Latest / Love Matters With Leeza Mangaldas / Does living-in deepen or dampen a couple’s love? Ft. Ashlesha Savant & Sandeep Baswana

Transcript

Does living-in deepen or dampen a couple’s love? Ft. Ashlesha Savant & Sandeep Baswana · Love Matters With Leeza Mangaldas

0:03
We just did not promise each other our tomorrow's because we don't know what's going
0:07
to happen tomorrow. We both are very spiritual people, so we just don't
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want to We don't know what's going to happen tomorrow. But we have together
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now, so in a way, we never found time to just book a
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place and get married. When it comes to a couple living together without being
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married, India has seen a lot of change. What used to be a
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taboo is now well maybe not so shocking anymore. So what are the benefits
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to living together without getting married first and how do society's attitudes affect couples who
0:41
go this route. Hi, I'm Eveline Sharma and you're listening to Love Matters,
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a podcast about relationship issues that matter to you and me. Today,
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we have two great guests, actress Shlesha Savant and her partner, actors son
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Deep Basbana. Back in two thousand and two, they met and fell in
1:07
love on the set of a TV show. Instead of getting married, they
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decided on a live in relationship. Now they've been living in for more than
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fifteen years, something that's gaining acceptance in India, but still isn't commonplace.
1:21
Welcome to the show, Ashleicia and Sandee. It's so great to have you
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on the podcast. Thank you so much. Aliens great to be here too.
1:29
Hi Evelyn, thank you so much. I'm so looking forward to hearing
1:33
all about your living journey. Tell me the little love story of how you
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guys met. Okay, so I'll take this one. See as we met
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on the sets of it was my second show, it was her first show.
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And yeah, we both were, you know, learning how to act.
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At the same time, we also were learning how to live in Mumbai
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because you're both were fairly you know, young and very new to Mumba.
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Where did you guys come from? I come from North India, a state
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called Haryana, and Shlesha comes from because her father was in Air Force,
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so she has also been traveling all over India, so I think she's but
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mostly she stayed in Pune, which is in Marshta, very close to Mumbai,
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so that used to be posted all over the country. So I've seen
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like parts of west, east, south, North India, and I think
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growing up having that kind of an influence definitely had a huge impact on who
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I am as a person. Today. It kind of shaped me because while
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growing up we had a very cosmopolitan kind of upbringing. Parents were highly liberal.
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I mean it wasn't like my mother was very strict or my father you
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know, didn't allow us to do things. But at the same time there
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was a balance. But yes, we could speak to them. And I
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remember telling my mother, I think, way back in two thousand, when
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I was probably fourteen fifteen years old, just like in India, this whole
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term called living in had she started. I mean, people were talking about
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it and one didn't know what it meant. And I remember, this is
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actually a true story. I told my mother, I said, May I'm
3:10
not going to get married, I'm going to live in. And I didn't
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know what he was saying. As a child, I had no clue.
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I didn't know what it means. So deep these qualities of um Ashleicia attracted
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to her. Is that what made you fall for her? No? Actually,
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you know what, I don't think we both fell for each other.
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You know, I don't think that ever happened. You know, we just
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were tooting together and then we just were like, no, I don't know
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when you started dating, and I don't know when she started visiting my house
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and then one day she came and with her bag. She never left,
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you know, no, but you know what I think, I will.
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I think it's a chick thing. I think women have girls have better memory
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of how it started, what she was, what he was wearing, when
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she was wearing. That's right, I see, I do remember this that
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I when I met him. So I don't know if i'm I think to
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go do. But he was he was a bachelor, right, he was
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this new guy, uh in the television industry, and you know, everyone
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was like, who's this cute looking boy from naught? And he had his
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own squag so there were a lot of girls who really used to love him
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a lot. Obviously. He was also let's not call him a Casinoma body.
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He was a bratty brad, a cute little boy. And I remember
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I remember he was you know, he thought that I'm this because I was
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very gawky. I remember I was seventeen, sixteen, seventeen and a half
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eighteen were gowky. I was a gowfy looking teenager. I really hadn't turned
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into a blossomed into what I looked today obviously, But yeah, there was
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this awkwardness and and very not so confident small town girl. So he always
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used to think that, you know, this girl really needs to grow up.
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She doesn't know what the hell she's doing. So, yes, I'm
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deep. I'm not older to you. We have a gap of six years,
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yeah yeah, six yeah. So but yeah, but he was more
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he was he was more world Levis. I mean, come on, when
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I first met him, the only movie I've seen was Baby's Day Out.
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And here, I mean this guy who's talking about on the Waterfront and he's
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talking about like all the movies that he's probably seen and I didn't even know
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who the hell is Robert and Arrow. So you know when I thank Sunday
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if it was like it was education for me. For me, it was
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like there's this guy who who's not just good looking, but he's stimulating,
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stimulating as well in terms of how he speaks, what he thinks. And
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he was very unlike the television men of that time. I mean they were
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all into, like, you know, going to the gym, and and
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here was this guy who was like very world Levi. So he was like
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a breath of fresh pressure for me at least. So you decided one day
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with your suit ka, this is too good. But that's actually true because
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Lego, she used to come visit me like that. She used to come
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come a place because she used to live with her sister. I used to
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live alone, so she used to so she used to come, you know,
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visit me. And one day she gave me her bags and she just
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didn't leave. I realized that after after month and a half. But this
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girl is not going and and and it's okay, you know, I don't
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mind it. I don't mind it too. I don't think you would have
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minded. So that's what that was. That was shocking from me too because
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I didn't mind it. Yeah, I didn't mind it. So the two
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of you became sort of flatmates that were romantically involved too. And when did
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you realize, m this is this is really good. We could continue doing
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this. Um when did it get more serious between the two of people.
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I'll take that first, because I think I was. I was shooting with
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him and we weren't seeing each other. I'm not I've not even shifted in
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with him. We were just like coactors and we used to have fun on
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the sets and like you know, gel with the rest of the cast and
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basically go to parties together. But I don't remember this one particular scene you
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were doing and he was standing and he was he had a lot of pain,
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back pain that back then he had to lift me in the scene.
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And I was trying to tell him that, listen, I don't want you
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to do that right now. Let let the director say action and then you
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do it. And he's like, no, just come here, just come
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and climb on this and just and the way he was screaming and shouting.
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I just looked at him now like I think I'm in love with this guy?
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What is it about him? And I for me, it was that.
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And obviously I didn't I didn't know lah blah blah bla whatever, but
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I did. I did realize that, yes, this person has something in
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him that just makes my world go around, and I ceased to see anything
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beyond him. It's just him, that sweet sentie. Ye're gonna tell me
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it's still not serious or what's here? Listen? Why why does it have
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to be serious? I don't understand. You know, you know, see
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we we had too, so like, no, who are visiting this uh
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this planet? You know? Why make anything serious? And you know what
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the reason for me enjoying this living relationship or going for it is because you
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cannot promise anybody your future. You can only promise somebody your present. I
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wonder what people said, like especially I guess your family and friends because they
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always have a thousand opinions, and I guess parents always wished it one day.
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You know, Oh, my children should be safe because they associate safety
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with marriage and you know children, grandchildren with marriage. And um, they
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terribly disappointed that this is not, you know, in the cards for them
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or is that still something that you you know, consider if it happens,
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it happens, or um, what's your take on you know, family planning
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and living together. Um, I think it's been fifteen years, hasn't it.
8:56
Yeah, it's you because for some deeper no. But but see I
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but unlike Assha's family, my family is very orthodox, you know, my
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family is like no, I come from a village, you know my family.
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So they obviously like no for them, like not to see their child,
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like now having a living relationship, not going for a marriage, not
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having like children. For them, it's a it's a big deal and they
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just didn't understand it and they had to. But at the same time,
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I was very you know, confident of living my life the way I want
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because I don't want to uh, you know, I don't want to do
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something just because other people are doing it. Absolutely, And how did you
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come to this conviction? Because if you say that you grew up in fairly
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conservative and you know, um, maybe even slightly backwards village, Um,
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how did you become so worldly? And how did you get these other ideas
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even that there is a different way of living? Yea, by not taking
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any decisions in life. Just let life happen to me, you know,
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I just yeah, I see, I didn't know when I like, No,
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it's not that I had planned to have a girlfriend. Ashlsha came in,
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yea. She never left Alicia Ashlicia, she came in. We we
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she she taught me how to love. You know, it's not that she
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because she was so she was so loving, so so and I was and
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I was open to it. I wanted to correct myself, you know,
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I wanted to see, like, no, how can life become better?
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And she she really helped me do it. And then we fell in We
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fell in love and then we kind of but we just did not want to
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do things just because other people, because we've I've also seen a lot of
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bad marriages, you know, I've also seen a lot of bad bad companionship.
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It's hardly companionship. It's just two people are together just for the sake
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of it. I know, let's be honest. It's a fifty fifteen,
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isn't it. When I walked into his world, all I felt was contentment
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in peace. There was never this moment where I felt that I, as
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a human being or a girl, I'm not safe. I need something more
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to make me feel safe in this relationship. I still remember in the beginning
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years of our relationship, I think maybe seven or eight months into our relationship,
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there is to be boys night out, and here was some weep.
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He would take me everywhere, and the boys would be but why are you
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getting a girlfriend? And he'd be like, but she's my girlfriend. She's
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gonna be wherever I am. There's no boys night out. Now she's there
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and she's everywhere. And I looked at him and I was like, and
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I was like, oh, who does that? I saw girls who were
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being cheated on at the age of seventeen, eighteen nineteen, and here was
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this guy who only promised me here today, and he's complete today. Complete
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from the time I wake up in the morning till the time I sleep,
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he is there with his presence and his utmost presence. And that that was
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something that I was not just attracted to. I just knew this is this
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is normal. This is hey, I mean people, people maybe getting diamond
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rings and they may be getting the wedding, but hey, this is not
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normal. This is something else at once. No, but if you but
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if you actually see you know, Evelyn, like, no, what this
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is marriage? Right? This is what you call marriage right that it wants
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to be working a good relationship. We've just we just don't involved people.
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Marriage is like two people living together. They're making a life together. So
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that actually is if you've just not involved people, you've just not involved government
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and you're not you know, signed that paper. Otherwise, this is how
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marriage should be. Two people very loving will come to the league guarantees in
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a bit. But it's nice to see that, you know, how happy
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the two of you are in this. And I'm sure that's what convinced your
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family and friends that hey, if it works for them, you know it'll
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work for us, because what they want sees their children happy in the end.
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Um, what what's the other the other? You know, opinion,
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the public opinion on your relationship. Do you get to hear some things on
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social media nowadays or did the media ever write about Oh my god, it's
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it's been so long. We've seen people change their opinions and how the two
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of us have lived and being together because they'reout friends who will tell us,
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oh, you guys need to get married. Why are you doing this?
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Why are you living this? What about your security is? What about this?
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Those same the same couple or those same people today they'll ask, you
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know, it's so good you guys didn't marry because now we see the true
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love. We see the true love, and twenty years later they've already gotten
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the yes. Yes, the second marriage. Yeah yeah, well well obviously
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not all marriages divorce. I'm not saying yeah, you know, it's I
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think for me personally, it's that, like you said, at something,
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that relationship that you nurture, and whether it's married or not, that's not
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really the the factor that should make you stay together. Love companions two people,
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and two people have to be two people have to be smart enough to
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know that they should be together only till the time love is you know.
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And then as kids, when you hear about these virtues, when your children
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you hear about these silent virtues like patients, love, trust, kindness,
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honesty. You know, these virtues actually means something. They're the basis of
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everything. They're the basis of your being. So today, if somebody gives,
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like I remember a couple of years back times and when they want to
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do an interview when we were speaking about our relationship after a gap of I
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mean, you've never spoken about it, and they were very they wanted to
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do an article and some they've said something and I quote he said that,
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you know, tomorrow fflshall find someone and she falls in love, I'll be
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very happy for her. And you know what, it's this rock solid mess
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of this human being and this honesty of this human peoples. And I do
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know because it works with me also tomorrow, if I see that, all
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I want, all I all I want from the universe is this human being,
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this person, this man. My goodness, you guys are so passionate
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about each other. It's okay, it's your sacred space when you're together.
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And I think, yeah, that's that's super beautiful and it's worth preserving well.
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In each episode of our Love Matters podcast, our team puts together some
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statistics about today's topic. So let's look at some facts and figures when it
15:48
comes to attitudes towards living together in India. Indian Express reports that, according
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to a recent paul, more than eighty percent of millennials perceive living relationships to
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be taboo in Indian society. More than forty seven percent of all Indians believe
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marriage is preferable to lifelong livings. However, the same paul found that more
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than eighty percent of Indians do support livings as a way of life. Twenty
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six percent of millennials went a step further, saying they would choose a lifelong
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living relationship over marriage. What do you guys think? How is it that?
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Well, it says that eighty percent of millennials still perceive a living relationship
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as a taboo in Indian society, so they think that society does not accept
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it. However, they do support live ins as a way of life,
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So definitely there's a change in society which or maybe even a misconception that it's
16:53
still a table, but actually it's pretty accepted now what do you guys think
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I would listen, I would I would say if not, if not,
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like now, what for the for the for the generations right now, for
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the future generation, if not living together at least living together for some time
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before marriage you know at least no, at least no that you know that
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are you compatible or not? Because just get because in India what happens like
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now you have like two three meetings before your marriage and then you're put together
17:30
for life. You know, the compatibility that's a whole different story. So
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but but you see, but you see that's that's that's how the marriages are
17:40
in India. The other extreme. Yeah, but that's if you leave the
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metros out and if even in metros, like know what people who are like
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no that they is the websites like no, the marriage websites and stuff.
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They also meet like your two three times they meet and then they're together.
17:56
And then in in COVID times because my my father was a judge and my
18:02
brother is a judge, and my brother was in family court. So he
18:07
was saying there was so many divorce cases during COVID because people actually didn't go
18:11
out and they were spending so much of time together in a flat and they
18:15
just could not, you know, take each other. They just could not,
18:19
like not bear each other. Yeah, I think I would have probably
18:22
the worst everybody too. Yeah, I don't know the fact legal position in
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India. Maybe you know it better. It is it is, Yeah,
18:33
of course it is. It is a legal thing. I mean, if
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you're having to staying together you work, yes, you considered to be married.
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But even if you say you live together for ten years and then you
18:45
know your your husband leaves you, which is the You know, you're asking
18:51
all the right questions. Yeah, you're asking all the right questions. And
18:53
in terms of security, I think, I mean, it's it's fine.
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You know, you your love and you your sing, spiritual or whatever.
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It's all fine. It's all fine. That's also a way of life.
19:03
But when it comes to being practicalizing these questions make so much more sense.
19:07
Having said that, I think the two people involved, Step and I both
19:12
I can only speak for ourselves. And you know I have been working since
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the age of seventeen. He's been working since when he was twing two years
19:19
old, and the two of us have realized that no matter what you do
19:22
in life, no matter how security you are. Especially in our as actors,
19:26
there's nothing that you call security, because there's a time when you're working
19:30
and there's a time you're not working. And having seen that personally for ourselves
19:33
individually, I'm not Let's just say his professional life is very different than mine.
19:41
The shows that I do and he does. You there are times when
19:44
you're working and there are times you're not working. You understand what security really
19:48
means. There's nothing that's actually guaranteed for life. There is nothing that's guaranteed
19:52
for life. I guess the security comes in because in the end, you
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know, I mean, I feel it myself. The woman is the one
20:00
who bears the children. I guess a lot of women find it's scary to
20:04
fully commit to someone who doesn't want to fully commit to them in a legal
20:11
manner, I suppose, and I mean take our take on this whole thing,
20:15
would leg to make it legal. You know, the thing is,
20:18
we've never we've never ever spoken about this. It may sound very funny and
20:23
make me look very stupid, not him, but me for sure as a
20:27
girl that I've not never even spoken and they've never never even thought about it.
20:32
No, it's not like I've never even spoken about it. But now
20:33
when the conversation arises and we talk about it, it's mainly for our parents.
20:38
I want his parents to be happy they're old. I want my mother
20:42
to be happy she's old. I want them to know that. All right,
20:47
eventually these guys are going to get married, and we want to make
20:48
them happy. We want to do that ceremony for them. We want to
20:53
see and seek their blessing because now we do see their side of the story.
20:57
While we were young and we were doing our own thing and living as
21:00
rebel as wanting to do what we wanted to do, we did that.
21:03
And today when we see them give their whole lives to us and sacrifice so
21:08
much for us, and today when we have that sensibility, the conversation that
21:12
arises to marry is only and only for those parents, because I only deserve
21:17
that what we wanted to do put down. But now like that, because
21:22
they've they've also seen, Like they keep telling us, like you already bad.
21:26
You guys did together all the time together, Yeah, you guys,
21:30
yeah, you see this, Like what is the problem signing a document?
21:33
You know, just sign it? No, we've just we've just dealt with
21:37
life so ganically that like when we started dating then we started living in together,
21:42
we just did not take any decision. We just don't think. We
21:47
just did not promise each other our tomorrows because we don't know what's going to
21:51
happen tomorrow. We both are very spiritual people, so we just don't want
21:53
to We don't know what's going to happen tomorrow. But we are together now,
21:57
so in a way, we never found time to just book a place
22:02
and get married. If she had insisted, like you know, if she
22:07
had ever insisted that I want a wedding and I want to you know that
22:11
can you can you give me? I would have given her. Yeah,
22:12
well no, I don't know. You know. It's like I'm sorry,
22:15
I'm gonna bloat, and I don't want to be lad. I don't want
22:19
like bullying, bullied as this like bad evil eye on this when I say
22:22
this. But honestly, I just feel that if once in a lifetime you
22:27
get to experience being totally consumed by the person that you love so much so
22:33
that there is just no space left for you to think about anything, any
22:38
technicality, any practicality, anything that the world is telling you, and you're
22:44
just so consumed with this thing. I feel that, I mean, I
22:48
feel it's a blessing. And I lived with that. And that's why I
22:52
never asked him. I never told him that I want to get married and
22:55
I want to buy this and this should be by wed wedding. True,
22:56
so, and this is where we need to do a wedding. And what
23:00
are we going to tell your family? Are they going to come around?
23:02
It was never a conversation in my head. I was way more consumed with
23:07
a lot, more loved than receiving. Yeah, it's not. It doesn't
23:10
give a license to flirt around and you know, just have multiple partners and
23:14
no, no, it's not that. It's it's much more serious. You're
23:17
not involving, you're not involving people in your marriage. But it is your
23:21
it is it is a commitment from insight that we will be together till the
23:25
time love is there. But you know what happens even sometimes you know what,
23:29
even if you have purest of intentions, love does leave a couple.
23:34
Sometimes you know there's something happened that the love leaves and you have to be
23:38
smart enough to understand that the love has left us. It's better to part
23:41
ways rather than giving each other help, you know, or rather just being
23:45
sticking together just because we we we we promised each other or we're committed to
23:51
each other. No, you have you're committed. You're committed for each other's
23:53
happiness. You're not committed for you know, to give each other company for
23:57
for life. So you have to be smart enough to understand that that there
24:02
is no it's better to part plays. You can have other mello, you
24:06
can go for somebody else like we will be friends forever. Yeah. Well,
24:10
that's very interesting view on relationship. I guess. I guess people have
24:15
different views on this kind of relationship because for me, I would love,
24:22
you know, to believe that my partner and I, even if we're not
24:26
you know, crazy and love anymore one day, we still want to be
24:30
best friends and kind of you know, to life together. Yea. And
24:34
yeah, I guess it's all about the way you want to plan your future
24:40
as well. Yeah, I guess it's I guess that's really no recipe to
24:44
this, right, I mean, And at the end of it, it's
24:45
it's your individual unique blessing you were born, but it's your destiny. It's
24:48
how you choose to. I think love and marriage and I think your life.
24:53
It's it's it's the luxury to design it by yourself. That's the luxury
24:57
and beauty of it. Right. If you're in love, you you have
25:00
the luxury to love the way you want to love. If you are living
25:03
your life, you have the luxury and the benefit to design the way you
25:07
want it. It's your life. At the end of the day, if
25:08
you're happy and you're sleeping, usually what do you And I guess it's all
25:14
about finding a partner that wants a similar lifestyle as you. But question,
25:21
do you guys come from the same religious backgrounds or yes? Yes, yes,
25:26
yes, so to say yes, But I don't know if you'd call
25:30
it religion. But you know what when everyone you were telling me about you
25:33
know, the way you how you think about what a partnership and a relationshipship
25:38
should be, Like I do. I do believe that when you get married
25:41
and when you're standing there all decked up and you see your husband, you
25:45
know, tradition, does it steeps in? It seeps in it? Does
25:49
it? Does you know if there's something about that ritual, there's something about
25:53
that custom. It's just so age old as an institution that I mean,
25:57
there has to be utmost respect towards it. There's a reason that it's day.
26:02
I would never say that I'm living in so you know, screw you
26:06
guys, Okay, I'm living in it. I'm happy, I'm in love.
26:08
You guys, you are the bad guys. You fight in your marriage.
26:11
No, that's not mad, didude? Here is that? You know
26:15
what? It's all beautiful, It's all it's all lovely. There's a reason
26:18
you're getting married. You want to announce your love to the world. You
26:22
want people to know that you're in love. And that's beautiful. What you
26:25
say that, you guys are just really lucky that you found each other and
26:27
you wanted the same thing about life. Uh see, I think you know
26:33
what God? God, God is a friend. You know, God is
26:37
not a so God always, like no, gives you the best thing that
26:41
is possible for you. But if you accept it, if you don't,
26:45
if you then you you do realize that everybody is lucky. But it's just
26:49
that just because you start to you know, accept few things, reject a
26:53
few things, and then you I don't know, I think I'm going too
26:56
far with my spiritual yet but no, But I think I think one thing
27:03
that sund Deep has already always taught me, one thing that I remember,
27:07
you know, and he's always said these five five words make a huge impact
27:11
on your life. He's always told me it's acceptance, it's surrender, it's
27:15
understanding and totally totally uh totally totally making it your own being being in the
27:21
being. It becomes your being. Once all these things come in place,
27:23
you just with it. You just with it. There's no separation from because
27:29
if you if you actually don't if you don't plan anything, if you actually
27:33
your mind is empty, you know what, you are full of love,
27:36
you know you are. But then you don't have to choose to love you.
27:38
You love everything and everybody. And of course, like you know,
27:41
my partner is like no, the one who's with me, like no,
27:44
hobously I'm gonna do, I'm gonna do no love her and you know,
27:48
emper her and like no, just make sure that she has the best best
27:52
things in a life. But not not deciding to do it, not not
27:56
choosing to do it, just let it happen, let it all happen on
27:59
anything. So you're a very um passively embracing life. Yes, yes,
28:07
yes, yes, yes, that's a beautiful meat, especially India, especionately
28:11
Legland. Just accepting everything. It's a very new way of life, the
28:17
doablest way of life, saying in the wind and it will all ye kind
28:22
of go. Well, that's beautiful now. I'm so so happy for you,
28:26
guys, and I wish everyone to find the kind of love that you
28:30
have. Um and yeah, I wish you all the best, guys,
28:34
Thank you, thank you. Yeah, let's see where life takes us.
28:37
And Evelyn, you are very too cute and God bless you always may be
28:41
so cute and pretty and may or Babby as cute and pretty and lots and
28:45
lots of love to you and your husbands, all the very best. I
28:51
have a wonderful time and I have a very beautiful Thank you so much,
28:56
Thank you, guys, thank you, thank you. Well you've been listening
29:00
to Love Matters, a podcast about relationship topics that matter to you and me
29:04
from Indian Express and DW, Germany's international broadcaster. If there's a topic that
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is important to you and you think we should cover it, please write to
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Love Matters at DW dot com. I'm em Lynn Sharma and I think love
29:22
matters. No,