Latest / Finding New Waters / The Healing Power of Long-Term Recovery and Family Involvement with Jared Murray

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The Healing Power of Long-Term Recovery and Family Involvement with Jared Murray · Finding New Waters

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And those things are are crucial and and for me like getting
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sober when I was 20 like recovery had to become a
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lifestyle for me, right. Like it.
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It had to be something that I really could truly see myself
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living out each day. And and for the young men coming
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into our program like recovery happens throughout the inner
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therapeutic groups and you know recovery happens in individual
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therapy. Growth happens in those in those
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ways like those things are crucial to the therapeutic
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process. But where I see guys engage the
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most is when I see, like any other, running around on the
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softball field, smiling and laughing.
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You know what I mean? Like, I I couldn't remember the
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last time I laughed or smiled or had fun, you know what I mean?
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And when I was in treatment, like coming alive again in that
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way and experience and stuff like that, help me see that
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like, hey, this is something, man, that I might not hate.
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Good afternoon. My name is Graham Durgey and I'm
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the founder and CEO of New Waters Recovery in Raleigh, NC
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Welcome to our weekly podcast, Finding New Waters.
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Our goal in creating Finding New Waters is to provide a resource
1:22
for families to help navigate the complexities of supporting a
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loved 1 struggling with substance use or mental health.
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When we find ourselves in crisis due to one of these issues, most
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people have no idea where to turn.
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We hope to shed some light onto what is often the darkest hour
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for many families. Hello everyone.
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Welcome to Finding New Waters. I'm Ryan Jarrell, Continuing
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Care Coordinator. I I'm sitting here with Justin
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McClendon, our Executive Director, and we have the
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privilege of talking to Jared Murray, works in admissions and
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outreach at Momentum Recovery. Jared, welcome to finding new
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waters. Absolutely guys, happy to be
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here. Decided to be on here with
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y'all. Yeah, yeah this is this is
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really nice Jared. You know I know that we work
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together we we work together regularly and it's a really it's
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a really wonderful experience to be able to to to work with young
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men and and get them kind of engaged on a path that I know
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personally I think Justin knows personally and and you do as
2:20
well and. I was really hoping that you
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would open up and and talk a little bit about, you know, how
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you found yourself in the industry and and maybe how you
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found yourself in recovery yourself.
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Yeah, totally. Yeah.
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I guess a little bit of background on me.
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I grew up in Huntsville, AL, so born and raised in Alabama.
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I was hoping we would get on this podcast and just talk about
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Alabama football for an hour. But that's okay.
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We can talk about recovery instead.
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But yeah, man, I guess like a little bit about my story.
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A little bit of back story, I guess for me, like I grew up in
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a good family, had an older brother who I looked up to, had
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loving parents who poured unconditional loving to me.
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I had everything you could have ever asked for growing up.
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Of course, my family system had its own stuff in it, like every
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family system does. But somewhere along the way,
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through my experience experiences growing up, like I
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did develop a negative belief system about myself, you know?
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And like I was an athlete, I thrived in sports.
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I did well academically. I did well in social groups.
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I could put on whatever mask I needed to put on to fit in with
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whatever group I needed to fit in with.
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However, I never fully felt comfortable with myself.
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You know, I never felt fully okay with me.
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There was always that kind of emptiness and that internal
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void, that fear of not being good enough, fear of being
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alone, fear of failure, fear of success.
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Like I always struggled with that level of selfcentered fear
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that we talked about in recovery a lot.
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And as far back as I can remember, I've.
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I've always kind of felt that way.
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And so I recall, like the first time I ever tried any
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substances, I was probably about 13 years old.
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And it was like all that fear went away.
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All that insecurity went away. I felt like I could be who I
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wanted to be. I felt like I could be who
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others wanted me to be. I'm someone who really likes
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connection from others. I like acceptance from others.
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I like approval from others. And and I seem to be able to
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find all those things through the lifestyle of using drugs,
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you know, and I found that out early on when I was really
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young. And so my addiction really
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started at a young age. When I went into high school was
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when it really kind of started to really progress.
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That was when I was introduced to opiates and benzos and
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cocaine and certain substances like that, that I really
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struggled with. And so I got in a lot of legal
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trouble in high school, got arrested quite a bit, skipping
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school, getting high before school, Deering school after
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school. You know, my, my disease
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continued to progress throughout the later years of high school
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for me. And then I left Huntsville and
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went down to the University of Alabama, which was a phenomenal
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idea for the substance abuse problem I had coming out of high
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school. You know, my parents, I I talked
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to him about that decision. And they're like, man, we were
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so ready for you to get out of our house.
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I think some denial on their part is that they did think that
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I would just somehow go to college and grow up and these
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things would just figure themselves out.
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But they desperately wanted me out of their house because of
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the unmanageability that was going on as a result of my
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addiction when I was living at home.
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So I went down to Alabama, basically got heavily addicted
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to Oxycontin down there and cocaine.
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Those are my two kind of constants.
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Was an IV drug user eventually and got into some pretty big
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legal trouble when I was 20, which is what drove me to go
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into treatment. So I got arrested with a, you
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know, about 5-5 felonies and two counts of two misdemeanors and
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one big arrest. I was living in the fraternity
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house at the time, and that's kind of what pulled me out of
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the University of Alabama and put me in treatment.
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And since then I've been. I've been completely clean and
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sober since then. So January 29th, 2011 was was
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when I went to treatment and it's my sobriety date, so went
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into this thing when I was 20 and man, it's been an incredible
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journey for almost the last 13 years.
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Jared, I think it it's really interesting that you kind of got
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springboarded. A lot of people think, you know
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in a recovery setting that the only way we can enter it is when
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we have a full internal collapse.
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We've totally surrendered to the process.
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We have to be fully accepting of ourselves as Alcoholics and my
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guess is. Getting busted with the heroin
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at the frat house, That's maybe not mentally where you were at.
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Did you? Was that your motivation
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initially? And did your motivation change
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over time during your treatment experience?
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Yeah, I think that's a great question, Ryan.
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I think that ties into a lot of the things that even when I get
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to work with young men with you on, that we try to talk to
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families about and guys about is that, hey, like, you know, it's
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OK that you're not fully surrendered to the idea that
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you're an addict or an alcoholic.
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It's OK that you don't, you know, fully see the true, severe
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consequences of your substance use, right.
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Like what we try to do in this field as interventionist
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treatment centers, professionals that do this work is try to help
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raise the bottom for young men and try to coach their families
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on helping them understand that like you know the we put the
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shovel down when we stopped digging, right?
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Like it, it's I didn't have the rational ability to make a
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decision to go to treatment on my own.
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Like I had to be intervened on from that standpoint.
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And I remember when I was getting arrested that day, like
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I was telling this police officers, I'm going to get it.
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I've been clean for two weeks, you know?
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And what's so crazy about that? It's like I believed that being
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delusional, I was at that point in time in my addiction.
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And man, like if it was left up to me, there was no way I was
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going to make a decision to go to treatment.
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Like deep down I wanted something different, right?
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Like and and I was miserable and I was empty and and all of those
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things. But the light bulb of recovery
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and surrender did not happen for me then, right?
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Like it happened for me over the course of the long period of
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time 1. 100%, I mean, Justin, I know you have a lot of
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experiences at therapists, like working with young people like.
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How do people have these kind of motivation shifts and changes?
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You know, I think there's, I mean, I mean, I think we all see
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it, right. And we see it at so many
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different levels. Everybody's so different.
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And I think, you know, sometimes we get lucky and we have people
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whether they're young, whether they're middle age, older.
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We have some people that, you know, maybe they did, they did
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have that light switch kind of go off for them, right.
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You know, they had a. A horrible experience or they
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just happen to wake up one day and they were just like, hey,
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I'm tired of living this way. And they and then maybe they're
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stepping into that process with that motivation.
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But I think more times than not people simply don't, right?
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They're just not at that place yet or they're not.
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You know, maybe they have a little bit of motivation or they
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know that they need to make a change, but they're still not at
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the place to where we hope that they're going to get.
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And and as you were saying, Jared, I think.
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It's not a prerequisite, right? I mean, it's not required that
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somebody is fully on board or that they're fully accepting of
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where they're at in their life and their substance use in order
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to take their first step towards change.
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You know what I mean? And I think, Jared, I know you
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do too. We have these conversations on
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what feels like a daily basis is.
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You know, we're not asking you to have that right.
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We're just asking you to take one step forward right now and
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and with the hopes that it along that path you are going to come
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to believe some different things about yourself and what life
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needs to look like for you, you know?
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100% I think purity of motivation.
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Sometimes it's very difficult for parents or spouses of people
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that are involved in this, right?
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They don't just want the person to make the right action, but
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they wanted to make it for the right reason.
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And I think a lot of times the work is letting them know like,
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hey, that may not be the case. That's just maybe not a
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realistic expectations. One of my best friends, a real
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icon of mine in recovery. You know, he he got sober and
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chose a sponsor because a sponsor had a nice watch, you
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know, he wasn't interested in like.
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What he had to say about God, you know, or how thorough kind
10:10
of a fifth step was, like he saw that guy had a nice watch in
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sobriety and he said, I I that's what I want.
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Like when he worked with that guy for like a year, you know,
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Right. Or.
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Yeah. And and especially when you're
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talking about young men, I mean sometimes it is, it is like,
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listen, I see this guy and he's, he's dating a nice girl and he's
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going back to school and he's in sobriety.
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And I never thought that would be me, you know?
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And Jared, I think that's something that I see you when
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you're connecting with guys at Momentum.
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I think that's something that that I see you trying to trying
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to engage with them with. Could you talk a little bit
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about momentum that the demographic that you guys serve
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and and what you guys specialize in?
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Yeah, I came in. So yeah, at the minimum
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recovery. First off we're based in
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Wilmington, NC and we work with 18 to 35 year old young adult
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men, primarily 18 to 30 year olds.
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We occasionally get, you know guys who are 30 to 35 depending
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on their situation and and specializing in that age group,
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right. Kind of like what we're talking
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about. I think some of the biggest
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things that are so needed for for the young men that we work
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with is they all come into our program with this negative
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belief system about them themselves, in the world around
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them, you know and and what we're trying to create for them
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is help them develop a positive belief system about themselves
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and the world around them. And and how we accomplish that
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is through helping them achieve and maintain healthy
11:28
relationships and accomplish healthy relationships and
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establish connection with themselves and with others.
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You know and really kind of how we go about helping them
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accomplish those goals is through the therapeutic
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approaches that we do, you know. And so when guys come to us,
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basically we have a full continuum of care, right.
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That's spread out over the course of you know, 9 to 12
11:50
months. If someone was to do our full
11:52
continuum, when guys usually first initially get to us,
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they're going to start in our first days, right?
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Like when they're coming out of new waters, coming out of detox,
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they land in phase one. And when they're in that phase
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of the program, you know they're in a 90 day, pretty intensive
12:06
structured regimented program in that days where their sole focus
12:10
is to really kind of dig deep and do the internal work that it
12:13
takes to build an appropriate foundation in the recovery
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without a ton of distractions that are going to keep them from
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doing that work. And you know, in working with
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this age group, 18 or 30 year olds, I know for me getting
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sober at 20, like, I had to see that there were other young men
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who are my age, who are normal, who are having fun, who are
12:32
cool, who I could connect with to be able to identify.
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Right? Like if I was in a setting where
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I was around guys who are way older than me with wife and kids
12:42
and career and all that, like, I wasn't going to connect to that
12:45
as much. You know, Like I needed to be
12:46
around young men who I could really relate with and identify
12:49
with. Because if I wasn't, you know, I
12:51
know you guys probably can relate with this.
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My disease is going to focus on the one difference instead of
12:56
the 99 similarities. You know, I mean that I'm
12:58
someone like it's a disease of isolation.
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So I need to be able to find common ground with guys and I
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think we do a really good job of fostering that for young men.
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And you know what? What's really important And one
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thing I want to highlight like we do some really exceptional
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trauma work, dual diagnosis work, attachment focused work.
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I mean those things are a lot of the things that we focus on.
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But I really love talking about like the experiential and the
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adventure based stuff that we do, you know, And when I'm
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talking to families, I'm like look like in Group Tuesday
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mornings and Saturday mornings for group, like they're going to
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be surfing or free diving or fly fishing or kayaking or paddle
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boarding, whatever it is that we're doing in terms of our
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experiential curriculum at that time.
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And what's important for these guys is through having those
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experiences, that's what allows them to engage in this work, You
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know what I mean? Like if we keep them in a
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setting where they're just standing at the same for walls
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every day, sitting in the same groups, hearing the same things,
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like they're never going to engage in this stuff, man.
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But we get guys outside and allow them to have these
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experiences that really helps them find themselves and really
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helps them connect to the guys around them in the program,
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right? And I think like doing that kind
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of work, man, is so therapeutic and so crucial for this age
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population. You know, like it's amazing when
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you see a resistant 1920 year old coming to the program and
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like get out, you know, in the water and catch a wave.
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Like we were on the clinical morning meeting.
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We're on the clinical morning meeting this week and we had
14:24
this guy come to us and he's wanted to leave the whole first
14:27
week that he's been there because that's what happens at
14:29
primary treatment, right. Like he came in resistant and
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like he went out surfing with the guys and afterwards was
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like, man, that was a killer experience.
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You know, like I might, I might actually be able to enjoy it
14:39
here. You know, like he, he really had
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an experience with recovery in my opinion through that.
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So man, I love that we do that kind of stuff.
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That's. Huge.
14:48
Yeah. I mean.
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You know, the whole idea of experience recovery or even you
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know, a lot of these like adventure based programs and
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things like that. As a matter of fact, one of the
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podcasts we we did with someone earlier today was with the
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Adventure Recovery Center program, Tim with Adventure
15:04
Recovery. And you know, it just never
15:08
ceases to amaze me. You know, we talk a lot about
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you know, like learning to have fun and recovery and like yes,
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that's important. I don't want to devalue that,
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That is important. But there's something about.
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Like you're saying, Jared, like that experience, that that
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feeling of, you know, the dopamine rush that we get from
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those experiences, the connectedness of being able to
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share those experiences with other people.
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I mean, it's just something deeper that I think sometimes is
15:32
really difficult to find in an office clinical setting or it
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takes a lot more work to maybe get to that place.
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You know what I mean? You know, not to devalue
15:43
clinical work. I mean, I'm a therapist.
15:44
I think there's a. A lot of value there, but
15:46
there's just something of essence and doing that
15:49
experiential work that is just really hard to find in other
15:51
places. 100% and I think one of the things is that it, you know,
15:55
people don't, I think assign it as a classical value.
15:57
But adventure, exploration, those are values that people
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have, especially that young men have.
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It's the thing that they've been chasing in this substance use
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and so they get to address and empower themselves and their
16:07
values. I had an experience when I was
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we took the guys at Green Hill, we took them rock climbing, you
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know, and we got the instructor and at one point.
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A client at Green Hill was operating, was was using the
16:19
ballet for me, myself, who was the program director at the
16:22
time. And you know, it was pretty
16:24
scary for me, right? It was, it was a kind of
16:27
terrifying experience. This guy seemed to have a real
16:30
inability to do laundry and he was responsible for my life,
16:33
essentially a pilot mountain. But it was, it was really,
16:37
really beautiful. I think what a lot of people, I
16:39
think what a lot of parents really struggled to see with
16:42
young people in recovery. This was definitely true for me.
16:45
Is the complete lack of self efficacy the complete?
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I did not believe I could do anything at my core.
16:50
I certainly couldn't do anything without drugs and alcohol and
16:53
that's what that escape was. And and that adventure therapy
16:55
builds up self efficacy like nobody else.
16:57
You know it's. True.
16:59
I I know you guys have a lot of real specific, kind of
17:03
experiential options. Do you guys work with people in
17:05
the Wilmington area and in the Wilmington recovery community
17:08
there? Yeah we do man.
17:10
We have a lot of relationships with you know people in our
17:13
recovery community and locally in Wilmington like on the on the
17:16
topic of experiential work like we have a relationship with the
17:19
right school beach Outrigger canoeing club and so our guys
17:22
get in these big Outrigger canoes and you know do some
17:26
Outrigger canoeing around like in the Bay which is cool man.
17:29
You learn about teamwork. You learn about connecting with
17:31
these up with each other. You learn about trust and and
17:34
trust in the other guys to to row and you know there's there's
17:37
a lot that goes into that Outrigger and I got to do it
17:40
with the guys when I was down there one time.
17:42
And again like we're talking about, it's really through those
17:45
experiences that the connectedness happens, the self
17:49
efficiency happens. I can't say that word right like
17:51
you can Ryan, know what it means.
17:54
But you know, man, those things are crucial.
17:57
And for me, like getting sober when I was 20, like recovery had
18:01
to become a lifestyle for me, right?
18:03
Like it, it had to be something that I really could truly see
18:06
myself living out on each day. And and for the young men coming
18:10
into our program, like recovery happens throughout the inner
18:13
therapeutic groups. And you know, recovery happens
18:16
in individual therapy. Growth happens in those in those
18:18
ways. Like, those things are crucial
18:20
to the therapeutic process. Where I see guys engaged the
18:23
most is when I see, like 20 of them running around on the
18:26
softball field. It's my own laughing, you know
18:28
what I mean? Like, I I couldn't remember the
18:30
last time I laughed or smiled or had fun, you know what I mean?
18:33
And when I was in treatment, like, coming alive again in that
18:36
way and experience and stuff like that helped me see that,
18:39
like, hey, this is something, man, that I might not hate, you
18:42
know? And I don't know, for this
18:45
population, for for young adults, that stuff's just
18:47
crucial. I can't express it enough, you
18:49
know? Yeah.
18:51
Absolutely. You know, I think one of the
18:53
things that that and we've probably talked about it on this
18:55
podcast before, but I think it needs to be said, I'd like to
18:58
talk about length of care and the importance of that because I
19:01
think it's something that I think Jared, you know Justin,
19:04
you know I know people really balk at the idea.
19:07
I mean when you tell them that you have a continuing of care of
19:09
9 to 12 months, I mean I think that really blows people's minds
19:12
and I really be interested in. Justin, your and Jared like your
19:16
point of view from clinical and someone very experienced in the
19:19
recovery industry, what is the importance of that continue to
19:22
care in that and the length of time for that?
19:25
Jared, you go first, buddy. Yeah, I mean like since I've
19:29
been working in this industry which has been now just for
19:31
about, you know, eight years, like I've only, you know, worked
19:34
at long term programs. And that's what I'm a huge
19:37
believer in. And what I love about our
19:39
continuum at Momentum is we have the ability to take young men
19:43
all the way from residential care to extended care all the
19:47
way to silver living. You know, through a full
19:49
continuum of 9 to 12 months where we can slowly stand them
19:52
on their own 2 feet while giving them every single tool they
19:54
need, every step of the way to help them successfully do that.
19:57
And we help them do that at their own pace.
19:59
Like our program is not one where it's like you've done 90
20:02
days, you're 90 days is up, but you're going to the next phase.
20:04
It's like we only phase guys up if they're ready for that.
20:07
You know, I love him individualized.
20:09
Our care is, but we all know that every, you know, bit of
20:12
outcome studies we've ever seen in this field points to the
20:16
longer you can keep people engaged in a structured setting
20:20
over a long course of time, the better outcomes we're going to
20:23
have, you know, and and I'm a big believer in this, that
20:26
recovery does not happen overnight.
20:27
It happens over time. And you know, I can't tell you
20:30
how many guys and you guys see this too that I've worked with
20:34
doing this work who have just done the revolving door of
20:36
traditional 28 days of treatment over and over and over again.
20:40
And maybe when they've done that, they haven't followed
20:41
through with aftercare recommendations, right.
20:43
But you know it's just understanding that 30 days isn't
20:46
long enough to fully treat the magnitude of the the complicated
20:50
issues that we deal with. You know and this healing takes
20:54
takes a long time and and the longer because that's the thing,
20:57
right. It's like when we talk about
20:58
resistance and we talk about guys that are precontemplative
21:01
like I've seen many that are still kind of struggling with
21:04
that even 90 days into our program, right.
21:06
But when we get them into that second phase or into that third
21:09
phase and we keep them longer, we we see a shift eventually
21:13
hopefully right. That's the hope.
21:14
And you know sometimes that shift just doesn't happen right
21:17
at first. It needs time for that to be
21:19
able to happen, you know, and that's what I love about having
21:22
a full continuum and having the capacity to work with guys on a
21:25
long term basis and I think it's so crucial.
21:28
I couldn't agree with you more, Jared.
21:29
I think we have, again, we have these conversations with
21:34
families and with clients all the time and I think it's.
21:37
It's true, especially when you're, you're looking at a
21:39
program like Momentum or some other programs that are based on
21:43
a on a longer length of stay. There's kind of that sticker
21:46
shock, right? It's like, Oh my God, you're
21:48
asking me to go away somewhere for, you know, three months, six
21:51
months, nine months. And that's a lot for them to
21:54
digest. But I think #1 to to, you know,
21:58
go back to what you're saying, Jared, I think #1 like length of
22:01
time in. In clinical care, receiving that
22:04
clinical support is directly correlated with your increasing
22:08
your chances of successful sobriety.
22:10
I mean hands down and I think you can't argue that point.
22:14
I mean I think we see it time and time again.
22:16
As you said Jared, I think there's so many people that do
22:18
these you know, 28 day, 30 day programs and they think that
22:22
it's just a one time thing they can go in.
22:24
I'm going to, you know, commit myself for this month and then
22:27
I'm going to come out and I'm not going to follow any
22:29
recommendations or aftercare. And I'm, I'm just fine, right.
22:32
I'm going to go in, I'm going to, you know, do my time, so to
22:34
speak. And then I'm just going to be
22:36
cured and somehow life is just going to look completely
22:38
different when I come out. And the reality is, is it just
22:41
does not work that way, right. So I think you got two options.
22:44
You can either it's going to take about a year at least
22:48
clinically and it may continue on more of an outpatient basis.
22:51
Past that and obviously utilizing community support, you
22:54
know, working a personal program of recovery, these things are
22:56
super important. But if you're not going to a
22:59
facility. Where you're going to be there
23:01
for, you know, six months more and slowly step down to those
23:04
levels of care, then you're going to do it in a disjointed
23:08
fashion. You're going to do 30 days plus
23:09
of residential. Then you're going to come out
23:11
and you're going to do an IOP. Then you're going to step down
23:13
to an outpatient, like you're going to do the same thing.
23:17
It's just going to be in different settings, right?
23:19
And I think for those people that are willing to do that in a
23:22
facility like Momentum or places that have that more longer term
23:26
kind of modality. It's more helpful because at
23:31
least if you're going to do that work for that amount of time, at
23:35
least do it in a place to where you know the team is gonna have
23:38
continuity, they're gonna be able to communicate.
23:41
There's just gonna be more of a seamless transition from one
23:44
level of care while you're staying supported in that
23:46
environment instead of. You know going to the
23:48
residential program and then hoping that the residential
23:51
program team is going to communicate with the IOP.
23:54
And then when you step down to OPIE that the IOP is going to
23:57
communicate with the with the therapist that you're going to
23:59
see like you get you're you're rolling a lot of dices in that
24:02
situation. I think you know. 100% I also
24:05
think I like the cultural element of being a young person
24:08
specifically in recovery. Like the idea that I could have
24:11
done 30 days of residential treatment and then return to a
24:13
dorm room, you know what I mean? Where like.
24:16
Where there's drug dealers and drinking just everywhere like
24:19
I'm I'm just not gonna have. I'm just setting myself up for
24:22
failure in that regard and and kind of winnowing and sorting
24:25
between who is going through a quote UN quote phase like people
24:29
thought I was and who has a genuine substance used to sort
24:31
you just can't tell, you know and to throw you in that mill
24:33
you is just it's just really difficult.
24:36
It's difficult and you know, again, all of this not to say
24:39
that maybe some people are successful when they do that,
24:42
right? Maybe some people, you know
24:44
they, you know they. Wake up one day, they're like,
24:46
hey, I need to make a change. They go to a detox.
24:48
They go to a 30 day program. They get a therapist afterwards
24:51
and you know, and they're and they're sober, right?
24:53
And they're happy and that's fine.
24:55
But I think for the vast majority of people, things just
24:58
don't work out that right. Like you're saying, like you
25:00
can't, you know, leave from a potentially like dysfunctional
25:04
family system where you've been struggling and not been able to
25:07
maintain sobriety. You know, go be sober for about
25:10
30 days and then go right directly back into that family
25:13
environment or that home environment and then expect that
25:15
it's going to be OK Definitely not a dorm room, for sure.
25:19
A dorm room. I'm back in Alabama.
25:22
Yeah, going. To the front.
25:24
That's right. Yeah.
25:26
In talking about the full continuum and talking about long
25:29
term treatment like we are especially with young adults,
25:31
like it brings me to you know, just the the whole theory of
25:35
like the family's part in that, right.
25:36
And and the part that they play and engaging with us and
25:39
treatment to continue to keep their loved one with us.
25:42
You know what I mean? Because you guys see it on the
25:44
front end all the time. Like the way that guys get to us
25:47
typically is because parents are putting down some boundaries and
25:49
utilizing some leverage. And you know, understanding and
25:52
following our direction. When we tell them like hey, it's
25:55
not that your son won't be successful or not that they
25:57
don't want to get better. They just don't know how to
25:59
rationally make the best decision for what they need
26:01
right now, you know, and coaching them on how to put
26:03
those boundaries in place. And The thing is, is we have
26:05
that intervention on the front end and we ask these guys for a
26:08
minimum commitment of 90 days. And then typically what we see
26:11
is around that 90 day mark like we have to have that same
26:13
intervention. You know and the hope is, is
26:16
that throughout 90 days we're continuously prepping the family
26:20
and preparing them for understanding that there is a
26:22
next step after primary treatment.
26:24
The importance of that, you know, but also the part that
26:27
they're going to continue to play and helping them get to
26:29
that next step because families will think, well you know,
26:32
they've been there for 90 days, they sound better they.
26:34
Look, great. They're eating well.
26:36
They're saying all the right things, like they're good to
26:38
come home, you know, and it's continuing to educate them.
26:41
Not like, hey this, this process is still not over.
26:44
And in order to get them to the next level of care, we're going
26:46
to have to probably have a conversation about boundaries
26:49
again. You know, and that's the
26:52
family's role, right? And keeping them in treatment
26:54
for a for a year and and their part is so crucial for their
26:59
loved one to have a successful outcome, you know?
27:02
Do you, do you guys that momentum?
27:05
Do you have a family component? Do you work with the families on
27:08
exactly that, like setting those boundaries, understanding how
27:10
to? Kind of kind of what support
27:12
looks like and how to get their own treatment so to speak.
27:16
Yeah, absolutely. I mean so at Momentum we have
27:19
that same belief system and philosophy that if the whole
27:23
family system is not recovering together, it's going to be
27:25
really hard for their loved one to have a successful outcome.
27:28
Like I hear our owner, Rick say this all the time.
27:31
You know when you're asked about success and you know rates of
27:34
success and and all that, you know I hear Rick always mention
27:37
that like the guys who come to us that engage in our program,
27:41
that have their families also engage in our program and and do
27:45
the things that we recommend and trust us, you know what I mean
27:47
and follow our guidance throughout the whole process.
27:50
Those guys do well. Yeah, you know, and so how we go
27:54
about working with the family and engaging the family is all
27:57
of our families get weekly family therapy on a weekly
28:00
basis. They also attend a weekly
28:03
support group that we do via Zoom on Thursdays where they all
28:06
kind of hop on Zoom. And we have one of our masters
28:08
level therapists facilitate a support group via Zoom.
28:11
And then a big thing that we do is a 2 day intensive family
28:14
workshop that we do quarterly, so every 90 days and families
28:19
will come in town for that workshop.
28:20
And day one will be a lot of like psycho education around
28:23
attachment work and kind of what we're trying to accomplish with
28:26
your loved one, educating them on all of those types of things,
28:30
right? And then day two, we actually
28:32
bring the family and their loved one in and we do family
28:35
sculpting and psychodrama with the entire family, which is one
28:39
of the most powerful processes these families, you know, could
28:42
experience with their loved one. Like we've seen so much powerful
28:45
stuff happen in those settings there in the family program.
28:48
And you know, I want to mention it to like the The Cove, right.
28:51
Our young women's program, we do the same thing with them as
28:54
well, the same family program, the same family therapy, you
28:58
know, the same road map. Which is crucial.
29:02
Absolutely. It is crucial.
29:04
I mean as as you mentioned, I think if especially I think for
29:07
everyone, but especially that young or adult population, I
29:10
mean like the families. If they're not engaged, it's
29:14
just so much more difficult of a process for the client to be
29:19
able to find recovery for their self, you know, or.
29:21
How much? It's so often the idea that the
29:23
child is the problem, everyone else is fine.
29:26
If the kid would only act right, then we would all be in this
29:29
harmonious kind of correlation without seeing that we're all
29:31
impacting each other, we're all pushing and pulling in these
29:34
very specific kind of ways. And it's it's difficult to give
29:37
families to have that kind of. High opening experience that
29:40
they need to engage in their own kind of step up recovery.
29:44
I know you guys do The Cove as well.
29:45
I would love for you to talk a little bit about that, Jared, if
29:48
there are differences between those programs or how it's
29:50
different for you guys to interact with young women as you
29:52
interact with young men. Yeah, I mean, I think I think
29:55
there are like you know some differences, right.
29:58
I know when when Gabby had the vision to to open the Cove and
30:01
do the women's program, it was to have a heightened you know,
30:06
trauma component to it. However, like we do trauma work
30:10
with all of our guys too on a very deep level.
30:12
But the women's program specifically, you know, a very
30:14
trauma informed trauma based program.
30:17
You know we have therapists who are certified in the MDR somatic
30:21
experiencing brain spotting which are all different
30:24
modalities. We work you know through trauma
30:26
with you know with with our with our young men and our young
30:29
women and dealing with the young women.
30:31
You know, we we started out initially as an 8 bed program
30:35
and we're just serving these women in extended care and
30:38
server living. We we we we've not been offering
30:41
primary treatment for them. What we've done recently is
30:44
we've actually just now expanded our extended care and we have
30:48
more beds for extended care which is good to know.
30:50
And so we just moved our young women to a new campus that is
30:53
similar to the men set up. And so it backs up to the
30:56
Saltwater Marsh. We have brand new townhouses
30:59
that exist on this campus. They're awesome, really awesome
31:04
facilities. It's a really unique campus and
31:07
we're super excited about that. But as far as the programming
31:10
goes, everything's the same besides us not having primary
31:14
yet for young women, that is hopefully going to be coming
31:17
soon. That's great.
31:19
It's definitely a needed resource for sure.
31:21
I think not to get on that whole soapbox, but.
31:25
You know, I think young adult treatment, especially adolescent
31:27
treatment, which I know you guys don't do, I mean there's a huge
31:29
need for that. But there really is a lack of
31:31
services I feel just kind of in North Carolina in general for
31:35
for a female specifically. I mean it's so it's it's great
31:38
to hear that you guys are offering that and then they're
31:40
going to expand those services. Yeah, we've just seen a lot of
31:43
like a lot of need for it, right.
31:46
Basically like when we first opened up the women's extended
31:49
care, like we got filled, filled up pretty quickly and got on a
31:51
wait list pretty quickly because there's not a lot of longterm
31:55
options for young adult women. You know, like we're talking
31:58
about. And and I think options that are
32:01
gender specific that are you know, age specific that are
32:05
specialized in that way of working with trauma and Co
32:08
occurring issues that are longterm.
32:10
You don't see a lot of that you know women for sure.
32:13
And so, you know, I think those think those components are
32:16
crucial. You know, absolutely.
32:18
I love how you guys really address that recovery can't be
32:21
this monolithic experience that there are demographic specific
32:24
experiences that are that are best addressed within that
32:26
demographic and and just because it's a it, it's a more holistic
32:30
and and better treatment and it's true just in any medical
32:32
science a young body isn't going to react the same way as as
32:35
someone who is older and the mental health operates in the
32:38
same way. You talked a little bit about
32:40
Gabby and I think it's something that we don't talk a lot about.
32:42
I know we talk a lot about clinical modalities, but I
32:44
wanted to ask a little bit about.
32:46
How important it is it to have, you know, a psychiatric nurse
32:49
practitioner, like, really kind of keyed in to your milieu and
32:53
and and how psychiatric medication might play a role
32:56
over someone's continuing of care and momentum?
32:59
Yeah, that's a good question. And she's a psychiatric PA,
33:02
right? So she I know she's going to
33:04
listen. Child I'm.
33:06
Sorry Gabby, I'm sorry, no, but but I mean just to just to talk
33:11
about Gabby, not to get in too much of the weeds with
33:14
medication and stuff because that's really her, you know,
33:17
topic that she is so skilled with.
33:19
But just to talk kind of about her and her skill set, you know,
33:22
she has a large background in clinical mental health, a very
33:26
extensive background of substance abuse as well.
33:28
And what what's really dynamic about Gabby is she meets with
33:32
our guys and our girls weekly, you know, at 1st and and
33:36
definitely like does thorough Med assessments with them,
33:39
thorough evaluation kind of with them on the front end and goes
33:43
over everything from their childhood up to what led him,
33:45
you know, in the treatment. And what's great about Gabby is
33:49
she's the center of our pro, like she's a big part of our
33:51
program, right? Like, she's there, you know,
33:54
every single week, Monday through Friday, you know, she's
33:57
there. And she builds real
33:58
relationships and rapport with these guys.
34:00
Not to say that not all psychiatrists don't do that.
34:03
But, you know, a lot of programs like you ask somebody, hey, like
34:06
what was the psychiatrist like there?
34:07
And they're like, oh, you know, I met, I'm like once or twice,
34:09
maybe the time that I've been here.
34:11
Well, Gabby, like she's meeting with them on a consistent basis
34:14
and she's a therapist by trade. She's certified and somatic
34:17
experiencing. So I think what sets her apart
34:19
is it's not just like the psychiatry medication
34:22
conversation or topic that she meets with these guys and girls
34:25
on. Like she builds real
34:26
relationships with them. She does, you know, even engages
34:29
in some trauma work with them, you know, because she's also a
34:31
therapist by trade. So you kind of have like that
34:33
psychiatric skill set, the therapist skill set mixed into
34:36
one, and she just builds real reporting relationships with
34:39
them. What's interesting is some of
34:42
our guys, not as much the girls, but some of the guys look at her
34:45
as like, oh, I can trust her. Like, she's an outsider and
34:48
she's like, you know, I'm the medical director and like
34:50
everything you tell me is going to be communicated to our whole
34:53
clinical team, you know? But like, it just speaks volumes
34:56
about her ability to build rapport and trust, you know?
34:59
And yeah, we're very, very fortunate to have her for sure.
35:03
Yeah, that's huge, especially for a medical provider.
35:06
I mean, we are also blessed with Dr. Hong, our medical director
35:09
is. He's very much the same.
35:11
He's also skilled in therapy and he will really spend time with
35:14
with the patients and not to say anything negative about doctors
35:17
in general, but I I feel like that is a difficult thing to
35:21
find in the in that particular part of the field for sure.
35:25
It is definitely. And she helps so much with
35:28
medications and different mental health issues that we can work
35:31
with. You know, she's a major
35:33
component of, you know, being able to set us apart in some
35:36
ways and helping us work with various issues.
35:39
You know, yeah, that comes to different dual diagnosis issues
35:42
and medications. That's great, man.
35:45
That's good stuff. Well, Jared, I think we're
35:49
coming close to our time here. Is there anything else that you
35:53
want us to know? Anything you'd like to broadcast
35:55
about momentum, about yourself, man, I mean, no, not not that I
36:00
can think of. You know, I just, I I love doing
36:03
this work. As you guys know, I'm extremely
36:05
passionate about it. I love working with families on
36:07
the front end. I love doing the admissions
36:09
piece, you know as well and just kind of diving in the trenches
36:12
with them. And we've had so much good
36:15
experiences working with you guys like y'all are just
36:18
phenomenal on the detox and stabilization piece and so
36:22
responsive and you know just do such a good job and helping us
36:25
on the front end and and we appreciate you guys for that and
36:28
love working with y'all. So Jared let me.
36:31
Let me hit you with this real quick, man, not to put you on
36:34
the spot. So if we had to, if you had to
36:37
say one thing to any potential families or potential clients
36:42
that are kind of kicking the tires of treatment or looking to
36:46
stop their use and step into treatment, what, what would be
36:49
like 1 Nugget that should kind of leave them with, man, there's
36:54
so many, right? I guess that the one Nugget
36:56
would would be like, you know, as cheesy as the sounds, I guess
36:59
it's to not to not lose hope, you know, like don't don't give
37:03
up on them. If there's one thing I really
37:06
try to help family see is like when they get on the phone with
37:09
us, they have so much compassion fatigue, you know what I mean?
37:12
Like out they, they aren't able to view their loved one as a
37:16
cancer patient anymore that suffers from a chronic
37:19
progressive disease. You know, because the person who
37:22
has cancer doesn't steal from you, lie to you, manipulate you,
37:25
you know what I mean? So they develop this compassion
37:27
fatigue and when they get on the phone with us, man, they're
37:28
tapped out. And so the biggest thing we try
37:31
to accomplish with them is helping them get on this side of
37:34
compassion and empathy again with them.
37:36
Because if we can achieve that with families, then like we can
37:39
move them into action to really want to get them the best help
37:43
that they need, you know? So yeah.
37:47
Amen, brother. That's for sure.
37:51
Well, thank you, Jared. Yeah.
37:53
Thank you so much for taking the time.
37:54
Man, this has been awesome. I'm glad my cat didn't jump on
37:58
the screen over here. I'm kind of upset.
38:00
That that it did. That it did.
38:01
Yeah. Yeah.
38:03
Maybe better luck next to him. I guess that's right.
38:07
That's right.