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Five Unsolved Murders in "The Most Beautiful Small Town in America," Bardstown · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I want to tell you
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Speaker 1: a story about a town in Kentucky, a beautiful, close
0:13
Speaker 1: knit town where some truly horrible things have happened. I
0:16
Speaker 1: know everybody, so it's hard to also to think that
0:19
Speaker 1: somebody here in my town would do such a thing.
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Speaker 1: A police officer with a wife and two young sons,
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Speaker 1: a teacher and her teenage daughter, a thirty five year
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Speaker 1: old mother, and eighteen months later, her father. Four of
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Speaker 1: them murdered, one of them missing, considered dead. All of
0:38
Speaker 1: the cases are unsolved. It makes me fearful to even
0:42
Speaker 1: speak of it. So that kind of gives you a
0:45
Speaker 1: little insight. We'll tell you about those victims and not
0:49
Speaker 1: only how they died, but how they lived, and delve
0:53
Speaker 1: into the lives turned upside down by these horrific crimes.
0:57
Speaker 1: Growing up here and dealing with everything that's going on now.
1:00
Speaker 1: It's like Bardstown, the quote most beautiful small town in America?
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Speaker 1: Does it hold a deadly secret? Well, A brand new
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Speaker 1: podcast is tackling five unsolved murders surrounding this small and
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Speaker 1: quaint Kentucky town. I mayn't see, Grace. This is Crime Stories,
1:23
Speaker 1: and I've got two very special guests. I want to
1:26
Speaker 1: introduce to you Jessica Nole, my longtime friend, investigative journalist
1:30
Speaker 1: and now podcast producer with Vault Studios, who has created
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Speaker 1: the Bardstown Podcast with her. Shaye McAlister, investigative reporter with
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Speaker 1: wh AS in Louisville. Welcome ladies, Jessica Nol. Let's start
1:45
Speaker 1: with you. Jessica, how did we actually meet? I've known
1:48
Speaker 1: about you for years and years, but how did we
1:50
Speaker 1: actually meet? I think the first time that we met
1:54
Speaker 1: was when Paige Johnson disappeared from Northern Kentucky and I
1:58
Speaker 1: was covering that story back in I think two thousand
2:01
Speaker 1: and eight, and I came on your show and talked
2:06
Speaker 1: which show which shown? Yeah? Yeah? Oh? Was I mean
2:11
Speaker 1: to you? Did I cut you off and try to
2:13
Speaker 1: argue with you? I hope you scared me a little.
2:16
Speaker 1: I'm so happy. I'm so happy. I hope I made
2:19
Speaker 1: you t just a tiny bit. Now wait a minute, now,
2:22
Speaker 1: I remember that very very well. I can't imagine what
2:27
Speaker 1: I could have argued with you about, but that you know,
2:29
Speaker 1: whenever I didn't disagree with someone, the rating is just
2:33
Speaker 1: with me. So whatever you said, I'm sure I disagreed
2:36
Speaker 1: I remember your reporting on that was was excellent. Jessica Nole. Now, Jessica,
2:42
Speaker 1: how did you come up with the idea for the
2:45
Speaker 1: Bardstown podcast? And that is bard b as in brother
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Speaker 1: aar d dog s t own as in the bard
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Speaker 1: as in Shakespeare Bardstown podcast dot com? How did you
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Speaker 1: come up with the idea? Actually, I didn't come up
3:02
Speaker 1: with the idea. This was a pitch from shoo stop
3:07
Speaker 1: right there. You obviously haven't been in the media business
3:10
Speaker 1: for very long because everybody takes credit for everything, but
3:13
Speaker 1: whether it's theirs or not. I've learned that the hard way.
3:17
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, the ideas I've pitched and it's like eh.
3:20
Speaker 1: And then like two months later we announced. I'm like what,
3:23
Speaker 1: So I'm actually hearing someone truthful and Jackie Dave can
3:28
Speaker 1: you believe this? She's actually saying it was somebody else's idea.
3:32
Speaker 1: I am so happy. I've got so many people that
3:36
Speaker 1: I credit with. Well, the Nancy Gray Show, let's just
3:39
Speaker 1: start right there, because Jessica, you remember being on h
3:42
Speaker 1: l N. I don't know if you could hear all
3:44
Speaker 1: the commotion in the control room in New York, but
3:47
Speaker 1: there would be twenty people in the control room, including
3:50
Speaker 1: my beloved executive producer Dean Zuccoli. So, I mean it
3:53
Speaker 1: takes a lot of people to pull a show like
3:56
Speaker 1: that off. And here Jackie, Dave Wilson, Lee Egan, Ellen Colorne.
4:02
Speaker 1: I mean, there's no single person in my mind can
4:06
Speaker 1: really build a successful program. And I hate to use
4:10
Speaker 1: the worn out words it takes a village, but it
4:13
Speaker 1: really does. I got a hand it to you, Jessica
4:15
Speaker 1: forgiving Shay the credit. Let's go to Sha McCallister, investigative
4:18
Speaker 1: reporter with wh a s in a Louisville Shay. Let
4:22
Speaker 1: me just start off with getting something straight. How many
4:24
Speaker 1: people mispronounced Louisville mostly everyone. I cannot believe you nailed
4:28
Speaker 1: it right on the first try. That never happened. You're
4:32
Speaker 1: not kidding, Shane McCallister. And I'll tell you the only
4:34
Speaker 1: reason I know how to say it correctly at the
4:37
Speaker 1: get go. When I first got out of law school,
4:40
Speaker 1: I took a job. It is the only legal job
4:43
Speaker 1: I did not like in any capacity, because I weren't
4:46
Speaker 1: for a judge who was just let me say a
4:48
Speaker 1: big horse's ass. I mean, there's really no way around.
4:52
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, he was the worst, and he also
4:54
Speaker 1: smoked in the office. I just want to put that
4:56
Speaker 1: out there in the federal courthouse, I might add, well, anyway,
5:00
Speaker 1: why are you laughing, Jackie? He was, I mean the worst.
5:05
Speaker 1: Every day, give me some coffee. I mean, at least
5:08
Speaker 1: be nice about ordering your female clerk aunt. Anyway, that's
5:11
Speaker 1: a whole No other cannonors. But another intern who I adored,
5:16
Speaker 1: Lisa Horde maidename Lisa English, was from Louisville. And she
5:23
Speaker 1: didn't tell me how to say it. I heard her
5:25
Speaker 1: say it, and that's how I know how to say it,
5:28
Speaker 1: because everybody else says Louisville like Louisville slugger White, it's
5:33
Speaker 1: supposed to be a Louisville slugger. Oh my goodness, now
5:35
Speaker 1: my heads all messed up, Shay, how did you come
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Speaker 1: up with this idea? Well, I've covered these cases here
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Speaker 1: in Louisville for the last four years since I moved
5:44
Speaker 1: here and started working as a reporter. And when our
5:47
Speaker 1: parent company and the company that Jessica works for, a
5:50
Speaker 1: AULT Studios, asked for pitches, asking for what's going to
5:54
Speaker 1: be a good story, what's going to be our next
5:55
Speaker 1: big podcast? I thought this one was perfect for it.
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Speaker 1: It's hard to believe it really is. Guys with me
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Speaker 1: Shay McAlister, investigative reporter with wh A s N Louisville
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Speaker 1: and no it is not Louisville. Okay, that makes the
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Speaker 1: residence of Louisville just cringe. Also with me Jessica Nole,
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Speaker 1: investigative journalists, my longtime friend and now podcast producer with
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Speaker 1: Vault Studios. The name of the podcast Bardstown Podcast. Take
6:26
Speaker 1: a listen to this, Okay, now is scary warning. He
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Speaker 1: sees something in the middle of the road. There are
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Speaker 1: freshly cut and purposely placed tree limbs in the middle
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Speaker 1: of the exit ramp. He pulls his cruiser across the
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Speaker 1: ramp to block any oncoming traffic, puts on his flashing lights,
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Speaker 1: and steps out of his cruiser to remove the debris.
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Speaker 1: But someone is hiding among the lavender spring flowers just
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Speaker 1: off the slanted pavement. When Jason bends down to grab
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Speaker 1: an armful of branches, he's ambushed. Booming twelve gage shotgun
7:02
Speaker 1: blasts ring out. He's struck in his kevlar vest and
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Speaker 1: under his arm. More shots penetrate the darkness and the officer.
7:11
Speaker 1: He's sprayed with pellets striking his right upper arm, forearm,
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Speaker 1: and right elbow. More plow into his scalp, his forehead,
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Speaker 1: his temple, and his right jaw. He doesn't have time
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Speaker 1: to react or to grab his gun from his holster.
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Speaker 1: His body collapses to the pavement and the tree limbs
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Speaker 1: fall onto his legs. Blood seeps onto the asphalt below him,
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Speaker 1: leaving a trail of red. Hello. Hello, oh my stars,
7:44
Speaker 1: you just scare the crap out of me. Now, of
7:47
Speaker 1: course we're not allowed to say crap in our home,
7:49
Speaker 1: but for you shay McAllister and Jessica Nole, I will
7:52
Speaker 1: just let it go. Wow. In that one segment, you
7:57
Speaker 1: have capsualized what this is all about. For those of
8:02
Speaker 1: you just joining us. It's a brand new podcast called
8:06
Speaker 1: Bardstown Podcast b as in brother a r d st
8:11
Speaker 1: Own as in Shakespeare The Bard. It is a ten
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Speaker 1: episode series and it describes Bardstown, the quote most beautiful
8:23
Speaker 1: small town in America. It's in the heart of Kentucky,
8:28
Speaker 1: a tight knit community, but doesn't harbor a deadly secret.
8:44
Speaker 1: Climb stories with Nancy Grace, he frantically grabs the officers
8:49
Speaker 1: radio on his uniform. Out of breath, he calls over
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Speaker 1: to dispatch. I'll come home from all And there was
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Speaker 1: the police already sitting in the middle road with a
9:01
Speaker 1: life on and we didn't know what it was as
9:05
Speaker 1: a career across the road and I didn't know what
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Speaker 1: it was. And I got out. I know what I
9:09
Speaker 1: fur look good at deal. I believe from a pity Okay,
9:14
Speaker 1: can you tell if he's breathing. He is breathing. Lot
9:19
Speaker 1: of damagery is cold. I'm thinking about the setus of
9:23
Speaker 1: the officers. He consciousness. I'm believe you. There soon a
9:28
Speaker 1: flood of blue lights light up the night sky, dancing
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Speaker 1: off of treetops and illuminating the horror. Jason's fellow officers
9:34
Speaker 1: are about to drive up to one by one as
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Speaker 1: they received the call from dispatch to exit thirty four.
9:40
Speaker 1: Than it's far too how a fifty five they're potful
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Speaker 1: office down an officer and rude or what kind of
9:52
Speaker 1: run or where we're going on? We're not sure. We
9:57
Speaker 1: have officers responding from Marktown. We had on the officers radio.
10:06
Speaker 1: We're not sure what's going on. You are hearing just
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Speaker 1: a tiny bit of the Bardstown podcast about a small
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Speaker 1: Kentucky town that apparently harbors a nefarious, sinister and deadly secret.
10:17
Speaker 1: To Jessica Nol, investigative Journalists podcast producer with Vault Studios,
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Speaker 1: explained to me how these five murders are interconnected or
10:27
Speaker 1: are they? I mean, we're starting off, apparently with the
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Speaker 1: Officer of the Year, Jason Ellis, on his way home
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Speaker 1: from his shift. So how are the other four murders
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Speaker 1: in your mind, Jessica, without giving away your ten episode
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Speaker 1: series finale, do you think they're connected? Well, starting with
10:45
Speaker 1: Jason's keys, you know, I covered that extensively back in
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Speaker 1: twenty thirteen when it happened, and then and I covered
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Speaker 1: it for Cincinnati because that's where he was from. And
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Speaker 1: then year after year, these other horrific tragedies, you say,
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Speaker 1: year after year. I know, the Bradstown police officer Jason
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Speaker 1: Ellis was ambushed and killed on his way home just
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Speaker 1: after signing off for the night. Seemed like someone was
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Speaker 1: lying in wait for him near I believe it was
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Speaker 1: X at thirty four and it was around two o'clock
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Speaker 1: in the morning. That's not just coincidence. Now, shooting at
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Speaker 1: two am, yeah, I get. I would get one of
11:27
Speaker 1: those every Saturday night in Inner city Atlanta, but in
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Speaker 1: this location at two am out on an exit on
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Speaker 1: the highway that is planned. Now the next murder is
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Speaker 1: I recall was about a year later, seemingly unconnected. A
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Speaker 1: mother and her daughter. What happened there? So Kathy and
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Speaker 1: Samantha Netherland, her daughter, Samantha was sixteen years old. They
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Speaker 1: didn't show up for school. Samantha didn't show up for
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Speaker 1: she was a high school student. She didn't show up.
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Speaker 1: And her mom, Kathy, was a special education teacher at
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Speaker 1: the elementary school, and she didn't shop for work. So
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Speaker 1: the mother is a specially a teacher. She doesn't show up.
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Speaker 1: And you're telling me the daughter Samantha didn't show up
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Speaker 1: for school? Was Samantha? Did she go to that school
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Speaker 1: or a different school? Samantha went to the high school
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Speaker 1: and her mom worked at the elementary school. Oh my goodness.
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Speaker 1: You know, if these are interconnected, to solve one solves
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Speaker 1: them all. So let's circle back for a moment. Let's
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Speaker 1: circle back. Take a listen to this. Richard Caldwell grew
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Speaker 1: up visiting his grandparents in Bardstown. Today, he describes himself
12:44
Speaker 1: as a citizen journalist. The Jason Ellis murderer really slammed
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Speaker 1: on the brakes for a lot of people. It made
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Speaker 1: people locally and beyond stop and really pay attention. And
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Speaker 1: I think evincith happened since then just add to that.
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Speaker 1: In his blog and now with us, he shares his
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Speaker 1: thoughts on what he believes happened to the Bartstown police officer. Well,
13:09
Speaker 1: the hot gossip at the time was that a local
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Speaker 1: gang called the BMGs or the Big Money Gang they're
13:16
Speaker 1: big on drug trafficking, that they had some sort of
13:20
Speaker 1: involvement in it. And I have cousins who consider themselves
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Speaker 1: parts of the BMG And from everything I've gathered, I
13:28
Speaker 1: think there are a bunch of kids that watch entirely
13:31
Speaker 1: too much television. I don't think that they would have
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Speaker 1: the brains or the resources to execute the execution of
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Speaker 1: a law enforcement officer. I mean, just considering the planning
13:43
Speaker 1: that had to go into it, I think it's an
13:46
Speaker 1: easy cop out to try to pin it on, you know,
13:48
Speaker 1: some gang banger wannabes. The angle was funny enough that
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Speaker 1: it wasn't just some random idiot with a gun, and
13:54
Speaker 1: it probably wasn't even a hobbyist hunter. It was someone
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Speaker 1: who knew how to use a long range assault rifle.
14:02
Speaker 1: And there's a lot of veterans here, but there's also
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Speaker 1: the law enforcement community itself. Oh my goodness, those last
14:11
Speaker 1: few words open up a real Pandora's box, a real
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Speaker 1: can of worms as to who the killer may be.
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Speaker 1: You were just hearing Richard Cardwell, a quote citizen journalist
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Speaker 1: who is going through some of the theories about the
14:23
Speaker 1: original murder or at least we think it was the
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Speaker 1: first one of the Officer of the Year Jason Ellis
14:29
Speaker 1: on his way home to Jessica Nole the Star along
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Speaker 1: with Shae McAllister of Bardstown Podcast. Jessica, what were some
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Speaker 1: of the theories at the get go when the officer
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Speaker 1: Jason Ellis was gunned down and that was no accident
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Speaker 1: and that was not a fly by the night or
14:45
Speaker 1: some quote kids that have been watching too many video
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Speaker 1: games or playing Call of Duty. Because I got to
14:53
Speaker 1: tell you something, Jessica, and I'm not happy about it.
14:56
Speaker 1: You know how I feel about gun violence. I'm a
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Speaker 1: gun violence victim. For Pete say, we do not have
15:01
Speaker 1: guns in the home. We didn't even say the word.
15:04
Speaker 1: We spelled gu in. When the children were growing up,
15:07
Speaker 1: they did not play with toy guns. Long story short,
15:11
Speaker 1: I take my twins to Scout camp. I volunteer. I
15:14
Speaker 1: live in a tent that leaked for a week out
15:18
Speaker 1: in the middle of nowhere. It was beautiful, but let
15:20
Speaker 1: me just say rustic. I shared a tent with about
15:23
Speaker 1: twenty five granded long legs and my son. One of
15:27
Speaker 1: the things they did one of their classes was gum
15:32
Speaker 1: and ship. I didn't like it, but I thought, well,
15:34
Speaker 1: if I throw some kind of a fit, he'll want
15:37
Speaker 1: it even more what it required. One day, I locked
15:40
Speaker 1: thirty three thousand steps on my fittbed that my children
15:43
Speaker 1: gave me for Mother's Day hint, hint, mom, and going
15:47
Speaker 1: back and forth so I could keep an eye on him.
15:50
Speaker 1: Of course, it was a Scout activity, and they had
15:52
Speaker 1: it totally well done, orderly, as safe as you can
15:57
Speaker 1: possibly be. Not only did he get his quarter a
16:01
Speaker 1: quarters when you fire at fifty feet and you get
16:06
Speaker 1: five consecutive shots in the space of a quarter the
16:11
Speaker 1: coin he was, and you have to do it five
16:14
Speaker 1: times five quarters. Not only that, Jessica, I hope you're
16:18
Speaker 1: sitting down. He got his dime, which is ten shots
16:22
Speaker 1: at fifty feet in the space of a dime. Oh
16:27
Speaker 1: my stars. Okay, when I was watching that and I
16:29
Speaker 1: had to train in ballistics to be an assistant DA.
16:32
Speaker 1: We had the power to carry a weapon, which I
16:37
Speaker 1: did not. But shooting a high power to assault rifle
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Speaker 1: at that distance to gun down Ellis. That was not
16:46
Speaker 1: some kid that's been playing fortnight. I'm beating around the bush.
16:51
Speaker 1: But Jessica, what were some of the theories as to
16:55
Speaker 1: who gunned down executed the officer? That was only a methodical,
17:02
Speaker 1: well laid out plan. They were waiting for him. It's
17:05
Speaker 1: believed that he was the target. They knew when he
17:08
Speaker 1: was coming, and we've driven I've driven several times to
17:14
Speaker 1: that exit off the Bluegrass Parkway at the time that
17:19
Speaker 1: he was ambushed at two am, and it is desolate,
17:23
Speaker 1: It is quiet and dark, and there's no one on
17:26
Speaker 1: the roads. So they knew that he was coming at
17:30
Speaker 1: that time and early on, a lot of the theories
17:33
Speaker 1: that came out were this Bardstown money gang, or it
17:38
Speaker 1: had to do with drugs, or you know, was it
17:42
Speaker 1: someone in the in the police force that had a
17:44
Speaker 1: grudge against him. So there was a lot of floating
17:47
Speaker 1: theories that they the cartel brought someone in to take
17:52
Speaker 1: care of him because he was a canine officer. He
17:55
Speaker 1: was the only canine officer at that time, so he
17:58
Speaker 1: was in charge of getting drugs off the street. But
18:01
Speaker 1: you know, we talked to his former chief, Rick mccoben,
18:05
Speaker 1: and according to him, you know, Jason was a very
18:08
Speaker 1: tiny fish in this pond, and he doesn't believe that
18:13
Speaker 1: that it was the cartel or someone coming in to
18:17
Speaker 1: take him out. And they have looked at all the
18:21
Speaker 1: arrests he made and looked at people he arrested and
18:25
Speaker 1: anything to do with drugs, and so there was a
18:28
Speaker 1: lot of theories, a lot of tips and leads that
18:30
Speaker 1: came in. Initially, when I asked Chief mccoven about the
18:34
Speaker 1: Bardstown money gang, because that was a huge theory at
18:37
Speaker 1: the very beginning of all this, he dismissed it immediately.
18:40
Speaker 1: You know, he says they are a small time street
18:46
Speaker 1: thug gang. You know, they're they're not equipped or as
18:50
Speaker 1: he says, smart enough to pull something this methodical off
19:04
Speaker 1: crime stories with Nancy Grace to look at this town,
19:10
Speaker 1: this small Kentucky town, a tight knit community in the
19:14
Speaker 1: heart of Kentucky. It's been called the quote most beautiful
19:17
Speaker 1: small town in America, but are a series our murders connected.
19:23
Speaker 1: Shane McAllister, investigative reporter with WHAS in Louisville, and Jessica Noel,
19:27
Speaker 1: investigative journalist and podcast producer with Vault Studios, have come
19:32
Speaker 1: together to create Bardstown Podcast. You can find it at
19:37
Speaker 1: Bardstown podcast dot com. To Shay McAllister, we just heard
19:41
Speaker 1: from Jessica Knowle and she said that when the chief
19:45
Speaker 1: of police was asked about the Bardstown money Gang, he
19:48
Speaker 1: said something to the effect, well, they're too stupid to
19:50
Speaker 1: pull this off. You know, criminals a lot of times
19:54
Speaker 1: are stupid and they get lucky. But when you've got
19:58
Speaker 1: a series, for instance, here multiple murders seemingly unconnected, that's
20:06
Speaker 1: not stupid in my book. Yeah. So there in these cases,
20:10
Speaker 1: these four different cases, two of them we can say
20:14
Speaker 1: are likely connected because it is a father who had
20:19
Speaker 1: been searching for his missing daughter. A lot of people
20:22
Speaker 1: say that all of them might be connected, but there's
20:26
Speaker 1: never been any ties really put out there like that.
20:28
Speaker 1: Investigators have never confirmed that. It's just conspiracies like Richard
20:32
Speaker 1: Caldwell who try to piece them all together. And that's
20:36
Speaker 1: where we get those ties. Now, let me understand something.
20:39
Speaker 1: This beautiful young mom, Crystal Rogers, a case that I've
20:44
Speaker 1: been working on. Is she part of this and the
20:49
Speaker 1: Barnstown murders. She is? She was the third case in
20:53
Speaker 1: these string of murders. Wow. Hers of course is a disappearance,
20:57
Speaker 1: but police consider her to be dead. Okay, can I
21:00
Speaker 1: just needs flash she's dead. Crystal Rogers would never have
21:04
Speaker 1: left her family. It's just completely unlike her. She's dead.
21:11
Speaker 1: And you know, Jessica Nole, you've been with me on
21:13
Speaker 1: HLN many many times, and I don't like if I
21:18
Speaker 1: had had the victim's family on right now, I wouldn't
21:20
Speaker 1: have said that the way I just did, because I
21:23
Speaker 1: don't want to hurt their feelings. I mean, they've got
21:25
Speaker 1: to know that it's a possibility in the back of
21:28
Speaker 1: their mind, a very strong possibility. But it never feels
21:32
Speaker 1: good to victim's family to say they're dead. Never many times,
21:38
Speaker 1: even after they're buried. You don't want to put like that.
21:42
Speaker 1: It's very upsetting to crime victims families. So it's my belief,
21:48
Speaker 1: Jessica Nole, that you, Jessica and Sha McAllister, because of
21:54
Speaker 1: your Bardstown podcast, may have brought effect brought about change.
22:00
Speaker 1: Isn't it true that that a new investigator was named
22:04
Speaker 1: on the Crystal Rogers case. Yes, a new investigator has
22:08
Speaker 1: been named for Nelson County Sheriff's office. Who is the
22:12
Speaker 1: agency investigating the Crystal Rodgers disappearance? That was announced earlier
22:17
Speaker 1: this week. But when we talked to the Nelson County Sheriff,
22:21
Speaker 1: he did let us know that he has brought on
22:23
Speaker 1: what he calls an a team to investigate not just
22:28
Speaker 1: her disappearance, but what they're considering her murder. A new
22:32
Speaker 1: lead detective has been named the disappearance of a beautiful
22:36
Speaker 1: young mom, Crystal Rogers. The Nelson County Sheriff's Office announced
22:40
Speaker 1: that Chief Deputy Jody Gilliland will be the new lead
22:44
Speaker 1: detective in solving what happened to Crystal Rogers. Tell me
22:49
Speaker 1: a little bit, Jessica Noll about the disappearance of Crystal Rogers. So,
22:53
Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers disappeared the fourth of July weekend in twenty ten.
23:00
Speaker 1: The last person that she was with was her boyfriend
23:04
Speaker 1: and father, her fifth child, Brooks Howk. According to him,
23:09
Speaker 1: they went and fed cows on his mother's farm and
23:15
Speaker 1: then they went back home. She was on her phone
23:19
Speaker 1: on the couch, you know, and he goes to bed,
23:22
Speaker 1: and he wakes up the next morning, she's not there.
23:27
Speaker 1: He says he's not concerned because she does quote this
23:30
Speaker 1: all the time. Whatever that means disappears, I don't know,
23:34
Speaker 1: but that's what he tells police. And meanwhile, her family
23:39
Speaker 1: starts to get frantic because they can't find her. They
23:42
Speaker 1: can't she's not answering her phone. Well, not just a moment.
23:45
Speaker 1: We're talking about, guys. For those of you just joining us,
23:48
Speaker 1: a beautiful mom. Crystal Rogers, her disappearance and presumed death unsolved.
23:53
Speaker 1: Now for four years, she seemingly vanishes without a trace,
23:58
Speaker 1: but interesting her car, her purse, and other items are
24:04
Speaker 1: found on the Bluegrass Parkway. She has five children. Now,
24:11
Speaker 1: I'm just curious, if Crystal Rogers case is solved, does
24:17
Speaker 1: that mean the other cases they are solved. I'm not
24:19
Speaker 1: necessarily convinced her case is connected all the way back
24:24
Speaker 1: to the officer Jason Ellis's murder or the disappearance of
24:28
Speaker 1: the high school teacher and her teen daughter. It's hard
24:33
Speaker 1: for me to make that connection. But not unheard of.
24:36
Speaker 1: Shay McCallister. We've touched briefly on the murder by a
24:41
Speaker 1: sniper shot of Officer Jason Ellis out on a highway
24:47
Speaker 1: at two am. We've touched briefly on the disappearance of
24:52
Speaker 1: a high school teacher and her teen daughter. Well, we
24:54
Speaker 1: know that those two are in fact dead. We know
24:57
Speaker 1: about Crystal Rogers. Are there any other murders covered in
25:03
Speaker 1: the Bardstown podcast? Yes, there is, and the victim's name
25:06
Speaker 1: is Tommy Ballard. About sixteen months after Crystal Rogers disappeared,
25:12
Speaker 1: her father, Tommy Ballard, was shot and killed while hunting
25:16
Speaker 1: on family property with his grandson. Was there a ballistics
25:20
Speaker 1: matchup between the grandson's weapon and the murder of Tommy
25:24
Speaker 1: Ballard family have told us that they don't believe the
25:27
Speaker 1: grandson was holding a weapon at that time. He was
25:30
Speaker 1: standing right next to Tommy when Tommy was shot. Wow. Wow,
25:34
Speaker 1: that opens up a whole plethora of possibilities because I
25:39
Speaker 1: find it hard to believe unless it was a shooting accident,
25:43
Speaker 1: that the boy shot his grandfather. Very very rare, extremely rare,
25:48
Speaker 1: almost unheard of. We've heard of parenticide, which is slang
25:53
Speaker 1: for the murder of a parent by a child, much
25:56
Speaker 1: less the murder of a grandparent, So I find that
25:59
Speaker 1: very difficult to believe ballistics if the bullet was found,
26:04
Speaker 1: unless there's an entry in an exit, and the bullet
26:07
Speaker 1: was never found, should be able to be matched up
26:11
Speaker 1: to a weapon the grandson may have had or clear him.
26:16
Speaker 1: You're telling me the grandson likely didn't even have a
26:19
Speaker 1: weapon in his hands. He was just along with grandpa. Wow,
26:23
Speaker 1: that's quite the coincidence, is it not, Shaye McAllister, For
26:28
Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers to go missing, and then just shortly after that,
26:34
Speaker 1: her father, who was leading the charge and finding her,
26:38
Speaker 1: ends up dead in an unsolved shooting out in the
26:42
Speaker 1: middle of the woods, and all this is around Bardstown. Shay. Yes,
26:47
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what his wife and Crystal's mom
26:51
Speaker 1: told me hours after he was killed. She sent me
26:54
Speaker 1: a text that said, and Shay, this was no accident.
27:04
Speaker 1: Climb stories with Nancy Grace. I think the fact that
27:09
Speaker 1: Ellis was the newest police member, I think he might
27:14
Speaker 1: have unintentionally been making his fellow officers look a little bad.
27:19
Speaker 1: Maybe it was a Serpico thing, you know, where he
27:23
Speaker 1: was starting to realize that some of his fellow officers
27:26
Speaker 1: might not have been on the up and narrow and
27:29
Speaker 1: maybe they saw him as a potential threat, but I
27:32
Speaker 1: think there's more evidence to support that than to support
27:35
Speaker 1: that it was just a bunch of you know, dropout junkies,
27:40
Speaker 1: you know who pulled the trigger. The fact that it
27:43
Speaker 1: was some an experienced sharpshooter who had to have pulled
27:45
Speaker 1: it off, and I mean, that's not my opinion. That
27:48
Speaker 1: was the conclusion that the state investigators reached the Kentucky
27:52
Speaker 1: State Police in their first investigation. I've heard crazier stories
27:56
Speaker 1: that it was a Mexican hitman who flew up specially
28:00
Speaker 1: well the day before, specifically to take out Ellis, And
28:04
Speaker 1: I think that that's a little more far fetched. Could
28:07
Speaker 1: it be that maybe the cops in my town aren't trustworthy?
28:10
Speaker 1: You know? That's that's stuff that people should consider. Do
28:14
Speaker 1: you ever fear for your safety? I would think anyone does.
28:19
Speaker 1: And these are scary times we live in. The people
28:22
Speaker 1: who are supposed to be answering these questions aren't. The
28:24
Speaker 1: people who are supposed to be asking these questions within
28:27
Speaker 1: the community aren't. So somebody has to And I want
28:31
Speaker 1: to think that me and my meager resources if I
28:35
Speaker 1: get wiped out, if I end up a body in
28:37
Speaker 1: a field or something. Then there will be someone else
28:40
Speaker 1: who will continue. You know, there will be someone else
28:43
Speaker 1: to do it because truth justice in the American way,
28:46
Speaker 1: it's it's that's what everyone's supposed to be living for.
28:49
Speaker 1: You know what is happening in the small town of Bardstown, Kentucky. Well,
28:55
Speaker 1: I know two people trying to get to the bottom
28:57
Speaker 1: of it. That's on the Bardstown Podcast. It's Shane McCaw,
29:00
Speaker 1: investigative reporter with wh AS in Louisville and Jessica Nol,
29:05
Speaker 1: investigative journalist and podcast producer with Vault Studios. You were
29:09
Speaker 1: just hearing Richard Cardwell, a quote citizen journalist, concerned that
29:15
Speaker 1: he may end up dead in a field. You know,
29:17
Speaker 1: that's getting very very serious, Jessica Nol, when people are
29:22
Speaker 1: becoming afraid to ask questions with a string of unsolved
29:28
Speaker 1: murders in such a small town. Jessica, what are people
29:33
Speaker 1: that live there in Bardstown saying? There? Are they not
29:36
Speaker 1: concerned about all the unsolved murders. You'll hear this in
29:39
Speaker 1: the podcast with some of the folks we talked to.
29:42
Speaker 1: There's both this anger but also a fear, and the
29:47
Speaker 1: fear is palpable. There not necessarily a fear that they're
29:52
Speaker 1: going to get killed, but a fear in that if
29:57
Speaker 1: whoever's doing this people person that they're getting away with it,
30:02
Speaker 1: and what else does that mean for their town? And
30:06
Speaker 1: in a town where literally everyone knows everyone, everyone has
30:10
Speaker 1: a connection, is scary for them to things that they
30:13
Speaker 1: have a killer or killers living among them. I'm thinking
30:17
Speaker 1: this whole thing through. How many murders Shaye McAllister are
30:25
Speaker 1: you investigating on your Bardstown podcast? We are investigating four
30:30
Speaker 1: different cases but five victims as our main stories. But
30:35
Speaker 1: we do talk to a few others who have had
30:39
Speaker 1: family members murdered that don't have those cases answered. In Bardstown, Yes,
30:44
Speaker 1: in Bardstown, good gravy. I mean that ups the body count.
30:50
Speaker 1: You know. I want to circle back on the teacher
30:53
Speaker 1: elementary special ed teacher and her daughter. It's in high school.
30:59
Speaker 1: I know that the mom didn't show up to work,
31:01
Speaker 1: the daughter didn't show up to school, but we never
31:04
Speaker 1: complained that thought. What happened to those two to you,
31:10
Speaker 1: Jessica Noll. So family starts to get concerned because they
31:13
Speaker 1: don't show up, and a family member goes out to
31:16
Speaker 1: their house to check on them, and what they find
31:19
Speaker 1: is a grizzly scene. They had been their throats had
31:26
Speaker 1: been slashed, the daughter had had her head was beaten severely,
31:35
Speaker 1: and a lot of reports have said that a lot
31:40
Speaker 1: of the violence seemed to be geared towards the daughter, Samantha,
31:46
Speaker 1: sixteen year old daughter. Just brutal, a brutal attack, and
31:53
Speaker 1: from what we know in talking to people, these are
31:58
Speaker 1: pillars of the community. They were volin tears. They went
32:02
Speaker 1: to church, she was an honor student, she was getting
32:05
Speaker 1: ready to go to prom. There was no one, according
32:09
Speaker 1: to investigators, that they can look at and say that
32:11
Speaker 1: this is who did it based on who they were.
32:17
Speaker 1: And I shouldn't say they don't know who did it,
32:19
Speaker 1: because I don't know if they know or not. But
32:22
Speaker 1: there is there's no CD character in these people. There's
32:29
Speaker 1: nothing that would make them a target. They were just really,
32:34
Speaker 1: really good people that no one had a bad thing
32:37
Speaker 1: to say about. We are talking about the Bardstown murders,
32:41
Speaker 1: and at that moment, we were talking about the brutal
32:45
Speaker 1: murder of a teacher entertain daughter. This tiny Kentucky town
32:52
Speaker 1: has gone from the most beautiful small town in America
32:54
Speaker 1: to a place where the residents feel they've got a
32:58
Speaker 1: barricade their doors at night. Now, apparently the most brutal
33:03
Speaker 1: killing of them all was the savage beating of a
33:09
Speaker 1: sixteen year old high school student, Samantha Netherland. Her mother,
33:16
Speaker 1: a special ed teacher, Kathy, was shot in Both their
33:21
Speaker 1: throats were slashed. Now, why would you kill two unarmed women,
33:32
Speaker 1: a teacher and her daughter. You've got Jason Ellis, Officer
33:38
Speaker 1: of the Year, ambushed on an exit ramp. You've got
33:44
Speaker 1: Crystal Rogers, a mother of five, presumed dead, vanishing without
33:49
Speaker 1: a trace. You have Tommy Ballard gunned down after he
33:58
Speaker 1: was seemingly on the trail as to the killer of
34:04
Speaker 1: his daughter, Crystal Rogers. How is it all connected? Or
34:10
Speaker 1: is it a small town? Is? Jackie here in the
34:13
Speaker 1: studio says, it's almost like a horror movie where the
34:17
Speaker 1: murders just keep happening and they're never resolved. As a
34:21
Speaker 1: matter of fact, Shane McAllister, I just heard one of you,
34:26
Speaker 1: either you were Jessica, state that as you investigated these
34:30
Speaker 1: five murders, you came upon other people whose family members, relatives,
34:35
Speaker 1: friends have been murdered in those cases are also unsolved.
34:39
Speaker 1: Is that correct. Yes, that's correct, and it's a common threat.
34:44
Speaker 1: You can see as you talk to people in this town.
34:47
Speaker 1: If their own loved one has not been killed, then
34:51
Speaker 1: they know someone who has. And that's pretty remarkable in
34:55
Speaker 1: a town of eleven thousand. Now five years later, the
34:59
Speaker 1: family of this Nelson County mom and her daughter are
35:03
Speaker 1: still seeking justice. A forty eight year old mother, Kathy Netherland,
35:10
Speaker 1: her daughter just sixteen years old, Samantha Netherland, murdred in
35:15
Speaker 1: their own home. It's very hard for me to imagine
35:20
Speaker 1: with a beating death, there were no forensics, with the
35:25
Speaker 1: throat slashed, the shootings. I mean, it just very, very
35:31
Speaker 1: difficult to imagine. In none of these cases do we
35:34
Speaker 1: have forensics that can lead to the killer. I and
35:38
Speaker 1: so many people are looking for answers along with Jessica
35:42
Speaker 1: Nol investigative journalist, podcast producer, Shape McAllister, investigative reporter whas
35:48
Speaker 1: in Louisville, and you can join the investigation at Bardstown
35:54
Speaker 1: podcast dot com. Tipline five zero two three four eight
36:01
Speaker 1: heat h E A T. That's five zero two three
36:04
Speaker 1: four eight four three two. Thank you for being with me.
36:09
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace Crime Story Signing off, goodbye friend,