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Trump Wants You To Stop Talking About Epstein · Pod Save America

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• 1:35
  Speaker 2: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau.
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: I'm Tommy Uthor.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: Jon Lovett is still on vacation.
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: You pray love. 2.0.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: He has missed some Some good stuff.
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: He's going to be so pissed when he realizes. I
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: wonder if he's doing a news blackout.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: That's the kind of thing that he would do.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: Well, Tim Miller did a week-long news blackout. I know.
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: During the Epstein week, which is very funny.
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: Tim, Dan, love it. All on vacation during this breaking news. Anyway,
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: there's some other things we're going to talk about today.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: We got a Trump flip-flop on Ukraine. More tariff threats.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Biden's interview with the New York Times on his auto
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: pen pardons. Some good news and some horrifying news on deportations.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: and J.D. Vance getting booed at the happiest place on earth. But,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: of course, we will start with Epstein. If you had
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: told me a week ago, when you and I first
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: did this on last Tuesday's pod, that we would be
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: leading the show with it today, a week later, I
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: would not have believed you.
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: You would have been psyched.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: But here we are. The president dropped a post on
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: Truth Social over the weekend that has only made his
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: fans angrier. He wrote, quote, What's going on with my boys?
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: And in some cases, gals.
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: So weird. The phrasing is so weird.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: They're all going after Attorney General Pam Bondi, who is
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: doing a fantastic job. Trump went on to accuse anyone
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: who has questions about his administration's decision not to release
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: the Epstein files, quote, selfish people who are trying to
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: hurt him, quote, over a guy who never dies, Jeffrey Epstein.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: He also said that the real authors.
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: Pretty sure he's dead.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's kind of the controversy. Well, I actually thought
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: that was a clever line, actually. It's like, he's dead,
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: but he never dies.
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: He lives on.
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because we're still talking about him. That's sort of
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: how I took it. Anyway, that's just a small thing.
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: Trump also said that the real authors of the Epstein
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: files are none other than Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, and
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: Joe Biden.
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: Incredible.
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: I think Comey was in there, too. Brennan. Sure. All
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: the deep state faves.
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: All the hits.
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: Trump's post broke records for the amount of replies it got.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: Fortunately for him... Just about all of them were negative. Meanwhile,
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: there is wagon circling and finger pointing at the Justice Department.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: Deputy FBI Director Dan Bongino took a mental health day
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: on Friday. They called it a mental health day after
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: getting in a fight at the White House with Pam Bondi.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: CNN reports that Trump is apparently furious with Bongino, and
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: it's still unclear whether he'll resign this week, though CNN
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: also reports that he's in a better headspace this week.
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: So I guess the mental health day worked. Laura Loomer,
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: who incredibly first broke the Bongino news, is also calling
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: for a special counsel now to investigate everything. And MAGA's
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: biggest stars, many of whom spoke at the Turning Point
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: USA Summit over the weekend, are very publicly expressing their
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: anger towards the White House in a way I don't
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: think we've ever heard. Let's listen. in the most polite way.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: I'm like, give us the Epstein list now.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: It's a baseline question that every US citizen has a
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: right to an answer on. What the hell was this?
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: I hope that President Trump will fix this by firing
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: Pam Blondie. Who would you guys prefer, Bongino or Bonnie?
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: Bongino.
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: Okay, 7,000 to zero. They want Dan.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: How many of you are satisfied you can clap?
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: Satisfied with the results of the Epstein investigation.
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: Clap.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: So that was Laura Ingraham, Charlie Kirk, Tucker Carlson. Who
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: else do we hear in there? I think Benny Johnson
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: was in there.
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: Benny Bannon was there.
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: The whole crew. Would you say this is the biggest
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: MAGA revolt Trump has ever faced? Why do you think
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: this has become such a big deal and it has
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: such staying power?
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: It's definitely the biggest MAGA revolt.
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: Also, I guess credit to Turning Point USA for having
• 5:34
  Speaker 5: all those conversations.
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Surprised.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: It's a little surprising, right?
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, I guess they kind of know where their
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: base is and they can't.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: Sort of the theme of the whole conference. Yeah.
• 5:43
  Speaker 5: I was trying to think about other things that were
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: as unpopular or if they came close, like obviously the
• 5:47
  Speaker 5: COVID policies were not popular, like Fauci generally masks, vaccines,
• 5:53
  Speaker 5: anything he said that was nice about immigrants, like the
• 5:54
  Speaker 5: dreamers led to a reaction from some quarters of the
• 5:57
  Speaker 5: MAGA movement.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 5:58
  Speaker 5: And like, There were some other dust-ups. Remember when he,
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: in 2019, he talked about pulling out of Syria, and
• 6:05
  Speaker 5: then that pissed off the neocons, and then they said, oh,
• 6:07
  Speaker 5: just kidding, we flip-flopped, and then that pissed off Tucker Carlson.
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  Speaker 3: There were a few moments.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: The Iran stuff briefly.
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: Yeah, the Freedom Caucus doesn't like the spending from time
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: to time, but nothing has united the entire MAGA coalition
• 6:19
  Speaker 5: like this. It is the traditional Fox News Republicans. It's
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: the right-wing kind of media influencer class. It's the TPUSAs,
• 6:25
  Speaker 5: the Tucker Carlson's, the Charlie Kirk, the Steve Bannon's. And
• 6:28
  Speaker 5: then it's like the far right loony fringe. It's Alex Jones.
• 6:30
  Speaker 5: They're all furious. They're all equally furious. And I think
• 6:33
  Speaker 5: it's a big deal for a lot of reasons. First
• 6:35
  Speaker 5: of all, I think some of them genuinely believe there's
• 6:37
  Speaker 5: an evil cabal of liberals harming children and that they're
• 6:40
  Speaker 5: being protected by the government and they want Trump to
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: do something about it. There are some that think the
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  Speaker 5: Epstein list includes all the people they hate the most,
• 6:47
  Speaker 5: namely Bill Clinton. I think Benny Johnson, who for those
• 6:50
  Speaker 5: who don't know, lucky you, he's a multi-time plagiarist who
• 6:54
  Speaker 5: got a job at TPUSA now. He outlined a four-part
• 6:57
  Speaker 5: plan for how Trump could fix his political problem that includes, quote,
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  Speaker 5: drag in Bill Clinton for questioning as step four, right?
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  Speaker 5: So you can tell what he cares about. And then
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  Speaker 5: I think others just smell bullshit and they feel insulted.
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  Speaker 5: And Pam Bondi going from saying, oh, the files are
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  Speaker 5: on my desk. I'm reviewing them to there are no
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  Speaker 5: files to Obama wrote them.
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  Speaker 3: Is just absurd.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. Trump's sort of like central belief is or at
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: least the belief he encouraged people to have for the
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: last decade is that there is like a deeply corrupt
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  Speaker 2: establishment in politics that like takes care of itself, screws
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  Speaker 2: everyone else, right? The Epstein case is like a prime
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  Speaker 2: example of that.
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  Speaker 3: The worst example.
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  Speaker 2: And his promise when he ran both times, three times,
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  Speaker 2: I guess, was, you know, you elect me and I
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  Speaker 2: will expose and destroy this corrupt establishment.
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  Speaker 3: Drain the swamp.
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  Speaker 2: And now- Not only is he not exposing or releasing
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: more of the Epstein files, but I think what's really
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: pissed them off is he's saying, if you have questions
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  Speaker 2: about it, fuck you.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, shut up.
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  Speaker 2: Like, you're a selfish asshole. And then he's insulting people's
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  Speaker 2: intelligence by saying that Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, I
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: guess like Candace Owens today was like, I don't think
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  Speaker 2: I'll ever forgive Donald Trump for making me defend Barack Obama.
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  Speaker 5: That's pretty good, Candace.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: But, like, I don't know. I think that's a pretty foundational, like,
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  Speaker 2: because it's the first time where they're like, oh, he's lying. Like,
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  Speaker 2: he's lying to me.
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: He's lying.
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  Speaker 5: Jeffrey Epstein died in 2019. Barack Obama was probably golfing somewhere.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. And some of his lies they don't care about
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: because they're like, oh, I know he's sort of lying.
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 2: You know? Like, I think you're right. Like for a
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: good chunk of the MAGA base, maybe they don't think
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: that there's a cabal of pedophile Democrats running the world, right?
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: But they do think that there's a lot of sleaziness
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: in government and that people are covering a lot of
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: shit up.
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: Because he led them to believe that. And now he's saying, no, no, no, no, no.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: It's fine.
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: And he also said, I alone can fix it. And
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  Speaker 5: now he's clearly just refusing to follow.
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  Speaker 3: Through on his promise.
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  Speaker 2: I also think, imagine if he, the way he handled
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: this was, look, Obviously, there's a lot of files, but
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: we've got to protect these victims. And, you know, there's
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: nothing else there. We thought there was something else there.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: I looked through it all. Justice Department looked, there's nothing
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: else there. And just, like, left it at that. People
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: would still be pissed, but I think the way he's
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: handled it is so much worse.
• 9:23
  Speaker 5: The rollout has been baffling. You had Pam Bondi saying
• 9:27
  Speaker 5: she was reviewing the files. The files were on my desk.
• 9:29
  Speaker 5: I think that was in February. She invited all those
• 9:31
  Speaker 5: influencers to the White House. She handed them binders that
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: said Epstein Files Part 1 or Phase 1. And they
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: all looked like fools. They were all humiliated when they
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: held them up and did photo ops.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: Dancing around like fucking idiots.
• 9:42
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 9:42
  Speaker 5: And then they had Dan Bongino, the deputy director of
• 9:45
  Speaker 5: the FBI, and Kash Patel, the director of the FBI,
• 9:48
  Speaker 5: do this kind of slow rollout where they started doing
• 9:52
  Speaker 5: interviews where they said, no, actually, Jeffrey Epstein did kill himself.
• 9:55
  Speaker 5: And then all of a sudden, there's this exclusive report
• 9:59
  Speaker 5: in Axios online. a Sunday after July 4th weekend with
• 10:02
  Speaker 5: this two page memo. That's like, basically, if you keep
• 10:05
  Speaker 5: asking questions, you're part of the problem. And they released
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: this so-called tape proving Epstein killed himself. That's missing a
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: minute and was exported into like Adobe premiere or whatever,
• 10:15
  Speaker 5: you know, editing software. And like everything about the rollout
• 10:18
  Speaker 5: and execution has been a disaster.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: Also, I looked again at the original statement that the
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: Justice Department put out, which, of course, was unsigned by anyone.
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: The words they used is, there's no incriminating client list,
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: which is like, okay, that's very specific. Maybe there's a
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: client list, but it's not incriminating. Maybe it's not a list.
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: Maybe it's files. It was a little too specific to
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: write that.
• 10:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, because I guess you can't say there's no client
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: list because he had a job, right? He was like
• 10:46
  Speaker 5: a financial something advisor to these creeps.
• 10:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: And we both, I think, have started it like, oh,
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: it's funny that all these conspiracy-minded people are now pissed
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: off and everything. But then maybe we've gone a little
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: bit down the rabbit hole. So last summer, so this
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: has been floating around today, Max Tanney at Semaphore reported
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: that Fox News edited an interview with Trump to remove
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: part of his answer on whether he'd declassify the Epstein files.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: What viewers saw on Fox was Trump saying, Yeah, I would.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: But the full answer, which only appeared later, is now
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: going viral. Here it is. Would you declassify the Epstein files?
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I would. All right. Yes, I would. I think
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: that less so because, you know, you don't know. You
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: don't want to affect people's lives if it's phony stuff
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: in there because it's a lot of phony stuff with
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: that whole world. But I think I would or at
• 11:43
  Speaker 4: least I would.
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: Do you think that would restore trust? Help restore trust?
• 11:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know about Epstein so much as I
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: do the others. Certainly about the way he died, it
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: would be interesting to find out what happened there because
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: that was a weird situation and the cameras didn't happen
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: to be working, et cetera, et cetera. But yeah, I'd
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: go a long way toward that one.
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: It'd be interesting. Now, first of all, first of all,
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: Donald Trump has assured us that a media outlet editing
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: a candidate's answer in the heat of a campaign constitutes
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: the biggest election hoax ever. In history.
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: Indeed.
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: The biggest media scandal in history. So I imagine a
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: lawsuit against Fox and a settlement is forthcoming, right?
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: I'm not really kidding. Kamala Harris should sue them just
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: for fun.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: That's a good idea.
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: Why not?
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Kamala Harris should sue.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: There's precedent.
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: And that was, and of course the interviewer there was
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: Rachel Campos Duffy, who was married to the transportation secretary,
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: Sean Duffy. NASA administrator. NASA administrator. Acting. Former- real world
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: road rules co-host and they met, they met there. So, um, that's,
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: that's what's happening there. But yeah, like just Trump answering there,
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: but like, there's some stuff, there's some stuff. We don't
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: want any fake stuff ruining people's reputations.
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: Yes. The Fox edit is wild.
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: Um, I'd never seen the juxtaposition of the long and
• 13:01
  Speaker 5: the short version until recently.
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: That's it.
• 13:03
  Speaker 5: I had noticed, uh, that his Epstein answers were always
• 13:07
  Speaker 5: like way less enthusiastic. When he's asked about the 9-11 files,
• 13:11
  Speaker 5: he's like, yeah, of course we'll put them out. The
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: JFK stuff, the answer is no problem. With Epstein, there's
• 13:15
  Speaker 5: always hesitation. Like I remember this from the Lex Friedman podcast.
• 13:18
  Speaker 5: This was during the 2024 campaign. Lex says, quote, there's
• 13:21
  Speaker 5: a moment where you had some hesitation about Epstein releasing
• 13:23
  Speaker 5: some of the documents on Epstein. Why the hesitation? Donald
• 13:27
  Speaker 5: Trump says, I don't think, I'm not involved. I never
• 13:29
  Speaker 5: went to his island, fortunately, but a lot of people did.
• 13:31
  Speaker 5: I think they do a little back and forth. So
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: a little bit later, Lex Freeman says, it's just very
• 13:35
  Speaker 5: strange for a lot of people that the list of
• 13:37
  Speaker 5: clients that went to the island has not been made public.
• 13:39
  Speaker 5: Trump says, it's very interesting, isn't it? It probably will be,
• 13:41
  Speaker 5: by the way, probably, if you're able to. Lex is like,
• 13:44
  Speaker 5: if you're able to release it, will you? And he says, yeah,
• 13:47
  Speaker 5: I'd certainly take a look at it. Now, Kennedy's interesting
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: because that's so many years ago. They do that for danger, blah, blah, blah.
• 13:51
  Speaker 5: He like pivots right to Kennedy.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: And then he was also like, oh, at least on Fox,
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: he was like, and certainly the January 6th files. Certainly
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: I'll get those out there. I think Trump is genuinely
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: concerned that his name is in the files somewhere. Not
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: necessarily as like a client on a client list. And,
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: you know, he seems more sure that he's, oh, I
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: didn't go to the island, right? But like, why bring
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: up the island, right? Like, so he knows that he's like,
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: he's not on the client list. He didn't go to
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: the island. But he gets, because now he's been through
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: a criminal trial and a few other charges and he's
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: seen indictments, he gets that sometimes your name is mentioned there.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: in an indictment or in court records. And even if you,
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: you know, even if you're not charged, even if you're
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: not a co-conspirator or sometimes because of hearsay. And so
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: like he, I think because he was friends with Jeffrey
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: Epstein for so long, because he hung out with him
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: a lot, because he's been on his plane, he thinks
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: he's in there somewhere.
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 14:52
  Speaker 5: And we know this also, Bill O'Reilly talked to Trump
• 14:56
  Speaker 5: about Epstein recently.
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: I think this was back in March.
• 14:58
  Speaker 5: Bill O'Reilly's quote was, I talked to Trump man-to-man, eye-to-eye
• 15:02
  Speaker 5: on St. Patrick's Day about this.
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: That's very uncomfortable.
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: He said there are a lot of names associated with
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: Epstein that had nothing to do with Epstein's conduct. And
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: he's concerned that if those names get out, those people
• 15:12
  Speaker 5: will be destroyed. So at a bare minimum, he thinks
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: a bunch of his friends are in those records somewhere
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: and maybe him.
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: Look, I'm with you.
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: Look, I used to think the conspiracy was hiding in
• 15:23
  Speaker 5: plain sight. Jeffrey Epstein was a rich, powerful scumbag who
• 15:27
  Speaker 5: used his money and his connections to to get away
• 15:29
  Speaker 5: with horrific, horrific crimes. I just sort of assumed that
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: was the whole thing. But the way Trump has handled
• 15:34
  Speaker 5: this has metastasized this conspiracy in so many different ways,
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: it's kind of hard to keep track of it.
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: At first, I thought it's either Trump or like friends
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: that he's worried about. But then I thought to myself,
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: When has Trump ever been concerned about his friends? No.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: This is why I think he's worried about his name.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: He's never been worried about anyone else, even if he
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: doesn't even fucking care about his family.
• 15:59
  Speaker 5: They knew each other for like 20 years. I mean,
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: they hung out in New York. They hung out in Florida.
• 16:03
  Speaker 5: There's video of them. There's Jeffrey Epstein saying.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: Hanging out at Mar-a-Lago. Hanging out at Mar-a-Lago, like.
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: Ogling women on camera.
• 16:10
  Speaker 5: There's a 2017 quote of Jeffrey Epstein and Michael Wolff
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: where Epstein says he was his closest friend. There was
• 16:18
  Speaker 5: a report that Trump considered pardoning Ghislaine Maxwell in his
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: first term.
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: Like there's a lot of smoke here.
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: There was a report that Trump said at one point like, oh,
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: Jeffrey likes– likes girls and he likes them young.
• 16:29
  Speaker 5: Verbatim quote i think he sounds like new york magazine
• 16:31
  Speaker 5: yes great guy uh loves beautiful women like some really
• 16:34
  Speaker 5: young though it's like really creepy yeah so you know
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: i think i think he's got a legitimate concern here
• 16:40
  Speaker 5: oh here we go i've known jeff for 15 years
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: terrific guy he's a lot of fun to be with
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: it is even said that he likes beautiful women as
• 16:45
  Speaker 5: much as i do and many of them are on
• 16:47
  Speaker 5: the younger side no doubt about it i mean what
• 16:50
  Speaker 5: more do.
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: We need what more do.
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: We need this stuff's all out there so like what
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: else is in the files right It can't be worse
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: than that.
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: So we're now at the point of in a typical
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: Trump scandal where, you know, for a week, everyone freaks
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: out and kind of says what they actually believe. But now,
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: you know, word has gone out to MAGA media and
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: influencers that it is time to shut the fuck up.
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: And talk about something else. Charlie Kirk, who Trump reportedly
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: asked to tone it down in a phone call over
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: the weekend, said on Monday, quote, I'm done talking about
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: Epstein for the time being. I'm going to trust my
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: friends in the administration.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Fox News didn't have a single mention of Epstein as
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: of noon on Monday. And, you know, the DOJ and
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: FBI are saying that everyone's getting along swimmingly now. There's,
• 17:37
  Speaker 2: you know, this new CNN report that maybe Bongino's, he's
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: better now and he's reconsidering quitting. Do you think this
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: will work?
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: No.
• 17:47
  Speaker 5: Although I think CNN reported that no one senior at
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: DOJ had talked to Dan Bongino since Wednesday.
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: But he's back at work today, apparently.
• 17:54
  Speaker 5: Well, we're like yada, yada, yada-ing the part where the
• 17:56
  Speaker 5: deputy FBI director is just not doing his job.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: He just quiet quit.
• 18:02
  Speaker 5: I think Trump can silence parts of the MAGA professional class.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: The biggest sycophants. Right.
• 18:08
  Speaker 5: Charlie Kirk is a perfect example. TPUSA needs access to
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: Trump officials. It's a symbiotic relationship. I think Charlie will
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: try to calm the storm to preserve his relationships. But
• 18:20
  Speaker 5: I just don't think that that is going to work
• 18:22
  Speaker 5: on the rank and file and on the base. And
• 18:24
  Speaker 5: I think that's actually really dangerous for Trump, for MAGA,
• 18:28
  Speaker 5: for Charlie Kirk, for the country. Because Charlie Kirk's competition
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: is not like the lame kind of centrist traditional Republicans.
• 18:36
  Speaker 5: It's Nick Fuentes and guys to the far, far right.
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: Nick Fuentes is out there saying Trump's a joke. MAGA
• 18:43
  Speaker 5: is dead.
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: It's over.
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: This statement that he put out the other day is ridiculous.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: I can't remember if I talked to you about this
• 18:50
  Speaker 5: or if it was Ben on Pod Save the World.
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: One night, because I'm just a sicko, I watched a
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: two-hour and 40-minute debate on InfoWars hosted by Alex Jones
• 18:59
  Speaker 5: between Dinesh D'Souza and Nick Fuentes.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: We have talked.
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: On Iran. Look, I was doing my own research. Nick
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: Fuentes is a bad dude.
• 19:11
  Speaker 5: He's genuine questions of the Holocaust, real neo-Nazi shit. But
• 19:16
  Speaker 5: my takeaway from it was it was a really substantive debate.
• 19:20
  Speaker 5: It did not get ugly. Alex Jones kept jumping in
• 19:22
  Speaker 5: because he wanted them to fight each other more viciously.
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: You thought they were just making some good points. What
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: I came away thinking was.
• 19:30
  Speaker 5: Fuentes is dangerous. If you can present as reasonable in
• 19:36
  Speaker 5: that context for that long in a debate with someone
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: who is like Dinesh D'Souza, I don't respect him. I
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: don't think he's an honest person, but he's a professional debater.
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: I think you could convince a lot of people to
• 19:47
  Speaker 5: follow you and that your other needs views are maybe, they.
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: Seem less French.
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: I had that concern today seeing what Laura Loomer has
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: been up to, which is she's using her connections in
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Mago World to actually break news. And so then- people
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: take her a little more seriously because she's breaking news,
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: which is valuable to media outlets and people like us
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: who talk about the news, right? And then now that
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: she's taken seriously and like people go to her for quotes,
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: she can espouse all of her hateful, crazy views.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 20:21
  Speaker 5: I kind of like struggle with sometimes I'm like, should
• 20:22
  Speaker 5: I be retweeting these people? Cause I want to make
• 20:25
  Speaker 5: sure reporters all see that there is this like tumult
• 20:28
  Speaker 5: within the MAGA movement. I'm like, And it's not like,
• 20:30
  Speaker 5: am I platforming her? It's like, should I just be
• 20:33
  Speaker 5: promoting these people generally? And then I remember Laura Loomer
• 20:36
  Speaker 5: got the head of the NSA fired. So, like, horse
• 20:39
  Speaker 5: out of the barn here.
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: She's a mover and shaker. She's, like, got some influence.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: I do think, you know, he can get Charlie Kirk
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: back on board. And I think Fox will be, like,
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: the people at Fox will be, like, the first to
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: get back on board, right? Right. They'll be like, who
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: are we invading? I can see the news cycle moving
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: on because it just does. And he'll do other things
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: and say other things. But this is one of those
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: things that goes, like, back underground into the swamps of
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: the internet. And it just keeps circulating. And the Nick
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: Fontes of the world and Laura, like there's people who
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: are still going to be pissed about this for a
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: long time. And next time Trump pisses his base off
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: with something, this will get brought up. Yes.
• 21:15
  Speaker 5: And conspiracy theories like this that are kind of like
• 21:18
  Speaker 5: blobs with no boundaries and amorphous, they just evolve to
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: like envelop current events. Like I think I mentioned to
• 21:23
  Speaker 5: you how I saw some kind of conservative influencers saying,
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: that the DOJ memo that went out about Epstein in
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: the first place was time for Bibi Netanyahu's visit, because
• 21:32
  Speaker 5: they all think that Epstein was like a Mossad asset.
• 21:34
  Speaker 5: And it's just going to be like shit like that,
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: like over and over and over.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: Or Naftali Bennett, like having to respond today, former prime
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: minister of Israel, be like, he's not Mossad, I promise.
• 21:42
  Speaker 3: He's no ties to Israeli intelligence. Okay.
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: Okay. Did you see Lara Trump on Benny Johnson's show?
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: Lara Trump said, there needs to be more transparency. I
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: think that will happen. I know this is important to
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: the president. He's going to want to set things right.
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: I believe there will be more coming in anything they're
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: able to release. They will try to get out. They
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: hear it and understand it. What did you make it?
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: I'm interested in that.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: Interesting.
• 22:06
  Speaker 5: I mean, like the basic demand that seems like it
• 22:10
  Speaker 5: would satisfy someone like Megyn Kelly is let me sit
• 22:13
  Speaker 5: down with Pam Bondi, Kash Patel and Dan Bongino for
• 22:17
  Speaker 5: a two hour interview where I get to ask anything
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: I want. Like putting those three in front of a
• 22:23
  Speaker 5: Trump sort of sycophantic journalist.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: Makes a lot of sense why wouldn't you do.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: That i also think that they are not necessarily above
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: putting out uh fake information or uh information that is
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: real but just not the full story like i was
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: sort of not not to give them any ideas but
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: i've been wondering why they don't just like if there's
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: stuff they're worried about you know not release that and
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: then just give give some chum to everyone on other
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: issues i think they could definitely.
• 22:48
  Speaker 5: Do that my my guess for why um a smart
• 22:52
  Speaker 5: but evil person involved in these conversations would think that's
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: risky is that I think a lot of people have
• 22:56
  Speaker 5: probably seen these files that are kind of in the
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: professional workforce. Yeah, they're in the FBI, like New York office, or,
• 23:03
  Speaker 5: you know, they worked on the 2008 case down in Florida, right?
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: And there's just like a lot of ways it could leak.
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. Dan Bongino, like how does he stay
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: in the job? He, you know, he takes the mental
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: health day, he's been doing these podcasts and now he's
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: just going to be like, no, no, no, I'm okay.
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: Just for people who don't know, like take a second, uh, Google, uh,
• 23:20
  Speaker 5: Dan Bongino. He, his head looks like Minecraft. Um, he
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: looks so jacked. He's like a roided up dude. He
• 23:28
  Speaker 5: was a twin. Uh, I think there were two secret
• 23:31
  Speaker 5: service agents. Remember, I mean, he was like on Obama's
• 23:33
  Speaker 5: detail for a long guy.
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's where they wrote, that's where they wrote the
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: Epstein files together.
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: And then Dan ran for office three different times unsuccessfully,
• 23:41
  Speaker 5: but pivoted to being a very successful podcaster. but he
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: has a crazy temper and anger management problem. And there's
• 23:47
  Speaker 5: this clip of him screaming at this reporter named Mark Caputo,
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: who now works at Axios that Caputo published shortly after
• 23:54
  Speaker 5: it happened, where he's just like losing his mind. But
• 23:57
  Speaker 5: to your question, like the only way Bongino can stay
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: in the job is because ultimately in the Trump world,
• 24:02
  Speaker 5: there is one boss and his name is Donald Trump
• 24:04
  Speaker 5: and no one else's opinion matters because like Trump, like the, the,
• 24:10
  Speaker 5: the deputy director job, it's not Senate confirmed. There's not
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: a lot of accountability. Like Trump announced the pick of
• 24:15
  Speaker 5: both Patel and Bongino, but there's reporting that Patel actually
• 24:19
  Speaker 5: chose Dan to be his deputy and did so after
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: he told, I think it was like the retired FBI
• 24:25
  Speaker 5: association that he would pick a, uh, career, uh, FBI
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: officer to serve in that job.
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: Cause what usually happens literally every time, literally every time.
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: So he lied to them, but like technically, um, Dan
• 24:38
  Speaker 5: Bongino reports to DOJ. He reports to Pam Bondi and
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: he apparently screamed at his boss in the White House.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: You could also see a situation where Bongino stays in
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: the job for now and then tries to just like
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: leave in a couple months because of something else or
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: at least tries to claim that it was for some
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: other reason.
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: Ambassador to Liechtenstein.
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: More mental health days. Democrats in Congress like Ro Khanna
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: and Mark Veazey of Texas want to force a vote
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: on legislation that would require DOJ to release all the files.
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: What do you think?
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: I like it.
• 25:07
  Speaker 5: I mean, Roe's trying to attach his amendment to this
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: cryptocurrency bill that's kind of sailing through the House. So
• 25:12
  Speaker 5: I think it'll get voted down because they'll claim it's
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: non-germane to the underlying legislation, as if that has prevented
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: them from doing this in the past. But I think
• 25:19
  Speaker 5: as many bad votes for Republicans on this.
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: Issue is good. I support the other proposals as well.
• 25:25
  Speaker 5: I think the obvious caveat's right.
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: You don't want to release.
• 25:28
  Speaker 5: Anything that would put out information about the victims and
• 25:31
  Speaker 5: harm them. You don't want to do anything that would
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: help Ghislaine Maxwell- get her case thrown out on appeal.
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: So did you, I didn't realize this until today. Apparently
• 25:41
  Speaker 5: DOJ has until today, July 14th to respond to her appeal. Um,
• 25:48
  Speaker 5: because she wants to go up to the Supreme court. I,
• 25:50
  Speaker 5: and the Trump solicitor general has delayed their response to
• 25:54
  Speaker 5: her demands twice.
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: I also saw that she, she, um, like sources say
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: she's willing to offer more testimony about this. It's a Congress.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: It's a Congress.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: Let's fire up the Zoom.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: This is why I like the vote thing too is
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: because either Mike Johnson tries to block the vote, which
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: is going to just piss off the base even more,
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: or he allows the vote. And I think that thing
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: passes because there's enough Republicans, House Republicans who are pissed
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: about this that you could see it passing. And then
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: you could imagine DOJ stonewalling and just saying like, fuck you,
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: we're not releasing it. Like, I don't care what Congress says.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: But at the very least, I think they get pressure
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: to like have Cash, Bongino, Bondi come to the Hill
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: and testify. Like that has to be coming.
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: Well, those guys, I mean, I think statutorily will have
• 26:41
  Speaker 5: to go to the Hill at some point, right? There's
• 26:44
  Speaker 5: the yearly threat assessment hearing, or there's like general routine
• 26:46
  Speaker 5: committee oversight hearing. So they're going to be up on
• 26:48
  Speaker 5: the Hill at some point anyway. And Democrats in those
• 26:50
  Speaker 5: settings should ask about nothing but this over and over
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: and over again.
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: And ideally, like a Democrat should reach out to some
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: crazy Republican who's pissed about this and sort of like
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: coordinate questions and just be like on this issue, let's
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: kind of, you know, work together.
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: No doubt.
• 27:05
  Speaker 5: But like Glenn Maxwell, she, she is arguing that, uh,
• 27:09
  Speaker 5: the 2008 non-prosecution agreement that was given to Jeffrey Epstein
• 27:12
  Speaker 5: included all of her associates and should have prevented her
• 27:14
  Speaker 5: prosecution in this latest case. So that she's trying to
• 27:17
  Speaker 5: get that to go to the Supreme court. You have
• 27:19
  Speaker 5: to imagine her lawyer is also trying to get some
• 27:22
  Speaker 5: sort of appeal as politically untenable as that would be.
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: And maybe once It is confirmed that that will not
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: be happening, hence the delays. She decides to speak her
• 27:31
  Speaker 5: truth to some journalist somewhere.
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: Just wait until Trump hardens her on his way out
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: the door. And also just fucks J.D. Vance's campaign.
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: That's an ending.
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: Couldn't have been a nicer guy.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: Pod Save America is brought to you by Magic Spoon.
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• 28:51
  Speaker 2: All right, let's move on to another issue where Trump
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: made big promises, failed to deliver, and is now doing
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: the thing he criticized, Putin's invasion of Ukraine. On Monday,
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: the president announced that the United States would resume sending weapons,
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: including the Patriot air defense missile systems, to Ukraine. Except
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: rather than provide the weapons directly to Ukraine, the U.S.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: will sell the weapons to NATO countries, who will then
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: provide them to Ukraine. So we're basically back to the
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: Biden administration's policy, except with a few more steps in
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: the middle. Trump also threatened Russia with 100% tariffs. If
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: a peace deal isn't reached in the next 50 days,
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: a deadline I'm sure will hold. Here's Trump in the
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: Oval answering some questions about the announcement.
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: How far are you willing to go if Putin were
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: to escalate, send more bombs in the coming days?
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: Don't ask me a question like that. How far? I
• 29:35
  Speaker 4: don't know. I want to get the war settled. You know,
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: we want to defend our country. But, you know, ultimately,
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: having a strong Europe is a very good thing.
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: How did you tell Putin this was coming?
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: I speak to him a lot about getting this thing done.
• 29:53
  Speaker 4: And I always hang up and say, well, that was
• 29:55
  Speaker 4: a nice phone call. And then missiles launched into Kiev
• 29:58
  Speaker 4: or some other... City, and I said, strange. And after
• 30:01
  Speaker 4: that happens three or four times, you say, the talk
• 30:05
  Speaker 4: doesn't mean anything. He's, I don't want to say he's
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: an assassin, but he's a tough guy. It's been proven
• 30:12
  Speaker 4: over the years. He's fooled a lot of people. He
• 30:15
  Speaker 4: fooled Bush. He fooled a lot of people. He fooled Clinton, Bush, Obama, Biden.
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: He didn't fool me.
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: Oh, he didn't fool you, huh? Sure, it seems like
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: he did. Which is why now you're changing. Now you're
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: changing it. Pretty significant reversal in Trump's stance on Ukraine, right? Yeah.
• 30:31
  Speaker 5: Also, like, he always sounds like he just Googled Ukraine
• 30:33
  Speaker 5: for the first time when he talks about this. Or, like,
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: Googled Putin for the first time. I didn't know this
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: guy was such a dick. Some people say he was KGB. Yeah,
• 30:41
  Speaker 5: you know, when I first, like, my views on this
• 30:43
  Speaker 5: have been evolving throughout the day. It's obviously a massive
• 30:45
  Speaker 5: tonal shift.
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: How many weeks ago was it? Months ago where we
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: just had the Oval meeting with Zelensky where Trump and
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: Vance were screaming at him?
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, basically beat him up.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: Four months ago?
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: Punched him in the Oval.
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: Now it's like, well, I don't know. Thank you. Yeah.
• 31:00
  Speaker 5: It's not totally clear to me how much of a
• 31:02
  Speaker 5: substantive shift it is quite yet. So like the messaging
• 31:05
  Speaker 5: has gone from, as you said, it's gone from like
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: I'll end the war in 24 hours to I'll dick
• 31:09
  Speaker 5: around for six months and then solve it in 50 days.
• 31:12
  Speaker 5: But if you think back to the 2022 messaging, like Remember,
• 31:15
  Speaker 5: right after the full-scale invasion, he said he wouldn't call
• 31:18
  Speaker 5: it illegal. And he called Putin genius and called it savvy.
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: Remember that?
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: Oh, my God. I forgot about that.
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: It's like shocking when you think about it. And then
• 31:26
  Speaker 5: the campaign messaging on this was kind of predicated on
• 31:28
  Speaker 5: accusing Biden of starting World War III, especially when the
• 31:33
  Speaker 5: Biden administration let Ukraine hit targets with our long-range missile
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: systems that were inside Russia. But then in February, there's
• 31:39
  Speaker 5: that Oval Office meeting you're talking about. There was that
• 31:42
  Speaker 5: weird moment where he said, Putin went through hell with me.
• 31:44
  Speaker 3: Remember that? Talking about the Mueller probe? Yeah.
• 31:47
  Speaker 5: And so like the tone today, it's like, it seems
• 31:49
  Speaker 5: like Putin has just humiliated him and humiliated him and
• 31:52
  Speaker 5: the first lady's giving him shit about it.
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: That was part of it. Yeah. I don't think that
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: was in the clip that we just played, but he's like, yeah.
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: And I get off the phone with Putin and I
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: go home and I say, it was a nice call.
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: And then Melania is like, well, he just bombed another city.
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: Good for Melania.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 32:07
  Speaker 3: Good on you, Melania.
• 32:08
  Speaker 5: But yeah, so like, so in the last few weeks,
• 32:10
  Speaker 5: there was this weird announcement from the Pentagon where they said,
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: weapon shipments to Ukraine were paused. And then Trump reversed
• 32:16
  Speaker 5: the pause. And now he's saying like, okay, we're going
• 32:20
  Speaker 5: to send more weapons. We're going to do it through NATO.
• 32:22
  Speaker 5: And also after 50 days, I'll put in 100% secondary
• 32:25
  Speaker 5: sanctions on these other countries that do business with Russia.
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: But none of this has happened yet.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: So we'll see.
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: Like one expert I talked to today said, he thinks
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: this is basically the Europeans sending Ukraine weapon systems and
• 32:37
  Speaker 5: will agree to backfill them by selling them the stuff
• 32:40
  Speaker 5: back to the euros. Now that's not nothing because like,
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: The Europeans can get Ukraine stuff fast and they probably
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: wouldn't send the high-end systems like the Patriot missile defense
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: batteries if they didn't have a guarantee that they would
• 32:50
  Speaker 5: get replaced because it's like very long lead times.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 32:53
  Speaker 5: And the head of NATO, Mark Rutte, who's in the
• 32:55
  Speaker 5: meeting with Biden said, we're talking about air defense, missiles,
• 32:57
  Speaker 5: and ammunition. So it does sound like it's not just
• 33:00
  Speaker 5: defensive capabilities, but it's just like, I'll believe it when
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: I see it. And also the guy coordinating it is
• 33:06
  Speaker 5: Matt Whitaker.
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: Remember him?
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. Yeah. Wasn't he in a... Was he
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: an attorney general at one point? He was the acting
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: attorney general. Right, yeah, I know.
• 33:17
  Speaker 5: Acting attorney general from November 2018 to February 2019, who
• 33:21
  Speaker 5: was famous because he was on the board of a
• 33:24
  Speaker 5: company that sold the Big Dick Toilet.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: The Big Dick Toilet guy.
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: It was a masculine toilet.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: Matt Whitaker, Big Dick Toilet.
• 33:31
  Speaker 5: So if you were a well-endowed man and traditional toilets
• 33:34
  Speaker 5: just didn't have the space between seat to water that
• 33:37
  Speaker 5: you needed to stay dry... He had you covered. Although
• 33:41
  Speaker 5: I think the company was.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: Who among us has not needed a big dick toilet?
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: Listen, yeah.
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: I think the company was ultimately shut down by the
• 33:49
  Speaker 5: FTC because it was a scam.
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: Oh, surprise. That's crazy. That's crazy. Well, hopefully we're selling
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: just weapons and not the big dick toilets to... I mean,
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: maybe they need them. I kind of feel like Trump was...
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: like reverse polarized against Putin or he was like, he
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: was negatively polarized against Putin because of the Mueller probe. Right.
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: And so it was like, they're coming after me for Putin.
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: So now I'm going to defend Putin. Right. Because I
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: like Putin.
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: And also he's a tough guy and he loves dictators.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: So like Trump loves strong men, loves authoritarians and he's
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: mad at the Democrats because he thinks they invented a
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: Russia hoax, even though Russia was trying to help him win.
• 34:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: And, um, So, so, and then over the years, now
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: that he's, now that he's talking to this war, he's like, oh,
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: this guy's kind of a dick.
• 34:33
  Speaker 5: This guy sucks.
• 34:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: He didn't, he didn't fool me. He fooled Obama and
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: he fooled Bush and he fooled all the other ones,
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: but he hasn't fooled me. He's kind of a dick.
• 34:39
  Speaker 5: It is weird strategically for Putin. Cause like he would
• 34:41
  Speaker 5: get off the phone with Trump. They called, they talked
• 34:43
  Speaker 5: on like July 3rd and then July 4th, he launches
• 34:46
  Speaker 5: the most missiles and drones he's ever launched at Ukraine.
• 34:49
  Speaker 5: And they're, they're not hitting military targets. They're just hitting
• 34:52
  Speaker 5: high rise buildings in like Kiev.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: And for a you were relatively safe.
• 34:58
  Speaker 5: Compared to the east of the country because of the
• 35:00
  Speaker 5: Patriot systems, but they're just running out of interceptor missiles.
• 35:03
  Speaker 5: And Russia can also sort of overwhelm them if they
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: fire enough of these shitty Iranian drones in addition to
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: ballistic missiles. So like tons of innocent people are getting killed.
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's possible that their aging authoritarian also acts
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: on impulse and is not necessarily playing 3D chess.
• 35:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that's well said and is a prick. And ultimately
• 35:23
  Speaker 5: his kind of, his mission is not just taking territory
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: in Ukraine. It's kind of like undercutting the entire American
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: system and NATO and our values and the idea that
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: democracy is better.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: And I think that there is part of Trump that
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: doesn't like to see a lot of war, not necessarily
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: because he believes in peace and he cares about people
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: all over the world, but because he knows that war
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: is messy and that it looks bad.
• 35:45
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: This is like how I think this is how he
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: feels about Gaza and and how he felt about Iran.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: Anything I can do to just get wars over, to
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: just get all the mess off the screens because people
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: don't like war, I think he probably thinks like that.
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: I agree with that.
• 35:57
  Speaker 5: His latest thing is trying to take credit for all
• 36:00
  Speaker 5: these ceasefire deals and peace agreements and say he deserves a.
• 36:03
  Speaker 3: Nobel Peace Prize.
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: Dying for that peace prize.
• 36:05
  Speaker 5: Yeah, there was an agreement between Congo and Rwanda that
• 36:08
  Speaker 5: has a ceasefire and a conflict there, but the devil's
• 36:11
  Speaker 5: in the details. When you look at the substance of
• 36:13
  Speaker 5: the deal, it's basically just another mineral extraction deal for
• 36:16
  Speaker 5: the U.S.
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: For these rare earths.
• 36:17
  Speaker 5: And the main militant group, the M23, was not a
• 36:21
  Speaker 5: party to it and have not said they would agree
• 36:22
  Speaker 5: to it. So it's like when you dig one inch
• 36:25
  Speaker 5: below the surface, it's all bullshit. But I agree with you.
• 36:28
  Speaker 5: I do think there's a part of him that genuinely
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: knows politically.
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: War is bad.
• 36:33
  Speaker 2: Yes, exactly.
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: He's trying to pull U.S. troops back from abroad, whether
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: it's Europe or Syria or whatever.
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: He knows it's bad politics. Can I just say, when
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: I was listening to you guys on Pod Save the
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: World the other week, and I hadn't heard the clip
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: of when B.B., Tells Trump that he is nominating him
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: for the Nobel Peace Prize and then Trump says that
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: means so much especially coming from you I was listening
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: in public, and I laughed so hard, people were looking
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: at me.
• 37:00
  Speaker 5: It's like, this man.
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: Just bombed Iran.
• 37:05
  Speaker 5: Indicted by the ICC, indicted war criminal, has killed at
• 37:10
  Speaker 5: least 55,000 people.
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: I don't know why I'm laughing, but it's just like.
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: No, it's just so absurd.
• 37:14
  Speaker 5: You literally can't believe it. And by the way, the
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: Nobel Committee.
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: It's like five academics.
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, five random Norwegians. They're not like political actors. Which,
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: by the way, crazy way to decide a peace prize anyway,
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: but like that's neither here nor there.
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: It's true, yeah.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's wild.
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: Pod Save America, brought to you by Armra. Why are
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• 39:27
  Speaker 2: Speaking of Europe, let's talk about Trump's on-again offer. trade war.
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: On Saturday, he announced that Europe and Mexico will face
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: 30% tariffs starting August 1. The Europeans are like, we
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: were negotiating. I don't know what the hell happened. This
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: is after a week where Trump just sent a bunch
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: of letters to different countries informing them of the tax
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: rate we'll be imposing on ourselves when buying their products,
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: including a 50% tariff on Brazil. That's because Trump is
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: mad at them for putting fellow coup attempter Jair Bolsonaro
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: on trial. Whether or not Trump actually goes through with
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: all of this, always a mystery. The tariffs we're currently
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: paying are already higher than they've been in 100 years.
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: Here's what Trump said in the Oval Office on Monday
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: about all of this.
• 40:08
  Speaker 4: You know, I watched a show this morning. They were
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: talking about, well, when's he going to make the deal?
• 40:11
  Speaker 4: The deals are already made. The letters are the deals.
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: The deals are made. There are no deals to make.
• 40:16
  Speaker 4: They would like to do a different kind of a deal.
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: And we're always open to talk. We are open to talk,
• 40:22
  Speaker 4: including to Europe.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: The letters are the deals, but we're also willing to
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: do more deals if they're willing to talk, unless we're not,
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: because the letters are deals, but they're not deals. They're letters.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: Is that Does that make sense to you?
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: Yes. Schrodinger's deal. It's just such nonsense.
• 40:40
  Speaker 5: I mean, nice that people just followed up. Like, sir,
• 40:42
  Speaker 5: what the fuck were you talking about just then?
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: It's such a ridiculous fucking thing that we all have
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: to pretend is serious or that just because this is
• 40:50
  Speaker 2: the president of the United States. But it's like he's
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: sending these letters that are basically truth social posts on
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: White House letterhead to countries informing them that, we will
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: be levying a tax again on ourselves for all of
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: their products. And he's just, and he's just, and then
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: there's no rhyme or reason. What's his face? Kevin Hassett,
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: his economic advisor was on TV and John Carl at
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: ABC was asking him, he's like, so why is he
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: doing all this? I thought there were going to be deals.
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: And he's like, well, look, he thinks this is, you know,
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: this is good for the United States and United States
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: has been ripped off. And And this is how he
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: has the authority to do this. It's because of a,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: it's a national security emergency that we're being ripped off
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: and we need to have these supply chains in the
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: United States. And then John's like, okay, well then what
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: about Brazil? Because he said that was just because of
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: Bolsonaro and the trial. And he's like, like I said,
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: like most countries, most countries, it's overall, it's about fairness.
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: And he's like, but that has nothing to do with anything.
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: Just to hammer home your point about the seriousness of
• 41:51
  Speaker 5: these letters, like the one to the president of Bosnia, Herzegovina,
• 41:55
  Speaker 5: misgendered the president. Um, so not a good start. Um,
• 41:59
  Speaker 5: but yeah, I think I'm glad you brought up the
• 42:00
  Speaker 5: Brazil example. Cause that one to me, I think kind
• 42:02
  Speaker 5: of like epitomizes the absurdity of the whole process because
• 42:06
  Speaker 5: the initial liberation day tariffs were just based on the
• 42:08
  Speaker 5: U S trade deficit with all these countries, right? Like
• 42:10
  Speaker 5: Trump thinks trade deficits are bad. If we buy more
• 42:14
  Speaker 5: stuff from a country than we sell to them, we're
• 42:16
  Speaker 5: getting ripped off and we're mad about that. And we're angry,
• 42:18
  Speaker 5: but the United States hasn't had a trade deficit with
• 42:20
  Speaker 5: Brazil since 2007. We did the current, the USTR, the
• 42:24
  Speaker 5: United States Trade Representative website, right now, today, says we
• 42:27
  Speaker 5: did $ 92 billion in trade with Brazil in 2024, that
• 42:30
  Speaker 5: the US trade surplus with Brazil is $ 7. 4 billion. But
• 42:34
  Speaker 5: like you said, we're going to slap a 50% tariff
• 42:37
  Speaker 5: on Brazil because the former right-wing president is being prosecuted
• 42:41
  Speaker 5: for trying to overthrow the current democratically elected government?
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: We have a free trade deal passed by Congress in
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: place with South Korea. Free trade. That means no tariffs,
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: no tax on imports, exports, going either way. And he's
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: slapping a tariff on South Korea. Why? We don't know.
• 43:00
  Speaker 5: And just imagine you're them.
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: You're like, what do I do with this? What do
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: we do? What do we do?
• 43:03
  Speaker 5: And again, you justify these tariffs by claiming under this law, AIPA,
• 43:07
  Speaker 5: that there is a national security emergency that necessitates this tariff.
• 43:12
  Speaker 5: So the national security emergency in the case of Brazil
• 43:15
  Speaker 5: is that we don't like how Brazilian courts are prosecuting
• 43:17
  Speaker 5: a case.
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: So... Here's my question. We are heading towards a situation
• 43:22
  Speaker 2: where we might not have like liberation day level tariffs,
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: but pretty close in most of these countries now, if
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: we're doing 50% in Brazil and 30% in the EU
• 43:33
  Speaker 2: and all this kind of shit. So like the, the
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: markets are pretty calm. What do you think's going on there?
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 43:40
  Speaker 5: They're just like ripping lines of taco. Like they just,
• 43:42
  Speaker 5: they don't think like, I think they, they think Trump
• 43:45
  Speaker 5: likes the leverage of tariffs. I think he likes getting
• 43:49
  Speaker 5: to announce stuff. I think he likes looking like he's
• 43:52
  Speaker 5: taking action, but they don't think he's really going to
• 43:54
  Speaker 5: do it. I think the economic and political damage is
• 43:57
  Speaker 5: longer term. So just one more quick thing on the
• 44:01
  Speaker 5: Brazil piece. The thing we all agree on in Washington
• 44:04
  Speaker 5: is that China is the real threat. So one thing
• 44:07
  Speaker 5: China buys from us in huge numbers is soybeans. We're
• 44:10
  Speaker 5: talking like $ 15, $ 17 billion per year. But after the
• 44:14
  Speaker 5: 2018 US-China trade war, China started looking to Brazil for soybeans.
• 44:17
  Speaker 5: Since then, that relationship has only increased. So in practice,
• 44:20
  Speaker 5: our chair of policy has hurt farmers in the US
• 44:24
  Speaker 5: while driving China closer to the biggest country in South America.
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: What are we doing? What is the point of this?
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: It really is, he likes having the power. Like when
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: he was saying that line in April and May about like,
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: I can charge what I want, we're the world's store.
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: Like we set the prices. He likes the idea that
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: he is at least in his mind, running the world.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: And that United States, because we're the biggest economy in
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: the world, we have leverage over these other countries and
• 44:52
  Speaker 2: can treat them however we want. Though he's still not
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: understanding that, again, we are paying these taxes. And American
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: companies are either eating the tariffs or passing them on
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: for higher prices for consumers. And because this hasn't hit yet,
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: because the tariffs, the cost of the tariffs really haven't
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: factored into the economic numbers that we're getting just yet,
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: But they will.
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: They will eventually.
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: Especially if he goes through with this August 1st deadline,
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: which who knows. And then, you know, then what he's
• 45:25
  Speaker 2: going to be left with is, of course, saying this
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: has nothing to do with the tariffs. It's Jerome Powell's fault.
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: He should be cutting interest rates.
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: Exactly. Exactly.
• 45:34
  Speaker 5: And I think the markets are hoping that'll happen. They
• 45:36
  Speaker 5: don't want Jerome Powell fired, but they do want a
• 45:37
  Speaker 5: rate cut. And the kind of signal to the world
• 45:40
  Speaker 5: is the way you get a deal is you wait
• 45:43
  Speaker 5: until Eric Trump visits. And then you announce a $ 1. 5
• 45:46
  Speaker 5: billion luxury golf and residential development project like Vietnam did.
• 45:52
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 45:52
  Speaker 5: And then things work out.
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: It definitely, I mean, there's the personal corruption. There's the,
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: I want them to change a policy on X, Y,
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: or Z. He's like pissed at the EU over some
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: of their digital laws. It's a total shakedown and he
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: just wants to be in control. But at some point,
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: if he keeps backing off the threats, these countries are
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: going to be like, why would I negotiate? Who the
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: fuck cares? This guy just keeps backing off. So it's like,
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: it's not even a good negotiating stance from Donald Trump's perspective.
• 46:20
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 46:20
  Speaker 5: And a lot of these countries are better positioned now
• 46:23
  Speaker 5: to respond than they were in the first Trump term. Like,
• 46:26
  Speaker 5: for example, in 2024, the EU put in place a
• 46:30
  Speaker 5: mechanism that would allow them to respond to like coercive
• 46:34
  Speaker 5: economic behavior and And they did this because of Trump's
• 46:37
  Speaker 5: tariffs and because of shit that China was pulling on
• 46:39
  Speaker 5: various countries. Like if you like, if you like recognize
• 46:43
  Speaker 5: the existence of Taiwan, for example, and you're like Lithuania,
• 46:46
  Speaker 5: like a tiny little country, they'll just hammer you. So
• 46:48
  Speaker 5: now they have this way of kind of end running
• 46:50
  Speaker 5: the WTO process to leverage their own kind of retaliatory
• 46:55
  Speaker 5: economic policies if we fuck with them. And so like,
• 46:59
  Speaker 5: it's kind of a ticking time bomb.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, we'll see what happens August 1st. So in
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: the midst of Trump's worst news cycle, in recent memory.
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: Guess who popped his head up to give Fox News
• 47:09
  Speaker 2: something else to talk about?
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: Elmo.
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: That also is true. Google it. Yeah, someone hacked Elmo's account.
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: It's really, it's troubling.
• 47:18
  Speaker 3: Wild.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: No, no, it's Joe Biden, a man who always has
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: the most exquisite timing. The former president decided that now
• 47:26
  Speaker 2: was the perfect time to finally address Republicans' investigation into
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: his administration's use of the auto pen, so he granted
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: a rare interview with the New York Times. where he
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: said that he, quote, made every decision, end quote, about
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: his widespread pardons and clemency, and that the only reason
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: the auto pen was used to execute them was because, quote,
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: there was a lot of them, which is standard practice
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: at the White House when signing hundreds of documents. The
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: interview was part of a larger Times investigation into Biden's
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: use of the auto pen, which also found that Biden
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: approved clemency actions for groups of people rather than individuals,
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: another common White House practice. What do you think of
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: Biden's decision to do the interview with, And more importantly,
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: the substance of what he said about the pardons and
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: the auto pen.
• 48:08
  Speaker 5: I'm not ready to not be mad about the timing
• 48:11
  Speaker 5: quite yet. OK, reading the story, it seemed like someone
• 48:15
  Speaker 5: leaked the Times a bunch of emails, right, that they
• 48:18
  Speaker 5: somehow got about the decision making process within the Biden
• 48:20
  Speaker 5: White House. And they probably went to the Biden team
• 48:23
  Speaker 5: and was like, we're going to run something on this
• 48:25
  Speaker 5: with or without your comment. And so Joe Biden jumped
• 48:28
  Speaker 5: on the phone with them.
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: But like, and, and Neera had testified, Neera Tanden testified
• 48:33
  Speaker 2: about auto pen.
• 48:33
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: So there was, it was out in, it was, that
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: was like two weeks ago. I can't remember. But anyway, it's,
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: it's been, it's been out there, right? Like the auto
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: pen stuff. So the, the Biden's folks who don't like
• 48:44
  Speaker 2: him to do any interviews with anyone just decided, okay,
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: I guess you can jump in on this.
• 48:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 48:49
  Speaker 5: Does no one just say, Hey, you know what guys,
• 48:52
  Speaker 5: it seems like Trump's having the worst week or two
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: of his political career since January 6th, at least. Maybe
• 48:58
  Speaker 5: we just punt on this or we tell the Times,
• 49:00
  Speaker 5: we'll take care of you down the road. Like the
• 49:03
  Speaker 5: timing was so insanely fucking unhelpful.
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: So frustrating.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: It's like, do you see in the Tyler Pager's new
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: book and Josh Dossi about the 2024 election? They called
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: Biden for an interview because they got his, like Tyler
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: got a hold of his cell and then they they
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: called him and got him to talk a little bit.
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: And then, um, then Biden's staff was so mad that
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: they changed his cell number. They called him. He was like,
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: Biden's like, uh, I'm getting on a plane.
• 49:30
  Speaker 5: He's like, Jill, yell, yell choo-choo.
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: Do the whistle noise. Yeah, it was crazy.
• 49:35
  Speaker 5: It was so funny that they changed his number and
• 49:37
  Speaker 5: they screamed these reporters.
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: So who knows how the decision was made?
• 49:40
  Speaker 4: Okay. Sorry.
• 49:41
  Speaker 5: I will get back to the substance. I mean, like
• 49:44
  Speaker 5: there's a couple of different buckets of issues. Like we've
• 49:45
  Speaker 5: expressed frustration on past episodes about the Biden's pardons of
• 49:49
  Speaker 5: his own family and the messages sent and how it
• 49:52
  Speaker 5: made Democrats look like hypocrites and how they were like
• 49:55
  Speaker 5: kind of some, you know, perceived enemies of Trump who
• 49:59
  Speaker 5: got pardons, but not others. And it seemed unfair. But
• 50:02
  Speaker 5: that's kind of like a separate bucket, right? Like we
• 50:04
  Speaker 5: don't need to revisit that unless you want to. But
• 50:07
  Speaker 5: the allegation here the Republicans are making is that he
• 50:11
  Speaker 5: was essentially brain dead and that he doesn't know who
• 50:13
  Speaker 5: he pardoned and that his rogue staff was really running
• 50:16
  Speaker 5: the country. And I just think that's ridiculous.
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: Well, and let's be clear of the pardons that they
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: care about, right? The pardons they care about is Hunter,
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: Liz Cheney, the preemptive pardons for the January 6th people.
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: Mark Milley, Fauci.
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they're pissed about those because they want to go
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: after those people. Yes.
• 50:30
  Speaker 3: And so.
• 50:32
  Speaker 5: it's clearly an effort to undo like clemency decisions about
• 50:35
  Speaker 5: Trump's political enemies. Frankly, the fact that Republicans are doing
• 50:39
  Speaker 5: this kind of validates what Joe Biden did in the
• 50:41
  Speaker 5: first place.
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 50:42
  Speaker 5: But you know, you're also seeing Republicans like try to
• 50:45
  Speaker 5: make a big deal out of this idea that Biden
• 50:47
  Speaker 5: signed off on categories of people to pardon and not
• 50:50
  Speaker 5: every individual.
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: And that is dumb.
• 50:53
  Speaker 5: Um, I've not personally talked to someone who handled the
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: pardon process, but like, I think it's pretty standard to
• 50:57
  Speaker 5: say I'm reducing the sentences of nonviolent and marijuana offenders
• 51:02
  Speaker 5: through this time period, you're not going to have Joe
• 51:04
  Speaker 5: Biden read through a list of names of people he's
• 51:07
  Speaker 5: never heard of before and like check them off.
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, nor sign every single document for all those. That
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: is a perfect case for an auto pen.
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 51:16
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: When you have like a thousand, let's say, low-level offenders
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: that you're pardoning. Yeah, of course. Yes.
• 51:22
  Speaker 5: Now, the kicker on the New York Times story was
• 51:24
  Speaker 5: that Hunter's pardon was the only one that Joe Biden
• 51:27
  Speaker 5: signed with his own hand during that kind of period.
• 51:30
  Speaker 5: That was not the best detail, I guess, would be
• 51:35
  Speaker 5: my take.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: Well, I'll make sure that one you do by hand,
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: for sure.
• 51:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: And take care of it. That's a tough one.
• 51:40
  Speaker 5: I do hope, like, are reporters digging into how often
• 51:43
  Speaker 5: and in, like, kind of what use cases Trump uses
• 51:45
  Speaker 5: the auto pen?
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: It's been reported that he has used it, like, all
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: the time. Yeah. Not like, but like, as every single
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: president does use an auto pen. It's such a weird
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: scandal to, like, those of us who've been in government, like,
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: forget it even about before we got to the white house,
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: like in the Senate office with Obama, there was an
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: auto pen. There was every, like they all use auto pens.
• 52:05
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: There's a ton of shit to sign. There's constituent mail.
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: There's everything like no politician has the time to fucking
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: sit there and sign everything. Especially if you're the president
• 52:15
  Speaker 2: of the United States.
• 52:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: It's absurd. It's not like 1953.
• 52:18
  Speaker 5: We're not like banks aren't comparing signature records on your checks. Like,
• 52:24
  Speaker 5: I draw a fucking circle on the receipt thing.
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. One squiggly line is Jon Favreau. Yeah. That's all
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: I got.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: It's so stupid.
• 52:31
  Speaker 5: And listeners will probably be like, okay, you're belittling. This
• 52:33
  Speaker 5: is the presidency we're talking about. Again, like you're doing
• 52:36
  Speaker 5: like millions of executive orders and all these, like Trump,
• 52:40
  Speaker 5: the difference between Trump, I guess, and previous presidents is
• 52:41
  Speaker 5: that he views every executive order or document he signs
• 52:44
  Speaker 5: as a press event. And so he does it in
• 52:46
  Speaker 5: front of the cameras.
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: This time around.
• 52:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: This time around, but not last time.
• 52:49
  Speaker 4: Right.
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• 54:13
  Speaker 2: All right, let's end on the latest news on deportations.
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: On Saturday, Ron DeSantis finally allowed elected officials to inspect
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: the new Florida detention center that he and Trump call
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: Alligator Alcatraz. But this was only after the lawmakers sued
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: DeSantis for blocking access. The tour was heavily restricted. They
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: weren't allowed to speak with detainees or examine any occupied
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: cells up close. But the lawmakers described what they saw as, quote, vile, inhumane, gross,
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: and likened it to an internment camp. Democratic Congressman Maxwell
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: Frost said he saw 32 people per cage and heard
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: people yelling, help me, help me. He heard someone else yell,
• 54:50
  Speaker 2: I'm a U.S. citizen. Sure enough, the Miami Herald reported
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: that over 250 people being held at the facility, have
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: no criminal record. There's about 900 people right now, 250
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: with no criminal record. I think there was another 250
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: to 300 who have, who their criminal record is like
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: traffic violations, lower level crimes, and then a third that are,
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: who the Department of Homeland Security and ICE and Florida
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: officials say they're going after, the worst of the worst
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: people with violent crimes. So one lawyer said her client
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: is a dreamer, with legal status, could not believe when
• 55:26
  Speaker 2: she heard the news that her client was an alligator
• 55:30
  Speaker 2: Alcatraz because she's like, this person is a DACA recipient.
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: They have legal status, been here for years and years
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: and years. Shocked that they ended up there. Other lawyers
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: said they can't get access to their clients. And when
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: they call, they get like a runaround and no one
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: is like telling them how to talk to their clients.
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: Family members say their loved ones report power outages, sweltering
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: hot conditions, broken toilets, feces all over the place, worms
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: in the food, trouble getting medication, not being able to
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: take showers.
• 55:58
  Speaker 3: Awful.
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: I don't know. What has your reaction been to the
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: reports coming out of this place from now, elected officials, lawyers, journalists,
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: family members?
• 56:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, it is awful, but it's also not surprising.
• 56:09
  Speaker 5: I mean, I think they built alligator alcatraz in like
• 56:11
  Speaker 5: eight days.
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 56:12
  Speaker 5: And like you said, I mean, 250 people out of
• 56:14
  Speaker 5: 700 have no criminal conviction or charges. Like these are
• 56:17
  Speaker 5: not the worst of the worst. And like, look, Trump
• 56:20
  Speaker 5: was like, kind of goofing around when he talked about how, like,
• 56:24
  Speaker 5: you have to learn to run in a zigzag if
• 56:26
  Speaker 5: you escape from alligator alcatraz because alligators are going to
• 56:28
  Speaker 5: eat you. But, like, we are talking about, like, killing
• 56:31
  Speaker 5: people who did nothing wrong except for, like, maybe overstay
• 56:34
  Speaker 5: a visa or, you know, at worst are American citizens
• 56:36
  Speaker 5: who got wrongly swept up. I mean, it's just, this
• 56:39
  Speaker 5: is a facility.
• 56:40
  Speaker 3: It's not a facility.
• 56:41
  Speaker 5: It's tents and trailers. It's people in cages that look
• 56:45
  Speaker 5: like dog kennels. You go five days without showering. There's
• 56:49
  Speaker 5: toilets are overflowing. Like, It's in the Florida Everglades. Can
• 56:54
  Speaker 5: you imagine what it is like on July 14th? So hot, swampy,
• 56:59
  Speaker 5: like there's mosquitoes everywhere. It sounds like hell on earth.
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: I saw that, you know, our pal Jesse Waters and
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: the Five, they were like making fun of the complaints
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: about mosquitoes. They're like, oh no, mosquitoes are biting. Google this.
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: There's reporters, like local reporters, television reporters in Florida who've
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: been just near the facility, right? Like not even inside.
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: And they can't even speak in their live hits because
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: the mosquitoes are in their mouth. And then this reporter's
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: like- Torture. He's like, he's wearing this hood and this
• 57:31
  Speaker 2: heavy jacket. And he's like, you're probably wondering why I'm
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: wearing this heavy jacket and this hood in 90 degree
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: weather here. It's because I can't walk without getting just
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: eaten alive by mosquitoes. And that's just the mosquitoes. That's
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: not- And then there's the worms in the food and
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: the feces and the toilets that aren't working and the
• 57:48
  Speaker 2: showers that aren't working, the power outages. I mean, it
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: is fucking disgusting. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, she was one of
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: the lawmakers who went, she was like, look, there's another
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: immigration detention center in Miami-Dade that like the people being
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: held there can walk from building to building. They're like
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: allowed to go outside. There's like better meals. She's like,
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: it's not like this has, this is not like what
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: detention centers are supposed to be.
• 58:09
  Speaker 3: It doesn't need to be this way. And what happens
• 58:10
  Speaker 3: when there's a storm? or a hurricane.
• 58:13
  Speaker 5: You know, it's like, it's crazy. And like the lawyers
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: can't get in touch with these people. You're just getting
• 58:16
  Speaker 5: lost in this system that is like Kafka-esque by design.
• 58:20
  Speaker 5: And this is, you know, this is the ghost of
• 58:22
  Speaker 5: Christmas future. I mean, like Kristi Noem says she's in
• 58:24
  Speaker 5: touch with five Republican governors about building facilities like this.
• 58:28
  Speaker 5: This is what we should expect will be done with
• 58:30
  Speaker 5: the billions and billions of dollars in ICE funding that
• 58:32
  Speaker 5: was just passed by Congress. And by the way, I'm
• 58:35
  Speaker 5: not like seeing a lot of coverage of plans to
• 58:39
  Speaker 5: triple resources for the immigration court system or hire a
• 58:42
  Speaker 5: bunch of immigration judges to actually speed up the process.
• 58:45
  Speaker 5: It's just like the plan is to build the shittiest
• 58:48
  Speaker 5: prisons in the world, get a bunch of private prison
• 58:50
  Speaker 5: companies paid in the process, and then let people rot.
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: Well, and so here's what a lot of these immigration
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: lawyers are concerned about, and this is what they think
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: they're doing, which is make the conditions so horrible that
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: that they are forcing people who go there to agree
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: to self-deport or to give up their asylum claims because
• 59:09
  Speaker 2: you can like sign a document and say like, all right,
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: I'm out. And then that's how they just get people out.
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: So that's how they clear the backlog. Instead of actually
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: hiring more judges to hear these people's asylum claims, they're
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: just putting them in horrible conditions to force them out
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: of the country. Stephen Miller also like went on Fox
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: and encouraged other red states like Christmas to build their own. And,
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: of course, if you're a red state and you're like
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: some politicians like fucking the attorney general in Florida whose
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: brainchild this was, Uthmeyer, you get attention, right? Like you
• 59:38
  Speaker 2: do this. You become a star. It helps your political career.
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: And so, of course, other red states are going to
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: do this. And the other challenge now is this is
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: in a legal gray area because it is when ICE
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: and DHS are called for comment about this shit, they're like, well,
• 59:53
  Speaker 2: we're not running this. This is the state of Florida.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: And so ICE is like, oh, there's no federal oversight,
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: even though they're getting federal money from the, they're going
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: to be able to get reimbursed and get more federal
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: money from the bill. So they get federal money to
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: do this. But then the federal government and ICE gets
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: to say, we don't know. We don't know what's going
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: on there. And that's why some of these lawyers can't
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: even get access to their clients.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 5: I think this has kind of always been part of
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 5: kind of the big picture plan was to almost build
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 5: a parallel process.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 5: Just sort of outside of the traditional immigration structures and
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 5: laws and processes that demand accountability or have a little
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 5: bit of oversight and just do shit like this.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: There was also some deportation news here in California over
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: the weekend. On Friday, a federal judge in Los Angeles
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: temporarily blocked federal agents from using racial profiling to carry
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: out indiscriminate immigration arrests in California. The judge found that
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: a person's race, language, job, or location does not constitute, quote,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: reasonable suspicion and therefore violates the Fourth Amendment, which protects
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: people against unreasonable search and seizure. The judge also issued
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: a separate ruling that bars the federal government from restricting
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: attorney access at Los Angeles deportation facilities. Stephen Miller took
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: the news in stride by accusing the judge of waging
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: an insurrection against the United States. Real chill. But J.D.
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: Vance apparently thinks that Southern California is still safe enough
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: for a family vacation. He spent the weekend here at Disneyland,
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: where he was booed by other people at the park,
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: mostly over deportations. In fairness to J.D., though, he did
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: gift all of us this incredibly entertaining video of him
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 2: attempting to run. Do you think that was his first
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: time running? Did he have, did he have weights in
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: his shoes?
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 5: I can't wait till he issues some like 2000 word outrage,
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 5: self-righteous tweet about, I was going to check on my child.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: Like, Yeah, well, he could have got to the kid
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: faster if he didn't run like that.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 5: It's also, you know, I think our friend Peter Hamby
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 5: has long clocked the JD, just has a really weird
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 5: kind of walk motion. It's sort of like a hand
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 5: forward kind of.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: And also anytime the guy is out of a suit,
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: it's like, what is he, his, his, his fashion sense. Yeah.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: Very troubling.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 5: I think you, you said he dresses like he's going
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 5: to a club in 2008.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 3: But in like Orlando.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: That is exactly right. That is exactly right. He fucking sucks.
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 3: That guy is so annoying.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 5: He's such a hypocritical prick. Like, and yet, you know what,
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 5: like as a general matter, do I think it's, I
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 5: don't know. It'll probably just make him dig in further.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 3: I don't care.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: Let's make fun of him. He got booed at Disneyland.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: Newsom tweeted, like, oh, I hope you're enjoying your vacation.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: The families you're ripping apart aren't. And then, like, Stephen
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: Miller went in on Newsom and was like, the governor
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: of California thinks the only way you can staff Disneyland
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: is with mass migration. I was just like, what?
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 3: Talking about Mickey?
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: And then J.D. Vance responded to Newsom and just said, thanks.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 5: I mean, and the White House communications director said something
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 5: like really horrible and personal about Gavin Newsom.
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 4: Cool.
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 3: Shocking. But yeah, look, I don't know.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: He's such an asshole. I'm glad.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 5: First of all, shout out to Gavin's. We're talking to
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 5: him tomorrow for his podcast. I don't know if we're
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 5: supposed to announce that or not, but we just did.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 5: But I would say this to his face because I.
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 3: Really believe it.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 5: His team's social media presence and like aggressiveness and punching
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 5: has been very fun to watch the last six months
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 5: or so.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's been great. It's like they're really going after it.
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: And it's not like the sometimes cheesy, cringy DNC version.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: It's like they're doing some funny stuff.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's not corny. It's not– yeah, no, it's just fun.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: They're just taking shots.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: Also, Democrats have gotten better. I would say that the
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: Democrats' account has gotten better over the last couple of weeks.
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 5: Well, they're just taking a page from Trump's book, right?
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 5: They're being a little inflammatory. They're getting attention. They're picking fights,
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 5: like all the things it takes to go viral. I thought,
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 5: you know, Dan Pfeiffer's conversation– Dan Pfeiffer, Dan's conversation– with
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 5: Mark Cuban about all of this. I thought it was
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 5: really smart over the weekend.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: Very smart. Um, what do you make of the immigration
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: rulings we got and, uh, and Miller's response? Like it is,
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: you know, I took it as some good news, but
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 2: of course, you know, they're going to appeal it. So
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 2: who knows?
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 5: I mean, I just think what people like, well, we
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 5: live in LA and I think what people need to
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 5: understand about what this, what ICE is doing is just
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 5: terrorizing communities all across California, especially in Los Angeles. Like
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 5: the parks near my house are empty. because, you know,
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 5: there used to be lots of Latino families there and like,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 5: they're not, a lot of them were citizens. A lot
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 5: of them were, you know, I green cards, but now
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 5: people are just scared to go out in public because
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 5: there might be an ice raid.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 3: And I think.
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 5: Maybe this is popular with like 20% of the country,
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 5: but like normie Republicans even are saying, this is not
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 5: what I voted for.
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 3: Like Joe Rogan, Theo Vaughn.
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 5: Andrew Schultz are like, we voted to get criminals out
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 5: of the country, not people who have been here for
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 5: 20 years who are working really hard.
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 2: You, for fun, like to listen to debates that Alex
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 2: Jones has, moderates with Nick Fuentes. In my spare time,
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 2: yesterday on Sunday, beautiful day out, I sat outside and
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: I listened to Dasha Byrne's interview with Tom Homan on
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: the Playbook podcast.
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: That's mean to you. Why'd you do that?
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 4: I don't know.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 2: Because I was like, what is Tom Homan? And he's
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: such a fucking liar. His whole response to her about
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 2: all this was, there is no profiling. What happens is
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: we're going after the worst of the worst. We have
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: lists of people that we're going after. And if while
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: we're going after those people, we happen to see other
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 2: immigrants who are here without status, who are undocumented, of course,
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: we're going to scoop them up too. But we're not
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 2: intentionally going after people who aren't the worst of the worst.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: We're starting with the worst of the worst. And I'm like,
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: that is just like, It's not true. Like local officials
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: don't believe that's true. The courts don't believe that's true.
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 2: The videos that people are seeing with their own fucking
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 2: eyes don't believe that's true. When ICE officers are like, oh,
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 2: I got a lot today. I hit the number today.
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 2: Trump's really driving us. Stephen Miller's really driving us on
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 2: how to get these deportations. It's like, what the fuck
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: are you talking about, man?
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 5: This is entirely happening because Stephen Miller shouted at people
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 5: at ICE and told them they need to get rid
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 5: of more migrants. I don't understand it. Look, this is
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 5: Stephen Miller's project. It's the only thing he's passionate about.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 5: So I understand why the administration is doing it. Politically,
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 5: I actually think it's stupid. I don't think anyone really
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 5: wants this. I think Trump could be going to the
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 5: border saying, I closed it down. What a great success
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 5: I am. And then just solely methodically actually get out
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 5: criminals without collapsing industries and chasing people through fields at
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 5: farms in California. I'm going to racially profile for a second.
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 5: And I'm going to say that Tom Homan is a
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 5: thug who's like a wannabe like Tony Soprano community theater impersonator.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 3: Have you seen him?
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 5: Like whenever he goes to a, does a little press conference,
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 5: he walks out and he pops out his sleeve and
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 5: he starts twisting his fucking pinky ring.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 3: He's a big tough guy.
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: He is. And he, listening to him yesterday, I was like, oh,
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 2: he really believes, he like, he has internalized all of
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 2: this stuff.
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, they all believe it.
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: You know, he really thinks like, you don't know what
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: I've seen in my career and some of the violence
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: and whatever. It's like, I'm sure, I'm sure there are
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 2: some undocumented immigrants here, just like there are American citizens
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: who've committed horrible fucking crimes and should be held accountable. 100%.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 2: But like, that is not what we're all seeing on
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: these videos.
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 3: It just doesn't justify doing anything.
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 2: One last thing, wasn't sure where to put this, but
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: Trump also posted the following on Saturday morning, bright and early, quote,
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: because of the fact that Rosie O'Donnell is not in
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 2: the best interests of our great country, I am giving
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: serious consideration to taking away her citizenship. She is a
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 2: threat to humanity. And should remain in the wonderful country
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 2: of Ireland if they want her. Is that how citizenship works, Tommy?
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 2: You lose your citizenship if the president doesn't like you?
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: Imagine you're Rosie O'Donnell.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 5: In 2006, you pick a fight with Donald Trump on
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 5: The View. Now this guy is the president and he's like...
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 5: It's like that domino meme. You criticize his handling of
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 5: that year's Miss USA pageant and all of a sudden
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 5: this man's trying to strip your citizenship. Like, it It's
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 5: like there's something that's funny, but it's almost like.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: OG Trump, right?
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 5: Like this was his original kind of bit was like
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 5: picking fights with her and being just a prick. But
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 5: like it is fascism to just strip citizenship from people.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: It's funny and crazy, but underlying it is a very
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: dangerous project that they are engaged in. And, you know,
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: the announcement the other week that they are, I think
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 2: you and Lovett talked about it on the pod, kicking up.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: the denaturalization process. Now, denaturalization, even if you try to
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: denaturalize someone, you can only denaturalize someone who was an
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: immigrant and became a citizen here. This is like, oh,
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: this is an American citizen who was born here and
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 2: now he's just trying to denaturalize Rosie O'Donnell. And whether
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: he's joking or not, he's at least putting out there
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: that I'm the president and I get to decide who
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 2: is a citizen and who isn't.
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 5: And I think he called it a threat to humanity,
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 5: which means I'm going to kill you as far as
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 5: I can tell. I mean, also she moved to Ireland
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 5: in part because she has a non-binary child. And I
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 5: think as a completely justified concern about this administration's policies
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 5: and the way that they are not just trying to
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 5: target her child legally, but also constantly demagogue these kids.
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 3: In the cruelest way possible.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 5: Like the president of the United States is the meanest
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 5: bully in And he's like punches down at like kids,
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 5: like trans athletes in high school.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: And I don't think this is just a Trump thing.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 2: Like we know it's Stephen Miller. I think J.D. Like
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: this project where the federal government gets to define who
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: is an American and who isn't, right? Like for a
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 2: long time, Trumpy people and Republicans have tried to say like, oh,
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 2: we're patriotic, you're not, whatever. But this project, which is
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 2: actually like we get to decide who's a citizen and
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 2: who should stay and who should leave.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: So this was sort of went unnoticed, but J.D. Vance,
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 2: he gave a speech at the Claremont Institute on July
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: 5th out here, right? Very conservative think tank.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 3: Super right wing, yeah.
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: And in that speech, and I guess because it was
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: like a day after July 4th, this was on his mind,
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: he said, and I saw this at Talking Points Memo
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: reported on this. He said, identifying America just with agreeing
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 2: with the principles, let's say, of the Declaration of Independence,
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 2: that's a definition that would include hundreds of millions of
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 2: maybe billions of foreign citizens who agree with the principles
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: of the Declaration. But conceiving American citizenship purely as an
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: idea would reject a lot of people that the ADL,
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: the Anti-Defamation League, would label as domestic extremists, even though
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: those very Americans had their ancestors fight in the Civil War.
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: So this is J.D. Vance now saying the idea that
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 2: we're all created equal, everyone's endowed by their creator with
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 2: certain inalienable rights, that America is an idea, and he
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 2: alluded to this in his convention speech too, the whole
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: America is an idea and its principles and everyone who
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: wants to believe in American ideals has a chance to
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 2: become a citizen, they don't like this. And you're seeing
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: this a lot more now, that they're like, oh, the
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 2: Declaration of Independence and the whole thing that we're all
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 2: created equal, this is not what America is supposed to be.
• 1:11:03
  Speaker 2: America is blood and soil and your ancestors and just
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: because your relatives are We're Confederates and stuff like that. Like,
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 2: just because they didn't believe in equality, that doesn't mean
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 2: that they don't have a right to this land. I mean,
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 2: it's an extremely dangerous idea that has been circulating on
• 1:11:20
  Speaker 2: the far, far right for a while now and now
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: is being given voice by the vice president of the
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: United States, the president who's threatening to fucking revoke Rosie
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 2: O'Donnell's citizenship, and Stephen Miller, who's been doing this project
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 2: his whole life.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 5: And they're all into this, like, goofball Curtis Yarden who
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 5: believes we need to return to a monarchy.
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 3: Because that'll end well.
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 5: I mean, they've been doing this kind of revisionist history
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 5: project for a while. I mean, remember after the 1619
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 5: project came out from New York Times, they lost their
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 5: minds and they created this thing called the 1776 Commission,
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 5: which put forward a more patriotic view of history, America's founding.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 5: And it is North Korea shit. Every government, every country
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 5: tells its own story. I don't mean to overstate it,
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 5: but You know, blood and soil nationalism is a dangerous,
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 5: dangerous game.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 2: And it is the center of the authoritarian project, right,
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: that they have in this country. And then other countries too,
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: which is like, you know, there's racism, there's xenophobia, there's sexism,
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 2: there's all of it. But at the core, it's if
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: you're on our team and you're loyal to us, you
• 1:12:27
  Speaker 2: can stay. If you're not, if you challenge us, you
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 2: have to go.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 3: And also if you look like us, you're welcome. And
• 1:12:33
  Speaker 3: if you don't, you got to leave.
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 5: Even if you have legal status, I mean, look at
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 5: all the TPS designations, like, you know, we're sending people
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 5: from Haiti back to their country and saying it's safe,
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 5: but saying it's unsafe for white farmers in South Africa.
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 5: So they're welcome to this country as refugees.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: So keep running JD Vance.
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 3: He's the worst.
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 2: He's the worst. There's a new, new poll out today.
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 2: They did a Republican primary poll for 2028 echelon did.
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 2: And he's a, He's running away with it right now. Way,
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 2: way out there from Ron DeSantis. That's all name ID.
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 2: Name ID. But, like, crush Ron DeSantis.
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 3: What if Don Jr. will take him on?
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 5: Or Eric went to the FT and, like, floated that
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 5: he thought he might run for president someday or his
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 5: family is another political brother.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 2: Good for you, Eric. Good for you. Best of luck.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: All right. One quick note before we go. Last week,
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: Vote Save America launched a brand new pilot program to
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: recruit candidates in Arizona, North Carolina, and Texas. We're talking
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 2: school board, city council, state legislature. These are local races.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 2: First of all, a lot of them, there's not a
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: Democratic candidate. And so, you know, you can't win if
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 2: you don't run. So we need to fill those slots
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 2: with Democratic candidates. And this is the way to win
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 2: local and state races to, like, build long-term Democratic power,
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: especially in these purple states. And we're kicking things. First
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: of all, we have been overwhelmed with the response.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 3: It's amazing.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: Like, you and I, we never thought, like, our team
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: at Vote Save America, you know, conceived of this, and
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 2: they've done such a great job. But I didn't think
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: the response would be this great.
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 3: It's been wild. It's extraordinary.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 5: And what it tells you, there's a lot of amazing
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 5: people who listen to this show who have just done
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 5: a lot and gotten really politically engaged over the years
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 5: and are excited to take that next step. And thank
• 1:14:10
  Speaker 5: you for considering that. There's room for more. There's room
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 5: for a lot more.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: Way more.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 5: We need to run a Democrat in every race at
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 5: every level because that's how you build power at the
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 5: local level. And that's how you build a bench for
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 5: the party for the long term and kind of groom
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 5: the next generation of leaders.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 2: And VSA is doing a live call this Wednesday, July 16th,
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: to sort of kick things off. And I guess you're joining, right?
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 3: I'll be there. I can't wait.
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: Perfect. So if you've even thought about running, or even
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 2: if you haven't, but now you're interested, this is where
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 2: to start. Sign up for the kickoff call and learn
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: more at votesaveamerica.com slash run. Paid for by Vote Save America.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: You can learn more at votesaveamerica.com. And this ad has
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 2: not been authorized by any candidate or candidates committee. All right,
• 1:14:51
  Speaker 2: that is our show for today. Dan's back from vacation,
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: and he and I will be back on your feet
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: on Friday. See you then. If you want to listen
• 1:15:00
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• 1:15:15
  Speaker 2: episode and everything we do here at Crooked. Pod Save
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 2: America is a Crooked Media production. Our producers are David Toledo,
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: Emma Illich-Frank, and Saul Rubin. Our associate producer is Farah Safari.
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• 1:15:32
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