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What It Means To Be In Christ · The Hearing God Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Hearing God Podcast.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Anthony Moore, and I'm Dan Lamus.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: For over a decade, Anthony and I have been diving deep into weekly conversations about the prophetic, the mystical, and the matters of the heart.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_05: And we invite you into these weekly conversations.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_05: We hope you feel like an honored guest at our table.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: So pull up a chair, settle in, and let's get started.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, here we are.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, here we are.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_05: Here we are, Dan.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_05: Ah, it's a good day.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_05: So uh yeah.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I feel like I'm obligated to ask you how it's going.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_05: How it's going.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_05: I know.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: I know you're gonna ask me, and I'm always trying to have something about how I how I am actually doing.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: I feel I feel really grateful today.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I had this had this funny experience last night since you asked.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um I don't know.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: I probably lots of other people experienced this, um, but it feels unusual to me every time it does.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm lying there trying to go to sleep last night, not particularly thinking about anything, but you know, trying to let go of the fretting and all the stuff.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and suddenly I started to have these memories of times when I was a kid.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I I never I never liked the idea of uh like uh fighting or having fist fights or anything like that.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um I always enjoyed contact sports and had no problem being competitive in that, but never really liked the idea of getting into a fight, you know, with enemies or friends, which is funny when you're a kid.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of times friends will actually fight and deepens our friendship in some kind of weird way.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know how that works.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm but I'm laying there and I'm and I'm the all of the feelings, all the weirdness of it as it what I experienced as a kid would were just like sitting with me, and I was having this weird sort of oh my soul, I feel like I'm right back there again.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and I don't know, I just I feel I feel fine about it today, but it's just I was talking to to my wife about it this morning, and uh just kind of thinking, man, it's so wild how intricate we are.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like like that was literally decades ago.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: I know, and yet I'm lying there trying to go to sleep, and I feel like I'm 10 years old again.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, feeling all the feelings.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_05: I've had that, you know what?
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_05: I've had that too.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_05: I've had that a little bit too with um, I don't even know what I was doing, but I was just having it.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_05: I would I would say the feeling of nostalgia, right?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_05: Like I was feeling for me, it was a little bit like uh I don't even know what it was.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_05: I think I was watching I don't know if this is 100% true, but it it seems reasonable.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I was watching um just some old I don't know if it was like Top Gun related uh or Star Wars related stuff.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_05: And I was just, I was almost like I was, and whether that's true or not, there was a time in the last couple weeks where I was just taken back and I had the feeling of like you know, just that feeling of like I don't know, it was nostalgia is the best way to say it.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that's a good word.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_05: That's like an affection for there was there's it's a little bit of a double-sided thing, like it's just a affection for a simpler time and also sad for a time that is lost, right?
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_05: Like just because it was uh those were those were good days.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, I mean, again, for the for the simplicity of life, for the you know, uh, yeah, the simpler times and also uh just uh just uh you know the passing of time.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_05: Like yeah, you know, yeah, we have uh less time now than we did when we were kids.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_05: So just you know, there's a little, there's a little bit of melancholy there for sure.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, as just really grateful over time, over the last years, and some of the ministry God has called us to be part of, which is so cool of helping people connect with Jesus in some of those places in their life story where they experienced pain.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: And inviting Jesus to come and meet with them there and speak his truth, which is such a mystery, and yet it's such a beautiful encounter when it happens for people.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I think it's giving me a much better appreciation for and this is I think I really did hear Jesus saying this to me as I went to sleep last night.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the best part of that was we were there together.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like I was feeling all these awkward feelings, and I and I really felt Jesus was saying, Don't sweat it, man.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like the best part of that was we were there together.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it was just beautiful to remember, I wouldn't, as a 10-year-old, have been thinking to myself, yeah, wow, I'm glad Jesus is here.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: But he was reminding me last night of wow, I was actually there with you, and I really liked your company back there.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: Like you were a good kid.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: I enjoyed you as a friend.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: And anyway, I just that's been kind of with me on this on this morning, you know, at the beginning of our week, where there's you know lots of other stuff to think about.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like Jesus has been just being has been walking with me this morning and saying, Hey, like you're a good guy.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: I like you, I I like your company.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm just you know, this is this is a good day.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_05: So yeah, yeah.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_05: Well, that's awesome.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_05: Uh let's just jump into the thing that we want to talk about today.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_05: I'm excited about this.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_05: This is cool.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_05: I I really um just felt like I just think that we should talk about being in Christ.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_05: Um and really what what what sort of there's an anchor point that I just want to read here.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_05: It's just second Corinthians uh chapter five, verse 17.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's and and more, but it's really therefore, Paul says, therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation, right?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_05: The old has passed away, the old uh the new has come.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_05: And uh I think what I uh what I was just sort of preliminarily was running through my mind was is that um this uh notion of being in Christ, yeah, right, is which is a very New Testament biblical uh way of looking at uh let's say just call it Christianity.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_05: We don't uh like the common culture doesn't necessarily view it as as the same way, right?
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_05: The common culture would say uh you've invited Jesus into your heart or you've surrendered your life to Jesus.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_05: Uh the or or just a belief system, right?
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: That that we we would adhere to, like it looked probably so they would interpret in Christ to be a certain set of beliefs or theology.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_05: They would just not look at it like I'm just thinking the the the wording specifically in Christ, like you are like somehow enveloped yeah, yeah, existentially in Christ.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_05: You are ab you're like enveloped into someone, yeah, right.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_05: I was gonna say something, but it's clearly someone.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_05: And I just think that that's it.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_05: Like, I want to talk a little bit this this this morning because it's we're recording it in the morning, but today, uh, if you're listening in your car, uh today I want to just want to talk about like what what does it mean?
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_05: What are the implications of being in Christ, right?
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_05: Because we don't we don't often we don't often really like look at it this way.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_05: We think about maybe just our relationship with God, we're walking with the Lord, we're walking, you know, just or we're we're doing the stuff of the we're doing the stuff of Christianity.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe we're going to church, maybe we're reading the Bible, maybe, you know, just and good stuff.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_05: Oh man.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_05: And and yeah, and not there's nothing wrong with it.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_05: It's actually actually we should be doing that stuff.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_05: But I think it's really the understanding of what it means to be in Christ.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_05: And like we were just talking a little bit, spitballing a little bit.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_05: Like, let's before I I don't want to get too ahead of myself here, but I just want to sit there for a second and go, like, maybe what does it mean?
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_05: Like, what comes to mind when it when you know, to sort of like shift our thinking a little bit about like what does it mean to be in Christ?
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_05: And maybe just hit a few things this morning, but just how that's a little bit different than we commonly.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_05: I know a lot of times I don't think about it this way.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_05: Like I think a little bit, you know, even just the simple ways that we think Jesus is out there somewhere instead of within.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_05: Right, right.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_05: Or, you know, just the common sort of like paradigm misconceptions about what's really going on here.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: Uh oftentimes, oftentimes people are preoccupied with am I good enough to experience peace with God?
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like am I legally, morally, can I can I actually own being at peace with God given the ways that I know that I have sinned?
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: And some of the thoughts I've had.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, recently.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_05: Because sometimes we, because of the transactional nature of how we think, right, right, we can say, well, when I'm good, I'm I can be at peaceful.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_05: I can be in Christ.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_05: Gotcha.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_05: But when I'm bad, I'm clearly out of Christ.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_05: There you go.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_05: Whatever.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_05: Like he's clearly, you know what I'm saying?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I do.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_05: So, yeah.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so oftentimes the best in when we're thinking, I think it's that we're thinking too quickly and we make too many assumptions, but we can behave as if uh the best I can expect is that I can be because of Christ, I can be legally okay to be in the presence of God.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like because I'm in Christ, I'm legally okay.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like I I can relax, you know, I'm not going to be able to do that.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: You can be over there.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: I can be Yeah, I'm gonna be, but I'm actually absolved of any punishment, penalties, anything like that for my sin.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh and you know, I'm in Christ, so I'm legally, positionally, like we like to say, positionally okay with God.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm at peace with God.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: So no matter what else is blowing apart in my life, yeah, I I I'm okay to be with God.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's hey, thank, yes, thank you.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: But that's that's a shallow or it's incomplete.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_00: Only partial partial, yeah, yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Partial uh uh value of being in Christ as opposed to everything that I'm experiencing today.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm literally experiencing it with Christ.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: Christ is experiencing it with me because I'm in union with him.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_05: Correct.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that that he goes with me where I go.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: I want to tune into where he's going today to be in fellowship with him, but I but it's this existential, uh, experiential doing life in Christ.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_05: Well, because I think mysterious.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_05: And I think this isn't this is not an idea that even Paul came up with.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_05: Like I was just thinking, like in the, you know, in the John, the upper room discourse, right?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_05: John 14, 15, 16, 17.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_05: So the upper room discourse uh is where Jesus brings up like abiding, like remaining in me.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_05: Like it's like it's like this this thing.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_05: Like he's he's bringing up, you know, he's in the father, the father's in him, but he's also opening up this door of like like remain in me and I in you.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_05: And I in you, I know.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_05: And so that's right.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_05: And so this is the like, what is it?
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_05: Like, he's talking about something.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_05: There's a there's a positional thing, but there's also, I could say, pretty, um, you know, pretty with with a high amount of certainty, there's an identity thing.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_05: Like there's a there's like this is a this is fundamentally uh at the core of what it means of who we become, right, as the new creation, right?
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_05: If we're in Christ, then the old is gone and new is come.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_05: And so yeah, really, I just I think maybe poke at a little bit of the economy that sometimes goes on in our head about like how we're doing, what you know, how we feel about how things are going in our own life.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's actually there's something greater going on with like you're actually having a good day in Christ.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, like being positioned like inside of inside of who Jesus is.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_05: You are having a bad day positioned inside of who Jesus is.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_05: And to sort of poke at that a little bit, like we we get a little bit, you know.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_05: I just think I think we get a little bit off into some things that aren't necessarily true, right, by maintaining uh this sort of transactional understanding about what what it means to like behave or conduct, let's just say say conduct ourselves as Christians.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, there's something actually greater going on.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_05: You're we're doing all this because we've surrendered our life to Christ, because we're you know, we've decided to follow him, there's something going on about, you know, I've now I'm now enveloped in Christ.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_05: And so all of my circumstances, good, bad, or indifferent, right?
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_05: Have are now taking place as I am in Christ.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_05: And so there's uh just something that, you know, I just maybe kick off the conversation.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's more places we can go, obviously, but just to well, you know, um it's here's here's an interesting thought that hit me about an hour or so ago when I knew you know, when I was thinking on what we were going to be talking about today, and I and I realized, you know, God has God has saved us by delighting in us.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like he uh God isn't he didn't save us by cleaning us up so now he can delight in us.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: He he actually has saved us by the word becoming flesh, dwelling among us, becoming a human being, yeah, and living Jesus living his life as a human being, fully God, fully human, the mystery of all that.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but then actually dying as a human being, yeah, um, being raised again, all of that, identifying fully with humanity.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: And Paul, Paul talks about the first Adam.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: So we don't we don't really have much of a problem understanding uh we we know what Adam and Eve, what their experience was in the garden, and that that you know that triggered this whole the whole human race now is gonna take the same path of disobeying God.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: We're prone to we're prone to disobeying him, uh separating ourselves from him, right and so on.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then Paul says, now the second Adam, Christ Jesus, yeah, actually, and this is just a loose whatever, this is kind of what my way of saying it, started a brand new trend.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like now humanity, because of Jesus, now humanity has this potential to actually break that identification with the first Adam.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like now, now we can we can go into every day fully expecting the character of Christ is going to shine through us in the same way that before you know Jesus, you would say, Hey, of course I messed up here and there.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: Of course I sinned because I'm identifying with Adam.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like we know all human beings sin.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, well, in Christ, there's this brand new existential reality by faith in the gospel that now we could enter with the expectation the character of Christ is gonna shine through me as opposed to the character of Adam.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: That kind of idea.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, and I think there's you're you're you're hitting something there a little bit where I I think it's like one of the things is there's an identity piece that comes like it actually reframes and reshapes who we are.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_05: Who we are, absolutely.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_05: That's what we're doing.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_05: We now we now like uh maybe I could say it like this, right?
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_05: We we we were transplanted from the old atom into the new atom.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_05: Good, yeah, beautiful.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_05: So I just yeah, so just to say like that's fundamentally who we are, who, whose name we're in, yeah, like whose like the the container of identity of who Jesus is, right?
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_05: We're now within that.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_05: Right, right.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_05: And so, you know, again, like I just I remember uh you know, I've heard many times over the years, like, you know, when you know, when Jesus looks at you, right, he doesn't see, or when the father looks at you, he doesn't see your sin, he sees Jesus.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_05: Right, right, that's right, yeah.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_05: So if that if that statement were to be true, right, yeah, like you know, if that's true, then we would have to be in Christ, yeah, for that to be true.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that's right, yeah, right.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_05: Absolutely.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_05: And so I'm just I just throw like this is talking about the I the identity of the shift that happens maybe when when like as this, you know, just to help us expand on that a little bit.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, you know, when kind of the some theology, some basic theology here, when Jesus died, yeah, when he was, you know, when he surrendered his life, when he sub when he submitted to that, when Jesus died, he died on behalf of all humanity.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you know, so you uh Paul says in Colossians 3, for you died and your life is now hidden with Christ in God.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_00: So we died with Christ, and we when Jesus rose again, came out of the grave, he didn't just come out of the grave as a human who was alive again.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right, he came out as the first of the new creation.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, like it was like he came out with representing that for humanity things are gonna change.
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_00: Things have changed.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: So we identify when we when we embrace the gospel, we put our faith in the gospel, the power, you know, and we embrace that by faith.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: We're saying we believe as a human being, we died with Christ.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, his rising from the dead and ascending back to uh back to the Father at the right hand, we say, okay, he's done that on behalf of humanity, which includes drawing us into right relationship within the Trinity.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_00: The Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: So when we're in Christ, we participate in the favor the Father and the Spirit have toward Christ.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: So when the Father looks at you and says, I see Jesus, he's like, and my heart comes alive.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: He's like the same delight the Father takes in Jesus, he takes over me.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: And you.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that's before we do anything today.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's before, well, we did a good job, we didn't do a good job today.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: He's saying, No, my delight in you is actually empowering your day.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_05: And I think this is an interesting thing.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_05: I'm just gonna throw it out there.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_05: Like it's not like it's not like there's suddenly four people in the Trinity.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_05: That's right.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_05: There's still only three people in the Trinity, Father, Son, Holy Spirit.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_05: But it's like the Son has opened himself up to welcome us in.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_05: Isn't as as and forever to be that.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_05: Forever to be that, as as I don't know, sort of like as beings of the full affection of the Father.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_05: Like the the target, the targets of the full love of the Father.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_05: And it's like that's how that's why, oh gosh, I'm going like how great, oh, what manner of love the Father has lavished upon us.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_05: That we would be called the sons of God.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_05: The sons of God.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: It's sort of fathomless.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_05: It's sort of like yeah.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_05: So the same love, the same love that the father has for Jesus.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_05: The Father has for us.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_05: And so that, yeah, like, I don't know, that that that encourages me.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's deep, it's deeply encouraged.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's profound.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: And what's fun is to realize when you, you know, and you you were you were a kid like I was, where uh, you know, the Bible, uh, we were hearing the Bible in Bible studies and Sunday school classes.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_00: We we were we were f getting filled up with Bible stories and history of the Bible and Old Testament and Stuff and all the heroes of the faith.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: And also the frustration of seeing God bless the nation of Israel, bless his people with incredible promises.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I'll give you a new name.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to call you this.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm going to forget all your sin.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm going, and I'm drawing you.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: It's just come.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: I give, I've given you my commands.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: Walk in my commands, and you will be blessed above all the nations.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: And you'll be able to bless all the nations.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'll be able to bless all the nations through you.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: And we read with frustration as over and over again the people of God felt like that wasn't good enough for them.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like they had the favor of God and yet they were like, well, that's great.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder what else there is out there.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: And so we read that and we realize, man, like, why couldn't they understand why the favor of God was everything they needed?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: But I then I look at myself in 2026 and I realize how many days I wake up thinking, I know my I know you've given me your favor, God.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_00: But will I still get to will I still get to do that thing today I really want to do?
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_00: Because if I can't, this day's gonna suck.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not can you make sure that thing happens today, God?
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: Because I really want.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I find there's even ministry moments where God's calling me to go do a thing, and I'm wrestling because I'd rather go home and do my thing.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and I'm just like the people of Israel.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, wow, God's given me all of this in Christ.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Why is that not enough for me?
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: There's still that pole that wants to.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I would say that it's it's almost as if that you and I, and I'm sure plenty of people listening, still wrestle with this.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_05: Do we do we believe God?
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_05: Do we believe that what he says is true about our lives?
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_05: It's the it's the same question that the Israelites had uh, you know, in at Sinai and wherever wherever else the law was given, right?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_05: Is that there's these promises, there's realities that God has given to his kids.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_05: And also that that the challenge is.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_05: Can we actually do, does my heart actually like believe what God has said about who I am?
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right?
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_05: And you know, and I just think that that's that's true.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_05: And I it's the same for the Israelites to believe, the same thing uh for us to believe.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_05: It's like I feel like, you know, even in that sort of that economy of like is a little bit of an old old covenant thinking.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, right.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_05: We're actually thinking from the place of an old covenant.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_05: And again, like I think we all sort of we all wrestle with this, right?
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_05: This is a very much, you know, is like, do I actually trust that what God has for me is better?
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right, is if I if I believe him, yeah, right, if I actually obey, believe him enough to obey, yeah, will it work out okay for me?
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you know, we hearing God podcast, we're all about healthy prophetic community and understanding what that's like, receiving it, giving it, all that.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: But I think I one of the very first prophetic words anyone ever spoke to me was you make God happy when he sees you coming.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, that's a good word.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean that was like uh probably three two or three decades ago.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: But I still feel in my heart, I feel what that felt like to hear that person say that.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: I had never imagined, yeah.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: I I could imagine me feeling happy coming to God.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right, but I never imagined him seeing me coming and being happy about that.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And so for me, it's like, wow, do I even like like believing what God has said?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: One of the first things I think God wants to say to us regularly is, man, I'm so glad you're here.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like, like, I'm so glad you you're coming, you're coming to be with me.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad you like I just love you so much.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_05: And we could be, and oftentimes are completely oblivious to that fact.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, completely oblivious.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_05: And I again, like I'm thinking about, you know, like Do you think we struggle to receive it?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_05: Sure, a hundred percent.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_05: I think our hearts, I think our hearts um have a hard time believing that.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_05: It's yeah, because I think it's like again, like I know, gosh, I've lost count.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, plenty of times over and over, I will go before the Lord, and it feels like I'm like, you know, just under it, right?
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_05: And I might just like vomit for half an hour and then and then leave going, well, I felt like I met with God and I felt like he met me where I was, right?
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_05: Where or where I am.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but I would be completely oblivious to the fact that he really enjoyed that interaction.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_05: Because he really loves me.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_05: Man.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_05: That I I you know what I'm saying?
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_05: Like, and I think I think maybe it maybe I would have that that shift that can shift me out of like being like just, you know, again, like there's time, and again, there's times and seasons for all of this, so it's no no shame in that.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_05: However, one of the things to to bear in mind is that it's like how how would that those moments change for me if I really believed that God was looking forward to that interaction.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: I know.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: I yes, it's it's it's you're talking and I'm and I'm imagining I'm imagining you know, my wife Linda coming into any room that I'm in, this very studio.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: If she barged in here in the studio, yeah, and she walked in here and said, Here I am, yeah, yeah, I wouldn't say go away.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like everything in me says that I would love for her to approach me all the time like that.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: Here I am, yeah.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: But her approaching me like that, and I'm throwing my arms open, you can't see this on the and through your headphones.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: I can confirm.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: But but the her doing that would be based on the fact that she knows that would thrill my heart to have her approach me like that.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: And that's true for my for my three children, and they're all grown adults.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_00: But if any one of them came into my space saying, here I am, yeah, with uh with an open-armed, happy expression on their face, that would come from a place that they know it would bring me joy that they're here.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I want that, I welcome that.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_00: And it's funny how I I don't give God that same understanding that he, of course, I could come into God's presence and say, Here I am.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: Because knowing that's gonna make him happy that I'm here.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: That like that, that is such it's wild how like for centuries throughout, like back through Old Testament, all the way back to the beginning, yeah, Adam and Eve, like where are you guys?
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_00: Why are you hiding?
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, we're ashamed.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_00: Well, if that was what kept them from going, here I am.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what a beautiful thing, like um to to even consider that, you know.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_00: I um would it be would it be okay for me to just share a quick testimony?
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, go for it.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: Of course not.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_00: You can't, you it's not like you're gonna go dance.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_05: Actually, Dan.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: But but just real quickly, I um I was at a retreat last summer, our staff retreat actually, and um, and there were prayer ministry teams available.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: The whole retreat was about listening to God, allowing, you know, it was about, yes, it was about repentance and confession and these things, but it was in the context of joy and of relationship with God, right?
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Being hidden in Christ.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: And in one of the prayer ministry times, God really stirred up in me a uh a desire to have people around me discover God's delight in them by encountering my life.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: It was kind of the first time I think I had ever really thought much about that.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, God, may I be so convinced with your delight in me that everybody I encounter would realize how much God delights in them.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Like, would it rub out, would it pour out on other people?
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like the best thing about life is God delights in me.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: God loves, God really likes me.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, He likes my company.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I wanted that.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so I went up for prayer ministry, and it was funny.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the the prayer minister said, It's funny as we're praying, I see this banner over the top of you.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: And this is kind of a this is gonna be funny to listeners, but they they said, I I see over you the word hepsibah.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right, which is an old testament, yeah, which is an old testament, which is an old testament.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: And you wouldn't see that hanging over anybody unless you had spent some time in the old testament.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, but I but they said, I see this hanging over you, and I and they the funny thing is they said, I don't even know what that word means.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_00: But I had come for prayer to that they would pray for me in this stirring in my heart.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that God would give me grace that by rubbing off on other people they would know he delights in them.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: And they said, Well, I just see this banner over the top of you, Hepsibah.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the funny thing is, our retreat was happening at a place called Beulah.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm just gonna read this quick scripture out of Isaiah.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: I uh he said, For Zion's sake, I will not keep silent.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: For Jerusalem's sake, I will not remain quiet, till her vindication shines out like the dawn, her salvation like a blazing torch.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: The nations will see your vindication, and all your kings will your glory.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: You will be called by a new name that the mouth of the Lord will bestow.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_00: You will be a crown of splendor in the Lord's hand, a royal diadem in the hand of your God.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: No longer will they call you deserted or name your land desolate, but you will be called Hepsibah and your land Beula, for the Lord will take delight in you, and your land will be married.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: As a young man marries a young woman, so your builder will your builder marry you.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: As a bridegroom rejoices over his bride, so your God will rejoice over you.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, wow.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, was that a temporary promise?
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: I don't believe it was.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_00: This was God's intention.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it was so beautiful because the banner hepsubah means uh uh that that you are God's delight.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: God will God takes delight in you.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's what hepsubah means.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Beulah means married.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so uh the it was beautiful, a beautiful time of prayer, but it has stayed with me that um that God really has been working with me ever since last summer, helping me to realize his delight and his joy over me, his love for me.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, not feeling sorry for me, right?
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_00: But his genuine love, like like liking my company, enjoying Christ in me and who I am in Christ, that whole mix, is it been helping me to realize that is my greatest resource every day.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_00: My greatest resource is knowing God takes delight in me.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, that's good.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: There's not much solved about my day yet, honestly.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: I've got a bunch of stuff.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_00: I got a bunch of stuff this week I gotta work on.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but none of that is going to actually give me joy.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_00: What's gonna give me joy is God's delight in me.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: But it's only because he's been teaching me since last summer.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I want to more and more, I want to be a like a witness for that.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: I want with people to pick up from being around me.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's good.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_00: The best thing we can know about ourselves is that God delights in us, yeah, and he's made it possible through Christ.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: So going back to in Christ.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, for sure.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_05: And I think that's the I think that's that's a a beautiful thing.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_05: Like, like we get we get the delight of the Father because be because we're in Christ.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right?
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_05: We get the love.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_05: Beautifully said, and we get and and uh, you know, one of the other things we we what happens is is that we get the promises that were meant for Jesus, right?
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_05: And I think like the Yes and Amen in Christ.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, absolutely.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_05: They they all find all the promises of God find their yes and they and amen in Christ Jesus.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_05: And so just so this the things like that we claim, like you know, the the classic Jeremiah 29, 11, right?
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_05: The you know, the I know the the plans I have for you, plans to, you know, for to prosper you, right?
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_05: And not to not to harm you.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_05: And things like that, like there's the promises that are really, really, really good promises, yeah, that we get those in in Christ.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_05: We get the promise, you know, right.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_05: All all of it comes from from being welcomed into into Christ.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_05: And so, you know, just a few thinking about a few things.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_05: Like, there's there's implications to being in Christ.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_05: And I think, I think if I could, we could get like maybe me and you and a few other people as you know, as you know listeners, to start to understand that that we're you know, we're we're all milling about, we're all doing our day-to-day stuff.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_05: We got stuff we got to do today and our daily lives.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_05: If we could say, if we could start to understand that like I'm doing this while enveloped into, you know, inside the second person of the Trinity.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_05: I am I am and in I am enveloped in someone, right?
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_05: There is a there's a unit, there's a there's this mysterious, right?
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_05: There's um, you know, Paul, Paul even talks about it a little bit.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_05: I'm doing a it's like first Corinthians, I don't know, four or six, where he talks about that our spirit is co-mingled with his.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_05: Wow.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_05: There's I there's a there's a mystical, yeah.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_05: This is what we do.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_05: There's a mystical reality of what happens when we we are in Christ.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_05: It's like my spirit, your spirit, and the spirit of every believer is ming like co-mingled.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_05: Like it's a there is a there's a mixture that's happening.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_05: There is a there's a uh a joining together, yeah, that's happening in a in a in in a very real but unseen way that that you know it's like this like why we don't like you're it's kind of blowing my mind like what I'm like it's almost like it's almost too good to be true, it's almost hard to understand, yeah.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_05: But there is a there is an invisible reality that's happening right now, right?
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_05: This mingling of my spirit with the spirit of God, the spirit of Jesus.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_05: There is a uh the it's just something that's something that's real, yeah, right.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_05: And again, like will we b and how we do is directly correlated to how how believable that is to us.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yeah, like will we receive that?
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the receiving.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: I I've wrestled with this over the years.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: I I know that God has had to work on my receiving technology, like I know he has.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: I and I've had to surrender that to him so many times, but it is so worth it's so worthwhile to keep surrendering that to him.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because I totally agree with what you just said, like how we do this, the fruit we bear, all like that whole thing is directly related to will we receive it?
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like, will we it's be you can't skip over the receiving part of yes, I do receive that deeper and deeper into my being.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: Because it it's not it's not a big jump, it's just one I think the enemy loves to keep us distracted from.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that unless I go away, the spirit will not be poured out.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's a good thing that I'm going away, Jesus taught his disciples.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: So that the spirit will be poured out.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: And we know the spirit was poured out in the day of Pentecost on all flesh, yeah.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_00: In the same way that we know no matter where you would go on the earth, people are breathing.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_00: They're breathing what?
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: They're breathing the air, they're breathing what we know.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, wherever you go on this planet, people are animated by the spirit of God.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: It's like what was accomplished in the spirit being poured out is massive.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it what's included in this is we can that we get to experience what being hidden in Christ is.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_00: It is exactly what you're saying.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_00: It's the very life that was in Christ Jesus is now in us.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_00: In us, yeah, absolutely.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_00: And we, you know, the limit comes on whether I will receive that or not.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_00: If I decide, well, I don't totally buy that.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, okay, my life's gonna show the fruit of that.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely, absolutely, and the opposite's true.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so I I l I love digging into this.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, this is I mean, it's just this.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_05: I I think just uh I think it's the the critical challenge is will we believe what Jesus has said about us?
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_05: And I remember that was a that was a word, that was a word that I had I felt like in the in the fall, like I felt like the you know, just the Holy Spirit sort of put his finger on that.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_05: It's like, will you believe everything that I have said about you?
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_05: Wow.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_05: And you know, and again, like that's through, you know.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_00: Anthony said, Well, how much time do we have?
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, how much time do you have?
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_05: And again, I think I and it all doesn't get you know solved in a day, right?
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_05: And again, we still have to get the but the but the moment happened and it stayed with me and it stuck with me, and it really was, in my opinion, just a an invitation to a journey, right?
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_05: A process that the Lord has me on, where it's like, you know, again, like we read the Bible, we we hear the good promises, we know, you know, the promises of of God, that He's never leaving us or forsaking us.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_05: There's you know, that He's providing for us, that He's healing us, all of those, all of those sort of um large promises.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_05: But there's also the there's also the the prophetic words that I've received as well over you know, over who I am, you know, the the identity words that I've received that have stuck with me over the years.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_05: And again, like as you shared, like it's the invitation is like, will you believe will you believe, Anthony, that that you see you you got some uh you got some lens issues, you got some vision problems as you rel, you know, think about yourself.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_05: You've got some there's some there's some things that are I and you know I this is I think this is true about me and everybody else, but for me it was like will you will you actually believe what I have said about you?
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_05: And to me, I have I have the the notion, not the notion, but the the idea of belief the Lord has put his finger on a couple times over the last season.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and really it's like will I believe will I believe him?
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_05: Will I believe the words that he has said over me?
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_05: And again, the and and and really the words are good, right?
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_05: In fact, they're probably too good, right?
• 42:25
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_05: Like that could that I honestly like you know, and this is we I'm gonna jump into an economy thing here where it's like I don't know if I if my life measures up to how good that is.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I hear you, right?
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_00: Right, like I always have interesting twist on Paul's invitation, live up to the calling you've received.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: I usually don't think of that in the goodness of it.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_00: Like live live up to the goodness of in the calling you've received.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like receive, like it's almost like there's a million dollars in in a bank account, Dan go withdraw that and transfer it into your current bank accounts.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: And you mean seriously?
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, seriously.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but if I never go and withdraw that money and transfer it into my accounts, yeah, I will never receive it.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_00: Like and I'll still be in my same current financial situation.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's live live up live up to the calling you've received includes the goodness of it.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_05: Like, but I'm just saying, like, and again, like the the pitfall is that I and and we as believers uh see see that as see our lives and how that is going.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_05: Like we we're we're judging ourselves unworthy.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, absolutely.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_05: Which isn't like we're pretty much encouraged not to do that.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_05: Like, you know, Paul's like, I don't judge myself.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_05: You know, again, like, but it's this, it's like I've suddenly decided that I'm by some by some economy that I've built in my my head, right, over the years.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_05: Like the that I've now decided that I'm not worthy of that.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_05: And so that, like I'm living, like so when I so when I uh and I think this is what the Lord's trying to do at so in that place, right?
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_05: When I when I sort of say that's how it is for my life, that bears it's that bears fruit in my life.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_05: Agreed.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_05: And right, so that's what the I think the Lord is so helpful.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_05: The Lord, the Lord is trying to get me to believe differently about, you know, about my, you know, how he sees me, you know, again, how like he's trying to shift my perspective of how to make, let me try to word this the right way.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_05: He's trying to shift my perspective so that I can see myself through his eyes.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_05: And so, and so then it once that happens, you know, and again, then I shouldn't say once that happens, I should say as that happens.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_05: Uh as that happens, then, you know, then it starts to like there's there's I it just goes better for me.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, right?
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_05: It just it goes like my circumstances will not change, but I'm better in the middle of those circumstances.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_05: And so I just I I think that's just the the I think this is the challenge.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_05: This is a real challenge for every believer to to, you know, as we sort of, and I think we're starting to land the plane a little bit here, but just I think there is a there is a there is a thing that the Lord is trying to do in this season for for me, for you, for everyone here, is to begin to shift our perspective, to shift like to know, like to just believe that we're in Christ.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_05: Like, and I think if we could get like, you know, like to be, if we could get like the idea of having, you know, 10, 20, 50, 100 people or a thousand people, whatever, fully convinced that we're in Christ and we actually live from this place.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, we actually live from this place.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_05: And it's not like it's not like we're believing something that's not true, right?
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 46:43
  SPEAKER_05: We're believing something.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_05: If we believe the word of God, then we then then we must believe this.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_05: If we believe that we've given our lives to Christ and He's in us and we are in Him, then we must believe this.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_05: We must believe that we're in Christ.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_05: And so, so that's the challenge for my heart.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_05: And I think that's the challenge that will keep us anchored in so many places.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_05: That will keep us, that will keep us through the storms of life that will, that will, you know, I don't know, that just is there's a there's an eternal, there's an eternalness, there's a security there that that seems to me that as I I know it's there and I have tasted what you know when it's been there, that I just know that I am I am secure within Christ.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_05: Because he goes, you know, again, I think I think it's in I think it's in that upper room discourse where it's like no one no one will no one can pluck you out of my hand.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_05: No one can pluck you out of my hand.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I could be wrong about that, but I for some reason that's uh that jumps up at me.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_00: But like I'm not sure, but yeah, something he definitely Jesus definitely said that.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_05: Jesus did definitely say that, but but he just there's an eternalness to that.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_05: That if we could just relax about it, and it's like then we if when we operate from that place, we'll actually start operating in a way that that looks more and more like Jesus.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um I'm thinking that as far as who's gonna wrap up our pod with prayer, I think you're up.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think I did last time.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I want to just confess to you, and there may be many people who are listening right now need to confess this too in this moment, that as you're talking, Anthony, I'm hearing just from my own heart, God, I surrender my unbelief.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_00: I can't fix it.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_00: I surrender my unbelief at the cross.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever's whatever is unbelieving in me, I surrender it at the cross and receive the grace to believe.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and just as you were sharing that, I just I was I'm thinking there might be other people who are feeling the same way I'm feeling in response to what you're saying.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, God, I I can't fix, I've tried so hard to fix the unbelief.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I I'm tired of trying to fix it and I want to surrender it.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_05: And I think that that's the like you're right, Dan.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_05: I think the best way isn't uh, as with everything, the best way to overcome your unbelief is not to just grit your teeth and try to believe harder.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_05: It really is is to bring your unbelief.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_00: It feels so good.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_05: I know.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_05: It's really to bring your unbelief to to Jesus.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_05: Right?
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_05: Bring it to him and let him decide what to do with it.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_05: And so uh and just to trust him, trust him with trust him with your unbelief.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_05: And watch him, watch him work a miracle.
• 49:53
  SPEAKER_05: Yep.
• 49:53
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 49:54
  SPEAKER_05: And so, and so if you're again, if you've made it this far in the podcast, uh congratulations.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_05: But uh, we're just gonna maybe I'll just take a minute and we'll uh we'll pray and just ask ask the Lord to to do a miracle in our hearts, and then we'll then we'll call it.
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_05: So Lord, we just father, we just come before you just say here we are, and we're so grateful for your affection towards us.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_05: Like how great the love that you have lavished upon us that you so loved us that you sent your son, and that is unfathomable with all that Jesus went through that he endured.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_05: And so I want to thank you for that, Lord.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_05: And so uh I just want to acknowledge for for our sake, Lord, just to say like there's you paid so high a price, and you paid too high a price for us not to get this.
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_05: And so I just want to say, for my own part, Lord, here I am.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, and I just say, Lord, I I give you all the ways that my heart has trouble believing you, believing your word.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_05: And I and Father, today I just want to just say, here we here it is, Lord.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_05: I just confess my unbelief.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, Lord, and Lord, I just want to thank you, God, that you are not repulsed by that, that you are drawn to that.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_05: And Lord, so I just want to just say, here's here is our unbelief and say, Lord, I trust you with it.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_05: And Lord, I ask that you would just take that and use it for your glory, God.
• 51:56
  SPEAKER_05: And I just pray, Lord, for uh for um for just for everyone, just for my own, my own part for myself and for Dan and for everyone listening, Lord.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_05: I just pray that Lord, would you seal in us the conviction like would our hearts be fully convinced that we're in Christ?
• 52:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_05: Would our hearts be fully convinced that we are we are accepted into your beloved son.
• 52:33
  SPEAKER_05: And so I just want to thank you.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_05: Like there's a jo there's a joining there that our minds cannot comprehend, but we believe according to your word that it is true.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_05: And so I pray, Lord, that there would be a shift in how that change that that would change our life in fresh new ways, Lord.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_05: And so we give this time to you.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_05: I just pray great grace on everyone in Jesus' name.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that's a wrap on this episode.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's been a privilege to have you as an honored guest as we all learn to hear God better.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_05: If your time with us has been encouraging and you think this conversation will be helpful to others, we would love it if you could share this podcast with the people around you.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_05: Until next time.