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FITM Extended Interview: Charles Lawrie (FIOS Health) · AHF Podcast

0:26
Charles Lawrie: I'm Dr.
0:27
Charles Lawrie: Charles Lawrie.
0:27
Charles Lawrie: I'm the co-founder and chief medical officer of FIOS Health.
0:31
Charles Lawrie: I'm also a high volume, uh, anterior approach hip replacement and robotic knee surgeon in Miami, Florida.
0:38
Charles Lawrie: Uh, consultant for several of the large orthopedic device companies, uh, medical educator and, uh, current president of the Anterior Hip Foundation.
0:46
Joseph M. Schwab: So glad to have you with us, Charles FIOS Health.
0:50
Joseph M. Schwab: Your company was founded on the idea that knowledge can be shared and scaled with almost no cost for you.
0:59
Joseph M. Schwab: Was there a specific moment or experience that made you realize that the real bottleneck in musculoskeletal care was information access rather than just patients being able to get into your clinic.
1:14
Charles Lawrie: FIOS Health was really born out of a simple observation I made in my clinic.
1:18
Charles Lawrie: Uh, patients don't struggle because their doctors don't care.
1:22
Charles Lawrie: They struggle because they don't have access to the information when they need it most.
1:26
Charles Lawrie: And the bottleneck in our care of our patients isn't just time in the clinic spent educating patients.
1:31
Charles Lawrie: It's actually for the patients access to timely and trusted knowledge.
1:35
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, for me, that realization came, like I said, in my clinic.
1:39
Charles Lawrie: Talking to my medical assistants, you know, going over the hundreds of postoperative phone calls, portal messages, emails they get on a weekly basis, and realizing that most of those really came down to the same predictable questions.
1:52
Charles Lawrie: Things like, is it, is the swelling normal?
1:55
Charles Lawrie: Uh, you know, when can I walk without a cane?
1:57
Charles Lawrie: Can I shower after surgery?
1:58
Charles Lawrie: When can I drive?
2:00
Charles Lawrie: Every surgeon knows that, you know, about 90% of these questions are routine answerable.
2:05
Charles Lawrie: We probably answer them multiple times, even for each individual patients.
2:09
Charles Lawrie: Despite the fact that we counsel them on this and give them information packets in the office, uh, you know, these questions can take up an enormous amount of time, uh, from clinical staff that could be spent doing other duties.
2:20
Charles Lawrie: It might be more important for the patients.
2:22
Charles Lawrie: Um, and you know, these questions also come from a real place in the patients.
2:25
Charles Lawrie: It creates a lot of anxiety for them, this perception of asymmetric knowledge that they have.
2:30
Charles Lawrie: You know, we as surgeons forget that the patients are only going through this procedure one time, um, hopefully in their life and.
2:38
Charles Lawrie: They have these questions that they're genuinely concerned about.
2:41
Charles Lawrie: Um, so, you know, it was that aha moment.
2:44
Charles Lawrie: Uh, you know, the problem wasn't the lack of expertise, it was the lack of scalable communication in the office.
2:50
Charles Lawrie: And FIOS really grew from that.
2:51
Charles Lawrie: You know, the idea that knowledge could be shared, personalized, and scaled, uh, you know, every patient instantaneously, um, in a way that websites or information packets, um, or phone calls, the officer messages really can't do.
3:08
Joseph M. Schwab: So that's a really ambitious sounding project, and one of the things that I'm curious about is.
3:13
Joseph M. Schwab: It's really, it can be really daunting to tackle a whole bunch of new aspects of communication at once.
3:20
Joseph M. Schwab: Was there a particular problem that you were most determined to solve when you started FIOS?
3:26
Charles Lawrie: So really, really the problem boils down to two things.
3:30
Charles Lawrie: One, on the provider side, we lacked resources.
3:35
Charles Lawrie: We're all being squeezed by payers.
3:37
Charles Lawrie: We're all being told to do more with less.
3:39
Charles Lawrie: We're taking care of more patients, we're operating on more patients, and that's fantastic.
3:44
Charles Lawrie: We focused a lot on efficiency in the or, um, you know, pioneers in surgery like, you know, Charlie DeCook, have really told us how many cases we can get done in a day, which is phenomenal.
3:54
Charles Lawrie: Uh, but you know, that, that scarcity of resources in the office, um, it really has a big impact on the staff as well as the patients.
4:02
Charles Lawrie: So, um, you know, we're really trying to solve in the office for that scarcity of human resources that we have to take care of the patients.
4:10
Charles Lawrie: Um, and then on the flip side of that, from the patient standpoint, we're really trying to improve quality and consistency of communications from the office.
4:18
Charles Lawrie: We've all suffered from staff turnover, lack of staff, um, you know, training, um, inexperienced staff, uh, staff that are shared amongst different providers.
4:28
Charles Lawrie: You get confused about the nuances of each provider's care.
4:31
Charles Lawrie: And with our product, what we're able to do is we're able to solve that scarcity, uh, by answering routine questions easily, quickly accessible 24 7.
4:41
Charles Lawrie: We're also able to improve the quality and consistency of those responses by training our product on each individual surgeon's preferences, practice patterns, and even on the patient level, patient nuances to the procedure they had done.
4:55
Charles Lawrie: Um, so what we get in the end is a product really that solves the scarcity issue of human resources in the office to take care of patients in an efficient manner, but also alleviating patient anxiety by improving the quality of those responses they're getting to their questions.
5:11
Joseph M. Schwab: One thing I find interesting about your solution is this juxtaposition of sort of familiar low tech interface, like using, you know, uh, SMS or WhatsApp Telehealth, um, powered by ai, something that's, uh, you know, obviously in the news quite a bit and significantly more advanced.
5:32
Joseph M. Schwab: Is there something about that combination of technology that was important to you or that spoke to you as being the right tool to handle this problem?
5:43
Charles Lawrie: Patient engagement platforms are nothing new.
5:47
Charles Lawrie: So there's a variety of different solutions out there on the market for engaging patients in their recovery.
5:52
Charles Lawrie: And the data demonstrates time and time again that patients do better if they feel invested in their care.
5:57
Charles Lawrie: So there is real value to these types of platforms.
6:00
Charles Lawrie: Unfortunately, I don't think we in the orthopedics field in particular in the hip and knee arthroplasty, uh, realm, have seen significant uptake of those platforms.
6:09
Charles Lawrie: I've, uh, tried to use several in my practice in the past, and there's friction almost at every step of the way trying to get someone onboarded.
6:17
Charles Lawrie: And actually engaged in using this product in a meaningful way.
6:21
Charles Lawrie: Once patients do get onboarded and they do engage, you know, we see increased patient satisfaction.
6:27
Charles Lawrie: We see improved outcomes, things like reduced ER visits, uh, you know, benefits to payers as well as the patients.
6:33
Charles Lawrie: So our goal with using the AI portion of FIOS was really to create an AI first product from the ground up, nuts and bolts to reduce the friction that patients go through.
6:45
Charles Lawrie: When they onboard to reduce the friction that providers experience when they're getting set up.
6:51
Charles Lawrie: Um, so that combination of.
6:54
Charles Lawrie: The future technology of AI and the past technology of SMS, um, really is kind of the perfect poison here, um, that really gets us that frictionless experience for everyone.
7:08
Charles Lawrie: Um, we use AI to assist with surgeon onboarding.
7:11
Charles Lawrie: We use AI to assist with patient onboarding, um, AI to assist with customization of the product.
7:17
Charles Lawrie: AI to assist with generation of the care pathways and customization of the care pathways, um, AI to assist with, um, you know, kind of the choose your own adventure features of the care pathways where depending on how the patient is doing, they're not gonna get a text message on post day seven that's identical to the other person who's on postop day seven, because those messages are gonna be tailored based on how the patients are doing and their interaction with the product.
7:43
Charles Lawrie: We use the SMS because it's familiar.
7:45
Charles Lawrie: Uh, it doesn't require any downloading of apps.
7:48
Charles Lawrie: Um, I remember trying to use some of these patient engagement platform applications and you have the patient in the office very eager, wanting to get started, and it turns out that their grandson had set up their Apple account.
8:00
Charles Lawrie: They can't download the app because they can't get on the phone with their grandson to figure out what their Apple password was.
8:06
Charles Lawrie: So by using SMS, it's familiar, it's frictionless.
8:11
Charles Lawrie: Uh, people are constantly checking their text messages throughout the day, doesn't require opening another app.
8:15
Charles Lawrie: Um, so again, all in the name of reducing friction.
8:18
Charles Lawrie: Making this as easy as possible for both the provider side and the patient side has led us to marry those two technologies, uh, which we think is gonna be a big win for our product.
8:29
Joseph M. Schwab: So take me back a little bit more to the beginning of this process.
8:33
Joseph M. Schwab: You identify this, um, need in your clinic.
8:37
Joseph M. Schwab: How do you begin turning.
8:40
Joseph M. Schwab: Your concept after having identified those gaps or identifying that need, how do you begin turning that concept into a, a real solution, a product that you can bring to market?
8:53
Charles Lawrie: Like you alluded to, the first step in this process, uh, you know, in innovation is really solidifying your problem that you're trying to solve for.
9:02
Charles Lawrie: Unfortunately, out there on the market, we see time and time again a lot of solutions developed, looking for problems.
9:09
Charles Lawrie: I think it's important to start with that problem first and then work your way out from there.
9:13
Charles Lawrie: So once we identified that problem once, you know, I identified that problem, uh, the next step was, you know, really finding someone with the expertise who could help me.
9:23
Charles Lawrie: Develop that problem into a product.
9:25
Charles Lawrie: Uh, you know, I'm a busy orthopedic surgeon.
9:28
Charles Lawrie: Um, I've got minimal background in computer science, engineering, uh, you know, even product development is my first real attempt at, uh, entrepreneurship.
9:38
Charles Lawrie: Um, so I wanted to partner with someone who had experience in that realm.
9:41
Charles Lawrie: So my, uh, current business partner, uh, CEO and co-founder, uh, professor Andrew McDaid from New Zealand.
9:47
Charles Lawrie: Um, serial entrepreneur has taken several products to the market successfully in the past.
9:52
Charles Lawrie: Um, and he was a, a long time friend and someone who had worked with on previous projects for, in a consulting manner.
9:59
Charles Lawrie: Um, I went to him with my idea.
10:01
Charles Lawrie: Um, and, you know, we helped really refine.
10:04
Charles Lawrie: The problem, refine the product idea.
10:07
Charles Lawrie: And then from there, you know, it's really about team building.
10:10
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, finding the different pieces of the team that you need, identifying the gaps and the expertise.
10:17
Charles Lawrie: Um, and as the company grows, you know, finding ways to both keep it, keep it tight, keep it lean.
10:23
Charles Lawrie: Of course, we're a startup, uh, but also really leverage the expertise of each individual party to make the company successful.
10:31
Joseph M. Schwab: When you and Andrew came together, sort of as co-founders, you began bouncing ideas off each other.
10:37
Joseph M. Schwab: Obviously you come with the orthopedic surgeon background.
10:40
Joseph M. Schwab: He comes with the PhD background.
10:42
Joseph M. Schwab: Were there unique perspectives that each of you brought to this problem that helped you to build FIOS into what it is today?
10:50
Joseph M. Schwab: How did coming together, um, to work with somebody in a different, industry or in a different area, help you develop a stronger product?
11:00
Charles Lawrie: You know, it's a bit like putting a jigsaw puzzle together, so the pieces need to fit well.
11:07
Charles Lawrie: I think Andrew and I luckily have a very good fit together.
11:10
Charles Lawrie: Uh, you know, we disagree on a lot of things, which is fantastic because disagreement, I think spawns new ideas, new solutions to problems myself with the clinical background.
11:22
Charles Lawrie: I'm able to really assist on business development, on, um, acquisition of clients, on marketing in the United States.
11:30
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, on the product roadmap, identifying the key features I as a surgeon need, trialing the product, identifying pain points, um, you know, in the products current iteration, and really finding new ways to tackle that problem.
11:43
Charles Lawrie: Whereas Andrew, with his strong engineering background, um, you know, entrepreneurial background, uh, really was able to.
11:50
Charles Lawrie: Do a lot more on the backend for us in terms of organization of the company, identifying those key areas where we needed new team members to come in.
11:58
Charles Lawrie: And then of course, on the product development side, being an expert in, uh, medical devices, um, and artificial intelligence, uh, was really able to help assemble the team on the back end that develops the product.
12:08
Charles Lawrie: You know, also really bring me down to earth.
12:11
Charles Lawrie: You know, when I say I want a new feature.
12:13
Charles Lawrie: He is like, well, it'll cost this much.
12:15
Charles Lawrie: It'll take this much time.
12:17
Charles Lawrie: You know, maybe we should tackle this other thing first before we get there.
12:19
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, overall it's been a really, really good fit.
12:22
Charles Lawrie: But, you know, for anyone who wanting to start a company, I think it's very important to understand where your expertise is, understand where your gaps are, and then work with someone who's very complimentary in their skillset, um, to really make sure that you're leveraging each other's skills appropriately and efficiently for the success of the company.
12:41
Joseph M. Schwab: You talked a little bit about what the product could do for you, right?
12:44
Joseph M. Schwab: During the development phase, things that you were interested in.
12:48
Joseph M. Schwab: Did you see, at some point, did you have an idea or a vision for how FIOS Health could reshape sort of the relationship between the surgeon and the patient throughout this surgical experience?
13:00
Joseph M. Schwab: And, and if so, could you tell me a little bit about what that vision was and how it's evolved?
13:07
Charles Lawrie: I think it's really important to be grounded in the initial problem you identified that you want to tackle with your company.
13:14
Charles Lawrie: And certainly we've been able to do that, but it's also important to have a long-term vision, a lofty goal, a pie in the sky, you know, something you're really trying to change about the way, uh, you know, medicine is practiced.
13:26
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, for me, my ultimate vision in creating FIOS Health was that one day I would be sitting.
13:34
Charles Lawrie: In my office at a rich mahogany desk with a lot of leather band books behind me and have nobody else in the office with me other than the patient.
13:44
Charles Lawrie: Take it back to the old school days of medicine where you would physically bring the patient into your actual office, not into a clinic room and exam room, no checking people at the front desk.
13:57
Charles Lawrie: No one in the back office supported the billing.
13:59
Charles Lawrie: You know, surgical scheduler, not sitting there having to talk to the patient.
14:02
Charles Lawrie: You know, having the patient not have to go through this assembly line of people as they just wanna see you in the office and talk to you about their complaints and get whatever it is they're there for, taking care of.
14:12
Charles Lawrie: Um, that was really my lofty vision.
14:15
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, a very real visual vision.
14:18
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, to do that, there's a lot of moving parts and basically I wanted to use.
14:24
Charles Lawrie: AI and technology to really replace all of those other people on the assembly line of that office visit.
14:32
Charles Lawrie: Except for me.
14:34
Charles Lawrie: In doing that, you have to back up and say, what can I fix first?
14:40
Charles Lawrie: What's the approachable problem that I can fix first?
14:44
Charles Lawrie: Because you can't build a giant product like that.
14:47
Charles Lawrie: Right off the bat, um, and expect it to gain adoption, expect to survive as a company as you're trying to build and build and build.
14:54
Charles Lawrie: Um, so the first thing we went after was answering patient questions.
14:58
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, people already Google things.
15:00
Charles Lawrie: People already use ChatGPT for things.
15:02
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, they go and search online, they thumb through your packet.
15:07
Charles Lawrie: We wanted to make all that information very approachable to the patient, very easily to access.
15:13
Charles Lawrie: The next step was patient care pathways.
15:16
Charles Lawrie: Now that we're getting beyond that, um, you know, our next goal is really changing, like you mentioned, the patient provider relationship.
15:23
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, by reducing unnecessary follow-up visits, creating more of a holistic, continuous view of the patient's recovery, instead of just generating that snapshot in time of the patient's recovery.
15:36
Charles Lawrie: So right now, as a surgeon, I find out about the patient immediately after surgery when I see them post-op week number two, post-op, week number six or eight, and then I may not see'em again for a year.
15:48
Charles Lawrie: With products like FIOS Health, we're able to develop continuous monitoring of the patient through both check-ins, patient reported outcome measures, as well as biometric sensor data, and we can create.
16:00
Charles Lawrie: Almost like a recovery score for that patient, uh, that gives us a continuous view of how they're doing throughout the recovery.
16:06
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, we can raise red flags and alerts if patients are doing poorly.
16:09
Charles Lawrie: We can congratulate them if they're doing well.
16:11
Charles Lawrie: We can make them feel like we're always watching them and caring for them while at the same time not wasting their time coming to the office for a visit.
16:19
Charles Lawrie: Um, and potentially opening up more time in our busy schedules to see more new patients to, to help more people with their problems they're having.
16:28
Joseph M. Schwab: Were there challenges for you in making sort of a transition from being a, a master surgeon and an expert clinician in the operating room?
16:39
Joseph M. Schwab: To being the chief medical officer and co-founder of essentially a technology company.
16:46
Charles Lawrie: I have learned to use parts of my brain that I did not know exist, is the way I'll sum up my answer to that question.
16:53
Charles Lawrie: I am a very visual person.
16:55
Charles Lawrie: That's why I love surgery, very hands-on.
16:58
Charles Lawrie: Physical.
16:59
Charles Lawrie: Um, a company is a very abstract concept that while it can exist on paper and exist in diagrams and flow charts and org charts, uh, it is a very different experience being a.
17:12
Charles Lawrie: Of a company, even a small startup, than being a surgeon.
17:16
Charles Lawrie: You know, as a surgeon we get very good at a couple things we do.
17:19
Charles Lawrie: We do them over and over and over again.
17:20
Charles Lawrie: Reliably.
17:21
Charles Lawrie: Reproducibly.
17:23
Charles Lawrie: Being a part of a company, it's a completely different pace.
17:27
Charles Lawrie: Um, you kind of wake up in the morning and don't know what's coming next.
17:31
Charles Lawrie: You don't know where you should go next.
17:33
Charles Lawrie: You don't know.
17:35
Charles Lawrie: How to drive the product.
17:36
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, as a first time entrepreneur, I didn't know the different parts of a company that we needed to have.
17:41
Charles Lawrie: You know, I didn't know we needed to, you have a marketing part, a sales part, a um, you know, product development side.
17:47
Charles Lawrie: I didn't know all these different widgets and how they fit together.
17:50
Charles Lawrie: Um, and it's been very rewarding learning about all those different ways the company has to function to really drive the success of the product.
17:58
Joseph M. Schwab: So you mentioned your learning style, and obviously e every clinician is gonna learn a little bit differently.
18:03
Joseph M. Schwab: So how did you work to ensure that what FIOS Health was delivering well for you?
18:10
Joseph M. Schwab: Would also be able to sort of fit naturally into other clinician's workflows as opposed to just adding some complexity that they weren't expecting.
18:21
Charles Lawrie: This is where we get to the product market fit part, which is critical for any early stage company.
18:27
Charles Lawrie: Uh, it's easy to identify the problem.
18:29
Charles Lawrie: It's relatively easy nowadays to create a product.
18:34
Charles Lawrie: But it's very challenging to fine tune that product so it truly fits a need in the market.
18:41
Charles Lawrie: You need to create something that people don't want.
18:44
Charles Lawrie: You need to create something that they need, and in some cases, that need is something maybe that requires awareness.
18:51
Charles Lawrie: So educating providers why this product needs to be in their office, you know, why patients need to be using it, why it's better than the status quo.
19:01
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, I think is some of the challenging part of what you have to do if you're developing a new product.
19:06
Charles Lawrie: And really, I think we're creating a paradigm shift in the way patients are cared for.
19:11
Charles Lawrie: Um, and you have to make sure providers understand that and are ready for it.
19:15
Joseph M. Schwab: When you were building sort of your core team, how did you balance the need for bringing in clinical expertise, which is what you can offer?
19:24
Joseph M. Schwab: With some of that specialized technical expertise, not just for the development, but also for product marketing, for talking to other clinicians and creating that need within them.
19:37
Charles Lawrie: We've been fortunate to have some excellent early partners, uh, surgeon, investors slash users that have had some skin in the game.
19:45
Charles Lawrie: So they've had some motivation to help us really fine tune the product, but they've also kind of at our test lab for product market fit.
19:52
Charles Lawrie: Since I'm the one driving a lot of the product development, it's easy for me to try to take the company in a certain direction that maybe isn't the right direction for other providers, other practice settings, other patients.
20:04
Charles Lawrie: So, um, having those different voices on board early, um, has been very important.
20:09
Charles Lawrie: And also really titrating how quickly we want to scale and get more customers versus.
20:15
Charles Lawrie: Trialing it with a few customers, making sure we get it right before we go out.
20:19
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, maybe blow the opportunity with other providers if we haven't gotten it right.
20:23
Charles Lawrie: So a delicate balance there.
20:26
Charles Lawrie: In terms of sales, marketing, it's been a steep learning curve for me.
20:30
Charles Lawrie: I'm not used to going out and fundraising.
20:33
Charles Lawrie: Uh, it's very hard asking people for money even when you really strongly believe in your product like I do.
20:40
Charles Lawrie: Um, so that's been quite a steep learning curve that, um, I'm still going through.
20:44
Charles Lawrie: But, um.
20:45
Charles Lawrie: You know, I think I've gotten better as I've gone along.
20:49
Joseph M. Schwab: So you talked about that focusing on individual sort of investor surgeons and investor clients versus, you know, creating for a wider audience that path to commercialization for FIOS health.
21:02
Joseph M. Schwab: What does that look like now?
21:05
Charles Lawrie: We're commercialized right now, so we have, uh, paying customers.
21:10
Charles Lawrie: Um, we're in several clinics, um, some big name centers.
21:14
Charles Lawrie: And currently our goal is really to just grow the, the commercial base, uh, grow the client base, um, and as we grow, um, you know, take our customer feedback seriously and really add in the features and functionality that um, surgeons and their patients need.
21:31
Charles Lawrie: We, we want this product to make surgeon lives easier and make patient recovery from surgery easier as well.
21:39
Charles Lawrie: I.
21:40
Joseph M. Schwab: Asking a little bit on behalf of our listeners who may be new to FIOS Health E, everybody who's an entrepreneur has developed an elevator pitch.
21:49
Joseph M. Schwab: What, what's your elevator pitch for FIOS Health?
21:51
Joseph M. Schwab: How would you describe what your platform does in 30 seconds,
21:59
Charles Lawrie: FIOS Health is a med tech company focused on improving patient and provider lives through the strategic use of artificial intelligence.
22:06
Charles Lawrie: At FIOS, we deliver personalized surgeon validated guidance to patients automatically in a frictionless experience via SMS or WhatsApp and improve outcomes and clinical efficiency By automating routine communications, we reduce staff burnout, streamline clinical workflows, and give surgeons more time to focus on what matters most: high quality, personalized patient care.
22:31
Joseph M. Schwab: Can you share a story that captures the real world difference that FIOS Health is making in patient care?
22:41
Charles Lawrie: We haven't really dove into the, the deep features of the product.
22:45
Charles Lawrie: Uh, but you know, that kind of has two, two functionalities right now.
22:50
Charles Lawrie: One of them is the patient facing application where patients interact with it.
22:53
Charles Lawrie: They get specific information from their providers care pathways that they want to, they want followed.
23:00
Charles Lawrie: Um.
23:01
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, I've had patients tell me that they've used it.
23:05
Charles Lawrie: I've had patients tell me they felt like they, I was texting them, um, you know, because the answers feel warm, empathetic.
23:12
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, I had one patient tell me that, you know, it saved them a trip to the ER because, you know, they were very nervous about something and they were texting back and forth with it, and it was able to answer all their questions right away.
23:22
Charles Lawrie: They didn't have to call the office, they didn't go to the urgent care or the er.
23:25
Charles Lawrie: So hearing stories like that.
23:27
Charles Lawrie: You know, is amazing.
23:29
Charles Lawrie: That's the patient facing side of the product.
23:31
Charles Lawrie: The, the provider facing side of the product, which we haven't talked about, is this is basically like an AI driven.
23:39
Charles Lawrie: Response platform for the clinic staff to log into.
23:42
Charles Lawrie: So the clinics can go in there, they can go through the patient messages and see what the patients are talking to the, the product about.
23:49
Charles Lawrie: Um, you can even go in and fine tune the answers, um, you know, so you can really train the model basically to be your.
23:56
Charles Lawrie: Digital twin in space.
23:58
Charles Lawrie: Uh, but what it also allows is it allows the medical assistants and the office staff to query your brain how you would want your patients taken care of.
24:08
Charles Lawrie: So if I've got a medical assistant in my office on desk duty, and they're covering three or four different providers in the office, and I'm one of them, they can select This patient belongs to Dr.
24:20
Charles Lawrie: Lawrie.
24:21
Charles Lawrie: And they have the patient on the phone and the patient's asking him a detailed question, you know, how does Dr.
24:26
Charles Lawrie: Lawrie typically close his wounds?
24:27
Charles Lawrie: They don't have to thumb through a binder.
24:29
Charles Lawrie: They don't have to.
24:30
Charles Lawrie: You know, find the document on the computer.
24:32
Charles Lawrie: They can just simply type into the box, you know, how does Dr.
24:35
Charles Lawrie: Lawrie typically closes incisions?
24:37
Charles Lawrie: And boom, it'll spit it out right away.
24:39
Charles Lawrie: It'll show them where the knowledge came from with the resources.
24:42
Charles Lawrie: Um, so they could either open that document up, find more information, or just take, you know, the Dr.
24:47
Charles Lawrie: Lawrie closes with subq and feed that right back to the patient on the phone.
24:50
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, hearing from the staff, dissatisfaction with.
24:54
Charles Lawrie: That portion of the product as well as hearing the patients really satisfied with the, the rapidity with which they're receiving the information and the accuracy with which they're receiving the information and how it feels personalized and reduces their anxiety.
25:07
Charles Lawrie: I think hearing it from both sides has really been validating, uh, you know, that we're really onto something really great here with our product.
25:16
Joseph M. Schwab: Were there any moments of doubt or course correction that maybe taught you something essential about either leadership or collaboration?
25:26
Charles Lawrie: Early on, I think there was a bit of self-doubt almost on a daily basis, uh, you know, you're creating something new.
25:33
Charles Lawrie: You think it's gonna be great, you're not sure if it's gonna end up.
25:37
Charles Lawrie: Exactly the way that you envision it as it's being developed.
25:42
Charles Lawrie: 'cause you're not the one actually doing the day-to-day development.
25:44
Charles Lawrie: Um, so, you know, on a day-to-day basis, you're constantly wondering, is this product gonna turn out to be what I envision it to be?
25:52
Charles Lawrie: As you get farther along, you know, the self-doubt becomes, you know, why, why isn't anyone using this?
25:58
Charles Lawrie: You know, I've talked to.
26:00
Charles Lawrie: I've talked to three people and all of them said, no thanks.
26:03
Charles Lawrie: Or, uh, you know, I pitched to 20 investors and every single one of'em said, thanks for the call.
26:09
Charles Lawrie: We'll be in touch and they don't follow up.
26:12
Charles Lawrie: Um, so, you know, it's not for the faint of heart going through this process.
26:17
Charles Lawrie: You really have to have strong conviction in the vision, in the problem you're trying to solve.
26:23
Charles Lawrie: And.
26:24
Charles Lawrie: I think people around you can really sense whether or not you have that conviction.
26:28
Joseph M. Schwab: If there was an essential piece of advice that you could give other practicing surgeons, or even if you could have given the younger Charles Lawrie, um, who've identified a problem, something that they want to solve that is a day-to-day issue in their practice, and they're now considering starting a company to solve it, what would that advice be?
26:51
Charles Lawrie: So my first bit of advice would be to start with a problem.
26:54
Charles Lawrie: You live every day, not an abstract one.
26:56
Charles Lawrie: That's where you're gonna be the most effective.
26:59
Charles Lawrie: Start with something in your wheelhouse, in your area of expertise.
27:03
Charles Lawrie: You know, the best ideas come from.
27:06
Charles Lawrie: Front lines, you know, for, for us as surgeons, it's from the or it's from the clinic.
27:11
Charles Lawrie: It's from interactions with staff and patients.
27:13
Charles Lawrie: It's not coming from a boardroom.
27:15
Charles Lawrie: Uh, you know, the second thing would be once you've identified the problem, resist the urge to build an isolation.
27:21
Charles Lawrie: I think we're all used to being the captains of the ship.
27:24
Charles Lawrie: You know, were the team leaders for our surgical teams, for our clinic teams, for our patient care teams.
27:30
Charles Lawrie: Uh, this is not a time to be.
27:32
Charles Lawrie: By yourself trying to do this on your own, you really need to surround yourself with people who know what you don't.
27:37
Charles Lawrie: That's the engineers, the designers, the data scientists, the marketeers, um, you know, really trying to use them and leverage their skill sets to bring your vision to light.
27:48
Charles Lawrie: Um.
27:49
Charles Lawrie: You know, the third thing I would say is, uh, you know, build simple, right?
27:52
Charles Lawrie: We talked about having that lofty vision, uh, the lofty goal, the light at the end of the tunnel.
27:57
Charles Lawrie: Um, but that's unachievable at the beginning.
27:59
Charles Lawrie: So if you get yourself into this trap where you're not gonna launch your product until you think it's perfect, you're never gonna launch your product'cause it's never gonna be perfect.
28:07
Charles Lawrie: You really have to define these series of checkpoints where you say, I have my, here's what I want my minimum viable product to look like.
28:15
Charles Lawrie: This is the point where I'm gonna take it to market and really start working on that product market fit.
28:20
Charles Lawrie: Because if you don't do that, you're gonna just develop forever.
28:24
Charles Lawrie: People are gonna stop believing you, investing in you, and you're never gonna have any customers.
28:28
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, and finally I would say don't be afraid to think big, um, but execute small, right?
28:34
Charles Lawrie: So.
28:34
Charles Lawrie: Pilot, iterate, you know, fall flat on your face, fail a few times is what you're working on.
28:39
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, measure the impact that each of these versions of your product comes out with.
28:44
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, really be a scientist about it.
28:46
Charles Lawrie: You know, make this a research project.
28:48
Charles Lawrie: Figure out where you're winning, figure out where you're losing, um, and really titrate that to make the product, um, you know, the best that you can.
28:57
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, it's not, doesn't have to be the best idea in the world, uh, doesn't have to be the most novel idea in the world.
29:03
Charles Lawrie: It just has to be one that actually works in practice.
29:06
Charles Lawrie: Um, so, you know, taking an existing product, taking something that's already out there that you don't think is working appropriately and really tweaking it in a way that makes it much more approachable and much more easier to use, um, it could, could be a big winner.
29:21
Charles Lawrie: Um, so, you know, don't feel like you have to.
29:24
Charles Lawrie: Develop the next great technology of our century.
29:27
Charles Lawrie: Just small tweaks to existing things can really make a huge difference and, uh, you may end up with a successful product that way.
29:35
Joseph M. Schwab: As far as FIOS health, what's next for it?
29:37
Joseph M. Schwab: What are the next big opportunities for growth or impact?
29:43
Charles Lawrie: The simple answer, uh, we're laser focused on moving beyond just being a great communication tool, um, and really being an essential intelligence layer for the entire clinic.
29:52
Charles Lawrie: I mean, I think our biggest opportunity here is to really evolve our AI from answering patient questions to becoming a comprehensive data-driven assistant.
30:02
Charles Lawrie: Uh, that fundamentally changes clinical workflows.
30:05
Charles Lawrie: Um, it really becomes like the brain of the practice, the operation layer of the practice, where all the different moving parts, all the different people from the practice can interact with this platform in a very simple way to get the information they need at the time that they need.
30:23
Joseph M. Schwab: So our series is titled From Idea to Market, and for you personally with the stage, uh, that FIOS Health is in, in its journey from idea to market, what does that phrase mean to you?
30:38
Charles Lawrie: We're still a very young company, but that phrase brings a lot of memories to me because.
30:44
Charles Lawrie: We're finally at the, the market end of that phrase, but it's only been two years.
30:50
Charles Lawrie: We were at the idea portion of that phrase, you know, drawing things down on napkins and having late night phone calls about different directions the company could go.
31:01
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, it's been a very long yet short, arduous process.
31:07
Charles Lawrie: Um, you know, a lot of blood, sweat and tears late nights.
31:12
Charles Lawrie: Um.
31:13
Charles Lawrie: So, you know, that that phrase to me really brings me a lot of joy because it's rewarding to see the fruits of my labor having gone through the whole process now of taking an idea to market.
31:26
Charles Lawrie: Um, and then I would just look forward to the next podcast series you run, where you take it from markets to global domination, and we can talk about it when I get to the end of that spectrum, Joe.