Latest / Hoop Industry Podcast / Future of March Madness, NCAA Tournament Takeaways, and 'Old-School' Coaching

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Future of March Madness, NCAA Tournament Takeaways, and 'Old-School' Coaching · Hoop Industry Podcast

• Spencer Davies: Welcome on in to another edition of the Hoop Industry podcast. Spencer Davies, Tyler O'Neill, here to talk about March Madness. As you can tell, I sound like JB Bickerstaff after berating an official or somebody going through puberty, but we're going to try and get through this one as best as possible. I'm feeling great. It was a rough week right before my birthday here. So luckily got it all out of the way. St. Patrick's Day is over. We got March Madness round one and two over. But we're heading on in towards the Elite Eight and the Final Four. So bear with me. Bear with us. We're going to do this as best as we can. But excited to be back on the podcast here for another episode. Ty, we got to talk about a ton of guys ⁓ that are left in the tournament, ton of teams that are left in the tournament. Talk about what the Cinderella stories are, what not Cinderella stories are, some coaching habits and stuff like that. But before we get into all of our episode here, Ty, what's going on, man? How you doing? Doing well. Yeah, doing well. Sun's shining after a weird night of weather last night. We actually had a really cool day in here yesterday. We hosted a coaches round table. We had several college head coaches in the building and along with our staff and just talked hoops, know, talked different ideas, X's and O's, new. new concepts, new actions, ⁓ managing time. So it was really cool. had obviously myself, Coach Kevin, ⁓ Jamil Cosby from our staff. had my dad, Guy Neal, who's an assistant now at Ohio Northern University after being a head coach for 34 years. ⁓ Coach Tom Heil was here, the head coach at Bowden Wallace University up in Berea, Ohio, coach Cody Hartzler, the head women's coach at Ohio Wesleyan coming off a historic season NCAA tournament appearance. And last but not least, coach Chad Shetler, the head women's coach at Bluffton University who has had a great career and has seen the NCAA tournament himself. And it was a lot of fun. Things are moving well here. We're kind of in our spring routine and getting busy and. It's been exciting to watch these NCAA tournament games the last couple of weeks. Heck yeah, man. mean, if you had to pick one so far, mean, obviously we've only had one weekend of it. And obviously, we're recording this on a Friday, the day after the first of the Sweet 16 being underway. But do you have any favorite upsets? Do you have any favorite moments from the tournament yet? Like, I could definitely name some. I mean, High Point was so fun. Point. I really enjoyed that. Just seeing, you know. Johnston come out get his first two-point field goal as a game winner. I thought that was awesome You know you had some of these these really tight tightly contested games In the first round. I loved that, you know, everyone's killing the upset picks and stuff like that But I mean, I think they still were really playing hard games the obvious the sienna game against Duke I thought was one that really stood out You had one of the top scorers in the country over at Cal Baptist give Kansas a run for their money in the first round. So a ton ⁓ of games that really tried to come down the wire, did get down to the wire. Obviously you're going to have your blowouts. There's so many games. You can't avoid that. But I really enjoyed the first few days of the tournament. It's always my favorite time of year. That was what we were telling each other. We watching the Akron Texas Tech game in here, obviously, with the guys. Had some food in here, enjoying the company and all that. Unfortunately, we came out on the wrong end of that. just those days are my favorite. This is why this month is my favorite. So yeah, I just wanted to ask you if you any favorite moments. Well, yeah, I think the high point game ⁓ and really just watching them play and. fun to watch. You know, last night, the Purdue ending was fantastic. my goodness. It just again, another example of how good not only Matt Painter is as a coach and what they've built and how they're able to do it year in and year out, but like how impressive is Braden Smith at his size? And he's he's he's not big. He's small. And not only is he not tall, but like he's got to weigh 165 pounds and Time after time after time again, he's he's a great example for young players, youth, high school, even young college players. Just understand the game, have a great IQ, and just little things. He took the, I think he had a big basket in the last couple minutes where he took a, he got a switch, Texas's, one of their bigs and got him and took him to the paint and just his timing. Right. How was he able to finish with a with a 610 guy draped over him? Was that what he puffed three times? That's another one. I that patience and his pauses and his change of pace. He's elite at those things. He's not an elite athlete. I think he's a better athlete than he probably gets credit for. But what makes him so good is his understanding of. Changing pace and and pausing and playing on two feet the last basket he made before the game winner attempt It was all because he was on two feet and the angle and the timing of it and he's able to finish With a 610 defender draped draped over him. So it just goes to show you you know, a lot of the things that might seem old-school might seem elementary they work if done correctly and if mastered and And then again, he gets off the game winner that obviously he missed by by, you know, a half an inch that was tipped in to win. But how he gets these shots off and and just the way he plays is so impressive and a great ending to that one. Great ending to Nebraska and Iowa as well. What a ball game that was. I mean, these teams are just playing so hard and extremely hard and really, really fun basketball to watch. You know, I know I've I've said it several times now and I said it, I think in the heart of the season, end of January, maybe I think this is arguably the best college basketball has ever been in terms of just level of gameplay, the high quality gameplay and the IQ and the talent. And it's just that it's such a high level right now. And we'll get into the reasons why, but, you know, the NCAA tournament so far has not disappointed. High, high quality games, competitive games, great basketball. Figures when I can't talk, I want to ask you the most stuff. The thing with me with Purdue that's interesting is like, I feel like when you look up guys like Braden, guy like Fletcher Lawyer, like Trey Kaufman-Rendt, they've been there for however long. And a lot of the upperclassmen stuff doesn't happen because there's so much transferring and stuff like that. I'm sure that their experience in what they've gone through in NCAA tournaments, also just kind of the hits that they've taken over the years has really helped them propel forward. And you were ahead of me. was just going to say, Braden, getting that shot off for TK Arditip in the first place was pretty much a huge reason why they were able to come away with that one. Sticking in the Big 10, though, man, like this Iowa squad, man, I've had a joy watching them. I really love when you see people who start at not the bottom. don't want to take away from D2s and D3s. But man, I'll tell you what, Coach McCollum starting off at a D2 with Bennett Sturtz and with a lot of these guys. And the fact that Sturtz has followed him from Northwest Missouri State to Drake and now to Iowa. And you just see people who win going up those levels, up those levels. And this can even be cross-bord applied to someone like Kurt Signetti, for example, right? McCollum has a great attitude and I think that it has shown through his coaching at Iowa. Iowa was down 16 to six off rip yesterday and he tore into those guys and it worked like they started to really play hard and I really enjoyed watching those two teams go back and forth because obviously Nebraska isn't known that much for their basketball program but Freddie Hoyberg's done a great job there to price Sanford what a player he is ⁓ but The McCollum stuff though, especially even in that Florida game, to have the nuts to draw up the play he did with Sturtz coming up the floor and to one pass it over to Folguera in the corner for the three. And we'd be remiss not to mention the tournament that Folguera has. He's posterized like three guys. He's made some huge shots, played some big defense. And look, I'm not going to lie and tell you that I knew who Folguera was before this tournament. He's making a name for himself. Those are the types of games that I've really enjoyed or those big ten games We got another one coming up on Saturday with and by the time you guys listen to this it might be over But it'll be Iowa versus Illinois so another big ten opponent and what a job brand Underwood's done over with the Illini and Andre Stojakovic and Keaton Vogler and all these players like They know what they're doing, and I think that's a good segue especially with Illinois talking about why the level of college basketball is where it is right now. And you think that there's definitely some international influence that's helping out with the quality of play, bet. Yeah. Yeah. think the international, the influx of more high end international players is certainly attributed attributing to the increased quality of gameplay, you know, this year and maybe last year as well. And You know, the reasoning behind that is, you know, seven, you know, five, six, seven years ago, before this NIL explosion and the amount of dollars getting thrown at kids existed, a lot of these guys, made more sense in a lot of cases to stay in Europe and stay with their club and start to play professionally at, you know, again, 16, 17, 18 years old. much like the Luka Donchiches of the world did. But now, they can make so much money, they have to come over. If Illinois and Brad Underwood says, hey, we can give you a half a million dollars, we can give you a million dollars to come play for us, they're not getting that, ⁓ at least not right now for the most part with their clubs. So that's obviously made a big change and you can see Brad Underwood, ⁓ genius, you know, he just like in business, right? You have to figure out a way to differentiate yourself. Where can we get an edge? Right. Where can we be different? Where can we ⁓ start a pipeline that nobody else is getting? And they've sort of done that at Illinois with, you know, the Eastern European players that they have. it's Yacchonis, who's down in Miami, who got drafted in the NBA. He was there last year and he's not he hasn't been shy about it. He's flat out. ⁓ Just just said it. Hey, we're going after these kids. We like how they play we like their IQ and We're able to get them now ⁓ at a high clip compared to you know, five six seven years ago. So that's interesting I think ⁓ you know one of the other factors that's contributed to again just just a really great games and the high level of basketball that's being played is similar concept to the to the international kids is you got more players just just sticking around Right? Where, you know, again, five, six, seven years ago, you know, a boogie flanned or some of these guys that decide to, you know, that aren't like lottery picks, like, like surefire lottery picks that might be late first round or second round guys, they're staying for another year or two because, you know, they can make enough money that's close that, ⁓ and they can continue to get better. so that bit where, you know, six years ago, these guys, like they're going because In theory, I'm sure there is a lot of, you know, a couple thousand dollar handshakes going on. But in theory, you know, these guys can go from making nothing to all right. Well, at least if I go to the draft and I'm like a second round, you know, I could get a two way and make, you know, four or five hundred thousand dollars. So now they're not put in that position. That's a risk. They can play a little more safe. probably make that same amount of money, if not maybe a little more in some instances, like a boogie flan, and buy yourself time to continue to develop, to continue to get better and mature. And so because of that, again, more better players are sticking around. So you got the international players, you got more of these guys that six years ago would have left or staying. The other factor is just that ⁓ I think with the transfer portal, okay? And you look at Iowa. There's just more older guys playing on these teams that are making these deep tournament runs. you can say all you want about talent and ability and this and that experience and maturity. One hundred percent matters in sports. And if you look at Indiana's football team, they were built on guys that were playing at lower levels, you know, their their first year over J.M.U. or three of college. And a lot of them came with Coach Signetti from JMU. And they just won on experience and toughness and maturity and IQ. And I believe in that. And I think you've seen it for the last several years in the tournament. The older teams win. The older experienced teams win. And it's ringing true again this year with a team like Iowa, right? You have ⁓ a coach that Has won at every level, essentially one big in division two, one big at Drake, a mid-major. Now he's at a big 10 school in Iowa. He brought, you know, a guy like starts with him who each year is sort of leveled up as well. And, and if you can play basketball, ⁓ and you have that experience, you can be, you can be successful. So I think that those three factors are what we're seeing here. And it wasn't that long ago that the one and done theory was, it was a thing, right? Coach Cal. made it work at Kentucky. I mean, they won a national championship. They were in final fours. They were in elite eights and they were considered, you know, and they were doing it with freshmen and sophomores for the most part. Now they'd have a guy or two that would be a little bit older like, ⁓ you know, ⁓ I can't not know names come to mind off the top of my head. Maybe how many years was Kyle Wiltshire there? Well, Wiltshire was there for a while. I was I'm thinking like maybe maybe a Patrick Patterson, Patrick Patterson. Those sort of guys. and you know what? Fifteen years ago, Kentucky forced Dukes and to start because he did such a good job with it. And it's like, hey, you know what? All you want and you might as well come to Kentucky because we're going to embrace the fact that you're going to be here one season. We're going to we're going to get you ready in one season for the NBA better than anywhere else. So you might as well just come to Kentucky. And that's when he was getting three or four of them a year. And it worked for him. He made it work. And then what you saw was he kind of forced Duke's hand. They started accepting and embracing the one and Duns and and North Carolina and Kansas and so forth and so forth. And that was kind of the thing 15 years ago up until the NIL, you know, ruling change. So it's interesting how in 15 years, everything has changed so much. And to be honest with you, in terms of the game itself and the gameplay and the quality of the actual basketball, I think it's been a good thing. I do. I do. Because because like I said, I just don't remember ⁓ games being as good as they are now in terms of talent, in terms of just high level basketball execution and. and reads and decision making and and just guys being connected and you don't get that without experience. And so so that's where we're at. It's great to see. I like when you have a mixture, right? Like if you have like a one and done potential prospect with a team that is a little bit more experienced. Like I think of Tommy Lloyd's Arizona team like that. You know, you got Burry's, but you also have Coop Pete and you have Krivats in the middle. But those guys have been around the block. So it's. It's cool when you have that kind of synergy between the youth and the guys that have stuck around. It was interesting to me, you bringing up Cal too, because I had such an opinion on Cal when he was in his younger stages of coaching, right? Like going from like UMass to Memphis and then to Kentucky. I was like, what is this guy doing? It's not helping college basketball. But what he was really doing, and now that I've been in this side, is trying to maximize the value of guys for their greatest potential. which is usually going to the NBA. You know, like Darius Akoff. He went out and spoke the world of him after that loss last night. It's like, look, you you cannot pass up on a kid like this. You know, like I said it about Shay and I said it about all these point cards that I've coached. This kid's unique. He's different. And just cause you don't win it all in March Madness. And I think that's where a lot of things get misconstrued. Cause people see the results and they're like, why did AJ Dubonza get- eliminated necessarily. Why did Darren Peterson not make it to the Sweet 16, right? It's not about that. It's not about that in college basketball. And things are a lot different between college and NBA, by the way, the spacing and the speed of the game. It's all different. But I think there is a ⁓ major misunderstanding. And I started to learn this when I was around like the combine. The first NBA draft combine I went to was in 2018. And I learned a lot from you know, lot of people around teams and all that and how they evaluate and whatnot. I would love to get your opinion on that because I think a lot of people see results with teams and they link that to their best players when I don't think that's exactly right. Well, you know, certainly as evaluators, you know, I think specifically if you're an NBA evaluator, you're evaluating somebody. to play in the NBA, yeah, you want winners, right? You do want winners. ⁓ I think a lot of teams think they can develop winners, but. You know, you gotta remember too, okay? LeBron didn't win, didn't go to the NBA finals his rookie year. It took Jordan how many years to get to the NBA finals. So it's really hard for somebody in their first year, like an AJ DeVanza, like a Darren Peterson, to will their team to the pinnacle, to the mountaintop. You know, it's been done a few times. Carmelo Anthony. Now he had a cast of experienced vets. Shout out Jerry Mack, by the way. New head coach at Syracuse. I feel old as hell, by the way. Yeah. Akeem O'Rourke and Jerry McNamara. And and and I see the faces, but I can't remember the names, you know. So it's been it's hard. It's hard to do. But I think if you take into effect the whole package of what he says, what he does. and they did win a lot and he's only been there, he's only been with that group of people in that place for eight months. Right? And so it takes time. Great things take some time. So I think you're correct in saying that. I will say yeah, but nonetheless people want winners. So that does play a role to an extent, to an extent. ⁓ But yeah, I think the cool thing also about this this tournament so far is the coaches. If you look at the Sweet 16, who was left? The Sean Millers. The old schools, baby. The old school guys. The Tom Isos, the Dan Hurleys, the Rick Patinos. Who else? Yeah. No. You said Izzo, Patino, Hurley. I got to go through the list. I got my phone on me because we're recording. mean, you know, so so yeah, it's really, you know, Cal coach Cal and and. Coach Sampson, right. And so the cool part is look what look what these guys are saying about these coaches when they get knocked out or when they win and how much how important. The coach is to the player and then vice versa, the player is to the coach. And so that's really great to see. And it's something that is a concern, not only of mine, but I think a lot of people, is that in an era of the transfer portal, in an era of money is taking over, are we losing that relationship piece? Are we losing the mentorship? Because to me, that's most important part. And you're changing lives. You're forming bonds, brotherhoods, and lessons that, know, like think about youth. Like I think about, I take stuff that my high school coach said to me, not only with basketball, like, you know, as a person. Obviously, you know, my dad coached me. You know, I remember things that my Pee-wee football coach said to me. And, you know, There's a special place in my heart for a lot of the coaches that I had because of the time that they took to care for me too. Cause they didn't have to, right? And obviously these coaches are getting paid a lot of money to do this job. But, ⁓ so it's really great to see that the relationship piece still matters, still matters, especially when you get down to the 16. in theory, best teams remaining. Yeah, no doubt. And you bring that up, just the human side of it. And I think that's a good place to build upon that is hearing what Coach Izzo said the other day and what Coach Hurley said the other day about just disciplinary stuff, right? Like the way that they coach and how it has more of an old school mantra. Because, you you think about a lot of the new age coaches, they're a little bit younger. They're a little bit more relatable, I guess. They're a little bit more I don't know how to explain it, a little bit. Their communication is different than some of those old school type minds. so I think when people see, let's use these examples, right? Like if Izzo is yelling at one of his players, like Jeremy Fierce, for example, on the sideline, or telling him that one of his players couldn't guard his mother, right? Like in the huddle, which was hilarious, by the way. You know, Dan Hurley is berating an official. and he's losing his mind and his veins popping out of his head. Or if you want to look on the women's side, Brenda Frese, playing over one of her players and saying that she is demonstratively saying that I believe in you, but the cameras catch it and people catch it and think of it as a negative type of ordeal. I know where you stand on that. I would love for you to expand on that because there is a definite disconnect with the outside world that doesn't involve itself in sports. in the actual moment where you have to be like that in order to get a point across instead of just kind of letting things happen or being pushovers, I guess, in a way. And I don't want to say that because not every coaching method is the same. And some people do do well at that. But there is an old school approach that might be more effective than anything just because of how we were raised or for example, or something like that. Yeah. No, it's been interesting the last year or two just to see. You know, I guess you call it the media. Some of the pushback or negative, the vilification, the vilification of coaching and and and to me it's passion. To me it's passion. You know, I think a lot of people. That night maybe criticize these things, just don't understand the passion that goes into it or the the urgency or you know, like these coaches know, especially by now they know their players. They know. Coach Izzo knows, hey, I can get on this guy to get him to respond, to get a better, to push him. And they probably know the guys that they can't or they shouldn't, because they might just melt or crumble. But to me, it's just passion. And there's certainly a line. There's obviously a line that, you know, I hate to even say it, like, you know, people throw out the word abuse. And certainly there's a line where it crosses into that. you know, if you listen to what these players say in terms of You know, like rarely do you see a player come out and say, I don't, I don't agree with how coaches coach me. They want to be coached. They want to be pushed. That's how they grow. That's how they maximize their potential. and, and I think a lot of times we just look at the facial expressions. We look at, you know, the demeanor and the body, you know, is it too, you know, it might be intense, but like, if you look at what coach freeze was saying to her player, as intense as it was, she was saying, I believe in you. to make somebody believe what you're saying, you have to say it with conviction. You can't, and you gotta understand too, we train and practice ⁓ year round to be competitors, to dominate the person across from me. And so why would we then in a game scale it back and talk to each other like we're in church? What does assuming do? Exactly. Make an ass out of you and me. There you go. So, you know, like, like we got it, we got to leave it alone. Like, let people coach, man. Let people coach. Most of these players, nine out of 10 of them, they want to be coached. They want to be pushed. ⁓ If you go, but that happens with Malki down in LSU too. And everyone just assumes the way that she does. But you hear Fajae talk the world out of her. You hear Angel Reese talk the world out of her. Like they've got to be doing something right. And, and, and, you know, I think in my own experiences, you know, like, yeah, there was times where whatever I'm playing in college and it was hard. And I was like, God, this, just don't want to hear it. But, you know, when I was working at Akron and, and you know, like A lot of people say Coach Danbrough is a lot like coaches, just demanding. It's a demanding job, it's a demanding atmosphere, and it's okay to do hard things. It's okay to be challenged, to have things demand of you. That's how you grow. And the way I look at it is like, hey, was he 100 % politically correct or right in getting on me at that place and time? Coaches make mistakes. Yeah, that very well. I could have been right. I did the right thing and he misinterpreted it, but. It forced me to grow. It forced me to grow and. No matter what circumstance I'm in, as hard as somebody might be on me or as difficult as a conversation may be that I have to have. I've been there. I can handle it. It's no big deal, you know, so I think that's the point and. You know, in a game look like. with a crowd and noise and a lot of times you have like two or three seconds to communicate something that's urgent. It's an urgent matter, right? Hey, they're shooting a free throw. We want to be back in this coverage. You just gave up two threes. You know, hey, Johnny, Johnny, you got to get up. No airspace, man. I can't sit back and hey, hey, Johnny, could you come over here for a second? And you know, I've been thinking about, no, come on. if you really sit back and think about criticizing. Coaching hard, it's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. If you have a job and you work for a company and you don't do what you're supposed to do, right? Once, twice, three times, you're losing your job. Now you can't provide for your family. So what's wrong with conditioning young people to do things the right way? And if you don't, there's consequences. And we probably need more of it, to be honest with you. And you know, the good coaches, like I said before, they know who can take it and who can't. And I always say coach everybody the same differently. I'm going to coach everybody the same differently. Right. Once I understand who you are as a player, as a person, I know exactly how much I can push you. I can push these buttons. Maybe not that button. Right. ⁓ I know the guys like I know Kevin Christie. Right. Right. If I need him to get get get his button in gear. Right. I can get on. I can get on him. and challenge him and he can handle it and he respond and he gets better after that. I know Johnny, hey, I can be stern with him, but I got to build him up and be positive with him while still holding him accountable. So everybody's held to the same accountability. It's just a different method of getting there. But nonetheless, we got to leave these coaches alone. Let them coach, man. Let them coach. It's passion. The players want it. And and obviously it's working. And the press conference after these games prove it. You know how much love they have for each other, how much they trust each other. You know, you hear all the time, you know, coach changed my life or this and that. And so. We got to let these coaches coach when I talked to Braylon Mullins early in the season, like he had been with Coach Hurley for like a couple of months. He's like, look, man, like he is intense. But I love this guy. know, Braylon's dad was the same. Like, he was like, he gets such a bad rap because what's shown on screens and what is talked about by all these talking heads. But he is a down to earth dude that wants the best for my kid. And I'm just like, you know, maybe, things are just put out there to get their reactions and their engagements and retweets, whatever you want to call it. That's part of it. So that's part of it. So I completely can see that side. And it's good for me too, because being a media for so long, to get both perspectives, it's not easy. it's definitely when it comes to being able to coach each different type of player and personality, it's not a one size fits all approach. It's not, because not everyone has the same personality. So good topic there. I wanted to ask you about the new Cinderella because I think that's an interesting topic. A lot of people assuming because only high point was left and only you know what two made majors made it to the whatever it was. Mid-majors didn't win many first round games is what we're getting at here. Is the Cinderella dead because that is a huge topic around the nation right now and a lot of worrisome stuff because you talked about the quality of play earlier. of college basketball. think a lot of people would like to know whether the quality of that play is going to all of these P4s. Is that what the new norm is? Or are they picking off of these other squads? like, what is your view of the quote unquote new Cinderella? Because, you know, Texas almost did it. They've only just lost to Purdue on that tip in like we were talking about earlier, but Texas was an 11 seed. You know, they were in there in the first four with. with Miami in them and Dayton. ⁓ You know, you have Iowa, the ninth seed now going into the Elite Eight, right? Like those are technically low seeds, but they're still powerful conferences. So what's the deal here? Is the Cinderella dead or are we overreacting? Well, again, I think in previous years, the Cinderella's were able to win some of these games because they were older. They were more experienced and mature and they're beating. far more talented teams and players that were inexperienced. Now, again, for the factors that we named earlier, I think there's just more experience in general, right? The more talented teams also have experience. ⁓ Again, the transfer portal, right? So guys that were, you know, division, ⁓ whatever, a division two player or a mid-major, low-major player, their first two or three years of college basketball, you know. they can freely move up easier and they should. ⁓ You can go from playing at Akron to Kansas State, no big deal. ⁓ You can go from playing at ⁓ Drake to Iowa and the Big Ten, no big deal now. I think that the transfer of, look at ⁓ it this way, if Drake. had the same team they had last year and they are still at Drake because 10 years ago they probably would have been the same team at Drake this year. Yeah, like and you have Bennett Sturtz like, yeah, Drake might be Iowa in theory, if that's how you want to look at it. Wichita State turned into that, right? Like Wichita State turned into a powerhouse program. VCU turned into a powerhouse program like. Yeah. And I think part of that was just the investment. You know, it's like the Dayton's, it's the Gonzaga's and you know, the institution's purposely made a initiative to invest in those programs. And they saw the residual value and, ⁓ hey, if we have a great basketball program that's a national brand, it's a front doorstep to our school, it's great marketing, the numbers of, ⁓ hey, VCU makes the Sweet 16 applications triple. So there is a residual value in that but now and you heard coach patino talk about it. I think two days ago He says there is no blue bloods anymore because and who said ⁓ You know, another coach came out and said, you know, I think it was Jared Calhoun. You need $10 million to be a Sweet 16 team. That's the amount of resources and investment it takes. ⁓ And if you look at it from that perspective and you go down the list of the Sweet 16 teams, yeah, lot of those teams were probably able to invest around, give or take $10 million in terms of budget in terms of, ⁓ you know, paying players and, and amenities and everything like that. So, you know, it's interesting. It's interesting. I think that, I think the same players that 10 years ago would be the guys on the Drake's or the, or the Northern Iowa's are playing for Iowa. Now they are playing for, ⁓ you know, the bigger in state school. Right. Yeah. Like, ⁓ the, kid on Illinois, Jake, ⁓ He's from Indiana, the long hair. He started out at, I believe he went to Evansville. He was certainly a mid-major player. I got to work with him at the Kyle Guy camp three or four years ago after his senior year. So yeah, the ability to move freely and move up or down, I think certainly has impacted that. I still think, hey, look, if an Akron or a High Point You know, what's the difference like, hey, like high point, just they win one one more game or four or five possessions go their way. We're not having this conversation, right, because they're in the sweet 16. So I don't think it's totally been wiped off the map, but there's certainly, think, some effects of all those factors that are attributing to two years in a row now. No mid-majors making the sweet 16. And let's say this, too. I mean, there were some highly contested games like. Our man, Solomon Callahan, over at Wright State, Wright State gave Virginia a heck of a run for their money. Right. Hofstra gave Alabama a good run for their money. Heck, even Akron, when they weren't even playing at their best, gave opportunities to win the game, opportunities to win the game. So it's like sometimes the ball doesn't bounce. You I should have probably beaten Duke. Yeah. If they didn't. Sure. Maybe not play five players, but also if the one kid didn't get hurt ⁓ with the ankle injury. So like those teams were still competitive. Sure. You know, you can look at and cherry pick the games that didn't you know work weren't competitive like Florida versus Prairie View A ⁓ right? Like that was not a competitive game understandably so but Same thing that we were just talking about with coaching not one size all fits all every every game is different Every style is different. So it's it's hard to to say that it's completely dead Well, the unique thing about the NCAA tournament and March Madness and I think is what? Has made it such a, you know, it's basically a holiday, you know, in the United States. And why we love it so much is the idea that, a St. Peter's can go to the Final Four. It's the idea that, man, know, Butler can be one shot away from beating Duke in the National Championship game. It's, yeah, it's high point, is right there in the mix with, you know, the best of the best. And a kid that... you know, grew up down the street from you is playing on national TV in this game. That's what makes it great. And the fact that the last couple of years, again, we haven't had a mid major make the sweet 16 is it's going to raise eyebrows. It's going to be people ask questions because that's what we all love about it for the most part. So it is interesting. ⁓ Times have changed. Times have changed quite quite a bit in the last five or six years. So we'll see where it heads and. But nonetheless, like I've just been so have had I've had so much fun with the quality of the games and the level of basketball that we're seeing is what really excites me. And we'd be remiss to completely slip my mind because it seems like it happened forever ago because that's how this tournament goes. It's very, very fast. Shout out to Miami. They a great showing. Huge March Madness moment. Listen, sucks that they were in the first four, you know, maybe wanted to get them in just kind of on merit. But Got them into there, had the ⁓ basically home game in the first four against SMU. Amazing game. on a show. Put on a show. A clinic. Listen, Luke Skowjack, ⁓ heck of a performance to come out there and have the balls to play the way he did. Take a huge shot. Ian Elmer, Peter Suter is a heck of a player. ⁓ Fun to watch. Very, very, very good team. And they deserve a lot of the accolades. Unfortunately did not get the job done against Tennessee, but that was another one I completely completely forgot about it because it was the first four and it was a little while ago. One on this. You've worked with a lot of players in this tournament. Run the show has to. Nike Academy experience and all that like you can go down the list. We talked about AJ before we've talked about Darren Peterson before Malik Thomas, another one you brought up. You brought up Boogie Flan. There's a few other guys I know. ⁓ that are still in the field. any chance for you to show them some love? Because it's awesome that you have that connection. And it's got to be awesome just knowing that you've worked with some of these guys and to see the work that you guys have put in show up. It's always cool to see, you know, guys that you've worked with that you know, that you've had the opportunity to just watch and be in the gym with. even if it was for a couple of days, get to know him a little bit to see him succeed and play well at the biggest stage. And, you know, we've been lucky to be around a lot of these guys. Like you said, them, you know, obviously to Vari and some of the Akron guys and, you know, AJ last summer and Darren Peterson being from just down the street here, Malik Thomas, you know, a couple of years ago, you know, he was coming to run the show at our cranberry facility and a lot of the Nike Academy guys are in this as well. Even the older guys like Braden Smith was at the Nike Academy this past summer and he was the best college player there ⁓ in terms of how he performed and no surprise there. Braden Burys is a product of the Nike Academy and I can go on and on. ⁓ Mares Johnson Jr. at Michigan, ⁓ the kid at Tennessee, the big kid at Tennessee. We can go on and on and that's the great part about basketball is everybody's connected. But again, really cool to see a lot of these guys perform well ⁓ that we've been in the same gym with. Got anything else? Do you have any thoughts on who you think is going to take it? Again, I know by the time people listen to this, it might be over. But ⁓ do you think anyone is a favorite in the tournament the rest of the way? You just said it's really competitive. It's probably hard to figure that out. I've said I think Michigan is the best team and the most complete team. you know, I don't don't I don't really know. I don't think they have any matchup issues. think they can pretty much match any. Yaxle and Ademara are just just tough. And again, they're big, strong experience. Cadeau has been around for a while. You've got Roddy Gale. Like they've got a good roster. Yeah, so you know if I had to pick a favorite, I think I'd go with Michigan. I think you kind of has a chance. I think Purdue always has a chance. I really like ⁓ coach Patino right now and just watching those guys and how hard they play and how they get after it. It's really cool to see. ⁓ You know, I mean, Nate Oates has been there and they can they can beat anybody with with how they score the basketball, so it'll be fun. These games have been awesome. ⁓ So. We'll see. I got nobody. I had Houston going all the way. I feel bad. Like, I saw Emmanuel Sharp last night. You know, it's the end of his run there. And you know, I talked to JoJo Tuggler before the season started. Great talent, by the way. But I feel bad for them. And I thought this was their year. I really did. ⁓ it's seven straight sweet 16s, though, for Houston, right? Yeah. Incredible. Something like that. I mean, it's a heck of program. The job he's done in 10 years to take that program from him. on the street trying to sell tickets to him getting to those stages, even the national championship last year is remarkable. Absolutely remarkable. But I think that the old voice is out as a tank here. think got to get a glass of water. Can I get a throw of lozenge or something like that? But hey, I really enjoyed this. This has been a fun podcast. think college basketball is something that we can all. love together as Hoops fans because of the purity of the game and how invested everybody is. Fan bases, players, just everything in the area, especially those ones like Iowa and Nebraska who very niche followings, know, like I love that stuff. Us here at Akron, like it's really relatable. So ⁓ we'll get back to NBA, I'm sure, on our next episode because the playoffs are. around the corner. We are at the end of March, so it's pretty crazy. But the end of March, but we're not done with March madness yet. So be sure to stay tuned on that. Make sure you follow along with our stuff over on our YouTube page at Hoop Industry. Everything run the show. It's got all sorts of digital marketing stuff up. We've got our Instagram clips going up. Stuff on this show going up on Instagram reels, all that good stuff. thank you so much for joining us here on Hoop Industry. Catch you another time.