Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #130 We're Topping The Charts And In The Worst Way

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#130 We're Topping The Charts And In The Worst Way · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast, the podcast for the time
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Speaker 1: poor parent.
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Speaker 2: Who just wants answers. Now.
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Speaker 1: Hello, I'm doctor Justin Coulson and I'm joined today by
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Speaker 1: Luke and Suzie, husband wife radio team.
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Speaker 2: They've got three young boys. Oh my wife. This is
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Speaker 2: Happy Families and I have.
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Speaker 1: Six daughters and I've written six books about raising happy families.
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Speaker 2: And in this conversation I had a conversation.
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Speaker 1: With Luke and Suzie about a recent report from the
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Speaker 1: OECD that shows that Australia is not doing so well
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Speaker 1: when it comes to adolescence and bullying.
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Speaker 3: Doctor Justin Colson, how are you doing great?
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Speaker 2: Thank you. I have a quick joke for you, Susie.
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Speaker 1: It's been a while since I've had a dad joke,
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Speaker 1: but Kylie gave me one the other day that was
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Speaker 1: just so good. It's a little bit of bathroom humor.
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Speaker 1: I hope you'll forgive it, but it's a dad joke.
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Speaker 1: You go into the toilet Australian, you come out of
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Speaker 1: the toilet Australian, But while you're in the toilet, you're
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Speaker 1: not Australian.
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Speaker 2: What are you European? You know that one? Well done?
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Speaker 2: Isn't that good?
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Speaker 4: All tell us you've been doing some work in this area,
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Speaker 4: particularly recently, Doctor Justin Coulson.
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Speaker 3: Where is Australia in a statistic?
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Speaker 2: We just don't want to be Yeah, bullying.
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Speaker 1: The OECD has just released a report showing that Australia
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Speaker 1: is number two, just behind the Brits when it comes
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Speaker 1: to bullying. One in three Australian teenagers now indicates that
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Speaker 1: they've been bullied recently. And obviously this is the kind
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Speaker 1: of news that we don't really want to hear.
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Speaker 4: When you say recently, does that mean the statistic for
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Speaker 4: those teenagers who are bullied in their teenage yus is
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Speaker 4: probably higher than that.
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Speaker 2: It's kind of hard to know.
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Speaker 1: What we know is that on average Australian teenaged report
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Speaker 1: being bullied. About one in four usually reports that they've
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Speaker 1: been bullied, and some it depends. Some studies will be
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Speaker 1: like the last week, some will say the last month,
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Speaker 1: some will say the last year. This research shows that
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Speaker 1: it's one in three in more recent times, and I
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Speaker 1: think somewhere around twenty five to thirty three percent, let's
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Speaker 1: say thirty percent on average in the last month or thereabouts,
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Speaker 1: would report having experienced bullying. We don't know how many
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Speaker 1: people overall, because we just can't get that data. But
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Speaker 1: there's a pretty high percentage of kids that are having
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Speaker 1: a rough time socially.
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Speaker 4: I'm going to break a rule of broadcast here justin
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Speaker 4: and ask you a question that I don't know if
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Speaker 4: you have the answer to, and that is the countries
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Speaker 4: that are doing really well in this is their research
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Speaker 4: on what they're doing that is proving successful.
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Speaker 1: You break the rule every time we talk, So I'm
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Speaker 1: okay with that.
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Speaker 2: I don't know if you know.
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Speaker 1: There's a handful of things that are probably going on
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Speaker 1: in countries where bullying rates are lower that don't happen
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Speaker 1: in countries where bullying.
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Speaker 2: Rates are higher.
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Speaker 1: We live in a society and the countries that are
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Speaker 1: scoring highest on bullying generally where we have a really individual,
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Speaker 1: individualistic approach to life, and we live in these countries
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Speaker 1: that we call meritocracies. That is, the harder you work,
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Speaker 1: the further you can go. Therefore, if you haven't gone
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Speaker 1: very far, you mustn't be working very hard. Now, we
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Speaker 1: can obviously see flaws in those two approaches and those ideas,
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Speaker 1: and yet what we kind of have created is a
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Speaker 1: dog eat dog world.
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Speaker 2: I don't think that.
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Speaker 1: I don't want to blame social media entirely, but I
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Speaker 1: think over the last decade or so, the way social
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Speaker 1: media has polarized and created fences and barriers and distinguish
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Speaker 1: people based on their political beliefs, for example, or whatever
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Speaker 1: beliefs it might be, I don't think that's helped. I
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Speaker 1: think that's only enhanced this fractured, individualistic approach. But it
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Speaker 1: seems that the countries that do worset are the ones
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Speaker 1: who are the most individualistic, and also the ones who
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Speaker 1: are very much about, you know, just get to the top,
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Speaker 1: make sure that you win. There's a real competitive slant
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Speaker 1: to the way their societies work. And you know, when
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Speaker 1: you look at the people who are most likely to bully,
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Speaker 1: it's not the kids that are down on their luck.
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Speaker 1: It's not the kids that don't have too much going
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Speaker 1: for them. It's usually the kids who are at the
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Speaker 1: top of the hierarchy, the kids who aren't afraid of
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Speaker 1: ruffling a few feathers to maintain their power. There's that
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Speaker 1: level of muckiavellianism. They've got the skills to be at
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Speaker 1: the top and to put other people in their place.
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Speaker 1: The kids that get bullied the most are the ones
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Speaker 1: who are different, whether they're a different race, different religion,
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Speaker 1: different culture. Maybe they show up at school and their
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Speaker 1: lunch looks different or smells different to everyone else's. Maybe
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Speaker 1: they're the kid who is carrying a couple of kilos
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Speaker 1: more than the average student in their grade, or maybe
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Speaker 1: they're the skinny kid, or perhaps they've got a lisp,
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Speaker 1: or maybe they don't learn so well. All you've got
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Speaker 1: to do is be different, and the kids that have
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Speaker 1: got the power will make sure that you know that
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Speaker 1: you're different, and everyone else does too, Which.
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Speaker 4: Is interesting because in adulthood, when you get into a
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Speaker 4: certain sphere, you suddenly realize that anything you have that
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Speaker 4: sets you apart is an asset, whereas yeah, in these
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Speaker 4: teenage years, anything that might set you apart puts you
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Speaker 4: out on.
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Speaker 5: The edge, to you down.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's used to tee you downs.
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Speaker 5: I like the faith that you have in humanity that
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Speaker 5: we learn those lessons as adults.
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Speaker 2: I'll say the same thing. I know plenty of ABU
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Speaker 2: odds who are like, yeah, maybe.
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Speaker 3: Not, maybe I just have really nice friends.
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Speaker 5: Well, I think this is such an interesting thing because
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Speaker 5: I feel like we're very woke about the concept of
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Speaker 5: bullying about it. So I feel like we address it
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Speaker 5: regularly and it's a part of our language, and everything
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Speaker 5: is about anti bullying. So if we put so much
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Speaker 5: effort into counteracting this, then why is it still so prominent?
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Speaker 5: Why are we still some of the worst at it.
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Speaker 1: Let me get really deep for a second. My sense
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Speaker 1: is that it's because of our hearts. I don't think
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Speaker 1: that our hearts are turned towards our neighbors. I don't
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Speaker 1: think that our hearts are turned towards helping and lifting
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Speaker 1: and making a positive difference in the lives of the
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Speaker 1: people around us. Now I'm speaking collectively, I'm not speaking
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Speaker 1: about individuals here. You can look at our politics. Our
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Speaker 1: political leaders across the globe, but particularly in these Western countries,
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Speaker 1: have become more divisive than ever. They're not interested in
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Speaker 1: collaborate and working together for mutual good. They're interested in
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Speaker 1: power and winning. When you look at our sports teams,
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Speaker 1: when you look at our corporate culture, when you look
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Speaker 1: even at our schools and how competitive our schools have become.
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Speaker 1: We live in a culture of competition and comparison and
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Speaker 1: never being enough unless you're on top. I can't help
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Speaker 1: but think that that approach to life at a society
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Speaker 1: wide level turns hearts away from and even against our
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Speaker 1: neighbors and our peers, the kids that we're going to
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Speaker 1: school with, or the people that we're working with. When
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Speaker 1: competition rules, that means that there's going to be a hierarchy,
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Speaker 1: and that means that you want to be at the top,
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Speaker 1: not the bottom. And it's just I think that our
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Speaker 1: hearts are not turned towards helping and lifting. I think
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Speaker 1: that our hearts are turned away from or even against
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Speaker 1: the people who we really could be friends with and
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Speaker 1: collaborators with, even if they see the world differently.
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Speaker 2: And to me, it's actually that simple.
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Speaker 5: It's a really interesting challenge of self awareness as a
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Speaker 5: nation because I as much as white Australia, and I'll
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Speaker 5: say this quite boldly, can say that Australia is not
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Speaker 5: a racist country when the minorities in our country say
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Speaker 5: a very different story consistently, when we feel like we're
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Speaker 5: counteracting bullying, and the statistics globally say something different like
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Speaker 5: maybe we have a very strong self awareness issue that
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Speaker 5: we like to deny that these problems are real, but
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Speaker 5: they're more real than we could ever hope they would
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Speaker 5: ever be.
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Speaker 4: Yeah, me coming with a thought here, justin taking in
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Speaker 4: what you've said there about how you know one of
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Speaker 4: the things sitting at the core of our bullying culture
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Speaker 4: is this individualistic society that we do have. Now, does
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Speaker 4: that mean that as parents, when we're looking at how
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Speaker 4: do we help our children not become the bully, that
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Speaker 4: sitting down having a conversation with them about not bullying
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Speaker 4: is not going to be nearly as effective as taking
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Speaker 4: them with us to help our friends move or to
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Speaker 4: volunteer at the local whatever. Is actually that action of
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Speaker 4: having them see us and participate in helping people in
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Speaker 4: our society actually the bettert step to teaching them to
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Speaker 4: not believe.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I couldn't have said it better myself. You know,
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Speaker 1: when was the last time, and I'm not asking you
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Speaker 1: to directly, just as a general consideration, when was the
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Speaker 1: last time we had somebody from a different culture in
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Speaker 1: our own home, maybe for a meal or for a barbecue.
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Speaker 1: When was the last time that some people in your
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Speaker 1: street were moving in or moving out and you went
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Speaker 1: knocked on the door and dropped off a meal, or
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Speaker 1: you found out that somebody was sick and so you
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Speaker 1: just went to spend some time with them. I feel
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Speaker 1: as though we tend to have less of a sense
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Speaker 1: of community compared to how we might have when I
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Speaker 1: was a kid growing up, or you know, decades before that.
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Speaker 1: Even my sense is that our volunteering and our caring
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Speaker 1: for others has been diminished as governments have gotten bigger
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Speaker 1: and stepped in and is not for profits have stepped in.
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Speaker 2: And while there's all sorts of.
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Speaker 1: Great work being done in the world, there's a lot
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Speaker 1: less individual responsibility, I think, and our children are not
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Speaker 1: seeneing us being used up in helping and serving others.
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Speaker 1: As a result, they have less interaction with those who
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Speaker 1: perhaps are less fortunate, and therefore they have less empathy
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Speaker 1: for them because they have less contact with them. Therefore
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Speaker 1: it's easy to bully them, it's easy to dehumanize them
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Speaker 1: because they're not humans anyway. I don't see them, I
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Speaker 1: don't know who they are, I don't know what life is.
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Speaker 2: Like for them.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's been a really challenging conversation, all out of
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Speaker 5: a statistic in some research.
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Speaker 3: Doctor Dustin calls them.
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Speaker 2: Thanks for your time, Thanks Cuzzie, Thanks Luke.
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