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North by North Korea [from Very Special Episodes] · Operation Midnight Climax

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: On March thirteenth, nineteen eighty six, a couple burst out
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: of a taxi in Vienna. In front of them the
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: US Embassy. Only a few dozen feet stand between them
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: and their freedom. When they hastily push open the car door,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: they don't bother to close it behind them. Every second counts.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: A white taxi had been tailing them the whole ride.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Inside the taxi are their bodyguards. Bodyguards they have just
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: escaped from. The couple sprints across the pavement and hops
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: up the few stairs to the embassy. If a bystander
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: were to hit pause, freeze frames, and zoom in on
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: the couple their arms outstretched ready to open the heavy doors,
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: sweat clinging to their foreheads and upper lips, they might
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: recognize them. This is Shin sang Ok, a famous South
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Korean film director, and his wife, the award winning actress
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: Choi yunhi. Here on the steps of the United States Embassy.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: They are moments away from catching their biggest break yet.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: For the last several years, the couple has been in
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: the clause of the North Korean government. Today they're making
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: a break for it. Their life has been so bizarre
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: it could be mistaken for an action movie plot a
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: little too on the nose for the likes of Shin
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: and Choi. Their story involves kidnapping, love affairs, and friendships
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: with unstable dictators. But before we press play and see
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: if they pass through the embassy doors, we need to
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: rewind and watch the strange series of events that led
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: two of the most influential figures in cinema to become
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: personal hostages of Kim Jong Il. Welcome back to Very
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Special Episodes and I Heeart original podcast. I'm your host,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: Danish Schwartz and this is North by North Korea.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: Thank you for joining us. I'm joined by Janishwartz. Hey,
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: Zarah Burnette. I'm Jason English. I kept thinking as we're
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: reading drafts of this one that if we were writing
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: depraved Kim Jong Ill fan fiction like this is the
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: kind of crazy stuff that we could only hope to approach.
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, he is such a mercurial, strange character
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: as a dictator's son, but also as like just a
• 2:49
  Speaker 3: Hollywood and American lover. You don't see it coming.
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: It's such an amazing character.
• 2:54
  Speaker 5: This, I will say, is the one very special episode
• 2:57
  Speaker 5: the most where as I was reading it, this is
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: a movie.
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: Oh, this is incredible. I can't believe this story was real.
• 3:04
  Speaker 5: I had to like fact check this episode as I
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: was going where, I was like, is Jason doing an
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: April Fool's Day on me?
• 3:10
  Speaker 4: Is this too good?
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah? How can this be real? This is the best
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: love story I've never heard.
• 3:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah, a couple a love story? Are you kidding me?
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: All right? I don't want to give too much away.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: Let's get back into it. We'll discuss on the other side.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: The first time Shin sang Ak laid eyes on Choi
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: and he he saw her for who she truly was,
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: an ambitious creative force. It was nineteen fifty, three months
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: after the Korean Wars armistice. Both countries were still smoldering
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: from bombings and napalm. North Korea was run by a
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: socialist dictatorship. Our story starts in South Korea. Shin was
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: an aspiring director looking for a leading lady for his
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: upcoming film. He'd heard of the talented and popular Madame Choi,
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: so he bought a ticket to see her in a
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: play in a city south of Seoul. In that theater
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: on that unassuming evening, Shin couldn't take his eyes off
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: of her.
• 4:19
  Speaker 6: Chin grew up in an affluent household. His talents were
• 4:23
  Speaker 6: encouraged by his family. He was seen as gifted child.
• 4:27
  Speaker 6: He went to some of the best schools and he
• 4:30
  Speaker 6: was able to study painting and art in Tokyo during
• 4:34
  Speaker 6: the war.
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: This is Ravi Mangla, a writer and novelist. His most
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: recent book, The Observer is a fictionalized version of Shin
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: and Choi's story.
• 4:45
  Speaker 6: And then on the other side you have Choi, who
• 4:47
  Speaker 6: is a very shy and reserved child, her talents not
• 4:51
  Speaker 6: encouraged in the same way, and acting was a place
• 4:53
  Speaker 6: where she found solace and where she really came alive.
• 4:57
  Speaker 6: And when she told her parents that that she wanted
• 5:00
  Speaker 6: to be an actress, that was not something that they
• 5:02
  Speaker 6: accepted readily. So when she was seventeen, she actually ran
• 5:05
  Speaker 6: away to join up with a theater troop, and during
• 5:10
  Speaker 6: the war she was an entertainer for troops. So both
• 5:14
  Speaker 6: she and Shin ended up in the entertainment industry, but
• 5:18
  Speaker 6: through two very different channels.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: As the play unfolded, Shin watched Choi give everything she
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: had on stage until she had nothing left.
• 5:28
  Speaker 6: Choi, who was suffering from exhaustion at the time fainted
• 5:32
  Speaker 6: on stage, and as a story goes, Shin rushed up
• 5:36
  Speaker 6: to the stage, picked her up, threw her over her shoulder,
• 5:40
  Speaker 6: and then took her to the nearest hospital.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Shin stayed with Choi throughout her hospital visit. When she
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: was released, Choi told Shin about her struggles, how her
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: husband couldn't work, and how poor they were. Shin, having
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: only watched her perform in half a play, felt in
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: his gut that it was his destiny to meet her,
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: so he offered her the role in his upcoming film.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: He'd pay her as much as he could. According to
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Paul Fisher's excellent book A Kim Jong Ill Production, which
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: we'll link to in the show notes, Shin started loitering
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: around the theater's back door waiting for Choi to be
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: done with her play. Shin always called her Madame Choi
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: a sign of respect. They'd wander the streets so wrapped
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: up in conversation they'd miss the mandatory curfew. They snuck
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: around like teenagers, although they were both well into their
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: late twenties. Shin told Madame Choi, any film I make,
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: I want you to be in it. Choi filed for
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: divorce and swiftly married Chin on March seventh, nineteen fifty four.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: They'd known each other for less than a year. Once
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: they joined forces, they were unstoppable. Shin began to build
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: up his studio and cast Joy in nearly every film,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: right when the South Korean public wanted nothing more than
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: to escape to other worlds.
• 7:13
  Speaker 7: They're so powerful, I think as a couple because Chit
• 7:17
  Speaker 7: is the on screen figure, right and again, she is
• 7:21
  Speaker 7: so unmistakable, and then Shin is able to take her
• 7:26
  Speaker 7: through all of these really iconic roles that really span
• 7:31
  Speaker 7: across the kind of feminine archetypes that you can think
• 7:35
  Speaker 7: of or you could come up with, right, and so
• 7:38
  Speaker 7: I think that that partnership is so fruitful because you
• 7:40
  Speaker 7: have a screen presence and then a behind the camera
• 7:43
  Speaker 7: presence and they're kind of in synergy.
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: That's Michelle Cho, an assistant professor at the University of Toronto.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Her focus is on Korean film and culture.
• 7:55
  Speaker 7: South Green filmmaking of the early post war is described
• 7:59
  Speaker 7: as a golden age because there were some really iconic
• 8:04
  Speaker 7: films that were produced during the time that are really
• 8:07
  Speaker 7: sophisticated in terms of the way that they're trying to
• 8:10
  Speaker 7: process the changes that are happening in society.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: Shin and Choi worked across genres and grew exponentially.
• 8:19
  Speaker 6: Shin was also an innovator. He entered films and competitions
• 8:23
  Speaker 6: all around the world. So this was the first time
• 8:26
  Speaker 6: that South Korean film was really getting out onto the
• 8:30
  Speaker 6: international stage, and people were seeing what was being created
• 8:33
  Speaker 6: in South Korea, and they were hearing stories that they
• 8:36
  Speaker 6: had never heard before.
• 8:38
  Speaker 7: There are some parts of his body of work that
• 8:40
  Speaker 7: people will compare directly to Hollywood films that he likely
• 8:45
  Speaker 7: adapted a lot of things from. So you know, he
• 8:49
  Speaker 7: dabbled in the Western, He made a bunch of these
• 8:53
  Speaker 7: family melodramas. He made period pieces, he made war films.
• 8:59
  Speaker 7: He was really kind of a sponge, I think, in
• 9:03
  Speaker 7: terms of picking up influences esthetically and emotionally from this
• 9:09
  Speaker 7: kind of world cinema culture that was around him.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: It's up for debate whether Shin was intentional about creating
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: more political and progressive stories.
• 9:20
  Speaker 7: A lot of Shin's films, especially during the Golden Age,
• 9:24
  Speaker 7: were Enlightenment films quote unquote.
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: One obvious example is Shin and Choy's nineteen sixty one
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: film The Evergreen Tree, about an educated couple who tries
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: to instill modern schooling in a small rural town. They
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: become local heroes as they also fight against the colonialist
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: Japanese government trying to undo their teachings.
• 9:50
  Speaker 7: And so that has a very specific meaning in postcolonial Korea,
• 9:56
  Speaker 7: where it's kind of a storytelling mode that talks about
• 10:01
  Speaker 7: the modernization of a person, whether that's through a transformative
• 10:06
  Speaker 7: encounter with like an inspiring teacher or a learning experience
• 10:12
  Speaker 7: of a youth that then kind of forces them to
• 10:15
  Speaker 7: look at the world in a new way. This enlightenment
• 10:18
  Speaker 7: mode is really intended to teach the public how to
• 10:22
  Speaker 7: think of themselves as new national subjects and as new
• 10:26
  Speaker 7: like modern subjects. So what are modern ways of thinking? Rationality,
• 10:31
  Speaker 7: you know, a pursuit of learning, a kind of desire
• 10:35
  Speaker 7: to remake yourself as like a civilized human being. In
• 10:41
  Speaker 7: this very like progressive mode.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: These stories helped Korean audiences process not only their violent
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: past but a hopeful future, and the films were a hit.
• 10:53
  Speaker 6: It received quite a lot of acclaim at the time,
• 10:56
  Speaker 6: but they were extremely prolific during that period, producing over
• 11:00
  Speaker 6: two hundred films and Shin himself directed over seventy films.
• 11:05
  Speaker 7: Shin films is really responsible for the popularization of cinema
• 11:09
  Speaker 7: as like a core aspect of popular culture in South Korea.
• 11:15
  Speaker 7: It was such a strong and dominant source of films
• 11:20
  Speaker 7: and it defined the film culture.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: But Shin's films wouldn't have been nearly half as good
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: without his better half. Chi was more than a muse.
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: She was Shin's creative equal.
• 11:33
  Speaker 7: She is an unmistakably iconic screen presence. Shin casts her
• 11:40
  Speaker 7: in a couple of his most iconic films of the fifties.
• 11:45
  Speaker 7: I have thought quite a lot about how it's the
• 11:48
  Speaker 7: case that Chen he was so respected despite the fact
• 11:52
  Speaker 7: that she played characters who are representative of the most
• 11:58
  Speaker 7: kind of denigrated groups of people in South Korea.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Choi took on every kind of role imaginable, from a
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: confident sex worker to a chaste and dutiful widow.
• 12:09
  Speaker 7: So it's this constant struggle to try and reshape attitudes
• 12:13
  Speaker 7: around gender which is part of what makes Chi such
• 12:16
  Speaker 7: a remarkable figure. I have to think that the fact
• 12:19
  Speaker 7: of her marriage to Shin was part of what protected her.
• 12:23
  Speaker 7: I think because even if she played characters on screen
• 12:28
  Speaker 7: who lacked legitimacy, she in real life had the legitimacy
• 12:34
  Speaker 7: of this very powerful figure in the film industry.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: According to Paul Fisher's book, Choi was paid the highest
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: fees of any other actress, and even more than Shin,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: making Choi the bread winner in their house. Their whole
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: life revolved around their films. They even optimized their home
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: for work. They had a room where they set up
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: an editing bed and a large projector to sit side
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: by side and edit each movie together. At the height
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: of Shin Studios, they employed over three hundred people and
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: produced thirty films a year. Choi also started an acting
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: school and mentored younger actors. Part of their success came
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: from Shin's refusal to let anything get in the way
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: of his vision. A contemporary said Shin would have jumped
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: down to hell to make a film. By the early sixties,
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: Shin Studios was at its height. They had it all
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: well almost.
• 13:39
  Speaker 6: There is a story that Choi said that you wanted
• 13:41
  Speaker 6: to have children, and Shin said, why do we need children?
• 13:44
  Speaker 6: Our films are our children, which gives you a look
• 13:48
  Speaker 6: into how single minded he often was about filmmaking.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: But Choi wanted more When she had a hard time
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: getting pregnant, they decided to adopt. Now they really had
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: it all, stratospheric careers, fame, prestige, and a family. Their
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: names were always mentioned in the same breath. Every day.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: Shin got to peer through the camera lens and look
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: at his two loves at once, Choi and movies. Life
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: was picture perfect until someone of great importance took notice
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: of them. Over the border, North Korean film was going
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: through its own revolution, though under a very different regime.
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: When the thirty eighth parallel was tattooed into maps, North
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: Korea isolated itself from most of the world. The exception
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: was those countries who were bankrolling them to stay afloat,
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: like China and the USSR. North Korea became an authoritarian,
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: socialist regime. There was no freedom of speech, movement, or expression.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: Organized religion was restricted. Kim ilsung was the first great leader,
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: and everything and everyone served his vision. Neighbors were encouraged
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: to spy on one another, and history was rewritten in
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: the regime's favor. No one was allowed to question their leader.
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: Small infractions could be interpreted as an act against the state,
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: resulting in relocation to the countryside. Image was everything, and
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Kim Ilsung knew that.
• 15:41
  Speaker 6: So North Korean culture at the time embraced an extreme
• 15:45
  Speaker 6: level of conformity. People had a strong sense of duty
• 15:48
  Speaker 6: to Kim's father and figures of authority, and they valued
• 15:52
  Speaker 6: the collective over the individual, and that was really reflected
• 15:57
  Speaker 6: in all of the art and cinema and materials being
• 16:01
  Speaker 6: created at the time. Propaganda was being created to enhance
• 16:05
  Speaker 6: the reputation of the government and earn loyalty from the populace.
• 16:10
  Speaker 6: So North Korean citizens at the time were restricted from
• 16:15
  Speaker 6: consuming Western media, and the latest films at the time
• 16:18
  Speaker 6: were not accessible to North Korean residents.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: All films were under state control, and film is the
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: ideal medium for propaganda. It's easy to tell a message
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: on a mass scale where everyone watches together and can
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: watch each other.
• 16:38
  Speaker 7: From the beginning, the leadership in North Korea understands the
• 16:42
  Speaker 7: power of this medium and so wants to be able
• 16:48
  Speaker 7: to harness it for the sake of educating the public,
• 16:52
  Speaker 7: of instilling in the public a better understanding of what
• 16:56
  Speaker 7: the guiding ideology of the North Korean state is, what
• 17:00
  Speaker 7: it should be. That's the distinctive feature of mass culture
• 17:04
  Speaker 7: in a socialist country, and so it's entertainment. Yes, it's
• 17:09
  Speaker 7: showing ways for the populace to be kind of modern
• 17:14
  Speaker 7: and to think of themselves as new national subjects after
• 17:17
  Speaker 7: liberation or after the Korean War. But fundamentally it's there
• 17:21
  Speaker 7: to serve as an ideological vehicle.
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: All films are structured around the North Korean philosophy of Jewshe.
• 17:30
  Speaker 7: So the North Korean state ideology is called chu che ideology,
• 17:35
  Speaker 7: and it is translated as self reliance. I think of
• 17:40
  Speaker 7: it as a kind of paradox or tension at the
• 17:43
  Speaker 7: core of cheu che ideology in the sense that it
• 17:48
  Speaker 7: is placing responsibility for maintaining a kind of collective vision
• 17:55
  Speaker 7: in the individual hands of each member of society. And
• 17:59
  Speaker 7: so it does this really interesting thing of balancing out
• 18:03
  Speaker 7: the individual and collective.
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: Do you say bristles at the thought of asking for help.
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: It states that every individual should hold their own and
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: every action they take is for the collective good of
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: North Korea alone. If the collective relies on each other,
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: they don't need outsiders and can avoid being dependent on
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: countries like they had been in the past.
• 18:28
  Speaker 7: But it was also a way for North Korea to
• 18:32
  Speaker 7: also keep itself independent or distinguishable from the malist communist
• 18:39
  Speaker 7: China and the Soviets and not get overshadowed by larger
• 18:46
  Speaker 7: nation states that seek to incorporate the North into whatever
• 18:50
  Speaker 7: their agenda might be. And I think that comes directly
• 18:54
  Speaker 7: out of the experience of colonial occupation under Japan, and
• 18:59
  Speaker 7: that also shapes the way that North Korea sees what
• 19:02
  Speaker 7: South Korea is, which is as a puppet colony of
• 19:05
  Speaker 7: the United States.
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: Because all films were created through the lens of Jeuchet,
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: all of the films had nearly identical plots.
• 19:16
  Speaker 7: The dominant structure of North Korean films is this kind
• 19:21
  Speaker 7: of trajectory of some individual person going through hardship, either
• 19:27
  Speaker 7: because of class struggle, you know, or because of some
• 19:32
  Speaker 7: kind of injustice that they experience, and then coming to
• 19:37
  Speaker 7: realize through that suffering that the principles of Juche and
• 19:44
  Speaker 7: the stewardship of the deer leader are what offer some
• 19:48
  Speaker 7: kind of hope.
• 19:49
  Speaker 6: So a de factor of North Korea had said that
• 19:52
  Speaker 6: you didn't even have to stay for the second half
• 19:54
  Speaker 6: of a North Korean film because you knew what was
• 19:56
  Speaker 6: going to happen. There was no surprise.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: Although these movies objectively were boring and poorly made. There
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: was one person who was obsessed with film, Kim Ilsong's
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: eldest son, Kim Jong il.
• 20:11
  Speaker 7: He is widely known to be a film buff, with
• 20:14
  Speaker 7: a huge collection of films in a private collection that
• 20:19
  Speaker 7: he gets to access because most North Koreans do not
• 20:23
  Speaker 7: get to see films from the West.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: Although Kim Jong Iel was raised in extreme wealth and power,
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: his childhood wasn't a happy one, so Kim Jong.
• 20:34
  Speaker 6: Yiel had a lonely upbringing. By all accounts, the people
• 20:38
  Speaker 6: he played with or was allowed to socialize with was
• 20:41
  Speaker 6: extremely limited, and he found solace in film. Film was
• 20:45
  Speaker 6: something he fell in love with, so.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: He submerged himself in films. He started a bootlegging and
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: smuggling ring to bring international films into the country. He
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: had American prisoners of war translate and voice American films.
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: He created his own massive secret cinema layer, air conditioned
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: and fully staffed with two hundred and fifty people all
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: for an audience of one, and.
• 21:13
  Speaker 6: As he got older, he amassed the collection of more
• 21:16
  Speaker 6: than twenty thousand films. He was known as a huge
• 21:19
  Speaker 6: fan of Elizabeth Taylor. He loved the James Bond franchise.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: Kim Jong eel would rather watch movies all day than
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: partake in mandatory military service. He also had a bad
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: temperament and lashed out at people. Kim Jong il wasn't
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: qualified to inherit the country. Kim Ilsung couldn't place his
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: artsy antagonistic son until a perfect situation fell into his lap.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: One film was made. Some sources say it was a
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: play that risked challenging Kim ilsung's personality cult. It was
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: interpreted as treason. The creators were sent to the mountains,
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: and Kim il sung stormed into the studio office to
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: lecture the remaining studio executives. After his tirade, Kim il
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: sung asked the room if anyone had the courage to
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: lead the propaganda and Agitation department in accordance with the
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: party's ideologies and rules. Standing behind nearly everyone in the back,
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: Kim Jong il raised his hand.
• 22:30
  Speaker 6: In this informal role of propaganda minister, he was allowed
• 22:34
  Speaker 6: to lean into his love of film craft at the
• 22:37
  Speaker 6: same time he was being carefully trained to take on
• 22:43
  Speaker 6: a leadership role at a time that his father stepped aside.
• 22:47
  Speaker 6: So in a way, it was a win win for
• 22:50
  Speaker 6: both Kim and for his father.
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: Once Kim jong il took the reins of the film industry,
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: he thrived by North Korean standards.
• 23:00
  Speaker 6: He even wrote a book of film criticism in nineteen
• 23:03
  Speaker 6: seventy three called on the Art of Cinema. And this
• 23:06
  Speaker 6: was not just a thin fifty page book. We are
• 23:09
  Speaker 6: talking about a four hundred page tome. And in that
• 23:12
  Speaker 6: book he talked about how all films should be imbued
• 23:15
  Speaker 6: with an ideology It advocated for film is propaganda.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: Kim ilsung loved the films his son oversaw, but Kim
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: Jong ill knew something his father didn't. These films were bad.
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: Although citizens were told that North Korean film was the
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: best in the world and leading the film industry, Kim
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: jong il had watched enough foreign films to know that
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: his movies were not up to snuff. Kim Ill's song
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: also wanted North Korean film to be internationally recognized, so
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: the world could one day know that North Korea is
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: superior to every other country. But even South Korean cinema
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: was outpacing them, and he had to do something.
• 24:05
  Speaker 6: Kim Jong yale felt that the only way that he
• 24:09
  Speaker 6: could fix the North Korean film industry was with better talent,
• 24:13
  Speaker 6: and he saw Shin sang Ok and Choi and he
• 24:16
  Speaker 6: in South Korea, and he wanted that for his country.
• 24:20
  Speaker 6: He wanted it in such a literal way he was
• 24:23
  Speaker 6: willing to go to extreme lengths to get it.
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: Despite the meteoric success of Shin Studios, Shin and Choi
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: made movies during a time of increased censorship and authoritarian
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: rule by the South Korean government, but Shin did what
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: he had to do not to let anything get in
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: the way of his films.
• 24:58
  Speaker 6: Shin and Choi were able to rub shoulders with the
• 25:03
  Speaker 6: country's cultural and political elite. They had a good relationship
• 25:07
  Speaker 6: at the time with General Park.
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: The current leader of South Korea was General Park, who
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: had seized power via coup in nineteen sixty one. Park
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: wanted to show the world that South Koreans embraced modernism
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: and were culturally sophisticated, not like those tyrant socialists in
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: the north. General Park and his wife also had a
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: close personal relationship with Shin and Choi.
• 25:36
  Speaker 6: And for that reason he allowed Shan and Choi with
• 25:40
  Speaker 6: a great deal of artistic license, at least in the
• 25:43
  Speaker 6: early going. Because he wanted South Korea to be recognized
• 25:47
  Speaker 6: on the international stage. He wanted that cultural recognition from
• 25:51
  Speaker 6: the Western world.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: In the nineteen seventies, tensions rose between North and South Korea.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: General Park became more authoritarian, he started limiting the rights
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: and freedoms of South Koreans.
• 26:08
  Speaker 7: So from nineteen seventy two onwards kind of shows this
• 26:12
  Speaker 7: censorship regime growing and kind of being much more involved
• 26:16
  Speaker 7: in trying to well first take out anything that could
• 26:21
  Speaker 7: potentially be perceived as political viewpoints. The guiding principle to
• 26:28
  Speaker 7: all of his initiatives and the way that he's able
• 26:31
  Speaker 7: to convince the Korean public to go along with it
• 26:34
  Speaker 7: is this anti communist stance that everything that he's doing
• 26:38
  Speaker 7: to restrict the liberties and freedoms of South Koreans is
• 26:42
  Speaker 7: absolutely necessary in order to fend off the threat of
• 26:45
  Speaker 7: North Korea. But my sense is that Shin made some
• 26:51
  Speaker 7: of his best films in South Korea and kind of
• 26:55
  Speaker 7: experienced a lot of growth and really reached the peak
• 26:59
  Speaker 7: of his career when he had a pretty friendly relationship
• 27:03
  Speaker 7: with the government. There's a sense that, you know, Shin
• 27:07
  Speaker 7: Films and Shin Studios was getting along really well with
• 27:11
  Speaker 7: the Pukjangi administration until it didn't.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Now, South Korea was becoming as tight lipped as an
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: estranged brother to the North, especially in the arts.
• 27:25
  Speaker 6: Parks. Regime became much stricter around ideas in film and
• 27:30
  Speaker 6: music and art, and there were extremely rigid censorship boards
• 27:35
  Speaker 6: that would review films over and over again to make
• 27:38
  Speaker 6: sure that the content was nothing that could be seen
• 27:40
  Speaker 6: as controversial or out of step with South Korea and
• 27:45
  Speaker 6: the South Korean government at the time.
• 27:47
  Speaker 7: So anything that could be even in the slightest way
• 27:52
  Speaker 7: interpreted as criticism of the government is a no go.
• 27:57
  Speaker 7: Clearly he is really interested in policing. You know what
• 28:03
  Speaker 7: people see in film and television.
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: Regardless of politics, Shin always managed to use his political
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: connections to get his movies made. No matter the content,
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: Shin began to believe that he was above the rules.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: He continued to follow his artistic inclinations even if they
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: went against the censorship laws. Every other time he'd broken
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: the rules, he would just go and chat with his
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: government friends. But times were changing.
• 28:39
  Speaker 7: In a screening of a film a new film, Shin
• 28:43
  Speaker 7: had refused to take out a romantic scene, so a
• 28:47
  Speaker 7: scene where characters kiss, and that so angered the censorship
• 28:54
  Speaker 7: office that Shin Films Like finally loses favor with the
• 28:58
  Speaker 7: Pakshani administration.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: This time, Shin's justifications fell on deaf ears at the
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: censorship bureau. He was also stripped of his film license.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: That wasn't all he lost during this time.
• 29:15
  Speaker 6: About this time, the time that Chin Studios was beginning
• 29:19
  Speaker 6: to decline and running into struggles with the censorship boards,
• 29:24
  Speaker 6: was also the time that Chin and Choy's relationship was
• 29:28
  Speaker 6: facing a lot of difficulties in friction. So in the
• 29:32
  Speaker 6: early nineteen seventies, Shin struck up an affair with a
• 29:36
  Speaker 6: younger actress and this became a public scandal.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: Up until now, Choi had always looked the other way
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: when Shin had dalliances with other women. They were usually flings,
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: nothing serious, But this time was different. One morning home alone,
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: Choi picked up a film magazine and saw her Hu
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: Spin's name in a headline. Ice ran through her veins
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: as she scanned through the article. According to the news,
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: Shin had just become a father. He had had an
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: affair with a much younger actress and she gave birth
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: to Shin's son. Affairs were one thing but a love child.
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: When Shin knew, Choi was crestfallen that she couldn't give
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: birth on her own. They tried to make it work,
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: but then the actress gave birth to a second child.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: This was unforgivable, and Choi separated from Shin. Now Shin
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: had no wife, no career, no studio, no art to make.
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: The whole life he'd built began to unspool, like a
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: film a reel tumbling to the ground. Due to the
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: decline of Shin studios, Choi's acting studio and career took
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: a hit two life faded from technicolor to black and
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: white for both of them. Time went by, it looked
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: like there was no way for this former powerhouse to
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: regain their relationship or creative status. Until one unsuspecting day
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy seven, Choi received a curious visitor, a
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: Hong Kong businessman, asked if she would be interested in
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: directing a film in China. It was a strange request,
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: but Choi needed a break from South Korea. Choi packed
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: a bag and flew to Hong Kong, where the Chinese
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: businessmen whined and dined her when she tried to mention
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: the film, the men changed the subject. This unnerved her.
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: On her penultimate morning, men with sloppy long hair put
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: a bag over her head and threw her into a boat.
• 32:06
  Speaker 6: She described being held in the hall of a cargo
• 32:09
  Speaker 6: ship and feeling incredible fear. She had no idea what
• 32:13
  Speaker 6: was going on, but had been coerced onto this boat
• 32:16
  Speaker 6: and now does not know what the future holds, what
• 32:19
  Speaker 6: is in front of her, what is happening.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: For six days, Choi felt unmoored as the waves undulated
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: beneath her.
• 32:27
  Speaker 4: She barely ate.
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: When the boat anchored, she was transferred to a smaller vessel.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: Choi was brought up on deck and then brought on
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: shore a little ways away from the main port, still
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: wearing the same outfit she was kidnapped in. A man
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: in a large coat approached her with a huge smile.
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: Thank you for coming, Madam Chroi.
• 32:52
  Speaker 6: You must be exhausted.
• 32:54
  Speaker 7: Welcome, I am Kim Jong Il.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Choi musters the strength to not faint. The North Korean
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: dictator's son is standing before her, talking to her by
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: her name. People in North Korea hadn't even heard Kim
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: Jong il's voice yet someone whipped out a camera and
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: took a photo. Choi tried to hide, the camera clicked,
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: and the photo is the large, smiling silhouette of Kim
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: Jong ill. Madame Choi, after a life of having her
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: picture taken, buried her chin and nose into her scarf.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: The rest of her face is hidden under large sunglasses.
• 33:43
  Speaker 6: So it's a bit of a whirlwind for Choi. Once
• 33:46
  Speaker 6: she arrives in North Korea, she is brought to luxury accommodations.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: Choi is taken to a villa, which is really a
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: tacky yet glamorous house. Arrest, her handlers walked her under
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: gaudy chandeliers to her new rooms. Her passport and South
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: Korean identity card are taken. Her new bedroom is filled
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: with clothing tailor to her body, along with makeup she
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: used to use. They had been expecting her. When she
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: went to shut the door, she noticed the doors didn't lock.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: She will soon find that none of them do. Inside
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: this prison palace, her days are no longer her own
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: and are structured around her quote re education.
• 34:36
  Speaker 6: She's introduced to a private tutor who immediately begins talking
• 34:40
  Speaker 6: to her about the life and achievements of Kim Ilsong
• 34:43
  Speaker 6: she's isolated and board and being held in these luxury
• 34:46
  Speaker 6: accommodations for reasons that she doesn't understand. She doesn't know
• 34:50
  Speaker 6: why she has been brought to this country, what they
• 34:52
  Speaker 6: want of her. But she's almost like a you know,
• 34:57
  Speaker 6: an animal in a cage, just be being paraded around
• 35:02
  Speaker 6: and has no autonomy of her own.
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: During her re education, Choi learns fast not to question
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: what she's taught about North Korea, no matter how fanciful
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: and highly unlikely. Now in the belly of the beast,
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: Choi must do her best acting. Yet there's a phone
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: in her room where Kim jong il has a private
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: phone line for just Choi. He frequently calls her up,
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: asking if she's doing anything like it's a genuine question.
• 35:36
  Speaker 6: Kim Jong il is very excited by the arrival of Choi.
• 35:40
  Speaker 6: He has been isolated his whole life in his love
• 35:44
  Speaker 6: of cinema, and in Choi, he has somebody who he respects.
• 35:49
  Speaker 6: He respects her opinion. He wants to know her thoughts
• 35:52
  Speaker 6: and perspectives on art and entertainment. This seems a very
• 35:55
  Speaker 6: one sided relationship that Kim has almost force somebody to
• 36:01
  Speaker 6: be his friend. He has the friend that he always wanted.
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: At times, Kim Jong il calls her teacher Choi, given
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: that she was well into her fifties by now.
• 36:12
  Speaker 6: So Choi's behavior at the time is heavily watched over,
• 36:18
  Speaker 6: and she has people instructing her on how to behave
• 36:22
  Speaker 6: and act. She does not have a lot of freedom
• 36:25
  Speaker 6: to do the things she wants to say the things
• 36:28
  Speaker 6: she wants. She has been taught to be totally obedient
• 36:33
  Speaker 6: at this time, So while Kim admires her opinions and
• 36:38
  Speaker 6: wants her perspectives on things in a larger sense, she's
• 36:43
  Speaker 6: extremely limited in what she can say and do.
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: As Choi spent more time with Kim, she saw that
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: he had all the trappings of a dictator's son. He
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: had lavish parties, surrounded by yes men and women. Choi
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: was invited to the party. He's often as if she
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: had an option to decline.
• 37:04
  Speaker 6: So he loved parading Choi around as arm candy, as
• 37:09
  Speaker 6: a prize or a trophy that he had acquired.
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: Choi's disappearance didn't go unnoticed in South Korea. Shin had
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: known she was going to Hong Kong and was growing
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: concerned he hadn't heard from her so he called a
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: friend and was told to go there himself. When he
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: arrived in Hong Kong, he learned about her disappearance and
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: that all of her luggage was left in her hotel room,
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: which gave the impression she would return.
• 37:41
  Speaker 6: This was not somebody who had escaped, so Shin believed
• 37:46
  Speaker 6: that she had been kidnapped or something awful had happened.
• 37:49
  Speaker 6: And keep in mind they had children. They had children
• 37:52
  Speaker 6: who were wondering where their mother was.
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: Shin had to go to the United States for a spell,
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: but returned to Hong Kong to an investigate, and unfortunately
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: he met a similar fate.
• 38:05
  Speaker 6: Shin came to Hong Kong and he ended up being
• 38:08
  Speaker 6: betrayed by a friend who is an agent for the
• 38:11
  Speaker 6: North Korean government.
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: His kidnapping was a repeat of his wife's. His days
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: were broken up into hours of ideological training, lunch, and
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: a nap. The latter half of his day was spent
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: watching North Korean films that Kim Jong il specifically requested
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: he watch. For some reason, the films were so bad,
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: Shin preferred the ideological training. Unlike Choi, who used her
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: acting chops to survive, Shin only knew action. He was
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: not used to someone else directing his life. He tried
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: to escape twice. When he was recaptured the second time,
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: the North Koreans threw him in a packed detention center.
• 38:58
  Speaker 6: He was kept in that detention center for for three years,
• 39:00
  Speaker 6: where he was in a cell so small he could
• 39:03
  Speaker 6: barely lie down. He was forced to undergo extreme re education,
• 39:09
  Speaker 6: and he lost a great deal of weight. His health
• 39:11
  Speaker 6: suffered quite a bit during that time.
• 39:14
  Speaker 1: With nothing to do, all Shin could do was think.
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: He relived and rewatched every mistake he had ever made
• 39:23
  Speaker 1: in his life, his affairs, his children, his career, and
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: hurting choy and mixed in this doew of regret, he
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: began to mentally re edit all of his films as
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: he stared at the same spot in his cell every day,
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: he redirected his movies in his head, played them on repeat, reshoot, retrimmed,
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: and reorganized each one to have a stronger impact. If
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: only he could get one more chance. Then, one day,
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: after years of living in a deplorable detention, Chin was
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: released and told to get ready to meet the dictator's son.
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: Over the same three years, only the seasons changed for
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: Choi when she asked to be reunited with her family.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: She was told she would see them once the two
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: Koreas reunite. As the world continued to spin around the sun,
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: she quietly celebrated each of her children's birthdays to herself.
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: She often went into her bathroom and turned on the
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: faucet so no one could hear her weeping. Her days
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: were spent writing long congratulatory letters to both Kim Jong
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: il and his father, thanking them for showing her the
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: light and superior ways of North Korea. In the moments
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: when she put down her pen, she continued to rack
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: her brain as to why she was here. One unsuspecting night,
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: She's invited to another one of Kim's lavish parties. When
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: she arrives, she notices that there's something extra about this party.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: There are more people, more food, louder music, and everyone
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: is congratulating her for reasons she doesn't understand. In all
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: of the merriment, the guest of honor walks in the
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: music stopped. A woman grabbed Choi by the arm and
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: began to bring her over to the guest of honor,
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: a thin and frail man. Choi's heart drops to her stomach.
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: It takes her a moment to recognize him, but she
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: knew this man, she knew him very well.
• 41:42
  Speaker 6: That's the first time that they are seeing each other
• 41:45
  Speaker 6: in about five years. So it's hard to imagine just
• 41:48
  Speaker 6: the shock of seeing a ghost, someone that you weren't
• 41:53
  Speaker 6: sure was alive, that you had no idea where they were,
• 41:57
  Speaker 6: and somebody who you had built a life with suddenly
• 42:00
  Speaker 6: appearing in this foreign land. At a party by Kim
• 42:04
  Speaker 6: Jong Il, and I think there was a sense of
• 42:07
  Speaker 6: relief to know that one another was all right.
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: Choi was left standing in front of Shin. The room
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: went quiet. Kim jong Il looks from one to the other.
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: He tells them to hug each other. For heaven's sake,
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: Why are they both just standing there? Then Choi rests
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: her head on Shin's shoulder the way she used to,
• 42:32
  Speaker 1: and feels the familiar groove of his collarbone, the safety
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: of his chest. Despite the bankruptcy and the affairs and
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: the love children and now kidnapping, the world falls away
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: and they hold on to each other for dear life.
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: The room irrupts in applause. Kim Jong Il announces that
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: mister Shin will be his film advisor. The party continued
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: for hours. When the party was over, they were driven
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: back to another prison palace. They would be living together
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: again with their handlers.
• 43:11
  Speaker 4: Of course.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: When they arrived, they entered their private bathroom, Choi turned
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: on the faucets and they tentatively began to recap the
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: last five years. At first, Shin was apprehensive of Choi,
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: she seemed to have good relations with the North Koreans
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: while at the party. Then Choi equipped why the movie
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: director can't even recognize acting when he sees it and laughed.
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: Regardless of their past, at least they weren't alone anymore.
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: The last thing they discussed while the water was still
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: running was outlining not a movie, but an escape. The
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: next morning, Kim Jong Ill put them to work.
• 43:58
  Speaker 6: For six months. He had them watch four five films
• 44:02
  Speaker 6: a day and critique them. He gave them access to
• 44:05
  Speaker 6: his entire film library, and he engaged them in deep
• 44:09
  Speaker 6: conversations about film and art. So now he has two friends,
• 44:15
  Speaker 6: and he is absolutely over the moon.
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: And Choi and Shin finally learned the real reason they
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: were kidnapped. First, Kim believed making movies would help fund
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: the economy. Despite these opulent parties. The regime was actually
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: in decline. The North Korean economy hadn't bounced back enough
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: to repay the loans they had received from China and
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: the USSR. Kim Jong il wanted to maintain his lavish lifestyle.
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: Amongst many of his devious plans to boost the economy,
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: Kim Jong il believed that film revenue from international distribution
• 44:57
  Speaker 1: could be one way.
• 44:59
  Speaker 6: And Kim Jong Il's goal is to have North Korean
• 45:03
  Speaker 6: cinema recognized on an international scale, and he knows a
• 45:07
  Speaker 6: propaganda film is not going to be what creates that
• 45:12
  Speaker 6: fame and recognition from you from both the East and
• 45:17
  Speaker 6: the West.
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: Kim Jong Il wanted to be on par with Hollywood
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: and Western films. Choi and Shin were left to square
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: with a leader of a hermit country who wanted international attention. Now,
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: Shin and Choi began the balancing act of outlining scripts
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: and planning their escape. The couple researched and prepared for
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: their films around the country. They had bodyguards with them
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: everywhere they went, and in these tours around the country,
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: Shin and Choi visited a rare department store that sold
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: Western items and managed to purchase a tape recorder. Shin
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: realized he could use it to his advantage. They could
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: record Kim and get him to admit that he had
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: planned to kidnap them, and that's just what they do
• 46:11
  Speaker 1: secretly at a meeting with him. This was obviously incredibly
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: risky behavior. Recording the North Korean party leaders is a
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: death sentence, but the couple can't have the outside world,
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: especially South Korean leaders, thinking they came here willingly. Choi
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: kept the recorder in her bag. She reached down and
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: as quietly as she could, pressed record. As Kim Jong
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: Ale began monologing, he discussed the problems with North Korean
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: films and his knowledge of international films. He also admitted
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: that he plotted to kidnap them without prompting. He thought
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: he could only get to Shin if he captured Choi first.
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: They kept up.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: Their appearances, laughing and smiling at Kim's jokes as they recorded.
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: When the meeting finished, Shin and Choi played back the
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: tapes with the faucet running in their bathroom. With this tape,
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: they could prove they didn't defect to North Korea. But
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: in the immediate term, Shin and Choi's first task was
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: to make a movie for Kim Il Sung's birthday April fifteenth.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: It was late October. They had six months to go.
• 47:34
  Speaker 6: What was so fascinating for me is that any act
• 47:37
  Speaker 6: of creation, any book you write or film you make,
• 47:40
  Speaker 6: it is such a deeply personal act. It's an act
• 47:44
  Speaker 6: that requires safe mental, physical, and psychological space. So the
• 47:49
  Speaker 6: idea of creating something under duress, having your life being
• 47:55
  Speaker 6: almost dangled over you while you were making a film
• 47:58
  Speaker 6: is such a strange andign concept that very few people
• 48:02
  Speaker 6: have ever experienced.
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: What is that like?
• 48:05
  Speaker 6: How do you make art that is being coerced.
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: Under duress or not? Shin couldn't help but feel like
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: himself again when he got behind the camera.
• 48:15
  Speaker 6: Kim respected Shin Enjoy so much that he allowed them
• 48:19
  Speaker 6: a level of creative control that he had never allowed
• 48:22
  Speaker 6: for any North Korean director. He was not micromanaging in
• 48:25
  Speaker 6: the same way, and he trusted their vision. He had
• 48:28
  Speaker 6: seen the way that they had catapulted the South Korean
• 48:32
  Speaker 6: film industry, and he wanted the same thing for North Korea.
• 48:35
  Speaker 6: And he knew that he was not able to helicopter
• 48:38
  Speaker 6: over them in the same way. If those were the
• 48:42
  Speaker 6: aspirations that he had in North Korea. He's given a
• 48:46
  Speaker 6: great deal of license to create what he wants and
• 48:49
  Speaker 6: given all the resources to create.
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: It even leaving the country.
• 48:54
  Speaker 6: Kim's desire for cultural superiority and international recognition is so
• 48:58
  Speaker 6: great that he begins breaking his own rules. So Shin
• 49:02
  Speaker 6: and Choi were allowed to travel internationally, and they were
• 49:04
  Speaker 6: allowed to travel on the communist side of the Iron Curtain.
• 49:09
  Speaker 6: All of this is happening in the climate of the
• 49:12
  Speaker 6: Cold War at the time.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: Under Kim Jong Il's request, they set up shop in
• 49:17
  Speaker 1: eastern Europe and started rolling. Shin had officially jumped down
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: to Hell in order to make a film. Six months later,
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: their first film, Emissary of No Return, delighted Kim Jong
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: Ill and global audiences, even winning an international award. Kim
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: Jong Il showered Toy and Shin with gifts and gave
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: them full control over future films.
• 49:47
  Speaker 6: And that means money is no object. If he wants
• 49:50
  Speaker 6: a thousand extras, Kim Jong Il will deliver them. He
• 49:54
  Speaker 6: routinely would send members conscripted in the army to serve
• 49:59
  Speaker 6: as extras in Shin's films. He wanted a train to
• 50:03
  Speaker 6: explode in one of his films, So Kim Jong yeale
• 50:06
  Speaker 6: delivered a train filled with dynamite. So whatever Shin wanted,
• 50:10
  Speaker 6: whatever Choi wanted, Kim delivered for them.
• 50:14
  Speaker 7: It's like that scale of production was possible in the
• 50:19
  Speaker 7: North Korean context because he had all of the resources
• 50:22
  Speaker 7: of the government behind him.
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: Over the next three years, Shin and Choi pumped out
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: six more films, and in the strangeness of this time,
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: Choi and Shin fell back into a similar rhythm that
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: mirrored their previous life. They began to fall back in love.
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: Their days were filled with writing, editing, coaching, acting, and directing.
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: Like in their early days, the North Korean public loved
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: all of their films. With each success, Shin asked for
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: a bigger staff and imported goods from East Germany. The
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: couple could travel as much as they wanted within the
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: walls of the Iron Block.
• 51:09
  Speaker 6: So they were able to travel to places like Moscow
• 51:12
  Speaker 6: and Czechoslovakia and enter their films in competitions. Like Kim,
• 51:17
  Speaker 6: Shin and Choi had a lot of cognitive dissonance. At
• 51:20
  Speaker 6: this time, they are being granted the freedom that they
• 51:24
  Speaker 6: were yearning for In South Korea. They have the ability
• 51:28
  Speaker 6: to make the films of their dreams.
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: When Choi and Shin were in Eastern Europe and the USSR,
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: they demonstrated pride in their work, which made the Western
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: world question their whole story about them being kidnapped.
• 51:43
  Speaker 6: This is also the first time that South Korea is
• 51:47
  Speaker 6: seeing Choi and Shin. They did not know what happened
• 51:50
  Speaker 6: to them or where they went, and this creates a
• 51:52
  Speaker 6: ton of speculation and rumor in South Korea at the time,
• 51:56
  Speaker 6: and what most people believe was that they defected, that
• 51:59
  Speaker 6: they defect did to North Korea. So now Shin and Joy,
• 52:03
  Speaker 6: formerly leading lights, formerly stars of South Korean cinema, are
• 52:09
  Speaker 6: now persona on grata. They are now widely despised by
• 52:13
  Speaker 6: the South Korean public.
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: The Western world started doubting their loyalties.
• 52:19
  Speaker 7: And I think that, yeah, Shin, there are a lot
• 52:22
  Speaker 7: of questions about what his political ideologies actually were and
• 52:27
  Speaker 7: how he really felt about one regime or another, and
• 52:31
  Speaker 7: I think we'll never be able to know that for sure. Yes,
• 52:34
  Speaker 7: it's a kidnapping, was it a defection. There's not a
• 52:38
  Speaker 7: lot of clarity. So Shin gets to make his big,
• 52:41
  Speaker 7: you know, spectacles, and Kim gets his kind of tool mouthpiece.
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: Shin and Chroi maintained that escape was always in the
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: back of their minds, no matter how gratifying the art
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: process was.
• 52:56
  Speaker 6: So in one hand they're very satisfied. On the other hand,
• 53:00
  Speaker 6: and they're still captive. They can't see their children, they
• 53:03
  Speaker 6: can't travel to many parts of the world, and they
• 53:08
  Speaker 6: knew that this was not a long term or sustainable situation.
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: The height of their fame in North Korea was their
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: monster movie Paul Gasari, a North Korean ripoff of Godzilla.
• 53:21
  Speaker 6: This was the most expensive film that North Korea had
• 53:24
  Speaker 6: ever produced. It included thousands of extras and was a
• 53:29
  Speaker 6: huge hit. Kim Jong Yel loved it, and due to
• 53:32
  Speaker 6: the success of that, they were able to make a
• 53:35
  Speaker 6: pitch for an even larger film. They wanted to make
• 53:38
  Speaker 6: an epic about Genghis Khan, and they knew that they
• 53:41
  Speaker 6: would need more financing for this, so Kim allowed them
• 53:45
  Speaker 6: to go to Vienna to meet with financiers for this
• 53:49
  Speaker 6: speculative project, and that's where they hatched their escape.
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: In nineteen eighty six, Shin and Choi cashed in all
• 54:09
  Speaker 1: of their chips. They convinced Kim Jong Ill to let
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: them set up their European studio in Vienna. At the time,
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: Austria was explicitly neutral in the contest between East and West,
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: so being in Vienna could give them enough wiggle room
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: to slip under the Iron curtain altogether. Shin and Choi
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: arrive at their hotel in the city center with their bodyguards.
• 54:36
  Speaker 1: When their bodyguards aren't looking, Shin slips a piece of
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: paper to a hotel employee. It says who they are,
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: that they're kidnapped by the North Koreans, and to please
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: send help from the US embassy.
• 54:51
  Speaker 6: Normally, whenever Shin and Shoi left the country, they would
• 54:55
  Speaker 6: have guards and minders and people making sure that they
• 55:00
  Speaker 6: an escape. But over time it became a little bit
• 55:03
  Speaker 6: more lax, and they created the pretense or lie of
• 55:09
  Speaker 6: a journalistic interview. So Shin and Choi made up a
• 55:13
  Speaker 6: story about an interview with a journalist so they were
• 55:16
  Speaker 6: able to gain some privacy from their bodyguards.
• 55:20
  Speaker 1: Shin then calls an old friend, a Japanese reporter Inoki,
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: living in Vienna, and tells him to be ready the
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: next day with a car waiting outside their hotel. Shin
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: then tells their bodyguards that they had an interview with
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: a journalist which could help convince the Western world that
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: they were in North Korea by choice. Wink wink, nuge nudge.
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: The next morning, Shin and Choi have the bodyguards over
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: for breakfast in their hotel room to maintain appearances. Then
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: at twelve thirty, Shin and Choi go outside to meet
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: They notice their bodyguards idling outside. Shin spots Innoki standing
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: by a taxi. Shin and Choi, as casually as they can,
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: muster walk down the street at a seemingly normal pace.
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: Then once they get close to the car, Shin shoves
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: both the reporter and his wife into the taxi, slams
• 56:23
  Speaker 1: the door, and they book it. In the car, Shin
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: tells Aoki they have been kidnapped by the North Koreans
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: and need to make it to the American embassy. As
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: Shin tries to spit out the situation, Choi notices in
• 56:39
  Speaker 1: the rear view mirror that a white taxi is making
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: every turn. As they do it, they tell their driver
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: to go around in circles to try to lose the taxi.
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: The taxi's radio speakers come on. The white taxi is
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: calling to ask where they went. Inenoki handed their taxi
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: driver why of cash and told their driver to lie
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: to the other taxi tell them they went the other way.
• 57:07
  Speaker 1: They were only a few minutes away from the embassy.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: Finally they arrived at the bottom of a hill. There's
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: too much traffic for the taxi to go through, so
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: Choi and Shin jump out of the car and sprint
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: towards the embassy and burst through the doors. The couple
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: pants and sweats and tries to explain who they are.
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: American diplomats escort them outside and bring them to a
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: safe house. When they enter the safe house, Choi cries
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: and falls into her husband's arms. International papers blew up
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: when the news broke about Shin and Choi. In public accounts,
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: the North Koreans claimed that Shin and Choi had come
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: to North Korea voluntarily and were now napped by the
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: South Korean government. Who knows what Kim Jong ill thought
• 58:05
  Speaker 1: after they escaped.
• 58:07
  Speaker 6: So this is the first time that Chin and Choi
• 58:10
  Speaker 6: can tell their own story, and they are brought to
• 58:13
  Speaker 6: the United States and they are held in protective housing
• 58:17
  Speaker 6: in Virginia for several years.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: Now, after decades of making fiction stories and propaganda. All
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: they cared about was telling the truth.
• 58:28
  Speaker 6: This is a time that they began writing their memoirs
• 58:30
  Speaker 6: and telling the true story behind their kidnapping. And fortunately
• 58:35
  Speaker 6: for Chin and Choi, they had been recording a lot
• 58:38
  Speaker 6: of their conversations with Kim.
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: There were many.
• 58:41
  Speaker 6: People who believe that they had voluntarily defected, and because
• 58:45
  Speaker 6: of this recordings that in many cases Choi had captured
• 58:49
  Speaker 6: holding the recorder in her purse. They were able to
• 58:51
  Speaker 6: set the record straight.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: They eventually moved to Los Angeles, a filmmaker's dream. This
• 58:59
  Speaker 1: was the third time Shin tried to rebuild Shin Studios
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: from scratch, but they couldn't catch a break. Hollywood operated
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: much differently than the film industry in Korea.
• 59:13
  Speaker 6: They found it much more difficult than they expected, and
• 59:17
  Speaker 6: Shin did have a little bit of success. He directed
• 59:21
  Speaker 6: three films. People may know them as a Three Ninjas franchise.
• 59:24
  Speaker 6: He directed them under the alias of Simon Sheen, so
• 59:28
  Speaker 6: when you look at the credits, it's not Shin sang
• 59:30
  Speaker 6: ok on there. But these were small hits. They were
• 59:33
  Speaker 6: low budget films that had a fair amount of success,
• 59:36
  Speaker 6: but it wasn't what Shin wanted to do. He wanted
• 59:39
  Speaker 6: to make epics, he wanted to make artistic masterpieces, and
• 59:43
  Speaker 6: he was forced to make sequels for children's films. So
• 59:47
  Speaker 6: it was not his ideal situation.
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: When Shin and Choi talked to Hollywood producers about turning
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: their own lives into a movie, the producers were hesitant
• 59:59
  Speaker 1: to have three Asian leads. In nineteen ninety nine, Shin
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 1: and Choi returned to South Korea and lived out the
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: rest of their lives together. Looking back, there seemed to
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: be conflicting feelings about their time in North Korea. Although
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: they insisted that they were kidnapped, was it really all
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: that bad?
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 6: Shin regarded his time in North Korea as a real
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 6: artistic flourishing, so the film run Away, for instance, he
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 6: considers his masterpiece. He considers a film that he made
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 6: while in captivity the best film that he had ever made.
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 6: So he left with a certain measure of reluctance. If
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 6: he could somehow take that artistic freedom, that amount of
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 6: resources that he had been given in North Korea and
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 6: bring that to a place where he could live his
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 6: life freely, I think that would have been the ideal
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 6: situation for him.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: When they returned to South Korea, they did go through
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: questioning by the government and in the media. People wanted
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: to make sure they hadn't willingly defected. Shin died in
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: two thousand and six and Choi passed twelve years later.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: Obituaries written by American and South Korean papers referenced the kidnapping,
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: solidifying the story that they had been abducted. Although they
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: didn't exactly go out with a bang, their wider impacts
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: are still felt in South Korean cinema.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 7: I think that Shin's work, and then you know his
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 7: partnership with Chin, the way that they again ranged across
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 7: so many different genres and showed that they could adapt
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 7: story forms and settings like in dementia in Western to
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 7: the Korean context and make really compelling films. It's basically
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 7: exactly what the South Korean film industry has become famous
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 7: worldwide for doing. They were ahead of their time, and
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 7: so I think that his influence it can't be overstated.
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 7: It's recognizable everywhere in the South crane industry and then
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 7: across the region too. I think Asian cinema is part
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 7: of that as well.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: What a story.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, Paul Gasari.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 4: Come on now, Oh my god, this love story. I
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 4: can't believe they came together and the daring escape.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: Were you kidding me? The foot chase? Oh you're still
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 3: right down up top. This is a movie.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 4: It's like you could see it.
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So, Saren, I know you knew this story because
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: you and Elizabeth covered this on Ridiculous Crime. Is there
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: any other color that we had to leave out of
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: this version?
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: I would just the only thing that we fixated on
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 3: in the story that we kind of didn't cover in
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 3: this version was the abductors themselves were a funny group
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 3: and that nobody could ever get the number right, so
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 3: always like it was like three to four guys, as
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 3: we just kept that thing about how humans have a
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: hard time counting past three to four. It's three or four,
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: maybe five, I don't know. So the idea that these
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 3: abductors who we pointed out, they both get abducted, but
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 3: they get abducted in such strange ways, and all of
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 3: a sudden you show up in North Korea, Like how
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: bizarre is that? Is a life moment? Like So I
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 3: would say that was the part that we fixated on.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 3: But other than that, it's the exact same story, and
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: it's so beautiful that I loved this rendition because we
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 3: spent more time on the love story.
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 4: I love this love story. This made me so happy totally.
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 3: And by the way, the love story I'm talking about
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: is Kim jong Ill and Paul Gasari the monster. That's
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 3: what I meant.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's the real romance of this episode.
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: Also, by the way, Paul Gasari I kept noticing, but
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 3: this time I didn't notice it before. Sounds all like
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: Paul Gasol the form of basketball players. I kept picturing
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: a Paul Gasol inside the Godzilla style monster suit. So
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: that was just fun for me.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: I knew this story because going way back and the
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: Mental Floss magazine print. Oh yeah, someone had written this
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: as a feature about Kim Jong Ill and the filmmakers
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: he kidnapped and the Got movie. He always wanted to
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: make something like that. And I remember the night that
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: Kim Jong Ill died, we had a meeting, like frantic
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: phone meeting about like, wow, we should put something up
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: about Kim Jong Ill. What do we got? And then like, well,
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 2: I guess this is as good as story as any.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: Not sure how to talk about a brutal dictator on
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 2: his death. But this felt like, well, people should know
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: this story, so I'm glad we continue to get this
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 2: story out to more people in more elaborate ways.
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 3: And that is a proper perspective for a dictator is
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 3: to kind of poke fun at them.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: Any very special characters on either of your radars.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 5: I will do the Godzilla monster, Oh yeah, good, call
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 5: the monster itself.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And following in that, I picked the filmmaker, but
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 3: not when he was in either South or North Korea,
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: but when he was in America and known as Simon
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 3: Sheen and he directed the Three Ninjas franchise. I had
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 3: no idea that the director of the Three ninjasranchise had
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 3: once been kidnapped by Kim Jong Ill. I was like,
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 3: oh man, this changes the whole movie.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: How about their friend and Noki Japanese journalist, She just
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: like helps bribe the cab driver. I mean that guy.
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 4: Got them out.
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and the cab driver, because cab driver is going
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 2: about his day and this jumps into your cab that
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: was in You're an International Intrigue.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 3: This one was interesting on casting, by the way, because
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: I had a prizing number of Korean actors that I
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 3: wanted to cast in this. I thought it was gonna
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: be a challenge, but I was like, oh man, for
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 3: Kim Il sung, you gotta go with Choi Min sick
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: from Old Boy from the Child Park version. Oh boy, right,
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 3: he could nail it. And then for Kim Jong il
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: the son, I thought, have a little more fun with this.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: You go Bobby Lee from Mad TV or the co
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 3: host of podcast Bad Friends. I thought Bobby Lee would
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 3: be great. And then for the South Korean director Shin
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 3: Song Oh, I was thinking John cho He was in
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: Cowboy Bebop and so I thought he's kind of the
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: cool version of what you want for that and Elsie
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 3: he could play a lover. And then for his wife,
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 3: the South Korean actress Choi yun yi Kim yun jin
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 3: who played son on the TV show Lost if you
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 3: remember that at all, so I thought she would be great.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 3: She has the right vibe. I could not really cast
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 3: Paul Gasari other than the Paul Gasol inside the suit,
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 3: so that's all I got.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 5: You know, I love that you pulled John Choe because
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 5: I'm like, team put John Choe in more romantic comedies.
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 5: John cho It was in a very short lived TV
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 5: show called Selfie that no one watched but me, but
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 5: it was sort of like a rom com TV show,
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 5: and I'm like, this man needs to be a romantic lead,
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 5: and now that he is like a little older, like
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 5: making the director, let's see that relationship.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 3: I'm so into that call also for a very special character.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 3: I also like the US Prisoners of War having to
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 3: do voiceover work and translating the plots of Elizabeth Taylor films.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 3: I thought that was just.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: Great, some good roles for the film version, which definitely
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 2: now has to happen.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 8: Very special episodes is made by some very special people.
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 8: Today's episode was written by Adrian Bain and edited by
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 8: Carmen Borca Carreo at Wonder Media Network. The show is
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 8: hosted by Danis Schwartz, Zaren Burnett, and Jason English. Our
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 8: producer is Josh Fisher. Editing and sound design by Chris Childs.
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 8: Additional editing by Mary Doo, Mixing and mastering by Chris Childs.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 8: Original music by Alis McCoy, back checking by Austin Thompson.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 8: Show logo by Lucy Quintonia. The executive producer is Jason English.
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 8: If you want to email the show can reach us
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 8: at Very Special Episodes at gmail dot com.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: Very Special Episodes is a production of iHeart Podcasts.
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 1: And thanks for listening. Could you do us a quick favor?
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: If you are enjoying Very Special Episodes, go subscribe to
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: the show on your favorite podcast platform and give us
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 1: a rating on Apple or Spotify.
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 4: It all helps.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: We'll see you next time.