Latest / The Burros of Berea Podcast / Episode 10- Side Study- Did John Write his Gospel? Part 3 of 3

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Episode 10- Side Study- Did John Write his Gospel? Part 3 of 3 · The Burros of Berea Podcast

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  The Boroughs of Berea is a conversational podcast.
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  We study the Bible and we talk about it.
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  Not all of us are of the same faith and one of us doesn't actually have a faith.
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  And that's wonderful.
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  We all love one another and we're going to continue to talk about these things.
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  The things we believe in and the things we believe about what we read in the Bible.
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  Not all of these are necessarily true.
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  Some of it is opinion and speculation.
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  Thank you for listening and speculating with us.
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  There you go.
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  That was good.
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  I love your songs.
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  You are listening to The Boroughs of Berea.
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  Side Studies.
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  All right.
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  Welcome back to The Boroughs of Berea.
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  I'm here with Cherry Lewis.
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  Hello.
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  And Andrew Aaron Bishop.
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  All three names.
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  Am I in trouble?
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  Yeah.
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  In Hendersonville, North Carolina at Giraffe Studio.
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  So please forward all complaint mail to Giraffe Studio at, no, I don't have the address memorized.
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  Also tips.
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  Right.
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  I have a PayPal, a Venmo, a cash app.
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  I take Apple Pay, Facebook money.
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  Oh, I'm sure there's so much card over the phone.
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  Any way you can get money to me, I can accept it.
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  Do you have a Patreon page?
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  No.
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  We need to start one.
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  I've thought about that, but it's like I do charge for my services.
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  So I'm like, so on the other side, I'm just like, well, geez, why would these people give
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  me more money?
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  The only tip I ever got in my life was someone told me to never take my mother to a Harley
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  rally.
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  Maybe your mother would.
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  I don't know.
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  They're kind of fun.
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  They just stage with a cover band playing BTO as far as I can tell.
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  Bachman Turner Overdrive.
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  Yeah.
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  A couple kegs of beer and retired dentists in leather.
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  I don't think they're that bad.
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  Really?
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  Yeah.
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  I think in the seventies, but it is a long time since then and that's not how they are
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  now.
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  No.
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  They're just a blood light and retired dentists with $30,000 motorcycles and you know, weekend
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  leather.
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  As I say, it's probably a difference between the Harley rally and the Hells Angels rally.
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  Yeah.
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  Except the Hells.
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  I'm not sure the Hells Angels really exist anymore, at least not if they do exist in
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  a meaningful way.
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  I'd be willing to bet that they do not exist as the same organization in any meaningful
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  terms that they did when they were infamous.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  I don't know.
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  Bike week.
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  That's not a Harley rally, right?
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  No.
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  I think it's a Harley just completely different.
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  That's just any bike.
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  Yeah.
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  I think bike week is probably more like somewhere between the well to do Harley guys.
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  Don't forget how expensive a damn Harley is.
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  They're not jokes.
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  And in like, you know, 30 year olds that want to do wheelies to show off the girls.
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  So I think bike week is a different crowd.
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  Yeah.
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  Do they have a moped week?
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  There's one of everything.
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  I bet you there's gotta be a moped week.
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  Yeah.
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  more my range. Hey ladies, you want to ride on this hog?
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  I owned a moped for a long time. Did you really?
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  Yeah, I had a Honda Ruckus. I loved that thing.
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  How about that? Let's say it's good on gas.
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  Speaking of Hondas, you know, a lot of people talked about how the disciples had to walk
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  everywhere. Did you know that they had a Honda? No.
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  Everywhere they went was in one accord. And the dad jokes, the dad jokes begin.
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  I love it. That was an excellent transition,
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  segue. Yeah, absolutely. So we're going to do a side study, but before we get into that,
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  and since we're joking, there was a joke I was supposed to bring a long time ago. I didn't,
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  so I'm going to go ahead and bring the joke now. So here's how it goes. There is an Episcopalian,
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  a Presbyterian, and a Baptist, and their wives, and they all die in a plane crash,
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  and they end up standing at the gates. And an angel standing there looking at the books,
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  and they see these three lines, and they're standing in this one big line, and the angel is
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  sort of sending them each to their own individual line. And so the Episcopalian walks up with his
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  wife and the angel says, it says here that you were very fond of the drink. In fact, a lot of
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  people said that you were whiskey-pallians, not Episcopalians. You like to drink so much that you
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  married a woman named Sherry. You're supposed to go in that line over there. And so they walk over
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  to the line, right? And the Presbyterian walks up. It says here that you were a man of the cloth.
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  It also says that you loved money. And you loved money so much that you married a woman named Penny.
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  You're going to be going in that line over there. And so the Baptist minister looked at his wife
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  and said, well, Fanny, I guess we go to that other line. Oh, boy.
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  Oh yeah. Yeah. You noticed the rim shot. I did. I noticed that in the last, he put a rim shot in
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  the last recording. I just wrangled through a rim shot after one of Rick's jokes. Yeah, they're
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  terrible. I have an endless supply of terrible dad jokes. I can't help it. Well, we don't have
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  Ralph Hicks here today. Ralph is going to be doing some traveling. Ralph travels all the time. He's
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  on the road all the time. So we're lucky if we ever get him here in the studio and he's going
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  to be gone actually for a couple of weeks. And I get married, funny enough, I'm actually getting
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  married this Saturday and next Saturday. Wow. We discovered because of some COVID restrictions
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  that we weren't going to be able to get married in South Carolina in time. And that's where our
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  venue, we did this in a hurry. And so we got this venue and not realizing that there were some
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  restrictions. We had to go through the courthouse and then we had to have an ordained minister from
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  the state of South Carolina, which we did not have planned and didn't know of any. And so we got a
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  marriage license here in North Carolina. We have a North Carolina minister and my fiance and I are
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  going up to Murphy, North Carolina to a little church called Vengeance Creek Baptist, Vengeance
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  Creek. It's a beautiful little church. I love this place. I went and visited one of her bridesmaids,
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  grew up in that church. And so we're going up there Saturday. My mother and my aunt and my
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  grandmother are all coming down and going with me on my side. And then her parents and a friend of
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  her family is going to be there on her side as witnesses. And we're going to have a little
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  marriage on Saturday, which is exactly perfect. I would be totally happy with that. But then we
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  have the following Saturday where we're going to have the actual ceremony and all of the family
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  and everybody will be there. So I'm super excited. So. Well, that's excellent. You get to do it twice,
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  which is kind of fun. It can be fun. Yeah. I told her, hey, look at the bright side. You get two
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  anniversary presents every year. You know, hey, remember this, we got married on this day, but
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  our true anniversary is this day. Right. Oh, but here's the deal. It means you get a week's warning
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  every year. Every year. So if you forget, it's not a whole second. It's so, yeah, you get a second
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  chance because there's something will come up and remind you. Right. Right. You get a little buffer
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  before the real one. Right. Cause the legal one is the second one. No, actually the first one's the
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  legal one. Oh, so you don't really get the buffer. I don't get the pass. Like I screw up and then a
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  week later I get to make up for what I missed at the beginning. There you go. I feel like that way.
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  Anyhow. So I'm excited about that. So. Congratulations. Thank you. The next time you'll see me,
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  I will be a married man. I'm very excited. So Ralph had asked if we could do a historical
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  account of Lazarus. That was what his plan was. We've all been very busy with our personal jobs
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  and the things that we have to do. And so he did give me some information today, which I thought
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  was really cool. He was reading in some of his Catholic books about the gospel of John and he
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  found this little paragraph in it. And he said, I was so shocked. It said that Lazarus's name was
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  John Eliezer and which I had said before, and I didn't know it was in the Catholic book. Yeah.
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  I remember you mentioning that. Yeah. Yeah. So Lazarus is basically a, uh, the English version
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  of the Aramaic word, Alizar, which is a Hebrew word, which is Eliezer, which is from the priestline.
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  Eliezer is a priestline name. And so that was one of the reasons why I felt like he had the
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  entrance into the priest's inner sanctum was because he was from the priestline. But also,
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  it said that it was considered that John, if you call it the gospel of John, that it would
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  actually work because his name was John Eliezer. So it's pretty neat, you know, and that was in
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  his little Catholic book. So I thought that was pretty cool. But what I wanted to talk about today,
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  and, uh, we're just going to wrap this up pretty quick. And, um, this is called the golden legend.
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  It was compiled in the 13th century and it records the Provencal tradition and it records a grand
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  lifestyle imagined for Lazarus and his sisters. But here's something that's interesting. It says
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  this Mary Magdalene and her surname or had her surname of Magdala, a castle and was born of
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  right noble lineage and parents which were descended of the lineage of kings. And her father was named
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  Cyrus and her mother, Eucharist. She with her brother Lazarus and her sister Martha possess the
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  castle of Magdala, which is two miles from Nazareth and Bethany, the castle, which is nigh to Jerusalem
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  and also a great part of Jerusalem, which all these things they departed among them. In such
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  wise that Mary had the castle Magdala, whereof she had her name Magdalene and Lazarus had the part of
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  the city of Jerusalem and Martha had to her part Bethany. And when Mary gave herself to all delights
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  of the body and Lazarus extended all to knighthood, Martha, which was wise, governed nobly her
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  brother's part and also her sister's and also her own and administered to knights and her servants
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  and to poor men such necessities as they needed. Nevertheless, after the ascension of our Lord,
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  they sold all these things. So that was written in the 13th century in regard to Lazarus. So it's like-
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  So Mary Magdalene is Lazarus's sister?
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  Yes. Remember I'd said that I thought-
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  Somehow I missed that.
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  Yeah. I had thought that it was possible. And if you remember, I said that in our last podcast,
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  we were talking about, I think it was our last podcast, how I can't remember exactly when we
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  said it. I'm sorry, it wasn't in a side study. Or yeah, it wasn't a side study with me and you,
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  Cherry. That's right. The last time we did a side study. That I had thought that because Luke
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  was the ordered, you know, we talked about that in the last podcast, how Luke was the ordered
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  gospel. It's the one where it's the true historical account. You can base your timeline off of that.
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  This is all my opinion, of course. However-
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  Which we know is right.
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  Always. And so if anybody questions it, just send a check to Giraffe Studio at-
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  That's right. Or PayPal or Catch Up or Venmo or no.
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  We're going to start a Patreon for sure. So evidently, and I honestly do believe that I'm
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  right. I think that this time when this woman comes into Simon the Pharisee's house and she
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  kneels down at the feet of Jesus and she, actually I think she anoints his head.
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  This is an earlier time. It's literally two years prior to when the other gospels say that it has
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  happened because it happened right before his crucifixion. So if that's the case and it's
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  ordered, then this could have happened twice. I think that it did and it makes total sense
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  because especially for me as a Christian, you know, you go through these different experiences
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  through your life and sometimes you come full circle to some of the people that you met in the
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  beginning, you know? And it's like there's a difference between you. Like when I talk about
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  David Allen, you know, my relationship to David Allen years and years and years ago, now when I
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  see him, there's a sweetness to it that you can't even describe it.
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  I need to change the air in this place apparently.
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  It's not you. It's like, it's not you, it's me. It's not me, it's you. Yes, pardon me while I take
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  a drink of this. Ah, brought to you. That was good Foley. So when I read that, I was like, oh, this
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  is neat because I had thought that Mary Magdalene, as it says in this legend, this is just a legend.
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  Someone had written this, but someone else had picked up on this too, that it looks like Mary
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  Magdalene was the woman who was, she's always been mistakenly called a prostitute. She's not a
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  prostitute. She's a sinner, they say. And Simon the Pharisee said about this woman, if he knew who
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  she was, he wouldn't let her touch him. Well, that could be for any reason, not just that,
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  some sexual sin. I mean, it could be anything. But Mary Magdalene had seven demons that Christ
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  had exercised out of her. So we don't know what she was like prior to this, but we do know that
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  she was penitent and she came and she was thankful. So it seems to me that in this legend,
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  if Martha was in Bethany and she was taking care of all of the riches, and we know that this family
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  had money, they definitely did. So she was theoretically the good one, the church lady
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  that I was talking about. She's always staying busy doing the church stuff. This legend sort of
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  follows, and I'd never read this before, but when I was researching to wrap this up, I read it and I
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  was so elated because like, oh wow, that's so close to what I'd kind of put together in the
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  scriptures of my own. So maybe somebody else saw that. But I believe that Mary Magdalene of
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  Magdala, of the castle of Magdala was that woman and that they came again. And I believe that Simon
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  the Pharisee, it contracted leprosy, that Jesus healed him of that leprosy. And then later on,
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  a couple of years later, all of these people converged at Bethany shortly before Jesus goes
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  to his crucifixion, right after the resurrection of Lazarus. All these people come to this big high
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  point. It's really neat to, of course, I don't know anything about this basically except what
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  you tell me, but it's really cool to think about how intertwined this stuff might have been. I don't
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  know why that's super fun to me, but it's more fun than if they were just random people in a way.
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  I don't know. It almost looks more possible to me because you know what I mean?
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  Yeah. I agree with you. I think in our own lives, if you think about it,
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  most people keep their circles small. I mean, they're not like just running into just anybody.
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  It would make more sense that they would all be intertwined like that.
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  Sure. Friends of friends.
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  Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I think that if they,
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  you know, when you're telling a story and, you know, this story could have, according to the
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  gospel of John, if you had written all the books of all the things Jesus did, the earth couldn't
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  contain, you know, in his mind, the earth couldn't contain all the things that I saw this man do.
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  But I believe that the circle was very small. You know, Andrew was over here and then he went
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  and got Peter and then Peter took James and John and then James and John came over here and then
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  Jesus saw Nathaniel under the tree. He speaks to Nathaniel and then here comes Philip and hey,
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  I found this guy. They're all this close knit group. They all know one another. They're in Galilee.
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  And then John the Baptist has, you know, got this craziness. He is the cousin of Jesus,
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  so he's related and he's the one that's coming in the spirit of Elijah to,
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  you know, make the path straight for the Lord.
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  So John the Baptist is Jesus' cousin?
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  Absolutely.
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  Oh, that's so cool. See, he didn't know that either.
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  And see, and you find that out in the gospel of Luke. It talks about how John the Baptist,
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  his father, Zechariah, or Zechariah, I think it was, he was a priest. And while he was a priest,
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  him and his wife had been trying to have children. They couldn't. She was barren.
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  Her name was Elizabeth and that was the cousin of Mary. And so, yeah.
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  And that's how you can put the timeline of-
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  Wow.
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  Okay, yeah.
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  Second cousins.
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  Yeah, exactly. And that's how you can also put the timeline of when Jesus was born,
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  which was not December 25th. December 25th is, we say that it's pagan. There is an actual Christian
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  reference. I don't know if I talked about that in the podcast, but December 25th would have been
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  the time, the exact time that the Magi came to visit the Christ child and gave him gifts.
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  That's when that happened. So, the Roman Catholic Church sort of adopted that as his birth.
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  He was already one and a half, almost two years old by this point, because he had been taken away
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  because of King Herod and the massacre of the innocents, killing all the babies two years and
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  younger, which is also a repeat. Remember I was talking about the second Exodus?
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  Yes.
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  Okay. Well, if you know during Moses' time, just keep that in mind, Moses was the first Exodus.
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  They also massacred the innocents during his time. That's why he was put into a little arc.
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  The basket, yeah.
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  The basket that was sent down the river. So, there's a lot of parallels. It's pretty cool.
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  But anyway, when Ralph said that he wanted to finish this up, I thought,
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  I'll look into that. But when I read that legend, I was like, oh, wow, that's super cool.
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  So, let's finish this up with this last little bit here.
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  I'm not going to give you all my sources because it's coming directly from Wikipedia, therefore,
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  you know it's completely okay. So, whoever wrote this, thank you for writing it. But it's very,
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  very informative. It's pretty cool. So, I'm going to read this and then that's going to end our
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  Lazarus study and we're going to move on to our next one for the next week. So, according to Eastern
• 16:38
  Orthodox Church tradition, sometime after the resurrection of Christ, Lazarus was forced to
• 16:43
  flee Judea because of rumored plots on his life and came to Cyprus. There, he was appointed by
• 16:49
  Barnabas and Paul the apostle as the first bishop of Chytion, present day, Larnaca. He lived there
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  for more than 30 years and on his death was buried there for the second and last time.
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  Further establishing the apostolic nature of Lazarus' appointment was the story that the
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  bishop's omephorion, which is some sort of a garment that goes over your shoulder, right?
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  Now, listen to this. This is so cool. Was presented to Lazarus by the Virgin Mary.
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  Now, she was no longer a virgin at this point. She had other children. However,
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  if you remember in the Gospel of John, the disciple whom Jesus loved had Mary, remember? Behold your
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  mother, mother, behold your. So, it seems that Mary was with Lazarus. She made him this special
• 17:36
  thing and gave it to him. So, Larry wasn't, Larry.
• 17:38
  There you go. Combination of Mary and Lazarus. Do you guys remember the 15th apostle, Larry?
• 17:44
  So, Lazarus and Mary were together in Cyprus. There's a lot of legend, all Orthodox churches,
• 17:55
  the Catholic Church, they all have their different versions of these histories. But
• 17:59
  one thing that really was interesting, Virgin Mary had woven this thing herself. Such apostolic
• 18:06
  connections were central to the claims to autocephaly. What does that mean?
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  I have no idea, but it happens without anything helping it.
• 18:15
  It says, meaning property of being self-headed, the status of hierarchical Christian church
• 18:20
  whose head bishop does not report to any higher ranking bishop.
• 18:24
  Oh, top man.
• 18:26
  Yeah. So, autocephaly made by the bishops of Chideon is subject only to the patriarch of Jerusalem
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  during the period of 325-431. I don't know what that means. Anyway, according to tradition,
• 18:37
  Lazarus never smiled during the 30 years after his resurrection, worried by the sight of
• 18:42
  unredeemed souls he had seen during his four-day stay in hell. Yeah, okay. The only exception was
• 18:49
  when he saw someone stealing a pot, he smilingly said, the clay steals the clay. Okay. In 890,
• 18:58
  a tomb was found in Larnaca bearing the inscription, Lazarus, the friend of Christ.
• 19:03
  Emperor Leo VI of Byzantium had Lazarus' remains transferred to Constantinople in 898.
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  The transfer was apostrophized by Arethas, bishop of Caesarea, and is commemorated by
• 19:16
  the Eastern Orthodox Church each year on October 17. In recompense to Larnaca, Emperor Leo had the
• 19:22
  Church of St. Lazarus, which still exists today, erected over Lazarus' tomb. The marble sarcophagus
• 19:29
  can be seen inside the church under the Holy of Holies. After the sacking of Constantinople by
• 19:35
  the Franks during the Fourth Crusade in 1204, the crusaders carried the saints' relics to Marseille,
• 19:40
  France as part of the booty of war. From there, later on, they disappeared and up to the present
• 19:47
  day, they have not been traced, supposedly. But then in the 16th century, a Russian monk from the
• 19:52
  monastery of Scaf visited St. Lazarus' tomb in Larnaca and took with him a small piece of the
• 19:57
  relics. Perhaps that piece led to the erection of the St. Lazarus Chapel at the Scaf monastery,
• 20:05
  where it is kept to this day. On November 23, 1972, human remains and a marble sarcophagus
• 20:11
  were discovered under the altar during renovation works in the Church of St. Lazarus at Larnaca
• 20:16
  and were identified as part of the saints' relics. In June 2012, the Church of Cyprus
• 20:21
  gave a part of the holy relics of St. Lazarus to a delegation of the Russian Orthodox Church
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  led by Patriarch Kirill of Moscow and all Russia after a four-day visit to Cyprus. The relics were
• 20:32
  brought to Moscow and were given to Archbishop Arseny of Istra, who took them to the Zakhatevsky
• 20:39
  monastery, where they were put up for veneration.
• 20:43
  He did a lot of traveling.
• 20:45
  Yeah, I was going to say something similar. Yeah, well-traveled in death, for sure.
• 20:48
  Geez. Can you imagine being so venerated after death that people would want your bones and
• 20:54
  carry them all over the world? I mean, that's bizarre.
• 20:57
  It's an interesting story. Second, I mean, he's the only other person to be raised from the dead
• 21:02
  besides Christ, right? Well, no, he was, no. He had raised the
• 21:07
  widow of Nain's son. He had raised the daughter of Jairus.
• 21:10
  Oh, okay. Yeah. And then, you know, the disciples,
• 21:13
  Peter had raised a girl named Dorcas. Elijah, what? Oh, right.
• 21:18
  The Tishba raised the son of the widow. There's all sorts of raising going on, I don't know.
• 21:23
  Lots of resurrecting going on up in here. But the resurrection of Christ, what it sets it apart from
• 21:29
  all of the other resurrections is that no one resurrected Christ. Christ was resurrected.
• 21:35
  According to what he said, and if you destroy this temple in three days, I will raise it up,
• 21:42
  which was nothing more than a claim that he was God. So he was capable of raising himself up.
• 21:48
  So anyway, that ends our study on Lazarus. He absolutely wrote the Gospel of John. And if
• 21:53
  anybody doesn't believe it, I'll fight you. I'll take you down right now. No, but seriously,
• 21:57
  I sincerely believe that. Everything that I've read. Now, if anybody wants to disagree with me,
• 22:02
  I would be happy to do an argument podcast stating this has to be John. And feel free to do it while
• 22:08
  I'm not here. Actually, look some of it up.
• 22:10
  You're not the only person that thinks that. I'm not.
• 22:12
  I looked some, yeah, I just, you know. For fun?
• 22:15
  Yeah, I did. I was like, huh, wonder if anybody else thought this.
• 22:18
  So other people think this. Yeah. I mean, there have been other people
• 22:21
  who have claimed that there that is a possibility. To me, it seems like the Holy Spirit's pretty much
• 22:26
  spelling it out for everybody in the book when it says that, and Jesus loved Lazarus, loved Lazarus,
• 22:31
  loved the wrath, you know, maybe he's not the rich young ruler, but I think he is. I think he is.
• 22:36
  Well, I was thinking about the claim that Lazarus was so sad because of all the souls he had seen
• 22:42
  while he was in hell. I thought, well, if he was the leper that was healed, I wouldn't have.
• 22:48
  He would have been in paradise. Yeah. I would not have thought that he
• 22:51
  would be in hell. Yeah, absolutely. To me, it seems that way,
• 22:55
  you know, and whenever we did the podcast and we talked about the rich man and Lazarus.
• 22:59
  I'd say maybe I'd be more sad to think I was in paradise than I got brought back here.
• 23:03
  Yeah. If you remember, I had said that Jesus had, was it a parable or was it a true story,
• 23:11
  the rich man and Lazarus, and you know, in our faith in the Baptist church, they believe that
• 23:15
  it's a parable. Oh, they believe it's real, not a parable. And I said, and I agree with that because
• 23:20
  it uses the name, but then I started studying a little bit more and I sort of claimed that,
• 23:24
  but then I started, I did some research and I discovered something really unique that I didn't
• 23:30
  mean to discover. It was purely by accident. So, and I said this in one of the podcasts, I think,
• 23:36
  but when Jesus talks about the rich man that fared sumptuously and was in fine linen,
• 23:44
  fine purple linen, that is the chief priest. The chief priest uses fine purple linen.
• 23:50
  And he said, I have five brethren. Okay. And I'd said this before. So the weird part was
• 23:57
  Anas, who is mentioned in the gospel of John, is the father-in-law of Caiaphas. And so Anas was the
• 24:04
  previous high priest who still has some influence and his son-in-law is now the high priest.
• 24:11
  And so this rich man, whenever he's in hell, he looks up, he says, I have five brethren.
• 24:15
  He uses the name number five. And I'd said that Anas has five children. And so that would have
• 24:21
  been his brothers-in-law, but those would have been his brethren. All five children of Anas,
• 24:26
  the high priest, became a high priest and his son-in-law, but all five of them did.
• 24:32
  And the weird part was in 37 to 41 AD was one called Theophilus, then Ananas. And we just read
• 24:41
  about how Luke is writing to most excellent Theophilus. He was writing to him. I think Jesus
• 24:48
  was either speaking prophetically and Lazarus died, but Caiaphas wasn't dead at that point.
• 24:53
  I think Caiaphas died six years after Christ did, but it's almost like it's a parable, but it's true
• 24:59
  because Lazarus was the person that he raised from the dead. But if you keep in mind, remember when
• 25:04
  I said about Lazarus, his name is Eleazar. So if it was spoken in his language, it would have been
• 25:11
  Eleazar of the priest line dies, but this rich man who fared. So it's almost like he's doing a
• 25:17
  play on who is the real priest and who isn't. It's a pretty unique little thought, but there's
• 25:23
  no way, I mean, I don't believe that it's Lazarus necessarily. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. It
• 25:27
  depends on the day. I don't know. That's the way it is with everything.
• 25:30
  I found it interesting that Jonah was in the belly of the well for three days. Some people say
• 25:37
  Jonah died. They referenced that this would be in hell in the belly of a well. Then you said
• 25:43
  Lazarus was sad because they thought that he had spent four days in hell.
• 25:47
  Mm-hmm. And sheol, that was the word. Remember I said Gehenna or Hades, we were talking about
• 25:53
  the dead and I was like, what is the Hebrew word? It's called sheol, which is where all the dead go,
• 25:58
  sheol in the Hebrew religion. Yeah. So thank you, Cherry Lewis.
• 26:04
  Thank you, Rick.
• 26:05
  Thank you, Andy.
• 26:07
  You're welcome.
• 26:09
  That wraps it up and that's the end of this side study. So if anybody has any argument or anything
• 26:15
  whatsoever, whenever we do put out this podcast, please let us know. We're always searching. We're
• 26:21
  not perfectly set in stone. This is the way it is. We'd love to learn. That's why we're Bereans. We
• 26:26
  like to study to see if it's so. So thanks a lot, guys.
• 26:30
  Thank you.
• 26:31
  Thank you.
• 26:36
  Invited me up and I did a recording and Andy was... Andy, did you live with the Gillums or did
• 26:44
  you just... No, I just kind of worked for them. It was a weird situation, honestly.
• 26:48
  Yeah.
• 26:49
  And of course they were weird people, but I just kind of got out of school not long before that,
• 26:57
  or back from up north where I did my internship and somehow I don't have any idea how I met them.
• 27:03
  I have the worst.
• 27:04
  Through Ryan Witted.
• 27:05
  Yeah. I guess that would have to be. And somehow they found out that I had gone to school for it
• 27:11
  and they had designs on making a recording studio in their basement. And they put together a very
• 27:17
  modest studio and asked me to work at it. And yeah, and that's kind of how I got my start,
• 27:26
  if not for that. I mean, it was... There was nothing special about the place and the work I
• 27:31
  did while I was there was pretty trash, but it was a nice launch pad and I worked there part-time
• 27:39
  while I worked at the Honey Baked Ham and I recorded for them and I saved up some money and
• 27:45
  bought my first work computer. And when inevitably it all fell apart because there was no way that
• 27:50
  was going to work. If you knew the people, you'd know why. Then I took my computer and that's right
• 27:58
  because it was Ryan's gear. And the whole thing, Ryan, I think there was a falling out there and
• 28:04
  Ryan kind of got burned and then sold me all of that gear for like just too good an effing deal,
• 28:12
  too good a deal. Yeah. And that was the core of my first recording studio. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah.
• 28:20
  My first recording was with you up there.
• 28:24
  You were in what band were you in?
• 28:26
  It wasn't a band. I did a spoken word thing called the Fishers of Men.
• 28:30
  Oh boy, I'd like to say I remember it, but I'd be lying.
• 28:34
  All I remember is that you had curly hair on top of your head.
• 28:38
  And it was a while ago then. Yeah, it was a while ago. You had curly
• 28:41
  hair on top of your head and you were eating ramen downstairs. I think it was ramen or something.
• 28:46
  And then we recorded that and that was spoken word called the Fishers of Men and it was about Peter.