Latest / The Parenting Podcast / Growing Up Confident: Fostering Independence in Young Children | Ep. 92

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Growing Up Confident: Fostering Independence in Young Children | Ep. 92 · The Parenting Podcast

• 0:06
  Hello parents and welcome back to the Parenting Podcast.
• 0:10
  I'm Cheryl Lang, your host, and I'm truly excited to have you join us today.
• 0:16
  Picture this.
• 0:18
  You're at a crossroads standing right where your nurturing heart meets the wisdom of letting go.
• 0:27
  Ah, it's a bit like tightrope walking, isn't it?
• 0:32
  On one hand, you're eager to develop your child's growth.
• 0:36
  And on the other, you're instinctively protected.
• 0:40
  Now imagine this journey full of questions, doubts, and the fear of the unknown.
• 0:45
  And here's the twist.
• 0:47
  I'm not just talking about our children.
• 0:49
  I'm talking about us as parents.
• 0:52
  But because we love our kids.
• 0:55
  We're committed to doing something remarkable.
• 0:58
  We want to empower them.
• 1:01
  We want to give them the space they need to learn, grow, and become confident, autonomous individuals.
• 1:10
  So today, we're venturing further into the art of nurturing independence in our young children.
• 1:17
  We'll explore powerful tools like calculated risk, intentional choices, and embracing the unknown.
• 1:25
  Together, we'll navigate this incredible journey of raising kids who are not only self reliant, But also full of earned confidence.
• 1:34
  Stick around.
• 1:35
  It's going to be an interesting conversation.
• 1:46
  Cheryl: So, on the heels of several episodes of, releasing our children into adulthood and off to college and, and helicopter parenting and all of that, I've had, some questions from parents of younger children that want us to address them okay?
• 2:05
  Ellen: Do you mean like eight and under by young or do you mean preschool?
• 2:09
  Ellen: I would
• 2:09
  Cheryl: say more five and under.
• 2:10
  Cheryl: Okay, five and under.
• 2:11
  Cheryl: Okay.
• 2:11
  Cheryl: We're looking at that because before we've been talking about, you know, driving the cars and so forth.
• 2:17
  Cheryl: So, here's a question from a parent and what we want to address today.
• 2:23
  Cheryl: We want to avoid helicopter parenting, but it's hard not to worry.
• 2:27
  Cheryl: How do we encourage our child's curiosity and development while resisting the urge to constantly intervene.
• 2:36
  Cheryl: It's tough to know when to step back.
• 2:38
  Cheryl: Any tips for striking the right balance between support and giving them space to learn and grow?
• 2:46
  Christie: Yeah, the million dollar question.
• 2:49
  Ellen: Because I think at that age, safety is the main thing that comes to my mind.
• 2:54
  Cheryl: Okay, think about this.
• 2:55
  Cheryl: This is someone with little children, all right, and I'm just feeling compassion.
• 3:00
  Cheryl: It's hard not to worry
• 3:02
  Ellen: Most parents are nervous.
• 3:03
  Ellen: That their little kid's going to get hurt doing something so they don't let them do it.
• 3:08
  Ellen: And I'm not talking about jumping off a building.
• 3:11
  Ellen: I'm talking, sometimes it's, you know, the little play slides they have.
• 3:15
  Ellen: They fall off the top and, you know, it hurts.
• 3:18
  Cheryl: You're exactly right.
• 3:19
  Cheryl: Okay, and fear is a big part of this.
• 3:22
  Cheryl: And just the unknown.
• 3:24
  Cheryl: Because when we're talking to someone who has 20 year olds, that's 20 years of parenting.
• 3:30
  Cheryl: And a lot of these parents this is with first time through.
• 3:34
  Cheryl: But it is, it just, it's different because And a lot of times they don't know.
• 3:39
  Ellen: Well, yeah, a lot of times you're a new mom and you, you know, your first child in particular, you've never been through that before,
• 3:45
  Christie: so you don't know.
• 3:45
  Christie: Yeah, on the job training.
• 3:46
  Ellen: Yes.
• 3:47
  Cheryl: But I think in general, We have a fear driven society.
• 3:52
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 3:52
  Cheryl: Fear sells, and it's just increasing more and more.
• 3:57
  Cheryl: You know, we just celebrated the 22nd anniversary of 9 11.
• 4:03
  Cheryl: Right.
• 4:04
  Cheryl: And personally, I saw that as a big shift in our society.
• 4:08
  Cheryl: Oh, sure.
• 4:09
  Cheryl: You know, that fear just became every day.
• 4:12
  Cheryl: It can really happen to us, it can happen to me.
• 4:15
  Cheryl: And it sells news, it sells security systems, and everything else.
• 4:19
  Cheryl: And for people
• 4:20
  Ellen: that were born into the fear already being there, that's just their life.
• 4:25
  Ellen: We look back and remember, oh, I wasn't afraid of this before 9 11, I didn't even think about it.
• 4:30
  Ellen: But the kids that have, you know, our children and their children, are definitely
• 4:34
  Christie: different people.
• 4:35
  Christie: And the internet, social media, all of that gives us access.
• 4:38
  Christie: It's just so many horror stories.
• 4:41
  Christie: We see everything, every bad thing that could happen, you know, we know about.
• 4:46
  Christie: I
• 4:46
  Ellen: didn't know that bug bit and you could die from it.
• 4:49
  Ellen: You know what I mean?
• 4:50
  Ellen: Right.
• 4:50
  Christie: Until I got on the internet.
• 4:51
  Christie: Yes,
• 4:51
  Cheryl: exactly.
• 4:53
  Cheryl: And the 10, 000 things to be afraid of about everything.
• 4:56
  Cheryl: lawsuits and all of that.
• 4:58
  Cheryl: So y'all are empathizing with this parent and the struggle at this age.
• 5:03
  Cheryl: So the way I thought we might approach it, rather than give the 10 things to do to develop this independence and growth and confidence instead of a fear in young children, what about if we look at maybe Oh, the mindset and the culture of what the parent should be developing, and then we can come back next time with suggestions for a number of practical ways that we could put that into effect.
• 5:30
  Cheryl: Yeah, that sounds good.
• 5:31
  Ellen: Well, you know, just kind of jumping into it.
• 5:33
  Ellen: One of the things that I know I struggled with was I didn't understand child development enough.
• 5:38
  Ellen: And I've said that before in the past, um, because I just had one sister, we weren't around a lot of kids.
• 5:44
  Ellen: I didn't want to babysit, so I was never around little kids.
• 5:46
  Ellen: So when I was around my own, I was like, Oh, why are they doing that?
• 5:50
  Ellen: Is that normal?
• 5:50
  Ellen: Fortunately, my husband was very kid centered and his mother was a.
• 5:54
  Ellen: preschool teacher.
• 5:55
  Ellen: So, you know, she would always help me go, No, that's normal.
• 5:59
  Ellen: But I think that's important to kind of know what developmentally, because I sometimes was expecting my kids to be maybe farther along or be able to do this.
• 6:07
  Ellen: And then my husband goes, No, no, there's that's right for their age.
• 6:10
  Ellen: Oh, okay.
• 6:11
  Ellen: That's really good,
• 6:12
  Christie: Ellen.
• 6:12
  Christie: I think I worried so much about their, um, physical development and safety that what I could see outside that I wasn't as aware of the mental and emotional maturity and growth that they needed to be focusing
• 6:26
  Cheryl: on.
• 6:27
  Cheryl: I completely agree with that, Christy, because when I hear from young moms, fear is, in this Because there's an app for how to teach your baby how begin eating solids.
• 6:39
  Cheryl: I mean, an app for it, okay?
• 6:41
  Cheryl: Not just websites and everything.
• 6:43
  Cheryl: And you can have an app for measuring how much of what food they eat every day.
• 6:48
  Cheryl: About everything, there's an app, there's a website, there's so much information, but most of it's not what you just mentioned, Christy, the emotional and internal development of our children.
• 7:01
  Ellen: Right.
• 7:01
  Ellen: Some of this is, and I say this gently, minutiae.
• 7:04
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 7:05
  Ellen: You know, I mean, if, if they don't need this or that.
• 7:09
  Ellen: But we've made it into a 10 instead of a 1.
• 7:12
  Christie: Right.
• 7:13
  Christie: Well, and not to beat the same drum, but the external things are the things that we get props for.
• 7:19
  Christie: You know, Oh, congratulations! You kept your child alive or you didn't get.
• 7:23
  Christie: They didn't cut their hair with the scissors or, you know, those are the things people can see and we can brag about, but the, um, mental development, the emotional development, those are things that we kind of put by on the side because they aren't as obvious.
• 7:36
  Christie: And they become a big
• 7:37
  Ellen: pressure for young moms.
• 7:39
  Ellen: Yes.
• 7:39
  Ellen: Because if you're in a group that.
• 7:41
  Ellen: Of maybe what I would say were maybe a little overprotective parents, but you're not by nature, then you feel criticized because you, I mean, I, that's kind of where I was.
• 7:53
  Ellen: I would let my kids do a lot of things that my peer group wouldn't let them do.
• 7:57
  Ellen: And they would say to me, oh, I can't believe you let your kids do that.
• 8:00
  Ellen: Right.
• 8:00
  Ellen: You know, and everybody.
• 8:02
  Ellen: You know, it was fine.
• 8:02
  Ellen: They, nobody got hurt.
• 8:04
  Ellen: We didn't have any broken
• 8:05
  Christie: anythings.
• 8:06
  Christie: That's good.
• 8:06
  Christie: I should have been friends with you.
• 8:08
  Christie: I was the one that was like looking at the other one like, can we let them do that?
• 8:12
  Christie: Is that okay?
• 8:13
  Cheryl: Let's see.
• 8:14
  Cheryl: That's the difference.
• 8:15
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 8:15
  Cheryl: You're so much younger.
• 8:16
  Cheryl: That's true.
• 8:17
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 8:17
  Cheryl: Much fear.
• 8:18
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 8:18
  Cheryl: And you're parenting.
• 8:20
  Cheryl: Right.
• 8:20
  Cheryl: Um,
• 8:20
  Ellen: I had a friend list off when I was younger, all the things she was afraid of.
• 8:24
  Ellen: And I walked away going.
• 8:26
  Ellen: Oh, I must be a bad mom.
• 8:27
  Ellen: I never even thought of those things.
• 8:30
  Cheryl: Well, if we're going to lay some groundwork on this mindset that we're trying to have for the parents, there's one word that I really would like us to explore a little bit, because it's just not talked about much in parenting, teaching circles, and it's the word autonomy.
• 8:47
  Cheryl: Because when you look at psychology and they talk about what a healthy, well rounded, Balanced person is yes is they call it a differentiated person, but here's the definition of it It's that you can maintain healthy individuality and autonomy within the context of intimacy
• 9:11
  Christie: Relationships, okay, that's really good.
• 9:14
  Christie: Yeah, because I think of independence and autonomy feels Like separate, you know, there's a lot of separation there Separation anxiety even for moms and then you balance that with what was it intimacy?
• 9:29
  Christie: intimacy and attachment and attachment and you know, we can go unhealthy directions that way too, but this balance between the independence and autonomy with Intimacy and attachment.
• 9:42
  Christie: That's that's really good.
• 9:44
  Christie: I
• 9:44
  Cheryl: think so too, because there's the whole attachment parenting and Ellen, there are 35 apps to evaluate your attachment parenting.
• 9:54
  Cheryl: And I will say just from my study and being around experts in the counseling and child development field, I think Attachment is top tier.
• 10:04
  Christie: Right.
• 10:05
  Christie: Okay.
• 10:05
  Christie: Yeah, study after study.
• 10:07
  Christie: I mean, it's a defining feature of your
• 10:08
  Cheryl: life.
• 10:09
  Cheryl: But again, we're talking here balance and just what you said.
• 10:13
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 10:13
  Cheryl: And so we don't want to say, Oh, you go run live your life by yourself.
• 10:19
  Cheryl: or unhealthy attachment.
• 10:20
  Cheryl: So that's what we're trying to balance.
• 10:23
  Christie: Yeah.
• 10:23
  Christie: And that balance is the nuanced sliver in the middle.
• 10:27
  Christie: It's hard to, I know it was for me and I'd read this book and I would say, let them cry it out.
• 10:32
  Christie: And then I'd read this book and it would say, don't ever leave your child.
• 10:35
  Christie: And it's this, you know, unicorn you're chasing in the
• 10:38
  Ellen: middle and in the ends.
• 10:40
  Ellen: Some of it isn't that important, it's the compilation of your early years that matter.
• 10:47
  Christie: Right, right.
• 10:48
  Christie: And it's more the.
• 10:49
  Christie: Big picture of where you're headed in the end.
• 10:51
  Christie: But it's
• 10:51
  Ellen: hard when you're first learning to parent because there's so much.
• 10:54
  Ellen: Right.
• 10:55
  Ellen: And then the internet adds more guilt to you.
• 10:57
  Ellen: You know, you should be doing this or that.
• 10:59
  Ellen: And studies have shown that makes it even worse.
• 11:02
  Ellen: Uh huh.
• 11:02
  Christie: Right.
• 11:03
  Christie: Now it's the internet told me.
• 11:04
  Christie: But now science is even proving you're a horrible mother.
• 11:07
  Cheryl: And here's six apps to prove it.
• 11:09
  Cheryl: Right.
• 11:10
  Cheryl: You know, but if we're seeking this healthy, balanced autonomy, um, then one of the things I think is a good parenting philosophy, because it's the philosophy behind what we're doing, is to allow your children, as much as possible, to have control over their choices.
• 11:30
  Cheryl: You know, and encourage them to make choices.
• 11:33
  Cheryl: How did y'all do on that?
• 11:34
  Cheryl: Were you very good at choices and options?
• 11:38
  Christie: Well, I think I accidentally did it.
• 11:41
  Christie: I think I was so overwhelmed as a young mom that a lot of times, and maybe more so with my older, kids.
• 11:48
  Christie: I think I left them to do a lot.
• 11:52
  Christie: You know, left them to choices that I couldn't be there for all the time to watch every little move.
• 11:57
  Christie: And so, I see the fruit in those areas that it was accidental a lot of times.
• 12:02
  Christie: And then I learned from that, that, okay, this is good.
• 12:06
  Christie: They need to have some of this autonomy.
• 12:08
  Christie: I think
• 12:09
  Ellen: I was pretty good, maybe like, The physical autonomy, you know, learn to tell you get do your own stuff, you know, and, and, um, not hovering over them, fixing every little thing for them, teaching them how to do that.
• 12:21
  Ellen: Because with five children that made life go a little smoother.
• 12:25
  Ellen: And it was just It's really practical, you know, I couldn't hover over every child and sometimes they came out with shorts on in the middle of winter, you know, and so no, You got to go back or you get to freeze, you know, so I think some of those are things you kind of have to weigh what's important
• 12:43
  Cheryl: to you, but a philosophy of encouraging giving choices.
• 12:46
  Cheryl: I didn't know to intentionally give choices.
• 12:49
  Cheryl: I can remember the moment I heard a mom say well, do you want to put on your shoes here or in the car?
• 12:58
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 12:59
  Cheryl: And that's brilliant.
• 13:01
  Cheryl: Where was this all my life?
• 13:04
  Cheryl: To, you know, give choices to them, particularly when you study the stronger a child's, Will is in their determination.
• 13:11
  Cheryl: They need that.
• 13:12
  Cheryl: They need to do that.
• 13:13
  Cheryl: I need space to make their own choices.
• 13:17
  Cheryl: And if that's healthy for them, it's healthy for everybody.
• 13:20
  Cheryl: So that you intentionally have a mindset, we're gonna let them make choices.
• 13:25
  Cheryl: But not By default, but giving them parameters, right, and talk about how you make healthy, choices.
• 13:32
  Cheryl: because it might
• 13:33
  Ellen: be as simple as, you know, you can wear the blue shorts or the red shorts, there's their choice, because I know with my kids when they were that little, that would have been overwhelming.
• 13:42
  Ellen: If in the summertime, they looked at every pair of shorts they had, and had to pick that some of them would have been there for hours.
• 13:48
  Ellen: So this way, they got to choose, right, but it was within a simple parameter.
• 13:52
  Ellen: And I think sometimes We, we forget when children are really young, they need simple choices to
• 13:57
  Cheryl: make.
• 13:58
  Cheryl: Yes, but that we're have a mindset of letting them.
• 14:02
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 14:03
  Cheryl: Okay.
• 14:03
  Cheryl: Another thing that parents complain to me about is my two year old ask questions all the time.
• 14:11
  Cheryl: Why, why, why?
• 14:12
  Cheryl: Question, question, question.
• 14:15
  Cheryl: Actually, this is, again, developmentally, healthy.
• 14:19
  Cheryl: And, the experts say that we should embrace curiosity.
• 14:25
  Cheryl: How about y'all?
• 14:25
  Cheryl: How did y'all do on that?
• 14:26
  Ellen: I know it was hard, especially when it's a big family and some one or two kids are following you.
• 14:31
  Ellen: Why?
• 14:31
  Ellen: Why?
• 14:32
  Ellen: Why?
• 14:33
  Ellen: And sometimes I just ignored the why?
• 14:35
  Ellen: Because I was busy.
• 14:36
  Ellen: I think that's real life.
• 14:38
  Ellen: Real life.
• 14:39
  Ellen: And sometimes I gave them a brief answer or sometimes I just made up an answer because it was an inconsequential thing that, you know, didn't
• 14:47
  Christie: really matter.
• 14:47
  Christie: And so now they're adults still thinking that that is true.
• 14:50
  Christie: So you're like
• 14:51
  Cheryl: Calvin and Hobbes dad.
• 14:54
  Cheryl: Talked about when black and white pictures going.
• 14:56
  Cheryl: No, the world didn't have color back.
• 14:58
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 14:58
  Christie: Yes.
• 14:59
  Christie: Well, my answer to why was often What do you think yeah,
• 15:03
  Cheryl: yeah, that's a great answer but I never realized until I Listened and read the experts that this is brilliant development.
• 15:12
  Cheryl: They're trying to make sense of their world.
• 15:14
  Cheryl: Yeah.
• 15:15
  Cheryl: And so that we want them to do that and we can't do it all the time.
• 15:19
  Cheryl: when I was too busy Sometimes I say, that's a really good question.
• 15:23
  Cheryl: Let's talk about later And I love your response, but that we don't see question asking as an intrusion.
• 15:29
  Cheryl: Right.
• 15:29
  Cheryl: But as a really positive thing,
• 15:31
  Ellen: And at two, though, you have to be careful, because sometimes it's just a habit.
• 15:36
  Ellen: Why?
• 15:37
  Ellen: Why?
• 15:37
  Ellen: Right.
• 15:38
  Ellen: Why?
• 15:38
  Christie: They don't really care.
• 15:39
  Christie: Well, they don't have a lot of verbal skills yet, so they're just trying to figure out how to contribute to the conversation.
• 15:43
  Christie: Yeah.
• 15:44
  Christie: Yeah.
• 15:45
  Ellen: And if you go in like my husband sometimes would go into the long answer...
• 15:49
  Ellen: Right.
• 15:49
  Ellen: The
• 15:49
  Christie: kid would leave.
• 15:50
  Christie: Yeah.
• 15:51
  Christie: So the goal is to be boring enough, they quit asking for just one sentence, right?
• 15:56
  Christie: Well, when mine were a little bit older, maybe, you know, five, six years old or so, one of my kids favorite things to do was to take apart broken appliances like old things.
• 16:07
  Christie: They love to look into things like.
• 16:09
  Christie: You know, broken.
• 16:10
  Christie: I mean, unplugged, obviously.
• 16:12
  Christie: Unplugged toaster or we had an old laminating machine and we take it apart and look at you know, the way it works.
• 16:17
  Christie: Look, these are the gears that make the paper go through and they just are looking for, like you said, to make sense of the world.
• 16:24
  Cheryl: Well, and I just naturally am bent that way.
• 16:27
  Cheryl: I'm always asking questions.
• 16:28
  Cheryl: I'm always interested.
• 16:30
  Cheryl: And I didn't know it.
• 16:31
  Cheryl: And my grown children have come back to me and bequeathed me with a word that's very respected and trendy and wanted in their culture.
• 16:41
  Cheryl: And it's growth mindset.
• 16:43
  Cheryl: And so they have said, Wow, mom, we're so impressed with your growth mind.
• 16:49
  Cheryl: So I'm going, Oh, great.
• 16:50
  Cheryl: And then I go look up.
• 16:52
  Cheryl: But it is a term that's really embraced by this younger generation.
• 16:56
  Cheryl: And actually, that's what you're developing in those little children, when they ask about things, or they're trying to do new things, and that we want to develop a growth mindset, right?
• 17:06
  Cheryl: And in our home, learning and growing and asking and trying.
• 17:10
  Cheryl: are embraced and desired within parameters, you know.
• 17:14
  Cheryl: One
• 17:15
  Ellen: of the things that I was always surprised by, and still am, I always let my kids make messes.
• 17:22
  Ellen: And I didn't get bugged by, I mean, sometimes they, you know, we always had a cleanup time, but people would say to me, Oh, you let your kids paint.
• 17:30
  Ellen: And we're talking young kids.
• 17:31
  Ellen: You let them have paints and stuff like that.
• 17:33
  Ellen: I go, yeah.
• 17:34
  Ellen: And they go, Oh, I don't do it.
• 17:35
  Ellen: It's just way too messy.
• 17:36
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 17:37
  Ellen: And I always thought, Oh, that's so sad because that is.
• 17:39
  Ellen: That's such an important part of children exploring their world, squishing Play Doh, getting in paints, trying how colors work together.
• 17:47
  Ellen: And you know, yeah, sometimes it's a mess, but you can control it to a
• 17:52
  Cheryl: limited degree.
• 17:53
  Cheryl: If you have limited time or energy, right.
• 17:56
  Cheryl: On this time, we're going to make a mess.
• 17:59
  Cheryl: Right.
• 17:59
  Cheryl: Not I'm having a party and hosting 15 people tonight.
• 18:02
  Cheryl: Right.
• 18:03
  Cheryl: We're not going to do it.
• 18:03
  Cheryl: But then you choose the time.
• 18:06
  Cheryl: But we keep that philosophy.
• 18:07
  Cheryl: And eventually you
• 18:08
  Ellen: can train your children.
• 18:09
  Ellen: I would just put the art supplies on the table.
• 18:11
  Ellen: They knew how they worked.
• 18:12
  Ellen: And they cleaned up and put them away.
• 18:14
  Christie: Excellent.
• 18:15
  Christie: One thing though, all of this takes a lot of time.
• 18:17
  Christie: Yes.
• 18:18
  Christie: You have to slow down enough to be able to have time to do those things.
• 18:22
  Ellen: Well, one of the areas that I think is really important is allowing your child to take risks.
• 18:27
  Ellen: Oh, yes.
• 18:28
  Ellen: Absolutely.
• 18:28
  Ellen: And I see.
• 18:30
  Ellen: A lot of fear driven moms, I mean we all have fears as moms, let's never go away, but there's a point where it can stunt your child's development because you're not letting them take an appropriate risk for their age.
• 18:45
  Ellen: And there's such a feeling of accomplishment for your child when they get to ride their trike outside.
• 18:52
  Ellen: Yeah.
• 18:52
  Ellen: Or they get to, um, Jump in the pool by themselves, whatever.
• 18:57
  Ellen: I mean, even younger children when they get to take their toys out of the cupboard, play with them and put them away.
• 19:02
  Ellen: Now, those don't sound like risks, but those are all things that you're releasing control of because ultimately that's what you're doing.
• 19:09
  Ellen: You're saying, okay, I'm releasing control and now my child is going to step out a little bit farther and they're taking a risk and I'm taking a risk, but it's okay.
• 19:18
  Ellen: Right.
• 19:19
  Ellen: important part of
• 19:20
  Cheryl: growth.
• 19:20
  Cheryl: And I think a good word I'd apply to it is calculated.
• 19:23
  Cheryl: Yeah, that's a good one.
• 19:24
  Cheryl: You know, I'm intentionally letting my child go up and get their own drink.
• 19:30
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 19:30
  Cheryl: Soda fountain by themselves across the restaurant.
• 19:33
  Cheryl: And, and all
• 19:34
  Ellen: pay for dinner, buy something at the store, all of them
• 19:38
  Cheryl: calculated, even on the playground in your home, Well,
• 19:42
  Christie: this was not my strength.
• 19:44
  Christie: I was not good at this.
• 19:46
  Christie: And my husband was better at it.
• 19:47
  Christie: So I remember him asking me one time, Christy, what's the worst that's going to happen?
• 19:51
  Christie: Yeah.
• 19:52
  Christie: And I just kind of froze and he was like, no, really, what is the worst that's going to happen?
• 19:56
  Christie: And I played out the scenario that was in my mind, you know, what would happen?
• 20:01
  Christie: Remember the situation, but I, I think when you do that and you take it to the nth degree, you know, okay, some things might actually not be safe and the risks should not be taken.
• 20:11
  Christie: But if it's just that it's going to make a mess or make you late, you know, those things you should sacrifice.
• 20:17
  Christie: They might
• 20:17
  Ellen: fall or trip.
• 20:18
  Ellen: Right.
• 20:20
  Ellen: I'm not talking serious injury, but that's part of being a kid, right?
• 20:23
  Ellen: You climb something, you fall off it.
• 20:25
  Ellen: They don't learn.
• 20:25
  Ellen: I don't climb that again.
• 20:27
  Ellen: Or that's not a good
• 20:28
  Christie: idea.
• 20:28
  Christie: But the benefit, the gain in that is so worth that potential risk because on the other side of it, when they conquer the fear that they may have to, and you know, you've got to watch your, put your game face on, on the, in those moments.
• 20:42
  Ellen: I'm a child of the sixties.
• 20:43
  Ellen: We had.
• 20:44
  Ellen: Unbridled freedom.
• 20:46
  Ellen: Your parents shushed you out, and you were expected to go play all day long, and that's what we did.
• 20:51
  Ellen: We formed little small friendship groups, or by ourselves, I mean, I wandered everywhere in my neighborhood blocks away.
• 20:58
  Ellen: I even used to go down to the department stores in L.
• 21:01
  Ellen: A., which are like six blocks from my house, and storekeepers would go, Oh, where's your mommy?
• 21:08
  Ellen: Oh, she's at home.
• 21:08
  Ellen: You know, but I knew my way around.
• 21:11
  Ellen: I wasn't doing anything bad.
• 21:12
  Ellen: I was just looking at stuff.
• 21:13
  Ellen: Right.
• 21:13
  Ellen: but in a sense, that gave me a lot of confidence.
• 21:15
  Ellen: I knew not to talk to strangers.
• 21:17
  Ellen: Uh huh.
• 21:18
  Ellen: You know, I knew not to get in a car with anyone.
• 21:20
  Ellen: I was just exploring.
• 21:22
  Ellen: At that time, we lived in the city.
• 21:24
  Ellen: I was just exploring my city.
• 21:25
  Ellen: Now, I'm not saying everybody wants to do that.
• 21:27
  Ellen: No.
• 21:27
  Ellen: Yeah,
• 21:27
  Christie: TPP is not saying go let your kids roam around L.
• 21:30
  Christie: A.
• 21:30
  Ellen: No.
• 21:30
  Ellen: But what I'm saying, that was the 60s.
• 21:32
  Ellen: Right.
• 21:33
  Ellen: And we, there was a measure of safety.
• 21:35
  Ellen: And there were lots of people around and we could do that.
• 21:38
  Ellen: But in a sense that helped me as a person to be more independent.
• 21:44
  Ellen: It gave me confidence because I could figure this out.
• 21:47
  Ellen: Right.
• 21:47
  Ellen: And Oh, don't go by that house because the dog's mean and he might get out.
• 21:51
  Ellen: Don't do this because that might be scary.
• 21:54
  Ellen: And we all walked home from school, not a mile in the snow, but we all, California.
• 22:00
  Ellen: I mean, but I would think most people from my age group would say we were fairly confident because we had to do those things and everybody else did.
• 22:08
  Ellen: So you have to weigh, is this a true safety issue?
• 22:12
  Ellen: Is there really a big danger in letting my kid walk up to the counter and pay for their candy or whatever by themselves while I sit in
• 22:20
  Cheryl: the car?
• 22:21
  Cheryl: And that's a dramatic example.
• 22:23
  Cheryl: Like you said, we're not suggesting, drop your kids off at a corner downtown.
• 22:28
  Ellen: I'm trying to put
• 22:29
  Christie: it in context.
• 22:30
  Christie: No, that's fair, that's fair.
• 22:32
  Christie: Once I finally got on the risk taking bandwagon that my husband invited me on, see true benefits in my kids lives.
• 22:39
  Christie: I mean, the confidence, like you said, I mean, as my kids have gotten older, they navigate things that I'm thinking I would have never been able to do that at that age because they, they do have a confidence built in them because they've conquered some hard things,
• 22:53
  Cheryl: but their bruises and, you know, crack knuckles and all of the different things that come with it, I would say rather than Protect that we're supervising, not hovering, but we're supervising because I love that calculated, yeah, that I'm going to choose, you know, we've talked about birthday boxes, go back and listen to those episodes if you want to.
• 23:15
  Cheryl: But the idea now I'm going to release a little more.
• 23:19
  Cheryl: And I'm going to do it because I do think it puts a confidence right deep and instead of a fear based that they're confident based, I can try new things.
• 23:29
  Cheryl: And it's safe.
• 23:30
  Cheryl: to fail Yeah.
• 23:31
  Cheryl: So that when we do get to those releasing years and they're making their adult autonomous decisions, that they have a track record of trying things increasingly with more freedom, more autonomy, and knowing where to fail and how to fail.
• 23:48
  Cheryl: Yes And it's
• 23:49
  Ellen: called play.
• 23:51
  Ellen: When you're young.
• 23:51
  Ellen: That's right.
• 23:52
  Ellen: You know, you poke it, you know, the butterfly and see what happens.
• 23:56
  Ellen: You can pick up the caterpillar and carry it around.
• 23:58
  Ellen: I used to have a lizard on a yarn string that I kept in my hair for months and months.
• 24:03
  Ellen: He just wrote on my head and I had it tied onto my belt so he didn't get away.
• 24:08
  Ellen: Wow.
• 24:10
  Ellen: Yeah, but I mean, that was that weird kid, right?
• 24:12
  Ellen: You know, but that was That was all those fun, adventurous things
• 24:15
  Christie: you did as a kid.
• 24:16
  Christie: Right.
• 24:16
  Christie: You said safe to fail, Cheryl.
• 24:19
  Christie: And I'm thinking about our responses to their failure is what communicates safety.
• 24:25
  Cheryl: Oh, that's so good
• 24:26
  Christie: Yeah.
• 24:27
  Christie: And I know I can often respond with, Oh, my gosh, you know, you almost fell or rushed to it and panic and, um, but if I can keep my face where, okay, that happened now, now we've learned how a good way not to do that or, you know, and respond in a positive way,
• 24:44
  Ellen: don't climb on the roof and jump off.
• 24:48
  Christie: I guess that's what happens when you do that.
• 24:51
  Cheryl: Well, because just what you're saying, if we want.
• 24:54
  Cheryl: To develop this autonomy within the context of relationships, then we keep the relationship and and we make it age appropriate.
• 25:04
  Cheryl: Right?
• 25:04
  Cheryl: Yes.
• 25:04
  Cheryl: If we value curiosity.
• 25:07
  Cheryl: Then we can't say, but don't take risk because curiosity involves risk, right?
• 25:12
  Cheryl: And so That's why we're trying to say develop this mindset and help them like what you're saying about when they fail I love the idea of saying wow, what do you think about that and then helping them think through Maybe next time not Build that up quite so high before you jump off of it and talk with them about it instead of over parenting and over teaching saying, No, you never do this or this and this is why you failed and that we talk through it with them, helping them to go, Oh, okay, which says there's no shame.
• 25:51
  Cheryl: I'm not condemning you you're not bad for failing.
• 25:54
  Cheryl: It's
• 25:54
  Ellen: called natural consequences.
• 25:56
  Ellen: And we can almost be quiet with those.
• 25:58
  Ellen: You know, the kid's riding his bike down a hill, which you've told him not to do, and then he hits sand and slides.
• 26:04
  Ellen: Right.
• 26:05
  Christie: We don't need to remind them that we told them not to do it.
• 26:08
  Christie: Oh, bummer.
• 26:09
  Christie: But you're not going
• 26:09
  Cheryl: to let a three year old do that.
• 26:10
  Cheryl: No, no.
• 26:11
  Cheryl: They're first time out.
• 26:13
  Cheryl: I love the calculated plan for it.
• 26:16
  Cheryl: a plan of freeing.
• 26:18
  Cheryl: We're out of time again.
• 26:20
  Cheryl: What else would you say?
• 26:21
  Cheryl: Something in closing to these parents as they're trying to embrace this tight rope this balance of beginning the releasing process to help develop these healthy Autonomous, confident but relational children.
• 26:39
  Cheryl: That's what we're talking about here.
• 26:40
  Cheryl: What would y'all say?
• 26:42
  Ellen: That you, as a parent, have to take a risk to allow your children
• 26:47
  Christie: to take risks.
• 26:48
  Christie: Oh, that's really
• 26:49
  Ellen: good.
• 26:49
  Ellen: You know, because sometimes for the parent, it's a bigger risk than it is with the child.
• 26:52
  Ellen: The little kid wants to do, right?
• 26:53
  Christie: Sure is.
• 26:54
  Christie: Well, there's lots of risks that parents have to take.
• 26:56
  Christie: Yeah.
• 26:56
  Christie: The fear, you know, like we talked about, physical safety.
• 26:59
  Christie: Yeah.
• 26:59
  Christie: And then I'm thinking too, the fear of our reputation being right.
• 27:03
  Christie: Wow.
• 27:03
  Christie: You know what?
• 27:04
  Christie: People are gonna think of me.
• 27:05
  Christie: Oh, the answer's.
• 27:05
  Ellen: Kids are doing that thing again.
• 27:08
  Ellen: Why
• 27:08
  Christie: their mom lets'em do that.
• 27:09
  Christie: Yeah.
• 27:09
  Christie: She never makes her kid wear a coat.
• 27:11
  Christie: Yeah,
• 27:12
  Cheryl: that's a really good point, Ellen.
• 27:14
  Cheryl: So maybe that's how we can leave if you struggle in this area.
• 27:19
  Cheryl: Parents, maybe evaluate your willingness to take risk.
• 27:24
  Cheryl: Why or why not?
• 27:25
  Cheryl: So you can kind of evaluate it because our children aren't separate from us, they're, we're all integrated with each other and our struggles can become their struggles.
• 27:36
  Cheryl: So, this is really good.
• 27:38
  Cheryl: Okay, so this was sort of the philosophy mindset.
• 27:41
  Cheryl: How about if we come back next time and put feet to it and give a lot of examples of how we can actually do it?
• 27:47
  Cheryl: That's great.
• 27:48
  Cheryl: Okay.
• 27:48
  Cheryl: Sounds good.
• 27:49
  Cheryl: So, parents, remember, hang in there, keep loving, keep persevering, because it's worth it.
• 28:02
  As we wrap up today, I want to acknowledge that this journey of balancing, nurturing and letting go can be quite challenging, build with Nans and risk.
• 28:16
  But here's the thing.
• 28:18
  It's a journey worth taking.
• 28:21
  Before we part ways today, here's a key takeaway.
• 28:25
  Take some time to ponder your own parenting philosophy in this specific area.
• 28:31
  Then, Take intentional steps to put it into practice.
• 28:35
  Consider which area might be a bit more challenging for you.
• 28:40
  Embracing risk taking or letting them make choices outside of your plan.
• 28:46
  Connect with us on social media, visit our website, or simply shoot us a text.
• 28:51
  At contact at the parenting podcast dot com.
• 28:56
  In our next episode, we're going to dive into a treasure trove of practical suggestions.
• 29:02
  We'll explore how you can actively nurture your child's independence, giving them the space and tools they need to help them become well developed, confident.
• 29:11
  and autonomous individuals.
• 29:14
  I'm excited about what's coming up next time on the Parenting Podcast.
• 29:18
  Until then, remember, parents, you're not alone on this incredible parenting journey.
• 29:25
  TPP is here for today and for your future.