Latest / Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves / 169: Rach Taylor - From Chasing Olympic Gold to Building a Life Beyond the Boat

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169: Rach Taylor - From Chasing Olympic Gold to Building a Life Beyond the Boat · Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: What started to emerge as your goal as you entered into the into the corporate world?
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think I entered into that world with like a end game like I want an Olympic gold medal.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't enter in there and think I'm going to be the chief paper officer of BHP bilitant.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_03: I I didn't walk in with a really clear end goal, the same way I had with the Olympics.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_03: But the characteristics in me that always strive, always, always keep pushing, work hard, if there's an opportunity, take it, make the most of it.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_03: Those characteristics meant that I could quickly progress in the career.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_03: And there was always, whilst I wasn't focused on being the partner of the firm, I was always aware of what the next step up was and I was I was going for it.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_03: I was making sure that I was performing at the top of my level so that I'd be ready for the next opportunity.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I think it became more like climbing that ladder rather than the top of the ladder itself, if that makes sense.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: Hi, I'm Ryan Godsalvers and welcome to the Second Wind Academy Podcast.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: A show all about career transition through the lens of elite athletes.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: Each week, I invite a guest to the show who shares their unique sporting story.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: Please join me to delve into the thoughts and actions of athletes through a series of conversations.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Don't worry, there's plenty to learn from those of you that aren't particularly sporty.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: Elite athletes are still people afterwards.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_00: Let's be inspired by the stories of others.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Rach, welcome to the show.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_03: Pleasure to be here, Ryan.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: Great.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_00: As we always have been chatting, we will continue to chat uh through this show, and now we're gonna let other people listen to it as well.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, that's right.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_03: What an insight they'll get.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, who knows what they'll walk away with.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: But we're gonna have fun, and that's probably the most important bit.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_03: Awesome.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_03: Look forward to it.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: So so look, for those who are watching and listening, just give us a give us the infomercial of you.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: Ooh, highlights real, highlights real.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_03: Um I am Rach Taylor, ex-Olympic rower from the olden days.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_03: That was back in the 2000s, and since have been um worn many hats, been a mother, uh HR corporate career, and then coaching business, which I'm currently in.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I guess there'll be a few of the elements there that you might want to dive into, Ryan, but that's probably the very, very short highlights reel.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: That is a good highlight reel, but we we will delve into each of those, I guess, different roles that you play and have played and throughout throughout your life.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so much more to come, even though you do say back in the olden days.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna say, no, the the 2000s weren't, they really weren't that long ago, were they, surely?
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_00: Come on.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think of them that long ago, although, man, a lot of water has passed under the bridge, mind the rowing pun.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_03: Since then, when I when I reflect back.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: But I think a lot has changed in sport, which is also a good thing in that time.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, it's still a very fresh memory for me.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_03: It was still a very significant moment in my life, that decade or so.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it is.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: And and look, I guess we'll chat a bit about what some of those highlights might have been as an athlete.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: But you did say today you are as a coach.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: So talk to me, what do you mean by being a coach?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, uh, so that's not not a sporting coach.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_03: I walked away from my human resource career about a year ago, year and a half ago, and decided to package up all of my experience, all of the capabilities that I've developed through being an athlete, through all of the major life transitions I've been through, through that corporate HR career.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_03: And coaching felt like the best way for me to start to pay it forward, to be of service, to almost build a legacy for myself.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_03: And what I do now in my coaching business is probably wearing multiple hats, but I think they merge really nicely.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_03: One is working with athletes in their transition to retirement, and the other is working with professionals and often mid-career to midlife professionals who are either feeling very stuck, burnt out, or themselves in some sort of transition.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_03: Often, though, will come to me with a career quandary and we'll work out underneath that there's there's often a well-being quandary going on.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_03: The coaching crossover really, where it really meets nicely, is there's obviously I have a very high performance background, but also a very commercial HR and business and career prowess that's really beneficial in both of those different niches.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_03: And that knowledge and experience is able to sort of cross-pollinate nicely across all of my client groups.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm I love, I love it.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_03: Love doing it.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's been a great move for me.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you you you mentioned there this cross-pollination across across the niches that that you've focused in on.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: What are the sort of similarities that you see from those mid-career professionals and perhaps athletes in transition?
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_03: Transition is the key word there.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_03: Let's just double-click on that.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: So that life after sport transition is quite radical.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I see this a lot with career clients, um, especially the more senior people get.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: If they're looking to transition to a new career, whether that's a new job or a new line of work, a new industry, that transition has a lot of parallels to the transition that athletes go through when they choose to retire.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_03: Senior career professionals seeking to make that move out of the workforce.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_03: That's a radical transition.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_03: And so working with clients in that space, I work with a lot of parents who are going through a transition where they're there've been working parents, working parents, and going through that hardcore adulthood squeeze.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_03: And now they're transitioning into a new phase of life.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_03: So there's constantly transitions going on, and that to me feels like the parallel.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: I I mean, I I hear it, and as as we talk, but as you know, I certainly believe in those parallels as well.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it is in that transition, in that transition moment where, well, actually, many of us could do with speaking with somebody else, be it a coach, be it someone counsellor in some instances, but just to bounce those ideas around.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: And you you said something about enjoying it.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know yet?
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um you said it's a year, but do you know yet what it is that you really enjoy about the coaching aspect?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I guess there's there is this element within me, like it's almost spiritual, like it honestly feels like a legacy and an act of service.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_03: So there's a real meaning and purpose, and we all need that, right?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone needs that.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_03: And I was no longer finding that in my HR career.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_03: I get a lot of that through being a parent, but I set I was seeking something to give me personally more meaning and purpose for the next phase of my life, the second mountain, or in this case probably my third or fourth.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: But that's a that's a very me-focused, you know, that fills my cup up.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_03: But I get no more joy than just working with a client who's feeling really stuck.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_03: And that's really common.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_03: Often people come to coaches because they just can't work out the next step forward or they know where they want to get to, but they are just feeling trapped.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_03: And being able to just help someone untangle where they're at and see the light, and then to see them moving forward.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's just the most awesome thing to help people with.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's beautiful.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: I love it.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_03: Feels great.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: Great.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I'm I'm interested then, I suppose going back, maybe just well, actually, no, going back, I'll say I'll I'll I'll change my mind.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna go right back to the beginning instead, and we'll come on to the corporate life.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: Because like you said, that second or third mountain, you've I'm interested in what that was like.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: But talk to me then a bit about sport for you growing up and what role did that play.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I grew up on a farm, and whilst I was never doing many organized sports, because we lived so far out of the town where you know you would go into organized sports, I was always very athletic.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_03: I was always out riding bikes, climbing haystacks, walking up mountains, very fit, very healthy.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_03: As at about the age 14, I was actually selected into a talent identification program, which uh were quite common in the sort of um, you know, late 90s, mid-90s in Australia.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_03: And that was just a physiological thing.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I was a group of sports scientists going around to schools in my district looking for tall teenagers who, through a series of tests, showed capability and a physiological alignment with the sport of rowing, which does usually require very tall, strong, athletic, larger people.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_03: And look, I just I just fell in love with it.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_03: I fell in love with it straight away.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_03: I absolutely loved it.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I loved the fact that as soon as I got in a boat, I was like, oh man, I'm really good at this.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's you know, you just you're you're talented and you you know it.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_03: It's like this feels kind of easy to me compared to what it looks like for everyone else.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_03: So there was that.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_03: But also, I was going to an all-girls school at the time.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_03: I got to hang out with boys at the rowing club, down at the rowing sheds, and that was just this huge social outlet, and I just loved it.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_03: I'm someone who's naturally very driven and very competitive, so I just had this outlet for that part of me.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_03: And then I guess as I got a little bit older, you know, I left uh finished year 12, which is the final year of schooling in Victoria.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_03: And the day afterwards I went on an aeroplane to Canber and, you know, packed my bags and uh really left home at the age of 17 and never looked back.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: I then travelled the world with rowing, you know, with my crewmates, my best mates, and did that for, you know, almost another decade.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_03: So I was living my best life and I I really did fall in love with it.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and it sounds like it was something that was really natural for you because rowing, you didn't you weren't doing rowing, but you were measured and weighed and things like that, and it seemed they believe you'd had a natural fit.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: So you say you had this competitive edge and it it felt natural.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: What when you think about your experience as a rower, what what do you look back and think were the moments that you enjoyed most?
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_03: Oh gee.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_03: It's not the competitive stuff.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_03: As much as I I loved racing, like I loved it.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like a part of me just comes to life in in that environment.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_03: But mostly what I loved was these memories I have now of just thinking back, you know, we go on tour in Europe for three months a year.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_03: This is almost before mobile phones, before internet.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_03: So we're sort of just in this bubble with a team of maybe 50 or 60, might be in a crew of two up to eight.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_03: And we would literally be training three to four times a day, all eating together, lying around at these beautiful lakes in Switzerland and rivers in Germany, and you know, just tanned and going and racing it with the best in the world and then going up to parties afterwards.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_03: It was friggin' awesome.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like I just, I just have such great memories of the time that we spent together traveling and racing and just doing exactly what we wanted as a as a group of people, all very connected with a very, very strong purpose and drive behind us.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_03: That's a very unique thing.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_03: I guess as you get older, you realise just how special and how unique that that t time in your life is and how lucky I was.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_00: And and and so what was that purpose for you?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_03: That purpose for me was winning an Olympic gold medal.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_03: There was there almost was no other purpose.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_03: Probably I can say now with it with it why it's head on my shoulders, to the detriment of every other aspect of my life, but it seemed like a fair trade at the time.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I I suppose asking, well, you just answered it there in some respects, which is there may be another things that you sacrificed but perhaps didn't seem like a sacrifice at the time.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: So when you look back and you say to the detriment of other aspects, perhaps, um, what were the types of things you look and think, well, I didn't get to do that?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_03: I don't necessarily think I didn't get to do that.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: I just think, ooh, there was some collateral damage because I didn't do that.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, certainly occasionally you'd miss out on people's birthday parties and even weddings and things like that because you'd be traveling, but I I still don't that I don't hold those at all.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_03: I certainly was a late starter when it came to any sort of progression at in a career, a professional career sense.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_03: That really started from 27 onwards for me.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_03: So a 10-year delay.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_03: So that's collateral damage from that bloody-minded focus that I had.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: I was willing to mortgage my future for the present at that time.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_03: And it really did seem like a fair trade.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: Would I do it differently?
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_03: I I think sport now supports athletes in some sports to be more proactive.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_03: But certainly, when I reflect right now, I think I think of that any sort of movement towards any sort of life outside of sport would have been really beneficial.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_03: I was not in an environment or culture, and I was not the sort of person who did that very well.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's one of the bits is your natural inclination is the competitive edge.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: You were handpicked to go into an environment where the the focus is to win that Olympic medal or have that Olympic success.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: What type of support was there to think outside of the game and what encouragement was there to do that?
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_03: There wasn't.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, this is this is back in the late 90s and early 2000s, the olden days, as I said, rowing is a very autocratic sport.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_03: It just it sort of operates almost military like in in many ways.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_03: It's top-down.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's a very high volume of training that you have to get through because of the endurance aspect.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's not very normal that you'd be training six hours a day plus hours of recovery and physio and whatever else.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_03: So it was a full-time job.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_03: The culture in the sport at the time was the way, you know, culture is is how we do things around here, right?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_03: It's not necessarily what's said or what's written on a piece of paper that's handed to you when you start your scholarship.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: But the culture was it was a it was an inconvenience if I was going to be late for training because of work or because of of uni.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_03: This was before online studies, so it was difficult to study.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_03: You did miss a lot of classes, but would also be gone for big chunks.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: So so it it was just, yeah, it was a difficult thing to do, and it wasn't encouraged, the culture did not encourage it.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, the culture encouraged us to be myopic.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_03: And I I got high on that Kool-Aid, no doubt about it.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_03: To some extent, I think for me to be at the level I got to, that was required.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: But I also now know my performance would have been enhanced had I been allowed or encouraged some space to develop other parts of me.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: And I know that now actually academically, not just through lived experience, that is actually in the research.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_03: So I probably was actually compromised as an athlete because of that myopic focus, which actually is a little bit disappointing to think about now.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_03: And that's where I think sports have gotten a little bit better, certainly some sports.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: Broadly, we've got better, and the evidence supports the fact that having athletes with more than just that myopic focus on being awesome at winning that particular race.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but having that diversity of thought and time certainly enhances them as a person.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: So if I was stepping to that side of you, take it back then, were you academically strong?
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: What did you have, you know, leaving school at 17, were you like, oh, I'm I'm going to uni, I'm doing the hardest subjects.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, where were you on that?
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_03: Good question.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_03: I was a very like BC sort of level student.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_03: I was obsessed with rowing from the age of 14.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_03: I called myself Rach the Rower.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_03: It was my identity.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_03: These are your teenage years where you're forming an identity.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_03: I formed one in concrete.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: It was Rach the Rower.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: School, the final years of school to me felt like a box ticking exercise until I could get out and go and row for Australia.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: And that's exactly what I did.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: I have been a great student as a mature age student, like always getting high distinctions.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: So as I've gone back academically, when I apply myself, I was suddenly like one of these gifted academics.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, no, I'm not.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_03: But I'm actually just ready to learn now.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm actually, I actually have experience in life that makes this learning relevant to me.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I wouldn't have said I was academic or academically focused leaving school.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_03: I was sport focused and it was already enmeshed in me from an identity perspective.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: So you coming into the rowing environments at rowing world, you had that focus of becoming an Olympian, taking a medal, and you, it sounds like you prioritised that above, certainly in this above any academic or other career activities.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: So in terms of achieving your purpose, how did it feel going to the Olympic?
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: And then how did it feel after the Olympics?
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I was just the right age and stage to luckily make the Sydney Olympic team.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: So what a what a gift to be able to compete in a home country.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_03: It was so it was so awesome.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_03: So yes, going into that 2000 Games, um, I was in a crew with a with one other partner.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_03: And we, you know, for the two years leading in, we were some of the favourites in that event.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_03: We were some of the fastest in the world.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_03: We'd sort of be meddling at all the different World Cup and World Championship regatters leading into.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_03: So we certainly went into Sydney uh with very, very high hopes.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, I had not considered anything other than winning that race in Sydney.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: That was my entire life, that was my entire life's work to that point.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_03: And uh my pair partner Kate had won a gold medal at the Atlanta Olympics in 1996.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_03: So she was coming in as a back-to-back, you know, trying to trying to win a double up.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_03: So there was a unique pressure on her, and because I was her new partner, I, you know, I inherited that pressure as well.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_03: It was a home Olympics.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_03: So in a sport like rowing, where we're not used to having spectators, we actually did.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: We actually had the media really watching us, and it was pretty cool.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_03: It was pretty cool.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, there was certainly heightened pressure and excitement, anticipation, and also heightened support.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_03: Like it was unbelievable the level of support we had.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_03: Sitting on the start line, we made it to the final of the Olympics, and you know, all all of my life's work had got me to that point just to be sitting there waiting for a green light go.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_03: We had a great race, but we can second.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: And I say, but we can second, I I was uh I'd love to say, and we won, and then everything went well.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_03: We crossed the finish line, and I've never heard such deafening cheers because we're Australian and there's you know about a one kilometer long grandstand on along the second half of the rowing course, just full of Australians.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_03: So crossing the finish line was a real melting pot of emotions because I was just so fucking relieved it was over, like that was the first feeling.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_03: But then it was just like this mad, like cauldron of crazy energy and excitement and and joy from the grandstand, from my family and all friends and everyone there.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_03: But then I was also really devastated by coming second, and that was such a weird thing to try and, you know, cognitively work through.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_03: Very quickly, I realized there was no place for that disappointment.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: I couldn't share that with anyone.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_03: That was just a private pity party I could have by myself.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, it was a pretty interesting time.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_03: And so the moment, you know, crossing the finish line with that mixed mixing pot of conflicting emotions, and then going immediately onto about a two-month circus of non-stop media and events and parties and you know, Parliament House dinners and ticket tape parades in all different cities, and it was like a circus, the best kind of circus.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_03: So I was in the perfect position to just party and drink my way through any neat negative emotions and just shelve them.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_03: When that all finally ended, did I fall in a heap?
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_03: Oh my god, yes, I fell in a heap.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_03: I fell in a very deep, dark hole.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_03: And that was physical, that was emotional, that was psychological.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_03: And I think I didn't have time to spend in that hole because then I had to get a life, right?
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_03: I had to get a bond and move back to Victoria.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_03: And I didn't have time to wallow there, but that's where I was.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: That's what it felt like.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_03: And I think I stayed in that hole for a very long time, maybe a year, but not really being able to be there.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_03: I had to just get on with it, get on with it.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: And it was a tough time, and I I think that's really normal uh for a lot of athletes that they will go through something like that with a very different flavour for each of them.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, after that peak performance and then that come down in many respects.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, like you say, for you, you go immediately on this Olympic circus because well, you've got a nation that's really crowded that's wow, your medal, this must be more.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_03: They were so happy for us.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_03: Everyone in my life just wanted to celebrate with with me, and they'd all been part of it.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_03: And it was so special, like to the primary school I went to, to random friends of my family, to you know, e everyone I'd ever touched or been a part of, or every community I'd ever been involved in wanted a piece of it.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_03: And it was awesome.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_03: That's so beautiful to be part of something so supportive in your home country.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_03: But the conflict is when deep, deep, deep down inside you're managing the fact that you feel like you failed and your whole identity was wrapped up in who what that outcome.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: So now you're, you know, you you haven't just failed, but you you are now not worthwhile.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: Or you know, there's a lot of psychological stuff that goes on there.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: During that period, that year or so, what where did you struggle the most?
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_03: That's a great question.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: I struggle I mean, because there was a lot of struggle.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_03: I was I on the outside, if you had met me that year, you would have thought I was doing fine.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_03: You would have been like, she's having a great time.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_03: But what probably one of the biggest things I struggled with and I didn't expect or was not prepared for was the complete loss of my my tribe, my people.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I'd left home at 17 farm in Ballarat and come back many, many, many years later to Victoria, which no longer felt like home.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_03: My home was my rowing boat, my crew, my teammates.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: It was a suitcase, it was a hotel room.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_03: So this like um shattering of any sort of base and any sort of belonging, that was very shocking.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I didn't ever imagine it would feel like that.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_03: But everyone who was close to me scattered back into their own lives and was going through their own version of this.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: And it would have been different perhaps if I'd had a very strong home base that I'd been encouraged to go back to and keep relationships with, but it wasn't the case.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_03: That it's not I was not part of a culture where we sort of had a lot of time to go back and nurture relationships or spend time doing that.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_03: And if I knowing what I know now, I would encourage any athlete to as best they can keep keep a home base of people, keep your supporters in your front row outside of your sport and keep that strong and pay attention to those relationships because that was really hard when that when that was gone.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_03: And I was re-establishing a home, a base, you know, somewhere to live, a friendship group, a support group.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_03: My family, you know, were on the farm.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_03: My brothers and sisters at that age were all traveling and living in different parts of the world.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: And also I just had no career.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_03: So I was starting from ground zero as a what other people would see as a really successful person, but only at holding an oar and making a boat go fast.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_03: So it was really, it honestly felt like clawing my way back from the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_03: It was literally like food, shelter, warmth for a while.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: Like it really was.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_03: Like I was really broke financially, like crawling up and then sort of like, all right, now what, now what?
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_03: But all of that, all of that sort of foundational stuff that we need as human, belonging, you know, safety, that that had been shattered very much so.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm I f it sounds dramatic when I'm saying it like that, but honestly, that that is kind of what happened.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's a it's a fabulous perspective, and your description of it is is wonderful.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's vivid, right?
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: It really brings it to life because what I hear as well is to be successful, certainly at the time, but the culture to be successful was to get that belonging and community within that sporting fraternity.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: And they I mean, I guess in some respects, uh that it was successful because it built a very strong Olympic rowing uh squad that did wonderfully well and ticked all of those boxes.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: The um what's the word?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: The the the downside or the negative effect was at the end of that releasing you back home, you you'd lost that connection, that connectivity with who you had been before the sport in some respects.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I think, you know, this this this parallel might be relevant in military settings as well.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_03: I can absolutely imagine with with a lot more complexity in in many ways, that one minute you're on tour in a very, very intense environment, and then the next minute you're just home and sent back to wherever your home is.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_03: I've seen it with uh, you know, partners at big four consulting firms, you know, they they're actually really supported in their transition to retirement, unlike athletes or the military.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_03: But um it's a it's like a hard stop, and then everything you belong to and forms your identity around, it just ends.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_03: And it ends like literally minute to minute.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_03: It was there, now it's not, it's gone.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_03: So it is like falling off a cliff in that regard.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_03: It seems weird that I found that shocking, but the other thing that's interesting about all of this is I I had not considered anything past the finish line.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_03: I had visualized a gold medal on that finish line, and I had not considered anything.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: And isn't that I just think, oh man, you are such a such a crazy young thing.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_03: But that was how intense my focus was.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: Everything after that was new territory, everything.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: There are too many stories of bankruptcies, mental health issues, and unfortunately two is time.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it's time for to act.
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: Every year, we see thousands of athletes that reach a point where they need to consider their life active.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: It might be at retirement, injury, or they need to juggle your careers between sport and a job.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: As a former English professional footballer, I have somehow managed to transition from sport, into banking, strategy, innovation, and now life coach, career practitioner, and founder of the Second Wind Academy.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to help those around me find their career secondwith.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: Find me on Insta or through my new Facebook group, Second Wind Academy, where I'd love to know your thoughts and suggestions.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Described it as clawing your way out of Maslow's hierarchy, which I I think is great.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: Uh uh description, it's not a terrible situation.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_00: Great description about about what you had to do.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: So let's talk about that a little bit.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: How did you do it?
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: What did you do next?
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I guess as as I said, that sort of circus lasted a little while.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_03: And then it almost felt like I spat out.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, okay, where am I?
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_03: Who am I?
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_03: What's going on?
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm I was literally like couch surfing with friends in Melbourne, which was not even where I'd lived before.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I just had all of my stuff everywhere in suitcases and boxes scattered all over the place.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: So it's at first it was necessity housing, you know, it was like shelter, literally.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, in this culture, you need money, like got to put some petrol in the car.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: I was about$3,000 in debt at the time.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: I think we we ended up getting about seven and a half grand from the government for winning silver, which might have got me to a point where I could pay a bond and um pay off my credit card.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_03: So I was definitely at ground zero financially.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_03: So it was it was first it was just necessity, like you need a job.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_03: You need to get a job.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_03: And that sucked because I w I I needed time, you know, ideally I would have had time to heal and like deal with what had happened, but I just immediately had to go into action mode.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_03: But look, the minute you start taking action, even if it is out of just desperation to get money to feed yourself and get a bond for a house and move forward just anyway, that started opening doors, you know, different doors started opening.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_03: And at this point, I had a a litany of a few uh failed attempts at university behind me.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_03: At some point I'd hoped I would go back and study, but I had no means to do that.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_03: Now, no, no means at all.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_03: I needed to be working because I needed money.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_03: I actually ended up walking to a recruitment firm in Melbourne and looking for some temp work because I just needed money.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I had a conversation with the recruiter, and she's like, Oh, you're our manager director would really want to meet you.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: Because I was literally this Olympic medalist that had just walked in off the street like two months after the Olympics, and she said this beautiful woman comes in who owns the firm.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_03: She was just really excited to meet an Olympian.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_03: But I ended up having a really great chat with her for about an hour.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_03: At the end of that chat, she goes, I want you to come work for me.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_03: I want you to come and work in recruitment.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: I'm going to teach you everything I know.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_03: I think you'd be brilliant.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm just like, okay, whatever.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_03: I'll give that a go.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_03: Like I was, you it's like just start taking action and then things start coming.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_03: And bizarrely, that period of time I did work in recruitment, and she did to true her word.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_03: She mentored me and coached me and taught me everything I needed to know about recruitment.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_03: I was then working face to face with human resource managers all over Melbourne as my clients.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I I'd I'd go in and visit them in their offices and I'd be like, I want your job.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it looks like a good job.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_03: I don't want to be doing this recruitment.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_03: I want that job.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: And that started me.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I started understanding HR as an industry, uh, working in one channel of it in recruitment.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_03: And that was the catalyst for me eventually to then go back and start studying and eventually walk away with a master's in human resource management and that kicked off another career path.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: Which which in itself is great.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm interested in that the moment, right?
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: This um the power of moments.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: And you walked in, I'll I'll say in the in a point of climbing out of Maslow's higher, climbing up Maslow's hierarchy.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think it was that your, you know, your mentor that the lady saw in you to think that you might be successful?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_03: So such a good question because I see this now so clearly.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_03: So she, this is someone who owns a recruitment firm.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_03: She's walked in and seen somebody who I I didn't, I wouldn't I wouldn't have been able to market myself at that point.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_03: But I was able to tell a story about who I was and what I'd just been through.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_03: And what she saw was somebody who evidence will tell you is a very hard worker who will commit to something and not just quit on it, who is a team player, who can operate in a team environment under pressure, under any sort of pressure.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_03: I have good communication skills.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_03: I think she could see that.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'd someone she could put in front of a client and it would, it would go okay.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_03: And she saw those attributes, even she would have seen more than that, but um, even just those alone, because of the evidence of where I'd just come from, this Olympic regatta walked away with a medal, that enough, that alone would have been enough for her to go, I could, I could mould this piece of clay.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_03: I could I could take these attributes and I can I could turn them into something.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_03: Those attributes I know now, having worked in HR for such a long time, they're not something that you can teach necessarily.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_03: Some people, it's it's a very difficult thing to teach.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_03: You can coach people to work harder, or you can but when you see someone that's coming and that they've got the evidence that runs it on the board, that they've proven themselves in another field, admittedly, you can make a pretty safe assumption that based on past behaviour and perfor performance, that that could apply with some with some work.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_03: So I think athletes, and it's it's very normal to not be able to understand your transferable skills.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_03: This is where working with a coach can be really helpful, actually.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'll just give myself a plug there.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_03: Because it's hard to see what you can't see, but I I see it so clearly now what those skills are.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_03: And each athlete has the generic ones, but then more niche ones as well that it that do transfer across and make them highly valuable employees in the workplace or entrepreneurs.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: Did it need someone to take a chance?
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_03: On me?
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_03: Look, I'm sure I would have found my way.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_03: I I think I would have found my way.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_03: But this is another thing.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: I at the time I was still in my head disappointed with this result.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_03: So I I wasn't proud of it, which is crazy.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_03: I am now.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: I've gotten over this, don't worry.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, you wouldn't be the first champion or first athlete who comes on the here and says, Yeah, I really didn't do very well.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_00: And even being a champion sometimes isn't enough.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, yeah, but I I didn't do it three years in a row, like so-and-so did.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, there's always something else.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_03: It's a mindset that's a superpower, but it can also be quite disabling that this this mindset that athletes have.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_03: I can see that now.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, she did take a chance on me, and that door was open to me because of that Olympic experience.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't think it was just the medal, it was the fact that I I was an Australian Olympian who'd just walked into her office.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_03: That was a door that opened to me, and I've had this happen a lot through my career.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_03: I've never gone out and like sold myself.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_03: I'm actually doing it for the first time ever in my coaching business.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_03: So sort of like positioning myself, saying, I actually am an athlete, I actually did win a medal, because it's really important expertise in that life after sports space.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_03: But I never did that through my career.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_03: However, when people found out that I had been at the Olympics, I was on the rowing team, I'd won a medal, certain doors opened, conversations were granted that otherwise wouldn't have been.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_03: And and this is stuff that that decade spent paddling around on lakes all over the world, developing a skill, moving a boat.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, I was accruing a lot of future opportunity that I could never have quantified at the time.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_03: And it continues to this day.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_03: It continues to this day.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's a beautiful thing.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I'll change, change sort of tact a little bit here and then talk.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm interested in this recruiter going into the HR offices, seeing HR, people in human resources, and thinking, ooh, I won't mind that job.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_00: That seems like fun.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: You had this clear definition of what success was as you were an athlete.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: You knew it was Olympics, you knew it was the podium.
• 34:41
  SPEAKER_00: As you then shifted into this world of this corporate world, what started to emerge as the pinnacle, or indeed, what started to emerge as your goal as you entered into the into the corporate world?
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think I entered into that world with like an end game like I want an Olympic gold medal.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't enter in there and think I'm going to be the chief paper officer of BHP biliton.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_03: I I didn't walk in with a really clear end goal, the same way I had with the Olympics.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_03: But the characteristics in me that always strive, always, always keep pushing, work hard, if there's an opportunity, take it, make the most of it.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_03: Those characteristics meant that I could quickly progress in the career.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: And there was always, whilst I wasn't focused on being the partner of the firm, I was always aware of what the next step up was and I was I was going for it.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_03: I was making sure that I was performing at the top of my level so that I'd I'd be ready for the next opportunity.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I think it became more like climbing that ladder rather than the top of the ladder itself, if that makes sense.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: You fell in love with the process of progress.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: Like we and we'll probably come to it, but as athletes, as we look back at what we enjoyed, it's not as you actually we started there, it's not necessarily the the winning itself, but it is going through that training and it's the people who we do it with, and that's that's what we fall in love with in many respects.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, absolutely.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_00: And and so then for you, you saw that top meaning as you went went back to university as a stellar student and going all the way through to to get to get a master's.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_00: Did you was there a need for academic validation for you in in that part of the career to help you move forward?
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_03: So there's a couple of things.
• 36:28
  SPEAKER_03: I personally wanted the validation.
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I personally was like, I need to do that.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_03: I need to do that.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_03: I I couldn't even put my finger on what it was, but I just felt like that was a box that I had not ticked in any way as an athlete.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I'd always said, look, I can do that later, I can do that later.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_03: And then when it was later, I was like, Rachel, you have to do this.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_03: But I really wanted to as well.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_03: And from a career perspective, I got halfway through my master's, and I was doing this at the time, not not only was I a mature age student, I also had babies.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_03: It was like a, it was crazy.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_03: It was a crazy time in my life.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_03: I was working part-time, I had little two little beautiful babies and studying, and I got halfway through, and I there was a point where I could have walked away with just a you know graduate diploma.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I remember talking to my um manager at the time I was working at Virgin Australia, and she's like, I was like, I just want to quit, it's just so hard, I can't.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_03: I just and she's like, just keep going, just finish the masters, like just do what it takes.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_03: And I listened to her advice, and we go, don't tell me that.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_03: I'm so glad I did, because I personally feel like I got a level of education that was elevated.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_03: And I feel like when I then wanted to keep moving through into more senior roles, then moved on into KPMG.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_03: I went into places where a master's degree is appreciated.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I and I think it it certainly adds a lot of credit in a professional sense.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_03: I I'm really glad I did it.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_03: And for me too, I'm really glad that I achieved that.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_03: It was really hard to do.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_03: It was one of the things I fought hardest for just because of the phase of life I was in.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, I'm proud that I did it.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_03: And I certainly I probably could have done the things I did in HR without it, but I I always felt like I had a really high level of education that I was able to apply it.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it was rewarded and and respected whenever I was trying to level up in my career.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was never away, it was not a waste of time.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_03: None of the education I have has ever been a waste of time.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_03: And my manager was right at Virgin Australia.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_03: I should have finished it and I did.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you know, there's this interesting it's interesting, isn't it, right?
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: So imagine you did your degree, you you fought and it was you were able to do the degree during your athletic career, right?
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: You you probably absorbed more, learnt more doing your degree later and then the masters when you had when it was aligned to that purpose, like, well, I'm doing this to be better in the room, to move me further forward in on this career path, right?
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_00: You're right.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_00: Hard thing between, oh sh you should do it, you should study earlier and get it done earlier versus doing it later.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_03: I agree.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_03: I agree.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_03: I would not have been a HD level student had I been rowing, and it would have been, like Rachel going through year 11 and 12, a box-ticking exercise until I could root.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_03: But it would have been hugely beneficial to be taking some steps towards and like even if I'd walked away with an almost completed arts degree that I'd just box ticked my way through, that could have been turned quickly into something else or a postgraduate.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_03: Anything I could have been doing, even working in a role that was mildly related to anything I wanted to do in the rest of my life.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_03: I there was no movement forward in that sense.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and I and I agree with you because I I do see the back, I mean I did I did my MBA, my master's as well, and it's about that capturing of knowledge and and skills and sometimes that confidence to move forward because you believe you've got it.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I think being able to capture that when you have a purpose is is even more important.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_00: But the bit that you really nailed as well is action.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_00: So you talk about taking action, and so whilst during the athletic career is take action towards what you enjoy doing, take action to those things because it will definitely repay later on.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_03: 100%.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_03: Any action is better than no action.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_03: And it will probably feel a little bit insignificant and like it's not even worth doing because it's only 10% of your focus.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_03: But I would say that 10% you know will compound and pay big dividends down the track.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_03: So anything you can do to move just move forward, just move forward will not be time wasted, not at all.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_00: So you ended up in a sector and in roles that you had not dreamed about as a child or it as a young, a young adult, right?
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess to some extent, the I guess the the part of me getting into the question is you were doing things that you didn't perhaps know existed as as an as an athlete.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I certainly remember walking down the streets in London under all of these banks, like loads of banks in London.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm thinking, what do they do in there?
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_00: And is it different to them?
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: And what goes on here?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: I I just I just don't get um what sorts of roles did you end up doing in in HR?
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_00: What did you start to to enjoy?
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_03: Um I did love, I did love working at Big Four Consulting Firm.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_03: I loved my time at KPMG.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_03: It was such a high-performing environment and such a fast-paced environment.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_03: It felt most similar to elite sport.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_03: People really wanting to achieve, really striving hard, really focused on moving up.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_03: That's also has its downside.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_03: So it's pretty intense and pretty folk.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_03: But I loved working, I loved working on employee engagement, I loved working, I loved working with remuneration.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_03: I loved working in the employee well-being space, anywhere where it was about optimizing the experience and optimizing the well-being and optimizing the performance.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_03: That was a parallel to my elite athlete days.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_03: And it felt like I was coming in even as a junior HR practitioner, I still had this lived experience, this decade of high performance, high performing teams, optimizing performance capability that transferred across.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_03: And that those were the areas of HR that really gravitated to, less so, you know, I was less interested in employment relations or policy and you know, process.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um I was very much visionary and wanting to redesign employee initiatives and how do we engage these people, how do we drive performance?
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_03: So there it was a great career in that sense, yeah.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so from that as your career, that been your uh you know, second wind as a as a starting point, when did you start to feel you were ready for something else?
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_03: Uh it happened slowly.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_03: And I think during COVID was when things shifted for me.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_03: The part of HI that I'd loved was on its knees.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_03: So the employees, you know, I was at KPMG at the time through all of COVID actually.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_03: I was with I was with a law firm at the end.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: But we were dealing with, you know, 10,000 employees all over Australia who were going through a pandemic, all suddenly working from home with kids running around in their houses.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I I I saw and heard situations that I just still find really distressing, like that our employees were going through at the time.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_03: It started to become really unfun for me.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_03: Like I it started to become a real grind.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_03: And, you know, in HR, you are the person who behind closed doors every day you are dealing with the fallout of anything that's going on in the workforce.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_03: And you're dealing with a human fallout, and it it really got pretty dark, you know.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't think that we've recovered from this either as a as a work culture.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I I started to really find it difficult.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_03: And at the same time, although I wasn't aware of it at the time because this is what happens with burnout, I was burning out myself.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_03: So I was starting to get cynical and negative, and I'd love this career, but I was, and it was because I was personally burning out, but I was so busy um managing other people who were in different states of crisis and mental health disrepair and burning out themselves, I hadn't had time to fit my own oxygen mask.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_03: So it all that's sort of how it started for me, and also there it got to a point towards the end of COVID where I was having to write and enact policies I I personally fundamentally didn't agree with, and it started becoming ethical for me.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_03: And it and I sort of ended up getting to a point where I'm like, I kind of disagree with the system of work at the moment and the effect it's having on humans, and I'm not feeling like I'm able to make a positive impact here anymore.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_03: Once I sort of had been through that existential questioning, then I was like, well, what the fuck are you gonna do?
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_03: Because this is what you've done all of your training in now, you you're you know, you're a senior manager here.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_03: What are you gonna do?
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_03: So there was a little bit of mental wandering in the wilderness to try and work that out, and I did land at coaching eventually, and that has been the right decision.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_03: But it was it's it was a bit of a process over two or three years.
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I g I guess and it is amazing because you you know you talk about COVID impacted well, all of us in in simple sense, right?
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_00: We're all impacted by COVID.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: But what you've described is it shifted, and I'd never thought about it in this way, but it shifted the environment.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: You were you thrived in an environment and COVID removed it, shifted it.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so suddenly you're you're operating in this world where it's like, well, actually, I'm this is this is not what I signed up for.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not enjoying it.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I've never, I guess, you know, I'm listening to you and I've thought, yeah, actually I've never thought about how COVID did that, which meant the burnout of COVID, but suddenly it's like, no, no, I enjoyed this meeting in this way.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: I enjoyed doing these certain things or the way we interacted, and poof, that's gone.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 46:02
  unknown: Yeah.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_03: And why am I not enjoying this anymore?
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like, well, everything's fundamentally changed.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I changed as well.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_03: I also changed, which we are always changing.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_03: So it became that I grew into a different version of me, and the workforce changed into a different version of it in the way we work, and I I no longer fitted into that box.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: And it would have taken less courage to just stay there and be miserable and just be a burnt-out old grumbly HR practitioner.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_03: Just you know, I I could have done that, but it's got to a point where I'm gonna destroy my soul.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_03: I think people do that a lot just because financial financially, you know, just because what else would I do?
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_03: Because it's fucking scary to change and go, I'm gonna start a business, I'm gonna make a massive leap sideways and do something totally different.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: And how?
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you saw you had someone take a chance and you well, again, rowing ended, boom, you know.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: Now this was ending and you could see, well, this is not where I thrive.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_00: So yes, you spoke about the courage it took it it takes to uh recognise a discomfort and then act on it again.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: So how did you take that next leap into coaching?
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_03: Well, first, first there was a process of getting my finances in order, actually, because I had to go deep into myself and go, all right, well, if you're actually going to leave this career behind, how are you gonna how are you gonna pay the bills?
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_03: Like, how are you gonna afford to live?
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_03: And that's I think that's the first question most people ask when they decide to pivot careers.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_03: And so before I'd even considered coaching, I had to take stock of where I was financially.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_03: And whilst I'd been working my whole one of the big things I'd done for the for the sort of 15 years, whilst I was working in HR and whilst we we had a family and little children, I was always renovating properties.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_03: I'd always been a property investor.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_03: And I always had this kind of nuance that my escape route eventually would be through property.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_03: It was not going to be through working hours.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_03: And so I had actually done quite a lot in that space.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_03: So in 2021, 2022, 2022, I actually worked with um some financial coaches and just really got into this zone of going, all right.
• 48:18
  SPEAKER_03: And I also went deep down the rabbit hole of just like learning everything I could about finances, personal finance, investing.
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_03: I what do I need to survive?
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_03: Where do I want to be?
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_03: What's the what's the plan here?
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_03: What can I do with these properties?
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I really got to a position where I'm like, okay, I can make a choice.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_03: I'm free to make a choice here.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_03: I have got a runway to start a business if that's what I want to do.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_03: Or I could do something else.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_03: But I I got to a point where I knew I I was going to be good.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_03: And all that work I'd done, all that hustling I'd done, renovating and flipping and selling properties, and I have Airbnbs now that I that I hold and I run still.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_03: That put me in a position to have that choice, or or just I still had the choice.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_03: It just gave me like the okay, you can do this, you can do this.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_00: You were able to take the next best action and you set that up with the work you did before.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_00: But listening to you, what I learned, what I realize is you you didn't actually, I'm gonna say you didn't take a leap, right?
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_00: There wasn't a leap, but it was it was a strategy, and therefore there was this series of actions that you lined up, you prioritized and you took properties in order, personal finances in order, you studied, you worked at how can you get that lower run of Maslow's hierarchy set so you're not dropping down below that by making a perhaps then what would have I don't know, would it have then seemed a s would it have been a selfish decision to say, I don't like this anymore, I quit and then let everything flow away to rubbish, right?
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_03: It could have felt pretty reckless.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I and it was scary.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_03: I'm a single woman, I co-parent my two children, but I I knew that I needed to have this sure.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_03: I needed to be sure.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_03: And um I knew, yeah, it it took a bit of work to sort of get to the point of going, I don't want to do this HR thing anymore.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_03: Damn, what the fuck am I gonna do?
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_03: Do I have enough money to to get through?
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_03: Am I gonna be able to be okay?
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: Could I, do I have to go and find another career and start working for someone else, or could I start my own thing?
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_03: Like it just it took a lot of work.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm so proud I did that work because actually, and this is a cool thing as well.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_03: Like, even just going through the the pain of being in a career I knew wasn't fitting for me anymore, that actually triggered me to get my finances in order and maybe I wouldn't have otherwise.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_03: I now know exactly where I'm at and know exactly like I just got my shit so sorted because I had to, it forced my hand.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_03: And I would not have gone down that path of just geeking out on personal finance and just understanding everything, getting really strategic about it, if I'd not been sitting in that pain of going, I can't keep doing this fucking job.
• 51:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we've we've clearly got a lot of personal finance books and methodologies to swap and talk about.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: It is something I've Yeah, I got I got all of them.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm certainly passionate about it.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_00: And uh in nearly everything that I do, whenever I'm whenever I'm working with a client, I I talk about the catastrophe plan or get into the that plan and it's like, right, let's get the finances in order, let's know what what it is that's going on.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_00: And even but you don't get that from necessarily just being a coach.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_00: You actually kind of need to know, now this is really important.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_00: This and this is why it's this is in in society for us.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_03: There's one one I one book I love and read, J.O.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_03: Collins, The Simple Path to Wealth, but he calls it fuck you money.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_03: And it and fuck you money is the idea that you could walk into the job that you hate and go, you know what, fuck you.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_03: I actually I know I'm gonna be okay.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_03: And it's it's not like some huge amount of money.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's just knowing how much it takes you to live, knowing you've got this much here, knowing you've got a runway, and actually having the freedom that I don't have to take this.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_03: I don't have to take this.
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_03: And he calls it F E money.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_03: I just think that's great.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a very liberating place to be if you can get yourself there.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it hits us straight in the head, doesn't it?
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_00: It just comes boom.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_00: I know what that I know what that's gonna feel like.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, how much do I need uh be able to walk into a boss or or or even turn around to a client as we now come in service orientation, think, do you know what?
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_00: It's not gonna work.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_00: I'm good, I can walk up.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_03: So Yeah, that's right.
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_00: So tell me about you you now, your business.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we opened up at the start where you're working across two niches which feels like they are, I guess, people who you've had experience with, be they athletes, but then also that so-called mid-career um or early stage career um uh professional as well.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_00: So how does your business work?
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_00: Who do you who do you work or who you're sort of working with?
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_03: First of all, I'll just say it just it just feels like such privilege, and I've created it for myself, but to be able to manage my own time, that's probably the best part about the whole thing.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's just like I am the master of my time.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm able to choose clients, projects, opportunities that are fully aligned with me on the deepest level.
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_03: And that is just awesome.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_03: So my coaching business I see as a mechanism for me to be of service.
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_03: I see it as a mechanism for me to have a legacy to use all of my powers for good.
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_03: That is literally how I see it.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_03: I have time to, I I have time, I have the capability to manage my time so that I'm able to prioritize what actually matters to me in life, which is my health and well-being, my family, my friends.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_03: And I have time to, without stress, manage my Airbnb properties and other investments.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I feel like I'm in a real genuine portfolio phase of life.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_03: And the coaching business, whilst it generates income, is not my income-generating thing, it is my meaning generating thing.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_03: And the financial side of it is through property and investment.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_03: That's how I'm surviving.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_03: So this business is just this beautiful thing I get to genuinely pay it forward with or through.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_03: And um I haven't had a client come to me up where I'm just like, oh, I don't think I could work with you.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_03: I think you tend to attract what you put out into the world.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I think I'm because I'm so authentic about my message and who I am, I'm not, I'm not trying to market myself as something in particular, I'm genuinely here in this space, genuinely here to be of service.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_03: It attracts the right people and opportunities.
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_03: The um most of my one-on-one clients are more in the career life coaching space.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_03: And this is only, you know, early stages for this business that I plan to be playing with for the rest of my time.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_03: But the um life after sports space has actually turned and evolved more into me using my voice, which I would not have predicted.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's been more telling my story.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_03: It's been more going and doing speaking engagements with current athletes, being more of an advocate and a um agitator, if you like, in that space for an agent for change.
• 55:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_00: Changing changing what?
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_03: What do you mean that changing I see it as a legacy of mine.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_03: I I want to change the system.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_03: I want to make sure that athletes are better accommodated.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_03: I want to make sure that there is more awareness of what happens for athletes as they transition to retirement.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_03: I want to make sure that current athletes and people in in control of programs with current athletes understand what they're doing and what the consequences of that are and understanding that they could be enhancing their current performance if they actually consider what goes on afterwards.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, it's a it's a really interesting place to be.
• 55:46
  SPEAKER_03: But I'll just keep rattling my cage until until I change my mind.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_03: To be here and just go, this is what I want to do, this is where I can be of service.
• 55:54
  SPEAKER_03: It feels pure.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_00: You say, and as you say, it's a privilege and it it's it's wonderful to see you thriving in that opportunity as well.
• 56:01
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, as I press you there about why and what is it you want to change, that's absolutely brilliant.
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_00: And the fact you can dedicate time to it is great.
• 56:11
  SPEAKER_00: What I think is also really worth uh just just stepping into a little bit is the fact that uh you're in this portfolio career, right?
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_00: And so often, especially as athletes, but so often as individuals, we feel I can only have one job, and that's how I spend my time.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's it.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_00: All the the meaning, the value, the financial, all of that has to come from one role.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_00: And what you've just described is actually, no, no, there is a there's a separation or between the financial vehicle and the the vehicle of meaning.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_03: Totally.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_03: And it's totally new territory for me.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_03: I mean it's only just landing on me now, going, oh, this is where I'm at.
• 56:54
  SPEAKER_03: This is what I do.
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_03: This coaching, like even when we before we got on this call, I was saying I'm just trying to cool my jets a bit with the coaching business because it was never designed to just consume me and be another full-time job.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_03: It was not.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_03: It's my vehicle for meaning.
• 57:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm now I'm seeing it more clearly and I'm ring fencing it.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_03: But what's beautiful is just putting myself out there with this intention has attracted other opportunities back to me.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_03: I've recently invested in an uh AIHR tech company that is all about enhancing and optimizing performance and well-being of the employees within organizations.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_03: And that would never have come to me if I wasn't in this space and listening to a podcast that the founder happened to be speaking on, who's an ex-Manchester United player, where I was just listening to his life after sport story, heard him talking about what he's doing now, and just went, oh my God, that is that's exactly why I walked away from HR.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_03: You're planning on building something to fix this.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um let me get involved.
• 57:54
  SPEAKER_03: So that when I say portfolio, I'm able to be open to opportunities like that.
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_03: And now I'm a strategic advisor in that startup as well as an investor.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just this is the portfolio.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_03: And it might it may grow further.
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_03: But I'm involved in that, in that organization, because I am so aligned with that purpose at solving the problem I walked away feeling disenfranchised about.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_03: So this is the beauty of, in some ways, this phase of life.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_03: It's but I also I do see younger, more a lot, a lot more younger people desiring and seeking out portfolio careers for themselves.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_03: And I think it's becoming more, I think it's becoming less common to just have one lane that you swim in.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so I think, you know, for example, my teenage children, when they go out into the world, I wouldn't be surprised if they're swimming in a couple of lanes.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_03: And I think this is going to be normalized.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_00: With you in terms of the normalization of the portfolio career.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, there are current studies based on those entering the workforce now or currently in the workforce.
• 58:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_00: The number of careers or sectors they'll work in, the number of roles they'll have.
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, after being a footballer, I've had 21 different roles.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: And and yet I feel I've been really loyal to all my employers, but I'm like, hold on, how about 21 different jobs and juggling different things at that same time?
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_00: And it it is important both for I think athletes retiring, but also those in more traditional workforce to s to come to terms with this fact that you might get paid in two or three different ways, and each one can give a sense of, like we said, value or meaning or financial security.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_00: Based on how we're educated, that's actually quite a difficult thing to accept.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I feel I'm doing a lot of work imprinting that message on my children because it's it's not being imprinted at school.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_03: Well, they're at a great school and it does encourage them to think broadly.
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_03: But I I'm saying to them, think of all the different things you could do.
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_03: Don't just think about what unit you go to and what job you get.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_03: You'd be a freaking awesome entrepreneur.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_03: Think of what problems you could solve.
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like and and think about what interests you have and where that can.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_03: where you can align that into a cause.
• 1:00:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like I think generally speaking, younger generations coming through are looking for careers that are better aligned with them and their values and who they are, much more so than say my parents' generation.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_03: That's now quite a thing and it's quite normalized.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_03: And I think we're going to see the workforce radically change over the next three to seven years where workers we know it won't be recognizable.
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_03: And we're all going to be in a very different position where we will be able to work in this way.
• 1:00:29
  SPEAKER_03: We will have more opportunity to work in this way.
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_03: And if you can start dialing your mind into that sort of thinking now rather than thinking who will I work for, what will I do for them?
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_03: How I'm going to make money for my employer, like think differently.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_03: Think broadly.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm really pleased I always thought I don't think I'm going to ever make enough money to like do anything with just a you know P A Y G job.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_03: I just sort of knew that.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_03: I was like especially starting late starting at 27 on a shit salary.
• 1:00:58
  SPEAKER_03: I was like everyone else is already 10 years ahead like I need something else which is why I started reading the property investor magazine when I was back in my 20s like I need another plan.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_03: I need another plan.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_03: Had I not taken that course of action this would be a very different conversation right now.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes it would so tell me then athletes coming through their careers today what advice would you give to them about you know with regards thinking how they should live their life or what should they be thinking about from a career transition perspective from a life after sport angle?
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah so there's a few things and this is not just my opinion this is research based I'd I'd absolutely be like I've mentioned earlier in this podcast um focusing on who's in your front row outside of sport.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_03: So so who where where is that home base for you?
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_03: Where is home and who are those people that are going to cheer you on no matter what outside of sport.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_03: Only has to be let's call it five one handful in you know really put some time and effort into those relationships have your social support network outside of sport established and give a shit about it.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_03: That is really important.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_03: That that will shield you when things go wrong when you get injured and you are retired when you don't make the team that is what will shield you.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_03: It's not going to be your teammates at that point when you are critically injured or deselected or delisted.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_03: It's those people so don't don't just ignore that.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_03: And if you're if you're in a sporting environment where it's not encouraged you have to take some responsibility for that and it is a shield.
• 1:02:33
  SPEAKER_03: I'd see it like a shield.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_03: The other thing is your identity so whilst I was Rach the rower and it was completely enmeshed in my athlete identity that was that was a a liability for me after sport because I had to start from ground zero and actually work out who the hell I even was if I wasn't Rach the Rower because she just disappeared.
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_03: Be curious about other things you're interested in and actually follow them up like my son's Bazali really good at rowing at the moment he's nearly 17 and he's a great surfer he's a great snowbotter he's got heaps of great mates and I'm like keep doing all of those things like keep keep surfing keep your mates back in Perth like keep keep your interest in all the things that you love keep going to seed bands keep learning to play the cat guitar keep you know seeing yourself as more than just a rower or a footballer.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_03: So that doesn't have to be some sophisticated thing it's just that I I wear multiple hats.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not just Rach the rower I'm also these other things.
• 1:03:31
  SPEAKER_03: And then as I said before one of the biggest things it was not just it is it is the single biggest factor that will determine the level of success you have in retirement that is that the level of planning that you've done level of pre-planning so again that doesn't have to be some huge sophisticated five year plan.
• 1:03:47
  SPEAKER_03: It just needs to be I've got a bit of a vision where I'm going I I've got it I've got some steps I am taking this small I'm turning a dial on a few things to move me forward just a tiny little bit.
• 1:03:57
  SPEAKER_03: Any time that I have where there's a little space I'm doing something towards that end game.
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_03: And don't think you're going to have it all worked out because you won't like you you and I said we didn't even know what these jobs were that we ended up doing.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_03: Like I didn't even know they existed.
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_03: But any steps you can take towards creating a bit of a plan or a bit of a vision even if it's having a fucking Pinterest board with where you'd like to be and who you'd like to be with and what your life is going to look like that is enough for me.
• 1:04:24
  SPEAKER_03: And then start taking the little steps toward making that a reality just tiny ones.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_03: So those are the big ones those are the big ones that the research will tell us also are significant in shielding you from a sh a sudden impact retirement and also shielding you from what actually on average takes about two years for any athlete to successfully transition out of sport.
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah that's what I'd be doing differently if I knew where I know now.
• 1:04:55
  SPEAKER_00: Wonderful uh Rach, I've got to say thank you for the chat yeah quite simply but you know bringing your perspective to career transition but also sharing your story.
• 1:05:05
  SPEAKER_00: People are going to be listening and watching the show.
• 1:05:07
  SPEAKER_00: They're going to probably want to reach out and uh follow your journey what is where can they find you what's a a good way to get in touch?
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_03: You can hit me up at rachtorcoaching.com and I'm also on LinkedIn rach taylor.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_03: So they're the two places you'll find me and um I'd love to have a virtual coffee with anyone who's interested in having a chat.
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_03: And um yeah the everything I sort of do is on the website all the different hats I wear and the different services um that I provide.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah as I said like I I'm very much here of service.
• 1:05:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I really am genuine in in saying that if people just want to reach out and have a chat, have coffee, I'm always open to it.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_00: Wonderful.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_00: Rach, thanks again for your time today.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_03: You are welcome.
• 1:05:48
  SPEAKER_03: It's been a great chat.
• 1:05:49
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks Ryan Thank you for listening to the Second Win podcast.
• 1:05:53
  SPEAKER_00: We hope you enjoyed hearing insights from today's athlete on transitioning out of competitive careers.
• 1:05:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you're looking for career clarity for your next step make sure you check out secondwin.io for more information or to book a consultation with me.
• 1:06:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'd like to thank Claire from Betty Book Design, Nancy from Savvy Podcast Solutions and Cerise from Copying Content by Lola for their help in putting this podcast together.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's all from me take it easy until next time