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The Pros & Cons of Being a Youth Ministry Spouse - Student Ministry Tips · Ministry Coach: Youth Ministry Tips & Resources

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: if you were a worship pastor, there would not be an expectation.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: My spouse needs to be by my side singing or playing an instrument, and it's like I don't sing or play an instrument, so what do I do, you know?
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: Like that wouldn't be required of them.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: I don't think it should be required specifically in youth ministry either.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: It doesn't really make a lot of sense if that is not your gift set.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: We often talk about ministry as a calling.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: You know, and it's just like hey, if you're not called to it, it's going to be an uphill battle.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: So if you're forcing someone to inherit your calling just because they're your spouse, why would you want somebody to do what they're not called to do?
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: That's so abusive and unhealthy.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: If they can and want to serve, that's awesome.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: If they can't or don't want to, that's fine too.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: In this episode, we're talking all about the positives and negatives to being a youth ministry spouse.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the ministry coach podcast, where every week, we bring you actionable and practical tips that you can implement into your youth ministry.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: This is going to be a little bit of a different episode because Kristen once again lost her voice, but the show must go on, so what better way to fill void than have this idiot talk for a while instead?
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: Everyone's going to love it.
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: So what happens when you add a all nighter plus winter camp plus?
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Plus Disneyland, you get laryngitis.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: You stop screaming at everybody, I guess.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: I guess.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: So typical youth pastor problems.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: And I'm speaking at a winter camp this weekend so I got to recover.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: So I thought this will be great to kind of interview Jeff a little bit more, because it's usually you very politely listening to mostly me talk.
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: I enjoy it.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: I enjoy it.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: You have a lot of good stuff to say Thank you, but the listeners want to hear what on earth is it like to be a ministry spouse?
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: So that's what we're going to talk about today.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: We're going to talk about what's it like from your perspective and how you can encourage pastors and ministry spouses of what you like.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: What advice would you give them?
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: basically, Probably not any good advice, but I'll do my best.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: Okay, so that's the last cell for that Perkene comment.
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: All right, you're going to have to move on from that.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: Okay, so let's just start off with the bad news.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: What's the bad news?
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: What has?
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: been the hardest part about being a ministry spouse for the last 12 and a half years.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: So I did write down some notes I knew these questions ahead of time, just to give me a little bit of a prep for myself.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: So I listed actually a bunch of things, which is kind of scary.
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: But the first one was one of the more difficult things I think are.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: The hardest part about being a ministry, youth ministry spouse is there's a lot of conflicting schedules a lot of times, and I think specifically this comes when both spouses work, and that's our case and we have two kids, which is a whole other element of difficulty to try and plan everything and make sure everyone has enough time to do everything that they need to do.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: And I'll get into this a little bit later with one of the other questions.
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: But one thing I think that can alleviate a lot of that which we try to do is have a shared calendar.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: I don't think we do a great job of sharing it, but it's there, you know like we have access to it, but I feel like we don't always update it as often as we should.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: But fortunately for us in our situation, I have a flexible job.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: Your job is relatively flexible outside of meetings, events, camps, things like that, but those are kind of some things that are a little difficult, I think, to navigate, when it's like well, I have a career, you have a career.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: So when those things conflict, all of a sudden it's like wait a second, this isn't going to add up.
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: That can be.
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: That can be a little bit difficult.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: Like a game of chicken.
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: Who's going to back down their schedule for her?
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so another thing that's been I wouldn't say I'm listing everything that's been the hardest part.
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: These things are not like end of the world type of things, but you asked and so these were my answers.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: But one of them is we at our church are now at three services one Saturday night to Sunday.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: We never get to go to church together.
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, we're coming up on this is our 13th or 14th year.
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: What year is?
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: this 2024.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: This is our 13th year anniversary coming up and like I feel like we can count on two hands tops Maybe four fathers days ago.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: I sat in with you on Sunday for one service.
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: So that's been kind of hard, you know.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: But at the same time I feel like it's just kind of become normal and maybe that's sad.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: But you know, we talk about the message.
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: We're in a bubble study together.
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: So we talk about it but actually and really it's like all you're doing is sitting next to a person you know.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: So it's like watching a movie separately and then talking about it later.
• 5:17
  Speaker 1: It's like, does it really matter that you're not right next to each other when it's happening?
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: I know for me I tend to forget things like immediately.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: So it's always hard.
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: After the church services over, she'll say what do you think of the message?
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: And I'll be like I'm trying to remember what it was.
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: So I'm sure if we were both in there together, maybe being able to have that conversation sooner would help jog my memory a little bit better.
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: So that's another one.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Number three I don't think this applies to us.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: So I'm throwing this one in there because I feel like this is a kind of like a classic statement, but again, it doesn't really apply.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: But a lot of times a problem that will come up is that spouses of youth, pastors or people in youth ministry will say you are more concerned with your youth group and your flock than you are with your own family, and it's like every time something comes up, you're at church or you're with a student, or you're mentoring or you know, fixing a problem, and we feel neglected.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: I don't, I don't feel that way at all, I mean, but I'm kind of throwing that out there because I'm sure that is a problem that a lot of youth ministry or just ministry spouses in general have.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: But I don't, I don't see that, you know from.
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: I've never experienced that like where I feel like man, you're always there and you're never.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: No, I don't, it doesn't, it doesn't faze me like that at all.
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: I don't think you, you do that so good job Yay.
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: Thank you, I'm glad.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: I hope our kids feel that same way as well.
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: This one.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: I think this could probably be true for just any job, but sometimes you feel like because, ministry, when you have a group of volunteers and you're really tight with them, sometimes it can almost feel like, wow, you have like a life outside of my life where it's funny, because sometimes you'll say you'll talk about a volunteer and you'll throw out a name and I'm like who?
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: I've never heard of that person before.
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember you saying that the other day, and yet like for a few hours.
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: I feel like I have to keep describing the same people to you.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: That's true, I have a horrible memory.
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: It's this one, it's that one.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: But a lot of times it's because I've never met them and so I can't like put a face to a name and things like that.
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: Or even every now and then, if I go to youth group, your youth ministry, like midweek, I'll see people and be like I have no clue who that is, or like are they even a leader or a student, like I have no idea.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: So there is sometimes that where you can kind of feel like Left hand.
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like sometimes, like there might be like these inside jokes or things that you guys will talk about.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: Like I have no idea what you guys are talking about, but again, I don't.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: These aren't like so I want you to quit.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: You know, like type things, like none of these.
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: To be honest, none of these are very high.
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: Wow, this episode could have taken a turn.
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: The one where Jeff tells Kristen to quit Right Live on the air.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: This one again.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: This is another one that I can't say is true, but I think hypothetically this could be the case.
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: So you have had really great campus pastors or bosses.
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: You've had really great coworkers.
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: I could see if that wasn't the case.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: Like bringing that home, bringing that home.
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: And then it's different because if you were, if you worked at some corporate company and you know my boss is horrible and I could, I could dislike Mr So-and-so or Mrs So-and-so and we could commiserate together and I'd probably never see them, maybe at a Christmas party, but with church it's like if you're mad or you're upset with your boss or the, you know the pastor, it's also your pastor, it's my pastor, or just someone I know really well.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: And then if you were to be there every Sunday and it's like having to put on you know a fake, you know facade and just be like, hey, how's it going In back of my mind, I'm like you're such a jerk.
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: You know all the dirt.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I could see that being a really difficult thing to have to navigate, so would you okay?
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: if that were the case, would you want to be told?
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: Or would you?
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: be like hey, like that's going to ruin my relationship with this person.
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: No, because my relationship with you means more than my relationship with them.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: And so for those of you who couldn't hear that, she said oh, it's true, though, because I would want to know those things, because I wouldn't want you to be struggling with something and me being completely oblivious.
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: That would be.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: I think that would be more difficult doing it that way.
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: So I think those would be the answers for those questions or that question.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: So then, and this you know, you can answer this like from your own experience, our own experience, but how do you think youth ministry spouses can be the most encouraging or supportive to their pastor or ministry lead spouse?
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: I always try to ask you know questions.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: You always say too many questions.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: Not too many, it's like yeah.
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: Like once.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: I'm like.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: How would I know the answer to?
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: that it's like, and then I feel just so dumb like well, should I have asked that?
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: So Jed came and he brought cake.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: What kind of cake was it?
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: Where was it from?
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: Like, what was the icing made out?
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: of, was it on sale.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: I'm too interested in this.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: It's like, okay, wow, that was not gonna be the end of the story, but now we're.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Was it round?
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: Was it square?
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: Did it have flowers on it?
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: Who got the first piece?
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: How big was it?
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: Why did they go first?
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: You get the idea.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: So I would say, though asking a lot of good questions and listening, you know, because I feel like there's always the chance, I always say when you come home late after a Tuesday night program, if you're late, I'm like things either went really well or they went really bad.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: Most of the time really bad For late being late, Not always.
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you guys are like oh, we were all hanging out and doing a dance party and whatever.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: With these people that I have no idea who they are.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: My other friends, your other life.
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: So I think, just kind of being, you're invited to hang out with us, you never come.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: I'll put the kids to bed.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: I'll drive over there.
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: I know like you could come in and like I don't know.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: So for years I did, I volunteered for seven years and then, when we had our first daughter, I just kind of took a break.
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: And now that we have a second, I never looked back and I never looked back.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: The spell was broken.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: I go and I'm like, who are these kids?
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: They're wild, they're crazy.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: No, thanks, but no, maybe one day I'll come back.
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: I could see me doing that at some point.
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: But to answer your question, just asking a lot of questions, you listening?
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: I think the default thing for guys is always to solve problems and sometimes it's not.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: I think I don't think what people use specifically want to hear.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: Like when you said it was my fault that I lost my voice.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: Why didn't you use?
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: a microphone.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: I did Well.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: Why did you use a megaphone?
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: I did.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: Well, why'd you keep yelling at people?
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Okay, I was at Camp Paul weekend.
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: The voice has gone and it's not my fault, like that.
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: I think I was less aggressive with my questions.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Was not All good points, police You've been out of youth ministry too long.
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: You've been a megaphone.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: It's going to solve this laryngitis.
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's your own problem.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: Thanks for your compassion.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: Tell us more about how to encourage yourself so anyways that's.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: I mean honestly that I think that's a big part of it Knowing as much as you can about the ministry.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: If you're not, this is also kind of assuming that you're not involved in the ministry actively, like being a volunteer in it Just kind of trying to be from an outside perspective, like as much a part of it as you can.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, so that brings up a good question.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: Like some, churches are very adamant that the spouse and the youth pastor are both involved in some way shape or form in ministry, and you've just made it really clear you're not anymore.
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: You were so kind of explain that dynamic like being involved versus not being involved, and like expectations of church leadership and even some spouses, they have an expectation of their spouse Like well, I have a built-in small group leader right here.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: I have a built-in admin right here.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: I say if they can and want to serve, that's awesome, If they can't or don't want to, that's fine too.
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: I think an analogy that kind of came to mind for me was if you were a worship pastor, there would not be an expectation my spouse needs to be by my side singing or playing an instrument, and it's like I don't sing or play an instrument, so what do I do?
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: You know like that wouldn't be required of them.
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: I don't think it should be required specifically in youth ministry either.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: It doesn't really make a lot of sense.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: If that is not your gift set, and why would you want to?
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: If you were the youth pastor, why would you want to force your spouse to do it?
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: I understand the blessings and the all the good that can come from being in a ministry together, because we did get to experience that it was super fun, but at the same time it's like, if that is not healthy or just what you're called to do, why would you want somebody to do what they're not called to do?
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: That's so abusive and unhealthy, I think, for somebody.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: And you can probably breed some resentment too Totally.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: You know, like what other job could you be like?
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: Hey, you have to come to work with me.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: Hey you have to do free assisting for me.
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: Like you know, ministry, yeah, no other capacity.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: Would that be required?
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Or expected.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's weird because we often talk about ministry as a calling.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: You know, and it's just like, hey, if you're not called to it, it's gonna be an uphill battle.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: So if you're forcing someone to inherit your calling just because they're your spouse, like I mean, does anyone even know if Paul?
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: ever got married yeah like you know what I mean, like it wasn't.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: If he was, we didn't hear anything about her.
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: And the only reason I knew Peter was married is because I watched the chosen and he had a wife and they were always fighting.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: But which brings us back to Paul.
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: He could see that.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: Well he's like if you don't need to get married, don't because ministry's hard, but like we don't really hear about any of the disciples' wives.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: Like maybe you guys are smarter than me and know the answer to that, but I've been a Christian since I was four years old, went to a Christian school and church, every and youth group and every camp.
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: I've never heard about the disciples' wives so if they had them.
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: we don't know much about them, or maybe someone out there does, but all that to say pretty clear from scripture it's not like some requirement.
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: So what would you say?
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: Like if a church is pressuring a spouse to help in a capacity that they don't feel gifted in?
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: How would you handle that?
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: I think if this is something where you're applying at a church and that is a requirement that they have, that's a question you have to discuss with your spouse, like are they willing to do that?
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: Is that something that they're okay with?
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: And if you're not, I think at that point you either need to say we need to just pass on this.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: I personally would vocalize it as peacefully as I could just say I'm not really in favor of that.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: And here are the reasons why I, on a side note, I do think it's important for everyone to serve.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: I was just thinking that, but not necessarily have to serve.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: Because that just seems weird.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Because what if your spouse, who is in full-time ministry or even part-time ministry, all of a sudden switches roles?
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: Well, the spouse has to go with you.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: You now have a calling to your.
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: How many?
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: We've talked to so many youth pastors who are both youth pastor, worship pastor, and if all of a sudden they said you're no longer gonna be the youth pastor, we want you to full-time youth worship pastor, so your wife has to go?
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: It's like that doesn't make sense.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: Or husband.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: Right, exactly, I just default to the wife.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: What can I say?
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: I think that if you were in a ministry where all of a sudden they said, hey, this is a new thing, that would be probably more, I think, more difficult, because if you haven't gotten the job, you can make that decision before you get it.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: I mean, you might be in a position where, like, I really need this job, and again, that's a conversation you need to have with your spouse.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: But if it was, you were in a role and all of a sudden they decided, hey, now we've decided we want spouses.
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: It just seems like weird that anybody would do that.
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: I'm sure someone has faced that.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: I again.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: I would just peacefully push back and say that's not what my spouse is gifting.
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: But I like what you said, like serving somewhere.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: Like hey, my spouse is so in favor of ministry in this church and wants to find where they fit.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: You know, like Jeff is a greeter.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: I've served as a greeter and he fits on the greeter team and he tries every week to get less awkward, Less awkward doesn't help, but I try.
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: I keep toying with the idea of filming myself and miking myself up just with some of the weird stuff I just comes out the greeter chronicles Maybe.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: No, yeah, I think it is important.
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: Did we ever?
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: tell them about when you were wearing that pineapple shirt?
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: Probably not.
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: He was wearing this pineapple polo.
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: It was really cute at all these little mini pineapples on it.
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: And this lady goes oh, I love your shirt.
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: It reminds me of Hawaii.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and he goes.
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Well, I'd rather be in Hawaii than have this shirt.
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: I don't know why that's.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: That was my response to someone saying it reminds me of Hawaii.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: I'd rather be in Hawaii than have this shirt.
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: I just wanted to punch myself in the face and just go hide under a rock, and what made it worse is she didn't quite hear me, so then I had to repeat it, and the second time around it sounded even worse.
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I shouldn't be on the green.
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: Hey you are one pathetic loser.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: No offense, no offense taken, no offense Dumb and Dumber reference, just in case you think I'm really that mean, it's just a quote.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: We say to each other a lot, a lot.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: No, again, going back to that, I do think it's important for someone to serve.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: I don't think they need to be serving on the same ministry the I'm gonna just to talk for a second here.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: The blessings that you can have, though, if you are on the same ministry, if that is your calling, and you're on the same ministry as your spouse, who is in full-time or part-time ministry, is that you can share more intimately for a lack of a better word the wins and fails, because it is more.
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: There's more of a connection there.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: The same would be true if I just told you hey, a guy I went to middle school with named Mike Jones got saved last week.
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: You'd be like cool, I don't really know who Mike Jones is, maybe you had or haven't talked about him, but that's cool and probably within five minutes you had forgotten about it, whereas if it was like, hey, my best friend that you know well and love just got saved there's so much more of a connection there.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: So when things are in ministry, when there's things happening in ministry, if a kid gets saved or if a volunteer is having a problem, it's like you intimately know that person.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: I know their personal lives, I know what's going on, I know who they are, and so those wins mean so much more, or those times of mourning or what have you, means so much more because of that connection that you have with that person.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: So when you do come home and say this awesome thing happens, I don't maybe have the as close of connection with that, or it was so bummed because this happened.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: It's like, well, I don't know that student, I don't know that leader, it's like that's a bummer.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: But then I can kind of move on.
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: It's not really a part.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: So I feel like you're not in the same way spouses.
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: You do life together.
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: When you're doing ministry, it's ministry life together and it's just so much more of a connection.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: Ministry life, yeah what.
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: You should be on the creating team.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: I was just gonna say that here's a riddle, what's cringy, awkward and has two thumbs, that girl.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: I don't know what he's talking about.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: Let's try to make a greater joke.
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: I've learned Gytus of the brain as well.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can see that.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: What's next?
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: So how do you we kind of you talked about this a little bit with like the whole concept of the calendar and you know, in the beginning when you were saying like I'm really good at making time for our family and not making it seem like I'm married to the ministry or anything like that but how do you think a ministry spouse can hold their pastor spouse accountable for like their health and family and time management?
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: And relationship management, that kind of thing.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: I think if you are intentional about your time, we do have a shared calendar, but it's not we need to actually move it online.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: We just have it as literally a physical copy and so it's like if I'm not home, someone says what are you doing on this day?
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: It's like I don't know.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: I got to wait till I get back home to check.
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: But if you can update that regularly and really be like okay, I know where, you know when you have an event or where this is happening, there's a meeting and vice versa, I'm going to be gone for work for this or that.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: And then if you set aside time and really be intentional about and stick to that and say this is the time you know, we kind of just say always say Sundays after church, sundays is just family time where neither one of us is working.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: After you know church is over and you know, and that is just set aside.
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: And sometimes something comes up where that's not the case.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: But I think if you can just make those times where you say, yeah, there's always going to be this time or if it's like hey on this day, and just not to get sidetracked here too much.
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: But I also think it can be part of seasons, because you're at a point in your minister you've been doing it a long time.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: You have a team of like 1000 volunteers, you have a really awesome guys director, you have a well oiled machine in a lot of ways where a lot of youth pastors can kind of get into.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: Like I got to, you know, I have to go to this sporting event, I need to go to this recital and like all these things, because maybe they're the only person and that's important.
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: And I think if that's for a season where it's like look, I'm really trying to build these connections with these students, I don't have this huge volunteer staff that can do a lot of those things, whereas you're at the point, you're small group leaders, you're volunteers.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: They're the ones that were a lot of times doing that, because they're the ones who are really close to those specific students.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: So when they have a sporting event or a recital or what have you, they're the ones that are there and you aren't always having to be the one that's there.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: So I think you have to have a little grace if it's like hey, I'm trying to build this thing, I'm trying to be, you know, a grower.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: You're saying like the spouse has to have some grace with the building phase.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: The spouse needs to have a little yeah.
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: Now, if that building phase because we're we should have always been a building phase, but if it's like, hey, it's been you know however long, you still don't have any volunteers your ministry's not really growing.
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: It's like like a church planter.
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: You know, like I remember we had a friend who he was a college pastor and then he planted his own church and it was like he needed that six months to whatever it was to like hit it hit the ground running and eat, sleep and breathe this thing.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: So I think you're right.
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: There's certain, but like our senior pastor always says, you can't call something a season unless it has a beginning and an end.
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: And he's like seasons do end.
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: So if you are just in this perpetual burnout, then now you're in a cycle of unhealth.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: You're not in a season anymore.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: This is normalcy for your family and that's not sustainable.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think even during that season, when you're in the middle of it, you can still make that intentional time.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: I would be shocked if someone said there's something I need to do seven days a week where I can't be at home.
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: You know that would be.
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: I can't see a situation where that would be the case.
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: So I think if you did make intentional time where the phone goes off, you know I was like this is time with my family or this is time with my spouse.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: But you know, having that caveat where it's like, hey, you're in just like a really head down, got to get things done, you know, and work hard phase, then yeah, the spouse, I think, should have a little bit of grace, you know, within that.
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: So so let's end on a positive note.
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: What is the best part, if there is one, of being a ministry spouse?
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: So I think if you are able to serve on a ministry together willingly, I think there's a lot of good that can come into your marriage and just in your spiritual life together because of the things we talked about, you know, being able to share in those wins and losses together and really kind of have that connection and knowing all of it.
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: If you are not in the same ministry, I do encourage you to serve, obviously.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: But I think some of the blessings just having a spouse in ministry is that you get to really see.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: I kind of think of it as like a backstage pass to ministry and just the church in general.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: You know, like a lot of the things that you get to see happen that maybe your average attendee you know wouldn't have access to and and and like what.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: In my mind, what I think of is like if you are at a wedding being, you know there's like if you're an attendee of a wedding it's fun and you get to see a lot of cool things and do a lot of cool things and all that.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: But it's like it's even better when you're part of the wedding party and you kind of have access more to the bride and groom and you have access to, you know just the behind the scenes stuff.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: That's kind of just a fun way I think of looking at it for ministry is you always know, you know staff members better and because you're around them more and you know, hopefully the Christmas parties are fun and you get to go to those two.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: But that's one thing I think of is just kind of being able to see the inner workings and sometimes you get like the inside scoop on a lot of stuff that's happening, like something like hey, this is coming down the road, this is exciting.
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: You get to know about it ahead of time so you might know, like someone who's about to get hired, you know like you'll know that ahead of time, like how exciting is that?
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: And there's just certain things like that I think that make it kind of kind of fun just to have that the inside scoop.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: And you also have like really access to other people in the church.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: You know where.
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: It's funny because I we live in a town called Fallbrook.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: I grew up for the most part in Fallbrook.
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: You did not.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: So theoretically I should know more of these people than you, but when I'm at church it's always oh, you're Kristen's husband, it's never.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: It's never the other way around, like, oh, you're Jeff's wife, no, like they always know who Kristen is.
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: But I meet so many people that know her and it's kind of like, well, I like her, so I like you.
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: Then too, you know you kind of like you're on the inside track, like with everything, which is kind of fun.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's sweet, so I think you've shared probably too much.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: No, but is there like one big lesson that you've learned?
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: That you would want to leave people with like when it comes down to all of this, like you said so many good things If it was like?
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: You know, this is one of the biggest lessons I've learned that could help or encourage.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: I'll give you.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: I'm going to give a negative and a positive.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Okay, balance things out and I'll start with a negative.
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: So we'll know.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: And on a positive note, but sometimes it's difficult, you know, and I'm sure a lot of you youth pastors and spouses can understand this, but people can suck sometimes and you don't want to think that's in the church but unfortunately it is, because we're all human, we're all people.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: I used to work at a Marriott property in you in hospitality, and I got to see a really ugly side of human nature often.
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: And people would come to the front desk and you know I was a manager for a while and I'd hear someone just say may I speak to your manager?
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: You know be upset and they never had anything good to say, you know.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: So you'd come out there and there'd be some complaint and every now and then it would actually be legitimate, but usually it was things where it was just so trivial and you know they'd be just throwing a fit and yelling at a front desk clerk or me or whoever, because it's like I wanted a second floor room and facing the court yard and I didn't get it, and probably nine out of 10 times you could just say, okay, we'll change that.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: Like, why are you so upset?
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: And it was really hard sometimes to have compassion for people where it's like you're flying off the handle for no good reason and I always wanted to say to them do you really think I or the front desk clerk or whatever, woke up today and thought I'm going to mess with Mr Johnson and not give him a second floor with a balcony?
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: It's like no, it was a simple mistake.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: It was either no one knew and we can correct it, or it was.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: We literally don't have that and it's not our fault as much as it's like it was a request.
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: So anyways, I'm kind of getting off on a tangent, but sometimes I feel that same mentality that can be maybe some entitled people will come at the senior pastor or you or someone in ministry and hearing about it.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: It does kind of come back to that thing where it's like I know those things.
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: It's hard for me to see that person Like you know too much Sometimes and just kind of thinking like you, people in ministry work so hard and I believe I know for sure you, your heart is for your students, for your volunteers, for the parents.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: So when someone ever comes and has this beef about whatever, you just want to say like, can we sit down somewhere and just talk about what is going on in your life, that you would talk to somebody in ministry that way, Because they act like that just entitled person that got a cheeseburger instead of a hamburger or throwing a fit at a restaurant and you're just like what is going on in your life and I think just seeing some of that is.
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: So like that protective side of like you see, like dang, you work so hard and then getting treated and that doesn't happen.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: You're flipping with your job, you're like whatever, I don't even care.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: And then stuff happened and it'd be like you kind of deserve the backlash.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: But when your whole goal is to build students up, have them grow in a relationship with God, and then some parents throwing a fit because for whatever you know, it's like wow, like I don't know, I just like a little discouraging.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the sidelines.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: So I think that's one thing.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: That's, you know, a lesson of learn that people people can be difficult in any aspect of life.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: You know, no matter what I mean.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: You'd think in ministry people would have a little more grace, but it's not the case a lot of times.
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: Well, that's kind of like what the sermon was about this weekend.
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: Like he was talking about it's the sin in us, like it's not necessarily like us as much as it is the sin that still lingers and finds a way out of us sometimes.
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: So then, like, what is?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: What was the good lesson you play?
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: No, I didn't have one.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: I'm not even the mood to talk about it, I think a really cool thing about having a spouse in ministry is your is raising a family, with that being a part of your life.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: It's such an integral part of your life.
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: So therefore, part of our lives, and being able to have two daughters who are like not just we consistently go to church, but like they're truly, truly just growing up within the church and they love it, you know and and that's also not just the testament to you but also to our church which is very, a very healthy environment and do such a good job with the children's ministry, youth ministry and beyond but just being able to raise a family within a healthy church environment like that has been a huge, huge blessing.
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: And they don't ever see like that side that you're talking about, like I never talk.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: You know, sometimes our older one will be like were there any bad kids today?
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: And like she wants to know you know and like don't worry about it, but you know, like they are.
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: Senior pastor has said I wanted to raise a family that, like at the end of my career, would still love the God I serve and the church I work for.
• 34:41
  Speaker 2: And he's like so I always did my ministry in a way that my kids would not be like my parents got, or my dad got, eaten alive by those people.
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: Or you know he was married to the church and was never home and he loved those youth group kids more than he loved us or the church did him dirty in one way or another.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: Like just knowing, like you don't want to burn your family on like you're a grown man, I think you can tell the difference between people and God, right, but like formative years of faith, people confuse that kind of stuff like well, christians.
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: My mom got fired by the church, therefore, god is bad.
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like because those people said they love God.
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: And if those kind of people do bad things or make my family you know, then it's like gets really messy and complicated.
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: But I think where we're at right now like our kids can't get enough of church and of the leaders that they're in their classes and you know it's it is such an incredible front row seat.
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: They get to healthy ministry like there's nothing to hide.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: It's not like well, we go to church.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: But I know the truth.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: You know, it's like like I work behind the scenes and there's nothing I need to like.
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: Protect you guys from because it's all healthy.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: So being in a healthy church makes that very easy.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, all right.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: So we don't really have any question of the day per se, but we do have a comment of the day, and this comes from Nina Medina, who says thank you both so much.
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: You guys are a prayer answer.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: Oh really.
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: That's what she said.
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: Nina right there.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: She's so sweet, I'm so glad.
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: Nina appreciate that, and also, if you guys can pray for Kristen's voice, that it would come back, because we really can't do another week of this.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: So well, and I have four days before I have to go to the mountains and do a whole other camp.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: At least.
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: Being a speaker, you're probably not going to have to herd cats and be yelling for kids to get yeah it'll be just like getting the messages done, but it takes so much effort to get taught the words out.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: It's frustrating.
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: All right, all right, that's enough.
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: Long episode I hope you guys enjoyed that.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: I wonder why it wasn't my fault.
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: You're the one time I'll be featured.
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: My voice is really hurting right now.
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: I've been talking too much.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: Maybe you should use the microphone.
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: Talk way too much, your fault.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: It's all my fault.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: All right guys.
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for watching and listening it will see you next time.
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: Today we're talking all about the positives and negatives to being a youth ministry spouse from somebody who's the youth ministry spouse.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the ministry coach podcast, where every week, we bring you actionable something.
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Is your house, is your house, is your spouse?
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: So much for watching and listening and make sure, oh yeah.