Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / Challenge Accepted: Raising Kids Who Step Up [with Chris Balme]

Transcript

Challenge Accepted: Raising Kids Who Step Up [with Chris Balme] · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

0:06
Speaker 1: This is The Happy Family's podcast today. My name is
0:08
Speaker 1: doctor Justin Coulson. Really excited to have this conversation today
0:13
Speaker 1: on the pod. A couple of weeks ago, Lanor Scanazzi,
0:16
Speaker 1: the World's Worst Mum, we had her on the podcast
0:19
Speaker 1: talking about her most recent ted talk about why we
0:21
Speaker 1: should spend less time with the kids. But when we
0:24
Speaker 1: were talking, Lena told me that I absolutely had to
0:28
Speaker 1: talk to this guest, and she was right. Chris Bam
0:31
Speaker 1: has cracked the code on what tweens and teens actually
0:35
Speaker 1: need to thrive, and he's got a brand new book
0:37
Speaker 1: that puts adventure back into adolescents and pre adolescents. It's
0:41
Speaker 1: called Challenge Accepted. It's all about giving kids real challenges
0:45
Speaker 1: that build confidence and creativity. If you know Lenoscanazzi and
0:48
Speaker 1: Free Range Kids, you'll know why she was so excited
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Speaker 1: about Chris and his book. And if you've got a
0:52
Speaker 1: child who is in what they would call middle school
0:54
Speaker 1: everywhere in the world except Australia, that is, we're talking
0:56
Speaker 1: about our tweens and early teen kids, kids that sort
1:01
Speaker 1: of seem, I don't know, glue to their screens, stuck
1:02
Speaker 1: in their comfort zone, and you're wondering how to help
1:04
Speaker 1: them discover what they're truly capable of, especially with the
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Speaker 1: social media minNum age legislation coming in the next couple
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Speaker 1: of weeks. You need to hear this conversation. Stay with us.
1:16
Speaker 1: This is the Happy Families Podcast, Real Parenting Solutions, every
1:19
Speaker 1: day on Australia's most downloaded parenting podcast. My name stops
1:22
Speaker 1: to Justin Coilson, and today I'm joined by Chris Barham.
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Speaker 1: Chris is an education innovator. He has founded two schools
1:30
Speaker 1: dedicated to helping young people to discover therefore potentially currently
1:33
Speaker 1: serves as co Prin's bullet at Hercuber. I don't speak Japanese, Chris,
1:37
Speaker 1: If I got that right, Harkuber International School in Japan.
1:40
Speaker 2: How do you say it? How? Hakuba?
1:44
Speaker 1: So sorry, and is also the founder and director of Argonnault,
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Speaker 1: an online advisory program for middle schoolers worldwide. Chris, before
1:51
Speaker 1: I bring you in a little bit more about you,
1:52
Speaker 1: because I think people should know just how accomplished you
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Speaker 1: are and why this conversation matters. Chris co founded Millennium School.
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Speaker 1: It's a pioneering lab school in San from just Go
2:01
Speaker 1: and has been recognized as a Shoker Fellow, did I
2:04
Speaker 1: say a choker correctly?
2:05
Speaker 2: Again?
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Speaker 1: Beautiful for his change making work in education. First book
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Speaker 1: was Fighting the Magic in Middle School. That was Best
2:12
Speaker 1: Sller a couple of years ago. Latest book, Challenge Accepted,
2:15
Speaker 1: written directly for your kids.
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Speaker 2: And I know some people say, oh, my kids are
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Speaker 2: going to read a book.
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Speaker 1: This one is designed in such way that kids can
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Speaker 1: actually read it because the chapters are short. Hello, short
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Speaker 1: form content packed with adventures that are going to help
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Speaker 1: middle schoolers unlock their creativity and confidence during what I
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Speaker 1: think is some vital, foundational, important years. Chris Long intro.
2:36
Speaker 1: Pleasure to have you on the podcast. Thanks for staying
2:39
Speaker 1: up until all hours in California to have this discussion
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Speaker 1: with me today.
2:43
Speaker 2: Welcome, great to be with you justin Thanks for having me.
2:46
Speaker 1: So a softball question straight up, but let's talk about
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Speaker 1: the book Challenge Accepted. Describe why you've written a book
2:52
Speaker 1: for kids, because the reality is data, unfortunately is telling
2:56
Speaker 1: us that kids aren't reading books nearly to the degree
2:59
Speaker 1: that they once did. And yet this is a children's
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Speaker 1: activity book four tweens and kids in their early teens.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, thank you for the question. Big picture, I
3:08
Speaker 2: mean there are two times in the human life span
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Speaker 2: where our brains are growing the fastest, early childhood and
3:14
Speaker 2: early adolescence. This is where it's at zero to five
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Speaker 2: and eleven to sixteen. But the big difference and the
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Speaker 2: reason both of these books came about is the zero
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Speaker 2: to five years. We have all of these resources. As
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Speaker 2: new parents. We get maps, we figure out the developmental stages,
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Speaker 2: and that way we don't take it personally. When our
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Speaker 2: two year olds starts saying no to everything, you know,
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Speaker 2: we see it coming. But fast forward to the eleven
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Speaker 2: to sixteen year range, the next big phase, when brains
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Speaker 2: are growing fast and you've got to work hard to
3:43
Speaker 2: keep up with your kid, we don't get those maps,
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Speaker 2: and parents, instead of knowing, oh, I can see exactly
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Speaker 2: what's coming, we get caught off guard. We take it personally.
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Speaker 2: We think something's wrong with us or wrong with our kid.
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Speaker 2: So I wrote the first book to guide the parents
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Speaker 2: and teachers to understand developmentally what's happening in the eleven
4:00
Speaker 2: to sixteen year range. And then the second book is
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Speaker 2: so kids can just go and do it and take
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Speaker 2: things into their own hands, feel like they're authors of
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Speaker 2: their own story. The catches as you said, if a
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Speaker 2: parent hands you this book and says you got to
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Speaker 2: do this, that is not a good beginning. So what
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Speaker 2: I always recommend to parents is, just like you mate
4:18
Speaker 2: with a health or sexuality book, you kind of leave
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Speaker 2: it available. Make it something that your kid can find
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Speaker 2: to get some good resources when they need it, not
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Speaker 2: as a demand from you the parents.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, oh, what's this book that's been sitting on the
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Speaker 1: kitchen bench for the last three weeks?
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Speaker 2: Baby?
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Speaker 1: You want to exactly right. I want to spend a
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Speaker 1: second talking about these challenges because these are the kinds
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Speaker 1: of things that once upon a time, and I'm talking
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Speaker 1: about your generation, my generation, we just did this stuff.
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Speaker 1: Like I remember so challenge number for challenge accepted. That's
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Speaker 1: the title of the book, Challenge number nine Open a
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Speaker 1: bank account. I remember sneaking down to the shops when
4:55
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't know, thirteen or fourteen years old.
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Speaker 1: I'd just gotten one of my first ever. I was
5:01
Speaker 1: probably a bit too young to be getting the job,
5:02
Speaker 1: but they gave it to me anyway. I was pushing
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Speaker 1: trolley's as we call them in Australia shopping cars in
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Speaker 1: the United States around a car park and I wanted
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Speaker 1: to have my own money. I didn't want my parents
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Speaker 1: to know about my money, and I felt so independent
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Speaker 1: to walk into the bank doesn't exist anymore. But I
5:18
Speaker 1: went to the Advance bank and I set up my
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Speaker 1: bank account and I got my own little card that
5:22
Speaker 1: went with it. It wasn't a credit card because I didn't
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Speaker 1: give those kids.
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Speaker 2: I remember just feeling so big, like Tom Hanks big.
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Speaker 1: I felt like I was a grown up because I
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Speaker 1: had my own bank account that I had opened on
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Speaker 1: my own with my own money, and the paycheck was
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Speaker 1: going to go in there, and my parents wouldn't know
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Speaker 1: about it, which meant that I could buy whatever I wanted.
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Speaker 1: And it felt so It just felt so big. It
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Speaker 1: was so enlarging for me. Talk more about the challenges
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Speaker 1: and what else is in there and why that's it? Well.
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Speaker 2: I had very similar experience. First job at thirteen, worked
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Speaker 2: in a retail sharp terrified of my boss. Thought this
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Speaker 2: was the most powerful being it ever in Calgary. And
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Speaker 2: I will never forget the day, probably six months in
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Speaker 2: where she allowed me to run the shop while she
6:06
Speaker 2: went to run an Errand's, and I swear I was
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Speaker 2: a foot taller at the end of that day. Just
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Speaker 2: that kind of validation from an objective adult who was
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Speaker 2: actually paying me that I could handle something like that
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Speaker 2: meant more to me than every grade I got in
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Speaker 2: school that whole year. And I think that is the
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Speaker 2: psychology that adolescents have, that they they know that their
6:25
Speaker 2: parents and teachers are subjective, and they want to get
6:29
Speaker 2: out there into the real world where there's objectivity, where
6:31
Speaker 2: they can earn something literally maybe money in other ways
6:35
Speaker 2: as well, that shows what they're worth. That helps them
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Speaker 2: internalize a sense of value. So that's what the book
6:41
Speaker 2: is all about. Whether it's you know, starting a business.
6:43
Speaker 2: I was thinking of some students of mine who started
6:46
Speaker 2: a student cafe at a school, invested in you know,
6:49
Speaker 2: industrial toasters and things like that, and at the time
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Speaker 2: of their life figuring out how to make money, or
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Speaker 2: all kinds of other things. Kids who do their first
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Speaker 2: camping trip, who you know, recently, my own daughter is
7:01
Speaker 2: taking on the challenge to create a time capsule with
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Speaker 2: their friend and they're finding all their kind of favorite
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Speaker 2: items that represent this era and they're burying them in
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Speaker 2: the backyard in a box. I think the idea is,
7:12
Speaker 2: you know, this generation of kids, for whatever reason, we
7:15
Speaker 2: can guess about it has had less autonomy, and for
7:19
Speaker 2: various reasons, they've been in more structured activities. We need
7:23
Speaker 2: to get them out into the world. There's even research
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Speaker 2: and Lenora and others are on top of this showing
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Speaker 2: that without autonomy, we have higher rates of anxiety and
7:30
Speaker 2: depression in our teenage years. So they've got to get
7:34
Speaker 2: out there. And this is a book that gives hopefully
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Speaker 2: fifty good ideas, one of which we'll catch them to
7:39
Speaker 2: get them out there.
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Speaker 1: So one of the challenges in the book, and this
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Speaker 1: is the last one that we'll talking about before we
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Speaker 1: step into some other content, but number twenty one become
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Speaker 1: a babysitter. Become a babysitter. As you're talking about that,
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Speaker 1: it just it reminds me that just recently somebody asked
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Speaker 1: if we needed to get a babysitter for one of
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Speaker 1: our kids because we were going to go and do something.
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Speaker 1: And I thought to myself, it's so funny because this
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Speaker 1: child at the age of fifteen. Once upon a time,
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Speaker 1: it was the fourteen and fifteen year olds who are
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Speaker 1: doing the babysitting. But now people are expecting that because
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Speaker 1: I'm leaving my fifteen year old behind.
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Speaker 2: She needs to be babysat. Like this shift is in
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Speaker 2: the name.
8:21
Speaker 1: That's right, baby sitting, that's right.
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Speaker 2: So the book is very much about helping kids to
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Speaker 2: grow up right, that's it, and to realize that they
8:30
Speaker 2: can be the author of their own stories. So I
8:32
Speaker 2: think whenever you see an adolescent who's kind of rolling
8:35
Speaker 2: their eyes and being too cool for school, I think
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Speaker 2: that's not natural. That's a kid who feels thwarted. They
8:41
Speaker 2: can't go out there and work on themselves and do
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Speaker 2: the things that they're driven to do, like to contribute,
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Speaker 2: to connect, to figure out who they really are. So
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Speaker 2: they're just rolling their eyes because they're waiting until we
8:52
Speaker 2: get out of their way. In many ways, So the
8:55
Speaker 2: idea of this is, these are ways where you feel
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Speaker 2: more in control of your own story. You can become
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Speaker 2: a babysitter, you can figure out how to go camping,
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Speaker 2: start a business, etc.
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Speaker 1: Chris Barmer is the author of Challenge Accepted after the
9:06
Speaker 1: Break as a high school principle. I'm going to ask
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Speaker 1: Chris what he's seeing parents doing right and wrong when
9:13
Speaker 1: it comes to helping kids to discover their strengths and
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Speaker 1: build their confidence and resilience. Plus the difference between a
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Speaker 1: good challenge and one that just stresses kids out.
9:25
Speaker 2: Stay with us.
9:33
Speaker 1: This is the Happy Families Podcast. Chris Barm, the author
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Speaker 1: of Challenge Accepted, is with me on the pod today. Chris,
9:39
Speaker 1: you're the principle of a high school, You've founded a
9:42
Speaker 1: couple of high schools, You've been in education all your life.
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Speaker 1: When you think about what parents are doing in the
9:46
Speaker 1: way that they're engaging with children, We've talked a lot
9:49
Speaker 1: about autonomy. What are the things what are the biggest
9:52
Speaker 1: mistakes that parents are making when it comes to kids
9:55
Speaker 1: and resilience, and what are the things that we are
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Speaker 1: actually getting right? Because I don't want this to be
9:59
Speaker 1: a big be up on parents. It's a challenging world
10:02
Speaker 1: at challenging time to rise kids.
10:04
Speaker 2: Oh it is, for sure. I mean, I'll start with
10:07
Speaker 2: the positive. I think something that parents are getting more
10:09
Speaker 2: and more right is understanding that we have different brains,
10:12
Speaker 2: that there is not one kind of brain that should
10:15
Speaker 2: fit perfectly like a glove into school. You know. Neurodiversity
10:19
Speaker 2: is something that used to be barely understood and it's
10:22
Speaker 2: it's still there's a long way to go, but I
10:23
Speaker 2: think modern parents have a lot more nuanced understanding and
10:26
Speaker 2: if your kid has ADHD or is on the spectrum,
10:29
Speaker 2: you know that's possible. We can work with that. It's
10:31
Speaker 2: something that parents aren't as afraid of, I think as
10:33
Speaker 2: maybe a past generation. On the flip side, I think
10:37
Speaker 2: that I think parents struggle with you know, I'm a
10:40
Speaker 2: parent of three. I think that we hold a lot
10:42
Speaker 2: of fear and we're frequently overwhelmed. Our to do list
10:46
Speaker 2: is ridiculously long. We don't have time to reflect, and
10:50
Speaker 2: in that fearful, reactive place, we don't give our kids
10:54
Speaker 2: enough trust and autonomy. We think that the world is scary.
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Speaker 2: We're taking care of them by putting in them and
11:00
Speaker 2: structured activities or being baby sad at fifteen, as you said,
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Speaker 2: And that comes from love without a doubt, but it
11:07
Speaker 2: has some unfortunate side effects that if kids don't get
11:10
Speaker 2: out there, they don't discover a sense of value, they
11:13
Speaker 2: don't get to mess up when they're young enough that
11:15
Speaker 2: those mess ups aren't that big of a deal in
11:17
Speaker 2: the big picture. That's the point where they can develop
11:20
Speaker 2: confidence in the sense that they can keep tinkering towards
11:22
Speaker 2: something good. So there's some work to be done in
11:26
Speaker 2: that sense.
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Speaker 1: I have been quite provocative this year and have said
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Speaker 1: this more times than I can count, that our children
11:33
Speaker 1: should be allowed to do at least one activity every
11:35
Speaker 1: week that could, if it went wrong, land them in hospital.
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Speaker 2: Most people, when I say that are aghast.
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Speaker 1: They're like, oh, what are you saying?
11:41
Speaker 2: How can you say that?
11:43
Speaker 1: And yet and I've got a couple of kids who
11:45
Speaker 1: have ended up in hospital this year because of the
11:47
Speaker 1: activities that they've participated in. Incidentally, do you think that
11:50
Speaker 1: those kids have said, well, I'll never do that again,
11:53
Speaker 1: Like they just don't go back at it.
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Speaker 2: They're back at it.
11:55
Speaker 1: They're like, Okay, opportunity for progress, mastery.
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Speaker 2: I love the activity. That's why I was doing in
12:00
Speaker 2: the first place.
12:02
Speaker 1: And I'm looking at your challenge accepted. I'm thinking about
12:05
Speaker 1: the conversations I'm having with you and Leonora and people
12:08
Speaker 1: like that, and just thinking we can actually trust our
12:13
Speaker 1: children's intrinsic growth tendencies. Right, Like, children are born resilient,
12:19
Speaker 1: and if they stop being resilient, it's often because we.
12:24
Speaker 2: Knock it out of them.
12:25
Speaker 1: Something that I've been playing around with lately in my
12:27
Speaker 1: own mind is that resilience often doesn't feel resilient, and
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Speaker 1: I wonder I wonder if, as you consider the challenges
12:36
Speaker 1: that are in your book and the experiences that you've
12:38
Speaker 1: had with students and families that you've spoken to and
12:42
Speaker 1: people who have done these challenges, can you share an
12:45
Speaker 1: example of somebody who took on a challenge and really
12:48
Speaker 1: struggled with it, maybe it didn't even work out, and
12:51
Speaker 1: yet the activity ended up being worthwhile the challenge being
12:54
Speaker 1: accepted was exactly what needed to happen.
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Speaker 2: Absolutely just for us to what you said before. I
13:01
Speaker 2: love what you said about trust. I think when we
13:03
Speaker 2: don't trust our young children, they don't trust themselves, and
13:06
Speaker 2: when we don't trust our adolescent children, they don't trust
13:10
Speaker 2: us that they then feel resentful that they're not being
13:14
Speaker 2: taken seriously brilliant. Yeah, sure there's something there, but yeah,
13:18
Speaker 2: oh so many stories of these challenges going in all
13:21
Speaker 2: kinds of directions. When there's a student who was determined
13:25
Speaker 2: to take on the challenge to stick out in a group.
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Speaker 2: This is one that I think is especially risky for
13:31
Speaker 2: early adolescents, where sticking out just feels like the worst
13:34
Speaker 2: possible thing that could happen, everything wrong, Like you've got
13:37
Speaker 2: to be exactly. You've got to fit in right, indicate
13:40
Speaker 2: you're belonging with anything, anything's worth it. And he was
13:43
Speaker 2: kind of searching around looking for what he could do,
13:45
Speaker 2: and he told me, I have no idea. You know.
13:47
Speaker 2: The one activity that I have or like maybe I
13:49
Speaker 2: could do something is swimming. I don't know, try something.
13:52
Speaker 2: And so he realized that right after his time in
13:55
Speaker 2: the pool was a senior swim hour. So he was like,
13:59
Speaker 2: all right, I'll just hang out until the seniors get there.
14:03
Speaker 2: We'll see what happens. And he told me this incredible
14:05
Speaker 2: story that he spent an hour with the seniors. They
14:07
Speaker 2: were so happy to have him there in the pool
14:10
Speaker 2: and made all of these friends who are sixty years
14:12
Speaker 2: older than him. And now every time he shows up there,
14:15
Speaker 2: he's got like his cheer squad of you know, in
14:18
Speaker 2: the seventy to eighty year old generation. I just I
14:21
Speaker 2: love that he found a way to make that challenge work.
14:23
Speaker 2: Wasn't exactly with his peers, but he stepped out of
14:26
Speaker 2: the kind of narrow road that we often put kids in.
14:30
Speaker 1: That's the hope of the listening to you share that
14:32
Speaker 1: story and seeing the delight on your face, the smile
14:34
Speaker 1: that it elicits. This is the whole idea, right, Like
14:38
Speaker 1: when you take on a challenge, you never quite know
14:40
Speaker 1: what the outcome will be, but there's always some level
14:44
Speaker 1: of enlargement even when it doesn't quite go the way
14:47
Speaker 1: that you thought.
14:48
Speaker 2: Chris, let's do a quick.
14:50
Speaker 1: Lightning round, just a halfl of questions that I'd love.
14:52
Speaker 2: A super quick, super short.
14:54
Speaker 1: Response too, and then I'm going to hit you with
14:57
Speaker 1: my last big important question. So lightning around question number one.
15:01
Speaker 1: What's one thing that parents worry about that they.
15:04
Speaker 2: Really shouldn't their kids moving around in the world. I
15:07
Speaker 2: think we restrict their physical movements so much out of
15:10
Speaker 2: fear of, you know, things like kidnappings that are actually
15:13
Speaker 2: unbelievably rare. Let them go find their way to school,
15:16
Speaker 2: find their way to friends' houses, if at all possible.
15:19
Speaker 1: Fill in the blank. Every middle school. That is, every
15:21
Speaker 1: child between the age of let's say nine to ten
15:24
Speaker 1: through to fourteen or fifteen. Every middle schooler should try
15:28
Speaker 1: blank at least once.
15:31
Speaker 2: Wow, that's a good one. Should try joining a completely
15:35
Speaker 2: new social group. Oh that is good. I like that
15:38
Speaker 2: a lot.
15:40
Speaker 1: What's the worst advice that you hear parents giving their
15:42
Speaker 1: tweens work harder on academics.
15:45
Speaker 2: That's a controversial one.
15:47
Speaker 1: No, you and I we've just become brothers.
15:50
Speaker 2: If you could only.
15:52
Speaker 1: Give parents one piece of advice about raising adolescents.
15:56
Speaker 2: What would it be, become more vulnerable. They can see
16:00
Speaker 2: through you anyways, So it's time to reveal more about
16:04
Speaker 2: the unfinished parts of yourself. Name one small risk every
16:07
Speaker 2: twelve year old should be taking, exploring a city by
16:10
Speaker 2: themselves or with friends. I love that.
16:13
Speaker 1: Okay, here's my last lightning round question. What's your go
16:16
Speaker 1: to response when a parent says, but what if they fail?
16:19
Speaker 1: This is a great time in life to fail. It
16:21
Speaker 1: stakes a low exactly feel high because they always feel high,
16:26
Speaker 1: but they're really not that high when you're twelve years old.
16:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, great stuff, Chris.
16:31
Speaker 1: My last question for you, this is not a lightning
16:32
Speaker 1: round question. This is a much more serious one that
16:34
Speaker 1: really ties in with what the book is all about
16:36
Speaker 1: and what your work is all about.
16:39
Speaker 2: What is the difference from.
16:41
Speaker 1: Your perspective between a good challenge and a challenge that
16:46
Speaker 1: just stresses kids out and causes anxiety and worry and
16:50
Speaker 1: fear and apprehension and.
16:51
Speaker 2: All the bad things. Well, I've said.
16:54
Speaker 1: Bad things like they're bad, But are they bad anyway?
16:56
Speaker 1: What's the difference between a good challenge and a challenge
16:59
Speaker 1: that just kids out.
17:00
Speaker 2: The difference is whether you chose it and whether you
17:03
Speaker 2: have friends with you. You know, if you chose it,
17:06
Speaker 2: you're invested. And kids often don't get enough choice, And
17:09
Speaker 2: adolescents are intelligent enough to make lots of choices that
17:12
Speaker 2: we're still making for them. And if friends are with you,
17:15
Speaker 2: then even something hard becomes part of your lore. You know.
17:19
Speaker 2: Those are the stories you're going to laugh about, you know,
17:21
Speaker 2: as soon as tomorrow or the next day, that bring
17:23
Speaker 2: you closer. So they need choice and they need good company. Right, Okay,
17:28
Speaker 2: so follow up question.
17:29
Speaker 1: I just know that there are going to be some
17:30
Speaker 1: parents who are saying, yeah, but my child just won't
17:32
Speaker 1: choose anything challenging. My child just wants to sit at home,
17:34
Speaker 1: sir at TikTok, playful, whatnot. And every time I say
17:37
Speaker 1: come and do something that's going to stretch you a
17:39
Speaker 1: little bit, they just say and they won't move.
17:44
Speaker 2: I think every adolescent, even across different neurological types, really
17:50
Speaker 2: wants to understand their peers. And that is one of
17:52
Speaker 2: the most fundamental ways that puberty, tunes, our brains, they
17:55
Speaker 2: want to be around them, know how to connect, join, leave,
17:58
Speaker 2: all of those things. So if you're going to hook
18:01
Speaker 2: them into something, it's going to be through a peer.
18:04
Speaker 2: It's not you pushing them out the door. It's a
18:06
Speaker 2: peer invading them into something. So our engineering is to,
18:10
Speaker 2: you know, through our parent friends or through their friends,
18:12
Speaker 2: to pull them out the door, so that they're going
18:14
Speaker 2: because their friend is there, not because you told them.
18:17
Speaker 1: So we're supposed to wrap it up here, but I'm
18:19
Speaker 1: going to mention really quickly. I'm not sure to what
18:22
Speaker 1: degree you're familiar with self determination theory. So that's the
18:25
Speaker 1: foundation of everything that I've been doing for the last
18:26
Speaker 1: twenty years, and everything that you're tapping into here is
18:29
Speaker 1: aligned with that. So for the Happy Families podcast audience
18:33
Speaker 1: who's listening right now, what you've really said is we
18:36
Speaker 1: want our kids to take on challenges because it builds
18:39
Speaker 1: their capacity, their competence, their capability. We want them to
18:42
Speaker 1: do it with other people and to be involved with
18:44
Speaker 1: others because that supports that relatdn's need and to the
18:47
Speaker 1: degree that we possibly can, we want them to have
18:50
Speaker 1: a say in the challenges that they're taking on because
18:52
Speaker 1: when they buy the why, when they're inventing the why themselves,
18:54
Speaker 1: when they're stepping into that rationale and saying this makes
18:57
Speaker 1: sense to me, I want to do this, they're much
18:59
Speaker 1: more likely to stick with it. What you've essentially done
19:01
Speaker 1: in this book is created a whole lot of challenges
19:04
Speaker 1: for kids to become more motivated, more effective, more functional
19:09
Speaker 1: humans because they all sit within the most well researched,
19:13
Speaker 1: most empirically backed psychological theory on the planet.
19:17
Speaker 2: That's it. We're singing the same song. I'm with you.
19:20
Speaker 2: I think they are naturally highly motivated people, so these
19:23
Speaker 2: challenges are just about giving them the conditions to act
19:26
Speaker 2: on that motivation, and they will drive themselves toward the
19:29
Speaker 2: best learning that we can imagine.
19:31
Speaker 1: So I'm sitting here with goosebumps all up my arms
19:33
Speaker 1: and legs and thinking, what a great conversation. I hope
19:35
Speaker 1: that everyone who's listened has gleaned so much. The book
19:39
Speaker 1: is called Challenge Accepted. We'll link to that in the
19:41
Speaker 1: show notes. It's available wherever you buy your books. Chris Bam,
19:44
Speaker 1: thank you for staying up late in California to have
19:47
Speaker 1: a chat with me on the Happy Families.
19:48
Speaker 2: Podcasts such a fun chat. Thanks Justin.
19:51
Speaker 1: The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin Roland for
19:53
Speaker 1: Bridge Media. Mim Hammond's provides research, admin and other support,
19:58
Speaker 1: and if you would like more info of what we've
20:00
Speaker 1: talked about, check the show notes for Chris's book and
20:02
Speaker 1: visit Happy Families dot com dot au for even more
20:05
Speaker 1: resources