Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Tampa gripped by fear as serial killer walks the streets

Transcript

Tampa gripped by fear as serial killer walks the streets · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: one thirty two. Tampa police on the hunt for a
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: killer after the shooting debts of three people in ten days.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: We will hunt this son of a down until we
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: find the three victims gunned down less than half a
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: mile apart. Tampa's mayor doing what he can to reassure
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: the public so that they've added a thousand streetlights to
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: the Seminal Heights neighborhood and that they won't stop until
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: that killer is caught. Nobody comes into our house and
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: does this not now, not ever. Authorities pouring over, bringing
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: surveillance video for clues, looking at this person of interest
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: walking alone, wearing a hood on the night of the
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: first killing. I need that Seminole Heights community to stand
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: up and I need them to point out who that
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: man is. An entire city on high alert, on edge
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: after three killings prove in my mind anyway, there is
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: a serial killer stalking the city of Tampa, thousands of
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: people at risk. I Meanancy Grace, this is Crime Stories.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: What do we know? Steve Heilling with People Magazine joining us. Steve,
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: what do we know now other than there are three victims,
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: two men and a woman, all shot down within a
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: thousand feet of each other, seemingly connected to the bus route. Yes,
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: that's exactly right. That's the only connection that we can
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: figure out between the three of them. They didn't know
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: each other, they didn't leave the same lifestyles at all,
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: but they all had something to do with the bus.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: They were near a bus stops, So that's what police
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: are focusing on right now to see if that might
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: be the connection. Joining you right now on the same
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: from w f L A t V Tampa is Meredith Sinsulo. Meredith,
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: I understand that one of the guys actually that wasn't
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: even his correct stop. He was an autistic male in
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: his twenties, and he got off the bus and was
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: actually walking to another route or somewhere to get on
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: the right bus. He was gunned down. One of the
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: women a young lady in her early thirties. Her fall
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: mother is heart broken and angry because he said that
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: was the light of his life, and the mom in
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: that scenario is death and her daughter was her interpreter,
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: as she was just the light of their lives that
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: he says he wants to look the killer in the
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: eye and ask why did you take my daughter? Meredeth Ceceula?
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: What about this? Uh? Aren't there videos on the bus
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: because I'm just wondering does he get on the bus
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: and follow the person off? And police are you saying
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: they don't know if it's a man or a woman.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: It's a man, Meredith, Well, I don't know that. The
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: surveillance video that we just have one video and it
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: was the night of the first murder, so just about
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: fifteen days ago. It's one video. It's really hard to tell. Now.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: Some people have said it's a man. Some people have
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: said it's a woman. Uh. The Tampa Police Department is
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: saying they're looking for this guy to question him. Um,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: we don't know at this point if this person is
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: related to these crimes, but we do have this person
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: of interest on video walking in the area. Appears to
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: be looking down. To me, it looks like the person
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: is is maybe looking at a phone. Some people have
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: said that it's the person. Maybe it's totally a fun
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: because you can kind of see it light up when
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: he touches. Well, that's true. He appears to be looking down.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: Some people have said he appears to be wearing gloves,
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: so it may be difficult to tell a race. I mean,
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: at this point, this person is a phantom. Um. The
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: third murder happened when Tampa police were patrols were literally
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: a block or two away. They heard the shots fired
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: and immediately ran to the direction of the shots. When
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: they arrived, the third person, that young autistic man, was
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: lying dead on the streets and there was no one
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: around this person. Uh, you know, I tend to think
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: it's a serial killer as well. Tampa police are not
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: calling it that, but if this person just seems to
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: vanish into thin air with no clues, no leaves, and
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: it's it's a total mystery to all of us here
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: in Tampa. And I really don't get the impression that
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: uh Tampa police from keeping anything from us. This is
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: very serious, and I know they're trying to get as
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: much information out as possible. Um, there's just so little
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: to go on that it's a really scary situation. Let's
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: take a listen to what Tampa police have to say.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: Listen carefully. The shooting occurred last night at about eight o'clock.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: Our officers were in the neighborhood or gunfire as they
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: came us through the neighborhood. Unfortunately, one of our officers
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: was able to find it, but it was too late.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: It was already dead. One of these officers content, this is,
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: you know, very frustrating. I go from the frustration to
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: anger on these unsolved homicides and now we have someone
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: who was terrorizing the neighborhood. Um, it's it's just difficult
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: to see. Just happened. This morning, on my way to work,
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: I stopped by the crime scene ten thousand blocks of
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: New Orleans where Monta Haffa was murdered last night. I
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: was at Benjamin Mitchell's crime scene and visited there. Last
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: night's murder was about two to three hundred yards south
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: of where Benjamin Mitchell was murdered, and it was nearly
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: in front of Benjamin Mitchell's house. So this morning, as
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: I visited Monica haff was crime scene. I then went
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: over to last night where Anthony de bo was and
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: I ran into his parents. I met his parents theres.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: Anthony last night was at work. He took the wrong
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: bus to this neighborhood. He should not have been in
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: this neighborhood. Appears that he was walking northbound from what
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: we think going to another bus stop and he did
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: not make it. While we were out there last night,
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: his father called a Dampa police department. I was worried
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: that his son was missing. After a further investigation, we
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: had to regretfully inform him that his son had been murdered.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Anthony is the oldest of five children. He graduated from
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: Middletown High School last year. He was in the prime
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: of his life and has been taken instantly. We're not
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: gonna be held hostage by whoever is doing this. We
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: needed everyone to come out of their homes at night,
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: turn on their porchlights, and just not tolerate this type
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: of terrorism in the neighborhood. We have to get people outside.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: This neighborhood is cooperating with us, and we have a
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: heavy presidence in there. We still have no leads, we
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: have no motive. You know, Uh, Cheryl McCullum, director of
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: the Cold Case Institute and crime scene expert. That reminds
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: me of the case, and I believe you remember it
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: that I tried as my first bank robbery. Normally the
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: Feds take those, but they didn't want this one because
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: it was so weak. The guy broke in to a bank,
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: I didn't break in. He walked him with a gun.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: Don't touch the al ram, this is a roby. He
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: was also dyslexic. Don't touch the alarm. This is a robbery.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: I'm translating. But what he did was all that aside,
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: you know, a fake beard, fake mustache, fake wig, hat, sunglasses.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: He had on a suit and when he left, he
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: ripped off the suit, was based it up the bat.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: He had on athletic shorts, socks, a short sleeve shirt,
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: ripped off the wig, all that, got on a bike
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: and pedaled away as the police were approaching, and he
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: just peddled off with all the money stuff down his shirt.
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: This guy, Cheryl is either riding the bus, he frequents
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: that neighborhood, or he lives in that neighborhood or the
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: perimeter of that neighborhood. It is a man, Cheryl. Everything
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: we know about method and assessment of homicide tells me
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: a serial killer is a man. Plus he's using a gun.
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: Women very rarely use a gun. Now, you had the
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: monster played by Shirley's there on and she used a
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: gun sometimes, but typically, you know, women don't use guns
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: when they're a serial killer. If they're a serial killer,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: which is rare. It is a man. My only question
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: is the race another thing, Cheryl. Typically a serial killer
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: kills within his own race. I mean, look at Gaycy,
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: look at Bundy, look at all serial killers. They typically
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: kill with B T K same thing. Uh. And this
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: are just off the top of my head. I mean,
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: if you really look at them, you'll see that's true.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: But here we've got a mixture of races of the victims.
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: We've got African, American and white. So you know, what
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: do you think, Cherylan, We also have male and female.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: So what you're looking at here is more of a
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: son of Sam type of thing, more of a d
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: C sniper. They are not picking the victim based on
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: any characteristic, They are picking opportunity. So it's almost got
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: a feel of a free killer as well. So again
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: it is going to be imperative that people stay vigilant
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: because this person is high. Oh Man, talk about hold
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: on talking about the d C killer. I was working
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: in DC at the time, and when I would get
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: off a plane and try to get to where I
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: was going, Steve Hailing People magazine, You remember that, well, Steve,
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: You've covered so many serial killer cases let's talk about
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: what you think about this one. Come on, you've been
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: investigating it. I have, And you know what I think
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: about this one is that, um, eventually, there's going to
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: have to be some sort of mistake made. And unfortunately,
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: I think that this isn't going to stop. These things
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: just don't stop. I mean, there might be a break
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: for a while. But you know, there's a reason why
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: Tampa police are. They're installing more street lights, they're stepping
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: up the patrols because they think this is going to
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: happen again. And I'm unfortunately inclined to believe them unless
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: this person is caught. But what we have to go
• 9:51
  Speaker 1: on right now? We have nothing, and so that's why
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: I feel like this may be the beginning of of
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: something really bad. It's bad, Steve Helen. And when you
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: say we have nothing to go on, I hear what
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: you're saying, but I I agree and disagree. While we
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: don't have a description, I'm telling you it's a man.
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: I'm telling you, but we can't round up every man
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: in Tampa now. And if they would do like they
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: did in the Missy Beaver case, just for an example,
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: or they did in the Delphi Girls on a bridge case. Sadly,
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: both of them are not solved. But you can take
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: the video and you can compare it to you take
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: the picture of the guy in the video, and you
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: compare it to what he's standing next to, and you
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: can get his height and looking at him, you can
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: extrapolate his weight. You can figure out what kind of
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: shoes he's wearing, what kind of sweatshirt he's wearing. He's
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: got a hood over his face, you can figure out
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: what kind of clothes he's wearing. I mean, I mean,
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: I hear what you're saying, anty. But the other thing
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: is this is just a person of interest. We don't
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: even know that this is the shooter. So you know, okay,
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: Steve Helling, it's just somebody else alone, guy walking along
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: right after a gunshot and there's a dead body near him. Okay,
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: what's the likelihood of that? Zero? I think walks sometimes.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: I haven't shot anybody. When did you take a walk
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: by a dead body? Well? No, not hearing, I have not. No.
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you for breaking down. It's hard to
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: break Steve Heling down. Now, Okay, you said it's gonna
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: be something bad, Steve, it is something bad that is
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: something bad. Of course, this is horrible, horrible, This is horrific.
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: But what I'm saying is and unless there's something to
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: go on that we can figure out who this is
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: and take him off the streets. I don't think it's
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: going to stop. I agree. I agree with that. Meredison's
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Hilo w f L A TV Tampa joining us there.
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: Do you agree or disagree with Steve Helling from People Magazine? Well,
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: I think that that this person on the videotape is
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: definitely substanct um, you know, needs to be looked at.
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: This This neighborhood maybe five minutes from downtown Tampa. It's
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: a residential neighborhood. Sort of the main rag there has
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: a lot of indie crafty beer type places, but beyond
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: that it's purely residential. It's a mix of races, um
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: of income levels, and it's just not a place aside
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: from maybe being at the bus stop that people are
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: going to be out and about walking late at night.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: All of these crimes have happened at night. Um, you know,
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: some later than others. That the gentleman that was killed
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: the other night, that happened, you know, pretty early in
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: the evening eight or nine o'clock. Um, But other than
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: those folks that are maybe coming and going from the
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: bus stop, there's just not a lot of activity on
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: the road. Wait a minute, Wait a minute. Was it
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: on a weekday or a week or a weekend? They
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: have occurred on week nights. Um. I believe the Steve
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: Helling hold on just a moment. This is what I
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: used to love to do with Bethany Marshall. I'm gonna
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: come to you very quickly, Bethanie Marshall's psychoanalysts joining us,
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: very well known in her field. Out of l a
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: Steve Helling in court. My favorite, well, one of my
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: favorite things to do when I was putting a killer
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: behind bus. Are so many favorites, but one was to
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: look up similar transactions and work them like a dog.
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: And to do that you'd have to get similarities. Let's
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: look at what we know. All of these are on
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: a week night. That means this guy is probably busy
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: during the day. They're all in the same area. He
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: either lives there or he frequents that area. They're all
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: related to a bus stop. Is he riding the buses
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: that his mode of transportation? Is he hanging out around
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: a bus stop. What is around the bus stop? What
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: is around other bus stops in the area. Is he
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: frequenting a restaurant? Does he work in one of those restaurants?
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: We know that, I know that he's a male and
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: he is wearing a hood over his face. Who would
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: do that? What else do we know? These three people
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: are not connected, but they all rode the bus. Are
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: you getting a picture of this guy who works at night?
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: What can you tell me about ballistic Steve helling from people?
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: That's a good question, And maybe that's a good question
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: for Meredith because I don't have the ballistics in front
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: of me right well, I haven't heard it either. That's
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: why I was asking you, guys, Meredith, do you know
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: Meredith Cecelia, do we know ballistics? You know? It's interesting,
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: um they have not come out and declared this a
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: serial killer, which indicates they did not linked the weapon. Now.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: I did speak with the former chief of police, Jane Caster.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: She's still very involved in the community here. I talked
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: to her the other day before they actually declared the
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: third killing was part of this series, and she actually
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: lives in that neighborhood herself, and she mentioned to me
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: that it was likely that they were going to be
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: doing ballistic fingerprinting to link these three um crime scenes together. Um.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: Now we know they have been linked, but outside of that,
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: they haven't come out and said, you know, other than
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: these were all shootings. Um that the reason why they're
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: linked is because of the weapon. Man, We've got to
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: get We got to get that weapons information. We have
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: to It's very simple matter. I've actually been air and
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: worked on it myself. All you do is get the
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: known bullet. I eat the bullet from the body, or
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: the bullet you find on the scene. You put it
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: under a microscope. On every bullet. It's like a fingerprint.
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: Every gun is created in a let's just say a factory,
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: and it's made of molten steel or metal, and when
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: it cools at least certain striations or marks on the inside.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: It's not it's not um polished and smoothed on the inside.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: So when a bullet hurls down the inside of a barrel,
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: it hits those little markings, those little irregularities on the
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: inside of the barrel, and it forever imprints the bullet
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: with a striation or a marking that only that gun
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: can leave. So we will know if these are the
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: same caliber weapons, if it's from the same exact gun,
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: won't we share on the absolutely that there's no question
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: about it. I think they're withholding that information to have
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: something in case they investigate and you know, get somebody
• 16:00
  Speaker 1: the ROO. But I want to make a prediction, Nacy
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: this again, this so very much like some for Zodiac,
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: and in all three of those cases, the killer contacted
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: law enforcement through the media. I think that will happen here.
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: Now let's go after hearing all of these facts to
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: our psychoanalysts, a true expert in her field, Dr Bethany Marshall. Okay, Bethany,
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: you've heard the facts. Well. One of the things we
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: know about serial killers is that searching for victims is
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: as important as killing. In other words, serial killers have
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: a very rich fantasy life. They often have literature on
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: their computers or in their homes about killing, about um
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: uh satal, massochistic types of um situations. So so whoever
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: is doing this is spending a great deal of time
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: in the neighborhood, walking through the neighborhood, writing the bos,
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: whatever it takes to look for victims. We also know
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: about these serial killers that they're often family man, Nancy,
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: remember the b T K Killer. There's so many that
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: you've covered over the years. Surprisingly, we're family men. And
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: even in the literature on suceerial killers, you know, one
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: of the things we read again and again, white male,
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: married children drives the family sedan. So I think in
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: these cases it's often important for police to put something
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: out via the media for family members to look for
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: strange or unusual activity amongst their own family members. In
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: other words, whoever is doing this is really doing it
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: in the early evening hours during the week. Is this
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: somebody whose wife works in the early evening hours. Is
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: this somebody who is having strange coming and goings out
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: of a household? Um often, you know, after these crimes
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: are solved, you learned that the perpetrator had a great
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: deal of unusual activity with within the household, but other
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: family members were overlooking it. Also joining in right now.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: Death Investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. He is a crime scene
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: investigator extraordinaire and Professor Forensics at Jacksonville State University. Joe Scott,
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: you've heard us sift through the facts analysis. I'm not
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: so inclined to throw around the term serial killer. Here. Uh,
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: going back to what's so, Yes, it's just a coin
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: kie dank right that three people are gunned down within
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: a thousand feet of each other. I'm a little disappointed,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: Jo Scott. I usually agree with you, but your dead.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: What Cheryl had said earlier was that was that, uh,
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: you know we had this could very well be a
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: spree event, all right, what we need to look at that.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: Let me give you a date, Let me give you
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: a day. No no no, no, no, no no, no no no.
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: Tell us tell everybody listening what you made by a
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: spree event versus a serial killer spree event. Spree event
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: means that you kill multiple people in a very short
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: period of time. We don't have enough evidence at this
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: point in time to say that this is a serialized event.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: We have two individuals that were killed on the ninth,
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: then there was another individual killed on the nineteenth, singular.
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: Now nothing else has happened at this time. I think
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: it's too early to call it a serial event. What
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: I can't say is that serial perpetrators many times work
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: on cycles. I've worked I don't know in my in
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: my career, probably five separate sets of serial homicide deaths,
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: like a series of these things both in New Orleans
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: and Atlanta. Okay, hold on, hold on, let me break
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: it down to regular people. Talkay, just got Morgan, you've
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: been living in that ivory tower there in the classroom
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: in Alabama that you're absolutely right? Yeah, yeah, okay, teaching
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: here we get. The definition of a spree killer is
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: somebody or it can be more than one person, but
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: typically somebody who commenced two or more murders without a
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: cooling off period. That means you you go postal and
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: you go in there and you shoot a whole bunch
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: of people at once. A serial killer has a cooling
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: off period. There is a period of time. It can
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: be a day, it can be a week, it can
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: be a month, it can be months. I think could
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: be t K. He committed by torture kill. He was
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: actually a dog catcher. That's the clue right there. Who
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: wants to catch dogs and euthanize them? Okay, think about it.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: So this guy kills over a period of years. Like
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: Ted Bundy spree killer, it's like a shopping spree that's
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: done in out bam Over. Serial killer is more methodical
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: in that there's a cooling off period between each murder.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: But in this case, you know you had to and
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: then you had another. To me, that constitute serial But
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: to me, that's all semantics. You're splitting hairs. Okay, let's
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: get down and dirty. Go Joe Scott. Well, what I'm
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: saying is that they need to be very purposeful in
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: what they're doing, and I think that Tampa is doing
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: exactly that. They're not releasing a lot of information. The
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: connectivity that we look for in forensic cases, Nancy, as
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: you well know, is what can tie these things together.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: We're talking about ballistics. It will be very interesting to
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: see if all three of these cases are tied ballistically,
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: behavior patterns, this sort of thing. One other thing. The
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: first of these killings took place on the ninth, the
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: next one took place in the nineteen I'd be very
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: curious as to what happens on the twenty ninth of October.
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: Moving forward, many many times these people work on site
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: Taber nine October October nine that the second victim was.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: She was killed on the eleventh um. They found her
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: body in a deserted um parking area field area on
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: the third team. So we know killings on that Yes, Okay,
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: you're right, So it's ninth eleven the body found one
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: and then the nineteenth is that right? Okay, just got
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: more against you on that, buddy. But what I'm saying
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: is we have to be very very careful moving forward.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: Is this guy going to patterns just like the doctor
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: mentioned a moment ago. Is there some kind of stock
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: hold on, hold on? That's what significant Cheryl McCollum about
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: what Joe Scott's saying, And he's right, uh in that
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: if it's just I accused, I accused him of splitting hairs,
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: parsing words. It's all semantics like is it spray? Is
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: it cereal? It's like it doesn't matter people are dying.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: But to me, it is important because if it is
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: serial if it's serialized, there will be more victims. If
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: it's spray, this may be the end of it. Well, Nathan,
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: let me jump in. You said you want to get
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: down in dirty. Let's do it. Keeps spending no time
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: with these victims. Nothing is sexual. So a lot of
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: times when you have a serial killer, whether it's Bundy,
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: b T K Gamer, sex is primary. That's what's part
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: of the murder. We don't have that here. This guy
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: is finding somebody again. I'm gonna go back to Sun
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: of Sam. He's finding somebody's hut him and he's done.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: So not only are they going to connect that bullet,
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: they're also going to connect where were they shocked. It's
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: gonna be paramount right now. The tip line eight eight
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: seven three tips T I P S. There's a twenty
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: five thousand dollar reward for this moment. We can pray
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: for Benjamin Mitchell's family, Monica Hoffa's family, and anthony Neboa's family,
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: the first three victims of the Tampa Cereal killer. You
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: know what a learning the public informing you about crimes
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: and the search for justice is so important, and that
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: would not happen without our partners, and we thank them
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: deeply for making our serious x M one two program possible.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: Right now, I want to thank our partner, and it
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: is Legal Zoom. Guys, as business owners all across our country,
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: from mom and pops to giants, you know how important
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: it is to keep moving forward. But so many times
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: things pop up that take your time and focus away
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: from growing your business, developing it. You get bogged down
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: when it comes to reviewing contracts, registering trademarks, staying current
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: on fees. Do you know, Jackie, I was actually late
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: on my bar do use this year? Yes, that would
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: have made a nice headline on page six, So it
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: obviously happens to everybody staying current on fees and permits.
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: Legal zoom dot com can help simplify your life. It
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: was created sixteen years ago by the very sharpest minds
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: in law and technology, and they've already helped over two
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: million business owners easily and affordably navigate the legal system
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: with confidence. And that is not an easy thing. Best part,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: you never have to worry about lawyers sneaky billable hours
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: piling up behind your back. It's happened to me. I
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: get a bill. I'm like, what is that. Legal zoom
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: is not a law firm. Instead, you get the advice
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: you need to answer your business questions at fixed rates
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: through legal zooms nationwide network of independent lawyers. So take
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: a little pressure off yourself. Go to legal zoom dot com.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: Now take care of business before this. Your wine's down
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: before you turn around. It's gonna be January one. For
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: special savings, be sure to intercode Nancy in a n
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: c Y in the referral box at checkout code Nancy
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: Equals special savings only at legal zoom dot com. Legal
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: zoom dot com. Legal Zoom thank you for what you
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: do for business owners every single day, and thank you
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: for being our partner on Sirius x M one thirty two.
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: I want to back it up just a moment on
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: this Tampa serial killer. We have more information, but first
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: I want you to hear the father of Monica haff Of.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: This really really broke my heart. I'm angrier than I've
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: ever been in my life. I need that Seminole Heights
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: community to stand up and I need them to point
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: out you know who that man is. She was a
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: good person because my daughter made a difference in this world.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: I just hated to someone took that from the world
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: and me. She was a god send to her mother.
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: You know, she would her mother being deaf, she would
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: she would interpret for her mom. Nothing's gonna help me
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: get through this. I just want to go look in
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: his eyes. Most of all, we need to identify him
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: and get him off the street so that nobody else
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: has to have their daughter killed needlessly by some random
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: guy on the street. You know. Cheryl McCollum, crime scene expert,
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: director of the Cold Case Institute and um former, you
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: know when I say former, you're really still doing it
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: as crime scene expert. Cheryl. I'm very surprised they have
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: not released the caliber of weapon, and you know it's
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: going to be the same. So what do you make
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: of that, Cheryl, because that's a big piece of this puzzle. Sure,
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: again with some of these cases, nay, if you can,
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: you know, have a if you've got a three seven,
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: whatever the weapon is, the caliber of weapon is going
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: to be paramian out here. There's no questions she selected
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: that weapon for a reason. But again, what's going to
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: be real critical for me is were these victims shot
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: in the chest? Where they shot in the face, where
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: they shot in the back. That's also going to give
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: you a lot of insight to this killer. They're playing
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: that really close right now. They're not going to give
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: those cards away yet, They're just not so Meredith, is
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: Hulo w f L A TV Tampa. We should at
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: least know where they were shot in the face, in
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: the chest, in the back. I understood it was the back.
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: Is that not right, Meredith? Aside from saying that the
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: victims have been shot, we know the kinds of day
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: that they were shot in the locations, but honestly, it
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: details about how and when they were shot that's just
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: so hard to come by. PPD is keeping a lot
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: of this very close to the vest um. There's just
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: not a lot of information out there um other than again,
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: these folks, we know that they were alone. They were
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: in an area near the bus shop bus stop which
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: by the way, bus service has been suspended to that area.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: This is how how scare this community is. But you know,
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: in terms of we you know they were shot from
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: a distance, but that's about it. A shot from a distance.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall's psychoanalyst joining us from l A. That's significant, Bethanie,
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: what does it tell you about the criminal? Well, I
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: think it's significant because these serial killings are so highly ritualized.
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: You know, when you when you have multiple victims, you
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: see the same offending pattern with with each act of
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: the perpetrator. And so the fact that they're all shot
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: it's early in the evening means that for this perpetrator,
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: the element of surprise is extremely important to him, the
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: idea that he's he's hiding, that the victims don't know
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: that he's around. And Cheryl McCollum said that these crimes
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: were not sexually motivated, and perhaps that true. That's true,
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: but you know he doesn't have there. It doesn't have
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: to be semen on the victim or a direct sexual
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: assault or a crime to be sexually motivated. I remember
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: with the BTK killer um reading quite a bit of
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: literature about the crime, and the seaman wasn't always on
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: the body. Sometimes it was outside the house, sometimes it
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: was in a different rooms. So for this perpetrator it
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: might be associated with a masturbatory ritual. And then the
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: idea of the cooling off period. I think it's important
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: for the public to know that cooling off is a misnomer.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: It doesn't mean that that person is losing interest in killing.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: It just means that the ritualized aspect of searching for victims,
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: thinking about it, reading stories about killing, looking at literature
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: about killing, means engaging in a rich fantasy life about
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: killing that that is more containing to them for a
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: period of time than actually acting on it. So you
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: have sort of a going back and forth the cycle
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: between thinking, fantasizing and then doing. And that's why I
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: was saying earlier that it's so important to let the
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: public know that if if anybody has a family member
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: that's engaging in very strange activity, it had a huge
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: online habit, a lot of pornography, a lot of violent
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: material on the computers. To really begin to think about,
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: you know, could it be that quiet person hiding in
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: the midst of the neighborhood. Everybody has to be on
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: high alert. Joseph Scott Morgan, forensics professor. What about the
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: a t F. How can they help us? Is there
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: any type of a database for guns or ammunition where
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: the bullet itself can be traced. I know, when a
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: bullet goes to a human body, it becomes deformed and
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: it can be ruined, but you can still very often
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: get UH striation mark off of it to make a comparison.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: Is there any data bank, so to speak, you know,
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: like a FS or codis for fingerprints and DNA for
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: for guns. Yeah, Nancy, there is. A t F has
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: got one of the most extensive ballistic databases that exist, UH,
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: and they've been working on this for years and years.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: Many times people think that it's the FBI. A t
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: F is really the tip of the sphere when it
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: comes to farms examination. UH. And not only let's let's
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: not forget, not only can they match these things up
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: ballistically where you were mentioned, uh, the striations on the bullets. Uh,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: they also have the ability to match these things chemically,
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: because every projectile has a specific chemical signature that goes
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: back to the latter to the manufacturer where it was composed,
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: and so the type of ammunition that's being used, the
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: type of weapon that's being fired. In my experience, most
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: serialized events, the individual stays with the weapon that they
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: feel most comfortable with, whether it's a knife or a
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: firearm or their bare hands. They don't deviate from that
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: a lot. And that's gonna be really important moving forward
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: relative to the connectivity between all of this. What's the modality?
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: How are these things connected? And I found it very
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: interesting where you mentioned that it was at a distance,
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: at a distance from an evidentiary standpoint, what that means
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: is that we're not going to have um evidence that's
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: related to say, like gunpowder on the boy, UH, that
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: can give you a specific range of fire. Most of
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: the time, they're going to refer to this as an
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: indeterminate distance. But again, a lot of that remains to
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: be seen. For me, personally, I'm going to be very
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: interested to see what the autopsy has revealed as far
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: as angle of fire deflection, Uh, the relationship between the
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: shooter and the victim. This is gonna be very very
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: you know, another significant fact to Sheryl McCollum. I want
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: you to think about this. Percolate for a minute, Cheryl.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: If they were shot at a distance, does that mean
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: a rifle along gun was used? Or are they that
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: good of a shot that they can shoot say a
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: thirty eight or twenty two at a distance and hit
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: their mark. Think about a Sheryl, what do you think? Well,
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: it also could mean he's new to it and he
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: doesn't have the guts to walk the white up two
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: of them yet and have any kind of interaction. It
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: could also mean that he's still a little fearful, or
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: if he's even seven feet away, he's already away from
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: the victim. He can leave faster. But I want to
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: revisit the sexual thing really quickly, name because this is
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: really important. Most people know whether they want to have
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: figs with Morgan Freeman or Britney Fears. If this was sexual,
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: the victims would be his type. So clearly, again, when
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: you have black males and white females that ain't the type,
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: so you're looking more. I have a feeling of a
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: free killer. This is somebody that will kill again, but
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: he will also be very patient. So the police are
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: making it harder for him right now. But that's his area,
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: that's his neighborhood, that's where he's comfortable. Well, he could
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: just skip to the next bus stop, you know, half
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: a mile down the street or a mile away, that
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: still is his neighborhood. What about it, Bethany Marshall, Well,
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: I think Cheryl brings up an interesting point that no
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: two victims are alike, so it does make you think
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: about the sexual component. But remember the bt K killer
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: assaulted entire families sexually adults, men, women, children, so sometimes
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: it's a heterogeneous group. I think it's fascinating that he's
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: staying near the same bus stock. In my fantasy about this,
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: I could be wrong, is if this guy is very
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: entrenched in this one area, he's very comfortable there, and
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: I agree with Cheryl that maybe he's frightened. You know
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: that he can only use a gun at a distance,
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: because at this point he's working up his courage to
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: get closer to the victims, so that you know, even
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: though in these serialized events usually there's the same ritual
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: again and again, maybe this ritual will be elaborated upon
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: and he'll get closer to his victims in the future. Hey, Nancy,
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: one thing I'm thinking about here is we keep talking
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: about the sexual component and this sort of thing. Let's
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: think about the DC sniper real quick. Uh, this guy
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: crossed the ratio? Are these guys crossed racial boundaries relative
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: to this? And the motivation was not sexual in that case.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: The motivation in that in those particular cases had something
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: to do with anger rage and it wasn't directed uh
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: in a sexual context. And this guy was killing multiple people,
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: but they were shooting them in open locations where they
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: could seek cover. Uh, they were disguise. Remember the white
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: panel then that that had everybody in a frenzy in
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: a Greater DC area and it turned out to be
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: a Chevy Caprice. They they completely put the police off scent.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: A lot of it had to do with the way
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: the case was initially worked. That's why they need to
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: be very very careful moving forward with this, and every
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: bit of information needs to be sifted and sifted through
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: very carefully. I get an indication in the this particular
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: case that Tampa has learned some lessons from mistakes that
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: have been made in the past, and I applaud them
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: for playing this close to the best. I think they
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: should continue to play the thing close to the best.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: I agree completely flying and I brought up earlier. I
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: brought up DC Ciber earlier because it has the same
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: feel to me. And again, the rage and the revenge
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: is clearer than any other component in this thing. And
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: that's again why I think if they play it perfectly,
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: she'll reach out. I think he's a black male. I
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: think he's young, and so I think they need to
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: start watching social media because if he contact them, it
• 35:55
  Speaker 1: won't be through a letter. He didn't know anything about
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: writing a letter. He will take it or eat it.
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: There will be indications on social media. Okay, yes, just
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: yesterday I was talking on Daily Mail TV about who
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: this guy is and I said it is a male.
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: Got a little argument with Jesse the host, and um
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: then I went on to say that most serial killers
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: are white males. So I got into the white male aspect.
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: But in this case, it could very easily be an
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: African American male. It is a man though, you know,
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: I'm just telling you that. Joe Scott morgana keeps trying
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: to tell me, or is that Steve Helling trying to
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: tell me it might be a woman. It's not a woman. Okay, Cheryl,
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: please explain why it's not a woman. Don't don't get
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: your feelers hurt. Steve Helling, People Magazine. Cheryl, tell him
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: why it's not a woman. Well, first of all, is
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: a handgun and we are so rarely going to see
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: a woman used a handgun, especially walking down the street
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: and just arbitrarily picking victims of opportunity or random That
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: just doesn't happen with women. But here's again, you're missing
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: the other big component. Jeffrey Dahmer assault sitting murdered people
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: of different races, but not different genders. D C. Sniper
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: I said on your show years ago, Nancy, that would
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: be a person of color. I was the only person
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: that said that, And I was also the only person
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: who said he wasn't a serial killer. VC Sniper was
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: a spree killer. There's a different field here. So if
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: you pay attention and just reduced it to its most
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: elementary state, you have men. You have women. You have white,
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: you have black, you have random, you have opportunity, you
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: have I'm just gonna walk away, so again, son of
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: Sam Zodiac, this is what they did. It's more spree,
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: you know. Dr Bethany Marshall psycho alis joining me out
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: of l A. I'll tell you why it's not a woman,
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: because we're too darn busy. We're too darn busy getting
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: up at five o'clock and making the children breakfast and
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: getting them dressed for school and getting them there, and
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: then working full time and then coming home and trying
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: to put a nice dinner on the table and have
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: that hallmark moment which ps never happens. Okay, So I
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: don't have time unless I'm going to run them down
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: on my with my minivan. I don't have time to
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: kill anybody. Okay. Now I have thought of that occasionally,
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: but I have an acting on it, just so you
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: all know. That's why it's not a woman. Okay, there,
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: and women don't kill with guns. I mean, it's just
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: so rare that they do. When women kill, it's usually
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: a soft kill, as you know, Nancy, it's and often
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: it's somebody within their own family unfortunately, like their own
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: children or a husband. But it's it's poisoning, it's drowning,
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: it's putting a pillow over a child's head. It's something
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: like that. It's not that violence from a distant um
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: shooting type situation. What about to Joseph Scott Morgan, Wait
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: hold on, let me throw this to Meredith because she
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: might know this fact. Meredith Inceulo joining me from w
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: f L A TV Tampa. Is there any financial spect
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: to these shootings? I haven't really thought of that. You know,
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: people ever typically kill over sex or money. Excuse me, yeah,
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: ever money or sex. Unless it's a woman, then it's
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: a love type, a love killing, if you could call
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: it that. That really doesn't fit together. What do you know, Meredith, Well,
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: I can tell you this. So we had the third victim, uh,
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: twenty year old autistic man. Um. That's that's not going
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: to be something where you know, this would be killing
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: for money. There. The second victim, thirty two year old female.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: She didn't own a car. Um, she used the bus
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: to get some location to location. UM. So again I'm
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: not going to say, you know, there's a lot of
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: wealth to be had there. And our first victim was
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: a student. UM. A twenty year old student. So you know,
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: I know, but if you're shooting from a distance, Meredith,
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: you don't know that do they take their wallet or
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: the pocketbook? Well, that's true, No, we if they if
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: that happened. There has been no indication that there was
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: you know, affect involved in any of these cases. And
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: I will see from living and knowing this community. UM
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: the bus system. You know, while we do a great job,
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: it is going to be catering to more at a
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: lower income UM residence here in Tampa UM South Seminal Heights. Again,
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: it's kind of gentrified at this point. It's a mix,
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: but for the most part, it's going to be a
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: lower income community. You know. On the tip line eight
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: eight seven three tips t I p as in Pennsylvania
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: S twenty five thousand dollar reward. I want to thank
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: our partner making our serious one thirty two program possible today. Guys,
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: you know how much I love Fat Boy, a k A. Nitro,
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: my pound puppy, and not to leave out my pound kittie,
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: Cinnamon Girl. I'm always on the lookout for fun new
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: things we can do with Fat Boy and Cinnamon Girl. Well,
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: I discovered an amazing new dog collar called Leak a
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: k C, and it's so much more than a collar.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: I never thought i'd feel this way about a dog collar.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: It's backed by the American Kennel Club. The link a
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: k C collar. It's a GPS locator, a fitness tracker,
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: and a smartphone app all rolled into one for a dog. Now.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: I love the GPS locator and I'll tell you why
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: Cinnamon got away one time. The days and hours I
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: spent trying to find that cat, I don't want that
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: to happen fat Boy. So he's got this collar, I
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: don't have to worry. Did he get out of the yard,
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: did he runaways in the middle of the road. You
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: can see exactly where your dog is right on the app.
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: It's total peace of mind. Best part activity tracker. It
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: doesn't matter how old or chubby your dog is, whether
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: it's a pure breed, a mixed or a like mine.
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: Link a k C shows the exact amount of activity
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: every single dog needs and it's easy to set up.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: There's a size for every dog, and this is important.
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: It is super comfy. Lenk a k C looks great
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: on fat Boy. You can see fat Boy on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter,
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: at crime online dot com. We posted his picture keep
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: your dog safe, happy and healthy. It got even easier
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: with a special offer from link a k C. Go
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: to link a k C dot com use code Nancy
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: save thirty percent off your order and free shipping code
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: Nancy save thirty on your order with free shipping at
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: link a k C dot com. Leak a k C
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: dot com code Nancy link a k C. I thank you,
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: and so does fat Boy street name NAU. Guys were
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: sticking with this Tampa serial killing case because people are
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: at risk right now. Now. Police are telling everybody just
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: be careful to go about your business. I don't necessarily
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: agree with that. To Cheryl McCollum, crime scene expert and
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: director of the Cold Case Institute, I'm not really sure
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: why they're saying, have your cookouts and go about your
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: regular business, because I sure seen when I was in
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: d C during the DC sniper I was a nervous wreck.
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: But kind of agree with the mayor that we're not
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: gonna let this so big, you know, change our lives. However,
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: that's easy for you to say. Tell Anthony Neboe and
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: Monica Hof and Benjamin Mitchell's parents just go about your business.
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: But you gotta get out. That's the way to flush
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: this guy out. That's the way to see it. That's
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: the way to get that rewards. You can't hide in
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: your house and catch him. So I agree, get out,
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: walk about. Pay attention because he's out there, Nancy. He is.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: He's in plain sight. He's going to grocery stores. He's
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: taken whatever bus he can near there, he's walking often time. No,
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: I think he's lost your mind, Cheryl mccollumn, because you
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: say get out of flash him out. I'm not sending
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: my children out of the street to flush out of killer.
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: He doesn't kill anybody in a group. He doesn't. I'll
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: tell you what. You go down there and flash him
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: out on the street, Cheryl, how about that? No, don't
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: do that, because then I wouldn't have you here on
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: our programs. Okay, Bethany Marshall, I completely different. Disagree with
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: telling everybody to just go ahead and get out. Go ahead.
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: Why why are they saying that, Bethany? I disagree because
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: whoever goes out is at risk. Why would you want
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: to put your life at risk to catch the serial killer?
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: You know. One of the things I can say, though,
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: is that we're talking about the differences between all these victims,
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: different rays, different gender, but there's some startling similarities too.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: They're all vulnerable, they're all young people, and one of
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: the things we know about serial killers is that they
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: always pray on a very vulnerable population. Whether it's sex workers,
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: that's a very frequent population because of their availability, but
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: in this case, young people who ride the bus. So
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: I think it's not the whole city that needs to
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: be on high alert, it's the most vulnerable population that
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: doesn't have their own cars, that has to rely on
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: the bus system. These are the people who are at
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: risk joining these j Scott Morgan also just Scott, are
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: we're going to catch this guy by very careful examination
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: of all the evidence, pay attention to patterns. UH. Police
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: really need to continue to take their time with this
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: and the public. It is absolute must that the public
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: pay attention to to their entire environment and also those
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: individuals that inhabit that environment, family members, close friends, anybody
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: that's acting oddly, or anybody that has said anything in
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: the past that would give them an indication that someone
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: has anger issues that they just want to go out
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: and randomly hurt somebody. That's how we're gonna catch this guy,
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: and vigilance, remaining vigilant at all times. I don't agree
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: with hiding in your house, However, I also agree with
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: staying in groups out there. I think that it's very,
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: very careful. When I was a kid, we endured the
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: Atlanta child murder cases, and I was in high school,
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: and every night at eleven ten fifty nine, the guy
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: would come on TV say it's eleven o'clock. Do you
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: know where your children are? And I remember being terrified
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: of that when I was in high school. Now, um,
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: and of course that was all happening in the inner
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: city of Atlanta, but it was still a scary time.
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: People need to remain vigilant. Right now, police escorting children
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: to school, and the Seminole Heights area warning residents not
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: to walk alone at night. A city bus changed its
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: route to detour the sides of the two incidents. But
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: as of right now, police still do not have a
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: motive or a suspect in the killings that started October nine,
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: and are linked so far only by time and location.
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: People are afraid these shootings only three hundred yards apart.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: I don't know the answer Seminole Heights is a working
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: class neighborhood just a little north of downtown Tampa. There
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: are all sorts of people that live in this melting pot.
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: There are rundown homes sitting next to brand new, big,
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: beautiful McMansions and Bungalow's, their new restaurants springing up there.
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: It's a really diverse area, so you can't peg it
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: as one thing or another. But I know this one
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: person is reaking havoc and I want it to end.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: Help us one eight hundred eight seven three tips t
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: I p s for twenty five thousand dollar reward. Nancy
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: Grace Crime Story signing off goodbye friend,