Latest / In The Pocket / Ep. 11: As Michigan MAC goes 3-0, Michigan and MSU's vibes are in the basement
Transcript
- Andrew Graham: Hello and welcome to another episode of In the Pocket, a college football podcast covering all things Michigan FBS football. ⁓ I'm Andrew Graham, one of your venerable co hosts, joined by my other venerable co host, Connor Irgood of the Detroit News. Connor, it's Monday, October fifth. We're doing this in the afternoon because Xfinity did some Xfinity stuff and now your Wi Fi is working. How you doing, Connor? Connor Earegood: Good, good. I'm surprised I don't sound like I'm in space right now. ⁓ pretty stoked that they fixed it that quickly. And ⁓ it's gonna be back in the city of ⁓ city of champions, city of legends, beautiful Flint, Michigan. Andrew Graham: City of Champions is Kalamazoo. You and Dan Bartholomew are gonna have to have that out. ⁓ no I we tried to do this earlier today and it was I thought I was podcasting with Wally with the way Connor's hot spot was working, so this is ⁓ this is much better. a good bit of action to get through. It was a three and ⁓ weekend for the Michigan Mac teams as they all opened well, e everyone but Eastern Michigan opened Mac play, opened the stretch run of Mac play, so to speak. ⁓ Connor Earegood: We'll we'll we'll we'll argue that one out. It was really bad. Andrew Graham: And very much not a good weekend for Michigan or Michigan State in pronounced but different ways that kind of both left I think both fan bases in a similar just kinda like, do I want to experience eight more weeks of this, five, seven more weeks of this? Connor Earegood: And and then the Lions made everyone say, Do I wanna live? Like it was that kind of week. Andrew Graham: ⁓ did it? And well here's well here's the here's the the kicker on top of that as if ⁓ like not not that like I actually feel good about this, but there's maybe some like genuinely definitional Schadenfreud to be taken about the latest news in the Terrion Arnold case that one of the co-defendants pled guilty for a plea deal and one of the conditions is that they testify against Arnold. ⁓ so they're gonna he's gonna be you know in Star Wars Return of the Jedi when Luke goes to Jabba's palace, they've got that one robot in like the zapping contraption? Like th that's Terrion's future, unfortunately, at this point. Like that buddy he is gonna be in prison for a good long while, ⁓ from the sound of it. So Really just a red letter like thirty six hours for Brad Holmes secondary selections and signees. Connor Earegood: In the future. Because neither secondary looks very good in either game. Andrew Graham: I No, no. Well I so I posited on Blue Sky last night, this is a quick early hijacking of Is it genuinely possible that the three starting D Bs for Michigan are like not maybe better, but like more talented than who the Lions have? Like I it's a real question that I think the answer's not a definitive no. ⁓ and that's that's a horrendous place to be if you're the Detroit Lions and Connor Earegood: Say what though, what wasn't enough in the Twin Cities. That's a city of ha city of hell. Andrew Graham: It almost was, which was the hilarious part. Yeah, ⁓ I well, it's actually a fantastic place, but not not to go play a football game apparently. ⁓ yeah. Well, not Michigan football for fifty years, but we'll get there in a minute. ⁓ I I wanna start I wanna start with ⁓ Eastern Michigan going out to U Mass. I picked them to win, to be clear. Chris Creighton said after the game no one picked us to win I was like, I did Chris. I got you coach. ⁓ but and just a domination by Eastern Michigan straight up. ⁓ Connor Earegood: I love no, I I have I have lived there. I I mean for Michigan teams. ⁓ the state. Andrew Graham: They gave up some yardage to Pop Watson. That was a little bit of an intentional game plan choice as Chris Creighton explained earlier today, where they were kind of willing to dial back the rush a notch to make sure they contained him. And that meant he had a little bit of more a little bit more time to operate in the pocket. He threw for like two hundred yards, completed like seventy four percent of his passes, but he had a pick, one touchdown, didn't damage you know, didn't cause damage with his legs, didn't, you know, make those Killer out of structure plays. Eastern won the takeaway battle 2-0. Ran for 192. Noah Kim was damn near flawless. Offensive line's coming into form, and it's just like there's a clip from they posted on Twitter of Creighton in the locker room post-game, and he goes, That was Eastern Michigan football. And I think that's like this is what they've been trying to get to. And what you play two Big Ten teams and you get your butt kicked and you can't really show it, and then you're little banged up. And then you roll Indonwood, you go and Smack UMass to be the top team in the Mac and they've given up seventeen points across the last two weeks while scoring let's see if I can do this math quickly, f sixty seven points, I believe. So like good two week stretch. I don't care if one of them's an FCS team, like you took care of the business in the way you're supposed to do it. And so I just think they really set down a si stake, like, are they the favorites in the Mac? Probably not, but like you have to take them seriously as a contender. They have Connor Earegood: Pretty good. Pretty good. Andrew Graham: every ability to be in the conference title race and make it to the conference title game for the first time. Connor Earegood: I mean this was what you wanted to see from Noah Kim and why he was where I start and finish my EMU analysis in a lot of these 'cause as a as a someone who's not in the trenches covering the beat every day. ⁓ I mean he's the the best athlete on the field. He's he's, you know, the top guy that stirs the drink. He's experienced. He's he's everything they've hoped for. And ⁓ he had a couple of down weeks against teams where ⁓ you know, that are probably a a notch above and ⁓ some defenses that gave him trouble, thinking of Michigan State and and Wisconsin. Andrew Graham: Ha ha. Connor Earegood: Any of the week before then against San Jose State was was not the greatest, but ⁓ this is what you want to see from him. They they challenged him, but this is what you want to see him get off the mat and ⁓ you know, entering Mac play. Like this is your dude that's gonna make stuff happen. ⁓ and I think Pop Watson showed he's that kind of guy for UMass when you contain him and then all of a sudden, ⁓ it's it's it's Roman architecture crumbling. Like, ⁓ you know, th w if they build a new stadium or something in UMass, it's gonna be the house that Pop Watson built if he stays. So ⁓ I I don't know how many years of eligibility he has left, but Andrew Graham: They they challenged him. Connor Earegood: eight through mi Andrew Graham: Wanna say one or this either this and he's done or he has like one more, but not a ton. Connor Earegood: Okay. Either way, like Michigan Mac going three and ⁓ is a reminder, a reminder for folks that the Mac is always good football and good to watch. And if you're out if you're out on the O and two Big Ten teams in the state, hey, Maction. You know, that's good tailgating. You can go up and ⁓ and watch a cheap game. G you know, it's fun. Andrew Graham: ⁓ all the time. I posit that the vibes the vibes in Mount Pleasant when Western visits to the Victory Canon on October seventeenth will be way more fun than all the vibes at Michigan Stadium in the Michigan Penn State. ⁓ my god, is this can can we get rid of this coach bowl? ⁓ which is what that's quickly becoming. ⁓ but yeah, no, like and I just like for Eastern Michigan too, like it's just such a nice like there's there's there are plays that gets very easily written off for obvious reasons. Connor Earegood: Pretty much. Andrew Graham: And I think after two years of not going to bowls and then they kinda have that three week stretch where they lose three straight and look like a Mac team against Big Ten teams, it's pretty easy for a lot of people who like aren't following closely to go, yeah, it's Eastern Michigan, they're gonna like four and eight, and I don't have to pay attention to ⁓ That's not gonna be the case. Like that's just if this is how they play, that's just not gonna be the case. ⁓ and I'm so impressed by the defensive turnaround from year to year. I mean, they were un playable against the run in the first half of last year. Like just straight up couldn't stop it in any effective fashion. And they're not the eighty-five Bears out there, but they're just really good at defense and forcing an offense to execute its way down the field. They can create takeaways, they can create sacks, they've got experience, they've got depth. And I just like all the credit in the world to Chris Creighton for going with the dual coordinator thing, trusting being convicted in that Giving Casey Tegarden and Tate Omley the room to run and operate and put their spin on it. And credit to those guys for like getting all these guys to buy in, communicating it right, teaching it consistently, not you know, crossing wires. Like it's really impressive what Eastern's done on that side of the ball from last year to this year, especially considering the specific context of like you're doing a dual coordinator thing, and that's usually a like We have no solutions. We couldn't hire someone we wanted, sort of reeks of desperation thing, and that's just not what it's been at all. Connor Earegood: The the interesting part too is like I i I feel like defense is the side of the field you need everyone to click and everyone to to fit together. So in the portal era, if you're at a lower level school, like being able to create any sort of functioning defense is an impressive feat, but when you're able to dictate the pace of play, when you're able to get turnovers, when you're able to do all the things that a damn good defense does, like at a it's like doing it on a difficulty modifier. Like I it's it's just downright impressive. Andrew Graham: Yeah, and they did a good job of like like they got a guy, ⁓ Joseph Oloy Oloyemi, I believe, came from like D two Harding. They were in like the D two title game. So it's like they did a good job of going out and targeting guys at like good FCS and good D two programs who could come and like make the step up. ⁓ and that's on the offense too, like on the offensive line. So just like credit to a lot of the things that happened this off season and a lot of the bets that Easter more or less made that are they Panned out Saturday at least and can going forward and they can contend to the Mac. ⁓ sh should we get to to Michigan and MSU? Connor, Connor. The the the the I'm just Yeah. I'm just I'm I'm very I'm so I'm I'm as in like the modicum of free time I have during the season, I've been do I've been rewatching the wire these days. And I am like Connor Earegood: Should we get to the to the ⁓ the mortuary? Like it's it's DOA for both in the Big Ten. Like it's it's it's over. Andrew Graham: right at the beginning of season or well, not right at the beginning, but like a few episodes into season two, like right when ⁓ I forg I don't care that I'm spoiling season two of The Wire on the podcast twenty years after the fact. But it's right at the beginning of season two, there's a a shipping container with a bunch of d dead women who are being trafficked. There's a whole dispute about who's responsible for the death investigations. It gets put on the city of Baltimore. And there's a scene in the Baltimore like homicide detective office where they're like filling out the board of like the Outstanding cases and they're adding the 13 like Jane Doe's. And that's kind of what like ⁓ not death exactly, but like it's just like it feels like just a morbid vibe for Michigan and MSU where it's like they're sitting there looking at the whiteboard with all their list of problems and few, few directions to go to readily solve them, and it's just like it's just bad. It's just bad in both places. It was there! I knew where I was going with it. It's like it's I knew it's just a morbid Connor Earegood: Dude, I was waiting for you to pull off that analogy. I was sitting here like, where's he going with this? I I I I I get what you mean. Andrew Graham: Looking at it and just going, Dear God, how do we even begin to address this? And you gotta st you just gotta get after it. Connor Earegood: Michigan State Yeah, Michigan State you expected the shoe to drop at some point. You d maybe didn't think it'd be this soon. You figured okay, Nebraska's in territory they can hang with, Wisconsin's fluke fickle, Wisconsin and I'm gonna take back everything I've said on every other holy turner turn, that team looked good. And he is obviously pimping the home run, like I he's gonna be there for a few more years, I think. ⁓ and and this, you know, gives him a proof of concept that I think he was in dire need of, but Andrew Graham: Yes. Also yes. Turned the corner. Yeah. ⁓ I'm with I'm with ya. Connor Earegood: ⁓ as far as as the Spartans go, like, these were the two games that were sorta swings. You need to beat Illinois and you need to beat Northwestern, and then you can have some sort of you really you really gotta beat Illinois. This is a bad Illinois team. They lost to They lost to Purdue. First time a team has lost Purdue since twenty three. Andrew Graham: You really gotta beat Illinois. Like this Illinois team is falling apart week to week. After fire after firing their defensive coordinator after week three and or week four in the Ohio State game, who had come f it's just it's like and I don't think this is like like Brent Bela was not a bad coach. I think this is just like it just it it's not clicking and Illinois just very beatable. Yeah. Connor Earegood: It's odd. It's one of those years. That th that's what Bielema said. It it's just one of those years where teams the team has to learn it the hard way. And I thought that was like the most Brett Bielema quote ever. And I think that's why he and Pat Fitzgerald get along, 'cause you can hear Fitzgerald saying the same thing, and he kinda has in his own you know, i his own way. ⁓ but Michigan State does have some lessons to learn, right? ⁓ a lot of them are gonna be roster construction and how th the when the top is skimmed off this roster, they just it's not a quality team. Andrew Graham: Yep, that was yeah. Absolutely. No. It's a ⁓ it's like a Mac caliber roster when they don't have the starters. Connor Earegood: ⁓ especially not in ⁓ well especially when it's like against Big Ten teams who are spending and I know Michigan State's spending too, but it's a lot more younger players if I am am assessing it right, and then guys who are like one year, hey, we need a ⁓ a left tackle. Hey, we need a a right guard. Cam Edwards got a bag. Like Andrew Graham: Yes that sounds correct. I would imagine Cam Edwards got a decent chunk of change, Ben Borofsky, like some of those guys, but broadly, yeah, they're probably this is not an expensive roster, so to speak. Connor Earegood: Yeah. So ⁓ but they're still spending twenty. And that's the crazy part. And and the way that the Big Ten is. Like you can in the old Big Ten, either was a little wiggle room of like, you know, you can be bad and still be middle of the conference, but when you add a US C and a UCLA who are gonna spend U C L A a little bit less, but ⁓ and then an Oregon, good God in Oregon, and a Washington, like Washington also could probably argue it the same, and Washington, you know. Andrew Graham: Yeah. Correct. ⁓ no, UCLA is better than you all of a sudden. Yeah. Connor Earegood: had a it's bit of a hangover from from after that title champion, you know, runner up team, but ⁓ i it's it's interesting. Like the the way they've been sort of stratified in the Big Ten, they're not getting out of the basement and it doesn't look like they are this year, but it's how you build and go forward and and sort of build a foundation. And I've liked that Fitzgerald's focused on that, but he hasn't made excuses. The excuses were what drove Jonathan Smith out of town. And and the sort of the aw shucks of it all. ⁓ he was never wrong about what he was saying. Andrew Graham: No, it was ⁓ he was being honest. Like he was being straight up, like, yeah. Yeah. Connor Earegood: It's just not what you tell. He was being too honest. Yeah, and it's like it's how you market it to a fan base, and I think Fitz is hitting the right notes, but there's a lot of people who are gonna be skipping over to to talk about, you know, football ⁓ basketball season for the rest of football season. Like the next eight weeks, most people are not gonna be watching. And that's okay, and honestly, might be good for them to not be under the microscope like Smith was last year, where people are out but they're like hate watching. Andrew Graham: Mm-hmm. Yes. Connor Earegood: There's there's a gray area in between that you wanna be in and I think they're there. ⁓ but it's it's gonna be ⁓ it's gonna be a ways. Andrew Graham: The you you You can't let it slide into like full-blown apathy, which like I think is a legit concern given nothing to do with Fitz, but just like the tail end of a half decade that he's arriving at is like kind of his cross to bear, fairly or not. ⁓ and I can't like I understand kind of every perspective in the MSU fan base about the people annoyed that fans aren't showing up. And I'm also completely rash like do you do not owe it to a bad football team to put yourself in the stands for it every week. You simply do not. And I don't think that that behavior signals or precludes like the ability to support in the future. Like I don't think because students aren't spending the five decent Saturdays of weather they have left until they're home for winter to do other things means that they're not going to show up next year if MSU's five and ⁓ in hosting, you know Connor Earegood: Especially one getting paid. Andrew Graham: four in one Wisconsin in some game that's like gonna get game day or whatever the hell. Like I I just Yeah, like or or just like s hanging out in the backyard on a night like it's supposed to be seventy-four degrees this weekend and sunny. Like it's gonna be cloud like I this I again like I not not to be like your Midwestern uncle, but like it's not gonna be sunny for more than like seven days between November first and April first. Connor Earegood: Like crunchies is a thing. Andrew Graham: in mid Michigan, like almost literally. So you might as well like I I just I have no no capacity to care about fans being checked out from an obviously incapable to compete team. Like I just that's just table stakes. That's like how that works. And I don't think that's an indictment of this team either. Like I think it's just reality. Connor Earegood: I this so a year ago, the homecoming game against U C L A is when Jonathan Smith kinda lost his job. That the Minnesota loss Andrew Graham: Yeah, losing to Deshaun Foster's UCLA is just not tolerable stuff, really. ⁓ that's right. It was it was ⁓ that's that's right. I forgot about that he'd already been kicked, yeah. Connor Earegood: Not even Deshaun Foster, it was it was New Heisel. It was it was back to back wins for him. And so the the the thing with that is like you can homecoming is when you're sort of putting yourself on the pedestal of, hey, look where we're at. And I think Fitz has said a lot of the right things and a lot of fans who are interested no. But this is a game where you're under a lot of attention and this is where you're putting your best foot forward. And he said the right things. I asked him today about Fans having access to players and and sort of the negative critiques and it's been a rough go on on Twitter dot com, Birdapp. It's been a rough go on the Instagram. Like when they announced the jerseys there were people like with players tagged in there, like dogging on where they're at. And people see that stuff, especially when there's brand management. So I just ⁓ asked Fitz what he thinks about it and ⁓ his response was he'd be mad too. He would be upset too. He'd be frustrated. Like and he is. And he he said the line starts behind him. ⁓ for for sorta who's frustrated with this team where they want to go. And I think that's the right response. Again, he's sorta batting a thousand on on the right things to say, which is what you get with a dude that's done it for seventeen years at Northwestern and ⁓ you know, is probably in a similar state of the Big Ten to where Michigan State finds itself now. Like if if we look at when he got Andrew Graham: I do I do wonder if there's a little bit of like he thinks he has or like he tries to like words have to be met with actions that back them up at a certain point. And I just feel I do wonder if there's ultimately like a shorter runway for that here than Northwestern just 'cause he's not beloved former player or like I just think he like that that's gonna get compressed on him soon here. Connor Earegood: ⁓ sure. Sure, sure. Yeah, but I I I do think though you have to say the right things at the start because it was Smith saying the wrong things that made it a two year stint and not a and and not showing any results. Andrew Graham: ⁓ yeah, absolutely. Absolutely, yeah. Th he could still be the coach this year if he maneuvered a little differently, perhaps, yes. Connor Earegood: Probably. I would think so. They they were not looking to spend thirty three million dollars for him to sit on the couch. Like and and so that's the thing, like and and if we I this is a good segue into Michigan, because Kyle Whittingham, what do you do with him if you're Michigan? And I said at the time, he's a retread, I didn't really like the hire. I dogged it as someone who's covered that team and an alum of that school, dogged it from day one, and I feel vindicated. Because man, does that team look bad? It looks pulseless, it doesn't Andrew Graham: No, they would rather have not done that. That was not the plan, no. Yeah, very good call. The hater said I can do it. The hater said I couldn't do it, and well the haters were right. Connor Earegood: I was the hater. I was the hater and I was dead right. And and it's interesting because it's it's the things that you've seen Michigan do so well for years that like the defense is good, that's the one thing that's sort of carried over, but like they can't move the ball. They can't beat Minnesota at Minnesota. It's fifty years of of of beautiful history from Moses to Sandy Koufax and they can't do it. Andrew Graham: ⁓ it was d it was atrocious versus Minnesota. Yeah. Yeah, they literally never lost to Minnesota in the Metrodome. They skipped a whole stadium before they lost to Minnesota in the Twin Cities again. Like that's how long it's been. I it is a nice stadium. ⁓ I I I think I like I had this sort of like epiphany the other day. And I don't know why I couldn't put this together sooner or like didn't think about it this way, but like Connor Earegood: Yeah. Which Huntington Bank is a dope stadium. Andrew Graham: Kyle Whittingham never had to build the Utah program from something to something else. He inherited Urban Meyer's program. And to that end, like he evolved it. He was an excellent steward of it. They were gr greatly successful year in and year out. Like, I like, you're not gonna hear me being like Kyle Whittingham was a fraud coach at Utah or something. No, he was incredibly successful there. But like he was handed a thing he was familiar with and got to put his own spin on it. This is like it's an inten he he literally and that was his first head coaching job, if I'm not mistaken, in at college at least. Like I I think we like all of us, like Michigan hiring deciders included, kind of overlooked the fact that he literally has never had to address the sort of challenges he was going to have to address at Michigan. And that matters. Like, in the same way that Sharone Moore was ill equipped to the job because he could just straight up Connor Earegood: Yeah. Andrew Graham: was lacking about a decade of experience he needed to go get at like n Northern Illinois. Like like he he failed in that way. And Kyle Woodig's different. Like I think he has more that he can lean on and like I like you you can clearly see like week to week prior to this Minnesota game how like it seemed he was affecting the team and getting them better, but then the bottom just falls out like this and it's like Connor Earegood: Miami Nor yes. Yes. Andrew Graham: Where do you even go? Like what are you like what 'cause I like I don't think the issue is Kyle Whittingham's being there and like assessing their coaching job and being like, Well, we've kinda l we've been lacking on pushing them or whatever. Like, I don't think they're that kind of staff. And so then it's just like they're not responding. So then what do you like, what do you actually do to get them responding? ⁓ and like I'm I'm not possibly informed enough on the inside of the walls of Shepler Hall to know that, but like I do think some of it, and this is something people have been pointing to on Twitter and and like n not just like randoms, but like Jake Butt has sort of s made this point, and some other people who like no no ball to a very high level and a level that I could only dream of. And this is something I kinda thought about after the Western game of like Michigan never ran at Western Michigan to I think their detriment. And they like they've just abandoned the sort of core of the power run game that is like actually how the offense is built. Connor Earegood: Very publicly. Andrew Graham: And you're seeing how bad they are at building offense outside of that. Connor Earegood: He's just a bad fit. It's i it's ill fitting. It's it's this is Michigan State's Jonathan Smith. It's it's ill fitting. And it's nothing on him as a coach, just like Smith was a good coach at Oregon State. Whittingham was a great coach at Utah. Pac twelve does not translate to the Big Ten. I think if you're a Big Ten athletic director, you put a big red highlighter through everyone that's ever interviewing from the Pac twelve. You just skip ⁓ Because it's it's it's a fundamentally different type of ball. It's a fundamentally different type of sort of Andrew Graham: Yeah. Like I think that's really kind of what it comes down to. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Or big big t nascent big twelve even, but Connor Earegood: position in the university and in the athletics scene, like, the stakes are completely different. And especially at U of ⁓ which is, you know, a as much as people joke about like the blue wall is under a huge media, like, microscope and gets so much attention, everything you do Andrew Graham: The blue wall has guns on both sides. That's what people don't realize. Connor Earegood: Yeah, they get ripped apart, and they are getting ripped apart. There's people writing columns for the fan blogs right now that are saying Tommy Carr should be starting, and they're right. And like Andrew Graham: And fairly at this point. I'm not sure that they're right about that, just from the point of that that might be mean to do to Tommy Carr. Fair, fair, fair, fair, fair, fair, fair. Gotcha. Yeah, no. Connor Earegood: They're right for writing it is what I'm saying. They're right to put they're right to to be where they're at. And it's sorta like being a Yankee or being a patriot or or any of these. Like when it's not w working and it's supposed to Lakers another good example. When it ain't working and it's supposed to work. ⁓ boy. Yes, it's this is a great example of pressures of privilege. And ⁓ and Michigan, listen, November seventh, the way Fitzgerald motivates his team, I've been saying this for a while now. Andrew Graham: Little bit, yeah. It's well it's pressure's a privilege, yeah. Ha ha ha. Connor Earegood: That may be a day of reckoning in this state where MSU is able to sort of wrestle back some control of a sp rivalry that, frankly, for a decade they dominated and I know the decade of domination was ⁓ a a saying, but truly, truly like Michigan could not overcome and you can after f you know, five straight losses I think it is, you can make up a lot of ground here or four straight, sorry. You can make up a lot of ground here if you're Michigan State. Andrew Graham: Counterpoint, I do not know that MSU will be able to move the ball forward against Michigan's defense as things currently stand. Like that's that's the if if things hold as they are now, Michigan might just be able to win that one thirteen to three and w wash its hands of it. Yeah, let's let's pump the brakes now. ⁓ Connor Earegood: They gotta be healthy. They gotta be healthy. You ever heard of Cade Kaufman? Nine yard sack. He ran his first drop back, poor kid. ⁓ he's gonna be something and you can see he's gonna be something and how he moves and how he directs. But good god that that offensive line is a meat grinder to play behind. Andrew Graham: No, yeah, no. And like the Establish your little pipeline to the six and ⁓ East Kentwood Falcons? Are they the Falcons? I think they're the Falcons. Sounds right. Connor Earegood: think they're the Falcons. I don't I don't know my high school teams well enough like I'd used to. Andrew Graham: ⁓ they I just know that they're the the class of the Ottawa Kent Conference out there on the west side. ⁓ Connor Earegood: Shout out. Shout out good Michigan High School ball. Andrew Graham: I c I could I could get D no, I'll I'll ⁓ don't get me go, I'll start shouting out the UP, like shout out shout out the the the Westpac iron and the Westpac copper, best division names for any high school football league and frankly the country in my opinion. ⁓ But my my kind of cosmic thought on this I would almost be less frustrated to be an MSU fan. Because it's like the i what what can you do with this to make it better other than like hope you get healthy and hope it just kinda starts to click along and look better by season's end. Connor Earegood: ⁓ a hundred percent. Andrew Graham: Michigan, you have future pros. Like like and I I I I think a little bit of grace maybe can be given for the offensive line with injuries and youth. Like that unit not being as good as we thought is maybe not surprising applying some hindsight. But just in general, like you have NFL players across the secondary. Connor Earegood: But you're numb to it already. Andrew Graham: Some of your linebackers will end up on NFL practice squads at a minimum, even if they're not like heralded guys. John Henry Daly, Dom Nichols, Jonah Leah, like those are dudes who NFL teams are surely scouting right now. ⁓ like your receivers will play in the NFL. Your running backs are NFL caliber running like like maybe not they're all gonna get drafted, they're not all gonna be like stars, but like these are all these are all dudes that NFL evaluators are going, we take a look at him, he could be useful for us, and you can't Connor Earegood: UDF A. Andrew Graham: You cannot be playing this poorly with this NFL talent and it not be a problem. And I think Yeah, it's just straight up like like because even if you even if you were executing your scheme at a substandard rate and it wasn't like clicking along, but you were just d going fast, playing confident, and playing largely like cr like Connor Earegood: It's coaching. It's coaching. Like You could at least see Andrew Graham: handleable mistake of like, you know, okay, there'll be mistakes of you ran a depth wrong on a route or something, but not like penalties, you know, too many men on the field. Like they wouldn't have lost to Iowa and they wouldn't have lost to Minnesota. And we might still go this offense has problems or X, Y, and Z, but they'd be five and ⁓ and everyone would go, all right, they're doing fine. Like like it's it's just the the ways they're losing are mind bogglingly frustrating. And I think reading the tea leaves, I don't know that Michigan fans will love this. Connor Earegood: It's it Andrew Graham: But you'd be crazy, crazy to move right now with the whole ward situation still being resolved. So Kyle Whittingham's probably gonna be your coach next year too. Connor Earegood: And and and that's not moving until they solve the the medical pyre. 'Cause U of ⁓ medicine makes you a hell of a lot more money than the athletics money pit. Even if it gives you free branding, there's priorities. And with U of M's expanding Andrew Graham: Mm-hmm. ⁓ Medicine, which I have a fun little tidbit about ⁓ Medicine relates to Michigan football, I promise. So apparently the Coke branding deal for like the on the pads at Michigan Stadium, those usually come with like procurement deals where basically like, hey, if you're gonna have our branding up, you have to like use Coke on your campus, because obvious reasons, fair enough. Apparently that also applies to the hospital system. Which like I just it's it's hilarious to it's hilarious to me that selling probably, I don't know, a couple of million bucks of ad space if that in a stadium changes whether a hospital can offer Pepsi or Coke. This is what I this is like a sort of a rumor I've heard, but I did like it tracks. Like I it's like I just love that. Connor Earegood: That rocks. That rocks. buy it. I I'll I'll say this. My my final thought on all of this is that if you're Michigan, like you can't you can't stop recruiting at such a high level and they're already seeing issues there. You can't let this team sort of disintegrate in the portal. You have to have guys who are gonna learn from this because otherwise it's just apathy and it's just dudes that wanna play behind a brand. And frankly you have to be able to find better coaching or Andrew Graham: No, they won't 'cause they have money. Connor Earegood: Motivated coaching, some way to fix it. It has to be an incremental change. This can't be something you buy your way through because that's just a band-aid fix. Like when it's a cultural pr the microcosm of this team under Whittingham is the Oklahoma game when they took two back to back plays roughing the punter. They got away with one. But back to back plays ran into the punter on a long yarded situation. It was not a fake. Did it twice, and there was no repercussion for it. And I think that was a a damning Andrew Graham: Yeah, it was bad. Connor Earegood: case. Like MSU Fitzgerald will tweak over like alignment or or or how fast someone gets to a dude to make a play on fourth. Like Andrew Graham: What did what did Matt Yeah, what it what if Matt what if Matt LaFleur say the bench is a pretty good teacher? Like, it's true. Connor Earegood: Yeah, ⁓ like you need to be able to scold and you need to be able to like teach guys who are in the room now to come out of this. And that's gonna be the hard part. Andrew Graham: Well and I I do wonder if there's some disconnect of like because with what you're paying people and what the expectation is at Michigan, Michigan is a you're gonna do it right or I find someone who will program, not a we'll figure it out over time program. That's just the reality of it, once like when you're in season at least. 'Cause you just Right. And that's but I think it's they're not doing the I will find someone who can part of it. And it's kind of they're going more of the well, we'll get it figured out, which might work over two years, like I'll Connor Earegood: But then you run into these problems. Andrew Graham: I believe it would. It has plenty of time for Kyle Whittingham in the past, but that's just not a tolerable timeline with like the amount of money and resources being sunk into college football and this could spin off into a whole thing about like the unsustainable nature of college football and the pressure that coaches are complaining about and why they want to fuck everything up with a PCSA, but that's that's another that's a whole other podcast episode. Yeah, yeah. Well it's 'cause it's not gonna pass the house because political economy being what it is. ⁓ Connor Earegood: Yeah. That'll be off season. That'll be a a nice December twelfth podcast. Andrew Graham: But yeah, like I I just I'm with you of like it's just not a tolerable spot for Michigan. That's where I really come back to. Like whatever the cause, whatever you s you look at and see, what they've done the past two weeks and really like the through lines through five games is just not tolerable. Like for the talent, the money, the expectation, the the what you were selling in the offseason, like this is just not a tolerable way. It's not a tolerable product on the field. Cause if you go three and two and it's a tolerable product No one cares. It's like yeah, what if shit happens, it's football. ⁓ so yeah, I don't know, it's tough. Bob Chesney, rent, don't buy. Rent, don't buy Bob Chesney. That's my advice. Connor Earegood: On that note Mm. Andrew Graham: Western Michigan, talked about this goal line stand quick. Connor Earegood: Alright. I think we go to West I was trying to figure out where we were at. We were on such a rant. I think goal line stand is where we start. Andrew Graham: There's there's one or the other. We we we we pick we pick one of the two Michigan Mac teams and Western's more interesting the way they won. So they kinda went into the the Buffalo like pit of despair where they just get teams playing bad and in close games against them even though they're kinda terrible on offense and that's what happened to Western. And I give the Broncos credit, they just figured out a way to win and they don't all have to be pretty. They don't all have to be your best game as long as you're winning ⁓ and that's basically what they did. ⁓ They probably realistically, like with some more consistency, could've just won this game like thirty five seventeen. Like they were moving the ball okay. They just had some weird things where they weren't ending drives, it would be like a turnover on downs, or they'd drop a third down catch or something, and then they'd punt and then they get stops and Buffalo punted and they kick the field goal with like a minute fourteen left on fourth and one. Lance Taylor told us today that actually the book said to go for it. ⁓ but he basically was like, Well, you go for it, even if you get the first down, you still gotta like run plays correctly and then still kick to like take the lead with time expiring. ⁓ so like his thing was just like I felt confident in that spot. I wanted to make the kick. They make the kick. They take a 20 to 17 lead. Trust the defense. Defense almost bottled it where Buffalo's just heaving it down the field to chance morrow. Gets to the Western four for first and goal. Goes forward two yards. Incomplete great pass breakup by Justice Betts. Stuffed on third and goal They try some like RPO looking thing on fourth and goal that doesn't develop so Jason Wright, their quarterback has to roll left. Excellent. I mean, this is like teach tape for why pursuit matters. Cause Scoop Gardner ran down the line and it forced I like I'm I'll try to explain this as best I can. Wright's rolling to his left from the right hash. Scoop Gardner's the near side edge and he breaks off and he pursues him down the line. So he's not really closing distance, but he's forcing Wright to keep going wide and keep going wide and he can't cut up to get to the goal line. And Gardner keeps forcing him, keeps forcing him until he gets to the boundary when Josh Franklin, a corner, comes off as man, plays this perfect technique where he goes, attacks the inside hip to keep right, still going wide of him, and then cuts him down, and he gets tackled at the two. And it's like you couldn't have played that, like that two-man defensive game with Scoop Gardner and Josh Franklin more perfectly to stop that guy from getting in the end zone. And I kind of asked Lance. Connor Earegood: It's just good ball. Like it's just great ball. Andrew Graham: It's it's I'll be like it's beautiful. I'm like I'm s I love it. Like I watch I've rewatched the play so many times I was like Josh Franklin that like literally you might never make a better tackle in your career, considering like situation. and I I kinda asked Lance about it today at his Monday presser. he has a cold, by the way. Confirmed. His son brought it home from school, I think is what he said, one of his kids. ⁓ but he like I asked him like is that kinda like could that like moment be a catalyst, like where you get your backs are against the wall and you stand up and you stop a team from beating you like that and the answer was kinda yeah. Like like we can really like turn around from that and say, you know, kinda almost like the Toledo game where they had like fourth in season and they complete it and they go on to win. It's kinda like, you know i they it instills that belief that even in stacked moments you can kind of pull off that uncommon result. and win a game that you maybe shouldn't win or were like on the brink of losing. ⁓ so just like really impressive like moment that I think if if Western kinda plays it right can really be a like kernel that leads to so much more. Connor Earegood: I i for Western too, it's like I I so I was watch scoreboard watching from afar in in faraway Madison, Wisconsin. And I was like, ⁓ man, they're gonna bungle this And I was wondering if they were beating themselves a little bit of like, they are too good to be in this situation and it happens. But those are the moments where you snatch, you know, victory from the jaws of defeat. Like sometimes you snatch dif you know, d defeat from the jaws of victory. Like i sometimes you do the invert. Yes. Andrew Graham: A little bit. A little bit. It's like the opposite of Michigan, where you like you play poorly and it's still close, but you lose, but you play poorly and you find a way to win. There's something about like you can tell you like like there is something motivating about like we played horrendously and we still won. We're a good football team. Like that's real. ⁓ Connor Earegood: Yeah. Yes. A hundred percent. Yeah, and I I think that's the the that's the separator. That's the that's the thing you wanted to see. Because like the Boise game was not what you wanted to see. You saw them in the Michigan game, should've had it, and and it's sort of late execution, but it's forgivable because hey, it it's it's it's U of ⁓ and and you probably didn't d deserve to lose it. Technically you didn't lose it. Like very st very strictly speaking. Andrew Graham: V very strictly speaking, you weren't so I think the strictest way is you weren't supposed to lose it by the way the rules were s supposed to be adjudicated is probably the like most technically accurate way to say it. Connor Earegood: Yes. Yeah. Like seven asterisks make you at least like go to bed happy. This one would have been a bad one. But they didn't, but they win it, and now you're still where you need to be in the Mac. Andrew Graham: ⁓ yeah. Yep. Correct. Yep, yep. One and ⁓ that's what matters. You can move on to Kent State, homecoming, have another crowd, get to two and ⁓ you're four and two, you're kinda right where you need to be. That's yeah. Central Michigan, buddy. Okay. So so Sean Foster had, in my opinion, one of the funniest passing or receiving touchdowns I've ever seen. Because Central, obviously, like Connor Earegood: You know who else is in the right spot? Central Michigan. Whew! Andrew Graham: very good rushing offense. They now have two of their five games they've rushed for over three hundred yards, which is insane. and they do it without like ever going backwards, which is the really most impressive part to me. I'm gonna write about this for this evening with some with some graphs at Minton Football. ⁓ but so they're running it, they're running it, they're running it, they're getting all they want on the ground. The passing game finally shows up because of this. And so it's like a second and six or whatever. I can't even remember what the down and distance was. They run the most basic vanilla like spacing concept you've ever seen. Like guys just get to the sticks, sit down, find a spot, find the quarterback, be a friendly target. Like high schools run it, NFL teams run it. Everybody runs something like this. It's just a staple. And Akron was so committed to the run that along with like heavy in the box, the safeties were so wide and down to the line to protect the perimeter run that Sean Foster's like eight yards down the field, catches the pass right in the middle. turns, not a defender between him and the end zone. And he just cuts up field and runs. I asked him after the game, I was like, were you expecting to turn around and see a defender? And was like, yes, yes I was. Like, I I can't believe that there's just nobody. Like he almost thought his teammate was a defender just because it was like the only body out there. ⁓ so I just like that was just like a very good moment. But it's kind of illustrative of like when Central gets this dialed in, they can kinda take you to hell. Like they can really put you in the walls of Jericho ⁓ with what they can do offensively. Connor Earegood: Yeah, a hundred percent. And good for Foster too also, 'cause he was a kid that was at Michigan State the past couple of years and never really got his moment, but was on travel rosters and Andrew Graham: No, after he was it's like Hope, then ⁓ S U, right? Something like that. Connor Earegood: hope that ⁓ SU and he transferred for two years and he just he never quite got his opportunity. And, you know, good for him, man. I'm glad there wasn't a defender in his way. He he was solid. Like there was a reason they traveled him in in a pretty deep receiver room. And ⁓ for for Central the thing I like also is like being able to have some duality to the offense. Like being so one dimensional that you gain another dimension, if that makes sense. Like almost, sort of. I mean it Andrew Graham: Yeah. Out of out of grand ledge. Yeah, he's got some wiggle. He's got some wiggle. He Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, he's Almost. Yeah. Well, and I think it's it's a little it's a little like Flores and the receivers are kinda more comfortable with more reps, more time on task. Like that's definitely part of it. But I like it has been opened up by the way they can rush the ball and also just playing like against like competition in the Mac. And that's all it need it doesn't need to be anything more than a credible threat for them, really. And like if you can run the way they run, where Connor Earegood: It affects. Like I I don't know. Andrew Graham: I I per game on paper, which is kind of my preferred authority for like advanced stats and stuff like that. They do a great job. And they have like a chart builder function, which I am like addicted to at this point. ⁓ and I chart it out, it's like the X access I did line yards per rush, which is basically kind of telling you like it's almost like yards before contact is kind of a similar thing where it's like how many yards is your offensive line producing on a given run play kind of and with EPA per rush on the Y axis. ⁓ UCLA like in its own stratosphere, which is hilarious. But then central yeah, Central Michigan's like right there with like South Carolina and all of the other like really good like Nebraska. Like there is not on an opponent adjusted basis really like a better Connor Earegood: It's insane. Andrew Graham: Assembled, understood, executing effective run game. And so like like there are run games as good as them. I do not know outside of UCLA that there's any run game in America currently more effective than Central Michigan. Like, legitimately, which Shocker, former offensive line coach who won a Joe Moore Ward at Army, knows how to cook up the run game. Like on Shocker. Like, that's not surprising. ⁓ and some credit to Jim Chapin, too, for they've kind of fused some like West Coast. formational stuff into it, which is really fascinating, and it's all out of the shotgun. ⁓ and like I tweeted this Saturday, but like I don't know that there's a team in the country that runs power read better than Central Michigan does right now. And that's the offensive line. That's also Angel Flores. Like they're just if you love like running football, watch Central Michigan. That is that is my pitch to you all. They just they're they're awesome. Their run game is sick. It's Cool, it's creative. They they feature like four different running backs and the quarterback. They'll hand it to receivers, like they don't care. They'll do what they think will work and it tends to work. Connor Earegood: works really pretty well. Some would say. Andrew Graham: And their defense is like lights out at this point too. ⁓ like really good transfer additions and ⁓ one guy I'll shout out Jackson Cherry on the defensive line. I I plan to write about this at some point, I promise. So he's a defensive tackle, like defensive like lineman tackle kinda. He was once like a decathlete. And like a sprinter. Yeah. Like ⁓ like I this is like the craziest thing I've ever seen. And you see him like run down a line and you're like, I kinda see it. Like I see I see it. ⁓ but they're they're just like I don't know that any team has like I ⁓ and I'm knowing my bias here of like not what not seeing everything, but like there can't be many teams in the country that have improved more from week one to now than Central Michigan. Genuinely. ⁓ like they're Connor Earegood: Kinda see it. Yeah. Andrew Graham: They're entirely transformed in terms of like their outlook and what you would expect out of them from getting just kind of pasted by New Mexico and really kind of creaking along versus Colgate to now where I mean they took it to Akron after kind of weathering an early storm. The defense came up clutch with a with a field goal. And can I can I did you see the the fourth and goal punt? Connor Earegood: No, I didn't. Andrew Graham: Akron punted on fourth and goal in this game. I asked Matt Drinkle afterwards. Well I'll I'll I'll I'll detail it. I asked I just I asked Matt Drinkle afterwards post game and he's like if he's ever been involved in a game where that's happened. And he was like, No. But like I've seen it before and he cited the ⁓ you might remember this, that like Louisiana tech play like three or four years ago where the ball went back like the length of the field. ⁓ this was not so bad. So it was first and goal at the nine for Akron. Connor Earegood: Far back. Yeah. Andrew Graham: Zero zero game at this point, like first I think it's like their second drive or something like that. And they rush for no game. Second down. They give up like it's a fourteen yard sack with fifteen yards added for a personal foul after the play. So that's twenty nine yards lost on a single down. They're back at the thirty eight. Third and goal's incomplete. They're not gonna try the fifty two yard field goal, so they end up punting and Connor Earegood: Brutal. Andrew Graham: It's I I witnessed a fourth and goal punt this weekend. Like I it's the ⁓ don't I got to I got to see Zippy, the mascot for Akron, and a fourth and goal punt. Like Maxon just delivers in ways that no other league in this country really can. I mean that I mean that as a compliment and as sort of a sometimes the you watch just some sideways football in this league too. But it it makes it great. ⁓ Connor Earegood: You should get a like a pin for that. Nobody's doing it like my action. Head scratcher. Andrew Graham: Anything else we didn't got like wet that feels like it covers what happened this weekend. Connor Earegood: think we covered it all. ⁓ otherwise we're gonna get into the picks that we'll get into on on Thursday Friday. But yeah, continue Andrew Graham: Yeah, like Brock Lowry had a good game, didn't throw a touchdown, like yeah. Connor Earegood: Yeah. Watch watch Maction this week because with with the way the games are, I think Michigan's on bi, are they not? Andrew Graham: Michigan's on by, MSU in Illinois. I was joking with ⁓ Lives Matt Ayler, Leewood Western today. Might be the literal worst game amongst Power 4 teams this weekend. Like I'd have to check, but like on paper, like that's just not two teams that I'm expecting anything out of at this point. ⁓ yeah, 'cause I'm trying to think. Central goes to Ohio, that should be decent. Western hosts Kent State, which should Kent's feisty. Connor Earegood: I think it is. It's probably a mid off. Yeah. Go go watch Maxion. This is a good weekend for it. Good games. Kent who's ⁓ better than most Kent State teams. Yeah. He he looks like White Matt or ⁓ not White Matt Damon. He looks like bald Matt Damon. I know. Andrew Graham: And their head coach, have you s you've seen the jokes about their head coach, right? He looks like white Matt Damon, yeah. Yeah, no Met the famous the famous swarthy Southy Bostons. ⁓ no he l someone said it was he looks like Matt Damon playing a football coach, then the better one was Matt Damal Matt Damon portraying Brian Dayball. Which just yeah, that that set me. ⁓ so that and then ⁓ Eastern, I believe, goes to Akron. So it's a double dose of Akron. Connor Earegood: Yeah. That sounds right. Yeah. It'll be good games. Andrew Graham: weekend to weekend and Yeah, it's just it should be a good time and we we can wait a week w before I talk about how weird the one thirty kickoff for the victory cannon is. Just I no no one no one at Western understood that one today, so that I can I can share that much at least. But ⁓ yeah, no th that covers it. We'll be back later this week with picks and preview and talking about everything but Michigan football. Connor Earegood: We'll get on our soapbox. Yeah. Andrew Graham: Frankly, for our sanity and yours, that's probably a good good thing. ⁓ yeah, no, it's it'll be good for my dad, a Michigan class of ⁓ eighty eight, to do anything else with his Saturday. like just just reading the tea leaves there. Yeah, he's he'll ⁓ he'll yeah, he'll I think he I think he wants to get the law the like the deck furniture put away. So that could be a that could be a big Saturday activity for Peter Graham this weekend with Michigan not playing. Connor Earegood: Probably yours. Probably yours. Mow the lawn, tear down a couple of trees, clean the grill. Hmm. Andrew Graham: ⁓ but but until later this week, ⁓ Connor, it's been a pleasure. I'm Andrew Graham for Connor Eargood. Thank you for listening to In the Pocket.