Latest / Leave the 99 / Ep. 2 - Escaping Pharma Protocols for True Heart Health with Dr. Jack Wolfson

Transcript

Ep. 2 - Escaping Pharma Protocols for True Heart Health with Dr. Jack Wolfson · Leave the 99

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: All right, welcome back to Leave the 99 presented by Black Sheep Health.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Dr.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: Russ Van Melee, and the name of this show comes from the parable, Luke 15, where the shepherd leaves the 99 to go after the one.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: And today's guest did something like that in medicine.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: He trained as a board-certified cardiologist, then walked away from the standard playbook to find the root cause of heart disease.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: He's known as the paleocardiologist and the natural heart doctor.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: And like me, he's a DO, he's a husband, he's a father, and his family shaped how he practices medicine.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: So welcome to the podcast, Dr.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Jack Wolfson.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's a pleasure to have you here.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, Dr.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: Russell.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, love it, love the name of your show.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and uh you uh you and I were talking beforehand, and uh yeah, we're kind of cut from the same cloth, and but uh you you're looking at uh two children right now with number three on the way.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: I've got no I've got four in the bag.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: My wife is 51, and she's still talking about having another one, and she's still ovulating.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, I'm like, you know, uh four for us is a good number.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm 55, about to turn 56.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: I was changing diapers at 50.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: So uh anywho, anywho, it's uh great to be on.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_01: Great to be on with you.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Appreciate it.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, thank you so much.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I was telling you before that uh I've looked up to you for a long time, I've followed you for a long time, and in being able to start this podcast and do this with you, I feel like I'm honestly I'm talking to my celebrities, right?
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Some people want to talk to NFL players, I want to talk to guys like you.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think the biggest thing that I admire from you is just your boldness.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: You are certainly uh, I mean, on an extreme level in the cardiology space, and you are you are the definition of this show that against the green, the you are the one out of the 100, right, that kind of left.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I kind of want to hear the the the backstory on that and uh where kind of where did this boldness come from?
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I would say I'm more like the one in uh the one in uh thousands, if you will, and the most extreme.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: Well, listen, I'm gonna throw it all uh number one to uh to God and to God putting me on this path to health and wellness.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's the only way that I can explain everything that's ever happened in my life.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm born into the cardiology world.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: My father was a cardiologist.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, he was the first DO at the Cleveland Clinic in 1970, first DO in that entire institution, uh, the most prestigious institution in the United States, Cleveland Clinic.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then he becomes the first DO at University of Iowa.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I am listening to cardiology stories at a very young age.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_01: I wanted to be just like my father, and I would do that.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: I would become just like my father, a cardiologist like him.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_01: And as my career was really uh taking off to the positive, and I was finishing up my training and getting all these job offers, moving from Chicago to Arizona, my career was taking off, and my father's health was declining, and uh nobody knew why.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: We eventually take him to the Mayo clinic, and at the Mayo clinic, he was diagnosed with progressive supronuclear palsy, a diagnosis similar to Parkinson's.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: And they told us we have no idea why.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: We have no treatment for him, and he'll be dead within three years on average.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: And simultaneously, serendipitously, uh, divinely uh intervened.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I get introduced to this 29-year-old holistic practitioner or chiropractor, and she tells me all the reasons why my father is sick and dying.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: So the male clinic has no idea why my father's dying.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_01: The 29-year-old chiropractor, she has all the reasons.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: And she tells me, you better change those ways that you're living because you're gonna follow in the same footsteps.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't want that for sure.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I started to change my personal life, started to change my professional life.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: I would marry that 29-year-old chiropractor, and then here we are, uh married for over 20 years with four children.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I would leave the big cardiology group in 2012 and start my own company, Natural Heart Doctor.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it really has just been such a whirlwind and such an incredible experience.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_01: And to become like that black sheep, you know, that you know, nine, you know, that one out of the 100, uh, it wasn't necessarily easy because yeah, the world is against you, the profession is against you, the governing boards are against you, uh, your friends, your colleagues are against what you're doing.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: But uh when you know what's right uh and and what's wrong, uh, that's that's the blessing is to follow that path.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: And you have to be true to that.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: And and before I forget, before we jump into the conversation, if you if you don't mind, could you mind if I say a quick prayer that we kind of just bless this call and bless this meeting really quick?
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: Wonderful.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: Heavenly Father, thank you today just for this, for this time, this experience.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we're just so thankful to have this conversation and we pray that this information just seeks out that one person that might need to hear this that is wanting to take better care of their health and just get a little bit better.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: And specifically, you know, we pray for Dr.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: Jack that his practice continues to thrive and does well, and that he can just make so many more people healthy through his medicine, his art of medicine.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm very blessed to have this conversation with him, and uh, we pray for just wisdom to be uh uh spread to the masses here.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: So in Jesus' name we pray.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I I was gonna say that uh, you know, the all we're really asking for, all we really want other people is to seek the truth or or even seek a different opinion.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what I believe that a podcast, you know, being on like this offers right now is the ability to say, hey, we don't have to follow exactly what the doctor said circa 1975, where it was a dictatorship, doctor to patient.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: And this is an opportunity for partnerships, really, is like, hey, let's have a conversation, let's talk about different uh options, and then you, the person, you're a free person, you decide.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: And and it it's a tough space to be in because we're trained a certain way.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: We have to, you know, you get these guidelines that come out, it seems like every every couple of years that we're supposed to follow.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, you're reading the same stuff that I am, and you look at some of this data and you you know, see what is prescribed or what intervention is done, and who they studied.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes it just to me, I I like scratching my head, I'm like, how is somebody so convinced on one side?
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's me going, I don't know, I still like the way I'm doing it.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I still think that lifestyle wins every single time, and that's something that I'm absolutely drawn to your art of medicine because that's how I practice on a daily basis.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_01: So well, I mean, if I can, you know, sorry to interrupt, but I would say that it is very clear and obvious and not conspiratorial, that pharmaceutical companies influence every bit of medical education.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_01: The guidelines, the physicians who write the guidelines, the governing bodies, the American Heart Association, the American College of Cardiology, the medical journals, pharmaceutical companies have extreme influence into all those different areas.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's not conjecture, not conspiracy, it just is, and it's been that way for over 100 years.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: So that's why doctors tend to behave the way that they do.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: And then if they step out of line, that's the opportunity where they get slapped back into line.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_01: And that's if we if we understand that reality, then we can say, well, let's talk about some alternatives to that.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_01: You know, let's, you know, let's, you know, let's let's revisit the guidelines and let's show people actually the real data that is out there.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: And if we talk about statin drugs and we say, well, statin drugs are the guidelines, everybody's on statin drugs.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: But if you look at what statin drugs do, yes, they lower numbers, but they very in a very unmeaningful way improve outcomes, which is what matters heart attack, stroke, and dying.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: So we want to offer people these opportunities to say, yeah, we know what the treat what the mainstream doctors say and and why they say it and what the guidelines, but here's actually the real data.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: And can we offer something that's better?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where doctors like you and I really shine is like, hey, listen, you know, we're we're gonna be the black sheep here.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna go outside of the lines, we're gonna talk about some other things, we're gonna talk about root cause, and we're gonna talk about how if we were living at the time of Yeshua, at the time of Jesus, what would our health be like?
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: And our health would be extraordinary.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: And if we embrace the tenets of that lifestyle from back in that day and bring that into a modern world, that's the only way.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we were built perfectly in the image of God by God.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_01: Our DNA is perfect, but it is the modern man-made lifestyle that's killing us.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: Do you ever get jealous?
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, or not jealous, but uh wish that you lived back in Jesus' time when life was just so simple.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, it's uh that's an interesting uh you know concept.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: And uh I definitely would say that the pinnacle of human existence, like the the health of the human, really at that time and and you know, even before then, where you're talking about where really where it's like survival of the fittest.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Now we can make everybody survive, you know, we can we can we can propagate that.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, listen, at that time you think about how you know the tenants of what's important.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_01: They they have ultimate circadian biology, right?
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: So they go to bed on time, uh, they wake up on time, there's no artificial light, there's no EMF, there's no Wi-Fi, there's a there's none of this massive amount of man-made toxins uh that are around at that time.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, there's firelight, there's candlelight, maybe they're burning, you know, olive oil, you know, lamps and stuff like that, but it was all so natural.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: And all the food was organic, and they were all physically active, and they were gardeners and hunters and shepherds and gatherers.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: It really must have been in a lot of ways a just an incredible, incredible existence.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: Not without difficulty.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's for sure.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, you know, war, uh, um, you know, just so many, you know, in particular at that time, the conflicts between the, you know, the Romans, you know, and the Hebrews and other governing things, like there was a lot that was going on that would have been very stressful.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_01: But not chronic stress, not every moment of stress like there is right now.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, so so many things lead to an unhealthy lifestyle uh and unhealthy, you know, people, uh, you know, most certainly.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: Now, the one thing I will say this that does that does go back into the book of Leviticus, where Moses is talking about in the book of Leviticus about if you live in a house that has mold uh uh and and bacteria.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: So if you live in a sick home, uh how you remediate that.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_01: And if you can't remediate it, then Moses commands you through God, God, you know, Moses through God, uh, or God through Moses, tells us that we have to tear the whole thing down.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_01: And that is a really good segue into telling people about if you're living in a home with water damage, uh, with which pretty much everybody does, how monumentally deadly uh that is, because mold was here first in the uh in the in the biblical model.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: Uh God creates you know, you know, plants and and fungus and all these other things before man enters into the picture.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: So mold was here first.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Uh even if you're even if you want to go with the evolutionary version uh that mold is 750 million years old, uh, and we are not.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: So, with that being said, it's uh it's it's extremely harmful, and it's something that mainstream medicine doesn't have a clue.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: You're you're much more recently trained than I am.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: Did you ever talk about uh living in a water-damaged home and the mycotoxicity and the bacterial toxicity and those toxins that are released and how that impacts the human frame?
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_01: And just to finish up that one quick thought, and we could expand on this if we want, we talk about oh, toxins.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_01: Well, what are mold toxins?
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_01: What's this, you know, what's this cardiologist talking about?
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: Toxins, toxins.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: You ever heard of penicillin?
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's a mold toxin, you know?
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's real.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, exactly.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think that's that's an interesting point.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think going back to like Jesus' time, you know, I I I go outside sometimes at night and I get a little chill, you know, it gets to like 40 degrees and I get a little chill, and then I think it having to sleeping outside versus my nice warm bed that's you know climate controlled.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: I I want to think that I could tough it out, and and you kind of just had to back in the day, there was no other option.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_00: But I certainly uh I I say to my wife a lot, like, if I could live off the grid, I think I probably would do it.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: That I could still support my family, right?
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: And but if I could get away from all the Wi-Fi, all the the toxins, all the, you know, one of my favorite things is optimizing my circadian rhythm with uh camping trips.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like my brothers and I, we always do this trip.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: We haven't done it in a few years because we all are starting to have kids, but going up to the Cascades and going trout fishing in these super high alpine lakes, and we're sleeping in tents, you know, waking up with the sun, we're going down with the sun, eating fresh fish that we just caught out of the freezing cold, you know, uh lake.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I am all about that.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um well you can do it more.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, and well, now you know, we just do it with our families.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard to take the guy's trip, but what's what's the greatest blessing, of course, is to do it with your family.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, I've done that with my family.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: In fact, my family and I, we lived in tents uh traveling around the western US and down into Texas for uh for a year.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: Recently, recently we've done this for a full year you did it for a full year, but but to get a little bit, I mean, just real quick to be granular about it, because a lot of people are listening and they're not gonna say, okay, well, I'm not living in a tent, you know, for a year.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not, I'm not doing what you just said.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: How can I achieve that?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's just spend more time outside.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: You have to think about this right now.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: How can you spend more time outside?
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: Because the more time you spend outside, the longer you will live.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: So figure it out.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: Now, I live in the mountains of Costa Rica.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: Currently, as we speak, I'm in Arizona, just visiting family, trying to get some business stuff done, some passport-related issues.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: But as of November 10th, I'll be back in Costa Rica and I will be living outside.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: We sleep inside, but for 16 hours a day in Costa Rica, I'm outside.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_01: Our ancestors were always outside.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_01: Now you're inside, I'm inside, everybody else is inside.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: And what happens when you bring a plant indoors, a tree indoors, they die.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: And when you bring a human indoors, they die.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: So at the time of 2,000 years ago, exactly, they they were inside to sleep, and then they were outside and they were in the fields doing their work with the chill.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody's outside running around.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: To your point, up in uh Bethlehem in you know Jerusalem in the winter time, it gets it gets pretty chilly up there.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: It can snow in in you know Jerusalem, and they were living in that.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: I think they were prepared.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: They would have had animal skins, they would have had fire, they would have had ways to protect themselves inside in that particular environment.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: But then, you know, it becomes uh you know 55, 60 degrees, and they're out in the fields.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: They're not sitting inside typing away on their computer, scrolling on social media.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: They're outside uh living life.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_00: And that's something, you know, one honestly, one of the reasons that me and my family decided to move from Michigan down to Arkansas, where we're at right now.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: It's not Costa Rica, but uh we we get a lot more outside time.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_00: We still get all our seasons.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: It still does snow in the wintertime, but man, we are outside exponentially more than we were back in Michigan, especially, you know, there's this long winter, especially northern Michigan where we where we came from.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: It just got got tough.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, obviously there's trade-offs with everything.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: We're farther away from family.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: That's a very, very, very difficult thing.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_00: But the climate, the people around us, the community, the God-centered uh people that are here, it's it's pretty wonderful.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, let me let me let me, if you don't mind, I want to expand on a couple a couple things there.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, number one, I you know, I love the Midwest.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a Chicago guy.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: I grew up in the Chicago suburbs.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: A lot, a lot, a lot of friends uh from the great state of Michigan, uh, a lot of friends who went to uh Michigan State, actually.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: I went to osteopathic school with a lot of the you know Michigan kids who came over to Chicago.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_01: And those are all wonderful places, summertime, nothing like, nothing like the Midwest summertime.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: Love it, love it, love it.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_01: But it's not a healthy place for the winter existence.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: And as much as what you said, you know, now you just start going you know further south, and the further south you go, uh our ancestors came from the East Valley Rift in Northeastern Africa.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: That's where that's where it all you know you know came from.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: And if we can if we can embrace that, the better off we are.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: But the flip on that is like you said, uh all these blue zones that people talk about and everybody debates about food and all these areas.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: The key to the blue zones, it's community.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's community, it's friends, it's family.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so to pick up and leave that, uh, there are consequences to it.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I think to your point, it's very important to find kind of that new community in these different areas.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe if we can encourage our family and friends from northern Michigan and Chicago land, like, hey, come on down here where it's healthier.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, like, let's not stay up in the sick zone.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we know clearly, you know, things like uh MS, other you know, diagnoses, they're much more common at higher latitudes.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: So let's bring that latitude down and hey, listen, come on join us in Costa Rica, come visit Dr.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: You know, Russ, your buddy down in in Arkansas.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: Uh let's all embrace that those healthier you know lifestyles and the outdoor existence.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I think honestly, for for optimizing your circadian rhythm, living at the equator where you're at is just ideal, right?
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: So what was it, what was it about Costa Rica that kind of brought you down there?
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, the the idea was we wanted to have uh water.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so water was very important, and we get uh plenty of rain, and we have a couple of different uh, you know, we have a river that runs through our property entirely spring-fed from our property.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_01: We drink right from the river, and it's just spectacular.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then we grow food, you know.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: So we grow food, our own animals.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, we have there.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: We've got goats, we've got chickens, uh, and it's a wonderful existence.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: We're 20 minutes to the beach, so we get a lot of good grounding, uh, very minimal uh EMF exposure.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: There's no planes that are flying over our head 24-7.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, so it's just it's a much more uh healthy, peaceful existence down there.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: And uh there's other places, but really it's just a it's a matter of uh you got to find something because the medical world, life expectancy of the American male is 76, female 79.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_01: The last 10 to 15 years of that lifespan is you know is not health span, it's a lot of sickness back and forth to the hospital, the doctor, the pharmacy.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_01: And uh really all depends on what your objectives are.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you're you're a young father, you're gonna uh you know, eventually likely be a young uh grandfather, and you want to be able to do these, all these activities and and things with you know with them.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: And your best chance of living that long life until you're 100 and beyond, where you're still you know, camping.
• 20:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like here's you know, great grandpa, you know, Russ, he's like he's pitching the tents, he's throwing the front be like he's an active member of the party.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's what everybody wants.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_01: And most people don't achieve that because they're not they're not following what we call the 100-year heart method, they're not eating well, living well, thinking well.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: They're they're following mainstream, they're taking their pharmaceuticals, and they're just not living the life that they were designed to lead.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think, I mean, you hit on so many important, interesting points there, but uh from the patients that I see, I think everybody has like a number in mind that they want to hit, right?
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: I want to live, you know, my dad died at 80, I want to live to 85.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I've heard some people 126.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why why that number?
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like, and I've heard it like three or four times.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know if it's somewhere on social media that 126 everybody's trying to get to, but you know, what do you plan on doing from that life expectancy of you know 75, 76 to you know, 126?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_00: That that's 50 years.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think it's Going to be like you're going to be, you know, doing pull-ups and bench presses and running marathons, or do you think it's going to be in a home medicated, having somebody do all of your daily tasks of living?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's what the reality of most people's lives are.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_00: They just want to hit a certain number.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we're missing the force through the trees here.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if you're not taking care of yourself early on in life, you're going to set yourself up for disaster.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: But then you never make it.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you're not going to make it.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I have this thing that I talk about with a lot of my clients, and I want to see if you have this conversation too, is that, you know, it's just, oh, it's just a it's just a pizza or it's just a little candy.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, I only I only do this on the weekends.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: I wish that it would hit the fan for people sooner.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: I don't wish harm on anyone, of course, but you know, usually people's wake-up call is a heart attack.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's a wake-up call of a of a stroke or somebody else in the family dying, and then they're like, whoa, I gotta start taking care of myself.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: So how do you coach or you know, doctor a younger patient, say, say they're 40 years old, maybe they have some family history, you know, of some cardiovascular disease, maybe even diabetes that I do not think runs in the family.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's a that's a personal choice.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_00: I'll just throw that out there.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but what would you say to that person that you're you you can sense that they their expectations are off?
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like they they think they're gonna live to 126, call it, and you're looking at them going like, yes.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, um, the number 126 uh around them, that comes from scripture.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: So scripture says, like, uh that that's as long as you will live, you know.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: So uh Noah lived until he was over over 900, uh, Moses lived until he was 180, uh, you know, I mean, like those kind of things.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, Abraham, a lot of those biblical people lived a long time, and then it was rewritten after that to say like this is what the what the limit is.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_01: And uh the the idea though is that medicine, we we love to focus on numbers.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: So people come in, my cholesterol's high.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and they're like, okay, well, how do I get that down?
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: My blood pressure is high.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: How do I get that down?
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and even so, but but is that really what you want?
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you know, is that really what you what you want and what you're concerned about?
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's what they've trained you to believe, worry about cholesterol.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: But what is the ultimate objective?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_01: The ultimate objective is just what you said.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: I want to live till 126, and I want to be an active member of the party up until 126, and then I close my eyes, and then I'm uh and then I move on to to to the next uh realm, move to heaven or whatever it may, whatever it may be.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: Uh that's that's what we want.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: We want it, we don't want to be the person in the wheelchair pushed into the the wedding when we're 85 years old.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, there's grandpa over there, and he's drooling on himself.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: That's and but that's what mainstream offers.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's the pharmaceutical model.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's not either or.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: If you go their way, you fail.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: If you go our way, you win.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_01: You set yourself up for the best chance to win.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: Our genetics are perfect, as we said, built by God, you know, in the image of God.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: We can run, jump, see, feel, make babies.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: We can do some incredible stuff.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_01: Why would we be genetically programmed to have disease?
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're not.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: Everything is man-made on top of our genes.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: That's called epigenetics.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: That's what you know.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: When I was a medical student in the 1990s, it was all about the human genome project.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we studied all the 25,000 genes, and you know what, we found out it's not the genes, it's the you know, it's the it's all the epigenetics on how the environment, you know, plays in.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: One other thing I want to talk about, because you did mention, you know, things like you know, candy and food.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: What I tell people is eat real food, um, and and that's the main objective.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: So just eat real food.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: If you want ice cream, eat organic ice cream.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: If you want candy, eat organic candy.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_01: Keep chemicals, keep chemicals out of the food and try and eat as much real food as possible.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: But the eat well is one facet, and we can all argue about what's the best way to eat, but we also need to talk about what's the best way to live.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where you get into the circadian biology.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_01: That's when you get into movement, that's where you get into keeping toxin burden low.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's when you get into things like osteopathic uh manipulation and physical medicine or chiropractic.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: And that's when you get into think well, mindset, spirituality, community, purpose, gratitude, passion, uh, relationships, finding your happy.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: And the relationship side and the finding you're happy side is more important than if we put a piece of candy in our mouths.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: Stress kills.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: Unhappiness kills depression, anger, anxiety, fear, worry, social isolation.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_01: Those are deadly.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: And we're all talking about, yeah, you know, should I avoid seed oils?
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know, our ancestors didn't eat seed oils.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna, I'm not sitting here as a proponent of seed oils, but if you look at the medical literature, it doesn't really say that seed oils are much of a problem.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: Some studies say they're beneficial, some studies say that they're harmful, but the differences are very small compared to if you have depression, you have like a four times higher risk of dying earlier than a person who's happy.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: So, what's more important?
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: Where should we spend our time focusing?
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that depression, I mean, so many people uh don't have purpose, they feel isolated, and it's only getting worse.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there are so many people that are friends with their AI bot of the week, right?
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: They're having conversations with Claude or Chad or you know, all these AI.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: We are losing touch with human existence here and our purpose.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: And we're just coasting through life.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, going back to like the depression, like the the end point is always death.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's something that it's an objective uh metric that we can focus on, whether it be cardiovascular disease, stroke, depression, right?
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: But what about the you know, that person's life?
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_00: We're still talking about somebody's life here, and being depressed is arguably nobody wants to be depressed at all.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: So and what does mainstream have, you know, for us?
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, they've got Prozac, they've got all these different things, and it's like they don't address their root cause.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I call myself a root cause cardiologist.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: If you're concerned about heart disease, blood pressure, strokes, uh, et cetera, it's always just peeling back the onion, looking at root cause, looking at everything through the lens of the 100-year heart method that you well, live well, think well, and with the objective oh, yeah, what do people really want?
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: They want to go camping when they're in their 80s, they want to go mountain biking, they want to go skiing, they want to be able to, you know, uh shower and uh go to the bathroom on their own.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and and uh those are the things that when you live the healthy lifestyle, that you achieve those objectives.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_01: And as you know, you've worked in the hospitals, you've been in practice, not as long as I have, but you see so much sickness, so many pharmaceuticals, and it's just uh it's it's just cataclysmic for the individuals.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I think Russ, you know, we're where the problem also for our colleagues comes in.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's like once you learn the truth and you turn your back on that truth because you're doing it for a paycheck, man, that's a pretty tough one.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: I wrote in my book, which called the paleocardiologist The Natural Way to Heart Health, I wrote the, I copied the quote from Upton Sinclair's The Jungle.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard to get a man to understand something when his job depends on him not understanding it.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: So our colleagues in medicine, the pharmaceutical, you know, companies, the hospital administrators, they are paid to not understand the truth, to not believe in the truth, because their paycheck, you know, how they pay for their mortgage and their and their kids' you know, schools and their car and their clothing and all the things that people pay for, it's um they just uh they they turn they turn the blind eye, they stay as part of the 99, they uh stay in the pack, stay in their lane, stay where they perceive it as safe, but they're not leading their optimal existence.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: And they will, those people will not live a long life either because they are not being uh true.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: They're not being true to themselves once they learn the truth.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I I hear you on that, and I I'm trying to live my life as as best as I can with living with the truth, because I know I do think I know what is what is right and what is wrong.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: And that's something like from a spiritual aspect that I feel like God is really opening my eyes to what is what is Him and what is the devil, and really understand.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm trying to understand honestly who the devil is and his tactics, and really if you can understand that, then if you can know darkness, you can know light, right?
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_00: And just knowing both sides of the of the coin there.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: So well, I mean, let me let me say this.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: Let me expand on that and kind of give you my version.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not here to say that I know everything, that's that's for sure.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: There's only one person who does, and that's not me.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_01: But the the devil here, Satan here in this equation is everything that is interfering with our God-given abilities and existence, and that does come down to satanic roles in the food, the break in the lifestyle, the break in the mindset, the pharmaceuticals, the injections, everything that is not natural is a break in our in our in our connection to our creator.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: And the more we can get people, and whether they believe in that, you know, or not, it's just quite simply that it's not we even if in the evolutionary version, where do pharmaceuticals come into that?
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: Where do these surgeries and injections and procedures come into that?
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: It just it just doesn't.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: We're not gonna live our optimal physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual existence in this man-made uh construct, and in every angle, you know, is it just circumstance or is there some satanic entity that is having their hand into that?
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_01: And again, these are these are pretty big questions that I'm not even sure that I'm but here's the thing, though, I believe two things we have the freedom to discuss these things, and the freedom and autonomy over our bodies to make these decisions.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: No man can tell me what I have to put into my body.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's being a free, sovereign person created in the image of God.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's so true.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_00: And like I'm thinking, I'm thinking through the lens of a primary care doctor because this conversation, the things that we're talking about right now, is so off to what we were trained, even in DO school, which is you know, a holistic school where we're talking about mind, body, spirit.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_00: And everybody assumes when they think of DO is are you sometimes I get, are you a real doctor?
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh my gosh, are we still there?
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like DOs have been around for a long time, people.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, we're talking about you know, all these things that are very extreme.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_00: And when you come into the office on Monday morning and you hear this conversation or you talk about it with your friends, your other doctor friends, the problem is, I think, is fear.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because say I see, you know, a patient in the morning who comes in.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_00: Here's here's a classic patient that I would see that that kind of gets the wheels turning.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: Is you've got a 60-year-old patient who comes in with high cholesterol.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: They might have a high C reactive protein, they might, their homocysteine might be pushing 12, 13.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if you look did uh the NMR lipo profile, it's a lot of small, dense LDL, like conjure up your perfect, you know, heart attack waiting to happen person.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: But this person's 60 years old.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: They've done wrong, you know, in our eyes, not wrong like you're blaming them, but they haven't done things, you know, very naturally for 60 years at this point.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_00: And now you're asked in the office to treat this person who has done damage for 60 years.
• 35:32
  SPEAKER_00: I want to know, and and being, you know, still new in this in my career from an experienced cardiologist, like how do I approach somebody like that, which you know it is a higher risk patient with with kind of covering your butt, right?
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: Because if if they die or they get a heart attack, I feel like I'm first on the chopping block.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's what that's what goes through my head if I don't think of pharmaceuticals, if I don't think of, you know, what mainstream medicine is telling me to think.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and I mean listen, but that's that's how the system was designed to keep doctors like you in line and worried and fearful, and and rightfully so.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, listen, you're a young physician with, you know, with with uh, you know, young family and bills to pay.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like though they they they really are are pulling the strings on us.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_01: They've got us, you know, really tight in our control.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_01: So it it's uh it's a unique physician like me.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like I told you before, I was making over well over a million dollars a year as a conventional cardiologist, and I left that to start over at zero.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: I did that because that was was right, and that's what the path that I had to take.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_01: And not a lot of people are are going to do that.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, as it relates to uh the reality of medicine, it's a failure.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's just not going to work.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_01: So I think if we speak our truth to the patients and then let the patients decide, right?
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: You've already heard this from one doctor.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: Now we're going to come in as holistic practitioners and we're going to give you another plan.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_01: And then now it's up to you to decide.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_01: You're a free, sovereign person.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_01: You decide what's for you.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: I can't make you take a statin drug.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_01: I can't make you not take a statin drug.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: I can only give you my version of the story, and now it is entirely up to you.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_01: I can tell you what the guidelines are.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_01: I can make you sign stuff, you know, whatever, that, you know, I'm not following the guidelines.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what we do at Natural Heart Doctor.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: We make people sign something that says I am not beholden to the American Heart Association or the American College of Cardiology.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, now, one thing you mentioned about the 60-year-old who's lived a very unhealthy lifestyle, because one could say, hey, so much damage is done.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_01: The only thing that could repair me is pharmaceuticals.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's untrue.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_01: That is unproven as well.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like if you take someone who smoked for 60 years, we know that if they stop smoking, their life expectancy is longer than if they were to continue smoking.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_01: So if you change your behaviors, your trajectory changes undoubtedly.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: There's no, there's no point of no return.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes, you know, there's emergency situations.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_01: God bless men and women who work in emergency rooms, trauma centers, the doctors there, totally.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_01: We're talking about the prevention, treatment, and reversal of chronic disease.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_01: That's where doctors like you and I uh really shine.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: One more thing about DOs.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_01: Back in the late 1800s, uh A.T.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_01: Still, who founded osteopathic uh medicine, was a contemporary of D.D.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_01: Palmer, actually, the founder of and discoverer of chiropractic.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_01: They were contemporaries, but they both came at a time when there was a lot of frustration with what was happening in medicine or medical treatments at that time, which had to do with heavy metals, had to do with some very, you know, a lot of mercury uh containing uh products that were used, surgeries that were dangerous.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_01: It was a time of extreme experimentation.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_01: So these brands of health came up.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_01: But what happened though, certainly much more so to the DOs than the chiropractors, the chiropractors were able to, in most cases, although there's changes over the years, they were able to avoid mainstream pharmaceuticals as created by the Rockefeller, uh uh uh, you know, Rockefellers and the controllers of mainstream, how they were able to change the message of osteopathic, fold the DOs back into the mix, shut down schools that would not uh acquiesce to that pressure.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: And then a lot of the real morphing of the DOs came in the 1960s, where they were able to say, hey, we want you to be the MDs, we're gonna grant you these uh MD licenses, happened to state of California.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: So there were a lot of practitioners, a lot of DOs at that time that basically were granted medical uh licenses and the MD title, trying to pull them into the fold.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: So the DOs became like many MDs.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_01: And the the training programs that you went through to learn osteopathic manipulation, it was in a lot of cases, it was an afterthought.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_01: Then there wasn't really good reimbursement, there wasn't a lot of ability to practice those skills.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_01: And the chiropractors who were practicing those skills with every patient, uh, they they they were able to become better uh on average, you know, certainly as it related to physical manipulation.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_01: But if we can reach a lot of those DOs now, but the DO schools, they're owned and run by mainstream medicine, uh, mainstream pharmaceuticals, so it becomes a tough existence.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, listen, all we can do is keep shouting the truth from the rooftops, uh, the version that we believe, and then you know, getting it in front of the individual.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the danger is that when they shut down platforms like you and I talking right now, and they really uh, you know, come in and just again, like there's there's only one way, it's the mainstream medicine model.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_01: That's what happened during COVID, uh, where a lot of people like us were silenced.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, but hopefully that was a big wake-up call for a lot of people.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_00: I hope so.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_00: That was um, yeah, we don't want to go back to those times, and I hope we learned from those times too.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um going back to this, going back to the 60-year-old patient, right?
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because this is this is just a real case that I deal with like all the time.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: What would you say to that person?
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_00: Because that person is usually coming in, say that their blood pressure is a little bit elevated, they're not on many medications or no, let's call them no medications, they don't really take supplements, maybe they drink a few times a week, you know, classic heart disease case.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: Do you feel in your heart that you can change that person to reverse a lot of these things, reverse the damage that they've done over the past 50, 60 years?
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_00: And you you obviously feel confident you can do that without medications, but can you give me a little insight without you know giving your you know master cocktail of what you do?
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_00: Because I know that takes a lot of time, but where do you start?
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: The I think really is that if you take that person, and obviously I've seen tens of thousands of that person, and you take that person and you kind of lay out two options.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_01: One is mainstream conventional medicine.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_01: And over here, you will take pharmaceuticals for your blood pressure, pharmaceuticals for your cholesterol, pharmaceuticals for blood thinners like aspirin, etc.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_01: You'll get nuclear stress tests, you'll get radiation-based CT scans, you'll do all this over here.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: Or you can do this over here.
• 42:28
  SPEAKER_01: And this over here is the 100-year heart method.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: The eat well, the live well, the think well, the test don't guess using the most advanced testing in the world, the evidence-based supplements, and then we'll throw in biohacking strategies.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: It's a pharma last, not pharma first approach.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'll lay that out to you, and then you'll choose what you want.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_01: Now they don't have to be mutually exclusive.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_01: You can say, Well, I want the best of both worlds.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_01: I practice over here, when over here is pure holistic health.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that when you give the body what it needs and you take away what it doesn't, that is the ultimate strategy.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_01: We cannot improve on the human frame.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_01: We cannot improve on God's creation.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_01: Can't do it.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_01: We we we we cannot do it.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_01: So you put that out to people and you say the the you are a free person to make the choice.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: The choice is yours.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_01: Here's what I tell you.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_01: I think the the the top cardiologist at University of Michigan, Michigan State, uh, University of Arkansas, Cleveland Clinic, Mayo Clinic, they'll tell you a different version.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_01: Now it's up to you.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_01: You can think about it, you can pray on it, you talk to your family and friends about it, you do your research on it, you talk to your friend Claude or uh, you know, Gemini, talk to whoever you want.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: And the beauty of Claude and Gemini is you know, you can actually talk to them and have an honest conversation.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'm a 60 year old guy.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, this is, you know, my current situation.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, what is the benefit of me taking pharmaceuticals?
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_01: What is the risk of me taking pharmaceuticals?
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_01: What are the alternatives to me taking pharmaceuticals?
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_01: See what AI says.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_00: I know, and it's getting it's getting better and better.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_00: I've had people that, you know, in other platforms have like said, uh, hey, Dr.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: Ross, it's been great chatting with you, but I'm I'm moving on to AI to manage all my care.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, whoa, that is kind of wild.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time, it provides a lot of great information.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_00: But the clinical decision making of what you what you just said right there, that conversation is what we never learned in medical school.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's the real, like, that's being super real, honest, transparent about hey, this is up to you.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_00: This is your life.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody's forcing this medicine down your throat.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you have to do it by the way, when we put you on a statin, we're expecting you to take this every day for the rest of your life.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like, there's no like doctor that thinks, like, I mean, there may be some out there, you take it for there's some studies that have taken it for a few years, right?
• 45:09
  SPEAKER_00: And you get this legacy, you know, protection, whatnot.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_00: But most doctors are gonna expect you when you commit to this version, you are taking it for the rest of your life.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas I truly, I want to say I kind of fall somewhere in the middle, but I'm every day I get closer and closer to the, in my opinion, what the the truth is, is it kind of how you practice.
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, hey, I guarantee you, if you spend a week in my home with my wife who cooks amazing food with my kids, you see what they eat.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_00: You do my workouts that I'm doing in my pole barn.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_00: I literally, this is a funny story.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I was listening to your podcast, one of your shorts yesterday on and I had it on my lunch break, and then I proceeded to go outside, take my shirt off, and did a kettlebell complex out uh in the grass in the sunshine.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, this is exactly what he promotes.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_00: But um, this that that conversation of kind of laying it out on the line of like, hey, I can't force you to take this, I can't force you to do anything, but here is option A, here's the blue pill, and here's the red pill, right?
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_00: You get to decide, and this is your life, not mine.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_00: Pick which one works best for you.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_00: The thing that I struggle is, all right, well, what about this person that's been doing it wrong for 60 years?
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_00: And all of a sudden you're gonna just get them to shift completely because you know that person needs a full 180.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_00: They need to go the entirely the different direction.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: So what if they don't?
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like well, the more the more they do it, uh obviously the more we do, the the better, right?
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_01: So 8020 rule, you know, 90 10 is better than 80-20, and 80-20 is better than 70-30.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, again, so making these little changes makes a huge difference.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_01: The pharmaceutical model plays with numbers and does it very well, but they very unmeaningfully lead to better outcomes.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_01: So the goal is not to reduce your annual heart attack risk for the 60-year-old male from 4% to 3.5%.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's about how do we reduce it to 0%?
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_01: We know mainstream doesn't do that.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_01: Mainstream lowers it from four to three and a half.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, pharmaceuticals for blood pressure.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: All these abnormal metrics, they are warning signs.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_01: They are the light on your car dashboard that says check engine.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_01: The problem is not the light, the problem is the engine.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_01: The problem is not your blood pressure, the problem is what's leading to the high blood pressure.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's the root cause.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_01: So we can put a sticker over the check engine light, that's not gonna go well.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_01: We can put a band-aid or a pharmaceutical over the high blood pressure or the cholesterol, but it's not gonna go well.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_01: And the evidence tells us that.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_01: But what happens is that men and women like you and I, we go through our medical training, and the pharmaceutical rep comes in with beautiful images and charts and free lunches and free pens and back in the day, free trips and beyond.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_01: Those are the golden years I didn't get those are the gold, those are the golden years, you know, for sure if you want, but it was the golden years of pharmaceutical companies and just influencing.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_01: But there is data that says you can buy the loyalty of a medical doctor with a pen, and you can also buy their loyalty with subtle nuance of basically uh, you know, innuendo that if you don't follow this, Dr.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_01: Russ, you're not really you're not following the guidelines.
• 49:10
  SPEAKER_01: And you could get in trouble for that.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: You could get, you know, something happens to your patient, like you can get sued, your board can come in, they've got their ways, they've got their ways to keep people in line.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_01: So again, that person, every little bit of change that you make, it's gonna be monumental.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_01: If you have family, family history is true because we eat, live, and and and think like our family members did, and therefore we get the same, you know, diseases.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_01: And you just say, How do I become different?
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_01: How does Dr.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_01: Jack Wolfson become different than Dr.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_01: Paul Wolfson, who died at 63?
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be as different in every way possible, you know, to the negative stuff.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_01: He was a wonderful man, a wonderful father.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_01: I'll keep so I'll keep the positive attributes, but I'm I'm gonna flip the negative so that doesn't happen to me.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_00: And and I I think, you know, I'm I'm in the same boat.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be different.
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like I value a lot of I grew up in a very healthy home.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like my parents are super healthy, you know, they trained us.
• 50:15
  SPEAKER_00: They, you know, by they led by example.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_00: My dad was a very soft-spoken man.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't really say too much.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_00: His emotional IQ, I think, is uh lacking a little bit.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I'm definitely the more emotional one in the family, but he led by example and he was always there for me.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_00: Every time I was playing hockey, every time I was playing baseball, I'd look up in the stands, and he was there every single time.
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that that's kind of the father that I want to be for my kids, too.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_00: So um, healthy to do it.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, like I know, I know, but too, and they and they gotta be healthy to do it.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_01: You're not gonna be in the stands, climbing in the stands if you're not healthy.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like when the oxygen mask drops on the plane, you gotta take care of yourself first.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of especially a lot of women too, as they're caretakers of their husband and and the children, uh, they kind of go by the wayside and they really suffer, you know, a lot as well.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and going back, I love that the check engine light.
• 51:10
  SPEAKER_00: I actually use that a lot in my practice.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_00: We all I think every doctor has their own like little analogies that we make that resonate with people.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I use the check engine light a lot, but the the sticky note over band-aid over the check engine light, I think most people live that way.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_00: They know the check engine light is on.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_00: Their their bones hurt, their joints hurt, they know that they hey, if you had to run a mile right now, could you do it?
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_00: Most people can't do it.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: If you could do, can you do a pull-up, let alone I think 10 pull-ups is is not a lot of pull-ups, but can you do one pull-up right now?
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think most people cannot do that.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_00: And and they know that that is not healthy, but they're not doing anything about it.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that's where you know, in what's one thing I wish they they trained us in in medicine is how do you be a motivational speaker?
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be like the Tony Robbins of you know medicine to kind of get people to wake up.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you're not gonna be able to do it because you want all they're doing, right?
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_01: You don't yeah, you don't have Tony's platform yet, you know, but uh that that's all we can do is use every opportunity to, you know, to stand on your soapbox and and shout the truth.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that's that's all we that we can do, and that's what we're doing right now, you know, with this.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, as it relates to uh the the check engine light, it's just to hammer that home, right?
• 52:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's when obviously when you put a sticker over the check engine light, it doesn't work.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_01: Your car breaks down, your body breaks down.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just a matter of of when, how much time you have left.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_01: And we open up people's eyes and say, change the way you eat to the best of your ability.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_01: We can help the way you live, the way that you think, we can help.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_01: And we need to offer people that kind of you know level of support.
• 53:00
  SPEAKER_01: And that's what we do at Natural Heart Doctor.
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_01: That's what you do in your, you know, in your practice as well.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_01: And we'll just continue to do that.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_01: But that accountability thing is a big factor, right?
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's one thing to know it, it's a it's another thing to implement it.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, another very famous DO by the name of Joseph Mercola, uh, who is the founding father of uh internet, you know, medicine, no doubt, no doubt, uh Joe Mercola, uh, a DO who went to the Chicago school.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_01: He was there when my father was you know on staff back in the heyday in the 70s.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: Mercola is um, I mean he's probably in his late 70s, you know, at this point, but he talked about years ago, FTI.
• 53:39
  SPEAKER_01: Don't suffer from FTI.
• 53:41
  SPEAKER_01: What's FTI?
• 53:42
  SPEAKER_01: Failure to implement.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_01: Make sure you implement these strategies however you can do it, but it's not either or.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_01: If you follow mainstream, you die.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_01: And if you follow our plan, you live.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_00: I couldn't, I couldn't agree with that more because I I know the changes, and we see it, right?
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_00: You and I see it.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_00: We we're checking, you know, these biomarkers, we're watching people, you know.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_00: I generally see people every 90 days, and when people actually implement these things, it is undoubtedly improving their health span, right?
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_00: You're watching, I'm because I get a lot of anti-statins, I get a lot of anti-medication, anti-everything, right?
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I always approach a lifestyle first.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_00: I am getting their APOB to come down, I am getting their LDL to come down.
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_00: My goal for their C-reactive protein, high sensitivity C-reactive protein, is to get less than 0.5.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_00: Why do we want to be in this moderate risk?
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_00: Why do we, why do we accept these average numbers?
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_00: And people think there's only a pharmaceutical to do that, but it's just it really is not true.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_00: These things actually do work if you implement them.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_01: Well, let me let me say one thing too about markers of inflammation.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_01: So there was a recent study that came out about IL-6.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_01: IL-6 in a lutin 6 is a marker of inflammation.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: So pharmaceutical companies they invent a uh pharmaceutical to lower that particular number down.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_01: And it lowers the number down dramatically.
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_01: But what it didn't do was lower the risk of heart attack, stroke, and dying in those people.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's just another perfect example of how playing with the number is not the same as the root cause of that number.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so, for example, blood pressure.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_01: If you take someone who's got high blood pressure and you put them on three drugs, put them on one drug, their number becomes normal.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_01: They're not at the same risk as you and I with normal blood pressure.
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_01: The numbers are the same, but we are different people because they're medicated, we're not, and the risk is totally different.
• 55:49
  SPEAKER_01: The risk is totally different.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_01: Same thing with diabetes, same thing with with inflammation.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_01: So it's always about root cause.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_01: What's leading to the inflammation?
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_01: You can't ban they, you can't bait, you can't bandate these things.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_01: It doesn't work.
• 56:03
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 56:03
  SPEAKER_00: But that I mean, now you know I'm glad you brought up that study because there's the same one with the horizon trial where they just knocked out people's LP little A and it did nothing, right?
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: And that's only preliminary data at this point, but still it's it's showing that that we're missing something.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_00: Medicine is missing something, and and that's where I think you know, doctors like you and I are we're trying so hard to go back to our root cause.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why is this happening?
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I think root cause gets like it's like throwing out inflammation, or you know, I you know, I have inflammation.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, what does that really mean?
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_00: People have to understand what that actually means.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_00: Interleukin 6 is a marker of inflammation.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_00: High sensitivity C reactive protein is a marker of inflammation.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_00: And and honestly, I read some of that that study, and my take on it, I'm interested with your take on that, because you're dropping an inflammatory marker.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_00: And in if we say that inflammation is the cause of heart disease or one of the causes of heart disease, and you dropped inflammation, then what are we what is it then?
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_01: So uh let me say this inflammation does not cause heart disease, and oxidative stress doesn't cause heart disease, and elevated homocysteine doesn't cause heart disease.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_01: And candidly, ABO B doesn't cause heart disease.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_01: What leads to those things is the cause.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_01: Those are just the markers.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_01: So the cause is not the check engine light, it's what's what's leading to that.
• 57:37
  SPEAKER_01: The cause of a low fuel level is not the light, it's just a measurement of your fuel level.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_01: The cause is there's no fuel.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_01: So the cause is violations of eat well, live well, think well.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_01: That's the that's the root cause.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe if we use, we continue with that tree analogy.
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_01: So we say we got the root causes down here, and up in the trees, up in the leaves and the branches, that's all the disease.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's high blood pressure, that's heart attack, that's stroke, that's cancer, that's dementia.
• 58:08
  SPEAKER_01: But the trunk, the trunk is the metrics.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_01: Inflammation, oxidative stress, those are still just metrics because a lot of times people say, oh, it's inflammation is the cause.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's what's that's a measurement.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_01: That's your body's response to the root cause.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why when you apply pharmaceuticals that lower that number down doesn't work because it's not root cause.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I agree.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_00: And in and going back to the the primary care perspective here is that you know, you hear from fellow cardiologists, right?
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_00: Mostly, mostly MDs that are saying this, but you know, this is a headline.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's and this is coming from the Jupiter trial.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_00: Is if you take a statin, you drop your risk of heart disease in half.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_00: And somebody would hear that and be like, uh, yeah, all I gotta do is take a pill and I can lower my heart disease risk in half.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_00: But when you dive into the details of the Jupiter trial, you're finding that, like, hmm, maybe, maybe it's that's not what it's all cracked up to be.
• 59:19
  SPEAKER_00: Those those changes when you do take a statin, it they are statistically significant for some of them, but it's it's so small.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's so small.
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_00: That number needed to treat, in my opinion, is is so high that I'm going, like, man, I got to treat over a hundred patients.
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's embarrassing.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's absolutely it is embarrassing that after all these years and everything that's been going on, the cardiologists, that's all they have.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_01: Life expectancy over the last 46 years, according to the CDC, for the American male has gone up from 73 to 76.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_01: We've gained three years of life despite trillions in pharmaceuticals, surgeries, chemotherapies, all the tests.
• 1:00:04
  SPEAKER_01: We've gained three years of life.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's absolutely embarrassing.
• 1:00:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's sickness paradigm, it's not the health paradigm, and that's where they are absolutely failing.
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_01: The pharmaceuticals fail, the Jupiter trial, horizon trial, it's beginning, they're not addressing the root cause.
• 1:00:20
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where they will continue to fail on and on and on.
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_01: In in Horizon, uh, you know, lowering down LP little A, yeah, we learned that in in that population, they were all on statin drugs.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, it was a short trial, it was already a sickly population.
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_01: So uh, you know, would the drug be beneficial if you gave it to a 25-year-old?
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, on the long term, they'll study that.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_01: They'll see, they'll try, they'll monetize it.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_01: But that's the first thing that they were going after.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_01: There'll be more things coming up after that.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_01: And Jupiter, uh, as you said, Jupiter, sure.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, Jupiter was a fairly impressive trial as far as trials are concerned, but it still led to, like you said, a very high number needed to treat.
• 1:00:59
  SPEAKER_01: What about all the side effects of statin drugs that they minimize?
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_01: What about the false sense of security that statins provide?
• 1:01:05
  SPEAKER_01: Take this pill and you'll be just fine.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then ultimately it just keeps you plugged into their matrix of back and forth that the doctor, the pharmacy, the hospital.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's just a bad world to live in.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_01: Live in the health space, not in the sick space.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 1:01:18
  SPEAKER_00: And and just to point out, the Jupiter trial was conducted by AstraZeneca, who makes Rosuva statin cross door.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:01:26
  unknown: Right.
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, again, I mean, I think it was very important as something to say that inflammation is a much better marker than lipids are.
• 1:01:38
  SPEAKER_01: That was the main point of it.
• 1:01:40
  SPEAKER_01: They took people with normal lipids but high HSCRP, and that's who they put on statin versus placebo.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not that the drug didn't work, you know, by a little bit.
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_01: The study proved what Paul Ridger, the lead author, was actually looking to achieve 20 plus years ago.
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_01: And he's a brilliant, brilliant man and researcher, as far as all these markers of inflammation.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, inflammation, but it inflammation is not the cause.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's whatever is causing the inflammation.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_01: Inflammation is the fire burning in the body.
• 1:02:17
  SPEAKER_01: But the answer is not to do something, you know, about, you know, artificially do something about the fire.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's about stopping the fire from being burnt in the first place.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's not about how do we put out the fire, it's how do we stop fires from being created.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so what so what do you say?
• 1:02:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because there's a lot of cardiologists, especially in the social media space, that'll that'll say, hey, if if you want to abolish heart disease, all you have to do is take a statin and keep your APO B under the flavor of the year.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it starts at 80, then it's going to be 70, then it's gonna be 60, then it's gonna be 50.
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_00: And I have cardiologists that I know of from my patients that have seen cardiologists.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_00: I thought this was just unbelievable, to be honest.
• 1:03:10
  SPEAKER_00: They are playing games with APOB.
• 1:03:14
  SPEAKER_00: They're playing games with LDL.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's a it's I don't know if they have it on their board in the office, but who can get their APOB the lowest?
• 1:03:22
  SPEAKER_00: Who can get their LDL the lowest with you know high-intensity statin, you know, PCSK9 inhibitor, ZEDIA, you know, bempadoic acid, all the all the things we have to throw at this.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_00: What do you say to that?
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_00: Do you think that's scary?
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because I certainly think it is.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, here's what I would say is that there's a perfect LDL.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: There's perfect numbers for each and every one of us.
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_01: And they're different.
• 1:03:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, maybe you're perfect for longevity is concerned, overall health and wellness.
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe your total cholesterol is 210 with an LDL of 134.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe my perfect level, if we were walking around the time of Yeshua 2,000 years ago, what would our levels be?
• 1:04:03
  SPEAKER_01: It wouldn't be LDL of one.
• 1:04:05
  SPEAKER_01: It would be, you know, for you, it could be LDL of 110, for me 134.
• 1:04:10
  SPEAKER_01: So, what we're trying to do is give the body what it needs, take away what it doesn't, and that's the perfect lipid level for each and every one of us.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_01: The pharmaceutical models is totally different.
• 1:04:19
  SPEAKER_01: They are trained by the pharmaceutical companies to have that uh modality right now to drive the number down as low as possible.
• 1:04:27
  SPEAKER_01: Meanwhile, there's no long-term evidence of that being beneficial.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_01: There's no long-term safety data on that either.
• 1:04:34
  SPEAKER_01: And we are all just part of one big giant experiment.
• 1:04:39
  SPEAKER_01: We know from the Fourier trial, which was on statin drugs plus Rapatha, the injectable, they got the LDLs down to 33.
• 1:04:49
  SPEAKER_01: There were lower cardiac events, not zero.
• 1:04:52
  SPEAKER_01: There were less, you know, stroke and heart attacks, there were less revascularizations, but in Fourier, the original analysis, more people died in the LDL 32 group than the LDL 75 group.
• 1:05:07
  SPEAKER_01: So we need to really take a look at what the numbers are.
• 1:05:11
  SPEAKER_01: We need to look beyond the headlines.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_01: The doctors preach the headlines.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_01: The cardiologists have no other treatment, though.
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_01: They were never taught in how to eat, live, and think.
• 1:05:19
  SPEAKER_01: They were never taught in advanced testing and metrics like we look at.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_01: They were told to look at LDL, to lower it down as low as possible with multiple pharmaceuticals, and that's exactly what they do.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: And it's sad, it's unfortunate, and it's not gonna be the way that people live their best life.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_01: We should be celebrating these particles, you know, for what they are, what their objectives are.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_01: And again, the the long term of an LDL of five, we have no idea what that's gonna do.
• 1:05:49
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think it's gonna be positive.
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, what do you say to the primary care doctor?
• 1:05:53
  SPEAKER_00: Because I I'm in a I'm blessed.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think you and I are extremely blessed that you know, we we didn't have to take a lot.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_00: Of risk to do what we do at this point and work for ourselves and see patients in this way.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's not the standard way.
• 1:06:08
  SPEAKER_00: But say you got a newly graduated just came out of medicine residency and they're seeing 30 some patients a day, and they don't have the time, the luxury of time to have these conversations.
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_00: They don't have health coaches in the background, they don't have all these testing, they have, you know, a CBC, a CMP, and a total cholesterol, you know, profile.
• 1:06:34
  SPEAKER_00: What do you say to those doctors to try and, you know, protect them?
• 1:06:40
  SPEAKER_00: You still want them to practice medicine, you don't want them to get in trouble.
• 1:06:43
  SPEAKER_00: But what do you say to them as far as how can we take the best care of these patients?
• 1:06:49
  SPEAKER_01: Well, um, what I would say is, you know, why did you become a physician in the first place?
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_01: Did you go there to help people or did you go there to follow guidelines and and be a glorified uh pill pusher and pharmaceutical rep?
• 1:07:04
  SPEAKER_01: And when you say we're blessed, yeah, we're blessed.
• 1:07:06
  SPEAKER_01: We're all blessed.
• 1:07:08
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, but you and I didn't get here because we're blessed.
• 1:07:10
  SPEAKER_01: We made a choice.
• 1:07:12
  SPEAKER_01: We we saw a truth and we followed the truth.
• 1:07:16
  SPEAKER_01: And again, the crime is to the person who knows the truth and doesn't follow it.
• 1:07:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying it's easy, I'm not saying it's without risk.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_01: You've got school loans, you've got a whole, you know, mindset of that and an indoctrination that you have to unpeel and unwind.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_01: But the choice is yours.
• 1:07:35
  SPEAKER_01: The choice is the choice is to the individual, and you can, you know, uh going back to the movie The Matrix, you can choose to go back into the matrix.
• 1:07:45
  SPEAKER_01: You you came out, you learned the truth, and you could say, you know what, I'm not, I can't, I can't live this way.
• 1:07:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the the um actor in the movie is Joe Palantonio, who he's running around with Keanu Reeves and all the people who are outside of the Matrix, they're awake, and he's like, you know what?
• 1:08:01
  SPEAKER_01: This awakeness, this this stinks.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't want to be here anymore.
• 1:08:04
  SPEAKER_01: Put me back in.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_01: And you could do that.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_01: You can do that.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_01: You're a free person to be able to do that.
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_01: But I think your best uh life, your your true purpose, what you're really here for is to give people health and wellness.
• 1:08:16
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why you became a doctor.
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_00: Amen.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's exactly why I became a doctor.
• 1:08:22
  SPEAKER_00: I wanted to, I want to help people, and I do think I have the 2020 vision, if you will, to see that something's something stinks here.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, this doesn't this doesn't look right, doesn't feel right.
• 1:08:35
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to do it this way.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_00: And it was a bold decision to to be a doctor in this fashion because it because it is so far away from the the rest of the herd, you know, to play on the sheep mentality here.
• 1:08:52
  SPEAKER_00: But um, you're right, it it is there is a degree of being blessed, but there is a a an even bigger degree, in my opinion, of of boldness.
• 1:09:01
  SPEAKER_00: And uh that's certainly why I appreciate you.
• 1:09:05
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, like I said, you didn't know this, but I I've you've been a mentor of mine for a while.
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_00: I've looked up to all of your uh talkings and just the the way you you speak and how you take care of people.
• 1:09:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think more doctors should be doing this.
• 1:09:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I would love to have another one of these conversations in the future because there's so many things that I want to talk about, whether it be you know more pharmaceuticals or or coronary uh revascularization and calcium scores.
• 1:09:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I I could talk for hours about this stuff.
• 1:09:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like cardiology is one of my favorite topics.
• 1:09:42
  SPEAKER_00: That and GI, I love talking about those things.
• 1:09:45
  SPEAKER_00: So um, what I want to leave with, I always ask this question.
• 1:09:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, I'm new to this podcasting and hosting and whatnot.
• 1:09:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's a totally different.
• 1:09:55
  SPEAKER_00: I've always been in your seat of being asked questions.
• 1:09:57
  SPEAKER_00: Now I'm I'm the one asking the questions.
• 1:10:00
  SPEAKER_00: So um, you know, on a deeper level, what what do you think is your purpose in this life that we have?
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's that's a that's a pretty big question.
• 1:10:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, what is my purpose?
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um I I would say that I am here as as a child of God, and that is obviously one facet.
• 1:10:30
  SPEAKER_01: Another facet, of course, is to be a husband, another is to be a father, and another is to be a member of the community, and another member is you know, another another thing that I'm supposed to do is to teach the world health and wellness through the lens that I'm that I'm doing it.
• 1:10:50
  SPEAKER_01: My father's death will not be in vain.
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_01: My father's death created who I am right now, and I will honor what he went through to create who I am, the intervention of the woman who would become my wife, how everything unfolded in an absolutely perfect way uh was was by design, and I can only continue to embrace that and continue to learn and grow and be open-minded, and be open-minded, and and for sure not be dogmatic about one thing versus another necessarily.
• 1:11:24
  SPEAKER_01: But I certainly believe that there is a real path to health and wellness, and I'm gonna be talking about it.
• 1:11:31
  SPEAKER_01: I have no fear, I have I I know that I am on the right path and that I will be protected.
• 1:11:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I walked forth, you know, very boldly, and I would encourage any other practitioner listening uh to do the same.
• 1:11:46
  SPEAKER_01: And if they ever need my help and my support uh after everything I've been through, and I've been through a lot, happy to help.
• 1:11:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I might I might be one of those guys.
• 1:11:55
  SPEAKER_00: So uh I I appreciate that answer.
• 1:11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I know that's a really deep question, and I know I can probably ruffle some feathers asking that, but that's that's why I'm here.
• 1:12:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm trying as a doctor, I'm trying to pull out what is what are people's purposes.
• 1:12:11
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is the biggest driver, like that hierarchy that you just talked about.
• 1:12:16
  SPEAKER_00: If you honor that hierarchy, there is no possible way that your life cannot be fulfilling.
• 1:12:24
  SPEAKER_00: No possible way.
• 1:12:25
  SPEAKER_00: You're honoring God, you're honoring your your family, you're trying to do your best.
• 1:12:31
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think this is like a Charlie Kirk quote when he's talking to somebody about the the the Bible and why do you follow it?
• 1:12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Because everybody who follows this, if if every time I follow this, my life gets significantly better.
• 1:12:44
  SPEAKER_00: And that is, I think, I think that's the missing piece to this life that is so chaotic, and we're always looking for the next biomarker or the next biohack or the next thing.
• 1:12:55
  SPEAKER_00: People are missing the forest of the tree.
• 1:12:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I appreciate your your insight and uh you're truly uh the black sheep of uh this space.
• 1:13:04
  SPEAKER_00: So um, Dr.
• 1:13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Jack, where can people find you?
• 1:13:08
  SPEAKER_00: How can they support you in your in your business?
• 1:13:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, my brand is called Natural Heart Doctor.
• 1:13:14
  SPEAKER_01: We're all over social media at Natural Heart Doctor.
• 1:13:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, come by, check it out if you need a you know second opinion about your cardiovascular health.
• 1:13:22
  SPEAKER_01: You got concerns, you got questions, uh, that's what we're here for is to provide those second opinions to people.
• 1:13:28
  SPEAKER_01: And uh yeah, you know, it's just uh it really just about information, freedom of information, freedom to choose over your own healthcare, and also just sharing the reality that life expectancy, the American male 76, female 79, I uh you deserve better.
• 1:13:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we talked about 126 earlier.
• 1:13:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think if you can offer people serious longevity with that, you know, or maybe they'd say kind of like uh die young at an old age.
• 1:13:56
  SPEAKER_01: So you're an old age, but you're still young, and that's what we're here to try and help people with.
• 1:14:00
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you again for having me on, Dr.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_01: Russell.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 1:14:03
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 1:14:04
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate you.
• 1:14:09
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for listening to Leave the 99 presented by Black Sheep Health.
• 1:14:13
  SPEAKER_00: I pray that you have an outstanding day and may the Lord bless you with amazing health.
• 1:14:18
  SPEAKER_00: Please follow us on all social platforms.
• 1:14:21
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're interested in becoming a client, learn more at Blacksheephealth.com.