaker 6: I had a client maybe a year ago, who when
10:41
Speaker 6: I asked her to sketch out her future in five years,
10:43
Speaker 6: she wanted to have her own successful business.
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Speaker 2: She wanted to be a business owner.
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Speaker 6: Now, at the time she was employed, she was an employee,
10:50
Speaker 6: and the decision she was calling me about was that
10:53
Speaker 6: she'd had a job offer that was, you know, in
10:56
Speaker 6: her field, and better paid and more prestigious.
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Speaker 2: Should you take that job off her?
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Speaker 6: Well, on paper, that seems like an easy decision, of course,
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Speaker 6: like just take the job offered, But when we talked
11:06
Speaker 6: about in five years, she wanted to have a successful,
11:08
Speaker 6: thriving business of her own, a business that was so successful,
11:11
Speaker 6: she could take time off to spend time with their
11:13
Speaker 6: kids when she wanted, or to take long vacations.
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Speaker 2: She didn't actually have time to leave.
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Speaker 6: Her first job, go to the second job, get settled in,
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Speaker 6: do well, save some money, and then start building up
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Speaker 6: her own business. Five years is not that long, you know.
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Speaker 6: We have less time than we'd think. So the second
11:32
Speaker 6: option was to not take the job offer and either
11:36
Speaker 6: quit her job and start her freelance business immediately, or
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Speaker 6: to stay in this job, which wasn't very demanding, and
11:42
Speaker 6: to start her business on the side and then get
11:44
Speaker 6: to that five year point. But either way, the idea
11:48
Speaker 6: was to be able to draw a straight line from
11:49
Speaker 6: the choice she was.
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Speaker 2: Making to the thing that she actually wanted.
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Speaker 9: Take away too. When faced with a big decision, start
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Speaker 9: by listing out the things in your life that you've
12:00
Speaker 9: tell you most in order of importance. If you can't,
12:03
Speaker 9: then think about future you. Where do you want to
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Speaker 9: be one year, five years, ten years from now? Nell says,
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Speaker 9: the most direct route to that ideal future you is
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Speaker 9: likely the best choice, so really try to game that out.
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Speaker 9: Like for that one client of hers.
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Speaker 6: We decided that she should stay in her current job,
12:22
Speaker 6: which was like really undemanding, the sort of job where
12:25
Speaker 6: she could take like a long leisurely nap after lunch
12:29
Speaker 6: to save money and to start working very hard at
12:31
Speaker 6: building her own business in her free time. That to
12:33
Speaker 6: take that time that she would normally spend like having
12:36
Speaker 6: a post lunch nap or walking the dog or knocking
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Speaker 6: off early, and while she was still making that salary,
12:43
Speaker 6: to go all in on building her own business.
12:45
Speaker 2: So that in five years she can actually have the
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Speaker 2: thing that.
12:47
Speaker 9: She wanted more life kid in a moment.
12:55
Speaker 10: You know.
12:55
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Speaker 9: Another thing that I really like is the idea that
13:23
Speaker 9: you can you can test things out. You don't just
13:25
Speaker 9: have to sit in the in the what if right,
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Speaker 9: You don't just have to sit in the what might
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Speaker 9: it be like? Can you can you speak a little
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Speaker 9: to that?
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Speaker 6: Yes, huge, huge fan of testing things out, and I
13:35
Speaker 6: feel like people can test out a lot more things
13:38
Speaker 6: than they think. You know, the way we make good
13:40
Speaker 6: decisions is just not by sitting at home and wondering
13:43
Speaker 6: if we're going to like something, right, It is by
13:46
Speaker 6: trying the thing out, and then we have actual, like
13:48
Speaker 6: tangible data that tells us whether or not we write
13:51
Speaker 6: you know, we like something. So somebody wants to start
13:54
Speaker 6: a business, great. You can spend six months thinking about
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Speaker 6: the business you'll start and wondering if you're going to
14:00
Speaker 6: like it and hoping people are going to pay you
14:02
Speaker 6: for it. Or you can spend those six months testing
14:04
Speaker 6: the waters, starting it in a small way, and by
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Speaker 6: the end of the six months, you will actually know
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Speaker 6: if people will pay you for this thing that you
14:11
Speaker 6: want to sell, or if you like doing it, or
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Speaker 6: if you like being an entrepreneur.
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Speaker 2: So the same amount of time will have gone.
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Speaker 6: By, but you have so much more information you can
14:21
Speaker 6: make like a real decision out of knowledge, just not
14:23
Speaker 6: out of guesswork.
14:25
Speaker 9: Take Away three. If you're stuck between a rock and
14:27
Speaker 9: a hard place, get creative with your problem solving. Don't
14:30
Speaker 9: just wonder, try the thing, gather some data, to help
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Speaker 9: make your decision off of give yourself a deadline so
14:37
Speaker 9: you don't endlessly feel around in the dark, and in
14:39
Speaker 9: that time maybe try to look for new approaches. Nell
14:43
Speaker 9: says she's a big fan of third, fourth, and fifth options.
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Speaker 9: It doesn't always have to come down to a simple
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Speaker 9: this or that, yes or no.
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Speaker 6: If somebody is wondering, like, Okay, should I stay at
14:53
Speaker 6: my job or should I quit to stay home with
14:56
Speaker 6: my kids? Okay, have you asked if you can go
14:59
Speaker 6: part time? Have you thought about maybe, you know, just
15:02
Speaker 6: doing some consulting gigs like independently and being able to
15:05
Speaker 6: still bring in some money and still have a flexible schedule.
15:08
Speaker 6: That's the most like simple example, But I think there's
15:10
Speaker 6: a lot of other ways in which you can sort
15:12
Speaker 6: of dip a toe in or find a middle ground
15:15
Speaker 6: that really might see you better.
15:17
Speaker 9: Can you talk about assessing risk, you know, people's internal
15:20
Speaker 9: risk thermostat How does that come into play?
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Speaker 6: So I coached a woman who was in her early
15:26
Speaker 6: twenties and she was thinking about dropping out of college,
15:30
Speaker 6: and on the surface, it seems like a really risky move.
15:34
Speaker 6: You know, she was almost finished, she was going to
15:37
Speaker 6: get this degree. Her mom really wanted her to stay
15:40
Speaker 6: in college. In fact, she was afraid to tell her
15:41
Speaker 6: mom that she was thinking about dropping out. And I
15:44
Speaker 6: could have spent the whole session telling her, well, you know,
15:47
Speaker 6: you're almost there, keep going, stay in college, et cetera,
15:49
Speaker 6: et cetera. But when I after I talked to her
15:52
Speaker 6: for a while and I probed a little bit, and
15:54
Speaker 6: I asked a bunch of questions, it was clear that
15:57
Speaker 6: she wasn't going to stay in college, that she had
15:59
Speaker 6: already somewhere inside made up her mind about this decision.
16:04
Speaker 6: And I found that in general, even when it comes
16:06
Speaker 6: to things that feel risky, people are going to do
16:09
Speaker 6: what they want to do, and my only job is
16:12
Speaker 6: to like pull out of them the thing that they
16:14
Speaker 6: want and then to essentially write them a permission slip
16:17
Speaker 6: and tell them it's okay to do that thing. Because
16:19
Speaker 6: most of the time, the thing that you want to
16:21
Speaker 6: do and the thing that you ought to do are
16:23
Speaker 6: the same thing.
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Speaker 9: The thing that you want to do and the thing
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Speaker 9: you ought to do are the same thing.
16:28
Speaker 2: Why is that the thing that.
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Speaker 6: You ought to do is often the thing that is
16:32
Speaker 6: more exciting, that is more adventurous, that really serves your
16:36
Speaker 6: true self, and people want to do those things. It's
16:41
Speaker 6: inside them that they want to do it. But it
16:42
Speaker 6: can be layered over with, you know, other people's opinions
16:46
Speaker 6: and societal expectations and things like that. But I would
16:50
Speaker 6: say that in general, if you can figure out what
16:52
Speaker 6: it is that you want to do, ninety nine percent
16:54
Speaker 6: of the time, you're good to go. Just go ahead
16:56
Speaker 6: and do that thing, and it's going to work out better.
16:58
Speaker 6: Then if you force yourself to do something thing because
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Speaker 6: other people tell you it's a good idea, or they
17:03
Speaker 6: think it's too risky to do the thing you actually want,
17:06
Speaker 6: or society kind of frowns on it, you know you're
17:08
Speaker 6: not going to be happy doing that. It's not going
17:09
Speaker 6: to serve you or anybody else. So if you can
17:12
Speaker 6: figure out the thing that you want, I would say
17:14
Speaker 6: ninety five percent of the time, go do that thing.
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Speaker 2: It's the best decision.
17:19
Speaker 9: Take Away four. The definition of risk in any decision
17:22
Speaker 9: is often relative, like should you bet all your chips
17:26
Speaker 9: on that brilliant business idea? A married parent with two
17:29
Speaker 9: school aged kids will surely have very different considerations than
17:32
Speaker 9: that of a retired widower living on a pension or
17:35
Speaker 9: a twenty something student intern subletting an apartment, Nell says,
17:39
Speaker 9: regardless of your personal logistics, it's important to be honest
17:43
Speaker 9: with yourself about the stakes of your decision.
17:45
Speaker 6: You know, when I ask them to imagine the worst
17:47
Speaker 6: case scenario if they take this new job, it's really
17:50
Speaker 6: not you know, they're going to be living in their car,
17:53
Speaker 6: they're going to end up in prison. The most likely
17:55
Speaker 6: worst case scenario is that they're going to end up
17:57
Speaker 6: in a job that they just don't like very much.
18:00
Speaker 6: And they're probably already in that scenario. You know, if
18:05
Speaker 6: they're interviewing for other jobs and they're taking offers, they're
18:07
Speaker 6: probably already in a job that they are not that
18:10
Speaker 6: fond of.
18:10
Speaker 2: So what's the actual risk?
18:12
Speaker 9: And similarly, beware of the sunk cost fallacy ELS is
18:16
Speaker 9: to remember that new or unfamiliar doesn't always equate to
18:20
Speaker 9: higher risk.
18:21
Speaker 6: People think all the time about sunk costs right the
18:23
Speaker 6: time they've already put into something, the money they've invested,
18:27
Speaker 6: you know, the years of building the relationship or whatever,
18:30
Speaker 6: and they spend almost no time thinking about the opportunity
18:33
Speaker 6: costs that they're missing out on by staying in a
18:36
Speaker 6: situation that's not really what they want. You know, you're
18:40
Speaker 6: missing out on like other wonderful opportunities, maybe job opportunities,
18:44
Speaker 6: maybe relationship opportunities, you know, and you're missing out on
18:49
Speaker 6: that time that you could spend really living your life
18:53
Speaker 6: and enjoying yourself doing the thing that you actually want.
18:56
Speaker 6: But people are very attached to their sunk costs, that's true.
18:59
Speaker 6: It can be hard to convince them to leave those behind.
19:02
Speaker 9: Let's talk a little bit about other people. Making decisions
19:05
Speaker 9: on your own versus in listening the advice of others
19:08
Speaker 9: is something I'm very, very guilty of, you know, leaning
19:12
Speaker 9: on other people. When is that a good idea?
19:14
Speaker 6: Honestly, I think that everyone should talk to like three
19:18
Speaker 6: to five people when they're making a big decision, and
19:20
Speaker 6: that's it. By the time someone comes to me, sometimes
19:23
Speaker 6: they've talked to like ten different people or twenty different people.
19:26
Speaker 6: Their best friends are sick of hearing them talk about it,
19:29
Speaker 6: you know, they're sick of talking. They're sick of talking
19:31
Speaker 6: about the decision themselves, and it's just really muddying the waters.
19:35
Speaker 2: You know, they're not taking in any new information. It's
19:37
Speaker 2: just other people's opinion.
19:38
Speaker 6: It's not really effective, it's not helping you make the decision,
19:41
Speaker 6: and it bores people to listen to after a certain point.
19:45
Speaker 9: Three to five max, you're just spinning your wheels.
19:48
Speaker 2: After that hundred percent.
19:49
Speaker 9: Yeah, are their best and worst people to talk to you?
19:53
Speaker 2: Well, you really have to know your audience.
19:55
Speaker 6: So, you know, I talk to a lot of people
19:57
Speaker 6: who are making decisions that they're maybe more trude or
20:00
Speaker 6: conservative parents would disagree with.
20:03
Speaker 2: Okay.
20:03
Speaker 6: So if you know that you are talking to somebody
20:05
Speaker 6: whose values are different from yours, or they don't really
20:08
Speaker 6: respect the way you live your life, or they always
20:12
Speaker 6: have negative to things to say about your choices, do
20:15
Speaker 6: not talk to those people while you are deciding. In
20:18
Speaker 6: that case, make the decision and then tell them that's
20:21
Speaker 6: what you've decided to do. Don't say like, I'm thinking about,
20:24
Speaker 6: you know, moving to Canada. Just you know, decide to
20:28
Speaker 6: move to Canada, buy the plane ticket, and then inform
20:30
Speaker 6: them you'll be moving to Canada. So you really have
20:33
Speaker 6: to think about your past history with everyone that you've
20:35
Speaker 6: talked to and think like, Okay, does this person support
20:38
Speaker 6: me and give good advice? And do I usually agree
20:41
Speaker 6: with how the choices they've made to live their life,
20:44
Speaker 6: or is this person negative about all my choices, Just
20:48
Speaker 6: like pay a little attention to your past history with
20:50
Speaker 6: these people before you decide to talk to them about
20:53
Speaker 6: a decision.
20:54
Speaker 9: Finally, take away five, you don't need the opinion or
20:59
Speaker 9: approval of everyone in your contact list to make a
21:02
Speaker 9: big decision. If you need to talk it out, seek
21:04
Speaker 9: the advice of a few of your most trusted objective
21:07
Speaker 9: advice givers, or maybe even seek out a third party
21:10
Speaker 9: like a coach, counselor, or therapist. And if you've done
21:14
Speaker 9: all of these things and you still feel unsure, or
21:17
Speaker 9: maybe if you made a choice but now you feel
21:19
Speaker 9: some regret, Nol's got one last bit of advice for you.
21:22
Speaker 6: I was coaching somebody who was thinking about having a kid,
21:25
Speaker 6: right she didn't have any kids.
21:27
Speaker 2: It was a big decision she was making.
21:29
Speaker 6: And she said to me, well, I know that I'll
21:31
Speaker 6: regret it either way. And I thought this was like,
21:35
Speaker 6: really great, this is almost a revelation. You know, when
21:38
Speaker 6: it comes to making a big decision, you are going
21:41
Speaker 6: to regret it either way. You know there's going to
21:43
Speaker 6: be a small amount of regret. And no matter what
21:45
Speaker 6: it is that you decide to do. But if you
21:47
Speaker 6: can accept the idea that they'll be regret either way.
21:51
Speaker 6: And except that this is kind of a liberating idea.
21:54
Speaker 6: You know, it sounds bad, it sounds depressing, Like again,
21:58
Speaker 6: we're trying to avoid regret at all. But if we
22:01
Speaker 6: know that there's going to be some regret either way,
22:04
Speaker 6: I think it frees us up to make like bigger
22:06
Speaker 6: and more adventurous decisions. Now, if you're going to feel
22:08
Speaker 6: bad whether you do the exciting thing or the careful thing,
22:13
Speaker 6: you might as all do the exciting thing and see
22:15
Speaker 6: what happens now.
22:16
Speaker 9: McShane Wolfheart, thanks.
22:17
Speaker 2: So much, Thanks so much for having me.
22:21
Speaker 9: Okay, let's recap. Take Away one, don't spend longer than
22:24
Speaker 9: you need to thinking about big decisions. Aim to make
22:27
Speaker 9: smart decisions promptly by using only the relevant data available
22:30
Speaker 9: to you, not what ifs or a bunch of outside opinions.
22:33
Speaker 9: Once you've made your choice, separate it from the outcome
22:36
Speaker 9: that follows. The decision is within your control. The outcome
22:39
Speaker 9: not always. Take Away two. When faced with a big decision,
22:43
Speaker 9: start by assessing your values and your future plans. What's
22:47
Speaker 9: most important to you right now and in the future.
22:50
Speaker 9: The choice that helps you draw the straightest line from
22:52
Speaker 9: who you are now to who you want to be
22:54
Speaker 9: is likely the right decision. Take Away three, Get creative
22:57
Speaker 9: with your problem solving. Don't just wonder, try the thing.
23:01
Speaker 9: Gather some data to help make your decision. Off of
23:04
Speaker 9: take away four, the definition of risk in any decision
23:07
Speaker 9: is often relative, regardless of your personal logistics. It's important
23:10
Speaker 9: to be honest with yourself about the stakes of your decision.
23:14
Speaker 9: And finally, take away five, you don't need the opinion
23:17
Speaker 9: or approval of everyone in your contact list to make
23:20
Speaker 9: a big decision. And remember, if you're stuck between two
23:22
Speaker 9: hard choices, that's probably because there's both good and bad
23:27
Speaker 9: on both sides.
23:29
Speaker 4: That was Lifekit reporter Andy Tagel.
23:33
Speaker 5: One last thing, would you consider rating and reviewing us?
23:36
Speaker 4: It helps us grow the show.
23:38
Speaker 5: Here's a review that I liked from listener F Walter
23:41
Speaker 5: eight nineteen. Having learned many of these lessons the hard way,
23:45
Speaker 5: I recommend Life Kit instead, and for all the lessons
23:48
Speaker 5: they cover that I never learned. Thanks better late than never,
23:53
Speaker 5: too true, F Walter. Leave us a review in your
23:56
Speaker 5: podcast app right now. This episode of Life Kit produced
24:00
Speaker 5: by Claire Marie Schneider Malka garib is our digital editor,
24:04
Speaker 5: and our visuals editor is c.
24:05
Speaker 4: J Rikalon.
24:06
Speaker 5: Meggan Kin is our senior supervising editor, and Lauren Gonzalez
24:09
Speaker 5: is our executive producer. Our production team also includes Andy
24:13
Speaker 5: Tagle and Margaret Serino. Engineering support comes from Jimmy Keeley
24:17
Speaker 5: and Sina Lefredo.
24:18
Speaker 4: I'm Mariel Sagata. Thanks for listening.
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