Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / DOORS, WINDOWS PADLOCKED, Woman HELD HOSTAGE 4 YEARS

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DOORS, WINDOWS PADLOCKED, Woman HELD HOSTAGE 4 YEARS · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:07
Speaker 1: A man now charged with holding a woman captive under
0:12
Speaker 1: key and padlock for four years? Was there no missing
0:17
Speaker 1: person's report, No neighbor realized what was going on. No
0:22
Speaker 1: family called to say where is she holding a woman?
0:28
Speaker 1: Kidnapped under padlock and key with chains and burglar bars
0:35
Speaker 1: for four years. I'm Nancy Grace. This is crime Stories.
0:41
Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation
0:44
Speaker 1: and Sirius XM one eleven. First of all, take a
0:47
Speaker 1: loadstar friends at Katie RK. She said. All the excess
0:50
Speaker 1: to the trailer at seven hundred West Green's Road were blocked,
0:54
Speaker 1: There were burglar bars on the windows and three handguns
0:57
Speaker 1: found inside, and last night, after bull cutters didn't work
1:01
Speaker 1: on the padlock, the fire department had to use power
1:04
Speaker 1: tools to cut through the bars to gain entry to
1:06
Speaker 1: get her out. According to quote records, that she was
1:09
Speaker 1: able to use a phone to call for help while
1:11
Speaker 1: Sigura was at work. She told deputies he held her
1:14
Speaker 1: at gunpoint and threatened to kill her. Multiple cameras are
1:18
Speaker 1: mounted on the home. Wow, let me take that apart
1:21
Speaker 1: for just a moment. All the exits were blocked, burglar
1:26
Speaker 1: bars on the windows, three handguns found inside, bowl cutters
1:32
Speaker 1: wouldn't work to dissemble the padlock. The fire department had
1:39
Speaker 1: to actually use power tools to cut through bars to
1:44
Speaker 1: gain entry to get her out. Wow with me an
1:49
Speaker 1: all star panel to make sense of what we know
1:51
Speaker 1: right now. But first I want to go out to
1:53
Speaker 1: crime online dot Com investigative reporter Nicole Parton. Nicole, where
1:57
Speaker 1: did this happen? Nancy? This was InHand Rs County, Texas,
2:01
Speaker 1: a small suburb of Houston, out kind of out in
2:05
Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere, a little bit in a mobile home,
2:08
Speaker 1: in a trailer there, and there were neighbors that were close,
2:12
Speaker 1: but he didn't have any really direct next door neighbors
2:15
Speaker 1: like we do in some of the communities we live
2:17
Speaker 1: in today. It's all took place in Texas, just a
2:21
Speaker 1: little bit south of Houston. You know, it's amazing to
2:23
Speaker 1: me that in a community no one had any idea
2:29
Speaker 1: that anything was going on. But you know, straight out
2:32
Speaker 1: to Daryl Cohen, a former prosecutor now veteran civil attorney
2:39
Speaker 1: in the Atlanta Jurisdiction on Facebook, Daryl B. Cohen, Darrell
2:43
Speaker 1: face a being with us. How many times have we
2:46
Speaker 1: argued it to a jury as prosecutors there aren't a
2:50
Speaker 1: witness because everything happened behind closed doors. This isn't the
2:53
Speaker 1: kind of crime that happens at the corner of Main
2:56
Speaker 1: Street and Broadway. There are no witnesses except the victim,
3:00
Speaker 1: you know, like a rape or Chamela Station case. Well,
3:03
Speaker 1: we have to argue that because that's the truth. If
3:06
Speaker 1: this is the case that he did all of this,
3:08
Speaker 1: he's not going to do it openly and notoriously. He's
3:11
Speaker 1: going to do it behind locked doors, behind padlocks. And
3:16
Speaker 1: he's got to do it this way because if someone
3:19
Speaker 1: or someone's found out, here come the police. Yep, here
3:24
Speaker 1: comes the popo. You know. I looked very carefully at
3:27
Speaker 1: the crime scene, and many people would immediately ask, well,
3:32
Speaker 1: why didn't she yell out the window through the burglar bars?
3:37
Speaker 1: The windows are actually boarded up, Nicole Parton. If you
3:41
Speaker 1: look at the windows, there's plyboard across the windows. There's
3:46
Speaker 1: no way she could have yelled out, right. I noticed
3:48
Speaker 1: that they were all the glass had been removed and
3:51
Speaker 1: the windows were boarded up, and then the burglar bars
3:55
Speaker 1: were placed. Also on the doors, there were multiple padlocks,
3:58
Speaker 1: not just the doorlock that was locked from the outside,
4:02
Speaker 1: but each exit to that mobile home was closed with
4:06
Speaker 1: multiple padlocks on the exterior, which leads me to the
4:12
Speaker 1: theory that if at trial he could ever claim, if
4:19
Speaker 1: he would try the amount of defense, that this was consensual,
4:22
Speaker 1: that she stayed there, then why why they have all
4:25
Speaker 1: the padlocks. In fact, let me hear that from KTRK
4:29
Speaker 1: one more time. I want to hear about all the
4:30
Speaker 1: padlocks and the measures he had taken to keep this
4:34
Speaker 1: victim trapped inside for four years. She said. All the
4:38
Speaker 1: excess to the trailer at seven hundred West Green's Road
4:41
Speaker 1: were blocked. There were burglar bars on the windows and
4:44
Speaker 1: three handguns found inside, and last night, after bolt cutters
4:48
Speaker 1: didn't work on the padlock, the fire department had to
4:51
Speaker 1: use power tools to cut through the bars to gain
4:54
Speaker 1: entry to get her out. According to quote records, that
4:57
Speaker 1: she was able to use a phone to call for
4:59
Speaker 1: help while he was at work. She told deputies he
5:02
Speaker 1: held her at gunpoint and threatened to kill her. Multiple
5:05
Speaker 1: cameras are mounted on the home. Guys, it may be
5:09
Speaker 1: fantastical to imagine that a victim could be held against
5:13
Speaker 1: her will for four years without being able to escape,
5:17
Speaker 1: but it's not the first time. Let's go to our
5:20
Speaker 1: cut thirteen. We all remember the case of J. C. Dugard.
5:24
Speaker 1: Here she is speaking to our friend Diane Sawyer. A
5:27
Speaker 1: great car pulls up, A man rolls down the window
5:30
Speaker 1: and his hand shoots out and I just feel numb.
5:34
Speaker 1: My whole body is tingly. I don't know what it's from.
5:37
Speaker 1: She had been paralyzed by a stun gun. I lost
5:41
Speaker 1: control of my bladder. I wasn't even embarrassed on the ground.
5:45
Speaker 1: Sharp edges of a pine cone are the last thing
5:48
Speaker 1: she touches before she comes to face down on the
5:52
Speaker 1: floor in the backseat of a car. The man behind
5:55
Speaker 1: the wheel is Philip Garrito, a convicted sex offender supposedly
5:58
Speaker 1: monitored by parole officers and doctors, holding her down on
6:02
Speaker 1: the floor as his wife Nancy. The district attorney believes
6:06
Speaker 1: Nancy scouted this little girl for her husband as a
6:09
Speaker 1: prize some monitoring, because we find out he and his
6:14
Speaker 1: wife keep jac Diggard locked away for eighteen years. Listen
6:20
Speaker 1: to Cup fourteen. He takes away the pink clothes she
6:24
Speaker 1: dressed in that morning. The only thing she has left
6:27
Speaker 1: is a little ring shaped like a butterfly. She will
6:30
Speaker 1: hide from him for eighteen years. Blanket over her head.
6:34
Speaker 1: He walks her through a small area of grass toward
6:36
Speaker 1: a fence where an opening is concealed by a tarp
6:39
Speaker 1: and hidden behind the fence and deranged collection of sheds
6:42
Speaker 1: and storage units which the people monitoring Garrito would not search.
6:48
Speaker 1: One of them tiny, completely soundproof. He leads her inside
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Speaker 1: and takes out handcuffs, said that they there were the
6:56
Speaker 1: fuzzy kind, so they wouldn't hurt as bad. There was
7:00
Speaker 1: a palette on the floor, and then he said he'd
7:02
Speaker 1: be back later. This girl held over a decade, even
7:08
Speaker 1: giving birth in that shed. And this is a guy
7:12
Speaker 1: that was under federal monitoring. That's some monitoring when they
7:17
Speaker 1: can't kind of find a kidnap victim in the backyard,
7:20
Speaker 1: handcuffed in a shed. For Pete's sake, listen to more.
7:25
Speaker 1: I try not to cry because I couldn't wipe him
7:27
Speaker 1: away or you know, and the naked itchy And at
7:31
Speaker 1: one point she made a note to remember the sound
7:34
Speaker 1: of the train so it would help her mom find her.
7:38
Speaker 1: I was so lonely. I felt so alone. Have you
7:42
Speaker 1: seen Ja c Lee Dugard? And one twenty miles away
7:46
Speaker 1: the mother who loves her and will never give up.
7:49
Speaker 1: Goes on television to make her first plea, it's pretty young,
7:54
Speaker 1: innocent child. Friends have been searching all day and evening
7:59
Speaker 1: police started searching in the neighborhood. Police set up a
8:01
Speaker 1: run block and go door to door. Her classmates are
8:04
Speaker 1: out in the streets holding up signs and in the
8:06
Speaker 1: case we're covering right now. I know it's hard for
8:10
Speaker 1: a lot of people to take in that she could
8:12
Speaker 1: have been held for four years, but that is in
8:16
Speaker 1: fact the claim. And when you hear the way that
8:19
Speaker 1: that home was barricaded, I mean, common sense tells you
8:23
Speaker 1: that there was no way she could have escaped. And
8:26
Speaker 1: if she was there consensually, then why all the barricades.
8:31
Speaker 1: Joining me right now is doctor Michelle Joy, forensic clinical
8:36
Speaker 1: and academic psychiatrist, author of an illustrated history of the
8:40
Speaker 1: insanity defense. Doctor Joy, thank you for being with us.
8:45
Speaker 1: What is the power trip someone must be on to
8:51
Speaker 1: hold a human captive for years on end? I mean
8:54
Speaker 1: that's exactly a rate. It's a power trip. And you
8:57
Speaker 1: see that literally manifested through all of those things that
9:00
Speaker 1: we're talking about, those padlocks, those barriers, I mean, this
9:03
Speaker 1: is all about controlling every single moment. So when we
9:05
Speaker 1: think about someone not being able to escape, that's because
9:09
Speaker 1: there's control of every single thing these women, these girls
9:12
Speaker 1: do for every single moment of those years and deckies.
9:15
Speaker 1: We're just thinking about this victim. We will not release
9:19
Speaker 1: her name. She has not made it public yet, being
9:23
Speaker 1: kept away for four years up. But what about that neighborhood.
9:28
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut eight. This is Sherman
9:31
Speaker 1: chow Khou. It's a quiet neighborhood of mobile homes on
9:36
Speaker 1: the north side. But Wednesday night, Harris County chefs deputy's
9:39
Speaker 1: the fire department converge on this home. I'll exit to
9:43
Speaker 1: the trailer were locked. There were burglar bars on the women.
9:47
Speaker 1: Three handguns were located. A woman inside called saying Abraham Bravo,
9:51
Speaker 1: sagurafendant hit chop. The complainant locked inside a trailer for
9:55
Speaker 1: a four years. You know that's another issue. Let me
9:59
Speaker 1: go out to Kathy Griffin joining US, Houston based private investigator,
10:04
Speaker 1: owner of Kate Griff Investigations, the largest female owned investigative
10:09
Speaker 1: agency in the state of Texas. That's saying a lot, Kathy,
10:13
Speaker 1: thanks for being with us. Kathy, It's interesting to me
10:18
Speaker 1: that the neighbors never thought anything was wrong with all
10:22
Speaker 1: those padlocks on the doors, of the burglar bars, the
10:27
Speaker 1: windows boarded up. They never suspected anything. Do people just
10:33
Speaker 1: not want to see what's right in front of them? Well, Nanthy,
10:36
Speaker 1: you're right, and this is a mobile home park, so
10:38
Speaker 1: people tend to keep to themselves. But I think in
10:41
Speaker 1: this situation there's more questions than answers. Wait wait, wait, wait, wait,
10:46
Speaker 1: why do you say that about a mobile home park. Well,
10:48
Speaker 1: because they're spaced out usually, and so there's not you
10:51
Speaker 1: don't have right next door neighbors. You have them far away,
10:56
Speaker 1: and people just kind of keep to themselves and sometimes
11:00
Speaker 1: are there, sometimes they're not, and you just have a
11:02
Speaker 1: tendency to mind your own business more. Okay, Kathy, for
11:07
Speaker 1: the first time ever, I completely disagree with you. I
11:10
Speaker 1: don't think that people in mobile home parks are different
11:14
Speaker 1: from people in any other neighborhood. I don't think that
11:17
Speaker 1: they want to fraternize any more or less with their
11:22
Speaker 1: neighbors than in any other area. Okay, I think that
11:26
Speaker 1: people in general, you're in your own life, well, unless
11:30
Speaker 1: you're Gladys Kravitz, in your own life and you're not
11:36
Speaker 1: looking around for the most part at people around you
11:40
Speaker 1: and what they're doing. But one thing about a mobile
11:43
Speaker 1: home park is that may be different is there's not
11:47
Speaker 1: always a tree line or big bushes or shrubs between homes,
11:53
Speaker 1: so you could actually see the home next to you,
11:57
Speaker 1: probably a lot better than let's say a rural area
12:01
Speaker 1: where there's big, huge spaces acres between homes or in
12:05
Speaker 1: a suburb where people plant trees around their home. They
12:09
Speaker 1: should have been able to see it even better. Kathy,
12:12
Speaker 1: I agree. I agree. I just think there's more questions
12:15
Speaker 1: than answers in this situation. Again, why did she find
12:19
Speaker 1: a phone suddenly after four years? And if there were
12:22
Speaker 1: guns in the house, why didn't she grab the gun
12:25
Speaker 1: if she knew where they were or didn't, And you
12:27
Speaker 1: know what did the inside of the trailer look like?
12:29
Speaker 1: So it's the victim's fault. No, I don't think it's
12:33
Speaker 1: the victim's fault. I just think you know, you have
12:35
Speaker 1: people friends, friends, and neighbors saying that she was outside,
12:39
Speaker 1: that they went on dates. I think things are going
12:42
Speaker 1: to come out that they were in a relationship on
12:45
Speaker 1: and off. No, this is not not a good relationship. Obviously.
13:03
Speaker 1: Time stories with Nancy grace. Okay, let's analyze what we're
13:08
Speaker 1: hearing right here with me a very special guest and Kathy,
13:13
Speaker 1: please let me enjoy the one moment that I ever
13:15
Speaker 1: disagree with you. Okay, Alicia Cosy Qvis is with me.
13:20
Speaker 1: Alicia was abducted, kidnapped as a teen girl, and when
13:25
Speaker 1: she tells the story, it always gives me a chill
13:31
Speaker 1: down my spine. Alicia is now a safety expert. She's
13:39
Speaker 1: a motivational speaker about how she has triumphed over evil.
13:46
Speaker 1: She was this close to death while she was kidnapped
13:53
Speaker 1: as a young girl, abused in every way, and now
14:01
Speaker 1: triumph and she is a motivational speaker. When I think
14:06
Speaker 1: of her story, it's very upsetting until you see her
14:13
Speaker 1: and hear her speak and you see how she has
14:16
Speaker 1: overcome this obstacle, this thing that happened to her. You
14:20
Speaker 1: can find her at Alicia Project, Alicia project dot org
14:25
Speaker 1: on Twitter at Alicia Project. Alicia cosa kevict that could
14:31
Speaker 1: be said about you two they had a relationship, because
14:35
Speaker 1: you did have an online relationship at first with someone
14:39
Speaker 1: you thought was a girl your own age. I think
14:41
Speaker 1: it's very natural to look deeply at what we think
14:47
Speaker 1: we know, we don't know all the facts. But the
14:50
Speaker 1: issue with this particular case is that this was an
14:55
Speaker 1: adult when the thirded, and when it's a child, there's
14:58
Speaker 1: clearly no fault to the victim and there never should be,
15:02
Speaker 1: no matter if the child went along willingly. And I'm
15:05
Speaker 1: saying that with the grades of air quotes ever, but
15:09
Speaker 1: in this case, it is easier for people to judge
15:14
Speaker 1: and blame the victim and to make it seem like
15:16
Speaker 1: the situation isn't as dark and evil as the victim
15:22
Speaker 1: is claiming it to be. And the fact is that
15:24
Speaker 1: we don't know because we weren't there. But we do
15:27
Speaker 1: have to go with what the victim said because the
15:32
Speaker 1: victim was and she's very lucky to be alive, and
15:37
Speaker 1: often when somebody is held captives, there doesn't need to
15:41
Speaker 1: be changed necessarily that the chains of fear are so
15:45
Speaker 1: incredibly strong that maybe she did go on dates, Maybe
15:49
Speaker 1: she did go out and try to make him happy
15:52
Speaker 1: or please him, or he said I will let you
15:54
Speaker 1: go if you come out with this. We don't know,
15:57
Speaker 1: We don't know the mind games he played. He certainly
15:59
Speaker 1: had local bounds, but he also almost certainly had mental
16:04
Speaker 1: chain If she were, in fact how captives, which it
16:08
Speaker 1: sounds like a terrible story that this poor woman was well.
16:11
Speaker 1: I mean, Daryl Cohen, just look at the place. It's
16:15
Speaker 1: like four knocks. If he wasn't holding something in there,
16:19
Speaker 1: then why all of that, the padlocks, the plywood at
16:23
Speaker 1: the windows, the burglar bars over the plywood. I mean
16:26
Speaker 1: they had to bring out the fire department to cut
16:29
Speaker 1: into the home. Darryl. That says a lot to me
16:33
Speaker 1: that she's not there willingly, Nancy. None of this makes
16:36
Speaker 1: any good sense. It makes bad sense. She was probably
16:41
Speaker 1: there not willingly at all, but has been pointed out psychologically.
16:46
Speaker 1: When she knew that there were guns, she knew that
16:50
Speaker 1: she could not get out, she knew how the padlocks were.
16:54
Speaker 1: She mentally was in chains, and mentally in chains can
16:58
Speaker 1: be a lot worse and physically a change. I'm talking
17:01
Speaker 1: to you about the evidence. Let me just check. Daryl
17:04
Speaker 1: Cohen JD. Not Daryl Cohen MD. Psychiatrist like doctor Michelle Joy.
17:12
Speaker 1: So as much as I appreciate your armchair psychiatry, I'm
17:16
Speaker 1: just talking to you about the hard facts, and the
17:19
Speaker 1: hard facts are this home is circled basically in chains,
17:24
Speaker 1: burglar bars, padlogs. That tells me something that proves something
17:30
Speaker 1: in my mind. Daryl Cohen, do you disagree with that?
17:33
Speaker 1: I don't disagree with that, Nancy, But I also know
17:36
Speaker 1: there are times he was out doing his tattooing, and
17:39
Speaker 1: there were times he was out being a barber, and
17:42
Speaker 1: so she could have perhaps tried to escape. Oh, Dear
17:46
Speaker 1: Lord in Heaven, blame the victim? What is wrong with you? Man?
17:51
Speaker 1: Don't you remember your days as a prosecutor? Not blaming
17:54
Speaker 1: the victim. I am just merely saying that because she
17:57
Speaker 1: was psychologically in change, she wasn't physically restoring. Your Lord
18:02
Speaker 1: in Heaven, please helped me. There were all these guns
18:06
Speaker 1: in the home. The home was clearly locked up like
18:10
Speaker 1: Fort Knox. To me, that till that is corroboration for
18:13
Speaker 1: what she's saying. You know what, Hold on just a
18:16
Speaker 1: mount Back to Alicia Kozakavitch, Alicia, could you, as much
18:22
Speaker 1: as you wish, tell us your story and during that
18:28
Speaker 1: time did you entertain escaping? Go ahead. When I was
18:32
Speaker 1: thirteen years old, I was groomed online by initial predator.
18:35
Speaker 1: This was back in two thousand and two, and there
18:39
Speaker 1: was no conversation surrounding internet safety really at the time,
18:42
Speaker 1: so it was very easy to blame the victim. In
18:45
Speaker 1: my case, we'll get to in the end of the part.
18:47
Speaker 1: But he kidnapped me from Pittzurh Pennsylvania, took me to Virginia,
18:51
Speaker 1: where I was held captive in his basement, dungeon and
18:54
Speaker 1: raped and beaten and tortured, and I was rescued because
18:57
Speaker 1: he had live streamed what he was doing to me
19:00
Speaker 1: to other people online. I did think certainly about escape
19:05
Speaker 1: at the same time. What I can tell you is
19:08
Speaker 1: that escape is almost deaf. You have to choose, am
19:13
Speaker 1: I going to risk my life in this moment? Or
19:18
Speaker 1: can I just imply? Can I just breathe for a
19:22
Speaker 1: moment and try to get to that next second, And
19:25
Speaker 1: if I can get to that next second, I can
19:26
Speaker 1: get to that next minute, and I can get that
19:28
Speaker 1: next minute, maybe I get that next hour and day.
19:31
Speaker 1: You were just trying to live moment by moment. An
19:33
Speaker 1: escape isn't something that is so easy. It is in
19:37
Speaker 1: the movies, and there are cases where it happened, but
19:41
Speaker 1: when it is something that there is so much fear,
19:45
Speaker 1: and also that she was quite potentially being hurt. In
19:51
Speaker 1: my case, he had hurt me horribly? Why would he
19:54
Speaker 1: not kill me? That threat was not something that I
19:58
Speaker 1: didn't believe. He had had already hurt me so badly,
20:01
Speaker 1: so how could I say that he wouldn't. And in
20:05
Speaker 1: my case, victim blaming was outrageous because people couldn't understand
20:10
Speaker 1: the Internet at the time and grooming and all of that.
20:14
Speaker 1: We don't. It's easy to think we know so much
20:18
Speaker 1: by reading books and textbooks, and it's so much more
20:23
Speaker 1: living in experience and having that inside perspective, and we're well,
20:31
Speaker 1: maybe here from the victim more. I'm really glad that
20:34
Speaker 1: her name isn't out there. It's been wonderful to know
20:37
Speaker 1: that she may be able to move on, and also
20:39
Speaker 1: that this is in the hands of the prosecutors and
20:43
Speaker 1: of the legal team, that it's going to be looked over,
20:47
Speaker 1: and that it's not just being assumed one way or
20:52
Speaker 1: another because she called her help or what have you.
20:56
Speaker 1: So the other thing, too, I just wanted to point
20:58
Speaker 1: out is that this look what I four years It
21:01
Speaker 1: very likely happened during COVID and for that very reason alone,
21:06
Speaker 1: people may not have been looking or noticing anything because
21:10
Speaker 1: we were all stunck inside joining me is doctor Harvey
21:13
Speaker 1: cast show Board certified Emergency cure physician, healthcare consultant, CEO
21:19
Speaker 1: of chat GPT and healthcare author of Revolutionize your Health
21:25
Speaker 1: and Fitness with chat gbt's Modern weight loss Tacks. You know,
21:31
Speaker 1: doctor Castro, I really appreciate you being with us. Could
21:35
Speaker 1: you tell me your thoughts on what the victim has
21:39
Speaker 1: endured and what you would be most interested in in
21:42
Speaker 1: this case? This is a tough one in the heartfelt
21:45
Speaker 1: to the patient. One of the first things that comes
21:48
Speaker 1: to mind immediately when they come into the emergency of
21:52
Speaker 1: a patient like this, would want I would prefer to
21:55
Speaker 1: have a female doctor taking care of the patient, just
21:58
Speaker 1: because to be sensitive to her health immediately. What I'd
22:02
Speaker 1: be very worried about is the malnutrition, dehydration and obviously
22:07
Speaker 1: the pencils that I won't go into because we have
22:10
Speaker 1: a psychiatrist or psychologists on the board here, But why
22:13
Speaker 1: just give me a tidbit and then I'll ask her
22:15
Speaker 1: what is it? Yeah, but on the mental side, there's
22:19
Speaker 1: so many parts of that, just a post traumatic stress
22:22
Speaker 1: disorder and then you know, obviously them feelings that sensory
22:28
Speaker 1: deprivement to the point where they can't talk to other people,
22:31
Speaker 1: and they're doing their coping mechanisms to just survive, and
22:36
Speaker 1: so they've adapted their mind and bring to these horrible situations.
22:40
Speaker 1: But as an ear doctor, the main thing I'd be
22:42
Speaker 1: looking for is things that are unfortunately going to kill them.
22:46
Speaker 1: So wrapped on my a lifes due to the dehydration
22:50
Speaker 1: slow down, I'm just a j I'm sorry, I'm sorry. UM.
22:54
Speaker 1: A lot of patients that unfortunately go through this get
22:58
Speaker 1: deprivation from food and nutrition, just basic water. And often
23:03
Speaker 1: these patients are so dehydrated that their kidneys basically can
23:08
Speaker 1: shut down due to the dehydration, and they can get
23:11
Speaker 1: so bad that their muscles will actually break down. And
23:15
Speaker 1: that disease process itself is called rabdough. And so these
23:18
Speaker 1: are some urgent, emergent situation things that I see in
23:22
Speaker 1: the emergency room. The other thing, unfortunately, these patients are
23:27
Speaker 1: in chains and often they can have sores, and these
23:31
Speaker 1: sources can get infected and they can have obviously fungus
23:35
Speaker 1: or infections, and sometimes these things are life threatening just
23:39
Speaker 1: because that infection has gone so profound and they have
23:43
Speaker 1: lack medical care. And in this situation for four years,
23:47
Speaker 1: I can't imagine there's some interesting medical things that you
23:52
Speaker 1: would normally not think about. For example, if I put
23:55
Speaker 1: someone in a dark room, your vision actually will become impaired.
23:58
Speaker 1: You may have a near sighted this. If I take
24:02
Speaker 1: you away from just sensory in general, you're hearing, actually
24:05
Speaker 1: you'll start having hearing loss or a medical condition called tonitis,
24:09
Speaker 1: and all it is is just this wringing of the ears.
24:12
Speaker 1: But these are things that we actually see in patients.
24:15
Speaker 1: Other interesting medical conditions that we really have to look
24:18
Speaker 1: for is you would never think a person would have
24:21
Speaker 1: hypertension or strokes, but this stress that puts a lot
24:26
Speaker 1: of stress on their body. And so often we're finding
24:29
Speaker 1: patients that you would never think they would have hypertension
24:32
Speaker 1: or predisposed to stroke having strokes at an early age
24:36
Speaker 1: because they've gotten over that they've had this tremendous, horrible
24:39
Speaker 1: stress on their body. The other one that that's not
24:43
Speaker 1: quite often bought us is just a respiratory infection due
24:47
Speaker 1: to the poor quality that these patients. For example, this
24:50
Speaker 1: patient was in confined and I would imagine they would
24:54
Speaker 1: have poor air quality and indexis heat. That's one of
24:58
Speaker 1: my personal worries that to basically was dehydrated. So all
25:02
Speaker 1: these things from a medical point of view is what
25:05
Speaker 1: I'd be looking for if this person came into the
25:07
Speaker 1: emergency room. Now you mentioned unable to speak because of
25:11
Speaker 1: through deprivation. I was thinking back on the House of Horrors,
25:15
Speaker 1: the Turpin children, the couple they married, couple that kept
25:20
Speaker 1: all of their children locked in. Some of them could
25:23
Speaker 1: hardly even stand once they were rescued because they have
25:27
Speaker 1: been chained to beds and in closets for so long. Doctor, Yes,
25:33
Speaker 1: that's interesting because that happens muscle atrophy. Basically, your muscle
25:39
Speaker 1: withers away because if you think about it, you're not
25:42
Speaker 1: putting stress on your body, which is helping build your muscle,
25:45
Speaker 1: and if you're just unfortunately chained and confined to a
25:48
Speaker 1: small area, that's often what happened to bring it to
25:52
Speaker 1: a modern or more recent not recent, but just an example,
25:56
Speaker 1: when the astronauts first came out of the first spaceships,
26:00
Speaker 1: they would come out crawling, and they would never videotape
26:03
Speaker 1: those astronauts because they didn't want to show the public
26:05
Speaker 1: that they were so much at muscle atrophy that they
26:08
Speaker 1: couldn't walk. Wow, I had no idea about that. I
26:12
Speaker 1: want to circle back to doctor Michelle Joy, forensic clinical
26:17
Speaker 1: and academic psychiatrist, Doctor Joy, doctor Harvey Caster. I brought
26:22
Speaker 1: up so many issues, but I also want to circle
26:25
Speaker 1: back to something that I'm really familiar with, prosecuting by
26:30
Speaker 1: day and being in volunteer at the batter Woman Center
26:32
Speaker 1: by night for nearly ten years. Very often I was
26:37
Speaker 1: listening to Alicia Kozakevitch's talks The Woman, and it's typically
26:42
Speaker 1: a woman is so afraid being murdered, killed, or tortured
26:49
Speaker 1: even worse than they are being that they stay. Even
26:53
Speaker 1: if they had a chance to leave, they're so afraid
26:56
Speaker 1: they don't do it. So there's that mind conditioning, that brainwashing,
27:04
Speaker 1: and other people on the outsicho, well, why didn't she leave?
27:07
Speaker 1: We cannot understand the mind of someone that has been
27:12
Speaker 1: abused in that manner. So padlocks are no padlocks. She
27:18
Speaker 1: may have been afraid for her life. I know this.
27:20
Speaker 1: Nobody saw her for four years, and I hardly think
27:23
Speaker 1: she signed up for that doctor exactly exactly. I mean,
27:26
Speaker 1: what's almost more surprising to me is that she maintained
27:29
Speaker 1: this sense of hope enough to actually look for her
27:33
Speaker 1: phone four years later, to make that call to have
27:35
Speaker 1: the courage to do that, right, because we see people
27:37
Speaker 1: in abusive relationships, like you said, without the padlocks, that
27:40
Speaker 1: are afraid to leave because of threats even to career
27:43
Speaker 1: or family or something like this. Plus we don't know
27:46
Speaker 1: this might have been the first time that she tried,
27:49
Speaker 1: It might have been the hundredth time that she tried, right,
27:51
Speaker 1: So what I see here as a story of resilience,
27:53
Speaker 1: someone that kept hope for four years. I mean, we
27:56
Speaker 1: hear about psychological effects of just one day of threats,
28:00
Speaker 1: of one day of having a gun pointed at you,
28:03
Speaker 1: of an attempted kidnapping, right, but this was four years
28:06
Speaker 1: of that, So to maintain any sense of hope to
28:09
Speaker 1: push forward to the future asily she was saying, you know,
28:12
Speaker 1: one minute, one hour, one day. That's what surprises me,
28:15
Speaker 1: not that she didn't try, but that she still had
28:18
Speaker 1: that courage after the four years, rather than just a
28:21
Speaker 1: coping mechanism. We've talked about coping mechanisms a couple of times.
28:25
Speaker 1: To even get through from one day to the next,
28:28
Speaker 1: one of those coping mechanisms would have likely have been
28:31
Speaker 1: to shut down just to not have hope, right, to
28:34
Speaker 1: sit there, to not think about the next day, because
28:36
Speaker 1: to get your hopes up and then be disappointed, to
28:38
Speaker 1: get your hopes up and then be abused, that cycle
28:41
Speaker 1: is so torturous that instead of being surprised that she
28:45
Speaker 1: didn't or she might not have done these things, I'm
28:48
Speaker 1: surprised that she still could do it, because I mean that,
28:51
Speaker 1: to me is really strength and resilience and courage. Time
29:08
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace. If you think it's fantastical that
29:15
Speaker 1: someone could remain a prisoner in a home for four years,
29:18
Speaker 1: what about ten years? Does the name Ariel Castro ring
29:24
Speaker 1: a bell? It does in my mind. Take a listen
29:28
Speaker 1: to our cut sixteen our friends at ABC. The posters
29:31
Speaker 1: have been part of Cleveland's landscape for a decade, the
29:34
Speaker 1: weathered or tattered ones replaced again and again by families
29:39
Speaker 1: who refused to give up, who refused to stop praying
29:42
Speaker 1: for a moment like this. Okay, yeah, what's going on there?
29:51
Speaker 1: I thank you. I've been mossing for ten years and
29:54
Speaker 1: I'm here. I'm right now. That is the voice of
29:57
Speaker 1: Amanda Berry calling nine one one tonight. Ten years. Not
30:03
Speaker 1: only her, but Castro had other women that he was holding,
30:08
Speaker 1: kidnapped for years and take a Listen now to a neighbor,
30:13
Speaker 1: Charles Robinson, and I look and they see this girl
30:17
Speaker 1: and she's just going nuts on the door. So I'm like,
30:19
Speaker 1: what's your problem? You stuck just opened the door, and
30:22
Speaker 1: she says, I can't. He got it locked. And I
30:24
Speaker 1: look how he has it. It's only enough to reach
30:27
Speaker 1: her hand out to grab the mail and you know,
30:28
Speaker 1: close the door and she we you know, naturally gonna
30:32
Speaker 1: pride open. That didn't work, so we had to kick
30:34
Speaker 1: open the bottom. Luckily on that door was aluminum. It
30:36
Speaker 1: was cheap. She climbed out with her daughter. She went
30:40
Speaker 1: to my house. We called nine one one. They had
30:42
Speaker 1: to kick the door in. And it's not just one
30:45
Speaker 1: victim being held for ten years. Listen to Bill Ware
30:50
Speaker 1: about five minutes after the police got here, see that girl,
30:54
Speaker 1: Amanda told the police. I ain't just the only ones.
30:57
Speaker 1: It's some old girls up in that house. So what
31:00
Speaker 1: egan went up there, you know, thirty forty deep and
31:02
Speaker 1: when they came out was just astonishing. Inside the home,
31:05
Speaker 1: they also found Georgina de Jesus, who also went missing
31:10
Speaker 1: from this very neighborhood nine years ago, walking home from
31:13
Speaker 1: a middle school. A few blocks from were a man
31:15
Speaker 1: had disappeared, and they also found Michelle Knight, who went
31:19
Speaker 1: missing in two thousand, but since she was twenty at
31:22
Speaker 1: the time, didn't get as much attention as the younger girls.
31:26
Speaker 1: And every day people would walk by the missing posters
31:29
Speaker 1: and they were right there being held captive for ten years.
31:33
Speaker 1: It's not as fantastical as you might think. But back
31:36
Speaker 1: to our case. Take a listen to our cut one
31:39
Speaker 1: our friends at KTRK tonight. The door at number one
31:42
Speaker 1: forty seven is still chained. Burglar bars remained on some
31:45
Speaker 1: of the windows and plywood covers the square that was
31:48
Speaker 1: cut open last night. Investigators with the Harris County Sheriff's
31:52
Speaker 1: Office alleged that this is where a woman had been
31:55
Speaker 1: held captive for years. Next person up is Abraham Bravo.
32:00
Speaker 1: Forty two year old Abraham Sagura is now charged with
32:04
Speaker 1: her kidnapping and he has a defense, of course, take
32:08
Speaker 1: a listen to what he has to say in court.
32:10
Speaker 1: Segura spoke up during his first court hearing today, the
32:13
Speaker 1: hearing officer having to explain that this setting was not
32:16
Speaker 1: the right time for his defense. Probable cause was already
32:20
Speaker 1: found for bond the state laid out the allegations that
32:25
Speaker 1: had kept the complaint out block inside a trailer for
32:29
Speaker 1: four years, many family for four years, and did you
32:37
Speaker 1: hear the astonished question for how many years? How many years?
32:41
Speaker 1: Back to Alicia Koza Keevitch four years and he heard
32:45
Speaker 1: the astonishment in that question how many years? As if
32:49
Speaker 1: they don't believe it, but it is entirely believable if
32:53
Speaker 1: you've ever been in that situation like you, Alicia. Absolutely,
32:58
Speaker 1: If it is somebody who doesn't have a choice as
33:01
Speaker 1: far as being there, then it could be four days,
33:05
Speaker 1: it could be four years, it could be ten years.
33:07
Speaker 1: It's not up to the victim. Now we're going to
33:10
Speaker 1: hear what I believe. The defense is going to take
33:13
Speaker 1: a Listen to Sabia Rayford. The investigators telling us Sigura
33:17
Speaker 1: and the woman were dating and a missing person's report
33:20
Speaker 1: was never filed on the thing that they're saying about
33:23
Speaker 1: him was not the famous. A friend of Segura says
33:26
Speaker 1: she and her husband have been close friends with him
33:29
Speaker 1: for twenty years. The reason that he asked the burglar
33:32
Speaker 1: bars and all that stuff that you have seen up
33:34
Speaker 1: there was because they try to rob him, you know,
33:37
Speaker 1: before they tried to get his held before, so he's
33:40
Speaker 1: trying to protect her and protect himself too. The judge
33:43
Speaker 1: also ruling that Segura have no contact with the victim.
33:47
Speaker 1: Ask for Segura, he is not a US citizen, so
33:50
Speaker 1: he is facing deportation to Mexico. What about that, Daryl Cole,
33:56
Speaker 1: and you're a defense attorney. He was afraid he'd be burgled.
34:00
Speaker 1: That's why he needed padlocks so intense the fire department
34:04
Speaker 1: had to come remove them. I think that he actually
34:08
Speaker 1: should not even utter that defense to his lawyer because
34:14
Speaker 1: that is a crock of you know what, I certainly do.
34:20
Speaker 1: Take a listen to share Minchow. That's four years. But
34:23
Speaker 1: neighbors have a very different story. She would go out, Yes,
34:27
Speaker 1: they would go out together on Sunday. They went out
34:30
Speaker 1: to wash his car. In fact, this neighboring friend, who
34:32
Speaker 1: does not want her identity revealed, says, the two have
34:36
Speaker 1: been a couple for years. Okay, so let me ask
34:38
Speaker 1: our shrink, And I mean that in a loving and
34:40
Speaker 1: caring way, Doctor Michelle Joy. Doctor Joy, if they're a couple,
34:46
Speaker 1: why did she use a cell phone? Want you to
34:48
Speaker 1: get her hands on one and call police to be
34:50
Speaker 1: rescued exactly exactly, and I think we don't know what
34:54
Speaker 1: we don't know yet. But again, if we even draw
34:56
Speaker 1: parallels to, you know, as we've talked about a couple
34:59
Speaker 1: of times, to relationships without padlocks, I think, I think
35:03
Speaker 1: what we're going to see here is that there was
35:06
Speaker 1: control in every sense. There was emotional, verbal, physical, possibly sexual, right,
35:11
Speaker 1: and so this could have been the one second, the
35:13
Speaker 1: one moment that she was able to escape. And even
35:16
Speaker 1: if they went I mean, we we've we've seen cases
35:18
Speaker 1: in the news over the decades. You know, captives go
35:21
Speaker 1: to the grocery store together. Right, there's it's not even
35:23
Speaker 1: a real psychiatric diagnosis, but we talk about Stockholm syndrome
35:28
Speaker 1: or you know, you you have to almost start to
35:31
Speaker 1: have feelings toward the captor. In this case, maybe that
35:33
Speaker 1: didn't happen, but we have to, we have to make
35:37
Speaker 1: make a face right towards the people that might see us,
35:39
Speaker 1: because maybe maybe that they as Alicia said, maybe she
35:44
Speaker 1: was threatened that she would be killed if she even
35:46
Speaker 1: looked away from him, you know, when they were washing
35:49
Speaker 1: the car. Right. There are so many potential, scary, serious
35:52
Speaker 1: and realistic forms of control in this because again going
35:55
Speaker 1: back to Alicia. If they've done this one thing, what
35:58
Speaker 1: wouldn't they do right if even they had kept her
36:01
Speaker 1: for one day, even if they had kidnapped her and
36:04
Speaker 1: it had converted from a voluntary car ride to padlocks,
36:08
Speaker 1: what wouldn't they do next? And I think that's what
36:10
Speaker 1: we'll see, and what we've seen so often is that
36:13
Speaker 1: this steer permits every single decision that the woman, like
36:17
Speaker 1: you said, usually the woman makes or doesn't make to
36:20
Speaker 1: act over those days, weeks, months, and years. To Crime
36:23
Speaker 1: online dot Com investigative reporter Nicole Pardon, is it true
36:26
Speaker 1: that all the exits to the home were blocked? That's correct, Nancy.
36:32
Speaker 1: Every exit to the home was blocked with multiple locks.
36:38
Speaker 1: Multiple locks, not just one locks like we have on
36:41
Speaker 1: our home or even a couple, but multiple locks, multiple
36:45
Speaker 1: cameras he had set up around the home so that
36:47
Speaker 1: he could see if someone tries to enter or exit
36:50
Speaker 1: the home, as well as those burglar bars on the windows. Nancy,
36:54
Speaker 1: I'm reminded of Elizabeth Smart. She was held captive, also
36:58
Speaker 1: seen in public with her captors. Yet that poor girl
37:02
Speaker 1: was kidnapped until she was finally found and set free.
37:06
Speaker 1: Just because this victim may have been seen in public,
37:09
Speaker 1: she was still held captive behind those locks and bars.
37:13
Speaker 1: To Kathy Griffin, joining US, renowned Houston based private investigator
37:17
Speaker 1: and owner of k Griff Investigations, Inc. The largest female
37:23
Speaker 1: owned investigative agency in the entire state of Texas. I
37:28
Speaker 1: see what you're saying, and as a former prosecutor, I
37:33
Speaker 1: would have to take into account what you said earlier, Kathy,
37:37
Speaker 1: about what the neighbors said and what the neighbors perceived,
37:41
Speaker 1: so I could battle it and shoot it down. In
37:44
Speaker 1: my case, in chief, the fact that she may have
37:47
Speaker 1: ever left the home with him. If she did, I
37:51
Speaker 1: don't know that she did, but if she did, it
37:54
Speaker 1: could have given the appearance that she was there willingly. Kathy,
37:58
Speaker 1: I agree. I agree, and her family needs to come
38:01
Speaker 1: into play as far as why didn't they file a
38:03
Speaker 1: missing police report. There's also allegation to drug and mental
38:07
Speaker 1: health issues, so I think there's more information that's going
38:12
Speaker 1: to come out. Again. The bottom line, she is definitely
38:16
Speaker 1: a victim. I'm not saying that she's not. I just
38:18
Speaker 1: think there's a lot of questions they need to be answered.
38:20
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, there're gonna be a lot of questions guys,
38:23
Speaker 1: it's not the first time this has ever happened. To
38:25
Speaker 1: take a listen to our cut nineteen and our friend
38:27
Speaker 1: Jessica More. Police say the woman met fifty seven year
38:30
Speaker 1: old James Pario Junior in New Mexico, where she agreed
38:34
Speaker 1: to give him a ride to Arizona. They made their
38:36
Speaker 1: way to California, where she says their relationship took a
38:39
Speaker 1: violent turn. Police say Perio physically assaulted her, took away
38:44
Speaker 1: her phone and debit cards. Eventually they ended up at
38:47
Speaker 1: this New Jersey gas station, ending what police call a
38:51
Speaker 1: year long nightmare. He just kept repeating that you know
38:54
Speaker 1: he's kemping against my will, and eventually the state troopers
38:59
Speaker 1: did get there. Pario Junior has now been charged with
39:02
Speaker 1: kidnapping and aggravated assault. New Jersey State Police are looking
39:06
Speaker 1: into the possibility that he may have held other women
39:08
Speaker 1: against their will in the past, in that case, holding
39:11
Speaker 1: her for a year. Alicia Kozakevitch, who has lived through
39:16
Speaker 1: a similar nightmare, a bit even worse because she was
39:20
Speaker 1: just a little girl when she was taken against her will.
39:25
Speaker 1: What goes through your mind when the purps not there
39:29
Speaker 1: and you're all alone, Well, when the perpetrator's not there.
39:34
Speaker 1: It's often the first time you can think, at least
39:37
Speaker 1: in my case, it was the first time that I
39:40
Speaker 1: was with my thoughts, and none of those thoughts were good,
39:45
Speaker 1: other than the hopeful ones that my parents and family
39:50
Speaker 1: and hopefully law enforcement was looking for me. I held
39:53
Speaker 1: on to that hope and if he was going to
39:57
Speaker 1: kill me, very likely, and I wasn't going to have
40:01
Speaker 1: many more days, if any. But if it had gone
40:06
Speaker 1: on and on and on and on, that hope would
40:09
Speaker 1: dwindle and dwindle and dwindle. And I know, even in
40:14
Speaker 1: the short time that I was held captive, I started
40:16
Speaker 1: to accept my death and that I wouldn't get out
40:18
Speaker 1: of there, and that you do lose hope and that
40:22
Speaker 1: you're back and forth on it, and you have to
40:25
Speaker 1: start to really think about is this is this going
40:29
Speaker 1: to be the end of my life? And is this
40:31
Speaker 1: person going to kill me? Because they certainly can. How
40:34
Speaker 1: long were you held hostage? Four days? I was rescued
40:37
Speaker 1: on the fourth day, and it was believed that he
40:41
Speaker 1: was going to quite possibly kill me that night. And
40:45
Speaker 1: that was the thing too. Four years, four years, four years.
40:47
Speaker 1: It's amazing that she survived this long perpetrators. We hear
40:53
Speaker 1: these cases, but they certainly stick out. We can name
40:55
Speaker 1: so many, We can name almost all of them, now,
40:59
Speaker 1: that is exactly. But we can't sit here and probably
41:03
Speaker 1: name all the murder cases. There are so many who
41:06
Speaker 1: are held captive for such a brief amount of time,
41:09
Speaker 1: and the person does not keep them. Guys, we are
41:12
Speaker 1: waiting for the next court appearance, and we wait as
41:16
Speaker 1: justice unfalls. Goodbye friend,