Latest / Patriots Catch-22 / Patriots Catch-22 8/5: Observations and Analysis from Padded Practices, First Impressions of Jacas, Latest Roster Battles

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Patriots Catch-22 8/5: Observations and Analysis from Padded Practices, First Impressions of Jacas, Latest Roster Battles · Patriots Catch-22

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Right off the shoot.
• 0:01
  Speaker 2: But Digs it does sound like Jordan Schultz, I believe,
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: was the first with it to report that Diggs is
• 0:07
  Speaker 2: going to go to the Commander's a good fit for Diggs.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: That's you pointed out.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: He's from the Baltimore, DC area, he went to the
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: University of Maryland. He's a terp, and they needed a
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: number two receiver next to Terry McLaurin. I feel like
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: they've been searching for the guy next to McLaurin for
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: a handful of years now. So nice fit there for
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: Diggs and for the commanders. So it sounds like that
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: is going to happen for Washington. But let's get back
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: to the Patriots. And like I said before, we had
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: the technical difficulties, we're gonna talk a big picture. Today
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: was a walk through, So we're gonna do more top
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: storylines like we did last week, similar format, and then
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: we'll get into three up, three down, and then we'll
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: take all of your calls and your emails about Patriots
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: training camp. But just off the top of the show,
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Alex and I've been texting with.
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: You about this. Yeah, I did some digging.
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: Yesterday, Okay, because I nerded it out as I do.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: And I went back and I looked because I felt
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: like the Patriots and I know, I just mentioned that
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: they had to walk through today, right, but we are
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: coming off of a run of five straight padded practices
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: and five out of six days. There was one day
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: off on Sunday in between there but five consecutive padded
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: practices for Mike Rabel and the Patriots, and anecdotally, it
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: just felt like that was a lot compared to last year.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: So I actually went back and compared the first sort
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: of week or so of training camp last year to
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: the first week or so of training camp this year,
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: and I did find out that they are getting after
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: it and having a little bit more of an intense
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: training camp this year than last year. So I'll read
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: it off for you. So this is this year, twenty
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: twenty six, and let's just put it out there. The
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: first five days are CBA mandated. They all have to
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: be the same, right, right, So it's an acclamation period.
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: So then yes, so.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: The five first five days of training camp are determined
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: by the CBA what exactly they're going to look like,
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: so that that decide I'm talking about once you get
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: into the.
• 2:17
  Speaker 3: Beyond a Belichick used to call it the extension of
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: the spring, which you get beyond the extension.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: Right beyond the acclamation period. So last year, twenty twenty five,
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: Mike Rabel's first training camp with the Patriots, here were
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: their practices five through ten pads, pads, shells, walk through, pads,
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: walk through. So that's three padded practices, two walkthroughs to
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: break it up. One day in shells. The Patriots just
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: went pads, pads, pads, pads, pads, walk through, so they
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: have two extra padded practices in there. They only had
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: one walk through and that span versus two and a
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: day that they were in shells last year was turned
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: into a padded practice. I hope to get to ask
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: him about this on Friday because I have a few
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: theories as to why they've ramped up the intensity in
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: this second training camp with Mike Rabele compared to the first.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: I think the biggest one though, is that they started
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: the year one and two last year with some sloppy
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: losses early on in the season. In retrospect, they should
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: definitely have not lost that game in the opener to
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: the Raiders. Now, it was Rabel's first game as the coach,
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: new coaching staff, new team, all that kind of stuff.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: Those are always wonky.
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: But given the season that the Raiders had, and they
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: were given the season that the Patriots had, the Raiders
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: picked had the number one overall pick in the draft,
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: and the Patriots went to the Super Bowl. That was
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: ended up being a pretty bad loss last year in
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: Week one, and then of course they had the turnover
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: fest against the Steelers a couple of weeks later where
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: they lost again and started the season one and two
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: with that win in Miami sandwiched in between those two losses.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: That's one theory is that he's ramping.
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: Them up to be better prepared for September in the
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: start of the season. The other part of it, and
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: I think that you hear this from a lot of
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: the players that were here last year and are still
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: here this year. Is there any element of it that's
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: that Super Bowl hangover thing? And this is maybe less
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: true over a recent NFL pass, and it was historically
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: over the course.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: Of the league.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: But there's a reason why that theory or that myth
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: of if you lose in the Super Bowl you tend
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: to struggle the next year. That's a real thing that
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: was at one point in time in the NFL was
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: really backed up by the numbers and backed up by
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: actual data that supported it. So, whether it was the
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: one and two start or the fact that they just
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: lost a Super Bowl and they don't want to have
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: a Super Bowl hangover, Mike Frable is running a pretty
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: intense camp. Tomorrow, they'll be in shell Friday, they'll be
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: back in pads next week. They have a joint practice
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: with the Colts, and then they have the two joint
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: practices with the Eagles after that. This is for NFL
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: standards in twenty twenty six. Yeah, this is about as
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: intense as a training camp as you can possibly script. Like,
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: this is by the rules that they now have collectively bargained.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: This is pedal to the medal.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: This is about as close to a real training camp
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: as I can recall.
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: I do wonder if some of it too along the
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: lines of the Super Bowl hangover thing, like we saw,
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: especially offensively, they fell off a little bit in the playoffs,
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: and is it less about the beginning of the season
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: more at the end of like, hey, we've got to
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: be conditioned better because we have to take this thing deeper. Right, Yeah,
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: So there could be. I know Belichick us talk about that, like,
• 5:43
  Speaker 3: you didn't run the hills to get off to a
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: strong start in September. You ran the hills, so you
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: weren't as gassed in January when the other teams weren't. Sure,
• 5:51
  Speaker 3: So I wonder if there's elements of that too.
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: Sure.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: So two years ago, girod Mao did run a hard camp.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: They were in pads a lot, they ran the hill
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: a lot, they were tackling to the ground a lot,
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: and that those practices as well. They came out and
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: they upset the Bengals in Week one and that ended
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: up being the highlight of their season.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: That was. It peaked in week one. So not what
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: you're looking for. So I guess I'm saying that just.
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: To say it's not indicative necessarily of what's to come,
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: Like you're not going to be seventeen to zero because
• 6:21
  Speaker 2: you had a hard training camp. But I thought last
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: year was a pretty light camp all things considered, and
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: this year I think it's been a I mean, five
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: straight days in pads is legit, and they were getting
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: after it.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: They were competing.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: There was a lot of hitting on the line of
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: scrimmage in those five practices and pads.
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: So it's an interesting departure for Mike Rabel.
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: That was just kind of a big picture thing that
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: was on my mind because I remember last year, especially
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: on places like euro Station Alex that was a narrative
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: around the team in training camp was that they were
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: having kind of a soft training camp.
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: I think it's look, you obviously there's a conditioning element.
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: You don't want to players into the ground. I think
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: it's more about what you do in the practices than
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: like how hard it's drilled. I think if you have
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: a lighter as we saw last year. I think if
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: you have a lighter camp, but you practice with purpose
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: and you're focusing on the certain things, that's good. I
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: think if you have a harder camp, that can help
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: with conditioning as long as you're not overdoing it, and
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: maybe the physicality is a point of emphasis. Excuse me
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: for that summer. So I don't think it's one of
• 7:27
  Speaker 3: those things like one's good or one's bad. I think
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: it's more about how the overall camp is structured and
• 7:31
  Speaker 3: what you're doing with that time. Like the Mayo camp
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: was tough, part of the reason it was tough is
• 7:34
  Speaker 3: because they were just running eleven on eleven like the
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: whole time. Yeah, and they didn't really do anything else.
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: The part of the reason the camp looked lighter last
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: year is it felt like they had more drills that
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: were focused on technique. They probably needed that. Yeah, maybe
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: they don't feel like they need to coach up the
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: technique as much this year because they've brought a lot
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: of guys back and some of that stuff is already
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: in place.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah. No, those are all fair points.
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: I go back to just one last thing on this
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: and then we'll get into my TA takeaways here empty
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: the notebook, so to speak.
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: The uh.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: When we talked to Mike Rabel at the combine, and
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: specifically not to plug one of our things, but when
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: me and Duce talked to him at the combine at
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: our table, that one of the things that he really
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: stressed was he felt like they lost the trenches. In
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: the playoffs, they felt like especially offensively, obviously, but in
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: general in the Super Bowl they felt like they got
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: run on a little bit too much, which they did
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: obviously Kenneth Walker won MVP, and then they thought that
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: they got beat up up front offensively. That doesn't feel
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: like the way Mike Rabel would want his football team
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: to play, to be soft on the line of scrimmage,
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: and he challenged a lot of the younger guys like
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: Will Campbell and Jared Wilson to hit the weight room
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: and physically, he said, physically get stronger, Like that was
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: verbatim out of his mouth. Was get physically stronger in
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: the weight room. He challenged those guys to do that.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: They made some offseason acquisitions, I think, and with that
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: in mind, you know Reggie Gilliam at the time, Julian Hill,
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: Elijah Vera Tucker, Draymont Jones, certainly on the edge of
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: the defense, drafting gay backus, the guy that we're going
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: to talk about here in a second. So in order
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: to fit that theme and fit that sort of directive
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: to be a better team up front, well, you got
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: to practice and Pats, you got to hit. You gotta
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: work technique and work physicality on the line of scrimmage
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: and make that a part of your culture. And I
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: wonder if maybe they thought that last year they were
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: a little bit too easy on them. And they were
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: a really good fitesse team, Don't get me wrong. They
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: were a really good pass offense and in the playoffs,
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: they were a dynamite pass defense, but maybe they felt
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: like the way they lost in the playoffs in the
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: super Bowl, it just felt like Seattle controlled the line
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: of scrimmage on both sides of the ball, and that
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: I don't think is something that Mike Rabel wants to
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: be about, Orsh McDaniels wants to be about, and they
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: are trying to change that. They're trying to change that mentality.
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: So interesting thought they're in terms of the type of
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: trading camp that Mike Rabel is running. Yeah, I don't
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: want to get into a bunch of the takeaways that
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: we've seen over the last you know, five or six
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: days since we've last been on the air on this show.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: The biggest one, I would say, just our first impressions
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: of gay Backus, who is a guy that both of
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: us are really excited about when they drafted. I understand
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: that it hasn't come out of the gate very well,
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: obviously with the contract and with the injury. He looks
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: though to his credit, he looks like he's in phenomenal shape,
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: Like this does not look like a guy who was
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: sitting on his couch eating oreos all summer and spring
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: long while he was waiting to get back in the building.
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: I think Rabele even said it right, he looks like
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: an outside linebacker. Yeah, like this is you hear me
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: talk a lot about, you know when we do do
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: rookies and do the draft, like, oh, I like where
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: this guy is at, Like it'll help him to be
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: in an n weight program. But he as looks ready
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: for the fl Yes.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: Physically, Oh yeah, he looks like he's a first off
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: the bus kind of guy. In terms of the way
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: he's played. I mean, you know, I think you'd take
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: that with the grain of salt. He's probably pretty rusty
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: and hasn't played a lot of football, uh, you know
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: until going back to last year's college season. He did
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: have the one one on one rep so far of CAM.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: He did go up against the Lord's Mets, who's their
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: ipp player and probably their ninety first guy. He is huge, though,
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: he is huge, but he's not very good to be honest,
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: he did beat him. He did beat him in that rep.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: The one thing that I have noticed about Accus though,
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: is in the run game. So far, I think he's
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: already flashed a couple of times when we were inside
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: on Monday, he went right inside off the ball on
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: Marcus Bryant to blow up a run play. I thought,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: the twitch and just the lateral quickness he showed on
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: that play really popped.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: Like I was like, whoa, there he is? You know?
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: Then he also, you know, shed did a little you
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: know pull push pull technique, you know, pushed out Lomu,
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: pulled him, swam over him on another run play to
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: beat the block and get in the backfield. Maybe God
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: has sucked up the field a little bit on an
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: end around in yesterday's practice, But overall, I think the
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: physicality and the ability to play the run has stood
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: out immediately. The pass rush, I think it has been
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: a little bit rusty, right, you know. I think it's
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: timing in his hands and went to throw his hands
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: and what step to throw his hands on, and with
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: the different moves and how to read tackles and set
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: up tackles. Those are all things that I think are
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: going to come in time for any young player. The
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: run defense, though, immediately, I think has shown up. I
• 12:39
  Speaker 2: think he's shown a physical play ability to beat blocks
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: and then you know just where he's playing. Also, I
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: think you know, you track that stuff a little bit
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: better than me in terms of who he's playing with
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: and where he's going.
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's mostly been the twos, but I
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: think with him especially being behind, like that's about right,
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: I don't know that i'd be kind of surprised if
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: he was wrapping over Ponder at the point. Certainly, Draymond
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: Jones to your point about where he's at, I agree,
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: and I just this is kind of what we expected,
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: right the run defense would come first and then the
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: pass rushing would come along. So yeah, obviously you can
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: still tell he's making up time. I just think the
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: fact that he is starting to ramp up more and
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: it'll be interesting to see where he's at tomorrow. I
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: kind of gave it's just and this is not knowing
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: exactly what happened with his knee in the medical side
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: of it, just looking at the football aspect, it would
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: be huge to have him be a legit participant in
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: those joint practices and then obviously to be able to
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: play in the preseason game. Those are just valuable reps
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: for a player that's learning. Yeah, now, I don't think
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: you want his first full practice to be a joint practice.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: I would just think right, Is that a fair assumption
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: that that's a lot to throw at him at once?
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: They gave it.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: Tomorrow, like I said, they'll be in shells, right, so
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: that's still kind of patted it in today's world, right,
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: And then Friday they'll be in full.
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: Pass and then they have another one on Monday too.
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so maybe he can get a little bit more
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: repetitions those three days.
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: It's just can he keep ramping up in that regard
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: and then be able to be at least close to
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: a full go in the joint practice I think would
• 14:07
  Speaker 3: be huge if that's ultimately his timeline.
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, expressing that this is a first impression take here,
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: This is not a a you know, don't print it
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: just yet, but is there a world already where he's
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: like the Anthony Jennings to Elijah Ponder right, where like
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: Anthony Jennings was really like a first and second down
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: run player and a sturdy edgesetter and a physical player
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: and could do those sort of things, Elijah Ponder as
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: a rookie really was a third down player and a
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: passing game player. I wonder if we get to the
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: point because I think Draymond Jones is just gonna play
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: a ton Dreymont Jones is going to be in all
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: situations kind of player for them. Do we get to
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: the point maybe early on in his rookie career, because
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: I think the run defense in the physicality for Accus
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: is a that's his game, but b I think that's
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: what translates the quickest, right, is his ability to play
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: the run, play blocks, be physical on the line of scrimmage.
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: That to me maybe is like a early down, first
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: and second down type of thing, whereas Ponder I think
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: has a little bit more juice in terms of pure
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: pass rushing.
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: Off the edge.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: If you can do that sort of thing like they
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: were able to do over the years, whether it was
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: jettings and Ucha or jettings and Ponder, like, I think
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: that that's maybe where this is headed for let's say
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: like September. You know, I'm hoping that acts. You want
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: me more than that eventually, but in the beginning.
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: You want to act a step into a bigger role.
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: But if that's how he initially gets on the field,
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: I could see that that makes sense.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, next point here.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: I have a couple of other thoughts on the edge,
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: but I want to save it for when we do
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: more like roster bubble guys. I wanted to just talk
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: about what we've seen now that we've seen a handful
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: of practices and pads, just overall impressions of the starting
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: offense against the starting defense when they go good on good,
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: if you will, with those two sides of the football,
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: is it fair to categorize as starting offense is a
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: little bit of a slow starter right now in practice,
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: like they they're I think Drake May yesterday was a
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: little bit slow to start.
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean i'd say this goes back to last year.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So maybe a little bit of a slow starter
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: in terms of practices.
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: I still think that they they come on.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: And they make a lot of good plays late in
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: the middle even of practice. If there's a couple of
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: little things about the offense though, that have popped up
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: to me that I would have just minor, minor, small
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: seed concerns about. One is I do feel like down
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: the field a lot of their deep throws are contested catches.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: You know, I don't see a lot of separation down
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: the field.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: But also just isn't that kind of the team they've built?
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: So is it the team they built? That's a fair question,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: is it that the Patriots secondary is also just going
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: to be really good?
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: Could some of it?
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: So I think that those two things both exist, But
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: it's a lot of jump balls to guys like Aj
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Brown and Kishan Boodie right now, like deep down the field.
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: So I'd like to see maybe a teeny bit more
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: separation down the field than that. I would also just
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: say from a blitz beating standpoint, and I thought Drake
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: made today kind of downplayed it, which I was a
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: little bit surprised by when we talked about him today,
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: talked to him today. I kind of feel like they've
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: struggled with some of the blitzes that the defense is
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: thrown at them. Now, I'll put that caveat on that
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: as well, that a lot of offenses in the playoffs
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: last year struggled with the blitzes that the Patriots defense
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: was throwing. You know, asked the chargers of the Texans
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: and the Broncos about the Patriots blitz package and how
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: good it can be. But at the same time, I
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: still feel like in early on in yesterday's practice, I
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: thought this was the biggest issue, Yeah, was that there
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: was a lot of free runners at the quarterback, like
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: guys that were unblocked to the quarterback, and I thought
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: that was a lot forcing Drake May to get rid
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: of the ball quickly or before he wanted to at times,
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: and really worked it underneath in the short game.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: If that's just something.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: That they want to drill so that Drake May and
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: the offense have to practice against that, I don't know
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: if that's just going to be their branded defense like
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: what we saw at the end of last year, which
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: it was in the playoffs. But if I have to
• 18:13
  Speaker 2: just nitpick anything about the offense, I think it would
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: be those two things right now.
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Again, some of it goes back to they were
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: slow starters last year, so this just might be what
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: it is. Yeah, but I would agree with that.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: Defensively, I would just add to it. Gonzales and Brown
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: have just been worth the price of admission. Like, if
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: you want to come down to training camp for some
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: of these open practices, I might just come down just
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: to watch the two of those guys go head to
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: head for two hours. It's really fun to watch. I
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: haven't I can't really remember another training camp where they
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: had players that were squaring off at you know, positions
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: that face each other directly on the field, like that
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: of that caliber, that's been really cool.
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: Because the only other one would be the offensive line
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: right offensive defensive line, and they really had that caliber.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: I guess, like what tackle against Judan, you know, like
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: there were no left tackles in camp that.
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: Were I guess like bar More versus and who when when?
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: Who signed his extension would probably be the closest.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: But that's not Gonzales and AJM Now it's not so
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: that one's been really really good. And I would say,
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: just from a schematic standpoint, what we're seeing, I have,
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: you know, a thought on on their personnel stuff, but
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: just schematically, I don't know. If it's just the way
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: that they're scripting practices that could definitely be it. I
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: don't want to say that this is going to just
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: be their defense, but they are throwing a lot of
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: pressure at the quarterback in these practices, and it's pressure
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: from all over the place. It's a lot of different fronts.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: You know, five six guys up on the line of
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: scrimmage and then you soar through who's coming. The safeties
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: are in the in the in the blitz package. Corners
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: at times are in the blitz package. There's a lot
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: of different things going at the quarterback, and I do
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: think that that feels like an extension of the playoffs
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: last year and how they played down the stretch of
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: the twenty five season. So I've been really impressed with
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: just the way that they are designing pressure. And this
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: goes back to the concerns that people have about the
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: edge and are they going to have enough pressure off
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: the edge. I think we're starting to see a little
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: bit of how they're going to kind of work around that,
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: and that is they are just going to be very
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: pressure heavy and exotic up front and rely on that secondary.
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: Basically what we saw in the playoffs last year.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: Yep, exactly. All right, go into some of the position battles.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: Let's start with linebacker. Since we're on defense. Is it
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: safe to say right now that Chad Muma has emerged
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: as a clear third linebacker?
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, in this group.
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: So I think he's probably closer at this point to
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: l And I don't think he's past Alis or Spoayne,
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: but I think he's probably closer to Ellis and Splain
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: at this point than he is to the rest of
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: the group.
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's fair, so I think Splain and
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: Ellis Muma are kind of emerged. That's like the spoying
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: Ellis Gibbons top three that they had last year. Khalil Jacobs,
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: they seems like a young player that they really like.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: I don't know if Khalild Jacobs is gonna have a
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: massive role on defense in year one. Maybe he's more
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: of a special teams player or even inactive on game dame,
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: but I think he's gonna have I think he has
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: a really good chance to make the team as of
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: right now. I think it's too early to put any
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: of these guys on the team quite yet, but yeah,
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: I think he has a really good chance to make
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: the team right now, just because they like him as
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: a long term development type of guy. That brings us
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: to kJ Britt, who I think is a player that
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: we both kind of thought was going to be here
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: and maybe even pushed for the third spot. He seems
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: to have been passed by Muma definitely and maybe even
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: passed by Jacobs a little bit too, just because of
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: the youth and upside. So is kJ Britt and ending
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: up being kind of like a bubble guy now that
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: might be an odd man out here.
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: He's probably now in that at large mix. I still
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: think it's a chance he makes the team because we've
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: talked to us. They lost so many core special teamers
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: from last year, and he's somebody that can make plays
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: on special teams. So can Kalil Jacobs. You know, do
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: they keep both? Is it more valuable to say, for instance,
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: having him as a coverage player or keeping a fourth
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: running back to have that depth hit, kick return or
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: something like that. Right, it could be other positions too,
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: Maybe six wide receiver comes in here Feftin Chisholm. So
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: I think he's the fifth linebacker right now. I don't
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: think that that pushes him off the roster. He just
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: slips into that spot where he's just going to have
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: to prove he maybe has some more value than other
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: guys at other positions.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: So they had five on the roster last year. We
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: were talking about this out of practice Splain, Ellis Gibbons, Jelaanni,
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: Tavia Marte Moppu. Yeah, but Tavai was a hybrid player.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: You could play edge, you can play linebacker. This would
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: be keeping five pure off the ball linebackers like true
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: inside linebackers. So it's a little bit different than a
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: guy like Tavai who had the versatility to play different
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: spots in the defense. But if they keep five, I
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: think that Britain makes it. If they only keep four,
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: then I think that Jacobs is gonna make it over
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: britt If I had to guess right.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: Now, I would agree.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: What about the defensive line, defensive tackle? We know Williams,
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: bar More Dirden are going.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: To be here. Yeah, sneaky a cam for Joshua Farmer.
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: I think Joshua Farmer's on.
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: I think josh Farmer especially against the run. And again
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: that's what they really lost with Tonga is those run players.
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: It's weird. He's built like a guy that you would
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: think is more primary pass rusher, but it's a good
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: player against the run.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, physical player, has those long arms, you can kind
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: of use those to get onto blocks.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: I have Eric Gregory right now as the fifth guy.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Now they really like Leonard Taylor.
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's between those two.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: Jeremiah farm still pops every once in a while with
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: the with the backups, with the threes and things like that.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: It's probably between Gregory and Taylor. But the reason why
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: I a lean Gregory is just a body type. I
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: think he's a little bit of a wider block eater,
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: space eater, whatever you want to call it, whereas Leonard
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: Taylor fits more of that mold of the other guys
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: that are already going to be here. But I just
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: wanted to highlight Farmer because I think he's had a
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: sneaky good camp. Like, not someone we're going to talk
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: a ton about, but that was the team. And that
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: was a fourth round pick last year too. Like it
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: wasn't like that was a guy that they you know,
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: it was a UDFA or something like that. That was
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: a pretty It was at least a top two hundred guy,
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: might have been the top one fifty guy.
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so you know, someone that they invested in. A
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: little bit. Last thing on the defense.
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: Last week, we talked a little bit about the three
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: safety package and my concerns about whether or not that
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: was going to work with the personnel that they had
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: the last couple of days. And you know, granted, a
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: lot of it has probably been just they need to
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: have some semblance of base defense, even if they don't
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: use it a ton. We have seen a lot of
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: pure base defense with four down linemen, three linebackers, like
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: a true four to three base ye, and it's been
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: a lot of splain Ellis Muma at the second level
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: of the defense. Instead, we're getting into all the personnel
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: matching stuff, right, Like, if you play a team that
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: plays a lot of two tight ends, even like the
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: Rams with the three tight ends, twenty one personnel with
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: the full back, you know something like that, you have
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: to have some sort of grouping that you were going
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: to use to match that. And I haven't loved how
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: it's looked with three safeties on the field. They've tried
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: Mike Brown. I think that's cooled off a little bit. Yep,
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: they've tried del Pettis. I still think del Pettis is
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: really kind of a special teams player.
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: He's probably been the best of the group.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: But I agree, could they be a more pure base
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: defense team? And just some numbers for you. Last year
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: they only played base twenty five point eight percent of
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: the time. That was twenty first in the NFL, So
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: they weren't a big base defense team last year. However,
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: the league is trending bases back.
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: I would also say that number is probably a bit
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: deflated because they got out to these big leads and
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: they're you know, going against teams in all these passing
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: situations where it's gonna be tougher to get into those spots.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: This year, they're just playing better offenses.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: It's a fair point. Bases back. Yeah, it's in vogue.
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: Fall back because why because the full back's back, the
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: full backs back, tight end is back, two tight ends running,
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: the football is back. Six offensive linemen is back running.
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: The football is back running. The football is to say it,
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: thank you. So the run game is back.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: If they're gonna if the offense is gonna put big
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: people on the field, you have to match big people
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: with bigger people.
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, that's just how you have to do it well.
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: And I think that's where specifically a guy like Muman. Look,
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: obviously he has not been the player he was projected
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: to be when he was drafted. He was twenty two, right,
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: was he twenty one? Oh yeah two wyoming right, Yeah,
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: it was that there were so many I remember, there
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: are a lot of linebackers in that class. I really
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: like him coming out, and part of the reason who
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: liked him was the athleticism. Yeah, he's an athlete, a
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: guy who can can maybe cover. So I think that
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: that is you know you're he's a guy that can
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: help and Ells can do this too, obviously, but.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: He was not going to be on the field too right,
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: A guy where you.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: Can play bass, but you don't feel like you're in
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: a total eyeability in coverage. He's not Fred Werner or
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: one of those guys, but he can match up against
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: a second tight end. He can match up. You know,
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: I wouldn't him against Christ McCaffrey, but against the average fallback.
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: I think you feel okay. He had a pass breakup
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: on unders even to the other day. By the way,
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: that linebacker class kway Walker and Devin Lloyd in the
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: first round, Ye, David a Jabo I thought was more
• 27:28
  Speaker 3: of an edge. Yeah right, he's listens linebacker Troy Anderson
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: from Montana State, who we both really liked. Nick Benito's
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: obviously been good. Chad Muma, Nikobe Dean, I think, were
• 27:37
  Speaker 3: you a big Channing Tindall guy or was I a
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: big Channing Tindall guy one of them?
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: I was a big MoMA guy all that one we
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: both really liked.
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: Leoshanal was in that class too.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: I was a good player, Baile in spector. So just
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: to go back to the base defense thing. These are
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: league wide trends, so not Patriots specific. League Wide, the
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: league in twenty twenty five play nine point seven percent
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: of the snaps and base defense. That's the highest base
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: defense rate since twenty seventeen, almost a decade.
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: The run game is back, baby, So the last.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: Three years twenty twenty three twenty one point three percent,
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: twenty twenty four twenty three point seven percent, twenty twenty
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: five twenty nine point seven percent. Yeah, so it's gone
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: up every single year over the last three years. And
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: from twenty four to twenty five it was a six
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: percent increase in how much people were playing. Teams were
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: playing base defense, and they played more base defense across
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: the league than any season in.
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: Almost a decade. Ye, So this is coming back in
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: the league.
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: And I have liked what I've seen out of the
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: Patriots base defense more than I've liked what I've seen
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: out of their three safety defense. And I wonder if
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: they feel kind of the same way that you do
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: about Muma and Ellis. They're athletic enough players that we
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: don't want Muma or Ellis on, you know, a really
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: good receiving tight end, you know, like Adulton Cancate or
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: something like that. But we can live with muber or
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: Ellis on a blocking tight end, like we think that
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: they can handle that matchup. I wonder if that's where
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: we're headed instead of the three safety thing.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's kind of how you get bigger
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: Will still being able to cover, right.
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I like it.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: The other last thing on the defense, and then we'll
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: move over to the offense. Couple guys that I think
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: have started to rap a little bit more with the
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: starting defense and maybe turn some heads. Your boy, Karan
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: Punti and Braiden Swinson. I think Braden Swinson's made a
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: little bit of a push here, definitely more than we
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: ever saw from him last summer in terms of getting
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: some opportunities. You know, not with Draymond Jones Elijah Ponder
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: are the top edge rushers, but when they go to
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: the second group, it seems like it's a lot of
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: Swinson on the field at that point.
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: Lately, it's been with Akis, you know now that Akis is.
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: Back, Xavier Holmes gotten some run too, those.
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: Xavier homes a little bit before that, and you're you're
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: a big punty guy, right.
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it's just me. I think it's the coaching staff.
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: So how much.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: Are we buying until let's start with Prunty. I don't
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: think he's over Charles Woods yet. Charles Wood seems to
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: be pretty solidified as that fourth corner. He's been getting
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: most of the work without Carlton Davis and these practices.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: But Prunty, what I like about him. I like that
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: he's got high weight speed, like, he's got the measurables
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: for it. He's got the length for it.
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: I would say height, weight speed, strength. Yeah, he's also
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: very physical player.
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: And he's got I think the ability.
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: And I said this on one of our shows, and
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: I know we lose track. I don't feel like Karan
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Prunty's going to get beat over the top too much
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: because he can run with people and he's got the
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: length to challenge and high point the ball at the
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: catch point. So I don't necessarily feel like I'm too
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: worried about he's going to give up the sixty yard
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: touchdown in one play. Yeah, that's a good place to
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: start for a young corner that was a fifth round pick.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: And maybe this is a little bit of what's the word,
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: like I trust them a little bit more than I
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: maybe did this time. Last year, they picked Craig Woodson
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: a lot higher than everybody thought they should pick Craig Woodson,
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: and they were dead on about that they scouted the
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: player better than everybody else did. Is there a possibility
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: that maybe he's not as good as Craig Woodson, but
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: Kuran Prumpty was looked at as a reach, probably the
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: one reach of the draft that they had last year.
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: Maybe they scouted the player then better than everybody else did.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: They did it with Craig Woodson. You know, there's no
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: reason to believe they might not have done it with Prumpty.
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: How excited are you about Prumpty?
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: I'm starting to get kind of excited. Like I think
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: when he had that pass breaking against AJ Brown on Monday,
• 31:39
  Speaker 3: It's like, Okay, this is legit. He's not just doing
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: this against the twos and the threes. I would just
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: love him. Look, I don't maybe I'm not as high
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: on the camp that Charles Woods has had as some
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: other people. I mean, he's been fine.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: But I don't necessarily think that he's done anything great
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: in terms of like catching my eye.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: He's just out there like he's.
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So I guess i'd like to see. I do
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: you think Prunty's done enough to kind of really get
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: the reps where that becomes a true battle of fifty
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: to fifty split.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: It hasn't. It hasn't come to that yet. Maybe if
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: he had a really good preseason open.
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: So maybe that's what it comes down during the joint
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: practice or something. I'd like to see him get that
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: shot if he continues trending in this direction. I look
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: at him and the thing with Craig Woodson, like Craig
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: Woodson essentially pushed or helped push Jabrill Peppers and Kyle
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: Duggar off the roster. Those were captains. Yeah, those were
• 32:29
  Speaker 3: proven players in this league, and all of them were
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: I don't think, and I don't necessarily think Karn Prunty
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: is going to push say Carlton Davis off the roster,
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: at least not this year. You know, Carlon Davis is
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: no guaranteed money on his contract. Next year, maybe Prunty
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: is a really good year, We're going way down the road.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: I'm not even saying that's gonna happen. I don't think
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: Prunty's going to push anybody off the roster. But Can
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: he be an improvement in that You know, last time
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: they went to Super Bowl? How often do we talk
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: about how valuable Jason mccordy was. Is that third boundary corner.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: Been looking for Jason mccordy's replacement since Jason?
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: Can Karan Prunty be that guy to Gonzalez or Davis?
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: He doesn't need us to plant them. I don't think
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: he's going to. I don't think he has to for
• 33:10
  Speaker 3: that pick to be a success. Can he be an
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: upgrade over Charles Woods or I guess it was Alex
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: Austin at times last year as that third boundary corner
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: is the guy you rotate in for twenty snaps a game.
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: Maybe if it turns out he can play a little
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: in the slot as well, I don't think he can.
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: And that's why I think ultimately it is him and
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: Charles Woods on the team, because I think Woods can
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: play in the slot. Yeah, and maybe it's there is
• 33:33
  Speaker 3: no real like who's ahead for both of them. It's
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: different situations. But I can punt he be that guy.
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: Maybe maybe he's done everything he needs to to get
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: to the start of camp. I need to see him
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: in more high leveraged reps. I think he's earned the
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: right to get those reps and see what he can do.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: But for now, like he's doing everything that I think
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: you could realistically expect him to.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: I think he has a nice foundation to his game.
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, of obviously checks all the athletic profile knoxes. I
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: think he plays the ball pretty well in the air,
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: and it showed that in college, and I think it's
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: translated to the prosy. He got his hands on a
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: ton of balls in college.
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: He mentioned wide receiver background, Yeah, which kind of shows up,
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: especially on the deep ball.
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: So we'll see about him being able to cover like
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: an entire routree. But if you're going to play on
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: the outside predominantly, then you're gonna see a lot of
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: vertical routery. You're going to see a lot of goes,
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: and you're gonna see a lot of posts, and you're
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: gonna see a lot of you know that type of thing.
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: Like that's gonna be what you're going to cover for
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: the most part on the outside. You know, is he
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: a guy that's going to be able to stay on
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: a slant and you know, stay on a dig and
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: all that well.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: Slant win against Kyle Williams the other day.
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well we'll we'll find out. But I like how
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: he plays the ball down the field. I like the length,
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: I like the speed. So there's something to work there
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: with him, for sure.
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: I will throw this out there too, because I know
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: one of the knocks on him has been he is
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: an older prospect and he has all these physical tools,
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: but he spent was it five or six years in college?
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: Started in twenty started college in twenty twenty four? Yeah,
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: six years in college, right, which is obviously a lot
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: like okay, well, like if he has all these natural tools,
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: why didn't he put it together? I will add you
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: mentioned the Craig Woodson comp. Craig Woodson spent six years
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: in college. Now it was all at one school. He
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: didn't transfer, but he was twenty four when he was drafted.
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: Koran Prunpty is twenty four right now. So both older
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: prospects too, and sometimes is what you get with the
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: with the older prospects. And this is where I will say,
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: when you talk about a year two lead for Craig Woodson,
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: the older guys are usually higher floor, lower ceiling because
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: they've maxed out physically. So that's why I wonder. You know,
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: I'm not gonna say Prunty has the ceiling of a
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: guy that's going to take over and I'm not riding
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: him into the cornerback two spot or anything. But he's
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: gonna have a higher floor because he's played a lot
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: of football. And that's I think something that helped Craig
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: woods Unless year. That It's not to say Craig Woodson
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: can't take a big jump or Prunty can take a
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: big jump, can't take a big jump. It can just
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: be a little bit higher. It would be harder to
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: do when you're a little bit older. But again, the
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: floor I think helps Prunty.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: So the only reason why I bring up the Craig
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: Woodson comp is because when he was drafted in the
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: fourth round last year, Oh, it was a head scratcher
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: for a lot of people at in the moment, including myself.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: I was like, wow, that's kind of early for a
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: player like Craig Woodson. Right, and again the front office
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: and too, you know, Rabel and Ellie Wolf and Stretch
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: and Ryan Codden's credit, they were dead on.
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: They nailed it. It was a good pick.
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: So I give them a little bit more equity a
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: little bit more trust now that they might these day
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: three picks, they might be able to find guys.
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: Hey, they might Look they did it here for a
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: long time with I mean, people thought they were nuts
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: for taking Drawn Harmon in the third round. Yeah, became
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: a good player.
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: So yeah, I just think that they they they've shown
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: that they can do it.
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: I'll just say that when we compare this, when we
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: compare them to Woodson, because people have made that comp.
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: I don't want to compare them to Woodsend and say
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: that he's going to be the second best player out
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: of the field in the super Bowl and that that's.
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: He might be a find. There's different levels of that. Yeah,
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: I don't think he's gonna be a Craig Woodson level find,
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: but he might be a fine And that again, if
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: he's Jason mccordy, if he's a reliable third corner and
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: also is probably a guy that's going to compete on
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: special teams for the fifth round, that's a good get.
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: And I will say too, I think part of the
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: reason people were bugged by that pick. He wasn't a
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: big name. He wasn't somebody who's talked about a lot.
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: Although We did talk about him on the show a
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: week before the draft as somebody that was going to
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: surprise people by them taking I said, wait, but yes.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: No it was you. I'm not gonna I'll give you
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: this one.
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: They traded the two fourth round picks.
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: Isn't that generous to me as I gave him one?
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: They traded the two fourth round picks. And if you're
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: somebody that was waiting around all day, you waited two
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: and a half hours. I think it was for them
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: to draft Courn. But like I think people thought it
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: might be a receiver, might be a tight end. It
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: might be you know, this is that well, not a
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: tight end. I guess they'd taken Rader, but it might
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: be a receiver might be like a you know, more
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: premium position. And so I think some people just he
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: might have gotten off on the wrong foot. Unfortunately, no
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: fault to him.
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah right, I think that I deserves some credit for
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: giving you credit for that one. I gave you some flowers.
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: I don't normally do that.
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: I'm usually I'm usually I remember when I tweeted the
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: clip of it, you were like you're really tweeting this,
• 38:11
  Speaker 3: and I was like, it's your show. Too, you could
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: share it and promote it, and you were like a
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: gast of the idea of promoting that at the time.
• 38:18
  Speaker 5: He's for it.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: I gave you your flowers, which is again, we don't
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: give each other a lot of four months mean to
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: each other most of the time, just things that we
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: bullied each other way too much.
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: He's like, why you guys so mean to each other.
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: It's like this, dude, you guys are seriously as benign
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: as they come.
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: Though.
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: That's not you guys aren't really bullying each other.
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: Right, I mean, it's not bad.
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: No, it's not that bad.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: All right, let's move over to the offense.
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: I'm not victory lapping, I'm not crowning him, I'm not
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: fitting him for any red jacket.
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: So now you're gonna give yourself your own pat on
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: the back.
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: However, we just have to say what we're seeing in
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: these practices. And I'll also throw the caveat out there,
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: because everybody's gonna throw it at me that the Patriots
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: Edge group is not exactly a bunch.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: Of world beaters. All right, Yeah, however.
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: Will Campbell is having a really really good camp Is
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: that fair to say?
• 39:16
  Speaker 6: Yeah?
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: I think with it's fair to say, with the caveat
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: he gave is how I would put it is that
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: he can only block the guys that are in front
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: of him. He's doing that, you know, credit to him.
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: Let's see what happens when the Colts and Eagles get here.
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: That's a fair way to put it.
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: That is, that is kind of how I would summarize
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: Will Campbell's camp, like you'd rather him be blocking Elijah
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: Ponder than not blocking Elijah Ponder. Correct, But he's gonna
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: see a lot no disrespect to Elija Ponder, but he's
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: gonna see a lot of tougher edge rushers than Elijah Ponder.
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: He absolutely will.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: But when I watch him play, I think the biggest
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: thing that I see with him right now is he
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: looks healthy. And I'm not trying to give him excuses
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: for how when in the playoffs, but just watching him
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: put his feet in the ground and anchor right now
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: compared to what he was doing when he was trying
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: to do it in the playoffs last year, is there's
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: a significant different technique. The technique is I think Sharper.
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: I think that he's got more change ups to his
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: hands and he's showing different looks at different sets, whether
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: he's vertical setting or he's being more aggressive and jumping
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: out and getting guys and kind of changing up on
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: the way that he's doing that. Draymond Jones played him
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: last year when Draymond Jones was with the Titans, yea
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: and yesterday had some really nice things to say about
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: the improvement that he sees from Will Campbell of last
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: year when they played him in Tennessee, and the Will
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: Campbell he's practicing against right now. I'm not ready to to,
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: you know, throw a parade yet. He's got to do
• 40:46
  Speaker 2: it against better competition, like you said, but this has
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: been a really really good camp. Like to the point
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: what I am willing to say is this, there are
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: a lot of people the night of the draft and
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: the week's following and probably still to an extent, yeah,
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: that wanted Caleb Blomo to start at left tackle, or
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: wanted Caleb Blomo to be in a competition with Will
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: Campbell at left tackle. Right now, those there are two guys,
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: And this is no disrespect to Caleb Bloman, who's a
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: rookie in his first training camp, and this happens, but
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: there is absolutely no competition with those two guys right now,
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: like they look like different calibers of player at this point,
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: which is the way it should look for a guy
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: that's going into his second season as the fourth overall
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: pick versus a rookie who was the twenty eighth overall
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: pick in the first round of the draft. But there
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: was that narrative was out there that you know, that
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: Lomu might end up surpassing Campbell and pushing him inside
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: the guard and all that different type of stuff. We
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: have not seen anything like that whatsoever, not only just
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: from the usage standpoint, but from the performance standpoint. On
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: that note, I do think that Caleb Blowmo struggled a
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: little bit here recently. Now, I think that's a rookie
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: roller coaster thing. I think that a lot of rookie
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: line and go through that. I think Will Campbell went
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: through it last summer at times. You know, Will Campbell
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: had some ugly practices too at this point last summer,
• 42:09
  Speaker 2: So it's not uncommon at all. But I think Caleb
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: Belomu right now has a little ways to go, and
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: I think that we're looking at him in the right way,
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: you know, as a third tackle, maybe as the sixth
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: offensive Lineman, maybe as a guy that can flex inside
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: and play some guard if they need him to.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: In a pinch.
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: But I again, I don't think that there's performance wise.
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: I'm not talking about usage wise. Performance wise. From my eyes,
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: I do not see anything close to Will Campbell and
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: Caleb Blomo being equals at this point.
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: No, I would agree with you, And again I'm with
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: you on Lomu too. I think he's had a slower start.
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: Doesn't mean he can't dig out of it, but I
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: think it is going to help that he is going
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: to have some time on the bench. And to remember,
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: this is a guy who's the twenty eighth pick, not
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: the fourth overall pick. But yep, I think with Campbell
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: the technique looks better. He looks a little bigger. I
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: know he was wearing a armsleeve today, or he had
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: the thing aesthetic injury. I don't know. We'll see.
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: Uh.
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: That's obviously something you.
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: Look for, but you never know what the youngest.
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: He does look a little bigger.
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: You know, Christian Gonzalez whears a dark visor inside the
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: other day just because it looks cool.
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: You know, you know, he never does look.
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: You never know what I like the most about what
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: I'm seeing out of Will Campbell and then we'll move on.
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: Is I really like how he looks like he's he's
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: more diverse in his past sets, Like he looks like
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: he's got more variety to his past seats. I think
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: last year one of the problems that he was having
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: is in the playoffs, was that he was vertical setting,
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: so he's going back vertically back into the backfield, and
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: then he was catching pass rushers and they were just
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: going right through him. They're powering through him to the quarterback.
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: This year, I see him closing down that space more
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: and more often.
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: He's being more aggressive. He's going out to get guys,
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: which is with his athleticism and his strength, is I
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: think what you want him doing.
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: Whoever, I don't know if it was Lane Johnson or
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: Dion Dock or Duke Mannyweather, whoever worked with him in
• 44:03
  Speaker 2: the off season. I think Tron Armstead was like kind
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: of the king of that technique, and maybe it was
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: something that he.
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: Saw on film from him.
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know who did it, but they did something
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: right right that they got through to him on that.
• 44:15
  Speaker 1: He looks strong, he looks healthy.
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: We'll have some more offensive line stuff here a little
• 44:20
  Speaker 2: bit when we get up to three up, three down.
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: But I wanted to give.
• 44:22
  Speaker 2: Will Campbell some love for the camp he's had. Let's
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: talk a little bit about the wide receivers. Obviously a
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: topic that everybody just talks about all the time. So
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: I wrote about it today, So you can check that
• 44:34
  Speaker 2: out on Patriots dot com if you want to see, you,
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: you know, kind of a deep dive into the position.
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: Let's just go player for player here for a second.
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown, I think, just continues to just look like
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown and that connection. I think it's kind of
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: where we think it should be at this point in time.
• 44:56
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of slants, I'll say that, but I
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: think the s pants to come back and then like
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: the go balls, whether they're high points, back shoulders, over
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: the shoulder, dropping it in the bucket, those are gonna
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: be sort of the foundation of the route tree for
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown is expected. Uh have you seen anything from
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown that gets you really excited or concerned either direction?
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: All? I think some of it is you mentioned we
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: haven't seen as much of the deep ball. Yeah, they're
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: and we talked about so they're working a lot against
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: the blitz yeah, So you're not gonna throw it deep
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: against the Blitz. It does see he I think he
• 45:31
  Speaker 3: is that the trust is there where it's like not
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: not the trust in terms of like the chemistry. But
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: there's been a couple of times where Drake Macy is
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: the Blitz changes the play and even if it's Christian Zalez,
• 45:41
  Speaker 3: it's I'm gonna have Aj Brown one on one where
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: is he yeah right, and I'm throwing to him? And
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: also those slants and comebacks and stuff that you know
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: in a game as the season goes on, that's what
• 45:50
  Speaker 3: you use to open up the deep ball. You can't
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: just throw it deep all the time. So I've said this,
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: I don't think he's the one hundred catch guy. I
• 45:56
  Speaker 3: think he's you know, eleven hundred yards fifteen sixteen, seventeen yards,
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: he catch guy, touchdown guy. But you're gonna have to
• 46:03
  Speaker 3: have some of the underneath stuff mixed in there too.
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: So one of the things I really like about the
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: underneath stuff is that he's a really good double move artist.
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown, really good yeah, stuttering ghost Lugo type of receiver.
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: We saw that was it Saturday that he beat Gonzo
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: on the double move down the right sideline. So in
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: order to set up the double move, you gotta run
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: the hitch, you gotta run the slant like those are
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: the moves that set up the bigger play right and
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: then when you see that and corners are starting to
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: sit on those slants, that's when you hit him with
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: the double moves. But Gonzales has played off of him
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: a lot. He's given him cushion a lot of these
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: reps because they're on the backside of the formation. They
• 46:41
  Speaker 2: see a lot. He's seeing a lot of off coverage,
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: and him and Drake may are just kind of taking
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: what that gives you. That gives you slants, that gives
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: you back shoulders. It's not Gonzo is six seven yards
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: off the line of scrimmage. He's not going to be
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: able to run by him, like especially a player as
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: fast as Christians.
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: But then do you take those seven eight yard slants
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: all day and if he can run out and you
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: keep going.
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: Those look automatic right now. The in cuts to aj
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: Brown at the first level look absolutely automatic. Going down
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: the depth chart here, Romeo Dobs not out there today
• 47:13
  Speaker 2: for the walkthrough, Maybe a little bit limited yesterday. Like
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: you know in team drills as well, maybe dealing with
• 47:20
  Speaker 2: something I still remain small se concerned about this one.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: And I think the biggest thing that stands out to me,
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: and I kind of sum this up in the written
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: thing as well, Diggs. You know who's now on the commander.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: So the ship has sailed, but Diggs. I think what
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: was so great about Digs in this offense is that
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: Diggs had that skill or that ability to like improvise
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: within the route on how to get open. He was like,
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: you know, they gave him like a canvas of like
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: you have to be in these framework of the scheme,
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: and they have parameters in terms of how far outside
• 47:59
  Speaker 2: of that.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: You can go.
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: But the way that Diggs runs routes is really unique.
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: It actually kind of reminds me a little bit of
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: the way Julian Edelman used to run routes. The way
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: he stems routes, the way he sets up the fenders
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: was a really really unique thing. When I watch Romeo
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: Dobbs and I bring up DIGS because I think they're
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: trying to use them similarly as like kind of like
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: a Z power slot type of player. But when I
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: watch Romeo Dobbs play, I see a much stiffer.
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: Athlete than Stefan Diggs.
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: I see much more of a linear player, and I
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: think the things that he's done well on are curls,
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: skinny posts and then winning the ball down the field
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: or in the red zone. So that's not the same
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: and I'm not saying that it can't be effective, but
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: it's just different. It's a different type of player than
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: what they got with Digs. So I think that that's
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: something that there might be a feeling out process with
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: of all Right, how do we now cater the Z
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: to more of a Romeo Dobbs skill set than a
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: Stefan Diggs's skill set, because again, think what made Digs
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: so unique was how crafty he was.
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, that's going to be a huge part of it,
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: and it's obviously been a work in progress. Not great
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: that Dobbs wasn't out there today. We'll see if he's
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: back out there tomorrow, because you know, you got to
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: be on the field to be doing that. But it's
• 49:16
  Speaker 3: you know, a lot it's been said of the chemistry
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: between May and Dobbs, and that's part of it, but
• 49:21
  Speaker 3: part of it too is just him learning the playbook
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: and getting on the same page as some of those
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: option routes and things like that.
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I just don't know if I see a player
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: that has the quickness at the top of the route
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: to be a true Josh McDaniel's slough.
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: No, he's more fit. Well, it would have to be
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: like the Jacoby Meyers, Like that's the comp I don't think,
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: like he's not Jacoby Myers. Wasn't like significantly quicker than.
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: I think a little bit looser than him, like a
• 49:47
  Speaker 1: little bit more.
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: Maybe a little bit, but but may Mark.
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now, I think that's the vision. That's that's what
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: it like.
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: You you're not turning him into Diggs or Edelman or Welker.
• 49:56
  Speaker 3: It's it's Jacoby Myers. That's if you're looking for. We
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: know they love to show the old tape right right,
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: if you're gonna put the old tape up of what
• 50:03
  Speaker 3: do we want this to look like? It's Jacoby Myers
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: for Romeo Dops.
• 50:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a it's a good comp.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: I that That's my biggest thing with it though, is
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: like when I see him like in the number two
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: or number three spot inside the slot and they're asking
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: him to like run the juke series and like get
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: to the top of the route and wiggle and get open,
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: and so I don't see that type of player, Like
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: I don't think he moves that way. So that brings
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: us to the next guy who I think needs to
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: be talked about more and is having a really underrated camp. Yeah, uh,
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: Tomoro Douglas.
• 50:33
  Speaker 3: You know, I'll happily talk about tomorrow Douglas.
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: So we're team caveat today because it's a training camp
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: and that's this time of year that we have to
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: caveat everything. Yeah, I think it is fair to say
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: that to Mario Douglass had a really strong summer last
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: year too.
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: This feels better, though I think this is still different.
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: I would agree, but I think that he had a
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: really good summer last year, And I went back and
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: read some of the things that I wrote about it
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: last year and and kind of refresh my memory on it.
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: He had a really good summer last year. These are
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: not fully tackled to the ground type of practices, So
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: a jitterbug speed slot receiver is going to be tough
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: to cover in this kind of setting. But with that
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: being said, I think what's different about it to me
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: is that when they break out into team drills. The
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: first three receivers on the field have britty consistently been
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: AJ Brown, Romeo Dobbs, Tomario Douglas, and Pop has been
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: the slot receiver and three receiver sets all summer long,
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: and it's really not waned one way or the other.
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: So I think that's maybe what's a little bit different
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: to me about this summer is that he's clearly in
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: that top three right now, and I think that repping
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: him with AJ Brown and Romeo Dobbs, he brings a
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: speed to the offense that nobody else can really bring.
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: Like if Kyle Williams isn't going to break out here,
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: then who else is going to be like the fast
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: guy in the offense. I'm not saying, I know people
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: think I get obsessed with speed. I'm not saying everybody's
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: got to be a speed You need a field stretcher,
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: somebody that is going to threaten to run by people.
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: And Bob Douglas right now, even though it's inside the
• 52:07
  Speaker 2: formation instead of outside the formation, Bob Douglas is the
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: speed element other than you know what's coming out of
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: the backfield, you know, for this offense right now?
• 52:16
  Speaker 3: Uh yeah, No, he is it's speed, it's quickness, it's
• 52:19
  Speaker 3: yards after the catch, that kind of wiggle, and he's
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: been doing it. And again, I'll go back to write
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: what I said in the spring. The difference this year
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: because I hear everybody, oh, he is a good camp
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: every yet over it.
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: I don't know if he's had a good camp every year,
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: but he certainly had a good camp last summer.
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he's had a good camp this year. And the
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: difference is last year he was getting open on his own.
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: I thought he'd a good camp on his own. But
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: how many times last year he get open and Drake
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: may miss them. It feels like they're both on the
• 52:49
  Speaker 3: same page a lot more this year. They both talked
• 52:51
  Speaker 3: about it like second year in the playbook is very helpful.
• 52:54
  Speaker 3: So I'm totally buying in on Pop. I know some
• 52:56
  Speaker 3: people have painted him as maybe the odd man out.
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: I'd even consider Mac Collins potentially the odd man out
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: before him. I think he is in some sense the
• 53:05
  Speaker 3: third receiver on this team right now.
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, agreed. So Paul does this all the time.
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: He pulls up the stats of the Mario Douglas and
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: Kashan Boody because I think I would I agree with
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: him on this one. The narrative around Kashawan Boody and
• 53:19
  Speaker 2: the narrative around Pop Douglas, you would think that Bob
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: Douglas was like a way worse player, right, Like the
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: way that people talk about Booty versus the way that
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: they talk about.
• 53:27
  Speaker 3: Pop Douglas's best season. Statistically, it's better than Kishon Boody's
• 53:30
  Speaker 3: best season.
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: Bob Douglas has five hundred more career receiving guards than
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: Kaishan Boody does over the same amount of time with
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: the same coaches in the same court.
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: To be fair, Kaishan Boody probably shouldn't have been benched
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: as a rookie fair enough.
• 53:43
  Speaker 2: But I just just saying, like the more productive player
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: for the first three years of their career has been
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: Tomorrio Douglas, not Kashan Booty. Now, Booty was better last year,
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: he had more receiving.
• 53:53
  Speaker 3: The yards point, the yards per game is almost identical. Yeah,
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: that's another right in the yards per catchull Douglas a
• 54:02
  Speaker 3: little behind. He plays differently, all right.
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: Moving on the next couple of receivers here, mccollins and
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: Kaishan Boody. I kind of put both in a similar
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: category right now, because I think both of them just
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: make plays when the balls thrown their way. Yeah, I
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: think maccollins looks really good in this camp.
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: He said he hasn't done as much. I wonder if
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: that's more of a veteran rest thing than anything else.
• 54:26
  Speaker 3: Thirty three years old plays a physical position. But you remember,
• 54:30
  Speaker 3: and you know, you start thinking, okay, could he be
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: the auto man out he's doing less? And then they
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: go yesterday, they run that one minute drill with both
• 54:35
  Speaker 3: the first and second offense, and on both drives ended points.
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: Both drives included a big deep in like a twenty
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: yard deep into mac hollins. And I flashed right back
• 54:47
  Speaker 3: to that Ravens game last year. Yeah, when he made
• 54:49
  Speaker 3: a couple of those catches, and he's just so money
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: on that play. And Drake May loves throwing that route.
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: Like you know, if you're gonna argue, well, they have
• 54:56
  Speaker 3: to keep Kaishan Boody because Drake May trust him and
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: because he's a contested catch guy. You could say that
• 55:01
  Speaker 3: about mccollins as well.
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the deep ends, the honey hole shots on the sideline,
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: they had one from de veto the other day. Yeah,
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: really good at that really nice quarterback. You know, friendly target,
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: six foot four, big target down the field. We know
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: he can mix it up in the run game as
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: a blocker as well. I think that he's done everything
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: that he needs to do to be have a role
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: and not just be on the team, but like have
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: a role in the offense. I also, and you're gonna
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: like this, I absolutely love and I want a name
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: for it. They're like big formations where it's AJ Brown, mccollins, Tanner, Arcid,
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: Reggie gilliam and a running back. And they've been doing
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: that some in short time, like monster package or something.
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: I think we talked, yeah, something like that. We can
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: brainstorm some nicknames there. They've been doing it on the
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: goal line. They had one practice I wanted to say
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: it was Saturday's practice where they put the defense in
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: an absolute blender on the goal line, like is it
• 55:59
  Speaker 2: a run? Is it a play auction pass? They had
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: Matt Collins on boots, they had maccollins on delay releases
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: where he's chipping and releasing on the corner routes, and
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: they had some walking touchdowns. Yeah, with those, I think
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: that package is going to be really effective for them
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: in the red zone this year.
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: And MATC. Collins is a part of that.
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: Where are you at right now on August fifth about
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: Kaishan Booty in his future.
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: I still think he gets traded now. There's no rush.
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: They really don't need to do it till roster cuts
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: and you hold on to them because in case something happens,
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: you know, if somebody gets hurt, it changes obviously the outlook,
• 56:36
  Speaker 3: and then maybe you keep them. I go back to
• 56:38
  Speaker 3: and I'm trying to find the exact quote here. I
• 56:41
  Speaker 3: know I have it because I wrote it up over
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: the weekend. A lot of people are pointing to Kaishan
• 56:47
  Speaker 3: BOUDI had this great he's having this great start to camp,
• 56:50
  Speaker 3: but that we've seen him less with the ones here
• 56:52
  Speaker 3: since the pads came on. Yeah, Kishon Budi had this
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: great start to camp. To remind you can't move them.
• 56:56
  Speaker 3: All of that. I do wonder if there's an element
• 57:00
  Speaker 3: of it was always the plan to trade them, so
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: they're going to trade them. And what made me think
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: of it is last year before the trade debt or
• 57:13
  Speaker 3: after the trade deadline. Right, Patriots are seven to two
• 57:15
  Speaker 3: going into the trade deadline. They lead the AFC is
• 57:17
  Speaker 3: they have the best record in the conference. What do
• 57:19
  Speaker 3: they do with the trade deadline? They trade away players,
• 57:22
  Speaker 3: They trade away starters or rotational players. They trade awake
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: Kyle Dugger, they trade away key On White. They don't
• 57:28
  Speaker 3: buy now it worked out. This isn't criticize AM for that.
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: Those were good moves, and this actually gets to the point.
• 57:33
  Speaker 3: Mike Rabels asked about that at the time and said
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: he was asked it was difficult at all for the
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: organization to adhere to its plan when you guys are
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: performing the way you're performing right now, He said, I
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: never really looked at it that way. I think we're
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: trying to build a program, the same thing that we
• 57:49
  Speaker 3: said when we got here. I think that's a part
• 57:51
  Speaker 3: of building the program. It's finding a way to win,
• 57:54
  Speaker 3: building a team, and figuring out where the pieces are
• 57:56
  Speaker 3: that we can continue to add when it makes sense.
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: And so I don't think anything. I don't think this
• 58:01
  Speaker 3: is a negative. I don't think this is this is
• 58:03
  Speaker 3: just where we're at. What if it's just where they're
• 58:06
  Speaker 3: at with Keishambouti that he's getting traded and maybe what
• 58:09
  Speaker 3: he does in camp ultimately doesn't affect that.
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's a good take, because honestly, their actions
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: have speaking that way all. Like I immediately went to
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: this offseason with Anthony Jennings and Jelaniki and Stefan Diggs
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: even and some of these players that they really weren't
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: in on Anthony Jennings. They weren't crazy about him as
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: a player. He had a really really good season for
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: them last year and a really good playoffs, And honestly,
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: with the way that it turned out with Harold Landry,
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: where would they have been without Anthony Jennings in the
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: playoffs on the edge last year? They would have been
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: screwed if they didn't have a player like that that
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: could play that many snaps. But what do they do?
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: They stuck to the plan. They still moved on from
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: him in this offseason. They easily could have said Anthony
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: Jennings was good for us last year. He surprised us,
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: came out, you know, kind of overcame the scheme differences
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: and stuff like that, and played really well, and we're
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: going to hang on to the player.
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: They did it.
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: They still moved on from him, right, And so I
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: think that that that's possible, that's possible that they feel
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: that way about Booty. I still look at the Booty situation.
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: I think their best bet is to hang on to
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: Booty for as long as they possibly can.
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: Well, I think as long as they possibly can is
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: until roster cuts.
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: So do you don't think that they can trade They
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: can trade him at the deadline, no season.
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: Not if he's like becoming a major part of the offense.
• 59:26
  Speaker 1: So the reason why I say that, And if he's.
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: Not gonna be a big part of the offense, then
• 59:31
  Speaker 3: you trade him soon.
• 59:32
  Speaker 1: His value, I.
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: Think his value is could be just as valuable at
• 59:37
  Speaker 2: the deadline, just as Yeah.
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: I if you hold on him through the deadline, one
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: of two things is gonna happen. Either his value he
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: doesn't play, so his value doesn't increase and you're getting
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: the same form thing for him many ways, you might
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: as well trade him now so you can keep the
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: extra player, or he does play a lot, which means
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: his value does go up. But now he's clearly key
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 3: part of your offense and you can't trade him. Assuming
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 3: that they're where they should be, which is back in
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 3: the mix for the playoffs and trying to contend for
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 3: Super Bowl. So I think it's a lose lose if
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: you hold on him till the dead.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: So the reason why I say to hold on to
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: it the deadline. Yeah, I think sometimes the prices at
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 2: the deadline get a little bit crazy. Now, Rashid Shahid
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: is also a returner, so that adds value to his
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: skill set in his overall market. But last year at
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: the trade deadline, Rashi Jaheed went for a fourth and
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: a fifth round pick. Yeah, but which is more than
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: they're going to get for Keishan Boody right now.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 3: But the Saints, I don't think it is. I don't
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: think his value goes up at the deadline. I think
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 3: that teams get desperate if he's No, I don't. I
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 3: don't think.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: Patriots once traded a second round pick for Mohammed se
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: That was a bad trade, Okay, But teams get desperate,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: teams that that think they're contenders, that think that they're
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: real players.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: And I would not think on his value going up
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: unless you plan on him playing a significant role. And
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 3: if he's playing a significant role, you shouldn't trade him period.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: Okay, so you just hold.
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 3: On him and you let him walk.
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: Okay, here's my point.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the reason why I might think about holding on
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: to Kishan Boody into the season is I'm not sold
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: on Romeo Dobbs being.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: A fit for this offense yet.
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: And if Romeo Dobbs doesn't work now, then then there's
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: no better insurance policy on the team right now than case.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 3: So that's a different reason, and that you can sell
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 3: me on the other thing. I think the other reason
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 3: that who are you? Who are you moving off of
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 3: if you keep Kishan Boudy me personally, yeah, or them?
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: I don't know who they would move on.
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 3: So here's the other thing, you know.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: That was the last thing I wanted to talk about
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: was the two seconds.
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: So let me lay this out and again I wrote
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 3: this on ninety five the sports sub dot com. It's
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: probably Ki wings Rift And I mean the talks are
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 3: just crazy, am I right? It's you know, it's just
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: like seamless, like you just it's it's called being a
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: professional and it's more effective.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: Way how many times, I mean, you can't.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 3: Just let that one slide that was just so like
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 3: on the nose.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: Man do you think how many times do you think
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: he said?
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 2: Nine to eighty five the sports up dot Com on
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: this show alone, it's just it's the plugs are endless.
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: We'll break the book out later.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: Good, go ahead, go ahead.
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 3: The you're probably talking about them moving on from Kyle Williams,
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: Reft and Chishlm. Yes, there is a long term implication
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: to moving on from those guys. Kashawn Boody is in
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: a contract year. Yes, so is Pop Douglas, so is
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: Mac Collins. And we'll see what happens with AJ Brown.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 3: His contract is up in the air. He signed for
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 3: more years, but uh, you know, there's a chance it
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 3: could get reworked. So your only receivers under contract for
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 3: the long term are Romeo Dobbs, who you've said you
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 3: have your questions about Williams and Chisholm and AJ Brown
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: and AJ Brown, but again he's kind of more year
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 3: to yearie.
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: I'm not saying Kyle Williams is gonna be the answer
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 3: of being your number one guy, but I think he
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 3: can be a depth wide receiver. I think Chism will
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 3: be a depth wide receiver. You move on for one
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: of them, like, you're really turning this over almost completely
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: in the next two to three years. Now, there is
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 3: an argument for the Patriots should be more worried about
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: their one year window than their three year window. And
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 3: we said that when they traded for for Aj Brown,
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: And I think that's fair. But if you cut Kyle Williams,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: Reft and Chisholm to keep Kaishan Booty under the idea
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 3: that well, we can get more form at the deadline,
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 3: and you then trade him at the deadline, well, now
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 3: you've lost the long term at the position and the
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 3: short term at the position. And okay, so maybe he
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: was worth a fifth and that turns into a fourth,
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: Well you're gonna be probably it was that worth Now
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: you have to go get another wide receiver. So because
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: you've lost the depth in the room, I mean, I
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 3: think holding on if you're holding on to him because
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: you're worried about Romeo Dobbs, that is a legitimate argument.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: I've heard that. Um I'll give you that. If you're
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 3: holding on a Kaishan booty just because what we think
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 3: we'll be able to get a little more form at
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: the deadline, what that little increase is going to be
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 3: is not worth the weight in the roster spot you're
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 3: gonna have to sacrifice elsewhere. And you're saying, well, his
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 3: value is actually gonna go up a lot, souse. He's
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 3: going to play now, then you should keep him.
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: So my argument is that I think the value at
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: the end of the summer versus the value at the
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 2: deadline is going to be exactly the same. And I
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 2: would rather have the insurance policy of Kishon Booty in
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: my back pocket in case this Romeo Dobs thing doesn't
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: go well. That's what I'm saying, because I think that
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: there's a chance that this Romeo Dobs thing doesn't go well,
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: and I would much rather be able to pivot out
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: of that and not you know, kind of have a
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 2: I'll just use the comparison.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't want to.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 2: Make the same mistake twice that I did with Jacobe
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 2: Myers and Juju Smith Schuster.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 3: That's fair.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: I don't want to make that same mistake.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 2: Fair And until they actually have to make a decision
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: on Kishon Booty, And this was one thing Fred brought
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: up yesterday that Bill Belichick was really big on, don't
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: make a decision until you have to make a decision. Well, so,
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: the last possible time that they can trade Kishon Booty
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: until his contract expires and he's a unrestricted free agent,
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: would be the trade deadline in the middle of the season.
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 1: Well, that's the deadline to trade him. Well, it's not
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 1: at the end of the summer.
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 3: Get ready, we're gonna get more calls now about trading
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: Romeo Dobs like we got last week. No, that's not
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 3: two I at that point, I would just keep I
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: would just keep them and let him walk at the
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 3: end of the year.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: At that point, that's just the way I feel about it.
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: I think that the value at the end of the
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: summer and the deadline is going to be pretty equal,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: and I'd rather just have Kishan Boodie on the team
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 2: for eight weeks to see how this all goes.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: Fair enough, I would just keep At that point.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: You mentioned the second year receivers. Well, and the reason
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: why you say'd rather just keep them, Well, what if
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: I'm wrong about Romeo Dobs and Romeo Dobbs is what
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: they thought he.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Was going to be, then you don't need to keep them.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: Well, but now you're gonna have a lack of death
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: because you're probably moving on from five guys.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: It's not a huge lack of depth.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 3: Well, I'm saying somebody gets if he'd be the fifth guy,
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 3: if somebody gets hurt.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: No, he'd be the sixth er, I guess so on
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: the second year guys Williams and Chisholm. I think Williams
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: and Chisholm are really interesting case studies because there are
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: two opposites. Williams is still to me all upside and
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 2: potential with the skill set, whereas Chisholm, I think is
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: a really good practice player. So it just kind of
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: depends on the way that you look at things.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 3: Like also, one's an outside guy, one's a slot guy.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: Sure, but Williams I think is not as productive in
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 2: these practices as Chisholm. Yes, but I think Williams has
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 2: more upside because of the skill set than Chisholm does.
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: So this is more of like do you want you
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 2: know which.
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: One would you prefer? Like did?
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: I still don't think that Williams's production or Williams's outlook
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 2: is tangible, Like I still feel like I am talking
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: myself into something that he might turn into down the road,
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 2: whereas with that and Chisholm, I think I kind of
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 2: know what he is. The thing that I struggle with
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 2: with Chism because I hear a lot of people say
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 2: they should.
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: Keep all seven of these guys. You can't do that
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: with Chism.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: I I don't know if Chisholm has the play speed
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: and the explosiveness to be what we all want to be,
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 2: which is like the next Julian Edelman or Wes Welker
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: Danny A.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 1: Mondola.
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 2: I think those guys were just just to put it
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 2: as simply as you can, I think those guys were
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: all faster than Eft and chism was. I think they
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 2: were all more explosive athletes than Eft and chism was.
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 2: He is I think a good blocker, decent blocker. Saw
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: him throw a really good block the other day in practice.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 2: I think he's got some sturdiness to him, and just
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: like some physicality and play strength that is probably better,
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: not probably is better than Pop Douglas. You know he
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: offers more of that with Pop. I'm still not doing
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: all these roster gymnastics just to keep eftn Chism on
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: the tree.
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 3: No me neither. I mean, you can just move off
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 3: of it. Leaves you a little thin in the slot
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: behind Pop Douglas. He's also player. I think you can
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 3: probably get on the practice squad, So I don't think
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 3: that that should be off the table. The big argument
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 3: for keeping Chishm is you want a true slot backup
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: for Pop, like that's that's the.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and he and he fits the suit like he
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: fits the role really well.
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: But you could also if it's not Chisholm, I'm sure
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 3: you can go find a slot receiver, put him on
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 3: your practice squad and if you need him, if Pop
• 1:08:10
  Speaker 3: gets hurt, you can elevate him.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 2: And you know I said this yesterday and Fred of
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: course mocked me, as he's one to do. I'm not
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: saying that you're building your offense around Afton Chisholm, but
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: the idea of that slot type of slot receiver, I'm
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 2: just not sure it's a great fit with Drake May.
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: I don't know if Drake May is going to be
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: the guy that's gonna hit the little slot receiver on
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 2: an option round one hundred times, you know, like that's
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 2: just not really you know, he said it last year.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: He doesn't want to be a check down Charlie.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: And so I think the way that they've built their
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 2: wide receiver room, you either have one of two things.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 2: You either have speed or you have size in that
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: wide receiver room. Right now, it's aj Brown, it's Romeo
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 2: Dobbs six one, six foot two, Matt Collins six foot four,
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 2: or a guy like a pop who is fast because
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 2: you want to get down the field, because this is
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: the way the quarterback wants to play. He wants to
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: throw the ball down the field. I don't think that
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 2: he wants to do death by a thousand paper cuts.
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 2: And that's I'm not saying there's anything wrong with either strategy.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 2: I just don't think he wants to do that. So
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: to keep a player like Chisholm or really go through
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 2: all these gymnastics, like I was saying, to keep a
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 2: player like Chisholm to have an archetype on the team
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 2: that I don't necessarily think fits the current state of
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 2: the offense, I think is a little bit counterproductive. Yeah,
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: that's just my take on it. Now, could he be
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 2: a decent backup slot returner, Yes, absolutely, I absolutely think
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 2: Chisholm could do all those things. I'm just not sure
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: there's a huge role for that anymore in this I.
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 3: Think it would be just backing Douglas.
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fair, all right, last thing, and then we
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 2: got to take a break.
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: We've been going for a while.
• 1:09:50
  Speaker 2: The running backs running back competition. Obviously, we know ramondre
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: Stevenson and Trevon Henderson are going to be here. Terrell
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 2: Jennings is back, he's been just in the last handful
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: of days. They've kind of just put him right back
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: into the mix. With the twos Land Larrison and him
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 2: have still been I would say for the most part,
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: splitting those second team reps between the two of them,
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: I would have those two guys ahead of the udfa's
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: right now. Maybe Jan Miller and Miles Montgomery, one of
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 2: those has a huge preseason game or something like that,
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 2: and we revisit this, But where do you feel like
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 2: Charrel Jennings is right now? Because I feel like he
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: just step right back in like he would.
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 3: Now left, step back right right back into that role.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 3: And he's obviously the veteran, He's had time there now,
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 3: you know. I think Lean Larison is a little more
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 3: of a and and jam Miller two verse tile back.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 3: I think they can do a little bit more, but
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 3: they're not as good like horror of just a downhill
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 3: runner as Chrel Jennings, So maybe they keep a fourth guy.
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 3: Some of those other guys have been returning kicks but
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: it does look like charl Jenning stepped right back into
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 3: that job.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: Yep, I agree, And he's done some kickoff return in
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: the past. Unfortunately got hurt on kickoff return, Laris, and.
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: I agree with you.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: Is still got a little bit more past game versatility.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 2: I think he's more of a subpackage back. All right,
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: we're going to take a quick break. When we come back,
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 2: we'll do three up, three down, and we'll take your
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: phone calls and emails.
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• 1:13:35
  Speaker 1: Catt catch twenty catch catch.
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 3: Catch catch catch catch catch cat cat catch twa two
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 3: catch catch catch.
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 1: Catch catch A big freets guy. I can't play.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: I am they're they're they're taking over the stadium right now.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: This is they are.
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 2: It's a pretty crazy I mean this stadium. We've done concerts.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: We were the World Cup was here. This is like
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: World Cup ESQ, I would say in terms of how
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: much they they've taken over the stadium. I'm not the
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: biggest K pop guy, but you know that I'm a
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: sucker for like top forty pop music, so it's in
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: my wheelhouse.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: We are also suckers for legal seafoods. We love legal sees.
• 1:14:16
  Speaker 3: Now legal seafoods I very much enjoy.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: So Legal Seafoods is giving fans a true taste of
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: Boston this season as the official seafood restaurant of the
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 2: New England Patriots. Pregame or postgame, get the seafood you
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: love at your local restaurant today, find that at www
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 2: dot Legal seafoods dot com. I heard a rumor that
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: we might be getting some legal seafoods on Tuesday, and
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 2: since you're kind of a Patriots dot com.
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: Employee, maybe I can help you.
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 3: Out and get it on these So I'll let you know.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: I do three up, three down, and then we'll take
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: some emails. We might end the show. I brought up
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 2: the BTS thing. We might ended a few minutes early.
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 2: The parking lots open at four o'clock for the concert.
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 1: Stacy's.
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: James told us it's an early arriving crowd, so it's
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 2: gonna get crazy. I don't want to get out of
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: in a couple of hours, so we might end around
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: like three fifty three forty five. All right, three up,
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: three down for training camp. This is from the last
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: time we were on the air, so the last like
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: five practices we talked all about some of these guys
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 2: on my list are ready. My number one up is
• 1:15:17
  Speaker 2: Karan Prunty. I think Prunty is out of all the
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: bubble guys.
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah, just remind me these are not.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: Like, yes, right, we're talking about bubble players. Yeah, that
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: are making pushes.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: Kuran Prumpty is my number one up for all the
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 2: reasons that we talked about before. Who where he's repping,
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: who he's repping with, some of the plays on the ball,
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: I will go down with the ship. The play that
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: he made in the bubble.
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: The other day.
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 2: I had that as an interception. A lot of people
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: thought it was a simultaneous catch and gave it to
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 2: Nick Dejaneiro. I'm saying it was a pick. He had
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: the ball and was laying on his back with ball
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 2: like this on his chest. And De Gennaro was trying
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 2: to rip it out. I'm saying an interception. I've really
• 1:16:00
  Speaker 2: liked what I've seen from Karan Prunty. I think he's
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 2: making a push here.
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 3: I'll even go beyond that. He had a pass break
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 3: if against s A. J.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: Brown, he did.
• 1:16:07
  Speaker 3: He's been he's been balling out. He's he continues to
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 3: get opportunities, and he continues to make the most of them.
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 3: And that's what training camps all about.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 1: Is he your number one?
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 3: Two? Y? Yes?
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 2: My number two is another guy we already mentioned, but
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 2: we can talk about a moment.
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: No. Joshua Farmer. Oh yeah, I think Joshua Farmer. We talked.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: I knew we were going to talk about Muma, so
• 1:16:27
  Speaker 2: I didn't put him on here. Joshua Farmer, I think
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: has been really good, really physical, really good at the
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 2: point of attack, steady run defender. I think Corey Durden's
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: a really good player too. I think that Durden's very
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: comfortably in his role right now. It wouldn't stun me though,
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 2: if Joshua Farmer plays a little bit in that role
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: too this season, because I think he's making a push. Yeah,
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: and he looks really really stout, physical, good at reading
• 1:16:53
  Speaker 2: blocks inside, a good at absorbing power. I think that
• 1:16:56
  Speaker 2: he's a guy that's gonna be be able to stick
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: around here a little bit.
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and again it's the run defense especially that makes
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 3: him stand out because that's something they need.
• 1:17:04
  Speaker 1: Yep, it was he on your list too.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 3: I did not have him on my list, right, who's
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: your number two? U, Chad Muma. We already talked about
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 3: just solidifying himself. It looks like is that third running
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 3: back a third linebacker? Sorry, this year's Jack Gibbons.
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:17:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we all kind of thought it was you know
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 2: that meme where like you're looking at the girl and
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 2: you're and you're holding hands with the other girl.
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 3: Distracted boyfriend me.
• 1:17:28
  Speaker 2: Yes, we all thought that that was going to be
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: kJ Britt, right, and it feels like that's pivoted to
• 1:17:33
  Speaker 2: Chad Muma. Last one here. Then I have a honorable
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 2: mention too. Can we just give some love to Tommy DeVito.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 2: Tommy DeVito's had some couple a couple.
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 3: Of really come about Baron Morton.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 1: I think that Tommy DeVito has been better than the.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 3: More obviously, but they both I would just say backup
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 3: quarterbacks as a whole.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 2: I think Tommy DeVito's looked really good. I think yesterday
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 2: he was the best quarterback out there. Now he's not
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 2: going up against the starting defense, right, but I think
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 2: that yes yesterday he had a really really good practice.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 3: No, he's had a nice summer.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 1: He threw the whole shot to Matt Collins. That was
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: a really good throw.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: He threw a deep bald cash on booty that was
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 2: more of a better catch than throw, but still completed. Yeah,
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 2: he led his two minute drill ins. They scored. They
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 2: had a really good red zone sequence when we were
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 2: in the bubble on Monday with Tommy DeVito. As far
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 2: as backup quarterbacks go, I think they're okay. I think
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: that they have enough there.
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 6: He is.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 3: I would consort him a high level backup. I don't
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 3: know about you. Does he a top thirty five quarterback
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 3: in the NFL? Yeah, top forty, certainly.
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 2: I think that he's a go if I had to say,
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 2: like a top ten backup, So yeah, maybe he's like
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 2: thirty three through forty or something like that. You know
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 2: in the NFL. Yeah, if you want to say all
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 2: thirty two starters better than.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 3: You might I mean the Browns have a starter better
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 3: than him. The Browns of a quarterback right on him.
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: He might be on par withh the door.
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 3: And yeah, like he's right there and the Jets, like
• 1:18:59
  Speaker 3: he's not as good as you know, outside of the opener.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 3: You saw what Gino was last I know, but I
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 3: still give I get fair, but you get what I'm saying, like, yeah.
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I think that he's been really solid, and
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 2: yesterday's practice was kind of fun watching that. You know,
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: he's not throwing a bums like he's throwing the guy's
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 2: like Matt Collins and Kishon Booty and Kyle Williams and
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 2: Efton Chisholm. So he's got some NFL talent on that
• 1:19:20
  Speaker 2: second unit with him, and I think he's made some
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: really good throws, so kodest to him. Yeah, he's having
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 2: a good summer. I thought he had a good spring too. Honestly,
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: who's your third one?
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 3: My third? I we just ended up doing it. I
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 3: know he's not truly a bubble player, but people were
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 3: treating him like one. I wanted to take a victory
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 3: lap on Pop Douglas. Yeah, but I already did that.
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, uh quick honorable mention Dimitrius crown Over and Marcus Bryant.
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 1: I think so both those tackles I think have been
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 1: pretty good.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 3: I can't get there with crown Over.
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: Because he's been solid in one on ones.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but we haven't I need he's still only repping
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 3: with the third team. We really even see him move
• 1:19:57
  Speaker 3: up so until he had until in terms of making
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 3: the roster right his usage right now reflects a player
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 3: that will not make the team. Yeah, I think he's
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 3: looking in one on ones. I'd like to see him
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 3: get more work, maybe like with Prunty, this is something
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 3: that he has a good joint practice, has a good
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 3: preseason game. We see him to plant maybe James Hudson
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 3: or even Marcus Bryant. Marcus Bryant's had a good summer
• 1:20:15
  Speaker 3: and he's getting the reps that reflect a player making
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 3: the team. I can't put crown Over on the ups
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 3: although he's playing well. I feel like some of that
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 3: when you talk about training camp specifically, is who does
• 1:20:25
  Speaker 3: it look like he's positioning himself after a roster spot.
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 3: And again, I think Crownover's performed well, but I can
• 1:20:33
  Speaker 3: only go off what the coaching staff is telling us
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 3: by the decisions they make. It hasn't been reflected in
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 3: the reps he's getting.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: That's a fairer buddle. I would just say, do I
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: understand why you have him on there? I thought he's
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 2: looked solid in the one on ones and half line
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 2: stuff that they've done at the other end of the field.
• 1:20:47
  Speaker 3: Do you agree he has earned more reps whether or not.
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 2: He's going to And I think that right now because
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 2: they have to get Lomu reps right.
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: They like Marcus Bryan quite a bit.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 2: It seems like James Hudson they're trying to figure out
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 2: if he can play side and outside. So it's just
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 2: been a little bit tough with Crownover. I would just
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 2: hate to give up on those traits. I'd hate to
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 2: give up on that length and feet like that, Like
• 1:21:08
  Speaker 2: that's well, those are like swing tackle upside traits and
• 1:21:12
  Speaker 2: I would just hate to like jettison that as a rookie.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 3: It's funny because didn't we kind of do this last
• 1:21:19
  Speaker 3: year with Marcus Bryant. We thought Marcus Bryant was gonna
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 3: come in and supplant Vedarian Lowe, and he didn't, and
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 3: it looks like he might not even make the team.
• 1:21:26
  Speaker 3: Then he did but he didn't really play. And now
• 1:21:29
  Speaker 3: he's the guy that the other kind of late round
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 3: rookie who has some fun trades in the playgo. So
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 3: maybe this is just the pattern. Maybe, And that's not
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 3: to say that he's gonna end up pushing Marcus Bryant off,
• 1:21:40
  Speaker 3: But does he stick around as like a fourth tackle
• 1:21:43
  Speaker 3: a fifth tackle, And that's kind of weird they kept him.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 3: He wasn't doing a ton in the spring. But he
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 3: essentially just needs like a true red shirt ear.
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I just would hate to give up on that.
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 2: I think he needs physical development. I think he's skinny
• 1:21:55
  Speaker 2: for a tackle. I think he needs to add masks
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 2: and add good weight to his frame. But he's got
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 2: incredible length and he's got really good feed and those
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: are hard. You can't find those like that's you can't
• 1:22:06
  Speaker 2: coach that, you know. So I'll get him in the
• 1:22:10
  Speaker 2: strength and conditioning program and they'll get him with the
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 2: coaches and all that stuff, and let's see what happens.
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 2: So I've liked what I've seen from both those guys.
• 1:22:17
  Speaker 2: Let's go to the downs. My number one down is
• 1:22:20
  Speaker 2: because of what we've been talking about, I'll show k J.
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 1: Britt I just really thought k J. Britt was gonna
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: be Jack Gibbons.
• 1:22:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that Chad Muma is you know,
• 1:22:29
  Speaker 2: distracted boyfriend meme.
• 1:22:30
  Speaker 1: Right, that's what you call it. That's what's happened here
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 1: with Chad Muma. So right now, I think k J.
• 1:22:36
  Speaker 2: Britt is squarely on a roster bubble and I'm not
• 1:22:39
  Speaker 2: sure if he's going to make the team at this point.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, he's He's an at large ross spot guy.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 3: He can still bring something in terms of special team's
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 3: ability as that let us isn't a linebacker, but they
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 3: have that elsewhere and he just has to prove he's
• 1:22:51
  Speaker 3: more valuable and guys at other positions.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: Was he on your list too?
• 1:22:54
  Speaker 3: He was not? Actually, Okay, who's your first, Kendall Vildor.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 3: They gave him a lot of chances to compete with
• 1:23:00
  Speaker 3: Charles Woods for that, you know, that top depth, boundary
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 3: corner spot. Wasn't able to do it, got burnt a
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 3: couple of times. Now it seems like he's been passed
• 1:23:07
  Speaker 3: by Karan Prunty. I would have him off the roster
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 3: if Cutsworth today.
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a fair one.
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: I think that he's the sixth guy right now, and
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 2: even Channing Canada, they're trying to give a look at him.
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 3: I don't get that one because he had a rough practice,
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 3: but they're still giving him a ton of lot.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I maybe, just like the youth in the upside,
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: there is a little bit more they want to see
• 1:23:28
  Speaker 2: a little bit more. My next one here was the
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 2: interior offensive line backups. I feel pretty good about the
• 1:23:35
  Speaker 2: starting three. Yeah, I feel pretty good about Ben Brown
• 1:23:37
  Speaker 2: as your backup center. I feel less good about Ben
• 1:23:40
  Speaker 2: Brown at guard. They've tried Andrew Rupstich all over the interior,
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 2: James Hudson is kicked inside a little bit, and the
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: last couple of practices, Makai Butler is elevated up the
• 1:23:51
  Speaker 2: depth chart. I haven't been dazzled by any of those
• 1:23:54
  Speaker 2: guys at guard, I would say. Rabel mentioned that Lomu
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 2: might start wrapping a little bit more at guard as
• 1:24:01
  Speaker 2: things currently stand, and this is assuming he can transition
• 1:24:04
  Speaker 2: just fine inside. If Vera Tucker gets hurt for an
• 1:24:09
  Speaker 2: extended period of time like he's prone to do, I
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 2: think you gotta go to low Moo like.
• 1:24:14
  Speaker 1: As long as Lomu can can.
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 2: Play the position, these other guys that they have a
• 1:24:18
  Speaker 2: backup guard right now are making me a little bit weary.
• 1:24:21
  Speaker 2: I wonder if maybe you know, they bring in some
• 1:24:24
  Speaker 2: competition at the end of the summer on the waiver
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 2: wire or a trade or something like that, it's backup guard.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 2: I'm not losing my mind over it, but I think
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: it's been a little bit of a sore spot for
• 1:24:35
  Speaker 2: them this training camp.
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: And we're doing bubbles. We're doing bubbles.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 3: I will say, Likesich hasn't been demoted yet.
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 2: No, And I think Rupsich is a better guard I
• 1:24:48
  Speaker 2: think than Ben Brown. I don't have the luxury of
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 2: watching the tape back of the offensive lines.
• 1:24:52
  Speaker 1: That hurts.
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 2: But Ben Brown's a much better center, yeah than these guys,
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 2: But at guard it drops off quite a bit. So
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 2: maybe him and Repsich are kind of equal at guard.
• 1:25:02
  Speaker 2: But he can play all three spots, So I think
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: Ben Bron's fine.
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 1: I think.
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 3: But we saw Kayden Wallace get to moted last week, right,
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 3: Rosich is still and now they're rotating in James Hudson.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 3: It's all but next to Ropsich. Yep, So they're giving
• 1:25:15
  Speaker 3: him every chance. I think that's totally fair, all right,
• 1:25:17
  Speaker 3: who's your second one? My second one was Demetri's crown Over.
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 3: Like we talked about, not that he's playing poorly, he's
• 1:25:26
  Speaker 3: just he hasn't gotten those more reps, and that's that's
• 1:25:28
  Speaker 3: more puzzling. I just wanted a chance to mix that
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 3: in which we got. Anyway, he's not playing poorly. I'm
• 1:25:33
  Speaker 3: just puzzled by the fact that it seems like he's
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 3: looking good and we're not really seeing any more reps
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 3: for him.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 1:25:38
  Speaker 2: Last one for me, I think it might be over
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 2: on the team for Jack Westover, Like I I just
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 2: not that I thought that he was gonna necessarily make
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 2: the team anyways. Probably if I had one in the spring,
• 1:25:50
  Speaker 2: I probably wouldn't have said had him on a roster projection.
• 1:25:53
  Speaker 2: But you know, Gilliam's pushing him off the team at
• 1:25:56
  Speaker 2: full back, Arkins pushing him off the team at at
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 2: tight end up. I just don't really see a path forward.
• 1:26:02
  Speaker 2: He hasn't practiced, he's been kind of banged up as well.
• 1:26:07
  Speaker 2: It's been it's the writing is kind of on the
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 2: wall at this point. For Jack Westover, I think he's out.
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 3: I would agree, all right, Last one for you, Last
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 3: one for me, was a tie between Lean Lerison and
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 3: Jim Miller. We talked about it earlier. Terrell Jennings comes
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 3: in slides right back in the third running back spot.
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 3: Felt like both of those guys had some momentum, but
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 3: obviously now they're going to have another guy they got
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 3: to pass.
• 1:26:28
  Speaker 2: Yep, all right, So those are three up, three down.
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 2: We just did like an hour and twenty minutes as
• 1:26:33
  Speaker 2: on it. So I apologize that we've left people on
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 2: hold for a long time.
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: But Sean is in Vancouver. What's up, Sean.
• 1:26:41
  Speaker 6: I've got a few questions. One. I don't know if
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 6: this is even possible to know, but will legal Seafoods
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 6: have a concession stand at Chill at this season?
• 1:26:50
  Speaker 2: I don't know the answer to that question, but stay tuned.
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 2: That's a boss man question, Sean. You call in and
• 1:26:56
  Speaker 2: asked for that one.
• 1:26:58
  Speaker 6: But let's go with defense then, So I feel comfortable
• 1:27:04
  Speaker 6: with Draymond setting the edge. But I don't know, maybe
• 1:27:09
  Speaker 6: this is again impossible to know. Will Harold Landry and
• 1:27:13
  Speaker 6: gay back is be ready to start Game one in Seattle?
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks for the call, sew and I appreciate you
• 1:27:20
  Speaker 2: holding on. I don't know about Harold Landry. That one
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 2: seems TBD. I think Acus is going to be able
• 1:27:27
  Speaker 2: to have a role. I think he got out there
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 2: fast enough. If he hadn't got out there for the
• 1:27:32
  Speaker 2: first preseason game and joint practices, I'd be a little
• 1:27:34
  Speaker 2: bit more.
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 3: I think week ones definitely an expected, fair expectation for
• 1:27:40
  Speaker 3: how when he came back to.
• 1:27:41
  Speaker 2: He got back in the nick of times, right, you know.
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 2: I think he just got back in time for that.
• 1:27:47
  Speaker 2: We'll see about Landry. I don't has anybody asked him
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 2: Vrabel about I've been in and out of the press
• 1:27:54
  Speaker 2: conferences a little bit about Carlon Davis and like his
• 1:27:57
  Speaker 2: long term he feels a little Gonzaleese.
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 3: Last sear was just asked like late last week, I
• 1:28:04
  Speaker 3: think if Carlton Davis is going to be at that
• 1:28:06
  Speaker 3: individual practice, and he said Carlton's working his way back.
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that sounded or looked like I should say,
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 2: and I'm speculating, looked like a hamstring type of thing.
• 1:28:16
  Speaker 2: I know that some people think that Gonzalez missed time
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 2: last year for other reasons, you know, reasons that like
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 2: complicated things with contracts and things like that. Yeah, but
• 1:28:25
  Speaker 2: I if Gonzalez his hamstring held him out of regular
• 1:28:28
  Speaker 2: season games when he injured his hamstring early on in
• 1:28:31
  Speaker 2: training camp. I just that one's on my radar to
• 1:28:35
  Speaker 2: ask more information on Carlton Davis. Marcus is in North Carolina.
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 2: What's up, Marcus?
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 10: It was going on.
• 1:28:45
  Speaker 1: What's up? Thanks for holding on?
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, no problem, no problem.
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 10: Yeah.
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 4: I I had two questions. One, do you think I
• 1:28:58
  Speaker 4: think Remandre Steveson is like one of the more underrated players.
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 4: I felt like he had an underrated season last year,
• 1:29:05
  Speaker 4: Like I feel like even in the playoffs, and I
• 1:29:08
  Speaker 4: know our old line was kind of you know, banged
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 4: up or not playing well, it seemed like he had
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 4: a little injury or something because every time he got
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 4: the ball, I just felt like we moved a lot
• 1:29:19
  Speaker 4: better versus Henderson. And I think even like when I
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 4: see the fantasy stuff, I think Stevenson is just I
• 1:29:26
  Speaker 4: just think he's just a better back right now. And
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 4: I also want to know, am I wild for thinking
• 1:29:32
  Speaker 4: that A J. Brown could have a top three type
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 4: of season this year with Drake May? Thanks Fellers, and
• 1:29:40
  Speaker 4: I look forward to welcome you all.
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks for that, Marcus, Thanks for holding on, Like
• 1:29:43
  Speaker 2: I said on the reminder thing you like to send
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 2: me the Madden ratings. They also Jeremy Fowler did his list. Yeah,
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 2: on both the Madden Ratings and on Jeremy Fowler's pull
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 2: of executives and coaches that are on the NFL, Traveon
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 2: Henderson was the one that was getting the love and
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 2: not Ramondre Stevenson, which shocks me. Like, Travon Henderson, there
• 1:30:06
  Speaker 2: is no disrespect to Travion Henderson. Yeah, Ramon, did you
• 1:30:10
  Speaker 2: watch the games at the end of last year.
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 3: He was the the best player of the second half
• 1:30:13
  Speaker 3: of last season.
• 1:30:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And like and just is the usage alone.
• 1:30:17
  Speaker 3: And I'll say this because the knock is the fumbles, right, Yeah,
• 1:30:19
  Speaker 3: he fumbled once after Week five.
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and Remondre was their their backfield in the playoffs
• 1:30:25
  Speaker 2: like that, that was a one man backfield at least
• 1:30:28
  Speaker 2: through the AFC playoffs like the Super Bowl, I think
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 2: Henderson played a little bit more because they were behind.
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 2: But through the AFC playoffs Fromandre was like their one
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 2: consistent offensive player as the rest of the offense was
• 1:30:39
  Speaker 2: kind of deteriorating, and he dominated the snaps. I want
• 1:30:42
  Speaker 2: to say he was like eighty percent of the snaps
• 1:30:44
  Speaker 2: in the playoffs. So I'm just surprised by and I
• 1:30:48
  Speaker 2: you know, not necessarily about the fantasy community because whatever.
• 1:30:50
  Speaker 2: But the Madden ratings had Travon Henderson ahead of Ramondra Stevenson.
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 2: Jeremy Fowler had Travon Henderson ahead of Ramandra Stevenson. Now
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 2: that with that being said, I did some number crunching
• 1:31:01
  Speaker 2: the other day on this because I've heard a lot
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 2: of takes about Travon Henderson and about how he needs
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 2: to be more consistent between the tackles and he needs
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 2: to cut down on the on the negative runs and
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 2: have more you know, basically, to use a baseball analogy,
• 1:31:16
  Speaker 2: people want him to mix in some more singles and
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 2: doubles with the home runs.
• 1:31:19
  Speaker 1: Right, So I looked this up.
• 1:31:22
  Speaker 2: Who do you think had few a lower percentage of
• 1:31:26
  Speaker 2: negative runs so runs for zero or negative yards last year,
• 1:31:31
  Speaker 2: Travon Henderson or Jamiir Gibbs. Jamiir Gibbs, the lower percentage
• 1:31:37
  Speaker 2: was Travon Henderson. So Travon Henderson was at about seventeen
• 1:31:42
  Speaker 2: two point two percent. Yeah, Jamiir Gibbs was over eighteen percent.
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 2: Now during the same ballpark, and I bring up Jamiir
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 2: Gibbs for obvious reasons, because.
• 1:31:51
  Speaker 1: That's the comp that's the comp. Now I'll give you.
• 1:31:54
  Speaker 2: Another one that I think is a similar player too,
• 1:31:56
  Speaker 2: Travon Henderson or Davon a Chan.
• 1:31:59
  Speaker 3: Lower percentage of negative. Uh well, I mean so it's Stevenson.
• 1:32:05
  Speaker 1: No Henderson. You mean is Henderson again?
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 3: I will So this is the one thing. He doesn't
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 3: have a lot of negative runs, but he has a
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 3: lot of zero He does a good job of getting
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 3: back to the line of scrimmage that's kind of hit.
• 1:32:16
  Speaker 2: So the point I'm trying to make is not necessarily
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 2: that he's like a better player than than Jamier Gibbs
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 2: or Devon a Chan. The point I'm trying to make
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 2: is more that that's just the style of running back
• 1:32:27
  Speaker 2: that these play. These guys are. Yeah, they are big
• 1:32:30
  Speaker 2: play backs. They are home run hitting backs. So if
• 1:32:33
  Speaker 2: you want the big plays, then it comes at the
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 2: expense of some not so big plays because they're dancing,
• 1:32:40
  Speaker 2: or they're bouncing out runs or whatever the case may be.
• 1:32:43
  Speaker 2: We don't watch Jamier Gibbs and h Chan on a
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: daily basis or weekly basis like we watch with Henderson.
• 1:32:50
  Speaker 2: Like I think that those guys have more of those,
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 2: you know, runs for like zero to negative yards, and
• 1:32:56
  Speaker 2: maybe people think because we see the highlights and we
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: see them go for the.
• 1:33:00
  Speaker 3: On a play to play base, you're gonna see more of.
• 1:33:01
  Speaker 1: It, right, So it's a it's an interesting thing. One
• 1:33:04
  Speaker 1: last one.
• 1:33:05
  Speaker 2: You know the answer it's already Henderson Henderson or Bresee
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 2: Hall Henderson, like all these guys that are like these
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 2: speedbacks that play like Trayvon Henderson. He was actually probably
• 1:33:16
  Speaker 2: the best at mitigating negative runs last year.
• 1:33:20
  Speaker 1: So it's just food for thought. Like I think, yeah, it's.
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 3: Just to me, it's more. Can some of those zero
• 1:33:25
  Speaker 3: yard runs become three yard runs? Sure, you don't want
• 1:33:28
  Speaker 3: to be able to stay ahead of schedule.
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm not saying you can't improve on it.
• 1:33:32
  Speaker 2: But I think the other thing that I would just
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: add to it if Trayvon Henderson adds this like consistent
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 2: efficient running between the tackles that everybody's looking for, where
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: he turns the one yard run into three instead of one,
• 1:33:48
  Speaker 2: or zero run into four instead of zero, and he
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 2: hits home runs and he's a factor in the passing game.
• 1:33:55
  Speaker 1: Well, you just described like one.
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 2: Of the best running backs in football, Right, so there
• 1:34:00
  Speaker 2: might be a chance that he's not a top five
• 1:34:02
  Speaker 2: running back in the league. You know, like you're talking
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 2: about making him into one of the best players in
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 2: the league at that position, right, it's a lofty, lofty goal.
• 1:34:10
  Speaker 3: It's a lot.
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, quick email here that I'm glad we got this
• 1:34:14
  Speaker 2: question because it's a it's one we should talk about.
• 1:34:18
  Speaker 1: I tuned in late, so sorry if you discussed this already.
• 1:34:21
  Speaker 2: But how about Jalen Polk because it's safe to say
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: that we are the worst head shrafting wide receivers. As
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 2: from David Man, what was your take on Jalen Polk retiring?
• 1:34:31
  Speaker 3: I mean, obviously, I hope everything's okay with him. Kind
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 3: of came out of nowhere. He'd been getting reps in
• 1:34:35
  Speaker 3: New Orleans, like it wasn't like he was buried. He'd
• 1:34:36
  Speaker 3: been repping with the second team. But that that whole draft,
• 1:34:40
  Speaker 3: which we kind of hyped up as being a not
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 3: terrible receiver draft, that whole second round not looking great.
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 1: Not good, Like Lad's a good player, even he.
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 3: Did not have a great gear last year, and he's
• 1:34:52
  Speaker 3: dealing with injuries and I'm gonna pull it up here,
• 1:34:54
  Speaker 3: hang on, So it was so the top group ended
• 1:34:58
  Speaker 3: up I think bearing out. Marvin Harrison's even struggled after
• 1:35:02
  Speaker 3: we were told you cannot take Marvin Harrison.
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 1: We'll see how much of that is just about that.
• 1:35:07
  Speaker 3: That might just be the cards. Yeah, but like him neighbors.
• 1:35:09
  Speaker 3: Obviously he's healthy, he's very good. Dunesa's a good player.
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 3: I was probably a little too high on him than
• 1:35:12
  Speaker 3: I should have been, but he's a good NFL player.
• 1:35:15
  Speaker 3: And obviously Brian Thomas is A is a good player
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 3: as well. Xavier Worthy's been He's a gadget player. I
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 3: guess we're kind of right about that. Ricky Piersoll can't
• 1:35:22
  Speaker 3: stay healthy, zavierly Get can't stay healthy, was struggling when
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 3: he was healthy. Kean Coleman has not been good. Lad
• 1:35:27
  Speaker 3: McConkie a good rookie or has fallen off. Jalen Polk retired,
• 1:35:30
  Speaker 3: Ady Mitchell. Can I call him a bust? Like we
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 3: were pretty high on.
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 1: Him, he's already gotten traded.
• 1:35:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Malachai Corley really nothing with him. Jermaine Burton, Roman Wilson,
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 3: Jalen McMillan. That was the top one hundred. Yeah, it's
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 3: not that you keep going like Tony Franklin has been great.
• 1:35:47
  Speaker 3: Javon Baker's out of the league. I don't think Tess
• 1:35:49
  Speaker 3: Walker's done much.
• 1:35:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so Franklin, I think has fallen out of favor.
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 2: And the reports are all advocating that the Broncos are
• 1:35:57
  Speaker 2: are featuring a lot more of Bryant. Yeah, Bryan with
• 1:36:01
  Speaker 2: Waddle and Courtland. And then did you mention Peter.
• 1:36:05
  Speaker 1: Sall, who's he's been hurt?
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 3: I did mention him.
• 1:36:07
  Speaker 1: Pearsall's out for the years, is.
• 1:36:09
  Speaker 3: Going to have his big comeback this year?
• 1:36:11
  Speaker 1: Is he still in the same guy that that was?
• 1:36:14
  Speaker 3: Bob means ball baby.
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 2: That run and I know everybody kind of gets above me.
• 1:36:18
  Speaker 2: Come back ends up on Lad McConkie. And Lad McConkie
• 1:36:20
  Speaker 2: was the right pick, don't get me wrong, Like he
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 2: was definitely the right pick, but.
• 1:36:24
  Speaker 3: Even Lad last the right pick was a tackle.
• 1:36:27
  Speaker 2: Maybe, but like in terms of you're gonna take a receiver,
• 1:36:30
  Speaker 2: the right pick was a tackle. If you were going
• 1:36:32
  Speaker 2: to take a receiver, yes, then they should have taken
• 1:36:34
  Speaker 2: mccon But if.
• 1:36:35
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna second guess it, just let me second guess
• 1:36:36
  Speaker 3: it all the way.
• 1:36:37
  Speaker 1: Well, uh, they it should have been.
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 3: Mc Johnny Wilson didn't do much. I'm trying to the
• 1:36:42
  Speaker 3: other guys be like, you know, actually is an okay
• 1:36:44
  Speaker 3: player for what he is, and he was a six
• 1:36:46
  Speaker 3: round pick. But credit obviously the Rams figured out they've
• 1:36:50
  Speaker 3: turned Jordan Whittington into a very useful player for them.
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 2: I mean that one is like, I like Jordan Wing.
• 1:36:55
  Speaker 2: He's kind of MATC Collins, Okay, I can see that. Yeah,
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 2: like he's uh to me, I guess he's more like
• 1:37:02
  Speaker 2: a he's a poor man's pooka nakua, like he's he's
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 2: dollar store pooka.
• 1:37:06
  Speaker 3: I was I was going to kind of comphim to
• 1:37:08
  Speaker 3: a little Jordan Humphrey. They use that size.
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 1: Well, that's a he's a really good ball carrier.
• 1:37:13
  Speaker 3: Though he's somewhere between little Jordan Humphrey and Mac Holmes
• 1:37:16
  Speaker 3: is where I put him.
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 2: Classic Rams receiver, good blocker, good with the ball in
• 1:37:19
  Speaker 2: his hands, tough over the middle of the field.
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 3: And you know he was buried on those Texas teams,
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 3: and they they still figured it out. And there was
• 1:37:27
  Speaker 3: one other name that oh uh to John Palmer now Patriot, Yeah,
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 3: also in that draft.
• 1:37:31
  Speaker 1: So but the the Pierce All.
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 2: Lad polk eight, Mitchell, run of that draft, mal Chai Corley.
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 1: Not good, not a good not a good group. Not
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 1: a good group. Besides, Lad, that's fine. Eldred's in North Carolina?
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 1: What's up? Eldridy?
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 10: Okay, all right, Evan Bart get ad Mitchell.
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 1: Okay, we gotta he ain't got.
• 1:37:58
  Speaker 10: A quarterback to throw to him. So yeah, he is
• 1:38:01
  Speaker 10: gonna fall and looks a look a little bad. If
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 10: we got him, he had made a throw too, and
• 1:38:04
  Speaker 10: that probably been a good tandem. But I just don't
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 10: like our receiver right now, what we're doing with Booty
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 10: and everybody else. You know, I'm like Bart, if you're
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 10: gonna trade him, trade him, I don't care what you
• 1:38:19
  Speaker 10: get for him. Trade him, you know, so everybody else
• 1:38:21
  Speaker 10: can move up, or you're gonna hold on to him
• 1:38:24
  Speaker 10: across of dobs. I don't think that's right because you
• 1:38:26
  Speaker 10: stump it, because you're stunting him for trying to make
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 10: this some money and stuff or whatever. If he can
• 1:38:31
  Speaker 10: be a two or three on another team. But like
• 1:38:34
  Speaker 10: I said before, I'm still gonna go and die and
• 1:38:37
  Speaker 10: living down the hill ad Mitchell, because I don't think
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 10: he got a quarterback now. Maybe with the Jets quarterback.
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 10: Now he might find him, but I'm not putting too
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 10: much about him either. So I think we're gonna go
• 1:38:49
  Speaker 10: like I said fourteen and three, and the offensive line.
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 10: You think Jered Willis is strong enough at the center
• 1:38:55
  Speaker 10: against a three hundred pounds nose tackle and I take
• 1:38:59
  Speaker 10: it off the air.
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 1: Thanks, Aldred.
• 1:39:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, I think that that's the one thing
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 2: about Jared Wilson, and just having some of the you know,
• 1:39:06
  Speaker 2: talks around the media, tend to people come up to
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: me to talk to me a lot about the offensive line.
• 1:39:12
  Speaker 2: I think that's the one concern that everybody has with
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 2: Jared Wilson. If you put a three and twenty five
• 1:39:18
  Speaker 2: pound nose tackle, you know, over him, is he going
• 1:39:21
  Speaker 2: to be able to be sturdy enough, be stout enough
• 1:39:24
  Speaker 2: in there. It's a fair question. I really like how
• 1:39:27
  Speaker 2: it looks at center for him. I think it's it's
• 1:39:29
  Speaker 2: clearly a better picture in terms of you know, Campbell
• 1:39:33
  Speaker 2: Vera Tucker Wilson. I like that a lot better the
• 1:39:36
  Speaker 2: way it fits. I think that he's really good at
• 1:39:39
  Speaker 2: getting up to the second level and getting out of
• 1:39:41
  Speaker 2: his stance in the run game, which can be really
• 1:39:44
  Speaker 2: useful and dynamic if it's done correctly at that position.
• 1:39:48
  Speaker 2: We're all going to have to wait and see on
• 1:39:50
  Speaker 2: whether or not he's going to have the sand to
• 1:39:52
  Speaker 2: you know, really anchor against some of those beer guys.
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: Now, i'd say.
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: League wide, you know, everybody plays, you know, with his shade,
• 1:39:59
  Speaker 2: but they're they're not necessarily Vince Wilfork's out there anymore,
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 2: you know, for the most part. Now Week one, Byron Murphy,
• 1:40:07
  Speaker 2: who's under undersize relatively speaking, is a hass like you
• 1:40:11
  Speaker 2: can't moving. Byron Murphy is tough. That's a big dude
• 1:40:16
  Speaker 2: in a strong guy. But most guys, i'd say league
• 1:40:19
  Speaker 2: wide play the most maybe three twenty, you know, you.
• 1:40:23
  Speaker 1: Don't see a lot of three thirty.
• 1:40:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, a lot of those.
• 1:40:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah. It just the past rush is too important. So
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: we'll see.
• 1:40:30
  Speaker 2: That's that's the for For Wilson, that's his big question
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 2: mark because is he gonna be able to handle those
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 2: big dudes and dig dout, you know, true noses and
• 1:40:37
  Speaker 2: things like that. Patty is an aguan.
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 1: What's up, Patty?
• 1:40:43
  Speaker 11: Hey, what's up? Guys?
• 1:40:44
  Speaker 3: Hey?
• 1:40:46
  Speaker 11: Yeah, I just wanted to throw this out there at you,
• 1:40:48
  Speaker 11: Evan and Well and Alex too. But I remember yesterday
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 11: when you were talking on to you towards the end
• 1:40:53
  Speaker 11: of the show about the Niners losing Ricky pearsall, don't
• 1:40:56
  Speaker 11: forget to Eldrick and my guy Chris Brazzle went down
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 11: and he's done for the year for the Panthers. And
• 1:41:04
  Speaker 11: did you see them possibly feeling foody to Carolina for
• 1:41:09
  Speaker 11: you know, like an early day three year, possibly a
• 1:41:12
  Speaker 11: Day two pick. And I'll take it up there, guys.
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 1: Thanks for the call, Patty.
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that that's not that you're hoping to trade anybody,
• 1:41:18
  Speaker 2: but the hope is that that market organically comes to fruition. Right.
• 1:41:23
  Speaker 2: The forty nine ers are in the market for a receiver,
• 1:41:25
  Speaker 2: the Carolina Panthers are in the market for a receiver.
• 1:41:29
  Speaker 2: Washington was in the market for a receiver. They just
• 1:41:31
  Speaker 2: signed Digs, So I don't know if that they're probably off,
• 1:41:33
  Speaker 2: they're probably off the list.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: But well, not that I'm wishing injuries on any other team.
• 1:41:39
  Speaker 3: Play together.
• 1:41:40
  Speaker 2: We do know that that's a pretty good top three McLaurin,
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 2: and I think you can make it work with all
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 2: three of those guys, Yeah you could.
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 1: I I'm not wishing injury upon any other team.
• 1:41:50
  Speaker 3: Right, But that's why it goes.
• 1:41:53
  Speaker 2: That's why you hold your water till the end of
• 1:41:55
  Speaker 2: training camp, right, You hope that that comes to fruition.
• 1:41:58
  Speaker 1: I mentioned the forty nine is just a possibility.
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 2: I know, we talked about that on the Crossover podcast
• 1:42:04
  Speaker 2: on CELNS as well.
• 1:42:06
  Speaker 1: Because of the pure.
• 1:42:07
  Speaker 2: Soul injury, they're bringing Deebo Samuel, who I think is
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 2: on his last leg. They're bringing him back to try
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 2: to add depth. Mike Evans has an injury, so we'll
• 1:42:16
  Speaker 2: see what happens there in San Francisco. I quickly was
• 1:42:20
  Speaker 2: very upset that Chris Brazl got hurt. That was a
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 2: tough blood socks. Yeah, that was a tough blow to
• 1:42:25
  Speaker 2: the take. He by all accounts, was having a really
• 1:42:29
  Speaker 2: good spring and a good start.
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 1: To training camp too. Yeah, and blew out his knee.
• 1:42:33
  Speaker 2: It's an LCL, not an ACL, but he's going to
• 1:42:36
  Speaker 2: be out for the season, So that one was a bummer.
• 1:42:38
  Speaker 2: I hated to see that. And the Panthers have had
• 1:42:42
  Speaker 2: a bunch of injuries. They've had a couple guys go
• 1:42:44
  Speaker 2: down for the year. So knock on wood at the
• 1:42:47
  Speaker 2: Patriots avoid all of those injuries. I think I'm gonna
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 2: call it so that the three of us can get
• 1:42:52
  Speaker 2: out of here before K pop really takes over this
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 2: building in about fifteen minutes. Tomorrow Patriots Unfiltered on to
• 1:43:00
  Speaker 2: three after practice. Should be a more competitive practice tomorrow
• 1:43:05
  Speaker 2: for the Patriots, so we'll break that down on Unfiltered tomorrow.
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 1: This show, Big Show.
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 2: Next week will be back at twelve to two on
• 1:43:12
  Speaker 2: the off day, but we'll have a joint practice to
• 1:43:15
  Speaker 2: break down against the Colts from Tuesday, and then we'll
• 1:43:18
  Speaker 2: also preview Thursday night's preseason opener against the Colts as well, so.
• 1:43:23
  Speaker 1: We'll get into games. Can you believe it? They're playing
• 1:43:25
  Speaker 1: a game next.
• 1:43:25
  Speaker 2: Week almost out of the dog is It's unbelievable that
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 2: we've moved this fast. But next week twelve to two
• 1:43:31
  Speaker 2: on Catch twenty two on Wednesday at its normal time,
• 1:43:33
  Speaker 2: recapping the joint practice against the Colts, previewing the preseason
• 1:43:37
  Speaker 2: opener Adam Vinteri Hall of Fame this weekend as well,
• 1:43:40
  Speaker 2: So a lot of the Patriots stuff going on in
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 2: the next couple of days.
• 1:43:43
  Speaker 1: We'll see you guys then. Thanks for watching.
• 1:43:47
  Speaker 3: Hey, this is Deuce. Thanks for tuning into the show.
• 1:43:50
  Speaker 3: If you really want to help us.
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 5: Make sure you like us wherever you get your podcasts,
• 1:43:53
  Speaker 5: like Apple Podcasts or Spotify, so make sure.
• 1:43:55
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• 1:43:57
  Speaker 3: to see this show and everything else that we do
• 1:43:59
  Speaker 3: here at the Pace Treats. Thanks a lot, MHM