Latest / Hangin' Out with Bob / A super fan since the early Seventies: Scott Black and his trips to the Minnesota boys’ state prep basketball tournament

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A super fan since the early Seventies: Scott Black and his trips to the Minnesota boys’ state prep basketball tournament · Hangin' Out with Bob

0:06
OK, hello and welcome to Hanging Out with Bob,
0:10
podcast hosted by me, Bob Edholm. Thanks for
0:16
joining us. Let's get started. Well, as most
0:21
of our listeners know by now, I'm from Minnesota.
0:23
You betcha. Except for three years in the mid
0:25
-1970s, when I worked as sports editor for a
0:28
newspaper in Decorah, Iowa, I've lived in Minnesota,
0:31
specifically in the Twin Cities all my life.
0:34
So I'd like to think I know a little bit about
0:36
some of the state's traditions and annual events,
0:39
like the Minnesota State Fair. This 12 -day great
0:42
Minnesota get -together is one of the largest
0:45
state fairs in the country. Where, as one writer
0:47
described it, healthy eating dreams are drowned
0:50
in batter and deep -fried goodness. Or the St.
0:54
Paul Winter Carnival, a 10 -day festival where
0:57
some Minnesotans proved that they not only survived,
1:00
but mastered the art of living in sub -zero temperatures.
1:05
Or every season for the Minnesota Vikings. The
1:10
team is rarely bad bad, but it's a tradition
1:13
that every year in their 65 -year history, the
1:16
Vikings break their crazy loyal fans' hearts.
1:18
Like the guys on a local podcast called Purple
1:21
Daily say all the time, we just want the Minnesota
1:24
Vikings to win a Super Bowl before we die. But
1:27
if we're going to talk about Minnesota traditions,
1:30
we need to include the state's high school sports
1:32
tournaments. According to the Minnesota State
1:35
High School League website, there are 46 different
1:38
activities with state tournaments. But in this
1:41
podcast episode, we're going to talk about the
1:43
Minnesota Boys State High School basketball tournament.
1:46
It's Minnesota's oldest state high school tournament,
1:49
which began as an invitational in March of 1913
1:52
and was later sanctioned by the Minnesota State
1:55
High School League. And here to talk about the
1:58
Minnesota Boys State High School Basketball Tournament
2:00
is Scott Black, a friend of mine who, like me,
2:03
grew up in Columbia Heights, Minnesota, the Heights.
2:07
And speaking of traditions, well, Scott has been
2:09
attending the Boys State High School Basketball
2:12
Tournament since 1972. Wow. Scotty, welcome to
2:16
hanging out with Bob. Thank you, Robert. It's
2:22
nice to be here. Just a little background on
2:25
Scott. He and I have known each other for some
2:27
40 plus years. We played some softball and basketball
2:30
together back in the 1980s. In the mid 1970s,
2:34
when Scott was a student at Columbia Heights
2:36
High School, home of the Highlanders, he was
2:39
a starter on the varsity basketball team in his
2:41
senior year, one of the two wings. and either
2:44
the first or second player off the bench in his
2:46
junior year. Scott was named honorable mention
2:49
to the All -North Suburban Conference Squad in
2:51
his senior year. And also in Scott's senior year,
2:55
the Highlanders won the North Suburban Conference.
2:57
They were the second seed in the regional playoffs.
3:00
They were upset by Minneapolis North in the regional
3:03
semifinals, but then in the regional finals,
3:05
North upset another team, number one seeded Minneapolis
3:08
Central, which had been rated number one in the
3:11
state all year in 1976. I mean, at the Central,
3:15
didn't Prince graduate from Central High School
3:17
around that time? Prince did graduate from Central
3:20
High School. In fact, I played against Prince
3:23
in a tournament. He played for Bryant Junior
3:27
High. And we played Prince at Totino Grace. And
3:33
I don't remember a lot of the specifics, but
3:35
of course, I posted him up because he was only
3:38
like five, five foot five. And his cousin, I
3:42
think his cousin on that central team was a guy
3:46
named Dwayne Nelson, who was a starting guard.
3:49
And I believe that Dwayne Nelson was Prince's
3:52
cousin. Oh, wow. Interesting. Well, anyway, Scott
3:55
also played basketball for a year at Hamlin University
3:58
in St. Paul, where he graduated in 1980. Scott
4:01
retired from mortgage banking in August of 2022,
4:05
after 37 years in the industry. He and his wife
4:08
Terry live in Fridley. But it's a part of Fridley
4:11
that's in the Columbia Heights School District.
4:13
In other words, Scott's mailing address may be
4:15
Fridley, but you're still a Heights guy, right,
4:17
Scott? Oh, yeah. Through and through, Bob. Scott
4:20
and Terry have two grown children, a son, Scott
4:23
II, and a daughter, Nicole. And Nicole has two
4:27
children, a son, Calvin, and a daughter, Lucy.
4:29
It's great being a grandparent, isn't it, Scott?
4:31
Oh, it sure is. Makes life worthwhile. It really
4:34
does. Now for this podcast, we're covering a
4:38
period of 50 plus years of boys state high school
4:41
basketball tournaments. We can't talk about each
4:44
and every game that was played in each and every
4:46
tournament. This isn't going to be a 10 part
4:48
Ken Burns type documentary. Not that there's
4:52
anything wrong with Ken Burns or his documentaries.
4:54
That said, we will mention the teams that won
4:57
state championships since 1972 because winning
5:00
any state championship is a big deal, especially
5:02
if you went to high school that hasn't won one.
5:05
And we will talk about some of the notable players
5:07
from those tournaments, many of whom went on
5:09
to star in college and some even in the pros.
5:12
And what we really want to do in this podcast
5:14
episode is let Scott share his thoughts and memories
5:17
from the many boys' state high school tournaments
5:19
he's attended from the 1970s to the 2020s. After
5:24
all, this tournament itself has really evolved
5:26
since the 1970s. For more than two decades, starting
5:30
in 1971, there were two classes, A and AA. based
5:34
on enrollment size of the schools. Then in the
5:37
mid -1990s, the tournament expanded to four classes,
5:41
1A, 2A, 3A, and 4A, again based on enrollment
5:44
size at the schools. Even the rules of the game
5:47
itself have changed over the decades, right Scott?
5:50
For sure. Like in the 70s, there was no three
5:52
-point shooting line. What were some other things
5:54
you didn't have back then? You couldn't even
5:56
dunk, could you? I mean, I couldn't anyway, but
5:59
I mean, wasn't that... I don't think so, and
6:02
so few... kids could dunk back then. And now
6:05
it seems like most of the roster on these teams
6:08
can dunk. And the venues have changed. It hasn't
6:10
always been in one place over the last 50 years.
6:13
And even the uniform styles have changed. I mean,
6:15
the shorts the guys wear now, they were like
6:18
really short shorts back then. The knee -high
6:21
socks. The knee -high socks. We wore double wristbands
6:25
when we played. I guess style was very important
6:29
to us. And I remember Scott... Back then, even
6:34
in the 70s, the Converse Chuck Taylor All -Stars
6:36
were the basketball shoe of choice, because the
6:38
NBA even used them. That was the shoe. For sure.
6:41
And it's funny, because those Converse, if you
6:43
try on those Converse now, they give you zero
6:46
support. So everyone would wear two pairs of
6:49
socks, because otherwise you'd get blisters.
6:52
In our junior year, we decided tennis shoes were
6:55
in their infancy, so we wore Pro -Keds. for our
6:59
junior year. Well, each shoe weighed like 20
7:01
pounds. So we went back to converse our senior
7:07
year. But it's funny now because nowadays, the
7:10
Chuck Taylor All -Stars are the shoe of choice
7:12
for people like Lady Gaga. The shoes have come
7:16
a long way. Yes. All right. So Scott, let's talk
7:19
about your tradition of attending the Minnesota
7:21
Boys State High School Tournament. First, Scott,
7:26
how did the tradition even start? I mean, when
7:29
did you go? Who'd you go with? Well, I went...
7:32
Originally with my father back in again back
7:35
in 1972 and how how I got into sports my dad
7:40
loved sports just like I did just like my kids
7:44
do and He's from a town out west about a hundred
7:48
hundred miles west called Renville and my mother
7:51
is from the town next door Danube and And I'll
7:55
mention those towns in relationship to basketball
7:58
as we go along here, but in my grandfather was
8:02
also into sports. He was in education for his
8:05
whole career. He ended his last few schools he
8:09
was at, he was a superintendent. He was a superintendent
8:12
at Daniel when my mother was in high school there,
8:15
and he ended his career. He was a superintendent
8:18
in a town called Renshaw, which is up by Duluth.
8:22
In fact, they named the football field after
8:24
him, KB Knudsen. field. So he initially started
8:29
as a teacher and a coach and he took a team to
8:33
the state tournament in 1937 called Trimont and
8:37
I guess it was two towns, Triumph and Montgomery.
8:42
And Rumor has it, I don't know if it's a whole
8:44
wives tale, but he was so excited and just into
8:48
going to the state tournament that he forgot
8:50
my grandma. He had to go back and pick her up.
8:54
So anyway, and then my dad he has there's some
8:57
history there. He taught and well initially He
9:00
was a teacher and a coach in some small towns
9:03
He'd coach football basketball baseball and teach
9:06
five different schools At a school and his compensation
9:10
was like $3 ,000. Well one of his last jobs before
9:15
he started his career He went to work for IBM
9:18
in that probably in about 1960 and that's where
9:21
he worked for 25 years and in sales But he taught
9:25
at Duluth Central High School. And we lived there
9:29
from the time I was probably two till the time
9:31
we moved to Heights in in 63. And he was the
9:36
assistant under Jim Hastings. Jim Hastings is
9:39
a Hall of Fame coach. And Jim took. In fact,
9:44
shortly after my dad left, he took a team in
9:48
1961 with Terry Kunzey. They were undefeated
9:52
and they won. the state tournament but but my
9:55
dad left prior just prior to that so anyway and
9:58
then my dad uh I think he went to state tournaments
10:01
I'm pretty sure you know in the 60s he had a
10:03
group of guys that he went with and again I don't
10:05
know why we waited till 1972 but that was the
10:08
first year that I went oh wow that's cool that's
10:12
cool and it's been going for you ever since yes
10:14
yes Um, just to back up for a moment, just to
10:17
kind of put this on perspective, the Minnesota
10:19
boys state high school basketball tournament,
10:21
it was just one class, regardless of the schools
10:24
and Roman size from 1913 to 1970. Now for this
10:29
podcast, while I could divide it strictly by
10:31
decades, you know, seventies, eighties, nineties,
10:34
and so on. I want to set it up this way. First
10:36
segment. I just want to talk about 1972. Cause
10:38
that was your first once you ever attended. The
10:42
next segment will be the years 1973, 74, and
10:46
75. Those are the last three years that the tournament
10:50
held playoff games on Monday following the Saturday
10:53
championship games between the A and AA champs.
10:56
The next one will be 1976 through 1979, just
11:00
to round out the 70s. The next segment will be
11:03
the 80s, 1980 through 1989. Next, 1990 through
11:08
1994. They were the first five years of the last
11:11
decade of the 20th century, sure, but they were
11:13
also the last five tournaments with just Class
11:16
A and Class AA championships. The next segment
11:20
will be 1995 and 1996. These were the two years
11:24
when a Sweet 16 format was used. They took the
11:27
eight Class A schools and eight Class AA schools,
11:31
but all placed them in the same bracket. Next
11:33
one will be 97, 98, and 99. Those are the last
11:37
three years of the 20th century, of course, but
11:38
also the first three years of the current format
11:40
of the four classes, 1A, 2A, 3A, and 4A. And
11:44
the next segment will be 2000 through 2009. This
11:48
is the first decade of the 21st century, the
11:50
new millennium, the aughts. Next will be 2010
11:54
through 2019. The 2010s, in other words. It was
11:58
also the decade when more people, well, at least
12:00
me, started using the faster to say 20 instead
12:03
of 2000 to say the current year. For example,
12:07
2010 versus 2010. Although I still hear some
12:10
people say 2000 in front of the year, as in 2025
12:14
to each their own, I guess. And finally, the
12:17
2020s, the turbulent 20s of the current decade.
12:23
OK, Scott, let's go back to 1972. the year you
12:26
attended your first Minnesota Boys State High
12:29
School Basketball Tournament. It was held at
12:35
Williams Arena, the barn, on the campus of the
12:38
University of Minnesota. So, Scott, you would
12:40
have been, what, 14 years old then? Yes. Okay.
12:44
It was the second year of the two -class tournament,
12:47
Class A and Double A. When I went to the Starship
12:50
Union archives online, In that 1972 tournament,
12:53
the first round of class A games were played
12:55
like on a Wednesday. And then the A games, first
12:58
round games, were played on a Thursday. So the
13:01
double A team is taking like a day off. Then
13:03
Friday they played the semifinal games. And then
13:07
on Saturday, they played the championship games.
13:10
The A was first, and the double A was second,
13:14
as I recall. And then on Monday, they played
13:15
the playoff game, they called it. How many of
13:18
those games did you actually attend then in 72,
13:20
that first time? Do you remember which days you
13:22
went? You know, I only think that we would go
13:25
to the quarterfinals, so we could see. All the
13:32
18's? Yes. Or the 18's in the AA, yes. Right,
13:37
right. And so we would go to Williams Arena,
13:40
they'd have a session in the afternoon, and then
13:43
we'd go have dinner somewhere around by Williams
13:47
Arena, and then we'd come back for the evening
13:50
session. Ah, so you had a full day then. It was
13:52
a full day. Yeah, yeah. Father -son stuff, it
13:55
was great. Yeah, no, great, okay. What do you
13:57
remember about the atmosphere? Were these pretty
14:01
good crowds? I mean, were they pretty filled?
14:03
Was Williams and Reed pretty filled? Or was it
14:05
sort of filled? You know, that's a good question,
14:08
Bob. You'd probably have to go back to the tenants
14:10
back then. I know, you know, back in the day,
14:14
you know, in the 60s, they would sell it out.
14:16
They'd have almost 19 ,000 people. But I think
14:20
the crowds were decent. Yeah, yeah. I saw somewhere
14:24
that the tickets. for both students adults were
14:27
like one dollar and two dollars and 50 cents
14:30
but that was 1972 after all exactly and i have
14:34
a program and i don't it's it's you can't see
14:36
it's probably the program was probably 50 cents
14:39
okay all right for the record in the class a
14:43
final saint james beat melrose 57 to 55 on a
14:47
40 -foot shot taken by Remember his name? Jeff
14:50
Nestler. Yes. Banged off the backboard and dropped
14:53
through the basket at the final horn. In the
14:56
Class AA final, Moundsview, led by Mark Landsberger's
15:00
24 points and 15 rebounds, beat Austin 62 to
15:04
54. And then in the playoff game, that following
15:07
Monday, St. James got an early lead and subsequently
15:11
stopped Moundsview 60 -52 to finish the season
15:14
unbeaten at 29 -0. Nestler scored 22 points for
15:18
St. James to lead all scorers. And St. James
15:20
forced Moundsview to commit 21 turnovers in the
15:24
game. So that made a difference. And Landsberg,
15:26
I'd forgotten this. I remember the year, but
15:27
I forgot that he had actually sprained his ankle
15:29
in the championship game. And so he probably
15:32
wasn't a hundred percent, but he did still finish
15:34
with with 17 points and 19 rebounds, and he was
15:38
a player. He was a player. I'm sorry, so did
15:40
you see? Either of those games on the Saturday
15:43
or the following Monday. Remember? Or was it
15:45
just a quarterfinal? I believe it was just a
15:47
quarterfinal. But I'm not certain. Right. Well,
15:50
you saw them at least, right? I did see them.
15:52
You know, Mark Oberding was a sophomore. Yes.
15:55
Landsberger was a junior. I have to do a shout
15:58
out to Renville, my dad's hometown, was in the
16:03
state tournament. And there were four Mulder
16:07
boys. Three that were brothers. And one was a
16:12
cousin. And they, in Renville back then, had
16:14
a run for probably three, four years where they
16:17
were really good. You'll have schools that will
16:19
have good runs. And then you won't hear from
16:22
them for a long time. But in kind of a side to
16:25
that, Marco, I went to basketball camp at Gustavus.
16:29
It was Bill Musselman basketball camp. And I
16:31
went when I was probably... 7th or 8th grade.
16:35
So, Oberding would have been maybe a sophomore
16:38
or junior. He graduated in 74. Oh, in 74. Yeah.
16:42
So, and he was my camp counselor. So, in the
16:45
morning, we were in bed and he'd come to the...
16:48
boom, boom, boom on the door. And, you know,
16:52
Mark Oberding, some say, I looked up, you know,
16:56
they've had Mr. Basketball since, I think, 1975.
17:00
And they, and someone did a hypothetical who
17:02
would be Mr. Basketball if they had Mr. Basketball
17:06
back then. And I think hands down, when he was
17:09
a senior, he would have been Mr. Basketball.
17:11
He was something. He was something. Yep. Yep.
17:13
And then, Did you ever play against Landsberger?
17:16
Was he too much older than you? No, I played
17:18
against his brother, Paul Landsberger. I graduated
17:23
in 1976, and Paul graduated in 1975. And Paul
17:27
was a very, very good player. Was he tall as
17:29
well? He was about 6 '5". I think he might have
17:32
been the MVP of the conference. He played at
17:34
St. Cloud, not very long, and then I don't know
17:37
what happened there. Do you remember when you
17:40
were 14 watching the state tournaments game where
17:42
you're thinking to yourself, man, I sure love
17:43
to be playing for heights in the state tournament.
17:46
Oh, Bob, that was my dream. I always wanted to
17:49
play in the state tournament. And in fact, it's
17:51
kind of funny because we're preparing for a 50
17:54
year class reunion. I'm on the committee. So
17:57
in our yearbook over the picture of the basketball
18:01
picture, and I don't know how this got in there,
18:05
it said basketball team goes to state. We didn't
18:10
go to state, but I guess it's one of those things
18:13
that I wanted to go to state so bad that it's
18:15
even in my yearbook. Yeah, no, that was funny.
18:18
I remember when I was in high school, when I
18:20
was a sophomore, the class of 69 had a really
18:23
good team, but they lost in some kind of sectional
18:27
regional. But we really were hoping they would
18:29
have gone that year, but it just never happened.
18:31
But it was a dream. I mean, everybody's thinking,
18:33
yeah, we got to go, we got to go. But it was,
18:36
especially then, where there's only eight teams.
18:38
Right. I mean, I was getting to that regional,
18:40
that's quite an achievement. Well, prior to the
18:43
Heights going in in the 2000s, they hadn't been
18:46
to the state. tournament since 1930. I was going
18:48
to say it had to be like almost a hundred years
18:50
ago, you know, just a lot 1930. Wow. So after
18:56
the 1972 state tourney, the playoff game on Monday
18:59
evening, which followed the A and double A championship
19:02
games played on Saturday, that continued for
19:04
three more years, 73, 74 and 75. For the record,
19:12
in 1973, the class double A champion Anoka beat
19:16
the Class A champion Chisholm 63 to 56. Again,
19:19
these were played at Williams Arena. In 1974,
19:23
the Class A champion Melrose with Mark Oberding,
19:26
which you mentioned, they beat the Class AA champion
19:29
Bemidji 58 to 42. Pretty decisive, but then when
19:32
you got Mark Oberding, you know, it's going to
19:35
make a difference. 1974 was also the first year
19:38
that the championship games and playoff were
19:40
held at the St. Paul Civic Center rather than
19:42
Williams. And then in 1975, the last year of
19:46
the playoff, the class A champion, Little Falls,
19:49
beat class A champion Chisholm 54 to 50. So it
19:52
was a close game. Now, did you see any of the
19:54
championship games that year? Or was it the same
19:56
where we kind of went to the quarterfinals? The
19:58
quarterfinals, I will say in 75, a couple of
20:00
things. Yeah. I got Frank Wachalorowicz played
20:03
for Little Falls and Little Falls had a run there.
20:06
Yeah. And we met Frank at a, I did a basketball
20:11
camp, Keith Howe and I. We were also played who
20:15
played for the Heights. We were co -captains
20:17
on the basketball team Yeah, and we played up
20:19
at st. John's we didn't play we had a We were
20:22
counselors at the basketball camp and we met
20:24
Frank Walker -Lorowitz Okay, and then in fact
20:27
before in 75 we went up they are I think all
20:30
the players stayed at the Lummington so we went
20:31
up and into his room and shot the ball with him
20:35
a little bit at that time and then Frank of course
20:37
had a Frank had a fact he He was the leading
20:42
scorer at St. John's, I believe, for many years.
20:46
And he got a tryout with the Boston Celtics,
20:48
I believe. You'd have to have your people fact
20:51
-checked on that bet. The other thing, I'll tell
20:54
you about 75. Fulda made the state tournament.
20:59
So, and the reason, so I met my wife at work.
21:03
We both worked for a company called Preferred
21:04
Mortgage. I didn't know her at the time. So,
21:07
you know, making conversation, I said, I said,
21:10
where are you from? And she said, well, a little
21:12
town by Worthington. I go, well, what town are
21:15
you from? She goes, Fulda. I said, yeah, Harvard,
21:17
Kramer, Kevin Fury from the 1975 state tournament.
21:20
She looked at me. She couldn't believe I knew
21:23
that. So even State Turnal has something to do
21:25
with how I met my wife. That's where Pat Roysey
21:29
grew up, didn't he? Yes, for sure. He was a sports
21:32
columnist. I remember reading Scott when I was
21:36
researching this, that when Little Falls played
21:39
Bemidji for that, or Chesum, excuse me, for the
21:41
overall championship, there were only 4 ,500
21:44
people at the game because there was a blizzard
21:46
that day. It was on a Monday and people couldn't
21:48
drive, the weather was bad. And that was also
21:51
the last year that they had to play. Well, let's
21:54
quit while we're at it. I think they kind of
21:57
thought that that was anti -climatic. They had
21:59
two champions and all of a sudden you only had
22:02
one champion. Right. So it's probably not a bad
22:04
idea. Do you think it was part of it to see if
22:06
the little school can beat the big school? Yes,
22:08
no question about it. Nice idea, but I can see
22:11
why the school overhead. Right. Art, you mentioned
22:15
some of the players. Wachlarowicz. His nickname
22:19
was Frankie Alphabet. Okay. Frank was a great
22:23
player. When I went to Hamlin, I didn't play
22:27
in the Varsity, I was on the JV, but we played
22:30
against St. John's and we had a guy named Bobby
22:33
Richardson. It was about the same height as Frank
22:36
Walker -Lorowitz, about 6 '5", 6 '6", and boy
22:39
they battled. No question about it, yes. I saw
22:42
when I was looking it up that when he was in
22:45
the quarterfinals of that year, 75, he went to
22:49
head with Kevin McHale and outscored him 19 to
22:51
10. You know, McHale would have been a junior
22:53
that year. Right. But still, I mean, McHale wouldn't
22:56
have become a Hall of Famer in the NBA. Yes,
22:59
and in 76, we only got to that point. They played
23:04
against Jefferson and Ligenfelter. Excuse me,
23:08
I was going to say Elmer Bailey played in the
23:09
tournament. He went to Mechanic Arts. I remember
23:12
him playing football for the Gophers after that.
23:14
Great athlete. And of course, Oberding, who was
23:17
amazing. Four straight state tournaments he went
23:19
to. Well, and that was the beginning of the Chisholm's
23:21
run. Of course, Bob McDonald, the all time leading
23:23
wins in the state of Minnesota and all his sons
23:27
played. And they just they had unbelievable teams.
23:30
Now, did you see games at the Civic Center then?
23:33
Oh, yes. What did you think compared to the barn?
23:36
I mean, did you like the games in St. Paul or
23:38
did you? Would you have preferred they just stayed
23:41
at one place? You know, from a comfort level,
23:43
obviously, Civic Center were better and everything.
23:46
But, you know, I would have liked to continue
23:48
in the bar. And I'm very glad that in the last
23:51
few years... They've had games now back at the
23:54
bar. I think it's more intimate. It's just a
23:58
more fun atmosphere. Just the history and tradition.
23:59
For sure. When I think of the Civic Center, the
24:03
late Civic Center, because now there's a new
24:05
arena, but for me it was a place to see concerts
24:07
and I think it was more of a hockey place than
24:10
a basketball. Yes, I would agree. I would agree.
24:15
So for the rest of the 1970s, 76 through 79,
24:20
where the championship games were played at the
24:22
Civic Center. There were no more Monday evening
24:24
playoff games. The tournaments ended on Saturday
24:27
with your Double A and Class A champions. And
24:30
during those four years, 76 to 79, a couple of
24:33
schools won back -to -back championships. In
24:39
Class A, Lake City. won back -to -back titles
24:42
in 78 and 79. They lost just one game in 78,
24:46
and they went undefeated in 79. The other Class
24:49
A championships were won by Marshall University
24:51
High School Minneapolis, which went undefeated
24:53
in 76, and Winona Cotter in 77. Cotter, by the
24:58
way, was the first private school to win a boys'
25:01
state high school championship. In 75, they let
25:04
the private schools join the state high school
25:06
league, and that's how you started getting De
25:07
La Salle's and Tertino Gray's and Austin Pacelli's
25:10
and those schools, but Cotter won in 77. And
25:13
then in class AA, Fire Lake was the other school
25:16
to win back -to -back state championships in
25:18
77 and 78. Bloomington Jefferson... had an undefeated
25:23
season in 76 on route to the state title. That
25:26
was the year you graduated, right? So they were
25:28
the state champs. And then Duluth Central won
25:31
in 79. So that took care of the double -A championships
25:35
those last four years. Did you ever play at Lake
25:39
Jefferson or Duluth Central or prior Lake Jefferson?
25:41
We didn't, but we won in 76. kind of biased because
25:45
that's the year I graduated. But I thought basketball
25:47
in the state of Minnesota was fantastic. You
25:49
mentioned that Minneapolis Central was Minneapolis
25:51
Central was rated all year number one in the
25:53
state. They just had a great team. They had William
25:58
Henry, Greg Boone, Andre Griffin, who was a junior,
26:03
this Nelson. and then North upset them. And then,
26:07
you know, who else was, of course, Mikhail and
26:09
Hibbing, they had a kid named John Redica, who
26:11
was a great player. His dad was the coach. And
26:14
then Ligon Felter and Jefferson, the Peterson
26:17
brothers from Prior Lake. I think they went to
26:19
the U. But in the and then Marshall University,
26:22
we scrimmaged both Marshall University during
26:25
the year and Minneapolis Central. And because
26:28
our coach, Ron Cadwell, who's in the Hall of
26:30
Fame, he wanted us to get prepared because They
26:34
played, we were used to playing at 45 RPM, they
26:38
played at 78 RPM. Fast and quick. Fast and quick.
26:42
So, yeah, Marshall University had a kid named
26:43
Ronnie Henderson, who went on to play at Augsburg,
26:46
and Greg Boone also played at Augsburg. And in
26:49
the finals of the state, actually, to your point,
26:52
Jefferson, Steve Ligenfelter, did outplay Kevin
26:56
McHale in the state finals. And I think he went...
26:58
maybe to South Dakota, I'm not certain. Right,
27:01
right. Yeah, I remember that was considered an
27:03
upset because I think McHale had gotten a lot
27:05
of publicity. Yes. Coming down, they said, yeah,
27:07
they're going to win. And then Lingenfelter and
27:09
Jefferson won that year. So, yeah, Ronnie Henderson
27:12
from our show. Yeah, he was only probably five,
27:15
eight, five, nine. But yeah. He could play. He
27:17
set some kind of single game record of assists.
27:20
He had like 14 assists in some game. He did.
27:23
He did. And believe it or not, so my... My dad's
27:29
cousin, his name's Rod Black, who was also in
27:32
the coaches hall of fame. He coached a guy named
27:35
by the name of Bob Bruggers back in the early
27:38
60s. Bob Bruggers was the second all time leading
27:41
scorer in the state for many years. Bob Bruggers
27:44
played for Daniel. They played Terry Kunze and
27:47
Duluth Central in the first game of the 1961
27:50
state tournament. Bob Bruggers went on to play
27:53
football at the U and he also then he went into
27:56
professional wrestling, but anyway my Rod took
28:00
a team back in the probably the early 80s and
28:03
his son played J black not to be confused with
28:07
J black and the Americans the J black broke Ronnie
28:12
Henderson's a single game assist record either
28:15
that or the three game, but I'm not quite certain
28:18
Okay, wow. And then we can't leave him out because
28:21
this guy went on to play for the Gophers and
28:23
then the NBA, Randy Brewer at Lake City. I mean,
28:26
my gosh. He was the first official seven -footer,
28:29
I think, to play in a state tournament. There
28:31
were guys that were 6 '10 or 6 '11, but he was
28:33
the first seven -footer and he was dominant.
28:35
I think his scoring record in the state tournament
28:38
still stands. He averaged 38 points a game. He
28:42
was unbelievable. He really stood out in the
28:46
crowd too. I can remember watching those games.
28:48
I was still living in Iowa at the time, but I
28:50
was able to pick up the Minnesota State Tournament
28:52
on a Rochester channel and seeing Brewer playing
28:55
against these kids. He was like this much taller
28:57
than everybody. I was glad to hear he was going
29:00
to the U. He was the center on the last team
29:04
that won the Big Ten title for the Gophers. He
29:07
was a very skilled player. Great shooting touch.
29:11
He had a decent career in the NBA. He did. He
29:13
played for several years. Probably 10, yeah.
29:16
Just to put a ribbon on the state tourneys you
29:18
attended in the 70s, did you see a noticeable
29:21
change in the caliber or quality of play from
29:23
the beginning of that decade to the end? or wasn't
29:26
it that? Probably not as pronounced and although
29:30
every year the kids did get better. I will have
29:33
to say shout out to my coach Ron Cadwell at Columbia
29:37
Heights. He had a team in 1979. They played Minneapolis
29:42
Central and it was in the region finals and the
29:44
Heights had a really good team. They had a string
29:46
of very good teams. And they were up probably
29:49
in the section final, probably six points with
29:51
less than two minutes ago. I think it might have
29:53
been at the Minneapolis Auditorium. And we were
29:56
all ready to go down and celebrate the first
29:59
time that Heights goes to the tournament. And
30:01
Central had a kid named Pedro Perkins. Heights
30:03
missed a couple of front ends of a one -on -one,
30:06
and they didn't make it to the state tournament.
30:08
Oh, so close. Wow. It was so close. But Ron never
30:11
made it to the state tournament, but he has three
30:13
players. Grant Guzzi, who's in the Hall of Fame
30:16
that played at Spring Lake Park or coached at
30:18
Spring Lake Park, he took three teams. John Demars
30:21
took the Irondale team to the state tournament
30:23
and Dan Cremacino took Forest Lake to the state
30:26
tournament. So his players succeeded at that.
30:31
Wow. Cool. Did you have a favorite player or
30:33
favorite team from the 70s that you saw? I mean,
30:36
is one that realistic? Man, that's really a great
30:38
player. That's really a great team. Yeah, probably.
30:43
Well, there's another there's another kid that
30:46
was a great player. Van Troup from Moundsview.
30:51
They had some epic battles, but I would probably
30:54
say, you know, I would probably say Michaela
30:58
Oberding. Yeah, that's for sure. You know, Bruce
31:02
Kalpa played for Woodbury in 78. Bruce Kalpa
31:05
was a sharpshooter, played at the Ude for a little
31:07
bit. Jimmy Jensen played at Bemidji. He broke.
31:11
There's a guy named Ron Johnson who set the scoring
31:13
record. 46 for New Prague. My dad was there,
31:17
he got a standing ovation. He had 48 points.
31:21
And Jimmy Jensen in a consolation game scored
31:23
50 for Bemidji. So just some of the highlights.
31:28
I think it'd be fun Scott, you and I maybe just
31:29
do a deep dive into like certain years or something.
31:32
Yes. We're just, we're just. There's so much.
31:35
There's so much. But I just wanted to give kind
31:37
of an overview of what you've seen in years that
31:39
you've been in. For sure. Yep. Okay, on to the
31:44
1980s. Again, all championship games were played
31:47
at the St. Paul Civic Center. In Class A, two
31:53
schools won two state titles apiece in the 80s.
31:57
Bird Island Lake Lillian won in 80 and 81, while
32:01
De La Salle won in 85 and 88. The other six Class
32:05
A schools that won titles in the 80s included
32:07
Winona Cotter in 82, And five other Class A schools
32:11
who won the state titles in the 80s included
32:13
Barnum in 83, Pelican Rapids in 84, Lesour in
32:18
86, Norman County West in 87, and Rushford in
32:23
89, and about four of those schools I never even
32:25
heard of until I started researching it. Now
32:29
in the Class AA, you had two schools that won
32:31
multiple state titles in the 80s. First, Bloomington
32:34
-Jefferson. They won in 82, 86, and 87. They
32:39
also went 26 -0 in 87. And second, White Bear
32:42
Lake enjoyed back -to -back undefeated seasons
32:45
in 84 and 85. And didn't Columbia Heights lose
32:48
to White Bear Lake in the playoffs or something?
32:51
They did. Heights had their best team ever to
32:55
that point with John and Marv. They were in the
32:59
same section as White Bear. And White Bear, they
33:03
couldn't get by White Bear. Yeah, that was tough.
33:05
Yeah, they had some... some great players. Other
33:10
class AA schools that won state championships
33:12
in the 80s included Minneapolis North in 1980,
33:16
Anoka in 81, Woodbury in 83, Rikori in 88, they
33:22
also went undefeated that year, and Owatonna
33:25
in 89. Now, Scott, which of the games was it
33:30
just double A or A? Double A. Just double A,
33:33
yeah. And was it quarterfinals again? Yeah, pretty
33:35
much the quarterfinals. Did you go to any championship
33:38
games? You know, I might have. Number of years.
33:45
I have gone to championship games, but back then
33:48
I don't recall well I think like you said though
33:50
probably the most fun thing is to see all Eight
33:54
teams yes class playing it that way you get to
33:56
see them all yes for sure you can see well And
33:58
then of course and then I would watch them on
33:59
television. Oh sure sure yeah, goodness Yeah,
34:01
the TV is but there's but there's in my you know
34:06
There's, there's no comparison between being
34:08
at the tournament and watching it on TV. No,
34:10
you're right. You're right. You're right. Yeah.
34:12
Enthusiasm of the kids. Exactly. Exactly. It's
34:14
great. Cause when you go to like a NBA game or
34:17
even college, you hear more mature sounding voices,
34:20
but in high school, you can still hear like the
34:22
girls, you can just tell their kids. Right. Exactly.
34:27
Enthusiasm is what makes it so much fun. I think
34:29
that, you know, if we're going to talk about
34:30
1980, I think he won in 79. We have to talk about
34:33
Barry Waller. Oh yeah. And Bird Island was in
34:39
the same conference, 2 -12, along with Danube
34:41
and Renville. And I believe, I know Barry, yeah,
34:45
you said back -to -back state basketball tournaments.
34:47
I think he won back -to -back football tournaments.
34:50
Oh, wow. Barry also pitched in the Dodger organization,
34:55
played basketball at the U. And Barry has taken,
35:00
I believe, He's the coach at Orono. He has taken,
35:03
probably been to the state tournament with Orono
35:06
maybe eight or nine times. When we get into the
35:08
2010s, we'll be getting back to Barry Bowler.
35:13
Yeah, there's some good players that played in
35:16
the 80s as well. Tom Coppa with the Coon Rabbits.
35:20
That was the only time they were there. He played
35:21
at Marquette and then he played in the NBA. Kevin
35:26
Lynch at Jefferson. Kevin, I don't believe...
35:30
played yet his brothers played I think he was
35:33
a little bit later he was 85 86 oh he was okay
35:36
yes yes I see that yep and then of course like
35:40
he said he in fact I saw an interesting stat
35:43
here he and Dave Winfield and Joe Maurer are
35:47
the only three Minnesota prep athletes to be
35:49
invited to all -star games in three different
35:51
sports you know like when they have this Did
35:54
he still even have those All -Star games? I can't
35:55
remember like football and like isn't there like
35:58
a North and a South or something like that? But
36:00
they were invited to play and Wohler was one
36:02
of those great all -around athletes. Right, right.
36:05
And that was Jim Peterson? Yep. He played, I
36:10
got him here, he played 78, 79, and 80. Okay,
36:13
so he just made it and Jim Peterson. Mr. Basketball
36:16
too, wasn't he? I believe he was and he played,
36:19
John Ault was a great basketball and football
36:21
player from the Heights, all state. And they
36:24
played in all -star teams. And actually, John
36:28
Wood, I'll play Jim Peterson. But Jim, I think,
36:32
Jim was a late bloomer. He had a decent career
36:34
at the U, but then he kind of flourished in the
36:37
NBA. I remember him playing for Lake Houston.
36:39
They played the Celtics in the finals, I think.
36:42
They did. With Houston that year. Yes, yes. Good
36:44
player. Yep. Good point. Brett McNeil played
36:47
in that. And he played, he was Mr. Basketball.
36:50
He played for Western Kentucky. Oh, yeah. He
36:53
was a great player. Sure. Sure. Sure. So there's
36:55
so there's so many. Yeah. Right. Tim Hanson played
37:00
for Pryor Lake. He played at the U for a little
37:02
bit. I remember Tim Hanson. Yeah. Yep. So Brett
37:05
McNeil, he's on my list here. Right. There's
37:07
a kid for Robinsdale Art Armstrong, Grant Johnson,
37:09
went to play at Wisconsin. I don't know if they
37:12
made the state tournament. Steve Schlotthauer
37:14
was Mr. Basketball for Mounds U. Of course, Chad
37:17
Kollander. Yeah. And Owatana. You probably mentioned
37:20
him already. So Owatana. Well that was not until
37:23
1990 I looked it up. They beat Minneapolis North
37:26
in the final 72 to 26. I think I remember that
37:31
team. Yeah, that was a blowout. Yeah, North has
37:35
been interesting because they've won state championships
37:38
in like three different classes. I mean big classes,
37:41
medium, little. But some years they got the tournament
37:44
and they just... you know tanked but but they've
37:48
got like seven state titles oh they've had a
37:50
great history tony queen at north took this six
37:53
years in a row he was in the state tournament
37:55
yeah and then after that and i don't i don't
37:57
know what became of them and right i don't want
38:00
to use coaching there but yeah they were tough
38:02
yep what did you think of the basketball in the
38:05
80s compared to the 70s. I mean, the caliber
38:08
of play, just the talent of the players. They
38:12
were dunking by then, right? Yeah. Did the three
38:15
-point line come in yet, or was it in the 90s?
38:20
I can't remember. That's a good question. Yeah.
38:23
I don't know the answer to that. OK, that's all
38:25
right. That's all right. What team or what player
38:28
and what team do you remember best from the 80s?
38:31
I know we're covering a large chunk of time,
38:34
but really, there's so many. But, you know, Kevin
38:37
Lynch was a great player and then he had a great
38:40
career at the University of Minnesota. He was
38:43
probably, you know, Tom Cobo was a great player.
38:47
We mentioned in the in the in the weight bearer
38:49
squad was just, yeah, he had a kid named Rainier.
38:52
Larry Ogden who played, I believe he played professional
38:56
baseball. Oh, wow. I believe as well. Maybe he
38:59
played for you. I can't quite remember. So, yeah,
39:02
the 80s. Good basketball. And I can't comment
39:06
as much on the A schools. I just didn't follow
39:09
them as much. No, I understand. Okay, on to the
39:14
1990s, sometimes referred to as the dot -com
39:18
decade or internet decade due to the rise of
39:21
the World Wide Web. But I want to break this
39:23
decade into three segments. The first segment
39:25
will cover 1990 through 1994. That's because
39:29
these were the last years of separate Class A
39:31
and Class AA state tournaments. And again, these
39:36
championship games were played at the Civic Center.
39:41
In Class A, Five different schools won state
39:44
championships between 90 and 94. Lake City, Chisholm,
39:48
Austin, Pechelli, Maple River, and St. Agnes,
39:52
the Catholic high school over in St. Paul. That's
39:54
what's at 90 and 94. And then in class AA, Owatonna
39:58
won their second straight because they'd won
40:00
in 89, so they won in 90. Creighton Durham Hall
40:04
won a couple of state championships in 91 and
40:06
93. And the other class AA champions were Anoka
40:10
in 92, and Minneapolis Washburn in 1994. Now,
40:15
how did this work for the AA then? Did they play
40:18
those all, did the AA games all happen on the
40:22
same day again? Did you go? Yes, yes. At the
40:25
Civic Center, yes. And I do remember Johnny Tower
40:30
played for Creighton in 1991. who now Johnny
40:34
Tower is the coach at St. Thomas. And they also
40:38
had a kid, Arvesta Kelly Jr. And there was Arvesta
40:43
Kelly Sr. He played men's league basketball for
40:47
many. And I don't know where he went to school.
40:50
But then Arvesta Kelly's son later played for
40:56
Creighton. He was a very good player. You mean
40:58
our Vesta Kelly Jr.'s son? Yes. Wow. Yes. Because
41:02
you'll see that now. I look at the state tournament
41:04
and guys, you know, sons and grandsons are playing
41:08
also. Do you remember a kid from Anoka that played
41:11
in the championship? It was Brian. Is it Doughty
41:14
or Doughty? Doughty. Okay. Okay. He was like
41:17
one of the... The Pioneer Press came out with
41:20
an article back in 2012, and they had listed
41:23
the top 100 state tournament players of all time
41:26
or something, and his name was listed. I don't
41:28
remember his name, but he was like 82nd out of
41:31
100. Is that right? Yeah. Well, his uncle. Was
41:35
a guy named Jeff Doughty Jeff Doughty played
41:38
a vocational in Minneapolis and in Jeff Doughty
41:42
led the city in scoring for two years used to
41:45
play men's league against Jeff Doughty and Jeff
41:49
could shoot it up, but anyway He he he was on
41:53
the coaching staff when when his nephew was on
41:56
the, on, played for Noko. I also have to mention
41:59
one of the all time, one of my all time favorite
42:02
players was a great player. His name was Skip
42:04
Schaffbauer. He played at Elk rivers about six
42:07
foot three. He was Mr. Basketball. He went to
42:10
East Carolina and played. And I often wondered
42:13
why, I think Clem was the coach at the time.
42:16
He didn't recruit him, but Schaffbauer was a
42:19
really good player. Robert Ware, who was the
42:22
coach at Park Center. He just moved to Hopkins.
42:24
He's the heir apparent to Kenny Novak. He played
42:29
for Hopkins. Kenny Novak coached at Blaine prior
42:36
to Hopkins. He took Blaine to the state tournament.
42:39
Kenny played, we played Kenny's team Hopkins
42:43
-Lindenburg in 1975. Still had two schools, Eisenhower
42:46
and Lindbergh. Yes, he was this two guard and
42:49
we played them but they went to the state tournament
42:51
in 1975. Wow, okay. His dad was the coach. All
42:57
right, the next segment will be the state tournaments
42:59
in 1995 and 96. Those were the two years they
43:02
tried the Sweet 16 format. Did not have traditional
43:05
seating. The 16 qualifying teams were from both
43:09
Class A and Double A and then they just threw
43:11
them into one bracket. Just for the record in
43:18
both years Minneapolis North won the tournaments
43:20
the first year in 95 they had a close finish
43:23
They they played a team called Staples Motley
43:26
and it was a very close game is 54 to 52 But
43:30
then the next year they played fertile Beltrami
43:33
It was 80 to 47 just just a complete blow it
43:36
but I something interesting about that first
43:38
game because Staples Motley had a player named
43:41
Blaine Yorker you remember him remember him and
43:43
what's interesting about that is this a quote
43:45
from Khaled El -Amin, who is actually the number
43:48
one player in this top 100 that came out with.
43:51
El -Amin said that this is one of the toughest
43:53
players I've ever faced. You know, this kid from
43:56
Staples -Lotley, he was just amazing, I guess.
44:00
He averaged 25 points a game in the tournament
44:02
and he gave El -Amin and North all they could
44:06
handle. Right, right. I mean, that North team...
44:11
Would go down as one of the best teams I'd ever
44:14
played in the state twenty three stage. They
44:15
had three kids. Yeah, Collette Alamine The author
44:20
these three started sophomores Ozzie Lockhart.
44:22
That was Oz born Lockhart's kid Yes, pretty sure
44:25
over. Yep, and they had a kid named Jabar Washington,
44:27
right? And those three kids started all three
44:30
years since sophomore and they were they were
44:32
great. Yeah, they were great and of course El
44:34
Amin plays at Connecticut, wins a national championship,
44:39
played overseas many years, and he has a couple
44:41
kids. One played for Hopkins, one still maybe
44:46
just graduated played for Minnetonka that played
44:51
also. They got the basketball gene. They got
44:55
the basketball gene. Yeah, he was a great high
44:57
school player. Well, didn't he start like he
44:59
was 14 when he was like eighth or ninth grade
45:02
or something? Yeah, I mean, and he was 5 '10",
45:07
stocky. He didn't look like the prototypical
45:11
basketball player, but... He could play. He could
45:13
play, yeah. Yes. He's amazing. Yeah, I've heard
45:16
more people when he talked about Elam, he says
45:18
he didn't even look like he'd be that good, but
45:20
once he was on the court, yeah, he could play.
45:22
Yeah, I think he got drafted. Yeah. Maybe by
45:24
the Bulls. I'm not certain. Right, right. Yeah.
45:29
Okay, next segment, the last three years of the
45:32
20th century, 97, 98, and 99. In 97, the boys'
45:37
state high school basketball tournament switched
45:39
to four classes. The official reason, well, there
45:42
are probably two reasons. First, to accommodate
45:44
a larger number of teams, some that go from 16
45:47
to 32. And then second, this is the official
45:51
reason they gave us to address declining attendance
45:54
and competitiveness in the previous two class
45:57
systems. Yeah, you know, I kind of forgot about
46:01
it until I was paging through the state tournaments.
46:03
I'm going, Gee, what happened here? It was interesting.
46:08
Yeah. Well, the thing I read too, Scott, just
46:10
researching is the when they started that the
46:13
sweet 16 tournaments, they were playing quarterfinal
46:16
games throughout the state. It wasn't just. They
46:20
were playing up in St. Cloud. I think Rochester
46:23
had some games. I don't think I liked that idea.
46:27
No. The whole idea was to bring them all together.
46:29
Exactly. And it's funny you should mention that,
46:31
Bob, because John Demars took, I think I mentioned
46:33
that he took Iron Deal to the state tournament.
46:36
I can't remember what years, but he played out
46:39
state. So that's not even like being in the state
46:43
tournament for the kids. It's more of a regional
46:45
thing. Yes. No question about it. I do in 97.
46:50
I gotta mention a shout out to a guy that I know.
46:53
His name's Ed Cassidy. Ed brought De La Salle
46:56
to state that year. Ed played for Simley. He
47:01
went to the state tournament as a player. He
47:02
was a year older than me at Hamlin. Played for
47:05
Hamlin. Very good player. He also took Simley
47:10
to the state tournament. They were state champions.
47:12
He also took St. Bernard St. Bernard's State
47:17
Tournament. And I believe Trevor Mbakwe played
47:21
for St. Bernard's when he went to the state tournament.
47:23
Oh, I didn't know he went to the high school
47:24
tournament. So Ed, I got to give a shout out
47:28
to you. Yeah, wow. Yeah, that was pretty good.
47:30
Play and coach three different teams in the state
47:32
tournament. And in the 98, Thorson took... They
47:37
coached you D. LaSalle. D. LaSalle. I'm sorry,
47:40
Dave Thorson to the state tournament, of course.
47:42
He's been state, you know, multiple championships
47:44
and Ben Johnson in 98 played for him as a junior.
47:48
Yeah. Yeah, we'll be getting to him. Yep. Yep.
47:51
I'm starting to take this thing over. Sorry,
47:53
Bob. No, that's fine. That's why you're here.
47:57
Because you've seen so many basketball, high
47:59
school basketball games over the last 50 years,
48:01
probably as much as anybody. And your enthusiasm
48:04
is what's making this fun. Just you're remembering
48:07
places and people and all that kind of stuff.
48:10
So. Right. Alright, and just for the record,
48:16
in class 1A, the three different schools won
48:19
championships in the years 97, 98, 99. Hancock
48:24
won in 97. Norman County East, not to be confused
48:28
with Norman County West, won in 98. And then
48:31
a school called Southwest Minnesota Christian.
48:34
And I believe they're in a little town called
48:36
Edgerton, which had a... public high school that
48:39
won. Was that the famous school? That was like
48:42
the Hoosiers of Minnesota, right? Hoosiers of
48:44
Minnesota, 1960. Yeah. And they won the state
48:47
tournament. They beat, in the semifinals, Richfield.
48:51
And Richfield hit a kid named Anderson who played
48:54
at the U. But everyone in the whole Williams
48:57
Arena, no one wanted Richfield to win. Edgerton's
49:04
coach was a guy named Richie. What's his last
49:07
name? Anyway, it was his first year coaching.
49:10
He wasn't much older than the players. Yeah,
49:12
that was our Hoosiers. That was Minnesota's Hoosiers.
49:16
Yes. So anyway, the Southwest Minnesota Christian
49:18
won it in 99. And then in class 2A, the first
49:22
year, Caledonia went undefeated to capture the
49:25
state title in 97. And then De La Salle won in
49:29
98 and 99. And in 3A, Simley was the state champ
49:33
in 97, St. Thomas Academy in 98, and St. Paul
49:37
Highland Park, the St. Paul School, won it in
49:40
99. And then in 4A, Minneapolis North, they captured
49:43
their third straight for the three -peat. Minnetonka
49:46
won it in 98, and then Moundsview with its 4A
49:49
champ in 99. Now, do you remember which games
49:53
that you saw that? In those three years, like
49:56
quarterfinal type games? Yeah, probably quarterfinal
50:00
type games. Will's mentioned a couple of other
50:03
guys in 1999. Pete Hegseth played for Forest
50:08
Lake in the state tournament. His father, Brian,
50:12
was a senior when I was a freshman at Hamlin.
50:16
And Brian hurt his knee. He was a basketball
50:18
player. So he ended up hanging up. He coached
50:20
me on the JV. I'll be there. And Brian is from
50:24
a little town called he and his wife called Wanamingo.
50:28
And so yeah, throw in there. Nothing political.
50:31
I'm just saying he was there. He did go to Forest
50:34
Lake. He did go to Forest Lake. He was a good
50:36
player. His brother was too. Jeff Hagen played
50:39
for Hopkins. He was a junior in 99. Went to play
50:41
for the U. A guy named Nick Horvath played for
50:45
Mounds U. He went to Duke, I believe. And one
50:50
of the all -time great players went to Iowa State.
50:53
He was a junior for Tartin, Jake Sullivan. Jake's
50:57
one of the leading scorers, or at that time he
51:00
finished up, you know, one of the all -time leading
51:03
scorers in the state of Minnesota. Great player.
51:06
Yeah, obviously Elamin from the 90s was great.
51:10
Ben Johnson, you mentioned him, he was a gopher
51:12
coach through last year. And Nick Horvath, Chad
51:15
Kollander was in, played in 89 and 90. Do you
51:19
remember, he was in Minnetonk, is it Jake Koopy
51:24
or Cuppy? Big guy. Wide -bodied. Shane Schilling
51:29
played for Minnetonka also who played at the
51:32
U. There was a kid from Totino, Darius Lane,
51:37
who was a great player. He started four years.
51:41
He looked like a senior as a freshman. He went
51:44
on to play at Seton Hall. He was probably all
51:46
conference at Seton Hall. Great player. Yep,
51:48
good players come out of that area. So, 97 was
51:51
the last year that the tournament was played
51:53
at the Civic Center because They ended up tearing
51:55
it down and built the Excel. But they played
51:58
a tournament in 98, a place called the St. Paul
52:02
River Center. Did you go to any games in 98?
52:05
I'm trying. I don't think I've ever been inside
52:07
the River Center. I can't even picture. It's
52:09
not the Roy Wilkins Auditorium, is it? I should
52:12
know this. That's a good question. That's when
52:14
they played it, because they were kind of in
52:16
limbo. The River Center. Yeah, the St. Paul River
52:18
Center. Not Roy Wilkins. Well, that's what I
52:22
don't know if it's one in the same. That's a
52:25
good question. But the barn, they did, let's
52:28
see, the barn, I think they played in the barn
52:30
like in the late 90s. There might have been some
52:32
games there too. Yeah, as the tournament expanded,
52:37
they needed... They needed more locations, so
52:40
they'd play Summit, Target Summit, Civic Senate
52:42
Summit at Williams Arena. And then Williams,
52:45
well, in the early 90s, I remember this, they
52:47
actually did some upgrades to Williams Arena.
52:50
When you went there in the 70s, it was still
52:52
like the traditional barn. Yes. You know, they
52:55
fixed the seats and put in some. I don't know
52:58
later they put in some fancy like boxes or something
53:01
to sweets or something. Yes, they've upgraded
53:02
They've got a new floor now and everything. So
53:04
yes, it may changes to it over the years So yes,
53:07
and I'm also I've been a state or go for football
53:11
or a go for basketball season ticket holder for
53:14
many many many years I inherited from my father
53:16
and I keep right so the Williams are in a lot.
53:19
Yep. Okay. All righty Okay on to the odds 2000
53:25
to 2009 in 2000 in y2k tournament championship
53:29
games were played at williams arena in 2001 and
53:32
2002 the championship games were played at the
53:36
then new xl energy center in st paul the x is
53:39
what was called for short and just a quick question
53:42
scott what's the new name for what used to be
53:44
the xl do you remember what they renamed it i
53:47
only know because i was reading about the wild
53:48
they have an it's a new name now naming new naming
53:51
rights I'm not a hockey guy. So yeah, yeah, it's
53:54
not called the Grand Casino. Oh It's got a new
53:58
name, but I thought the X was such a great name,
54:00
but now they have to change it Well, anyway,
54:01
yeah, that's where they played for a couple of
54:03
years But I think those were the only years they
54:04
ever played any games at the X Then they moved
54:08
to Target Target. Okay, which is kind of what
54:10
I think so I think one year we we took I took
54:14
the fam the kids were young And we stayed overnight
54:20
downtown St. Paul and then we went to the to
54:23
the games. Okay. So I had to get them going early.
54:27
Okay. It must have been Excel then. Yeah. Well,
54:31
yeah. Right. Okay. Which is actually a really
54:33
nice venue. Very. I've been there for concerts
54:35
and it's it's very nice. Yes. All right, we'll
54:41
just run through these names and you can let
54:43
me know if you've heard of any of these schools
54:45
in class 1A, okay? Now that's at Southwest Minnesota
54:48
Christian again. They actually have a four -peat.
54:51
They won in 99, and then they won in 2000, 2001,
54:55
2002, so good for them. And then Mankato Loyola
54:58
must be a Catholic school. They won the championship
55:01
in 03. Russell Tyler Ruthdon in 2004 and 05.
55:07
Rushford Peterson, they merged. It used to be
55:09
just Rushford. Now they took in another school.
55:10
That was in 06. Ellsworth in 07 and 08. And then
55:15
Granada, Huntley, East Chain. You ever notice
55:19
the smaller the schools, the larger the names?
55:22
I know. That's how they accommodate, I guess.
55:26
And then Class 2A, Litchfield won the state title
55:30
in 2000. And then you mentioned this a minute
55:33
ago. Well, it's called Kenyon Wanamingo. Yes,
55:36
they won the two -way title in 2001. Okay. Let's
55:39
field one again in 02 and 03 and then Braham
55:43
had a nice run there. They won it. They had a
55:45
three -peat. They won in 04, 05, and 06. Yes,
55:48
Braham. They had the Dolman boys. Yes. Isaiah
55:52
went to Michigan State, kind of sat on the bench.
55:54
Never played. There was a Noah Dolman who he
55:57
did play. I forget where he went to school. And
56:00
then they were at the top. of the all -time,
56:05
Isaiah at one time was an all -time leading scorer.
56:07
They had a sister, Rebecca Dahlman, who was up
56:10
there also. They had great teams. My dad got
56:16
a kick out of those years because his dad, my
56:18
grandpa, actually grew up in Bremen. The other
56:21
1A champions in the Aughts included Holy Family
56:25
Catholic in 07. New London Spicer, they won it
56:28
in 08, and Pelican Rapids in 09, so the ticker
56:31
of the 2A. We'll get to 3A now. Minneapolis Patrick
56:35
Henry also achieved a four -peat. They won in
56:38
2000, 2001, 2002, and 03. And then for the remainder
56:42
of the Aughts, there were different 3A champion
56:44
each year. Makeda West in 04, Shakopee in 05,
56:49
De La Salle in 06, St. Thomas Academy in 07,
56:53
Benilde St. Margaret's in 08, And then Minneapolis
56:56
Washburn in 09. That's like Catholic schools
56:58
for like three years in a row, it looks like
56:59
there. And then we'll get to 4A now. Tartan won
57:03
the title in 2000. Osseo in 2001. Hopkins captured
57:07
four 4A titles in the aughts. 2002, 05, 06 and
57:12
09. Then the other 4A champs included Minneapolis
57:15
North in 2003. Chaska in 04. Buffalo in 07, and
57:21
Minnetonka in 08. So they had quite a range,
57:25
except for Hopkins, of course. They got half
57:27
of those. Do you remember which games you saw
57:29
there in the 2000s and the aughts? Yeah, it was
57:35
probably... I wish I could remember specifically.
57:39
I remember names, but not as much. Because they
57:41
would have been in Target Center by then. Yes,
57:43
yeah. Yeah, probably quarters. I might have gone
57:46
to the semis as well. What do you think of having
57:48
the high school tournament at Target? I mean,
57:50
Target is a basketball arena. It is. It's a good
57:53
place to see games. It is a very good place to
57:55
see games. Again, you have a comfort level there.
57:59
It's good, you know, I like Williams Arena just
58:01
because the intimacy again, right? Target was
58:04
it was it was fun to watch games. Yeah Yeah,
58:07
who are some of the players you remember from
58:09
the from the odds? Oh There's a ton of them.
58:12
But I mean, yeah. Oh, I you'll Cretan Joe Maurer
58:15
played for Cretan and they had a kidney Joe Maurer
58:18
could have played D1 basketball as well. Yeah,
58:21
they had a great shooter called named Steve sir
58:24
who played at That's the year John took the state
58:29
tournament in 2001. Rick Rickard played for Duluthese.
58:35
When I was looking back on hypothetical Mr. Basketballs
58:39
back in the day, the year, and I can't remember
58:42
what year, his dad was a great basketball player
58:45
also. I was unaware of that. Chris Humphries
58:49
played for Hopkins as a junior. There was a kid
58:53
from Ellsworth. Oh, yeah. He was the first Schilling
58:57
brother to play. And there was like three different
59:01
Schillings and he was the first one. Abu Shamala
59:05
played for Shakopee. He went on to play at the
59:09
U. Travis Bush played for Monsby who's a sophomore.
59:13
He won Mr. Basketball as a senior. We mentioned
59:16
the the the the Dalman brothers. Yeah. Oh, Jake
59:22
Sullivan, you mentioned Jake Sullivan, right?
59:25
Jake Sullivan, yes. It says here that when I'm
59:26
looking, he finished with more than 3 ,000 career
59:29
points. Must have been quite a shooter. Unbelievable
59:31
shooter. Spencer Tollexon played for Chaska.
59:35
Blake Hoffarber was in 2005 as a sophomore. He
59:40
had the most famous shots ever. And I have to
59:44
be honest, I missed one state tournament. since
59:48
1972. I was in California and I believe that
59:51
was the year he hit the shot. 2005. He was sitting
59:57
down. Double overtime. Yes, yes. Wow. Yes. And
1:00:02
here we go. In 2006, did you say Ellsworth won
1:00:08
three years in a row? Well, no. Cody Schilling
1:00:12
was the leading scorer. in the state tournament
1:00:15
three years in a row. He was six foot five. At
1:00:18
one point, he was the leading scorer and the
1:00:22
leading assist person in the state of Minnesota.
1:00:25
That is unbelievable. And Rodney Wunds was a
1:00:31
freshman on the Cooper team in 2006. He went
1:00:34
on to play at the U. We talked about Trevor M.
1:00:38
Bachway. Jordan Taylor played for Bonil. He went
1:00:41
on to play at Wisconsin. There's a kid from Minnetonka,
1:00:45
Anthony Tucker, who played at Iowa. D1. And of
1:00:49
course, Hopkins had. They had Royce White, Joel
1:00:52
Coleman. He played at two schools, right? He
1:00:54
was at Hopkins and De La Salle, right? He says
1:00:57
here in 2006 he was at De La Salle, he missed
1:00:59
a transfer. Oh yes, you're right. Yeah. You're
1:01:01
right. And he played at the U for a couple of
1:01:03
games. He got in a little trouble I think. But
1:01:06
Joey King. played 2010, are we that far? Joey
1:01:12
King, who went on to play at the U. I have to
1:01:15
do a shout out to, I went to high school with
1:01:20
Toby Nord, Toby's son, played two years in the
1:01:24
state tournament for Eden Prairie. Connor Nord,
1:01:26
he then went to St. Tom and he had a super career
1:01:29
at St. Thomas. Got to throw in the Heights guys.
1:01:32
Oh, absolutely. Yeah, they appreciate that. And
1:01:35
then, Oh, DeLaSalle, they had some Travis brothers
1:01:41
that started a play and I think there was about
1:01:45
three of them and they were started to play at
1:01:48
about that time. So, yeah, Thorson had a lot
1:01:52
of good players. Okay, on to the 2010s. 2010
1:01:57
through 2019. Again, all championship games are
1:02:00
played at Target Center. In class 1A, two schools
1:02:07
won two championships apiece in the 2010s. Belgrade
1:02:11
-Bruten -El Rosa won in 2012 when they went 33
1:02:15
-0 and again in 2014. Minneapolis North, like
1:02:18
I said, I think they've been in every class.
1:02:20
They won two straight titles in 2016 and 2017.
1:02:25
The other class 1A championships were won by
1:02:27
Minnesota Transitions Charger School in 2010,
1:02:31
Springfield in 2011. that Southwest Minnesota
1:02:34
Christian won again in 2013, Rushford Peterson
1:02:38
in 2015, Russell Tyler -Ruthen in 2018, and Henning
1:02:42
in 2019. In 2A, at this school you certainly
1:02:47
heard of, Minnehaha Academy won four state championships
1:02:50
in the 2010s, first in 2013, three straight in
1:02:54
2017, 18, and 19. And six other 2A champions
1:02:58
in the 2020s were New London Spicer in 2010,
1:03:02
Perham in 2011, Plainview Elgin Millville in
1:03:06
2012, Esco in 2014, Melrose in 2015. I think
1:03:11
that was their first championship since the Overding
1:03:13
era or might've been one of the few. For sure.
1:03:16
In 2015. So, and then Brayham won another one
1:03:18
in 2016. We'll get to class three now. St. Paul
1:03:22
Johnson won the title in 2010. They also went
1:03:24
undefeated. Orono won in 2011, and Scott, while
1:03:28
I hate to bring this up, we'd be remiss not to
1:03:31
mention that Orono won their championship by
1:03:33
beating Columbia Heights, 85 -76. And that was
1:03:36
a team that Barry Wohler was coaching, right?
1:03:39
He did, and Columbia Heights had a player named
1:03:41
Zach Lofton. Zach was a great player. Zach played,
1:03:46
I think he played with about four different colleges.
1:03:49
Right. And then he did get a tryout, and he was
1:03:53
on a roster in the NBA for a while. Okay, okay.
1:03:56
Yeah, I know he was in college for a long time
1:03:58
because I remember like years after the state
1:03:59
tournament, he was in some school in Illinois
1:04:02
and I was watching a game with Steve Durant.
1:04:04
I said, he's still playing because you would
1:04:07
have thought he was like 30 by then, but he was
1:04:09
still playing in college. Yes. But in class 3A
1:04:13
during the 2010 to 2019, De La Salle owned that
1:04:17
decade. They won six straight and seven of eight
1:04:21
championships in 2012, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, and
1:04:25
19. Then in 2018, Delano won the straight three
1:04:29
high title by beating Columbia Heights, 65, 61.
1:04:34
So at least the Heights got to finals a couple
1:04:36
of times in that decade. They did. Yeah, De La
1:04:40
Salle, Thorson liked to win, obviously, but I
1:04:44
kind of thought that they probably should have
1:04:47
moved up. I mean, I don't think there was any
1:04:50
doubt from the first tip -off that they were
1:04:55
going to win the state tournament. They had a
1:04:59
lot of blowouts. And it's one of those things
1:05:02
that they probably thought, well, I don't know
1:05:04
how we're going to be next year. But just like
1:05:06
any schools, You know, with kids transferring,
1:05:10
districts, maybe they come, they start their
1:05:13
ninth grade somewhere, or sometimes they transfer
1:05:17
mid -year or they move or whatever. They are
1:05:22
identified with, this is where I want to go to
1:05:24
school because this school is really good at
1:05:26
basketball. And De La Salle is a private school.
1:05:29
They probably had an advantage from a recurring
1:05:32
standpoint. Do you know, because I think Tatino
1:05:34
Grace did that with football, can a smaller school
1:05:36
opt to move up just to face better competition?
1:05:39
Because I remember one year, Grace won the big
1:05:41
football thing. Yes. In Eden Prairie. Yes. She
1:05:44
had like three times more students. But they
1:05:47
wanted. Wanted to go up to that class. So so
1:05:49
deal this out could have they could have moved
1:05:52
but they didn't yeah, man I'm sure you know during
1:05:54
the year they they played The bigger schools
1:05:57
all the time because they wanted better competition
1:05:59
But when it got to the state tournament, there
1:06:01
was never any doubt who was going to win it,
1:06:03
right? And speaking of class 4a the 2010s were
1:06:06
dominated by two schools The first was hopkins
1:06:09
which won four state championships in 2010 11
1:06:13
16 and 19 and the second was apple valley which
1:06:17
won three titles in 2013, 15, and 17. The other
1:06:21
three schools to win 4A championships in the
1:06:23
2010s were Osseo in 2012, Lakeville North in
1:06:27
2014, and Creighton Durham Hall in 2018. Which
1:06:31
games do you remember seeing then, Scott? We're
1:06:33
getting kind of closer now, it's not as far back.
1:06:37
I remember when Tyus Jones played at the Target
1:06:42
Center. One of the things about the state tournament
1:06:44
was a little different. Back when we go originally,
1:06:48
there was a lot of us basketball junkies that
1:06:51
would go to the state tournament. There aren't
1:06:54
as many of us anymore. The people that go to
1:06:56
the state tournament are the people whose schools
1:06:58
are in the state tournament. In fact, you'll
1:07:01
have a session and a team will, they're done
1:07:04
with their game and then they all leave. I remember
1:07:09
when Tyus Jones was a senior and they played
1:07:12
for the state title. And my son and I were there.
1:07:16
By this time, my son and my son was joining us.
1:07:20
I can't remember when my dad stopped going. We
1:07:22
passed in 2014. But anyway, we left our seats
1:07:26
to go to get something to eat. We came back.
1:07:29
There was no room. We had to sit up in the upper
1:07:32
echelon in the Target Center. Pardon me? Were
1:07:35
those general admission seats? Yes, yes. No,
1:07:39
we couldn't do that, which was surprising because
1:07:41
we would never get filled up. But I do remember
1:07:43
that that got filled up when Tyus Jones played.
1:07:46
Yeah, he was, I was going to say, during the
1:07:50
odds, who were the players that you really remember?
1:07:53
Whether it was state tournament or regular season
1:07:54
because you saw so many basketball games. Oh,
1:07:56
yes. Well, one of the guys. One of the best performances
1:08:01
I've ever seen in the state tournament was there
1:08:04
was a kid named JP Makura who played for Lakeville
1:08:07
North Okay, and he was about six foot five and
1:08:10
he was confident borderline cocky. He was cocky.
1:08:13
Yeah, and He dominated and he went on to play
1:08:19
college basketball. He might have got a went
1:08:21
out east and I can't remember where he played
1:08:23
but he was a great player. Was that the year
1:08:24
they won the state too? I believe that was the
1:08:26
yes that was I believe now I I know he yeah it
1:08:31
had to be because he was a sophomore he he was
1:08:33
in 2012 yes okay but he was he's he's had one
1:08:37
of the great performances that I remember in
1:08:39
the state tournament. Of course Hopkins had Amir
1:08:43
Kaafi yeah they had one of Ishmir El -Amin who
1:08:48
was one of Khaled's Kids Trey Jones and Gary
1:08:52
Trent were Trey was a freshman and Gary Trent
1:08:56
was a sophomore in 2015 that's when Apple Valley
1:09:00
obviously had their run, right and then D LaSalle
1:09:05
had great teams. They had Gabe Kelser who played
1:09:08
as a sophomore in 2016. I had a kid named Goner
1:09:11
Mar Terey Tyrell Terry played as a freshman.
1:09:15
He went out to Stanford. Lakeville had great
1:09:18
players, and they have a pipeline. Their kids
1:09:21
all seem to go to Wisconsin. Oh, right. Yeah,
1:09:24
they do. There's a lot of players. Yes, they
1:09:25
had a kid named Nathan Reavers, who played at
1:09:32
Wisconsin. player. And then Daniel Otero in 2017
1:09:38
played for Crete and he went on to play at the
1:09:41
U. Tyler Wall was at Lakeville North. He also
1:09:44
went to Wisconsin. And then of course you had
1:09:48
for Minnehaha Academy had Jason Suggs and Holmgren.
1:09:53
Chet started playing as an eighth grader. When
1:09:56
he was only 6 '9". Exactly. And then you mentioned
1:10:01
in 2018, the Heights played Delano. They had
1:10:05
a kid, Delano, named Calvin Wishart, who was
1:10:09
just a great player. In fact, I go down to play
1:10:14
in the summer. They have a summer league this
1:10:15
year. They used to have it down at Minnehaut
1:10:17
Academy. They moved it to De La Salle and it's
1:10:20
a Pro -Am League. And some of those old timers
1:10:23
are playing in the Pro -Am League. All right.
1:10:27
On to the 2020s. Some people are calling this
1:10:33
current decade the Turbulent 20s. Case in point,
1:10:36
you're 2020. Because in 2020, there was no state
1:10:40
tournament. It was canceled due to the COVID
1:10:42
-19 pandemic. Yes. And Scott, since this podcast
1:10:45
is about your thoughts and memories of the Minnesota
1:10:48
Boys State High School basketball tournaments,
1:10:50
we'll move on to the tournaments that you have
1:10:52
seen since that canceled tournament in 2020.
1:10:58
The state championship games for 2021, 22, and
1:11:01
23 were played at Target Center, but the title
1:11:04
games for 2024 and 2025 were played back at the
1:11:07
barn in Williams Arena. This was due to some
1:11:10
scheduling conflicts. I know they've been playing
1:11:12
at Target Center since 2003, but it just wasn't
1:11:15
available for the last couple of years, so they
1:11:18
went back to Williams Arena. We'll go through
1:11:20
class 1A quickly. Hayfield. won it in 21 and
1:11:24
22. So they went back to back. Russell Tyler
1:11:27
Ruthen won in 2023. Cherry won the title in 2024.
1:11:31
And they have a go first ever players Isaac Asima.
1:11:34
Yes. Yes. He's he played for Cherry. Yes. A little
1:11:37
small school in a small class. Yes. And then
1:11:39
Dawson Boyd won it all in 2025. And class 2A
1:11:44
in 2021. Wasika won the first state title since
1:11:47
way back in 1918. I looked that up. Annandale
1:11:50
also won their first state championship in 2022.
1:11:54
I worked with a guy that was from Annandale.
1:11:55
He's really pumped when they won, because he'd
1:11:58
played in high school and never won. Albany,
1:12:00
I've heard of them, they won two -way titles
1:12:02
in 2023 and 25, and they went undefeated in 25.
1:12:07
And then Breck School won the title in 2024 in
1:12:11
that class, too, eh? Yes. Now we'll get to 3A.
1:12:15
Mniha Academy won it in 2021. Totino Grace won
1:12:19
the next three state championships, 22, 23, and
1:12:22
24. And then Alexandria Area won it last year
1:12:26
in 2025. And then the four, the big classes,
1:12:29
Waisetta captured titles in 21, 23, and 25. Park
1:12:33
Center won the championship in 2022. And Minnetonka
1:12:37
won the title in 2024. So. And getting back to
1:12:40
2020, Eden Prairie had a team that was fantastic.
1:12:44
They were undefeated. I think they would have.
1:12:47
I felt bad for those kids because I think they
1:12:49
would have. In fact, they played Minnehaha Academy
1:12:52
that year with Holmgren and Suggs and they beat
1:12:56
them handily. I think they would have won it.
1:12:59
In fact, the people that I feel the sorriest
1:13:01
for were the kids that would have graduated high
1:13:04
school in 2020. Oh, they missed proms. They missed.
1:13:07
That was that was very terrible. Terrible year.
1:13:10
Yes. Yes. So for sure. But it sounds like, you
1:13:14
know, at least as far as tournaments go. in the
1:13:16
20s. There were some good teams, some good games,
1:13:20
and some really good players. There were. I think
1:13:23
that now Totino Grace, they were a football school
1:13:27
for many years. And now they're kind of a basketball
1:13:31
school. They had some great players. They have
1:13:35
a kid named Isaiah Johnson, who went to Miami.
1:13:39
And then their coach left, so he went to Iowa.
1:13:42
Then the Iowa coach left, so now he's at St.
1:13:45
Thomas. They had a kid named Tyson Chapman, who
1:13:49
went to OSU. YZETA is now there on a roll. In
1:13:55
fact, they have gone to the state tournament.
1:13:58
We go to section finals. Steve Durant and I,
1:14:02
who you've had on a podcast about music, he's
1:14:05
one of the people that I go to a lot of basketball
1:14:07
games and backing up a little bit. Now, for many
1:14:11
years, I go to the quarterfinals. And I go to
1:14:14
the semi -finals of the big schools, and then
1:14:16
I go to the finals Saturday night, and it's either
1:14:19
a 3A and a 4A, sometimes a 2A and a 4A, but they
1:14:22
always have the 4A. So, but the section finals,
1:14:26
and why is that? beaten Hopkins the last probably
1:14:30
four or five years. And both teams are going
1:14:33
to be very good again. And Kenny Novak, this
1:14:37
month, he's shooting to become the all time leading
1:14:40
wins coach in the state of Minnesota. He's about
1:14:44
20 behind Bob McDonough from Chisholm. So he
1:14:48
might surpass this year. So, you know, a great
1:14:52
game that I saw at Target Center was Wayzata.
1:14:56
Beat Park Center is coming up set and it was
1:14:59
kind of a kid named McAndrew who six said he
1:15:04
ended up his junior year. He ended up going to
1:15:06
Creighton, but he was kind of his coming out.
1:15:09
They had a kid named Tibbetts who was the point
1:15:12
guard. He went to Saint Thomas Nolan Winter who's
1:15:17
now at Wisconsin played for Lakeville North in
1:15:20
22 Trey Holloman was was for Creighton Durham
1:15:25
Hall. who he played at Michigan State. He's probably
1:15:27
done now, although now it seems like these kids
1:15:29
can play five, six years. I don't quite understand
1:15:32
that. And then, of course, and then Braden Carrington,
1:15:36
who played at De La Salle. No, no, no, I'm sorry,
1:15:41
Park Center. And he played at the U and now he
1:15:44
transferred somewhere else. Now he's back in
1:15:45
Wisconsin. So there's some really good basketball
1:15:47
players, really good basketball players. And
1:15:52
with that, Scott, we've covered the better than
1:15:55
50 years that you've attended the Minnesota Boys
1:15:57
State High School basketball tournament since
1:15:59
the early 1970s. This might be tough because
1:16:02
you've been to so many games over the years,
1:16:05
but do you have a favorite among the 50 plus
1:16:08
tournaments that you went to that you went, you
1:16:10
said this might be the best basketball I can,
1:16:13
I've ever seen or whatever? Well, I think. The
1:16:18
kids nowadays are so much better. I mean I watched
1:16:21
I watched I googled it and I watched Mounds you
1:16:25
play Irondale with when Mark Landsberger played
1:16:27
it was on YouTube you can Google it it was back
1:16:31
in like 1973 It's a total different game. I'm
1:16:35
so glad that there's no video and if someone
1:16:37
has it Don't bring it out of me when I played
1:16:40
because now I can tell my kids what a great player
1:16:43
I am the kids now are so much better They play
1:16:48
year round. It's just amazing how good they are
1:16:54
now. I would have to agree. They look different.
1:16:58
They seem to be bigger and taller, faster. They
1:17:01
are. And they play so much basketball. They do.
1:17:05
We're going back to the... late 60s and early
1:17:07
70s, Minnesota didn't even allow camps back then.
1:17:11
Right. You played your sport during the season.
1:17:13
That was it. They didn't have sports camps in
1:17:15
the summer for basketball or football camps.
1:17:18
You just played when the season was. Exactly.
1:17:21
That was it. That's right. Now the kids like
1:17:23
specialize in sports. They do. And they're phenomenal,
1:17:27
but it's a different world. There's probably
1:17:29
some burnout. They play AAU ball in the spring.
1:17:31
They play AAU ball in the fall. I think I think
1:17:34
actually maybe high school ball takes a backseat.
1:17:37
You know, back when we were playing, we wanted
1:17:40
to play, we played with our friends and then
1:17:43
our goal was to win the conference or to go to
1:17:45
state or whatever. And, you know, I think that
1:17:49
might be secondary. Maybe not so much for kids
1:17:52
from small towns, but, you know, they play AAU
1:17:55
ball too. I mean, it's different. And I think,
1:18:01
you know, it's better. There's much more diversity
1:18:05
now, not just in the city, but in the state.
1:18:09
So the basketball is there's so many more athletes.
1:18:13
It's so good. And you mentioned with the three
1:18:16
point shot, that's another thing. You know, one
1:18:19
of these records stood for years and years and
1:18:22
years, the scoring records. But then with the
1:18:24
three point shot, that changed it a lot. And
1:18:27
the other thing is we talked about it to kids.
1:18:30
Kids will. They said, well, I want to go play
1:18:32
at this school or I'm going to transfer to this
1:18:35
school because they have good basketball. You
1:18:37
know, that's not that I like it, but it's it's
1:18:40
that's what the colleges do. That's what the
1:18:42
pros do. It's just it's just a sign of the times.
1:18:45
It is different. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and that's
1:18:48
why I wanted to, I think, talk about the state
1:18:51
tournaments because the world is changing and
1:18:53
so are the tournaments. What is your if it's
1:18:57
possible, what is your like favorite? your favorite
1:19:00
player or favorite team of all the tournaments.
1:19:03
I know that's a lot to look back on, but you
1:19:06
just remember this was probably the most fun
1:19:09
tournament I went to and games I enjoyed the
1:19:11
most. You know, it probably was back before I
1:19:16
graduated from high school because that was something
1:19:20
that I dreamed about doing myself. that I aspired
1:19:24
to playing the state tournament. And so I'd watch
1:19:27
this and I watched these players and it's like,
1:19:29
man, that's what I do, what I want to do. And
1:19:32
to be very honest, I really enjoy reading and
1:19:36
talking about the state tournament in the early
1:19:39
60s. In fact, I'm going to have, and I told you,
1:19:43
Bob, that you should have Terry Kunze on your
1:19:46
show who played for Duluth Central. I've never
1:19:49
met anyone, and then he played at the U. He played
1:19:52
professionally. He coached at the U. He coached
1:19:56
in Europe. There's two people that love basketball
1:19:59
who know basketball, and that's all that they
1:20:02
talk about. Terry Kunze and Ziggy Calls, the
1:20:05
late Ziggy Calls, who coached at Mounds. I student
1:20:09
taught at Mounds. And my degree is education.
1:20:12
I never used it. But Ziggy was there, and that
1:20:15
was in 1979. Every day Ziggy would corner me
1:20:19
and I loved it because we'd talk basketball and
1:20:22
I'd see Ziggy at state tournaments all the time.
1:20:26
I love going to the basketball tournament. I
1:20:29
still love it. Your brother goes sometimes. My
1:20:33
son goes with me now. It's a tradition. It is
1:20:37
a tradition. Yeah, you know, I love it. So Hopefully
1:20:43
I can keep keep going for for a long time. Yeah,
1:20:46
right I was just gonna say another thing that's
1:20:48
some of the improvements the fact that they seed
1:20:51
teams now at first They only see that I believe
1:20:54
one through four in the different sections or
1:20:57
in the different teams classes And now I believe
1:21:00
they do one through eight. I was talking to a
1:21:03
guy who his his he went to Totino Grace in 2000
1:21:07
where they were the number two team in the state
1:21:09
and Henry was the number one when they won three
1:21:12
in a row. They drew Henry the first round so
1:21:17
they had to play them. Now there's also talk
1:21:20
about well maybe we should only Because some
1:21:24
sections sometimes are historically weak or they
1:21:27
didn't you know, they should have They should
1:21:29
have seeding for all the teams in the state and
1:21:32
they do it that way. I'm not a big fan of that
1:21:35
I think I mean from the start of the glass. Yes,
1:21:38
so then you have Perhaps in theory the best teams
1:21:44
in the state no matter You know, you could have
1:21:47
three teams from this section go to the state.
1:21:50
I'm okay with the way it is Yeah. Well, this
1:21:55
has been fun, Scott. We've covered so much. And
1:21:58
thanks for just for the record. You brought notes.
1:22:02
You had a lot of stuff. You were really prepared
1:22:03
and you've got a lot of anecdotal stuff, which
1:22:05
really helped a lot. I just want to give you
1:22:07
the last word, like what the state basketball
1:22:09
tournament means to you and how big a part of
1:22:12
life it is for you just every year. Oh, yeah.
1:22:17
I'm kind of a context guy. I live in the same
1:22:20
neighborhood. I've had the same wife, the same
1:22:23
job, all that stuff. I'm not much for change.
1:22:26
But the state, you know, it brings you back.
1:22:30
It brings you back to, you know... yesteryear
1:22:34
and maybe this is hokey but with things with
1:22:37
with things were simpler and it you know you
1:22:40
think about going on a state tournament with
1:22:42
your dad and then with your son and and it's
1:22:45
just something that's just I think that's what's
1:22:47
really near and dear it started with your dad
1:22:49
and now you got it going with your son so yeah
1:22:52
it's something to look forward to every year
1:22:53
exactly and and and I I and now I'll never I
1:22:57
plan I'm in town for the state tournament I'm
1:23:00
not going to travel anywhere And my wife knows
1:23:02
that too, so. So, my daughter's been to this
1:23:07
day eternal with me too. I can't, you know, at
1:23:09
some point, hopefully my grand. My grandson,
1:23:13
my granddaughter will go to the state tournament,
1:23:15
too. Bring them to the tournament. Exactly. Exactly.
1:23:17
Three generations. That's right. That'll be good.
1:23:19
Yep. All right. Well, Scott, this has been a
1:23:21
blast. I'm impressed, you know, with your with
1:23:25
your memories, just the fact you've been going
1:23:26
to tournaments for as long as you have. I think
1:23:28
years ago, I think it was during the pandemic,
1:23:31
Royce did a column on a guy who had been just
1:23:33
like 60 some tournaments. Well, you're right
1:23:36
up there. I mean, right. I mean, the stories
1:23:39
you could tell. And you shared a lot with us
1:23:40
today, but I do appreciate it. I wish my memory
1:23:42
was a little bit better, but you know, it's looking
1:23:47
at the programs and everything and that kind
1:23:50
of brings things back. Right. We didn't talk
1:23:53
about it much, but next to us you've got a pile
1:23:56
of programs from probably 72 to sometime in the
1:23:59
2000s, right? Until they printed them. And then
1:24:02
I was at the club and I saw Jim DeMars. Jim DeMars
1:24:06
is a Heights guy. Heights graduated. His son
1:24:08
John played at the Heights. players and Jim said
1:24:13
hey I have programs back to 1951 I said Jim don't
1:24:17
throw those away oh no that's a collectible for
1:24:20
sure so that's great yeah so yeah no it's it's
1:24:24
been fun and it's been fun and I printed a bunch
1:24:27
of stuff looking up you know how long people
1:24:30
have been coat you know how many times I've been
1:24:32
to the state tournament this and that it's just
1:24:33
it's just It's fun. And I'm retired. I have a
1:24:36
lot of time. It's a great it's a great hobby,
1:24:39
then I guess it is almost like a vocation for
1:24:41
you. But that's right. But thanks for sharing
1:24:43
your memory. Scott really appreciate it. So thanks
1:24:45
for having me, Bob. And again, to our listeners,
1:24:52
thanks for hanging out with me, Bob at home,
1:24:55
and my friend Scott black. We hope you'll join
1:24:57
us for the next episode of hanging out with Bob
1:25:00
wherever you listen to your podcasts. And until
1:25:03
then, Bye!