Latest / Justice For / Kouri Richins Trial Week 2 Recap: Mistrial Drama, Jail Calls & Insurance Bombshells
Transcript
- JusticeFor: Welcome back to justice for trial recap edition. I'm your host Jackie. And today's going to be a little different. I'm solo for our recap episode today. Sam had some prior commitments that she is doing today. My sister was going to be on here, we had a little technical difficulties with the audio. I know surprise, surprise for us. So it's just going to be me and you and week two of the Kouri Richins trial for the murder of her husband, Eric Richins. If you have been listening to us anytime in the past couple months, or since season one, you know all about Eric Richins and Kouri Richins because this has just been my Roman Empire. I have been obsessed with this case, like Barry Morphew and some of the other ones. So, and we're really excited to get into what happened during week two. before we get into that, just a little shameless plug before we get started. I promise it won't be too long. We do finally have a date for our live show. It's going to be Thursday, April 16th. I think it's going to be about 6pm. You guys can get off work, have a little dinner, and not be out too late for work tomorrow. And we are going to have about 25 reserved seats up front. All the other seating will be open. It's not just limited to 25, but you will get a special little gift with those seats. You'll have a right up front reserved seat so you don't have to worry about getting there early. It's going to be at Voodoo Brewing. They have wonderful drinks. They have wonderful food. So please make sure you're supporting the local business that is wonderfully hosting us Sam and I are both going to be doing that episode. So keep an eye on our social medias Facebook Instagram tick-tock ⁓ YouTube Apple at Justice for podcast We will have it all up there where you can buy tickets a Facebook event for it. So just keep an eye out on everything. All right So we just wrapped up week two of court origins murder trial And let me tell y'all my deep dive on Eric Richins is holding up incredibly well The only new thing is still the boyfriend Josh Grossman So this week we got a lot of cell phone data text messages. We got best friends and boyfriends testifying So let's just start with Monday day six This week started off as the normal clusterfuck Defensive pose the first two witnesses because they apparently haven't had the time to meet with one of them And they just straight up didn't want the other one So we took an hour recess to deal with all of that, like first thing in the morning. Defense has evidence and witness lists and they're acting like they haven't had this for years. Kathy and Wendy have been Kouri's attorneys since May of 2024 because Kouri's original attorney, Sky Lozaro, who you all know I have a fiery hatred for her, she actually dismissed herself. back then and so I just don't understand why they are acting like they don't know half of this information and that's just the theme of the week. Them pretending to not know about evidence and other stuff that they've had enlist for I don't even know how long years. The next thing the defense decided to argue was the fact that Robert Cruzier was lying on the stand when he said that he couldn't remember versus what his interview said. So they wanted to bring him back in to prove that he was lying. But the state was like, no, no, no, no, we have this like 13 minute video of his interview that proves everything he said on the stand. So after they're arguing about this, the judge was like, all right, cool, we're going to play this video. But he instructed the jury to only take into account what Robert says, but not taken anyone else in this video as truth. And there even anything crazy in this video. was basically detectives telling Robert that he's not in trouble, they just need to corroborate Nicole and Carmen's stories about the drug deals and all this. They are trying to catch a much bigger fish. are, he is not their priority. So I don't really, I mean I understand why the defense was doing it, but also at the same time like, just let them play it. ⁓ are trying to impeach every witness. So they're trying to impeach Robert, they're trying to impeach ⁓ Carmen and they are trying to impeach another witness that we have this week and it's crazy. I had to even look up what impeachment of a witness meant because I've never heard it in a trial and I've heard it so much during this trial. It is insane. Next up we had Dr. Eric Christensen and he was the medical examiner after Dr. Ulmer retired and during his testimony they put a call he had with Kouri about Eric's toxicology report. I didn't realize I've never really listened to her talk outside of that interview about the book she wrote on that morning talk show, but she sounds like she's still in high school. Also, you're going to find out during this that her emails and her text messages, like her business and professional ones, read like high schooler text messages, the abbreviations, the LOLs, the ha ha ha's, the emojis. It's a little wild, like when you're talking about million dollar deals and hundreds of thousands of dollars to be conducting business that way. So I do want to play this phone call though that they play between Kouri Dr. about the report because... ⁓ One, I don't buy her whole innocent act. And two, she's like asking questions about a med that is literally prescribed to her, the quipipine or we're not saying that word again. We're not going to go through it again. ⁓ but yeah, so let's go ahead and listen to this call. Then they went into a lot about how the opioid F was found in his stomach, meaning it was most likely ingested and just a lot of testimony about why the death was ruled the way it was. And of course, a lot of testimony about that phone call that he had with Kouri. up we had Molly Crosswhite and she basically testified that she bought a house from Kouri and it was trash. It wasn't clean, there was broken down cars left on the property and it ended up being like way more work than it was worth because she was buying it to do a rental property. ⁓ ⁓ up there to show that Kouri had some shady business dealings and that the theme of the week by the way. Next up was Alison Wright. She is the wife of Eric's business partner, Cody Wright. And she was asked about a conversation she had with on vacation in 2019 about Kouri feeling trapped in her marriage, that Eric had all the financial power because of the prenup. And the judge actually dismissed the jury during this and the defense did a little test questioning, which I've never seen before I guess the judge in ⁓ state wanted to see where the defense was going with some of this. ⁓ And then the judge dismissed Allison herself for a moment to talk to the defense and prosecution and brought everybody back in. And she continued to state that she then understood Kouri's drive to get her master's degree and her realtor license. She was impressed that Kouri did it all with little kids because she also had small kids at the time and couldn't imagine doing all of that. She realized that this was Kouri's way of like gaining financial independence. The defense cross-examined her, and it was of course a train wreck. They really, really, really don't like her at all. They tried to discredit her left and right, and when that didn't work, they started grilling her about the alleged affair Eric was having with a coworker during this time, which could also be why Kouri was unhappy in her marriage. As they're like grilling her with a slanted questioning, Allison was confused and seemed unaware of any affair Eric was having. And Kathy Nestor then pressed further saying, isn't it true at the time of that conversation Eric was having intimate feelings for a co-worker? Allison was still super confused. Like, are you talking about lady? And Kathy just angrily said that she was done with questions, but the witness wasn't released and she will call her back later. And then she barked at the judge to instruct her further, which happened so much this week. I have never heard defense attorneys ⁓ orders at a judge so much or like just straight up be like, okay, well, I don't like that, or I'm still gonna do this. It's just like the audacity of these defense attorneys with some of the things they say to the judge is kind of crazy. But I would just like to say way to go Allison for getting out of the defense of skin by just existing and answering questions honestly. It was kind of, kind of enjoyable. but also one question for the defense, ⁓ it a full blown affair or did he have feelings for somebody? ⁓ ⁓ just, I don't really know where they were going with that. It hasn't really been proven ⁓ ⁓ With the amount that they bring up that Kouri and Eric would go through each other's phones and all this other stuff, it seems like there was a lot of like, not a whole lot of trust in this marriage and relationship from either side. So, I mean, that's still not enough to kill your husband over, but, you know. So... My sister and I got so excited when Detective Jeff Driscoll, the chief investigator, took the stand until we realized that they just called him to show chain of command for the phones. Such a letdown, such a letdown. But he will be back on Monday as the last witness for the state and his testimony is expected to go into Tuesday. did however pave the way for the next witness who ⁓ personally believe was one of the stars of the day Chris Cotradimos. He owns a forensics investigation firm that focuses on the tech side of analyzing phones, location data, deleted data. ⁓ He our Celebrite king y'all. ⁓ For of you who don't know, Celebrite is a program that is used as a tool to analyze the data extracted from phones ⁓ and it consumable. We learned some very interesting things from him. Like, Kouri had three phones. A white iPhone that was taken after Eric died, then a blue and silver phone that she had after her white iPhone was seized. He also analyzed Carmen Luber's phone, phone, and Josh Grossman, aka, boyfriend. We're going to be talking more about him this week. We found out Kouri started talking to Josh on November 21st using WhatsApp. So this gave her a second phone number attached to that white phone. So that white phone had two phone numbers on it that they were tracking. She also had a large amount of deletions on that phone, but there were hardly any deletions on her blue or silver phone, which were she had ⁓ like ⁓ of March, beginning of April to ⁓ following year when she got arrested. ⁓ learned that between December of 2021 and March of 2022, Kouri and Carmen had over 800 texts back and forth, ⁓ is a lot compared to only having about 650 messages from the end of March to December of 2022. As a reminder, Carmen is the cleaning lady who supplied drugs, who Kouri bought the drugs from. He then showed a map of cell phone tower pings for Kouri, Carmen, and Robbie's phones to corroborate the drug deals. Even though they deleted all the text messages, the phones still tracked the cell tower pings from them using their phones while driving to meet up and drop off. So... We love dumb criminals. Just because you delete the text doesn't mean that the phone doesn't still hold the GPS data from what you were doing on your phone at that time with cell phone towers. We got shown timelines of Kouri and Eric's phones, the night of Eric's death. I'm going to put those pictures up right here so you can look at them. ⁓ for those of you just listening, all of these pictures are on our website. They are also all under each daily mini recap on Facebook and they, yeah. So if you don't want to go through those days, over to the website and they're all going to be in there for you. I'm not going to go through that timeline because we go super over ⁓ it our deep dive, which is also going to be linked below. We've spent good amount of time on this timeline and her phone movements. They're exactly what we have. Then we got into more detail of Kouri's Google searches. ⁓ I'm so sad that Sam is not here to talk more about these because she loves good Google search. She really does. ⁓ It included those prisons for the rich and prisons in Utah searches. She searched a lot of the things that she talked to the medical examiner about. a about opioid F and how much of is an overdose ⁓ and just a lot of other stuff about that. She also searched how to access an iPhone remotely and if you could reset or delete things from an iPhone remotely. She also had a lot of searches about the FBI and how they investigate phones. Can they find deleted messages? When do they get involved in a case? How do know if you're being looked into by the FBI? It was a little wild how much she researched into that. Then those three gifts were brought back up and Kouri was 10 out of 10 not a fan of this. There was three gifts being sent somewhere in her phone within the hours after Eric dying and we have brought those up before. I'll put them over here again for you. after all of this, The cross for the defense brought up a real housewives of salt lake getting arrested around the time that Kouri was searching all of this and insinuating that that could be the reason that she was searching about when an FBI gets involved and Utah prisons for the rich and luxury prisons because she's a real housewife fan. I can't, I laughed so hard when they brought this up. I was dying laughing. All right. That was the end of day six, which was Monday, which led us into day seven Tuesday. And it was a full day of financial forensic testimony from Brooke Karrington. And we have some excellent video clips from her that we're going to play here at the end of me talking about her testimony because she absolutely owned the defense. So Brooke Karrington, she is an absolute badass forensics accountant. knows these finances inside and out. And I was super impressed with her testimony and how she handled the defense, like I said. When the defense was cross-examining her, she was recalling things. She didn't need to look back at documents or anything like she ⁓ knows this so well. was also leaning towards her having a photographic memory until she couldn't recall something exactly. And then I was like, nevermind. ⁓ But she insanely amazing. Brooke started out working for the Richins family when Kouri filed the lawsuit against Katie and the trust. so she worked for them for about a year. ⁓ And in May of 2023, she started working for the state after her firm was by them. ⁓ So like the prosecution didn't come and seek her out specifically and was like, it they sought out the firm she worked for. And they were like, hey, since you already spent a year in this, come work over here on this. ⁓ The biggest takeaways from Brooks testimony were Kouri was in financial distress at the time of Eric's death. After her purchase of the Midway Mansion, her net worth was negative $1.2 million. Speaking of the Midway Mansion, is absolutely terrible with money. She borrowed $3.2 million to buy that $2.9 million property. She only made $87,000 off the sale, turned around and only invested $3,000 into it, then decided to sell it a week after Eric's death because she knew she'd unfucked up and was in over her head. They showed emails and text messages of her saying that. She had up to 12 offers on the house by September. She didn't take any of them and ended up in foreclosure. What an idiot. Like, what an idiot. Before Eric's death, she was overdrafting multiple accounts into the tens of thousands a month. She wrote herself 60,000 in checks that bounced from her account. So many texts with her friend Chelsea about a property she bought as a flip and sold, for those of you listening, I'm putting sold in air quotes, to Chelsea. And we're gonna talk more about that during Chelsea's testimony later in the week. Defense tried to keep Kouri's tax returns out of the trial, but the state was like, nope, she lied on those to show a profit and attract new lenders. And then the defense tried to be like, um. She actually do attract new lenders. She wouldn't want to show a big profit. I'm like, but, but why not? Kouri wasn't so smug this day in court for the first time, although she did keep her signature witness death stare about her. ⁓ she was looking down a lot and had a much more blink stare today. Like I said earlier, after buying the Midway Mansion, Kouri's net worth was negative 1.2 million. She was in financial distress and there wasn't a way out of it. Even if she sold everything she had, she still wouldn't be at a zero balance with everything she owed. Yet, she was telling people she had an $11 million net worth with all of her properties. She received and spent 1.2 million in life insurances from Eric between June and September. At the end her direct... examination, the prosecution had an epic mic drop moment where they asked about a $25,000 that Kouri paid to someone. They then ended questioning and handed it off to the defense. So before we talk a little bit about the defense, I'm going to play a couple of videos of her cross-examination with the defense for you just to get a little taste of her. She's amazing. So I love that suddenly the defense is okay with ⁓ when Kouri was arrested and her time in jail being known to the jury. last week we had an entire debate and the judge had to instruct the jury ⁓ to assume at what points and not ⁓ was in jail. ⁓ now the defense is the one who brings it up and makes it known with an exact timeline. Just so interesting. And that was all of Tuesday's testimony. We had Brooke Harrington on the stand the entire day. It was a whole day of financial testimony. It was boring and shocking all at the same time. But it needed to all be done. which brought us to day eight Wednesday. And it started with a lot of life insurance testimony about Eric's policies with his business partner Cody Wright how that was ultimately done. Kouri logged into Eric's portal and changed it. So we had a few insurance people testify, including ⁓ testimony about the mailing card that Kouri used to take out $150,000 on Eric right before his death. There was an explosive moment after the first break of the day calling for a mistrial again and calling out prosecution for making faces at the jury during cross ⁓ the judge then laughed and said that the only faces he's seen the prosecution make are him then told the defense to put it all in a motion and he would read it. He ⁓ was kind of laughing at them while responding to this motion for mistrial based on a couple of things. ⁓ So they weren't really calling a mistrial over the prosecution faces. They're calling a mistrial over Carmen actually violating drug court and lying about it on the stand. And the emails, they didn't get one email, but the prosecution apparently told them about it. And the judge was not amused. He told them to put everything in motion and he would read it. So who knows where that's gonna go, if it goes anywhere. And just became, the judge even made a comment about how the defense is starting to become very obvious in what they're doing for appeals and building their appeal case now. I feel like it was kind of a warning to them to stop him back off of that, but I don't know. After all of that drama, Christina Miller, the divorce attorney that Eric hired, testified that she knew about him changing his power of attorney in his estate planning. She said that it was unusual when filing for divorce because none of that would matter for much longer. She is a very established and thorough divorce attorney who has like a packet like this that she makes you fill out and do and like commit to this. And she makes it make sure that you're not just there so your spouse can't use her. She makes sure that you were there because she wanted to a divorce. was incredible. Her testimony was great. And her testimony led us into Crystal Bowman-Carter, who the estate planner who helped Eric get everything changed from Kouri to Katie. She is also who Katie called when Kouri was trying to kick Katie off the property right after Eric died. You know, when Kouri punched Katie in the face, which still hasn't been brought up in court, and it's really annoying the crap out of me because I really want this brought up. She testified that Eric wanted Kouri's power of attorney revoked because he couldn't trust her and she was being irresponsible with money in her business. Of course, the defense was being so unnecessary about her knowledge of things she had nothing to do with, like Kouri's bankruptcy, which isn't a thing, but she had a bankruptcy lawyer, but they're trying to prove that she knew about this. Nothing really else got talked about that. ⁓ and she asked if Kouri asked for any funds from the trust, then the defense asked if it was true that she basically told Kouri she would be homeless telling her that the house is in the trust and under Katie's control, to which the witness actually laughed before answering, saying, no, that's not what I said. The last witness of the day was Kouri's affair partner, Josh Grossman. And I have never laughed so hard at someone getting sworn in. I'm just gonna play y'all the video. gonna try to have captions on it ⁓ that you can read along with it, because it is kind of hard to hear one little piece of what he says. But enjoy. Now that we're past that and we've had a good laugh, I feel so bad for this guy. It takes everything he has just to get through his testimony. He has a borderline panic attack up there at one point and we have to pause her and take some breaths and the judge asked him if he needed to take a walk and just take a moment. ⁓ And just Kouri is so unbothered by it. She could care less about what was happening in front of her. We found out that Kouri bought Josh two trucks, one of which her mom now drives. They go through a lot of their texts, which makes Josh really emotional. And I'm to have those texts over here on the side for those of you listening. It's on our website. ⁓ Josh seemed more upset over Eric dying than Kouri did. And she told him almost immediately that she thinks it's a brain aneurysm, which seemed to be her story to everybody until the toxicology report came back. Prosecutors didn't ask him a lot of questions like they maybe asked him like five questions after they got through all these text messages Which by the way like he is a heart on his sleeve pour his heart out very sweetheart kind of man And she's just kind of a cold heartless bitch So I just my heart breaks for that man. He really loved her One of the questions that prosecution did ask him was about what happened when him and Kouri met up about 10 to 14 days after Eric's death and the conversation they had. Kouri asked Josh if he ever killed someone in reference to his time in Iraq and she was asking how it felt and at the time He felt he thought nothing of it. You know, her husband had just died. so ⁓ he was like, okay, weird, but weird happen after death. That is until he found out about a year later that Kouri got arrested for Eric's death and he just didn't feel right about that conversation anymore. So he called Katie, Eric's sister, ⁓ who him to their private investigator. ⁓ And Josh went and talked to him, he basically said, we think Kouri did it and we're trying to prove it. The defense then tried to clarify that the $25,000 that Kouri paid him was for the work he did as Kouri's handyman, but I think the damage was already done by then and the jury has made their own decisions about that. lastly, he testified to Eric. He said that Eric was a phenomenal father and he only had good things to say about Eric and he kind of got emotional and teared up and was like upset talking about Eric dying. Like he was really upset when it happened because he knew Eric and knew he was good guy. ⁓ Thursday was the last day of trial. did not have any trial on Friday. ⁓ So this is the end of the and it started off with Marie Bromwell, an attorney dealing in divorce that Kouri met with in May of 2021. She paid her retainer, but she didn't have gone through with the divorce. So she actually got the retainer back and she was on the stand for less than five minutes, but basically just introduced that Kouri had met with the divorce attorney. Then the state wanted to play jail phone calls. The defense wanted them to admit them through a witness so they could cross-examine them. They just really did not want these phone calls in. They did not want them played. They didn't want anything to happen with them. So... They still ended up getting played. It really wasn't anything crazy. So I don't, it was just her being really annoyed and really pissed off that they were accusing her of doing this to Eric. That's it. They're just really annoyed and really pissed. She was talking to her brother. Next up was Becky Lloyd, a C &E employee who did ordering and estimating, and she was also friends with Kouri and testified that Kouri wished Eric was dead and it would be easier. And I'm going to play you a video of that because the faces that Kouri makes during it are top tier. So if we want to complain about anyone making faces during this trial, it's 1,010 % Kouri, not the prosecution. Then there was a pissing contest over this information. The defense basically tried to prove that she was given the info phone. It didn't happen. played an interview clip ⁓ she's talking about how she couldn't get up on the stand and like say this. Like she's not confident she could say this, but it's not because she thinks it's a lie or she doesn't think it's true. It's honestly, you can tell everyone who is close friends with them has a hard time because they were all so close and you don't want to think about like your friend like this. ⁓ hard to say these things out loud, ⁓ alone in front of them in a courtroom on a record. ⁓ understand. And she honestly kind of got to the point where she said that. It was like, don't want to be like, this is hard. Like don't have to be saying this. You know, things just awkward too. So I don't think she meant it as she couldn't say it it's not the truth. I just think she said, she's gonna have a hard time getting up there. It's gonna be on court TV. And then we had Gabe He is the owner of Mirror Lake Diner, which is where Kouri ordered that Valentine's Day sandwich that was allegedly poisoned and left on Eric's truck. And that actually gets brought up quite a bit. for the rest of the day because Josh Kazee, K-A-Z-E, I forget exactly how pronounce it, he took the stand and he's known Eric since 2014 and worked in a parallel business to him so they worked side by side on some projects. He played on some rec sports teams together. They took out of state hunting trips together and Eric called him after he ate the sandwich on Valentine's Day and... They don't get into the actual poisoning claim, it just alludes that something was very wrong Eric was being very serious and that's kind of a demeanor that these two didn't really have about stuff. Then Chelsea Barney took the stand ⁓ she was friends with Kouri for over 20 years. ⁓ met freshman year of high school. Chelsea was a true ride die ⁓ and just fucked her over without a care in the world. Chelsea gave Kouri her life savings of $45,000 to buy a house, and Kouri basically did a shady ass deal where she was the lender, Chelsea was the buyer, had Chelsea sign paperwork that said the deed was in her name, but Kouri never filed that paperwork with the county. And then Kouri sold the deed to someone, and Chelsea ended up getting evicted after paying the mortgage on that house for about two years. It's just... It's disgusting. I felt so bad for her. You could tell that she had such a hard time on that stand. She truly loved Kouri as a friend. she went so hard for Kouri after Eric's death. We listened to two insanely long phone calls ⁓ how Kouri is being accused ⁓ all this stuff with Eric and Chelsea just goes hard as fuck for Kouri. About Kouri just went to the house. She would never do this. I think she makes a comment about she's not a black widow. She wouldn't kill her husband for money. They showed a lot of text messages that honestly just show a best friend writing for her best friend. I mean, honestly, me and Sam talked about this. We hope our text messages would never get shown in a trial because the way that we like ride for each other when our husbands piss us off would not be good in trial. Those texts like, Kouri was texting Chelsea that after Eric's toxicology report came back that was finally over, it was all okay. Well, did she know it wasn't? They just, they talked about Katie and Amy and teaming up on them and... I just feel for her. She was being a true best friend when her best friend was in the worst moment of her life. Which leads us into the final witness of the day, Allie Staking, who in the day after Eric died to support Kouri and appears to still be friends with Kouri because she was like, your best friends with Kouri. And she was like, yes. I was. I am. It was like she was like torn over like what to do. And I was like, are you, who are you, who are you testifying for the state or the defense? ⁓ turns out she was testifying for both because the defense also did their direct with her so she could go catch a flight cause she's from out of town. So I guess she was on both witness lists. Interesting. But she testified about the Valentine's day sandwich incident and she described her ⁓ and and Eric and some other friends being at a gathering. And Eric brought up jokingly that Kouri tried to poison him with a sandwich on Valentine's Day. everybody was laughing about it. ⁓ it was all just like in good fun. Kouri was there and out. And then she testified to ⁓ entire safe incident the day after where they were trying to get into the safe. ⁓ went into it and then she had the fight with Katie. They talked about the phone call. the estate planner and all that and how Kouri was really mad, she was really upset, had some rage, but once again, we do not talk about her punching Katie in the face. I really, really, really want to know when that's going to happen. Because I want to talk about it with a jury present. I think it would be fun. So. That was week two of trial. was boring and exciting and shocking all at the same time. had a lot of stuff go down. we have a lot of good video clips in here. I'm still getting that body cam footage out for everybody. ⁓ I cannot wait to ⁓ watch for week three. We're to get finally the defense witnesses are going to be called. So I'm hoping we're going to get who's Kouri's mom, Ronnie, Kouri's brother. ⁓ I think Katie's going to get called up to the stand because the defense wanted her. held. There's a few other ones they're going to call back up later that they've held on to. We still have the walk the dog letter to get introduced. I'm excited for Detective Driscoll to come up there because I feel like he's going to be a very long two-day testimony day and a half at least. There's just still so much evidence to come. We're two weeks in. I think that we're still on track for a five-week trial, ⁓ I'm going to have mini daily recaps posted. Every single day I get those out the day after because eight hours of trial a day and it's on Mountain time so it's my time and I'm also working 40 hours a week. I've been so busy lately So bear with me, but keep the discussions coming. I have been loving loving loving all these discussions with you guys There's so much that we are all talking about and I love your viewpoints. So please please please keep those coming Every day I do post the court TV live link on our Facebook page. So look for that I this episode came from you out of our normal schedule. So Tuesday, we still have a great episode a brand new deep dive coming for so please make sure you don't miss that and then join me on Facebook for our discussions ⁓ and ⁓ last I want to say is if I were on this jury, I don't know what I would be thinking right now because ⁓ I Know case inside and out I do but they don't ⁓ I did not realize how much of a circumstantial case this is. I think that in the financials, I think we're getting lost at the fact that we still have to prove that Kouri physically did this. And I feel like we're getting a little lost on that. The defense, I don't even want to say they're doing a great job at anything, but they are still on this, when in doubt, create reasonable doubt. And I think they are doing a good job of that in some places. ⁓ Because the prosecution is not doing a good enough job of objecting They did a little bit more this week than last week and they have started to get a little fight in them But I feel like they could be doing a lot more somebody pointed out on a court TV chat That the prosecution thought they had this in the bag already And I think that really showed in week one in week two they realized they kind of need to step up So if I were on the jury, I don't really know where I'd be sitting right now ⁓ Is she a crappy human being? Yep. Is she horrible with money? Sure Was she having an affair and a shitty wife? Yeah. But does that all add up to her poisoning him? I don't know. The Carmen and Robbie testimony is really damning for her, wondering if it's really damning enough since we don't have any opioid F residue on things like the bottle that wasn't tested and we don't have the glassware or any of that. And we didn't find any of the opioid F in the house. ⁓ I'm just really curious about what the jury's thinking right now. I wish I could be a fly on that wall and any of their heads. So ⁓ tell us of your thoughts. We want to know. I was going to ask my sister what she thought. ⁓ but she's not here. here we are. All right. Like I said, we were going to have more information about our live show coming out on for April 16th, Voodoo Brewing in Colorado Springs. It's probably going to be at six o'clock. We're going to have a link for tickets. Don't worry. If you're not buying a ticket in that 25 for a reserve seat, you can still come. The whole place is open. They have amazing food. They have amazing drinks. So we hope to see all of you there. It is an all ages type thing. It's just a brewery. So it's a restaurant bar thing. We are going me a little bit more mild. We're both going to be doing this case. It's going to be so much fun. So we hope to see you there. All right. Let's get ready for week three of trial. Don't miss our deep dive on Tuesday. Follow us everywhere at justiceforpodcast.com. And okay. Love you. Bye.