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North Korea Cancelled?!?! Charlotte's ADHD update and Guy touches Charlie's Leg · Total Barnage

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome back to Total Barnage.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_05: The crew are back together once again.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_05: It's a sad day.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_05: But it is a sad day.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_05: I mean there's lots of it was yeah, there's a lot of sad days going on.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: It was also a great day yesterday.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's very true.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_05: What what made it great, Charlotte?
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_05: Elaborate.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: The weather was nice and I returned.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's very true.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_05: Yes.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_05: Partly true.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_05: The weather was nice, yeah.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: Swings and roundabouts isn't.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I returned.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: The swit the swing was that Charlotte was Charlotte was here and uh Ben, our cameraman, videographer, his little his little lad came came down to the gym.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: Baby Jack.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: Very cute little baby Jack.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: It was lovely.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um but the roundabouts, what's the roundabouts guy?
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: What's happened?
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: What's this oh the kind of news?
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_05: Pyongyang half marathon and marathon was cancelled.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_05: There was uh not much else said other than an email saying we're very sorry, but we're gonna have to cancel it, you know, three weeks out.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_05: Where I've been putting in a lot of effort to running recently.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_05: And uh yeah.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_05: So we're having to have a rethink.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_05: What what am I gonna do?
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_05: Am I gonna go?
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_05: Um well I've got the flight to to um Beijing.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so I've got the flights to Beijing still, um, and we're thinking we're actually still trying to do some form of an adventure.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_05: But it's it's kind of difficult to kind of come up with a plan after you're really let down.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_05: Um but you know, Richard and I had a bit of a brainstorm last night and thought maybe we could do a half marathon across the Great Wall of China, then go up into Mongolia, uh, meet some interesting people and ride some horses and hang out in yurts and do some all sorts of things.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, have a bit of an adventure out of it, but it's it's just trying to work out what that next thing is, and you know, we have been training for that event, it's now cancelled, it's trying to utilize our time correctly.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but yeah, you know, it's it's shit when these things happen because you you have in your head, right, I'm gonna do that, and then all of a sudden you're not.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and you're heavily motivated for a singular event, and then when the whole event, I mean it's different, you know, little maybe injuries that come along or something during in the process, a bump in the road.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: This is very much a blockade um at the end of the road.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_02: But which of those things that you mentioned, which ones are legit plans that you might actually do?
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: Oh well, all of it.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_02: Because it sounds it sounds like it doesn't sound real.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_02: The Great Water China sounds like a joke.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, no, I mean you can you can traverse it, it's just a lot of it isn't perfect anymore.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, a lot of it is just the stairs are no longer stairs, it's just piles of rock.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so there's only certain portions where you can walk along like long distances or run.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_05: Um, and it's not it's really not flat either.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, some of the stairs are like 500 meters uh centimetre steps, so you can only imagine uh sorry, five metre steps.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_05: 50 centimetre steps, so like half a metre per step.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_05: That's quite a big step.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_05: Um yeah, you know, so it's it's quite quite a challenge.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_05: Um we have by the looks of it, you can only really run 10k uh before the wall either gets way too busy with tourists or it's the 500 centimetre steps.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, the 500 steps to crank the harnesses out there.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_05: Five metre steps would be quite something.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_05: 500 millimetre steps, let's call it then.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_05: Um but yeah, yeah, it's it's gonna be we we need to come up with a plan.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_05: Uh South Korea is also an option.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_05: They've got a uh they've got half marathons there and marathons over there at the same time.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_05: Um just trying to find other events, but it just means more travel.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_05: Uh to be honest, we'd rather stick to just China um because we don't want to do any more internal flights.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_05: We can take some trains around and whatnot or rent out a car.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: Go to Hong Kong.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's a train train journey now.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it's about it's it's it's a good eight hours on a train.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you're probably better off flying.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, because we're kind of like northeast um corner.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_05: So Mongolia is is not far.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: Umgolia, that's such a cool place.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, but this time of year it's a bit barren.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_05: I I think we would just be getting into spring.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so it might be greening up a little bit.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_05: But you go on Google Maps and oh my goodness, you get you go on a road in Mongolia and just flat, like parts of it are just nothing going on.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_05: You cannot believe how flat it is, and there's just a straight road for like a hundred, two hundred miles and just flat and nothing.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's very America, and also even Australia.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_02: When I was like flying over Australia, um I was there, and all I was thinking is looking at I was like, you know, I've been travelling for like 25 hours.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, this is very flat.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of nothing going on.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I think like in 95% of Australians live in like like 2% of the land mass, something ridiculous like that.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, they're weird stat.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_05: All living on the on the coastlines and in the in the east, really, a little bit on the west, and then it in the middle, nothing.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: West side.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: So how do you deal with you know, how do you deal with this, you know, big, big setback?
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, setback's a bit of an understatement.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like it's a big spanner in the works, big letdown.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: How do you is this do you have a certain process that you you go through?
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_02: Is it completely rational?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_05: Um I think you just gotta come up with a with a solution and and try and create something just as fun and interesting.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I mean, you don't get much more interesting than North Korea, to be honest, um, because not many people can say they've been to that country, but uh yeah, creating a a bit of an adventure over in China and and doing wild things, maybe go hang out with some monks in the mountains and do some meditations and do breath work with them.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, you know, all this sorts of stuff which we you wouldn't usually do, a bit of a bit of an escape.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_05: Um yeah, it's just it's just really trying to recreate maybe perhaps the feeling I was going to get of the weirdness of North Korea in in the same holiday, um, and also doing something which is still challenging athletically because we have been training quite hard for this this half marathon coming up, and I was aiming to run a PB time and perhaps I might run a half marathon just before we go out just to kind of test the waters on my own, just to see if my training kind of paid off.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_05: Um but then out there I want to do something challenging, maybe climbing a mountain.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_05: But again, we we need to look into it more.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_05: I've had not even 24 hours of knowing yet.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so yeah, we'll we'll we'll I'm sure we'll come up with something exciting.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_05: Richard was talking about taking a helicopter along the Great Wall of China and and landing somewhere.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_05: Um so I was like fair enough.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_05: Fair enough.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's certainly making lemonade out of the lemons you've been handed, for sure.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 7:03
  unknown: Yeah.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_04: Some good some good lemonade right there.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_04: Sweet, sweet lemonade.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but yeah, it's just trading expectation for appreciation.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_05: Uh uh, you know, it's it's cool that I even get to go on holiday to China, you know.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_05: It would have been even cooler to go to North Korea, but still, like it it you you gotta I it's not a bad hand, I've been dealt, you know.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's pr it's a pretty cool hand, and I think a lot of people would just be excited to go and do what we're gonna do in China.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_05: So I I think it's you know, if not I've told people about what my solution is and they said, Oh, that actually sounds more fun.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_05: And uh yeah, you know, in some some people's eyes, but when you get I think North Korea is such a fascinating country and to really kind of see what goes on there uh was interesting for me.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_05: More interesting for Richard as well.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_05: Um but look, you know, I'm I'm not uh too down in the dumps, just a bit like that's annoying.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: Expectations for appreciation.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: That sounds like a phrase that I might have been taught or learned or bestowed upon you.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Or is that is that one of your one of your phrases you come up with?
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_05: Um no, I probably learnt that when I was five years old.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_05: No, not not five.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_05: Probably I think COVID, um, I was doing some courses throughout.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_05: I can't remember what course that was from, but I think it was more of a kind of like a mindfulness type thing.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_05: Um but yeah, it's it's I what I try and live by really.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_05: You just don't expect much, appreciate things when they happen, keep churning away, working hard, and and when things work out, whoop-de-doo, but if they don't work out, I mean I wasn't expecting anything to happen anyway.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_05: So um it kind of leads to you never getting let down.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, do you do something similar, Charles?
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, I think expectations is a massive thing.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: Uh a lot of the times it's a false expectation or something which has been created, which doesn't have much grounds.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: If I talk about like injuries and setbacks and uncertainty there, a lot of the timelines that I've been given, um a lot of the expectations and the deadlines and stuff like that, are kind of a rough guideline, not a set in stone, you know, this this can be reliably expected to happen.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um and when I find myself we were talking in the last episode about just setting a random time that you want to run or something like that, or setting an expectation that could serve a purpose and like motivate you to do it.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um but on the flip side, like you're kind of just sometimes you create these expectations and and then you are kind of let let down by them.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um it's a positive and a negative, really, but I think it is yeah, it's you can you can look forward to something, um, and then if it doesn't work out, then you know it's not that you've wasted your time looking forward to it, and it's all right then to just feel how you feel, and then you can move on to reframing a little bit later.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think that's that's something that I I learned in the last couple of years is really just trying to feel the feelings for what they are, and then there's always a time to put a positive spin on it.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_02: But if the situation just is how it is, you know, and you feel a little bit you know, your expectations have been dashed a little bit in a negative way, then it's like you know, Richard chatting to him yesterday seemed pretty you know down about the whole thing because he's he's really gone hard on the training specifically for this event.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um and like like you hinted at, it's it's very hard to replicate this exact event.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas for you, maybe you know, you would be training and doing stuff anyway, and so you're the approach that you've got can make it a little bit more malleable when these things don't work out.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I mean he does he never runs.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_05: I think this is probably the most he's ran in his life, yeah.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and he's been flying, he's been doing so well, and also he's he has been openly admitting that he does hate almost all of them.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I've got a good question.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: As a coach, what advice would you give to someone who was potentially in Richard's position where you know he sacrificed a lot of things to kind of work towards this specific goal and then something like that set them down?
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: How would you approach that with your client?
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_05: Um look, I I think yesterday I I because Richard's both a friend and a client of me, uh of mine, and uh for me it was just instantly taking action to try and create a plan where he was like, Oh, I want to feel a bit sorry for myself, and I was like, Oh, fuck off, Richard.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_05: Like, you don't need to feel that sorry for yourself.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_05: But um, and and we've also got a place next year, or well, that's if there is a next year, no, of course.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_05: Um so we got we're just trying to make a an action plan.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_05: Um, what's the what's the next thing?
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_05: Can we get something physically challenging scheduled for the holiday?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_05: And and and we will be able to, um, whether that's hiking a mountain mountain, running along the Great Wall of China, like you know, we might do both of those things.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_05: So um he just needs still to keep something in the diary that he's gonna train for, uh, as he's very goal-driven.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but it depends on the person.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_05: Um, if you if you had for me, like it's fun training for something, but I'm always gonna train anyway, so it's just an adaptation of my training plan.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so you know, after this running thing, uh it's not like I'm just gonna pack up training, I'll just adapt it to maybe be a bit more start training the gym again a bit more and get stronger, etc., and see progress on that behalf of things.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_05: So um, yeah, it's just kind of coming up with a solution as quickly as possible because that the longer you have that kind of lag time, is the the potential for that person to kind of go more off track and then you know break all those habits, and then you have to build those habits up again.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_05: And so we we don't want momentum to be destroyed.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um you've got to keep that positive outlook as a coach, haven't you?
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, for your client's behalf.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_05: So yeah, no, it's it's just all about keeping momentum and creating a plan and a strategy going ahead.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, it doesn't need to be more complicated than that, to be honest.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I think yeah, I think also to add because I had a session I had a session with Richard yesterday, um, and I'm sure he won't you know mind me mentioning like a couple of bits, just the approaches like in the session, what we were chatting about, and it's my view on it is asking questions to pick apart exactly what you're looking forward to and exactly what drives you.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of time we don't really know.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: There might be like approximate, like kind of obvious or closely related reasons why we do something, like saying, Oh, I want to run.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: Um there might be a reason of oh, I want to enter this race just for the sake of doing the race and the experience.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you dig deeper into the experience and the adventure of it and what you can build by going through that process, and then you find a little bit more about what you enjoy about it, um, and just asking you know Richard what he really gets out of adventuring and these these sort of trips.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: And he's telling me loads of stories about crazy stuff down in um down in South Africa and in maybe like Zimbabwe, yeah, and just just like crazy stories and going into that narrative and those memories of exactly what it is about the the kind of the pursuits that we have that really make you feel alive and that drive you towards it.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think a lot of the times we can put uh maybe one motivator on something and say we're driven by this singular thing, when actually it might be a whole umbrella of little things, probably more quality than like quantity, and probably a lot more a little bit more like experience-based rather than like metric-based, uh, to really get the most out of the experience.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: So I think it's you know, I think it's it's just trying to find out exactly why we do stuff, um, and and finding the next the next best alternative, and then accepting like okay, we're not gonna be able to do plan A, what's plan B?
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then don't completely like you say, it'd be so easy then just to go completely the other way and be like, right, that's it, down tools, not gonna do it at all.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: Also acknowledging like why you feel the way that you're feeling as well, and like rationalizing that for yourself.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because sometimes it'll just make it just make you more sad if you're not like, okay, this is exactly why I'm feeling like this.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, how long, Charlotte, how long would you personally kind of give it like feeling the emotions of the situation and then reframing it you know into a positive way or rationalizing it in that sense?
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: Do you have a certain length of time naturally that it happens?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I again it's it's quite dependent on kind of what the situation is, right?
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: But I've never been someone to kind of dwell on stuff for too long.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like I think if a same like for if I've got a client or someone comes to me with like an issue that they've got, I like try to kind of take a positive spin and like you know, not in like a talk to positive kind of way, but I just I just sometimes think there's no point dwelling on stuff for too long because once something's happened, it's happened.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: So it's just how you kind of approach that and how you work on from that, which is super, super important because otherwise you just end up like and I've done it before time and time again, where like you kind of end up end up like victimizing yourself into a situation a little bit and then like okay, cool, well that's fine.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: You're allowed to feel like give yourself time to feel stuff, but then you know, if it's gone on for kind of a like more than like say like a week, right?
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: If it's something that's quite severe, um you just gotta say like okay, well, how long am I gonna sit in this sit in this kind of lull for?
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_05: How long am I gonna sit my shit for?
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and like it yeah, the shit's gonna stink, right?
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like, and like if you're just feeling sad the whole time, it's gonna start disrupting your life, and then that's gonna just have a knock-on effect.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: So it's about trying to, you know, feel the feelings that you're having, but then okay, cool, how can I move on from this?
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: How can I generate like how can I make lemons out of the lemon lemonade out of the lemons?
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_05: You've got to I still don't really know how you do it, but yeah, sugar.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_05: You cut them, you squeeze them, and then you you sweat a lot, and you step on them.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, right, like they do the rinse.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_05: You try to share electrolyte lemons.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it's it's important, man.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want to ever stick in like a negative mindset for too long, and I found myself doing it in the past, and I think hopefully I've learned my lesson by now, but I'm sure you know we're only human, and sometimes you will just fall into those lulls.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_05: But it it it do you know what it all goes back to?
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_05: Go on.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_05: You ready?
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_05: Well, don't think for goodness sake.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_05: Just don't think just don't think.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, no, just don't yeah, but how does that wait how well actually got no go on but just go numb because it's a really good mechanism.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_05: Go on, why why don't you think?
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_05: Huh?
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_05: Why would not thinking because look, the clouds look quite nice today.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_05: And I think about the clouds.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: Listen to the birds.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: But you just but you just talked about creating an action plan.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: Surely that requires some thinking.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, once you thought about it, then you got your plan, you don't have to think about it anymore.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: So no overthinking.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_03: Well that that's it, Charlie.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_05: I think it's I think I trust myself enough to create a plan somewhat good enough that it's it's gonna whatever the outcome is, it's gonna be somewhat good.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_05: And then why think about it anymore?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_05: Unless it's like a really important financial decision, like perhaps there needs to be some more thinking there.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_05: But but you know, like you you put your brain to it, you create a plan, and then that plan's there.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_05: And if you're really worried if you keep finding yourself thinking about it, just go back to the plan, adjust it if it's needed, and then you can you can stare at the wall and watch paint dry.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_05: As they say on the competitive.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Simples.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_05: Because if your mind's wandering all the time, that's that's no fun.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_05: You know, Charlie?
• 18:29
  unknown: Yeah.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_05: Why think about the plan over and over again?
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_05: Because you taught yourself out the plan.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_02: And also, it just gets past the point of just you know, there's thinking and then there's rumination, you know, and thinking about something something going in a different way, or just thinking too much about the past.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think something yeah, some thinking is useful, and then after a while, you kind of discard it.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: I think if you always keep using the word think.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_02: I think what does thinking actually mean?
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: Have a think about that.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_05: I'll have a think.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_05: You thought about that one, didn't you?
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_05: I think I have to.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: Let's just say think a few more times, guys.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: This is getting really good.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_05: Wait, hang on.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_05: Really explain you you can do this.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_05: Explain what thinking is.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, there's the experience of thoughts coming into what is a thought?
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: Mate, no one really knows.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_02: For the most part, it's some sort of language, most of us probably English.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_02: And it'll come in and then be understood, and we'll have a response to that thought based on our previous experience.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_02: Neural pathways, fire.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_05: Do we think in do we think in language or do we think in emotion?
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Language.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh-huh.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_02: And then it trig and then it would we'll respond with an emotion depending on our experience of said word.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_05: So the emotion is the trigger of the thought.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_05: And are we thinking of that in text or visual?
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_05: Because then would it be in our language?
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: I see it visually coming across my So then it is it isn't language.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Different people think uh see different stuff.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_05: I see the words.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_05: You do.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_05: Sometimes I see the words out in front of me.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_05: He is a secret because no, because you just see numbers and stuff sometimes.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but some people work I'm like that meme.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like that meme where they've got the triangle and people's brains work differently.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: Some people see stuff as images, and some people do see stuff as well.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_05: I knew it.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_05: No, he's a computer.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_05: What do you think?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_05: I don't see ones and zeros.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_05: I just think you constantly see numbers and like uh calculations in your head like constantly, and and then you come up with answers.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_05: That's how I think your brain works.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_05: And it's just a constant web of of words and calculations going on, and then you spit out answers.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_05: But your thinking might be different to my thinking.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, definitely is, for sure.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_05: But Charlotte, what what do you think thinking is?
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: I just have a monkey with symbols in my head that goes.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_05: That's the sort of answer I wanted.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Charlotte's thinking's different now.
• 21:08
  unknown: Yeah.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: No, your thoughts are different.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: Do you want to share the news?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_05: You're gonna share some of your medication with me.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_05: Come on.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: You're not having any of that.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: You can't taste this candy.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_05: I'm gagging for it, to be honest.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_05: I just want to try it one day.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_00: Have you ever tried ADHD meds at all?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I did it.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_05: I did Rittling at school when I was doing my A levels, and um, I never felt more robotic in my life.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_05: I was like, do do do revise.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_00: I tried modapinil, my brother had modafinil, um, and that's not usually a prescribed ADHD med, but people with it do use it.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's what the Marines use to stay awake and alert.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, maybe you I revised for one whole night.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: That's gotta be some serious stuff.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it was fucked.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it was that stuff wired after one of my I did it in my mock just to try it out.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, I did well in that exam, but But retention I didn't find it was so effective.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_05: I think it It made me very product It made me productive but I didn't necessarily retain what I was revising.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_05: But this is a while back now.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I've I've been well I got well we spoke about that didn't we got officially diagnosed?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah but you're on the meds now come and tell us.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah so I tried the meds.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: Well, great story, and you guys have already heard this, but I got I got given two bottles of Ritalin and you're supposed to do something called a titration period, which is where you're kind of like increasing the meds or just seeing how your body responds to them.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: And I was supposed to start on it says 17 micrograms.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: The bottom wine says 18 anyway.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's not getting specifics.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: Supposed to start on 70 micrograms for two weeks, have a review.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_05: Is it weight dependent?
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_05: Like okay, gotcha.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um have a review, and then we're increasing my dose to 27 micrograms.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I picked up my prescription, went to take start my uh start my titration period on Saturday, took took one of the tablets, and then Sunday took the same one.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: And then I realised that I'd taken the higher dose by accident two days in a row instead of the starting dose.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm on the starting dose now.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: So yesterday I've clocked it and I was like, oh my god.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_05: Was it clear and obvious or not?
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: No, because they're both just in the same looking bottle, but I just didn't read the text on the bottle.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: Classic ADHD move classic ADHD move, just literally like impulse.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, cool, let's just chuck a couple of those in my pillbox.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I yeah, it was quite funny because the first I mean to be honest, I didn't throw seven milligrams, I didn't really do that much.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um I definitely noticed I and like my clients Petra called out there, she's like, Oh, you're counting both of our reps now.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: Like they were doing slambles at a slightly different time, and I was counting both of them.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: She was like, You never did that before.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, it's like limitless.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe she's seeing numbers in her head now.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I am seeing numbers.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the seeing numbers and monkeys, and it's multiple, multiple things, but yeah, I mean, the first day I took it, obviously I wasn't supposed to take that high dose, but I actually got quite emotional and I did document it a little bit.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I took it and my brain just was quiet.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: It was quiet, and it was on a Saturday morning, and usually Saturdays I get really stressed, I get very anxious.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like I've and it what I try to be really productive because it's the first day of the weekend, let's try and get loads of stuff out, you know, do some stuff on social media, do some stuff at work, like how can I boost this?
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: How can I like increase you know my clients, etc.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I just it was quiet, and I was like, oh, I've got this thing to do, I did that, I've got this thing to do, and I was just sitting there, I was like, I don't feel stressed.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's a stimulant.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: But my brain was like I definitely noticed, I think I am a bit more chilled.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_05: Obviously, you're like a meditating frog right now.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that's what I'm seeing.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_05: If you were green and had, you know, tongue out, uh get a get a fly.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_04: Get a fly.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_05: You could probably count every fly in the room at once.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_00: Don't set me that task.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: Well, speaking about the room, we didn't even get into it.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_02: We've got we're gonna I'm gonna return to your PhD Charlotte.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um but the room that we're in at the moment, we're in the studio in the gym.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I think it's quite a nice location for it, to be honest.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_05: I think it's better than the living room at my house.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_05: Um I don't know.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I'd agree.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's good lighting.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_05: It's good lighting and it's got an interesting background.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_05: We get the old barrel in there.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, we could do that for announcements, perhaps, you know.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_05: Charlotte Nudson has started her ADHD medication.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: Charlie thinks of numbers.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right, enough of that silliness.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_02: So going forward, Charlotte, you've now you've your mind's a little bit more quiet.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_02: Able to focus.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_02: How does it how does it feel to how's that experience?
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's well novel, right?
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like very novel.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: I just when I was documenting my experience the first day I took it, I just again went a bit emotional.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: I just went, oh, this is how normal brains are supposed to feel.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_00: I've been missing out for 26 years.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's just mental.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I didn't think yeah, it could make such a difference, but I mean I'm on the lower dose now, and I I yeah, I it's weird because you don't really feel it, but you just are I just do feel a bit calmer.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_05: It's interesting you call it normal brain.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_05: Normal brain.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_05: What neurotypical brain.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_02: Neurotypical, but what's neurotypical?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_00: Regular people who aren't, you know, ADHD or diagnosed with a neurodivergence, I guess is what you'd say.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_05: So like uh that's a spectrum of all like neurological condition uh what would what would the word be?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_05: Neurological?
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_05: But that's neurological is nervous system, right?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_02: But then it comes from the brain, so yeah, I guess so.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_05: And I guess where the CNS is disability.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_05: But anyway, yeah, like autistic, dyspraxic, dyslexic, all of that, ADHD, OCD, yeah, they would be under the neurodivergent umbrella.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_05: And neurotypical.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, but again, it is a spectrum, right?
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_05: So uh uh I don't know if there's someone in this world who's at like completely neurotypical but perhaps you know, maybe more so like over fifty percent would be neurotypical sort of thing.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um just able to f you know focus on stuff that they're getting taught in school would be nice.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_02: Not in school anymore.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: No, not in school anymore.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: How have you viewed over the last couple of weeks then?
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: I guess having the the confirmation of the the label of uh ADHD is that has the labelling changed any uh your experience, your lived experience?
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: Just validated, not validated, but validated, is that the right word?
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: It was just a relief because I I knew it's one of those things I don't like going like knew I had it, but to have that confirmation and to go because you say to a lot of people like oh yeah, I think I'm AHD, oh have you been diagnosed yet though?
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I don't think you get so many people telling telling you they don't think you're ADHD.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's like when sorry, when were you the psychologist?
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: So weird, and like people who like don't believe in it and stuff.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: So now to go, yes, like I've been diagnosed by the NHS as well.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um oh Benjamin tripped over.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um that it's just nice to have like that backing.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and obviously it's on like my medical records now, so you know, if I ever need external help with stuff, I think it's quite an accepted thing to have, right?
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: But um you can you can like actually say hey my brain sometimes needs you to repeat the question a few times because sometimes I don't soak it in.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: I mean you you you notice before in the podcast, like when you asked like this time I've been tuned into everything you guys have been saying.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: You've actually answered questions, it's great.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: I've done podcasts with you guys before where you guys were talking about something and Charlie asked me a question.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, oh sorry, what?
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, no, I'll try to like answer it.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_00: It just sounds awful because I was just completely tuned out.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_05: I wonder if they're gonna do a dyslexia pill where it makes you spell better.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_05: Wouldn't that be amazing?
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: Makes you spell better.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: It sounded like you said bell better.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: Make you spell better.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a dyslexia pill.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_05: A dyslexia pill, yeah.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_04: Make you spell better.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think you need to spell better.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_02: Your spelling's just fine.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we've it would actually be very um I would counterproductive if you were to spell well because I've got used to your dyslexic spelling.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_02: If you were to spell well, I'm like, you I don't know what you're trying to spell.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_05: It's too spooky.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_05: It's just phonetically, but then sometimes even worse than that.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_05: I what was the word that got me especially?
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_05: Because you're ex did you ex specially?
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_05: Oh yeah.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_05: I attempted uh it was like Friday night, I was writing an email and SH.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I was I was in the shit.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_05: I could not spell it.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_05: And I was like, what is this word?
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_05: And I I completely forgot it was ES.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_00: You clocked something yesterday, didn't you, Charlie?
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, it is ES.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_02: No, I'm just thinking about like you have spell check and like predictive text.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_02: But you must have been so far off that it doesn't need to be.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_05: No, no, because as soon as you go EX, X especially, that's how I was I was spelling it.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_05: Um but yeah, so it would have never just it was just completely wrong.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_05: And I I I was so frustrated.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_05: I was like, surely.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_05: And then I then when I it when it gets to the point where I'm like I give up, I'll just say it, and then it does it for me.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah, voice notes are really your friend to Yeah, yeah, no, it is.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_02: Unless you start saying it weird, but you're but you're spelling it as it's said, as you know, yeah.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: You're you're the true linguist here.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_02: You're you're communicating very close to the bone of the actual reality of the word.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_00: Some say you see in numbers.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_00: See No.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_05: I see in animals.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I rate that.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah, hell yeah.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_02: Charlotte, what are you gonna say?
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_05: I'm the lone back to you there.
• 31:14
  SPEAKER_00: I just it was you you spotted one of guys misspelling miss misspellings um yesterday and it made me laugh.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_00: I can't remember what it was.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, it's it's endless on the stories though.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_05: Sometimes people call me out for them and I'm like, alright, I'm pretty sure there's misspellings.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_05: On the board, maybe oh yeah that whiteboard.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, I think I th I think span.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_05: How do you spell span?
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_05: Span S-P-A-N.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I got it right.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_05: For some reason I thought it was wrong.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_05: I was looking at it and was thinking that's wrong.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_05: Time span.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_02: To be fair, I wrote on my on my story yesterday when I was like when my getting my chord activated, I uh I wrote it as in like the possessive word, like oh it's mine.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's starting to walk.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: And it looks weird, right?
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_02: And it looked weird, and I just looked at it and I'm like, I swear, is there an apostrophe?
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: Is there an apostrophe?
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, ITS?
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what what is that?
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_05: Um when you look at a word too long, but hey Charlie, let's stop talking about spelling.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_05: Come on, get it out, get your leg in.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_05: Look at this.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_05: Charlie's got his um tubi grip on.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_05: Tubi grip on.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, for completion.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_05: He's got his brace off.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_05: And he's got a little midget leg now.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_02: This is my chicken leg.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_02: Supermodel legs.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's not that bad.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_02: Not that much smaller.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_02: I did some um okay, we're gonna play a game.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we're gonna play a game as guess how thick my leg is.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_04: Can you tell us the Guess how thick Charlie's leg is?
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_04: This segment is brought to you by Iron Bruno Iron Bruno So first, Alex DeFizio did a measurement around my VMO.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay on my left side.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, what was it?
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_02: I'm getting I'm getting there.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_04: Fuck it home.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_05: Let me do a guess first, alright?
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: No, you're not allowed to touch it.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_02: You're not allowed to touch it.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_05: You're not allowed to touch it.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_05: That's cheating.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_05: You can give me any numbers.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_02: I want to go completely mind.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_02: Talking to the mic.
• 33:15
  unknown: Let me know.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_05: No, I can't.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_05: No, no.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_04: What's this camera angle like?
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_04: Guy is currently feeling up his own leg.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_04: He's wrapped his hands around his own legend.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Sponsored by Love Honey.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, don't go too hard.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_02: He's now thinking.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_02: I wonder what's going through his brain.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, why are you sliding your hand up Charlie's thigh?
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's next.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_02: We're just doing the VMO.
• 33:41
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, we did you do you do centimetres?
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_05: Centimetres.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_05: Why only know inches?
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, go for inches, I'll convert it in centimetres.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_05: Do you know how to do that?
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_05: Is it two is it three point three point two centimetres to the inch?
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_04: How do you know that?
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_05: Is that right?
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_05: No.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_05: Alright.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_03: 2.56.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_05: So I would say.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_05: I would say I'd say that that that there is roughly about 14 inches.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_05: And that's about 13.7 or 13.5.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_02: Wait, so you're saying that they're basically the same?
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, they're not far off.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_05: They're really not.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_05: Interesting.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_05: I think it's because there's a bit of inflammation, or maybe because this leg's more bent.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_05: Hang on.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_05: Hang on.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_02: Going again.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_02: The thing is, if you're not watching the video, this is makes for terrible listening.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_02: Guy's now bricks my leg again.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like he's gonna pull my leg off.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_02: Should we just guy's pulling me off?
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_05: There's only about an inch different there.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: So you think literally just two and a half centimetres different?
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_05: If I were to take a look at it.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_05: Oh no, no, maybe maybe three and a half centimetres.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_05: But I'm saying I'm calling that fourteen and calling that thirteen and a half.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_02: So left side in centimetres, 46 centimetres.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_02: What did I say?
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_02: You said 14 inches, which is only about 35 centimetres.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna say on your right side.
• 35:08
  unknown: Fuck.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: So 46, that's 46 on my left.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna say 40 42, 43.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_02: 39.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_05: Really?
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_05: It wasn't that bit no, it wasn't that different with my hand management.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_05: No, I just thought it was gonna be a lot less.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_05: Let me grip your leg again.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um then we go up my thigh, which is why this is gonna just be a visual episode, a visual segment.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um on my left, it was fifty-six.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, it's forty forty forty-eight.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_05: Let me just touch it again.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: No, no.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_05: Fifty-six here, this is forty-nine.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's fifty three.
• 35:55
  unknown: Okay.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_02: Forty-nine is correct.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_02: I told you, I told you I had a proper rub of his leg there.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, actually, I didn't rub his leg.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: Might have made a difference.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's definitely an advanced competitive competitive advantage.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: His leg might have been a bit wider if we both rubbed it.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's the end of that segment.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_02: Charlotte, you're not allowed to rub his leg.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_05: That's the end of the leg rubbing segment.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe we'll return next week.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: Sponsored by Grindr.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um So when I looked at it, so I then I tried to take a I was like, I'm gonna make a trans you know, transformation photo of me uh five and a half, six weeks post-surgery to then twelve weeks post-surgery and just like take a photo every day because my right leg is obviously considerably smaller by when you look at it.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_05: But it I have an idea.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_05: When I took a photo, it didn't make it.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_05: Any chance for him to grab your leg against it?
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_05: No, it does, but I think it's carrying more fat in there as well.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_05: Do you think that too?
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's definitely a looser skin.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_05: Potentially holding a bit less glycogen, water, like you know, everything.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not pumping the carbs in there, you are.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you're moving it about, right?
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_00: But not as much, there's not as much kind of pressure being put through that leg.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_05: Charlie just doesn't know how to get his leg as excited anymore, you know.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I did yesterday, I did five kilos on the leg extension and it was shaking.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_02: It was coming alive.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_05: It was vibrating, was it?
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was it literally was vibrating.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_02: It was like it was I don't know, it was just kind of spasming.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_02: Twitchy leg.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_02: You know, twitchy leg.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_02: It was good, the nervous system was waking up.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_05: I haven't done a quad extension in quite some time.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_00: Way too many of those.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_05: I don't really I haven't done any isolation.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I do like isolation lesson sessions in here, but on my hamstrings and my glutes, but never my quads.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe sissy squats you could class them as uh an isolation.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_02: I tried to do a wool sit.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_02: He got me doing a wool sit, and it was for what it was worth.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_02: Like at the moment we're just focusing on getting the quads working.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I tried to sit and it was like the pain, yeah.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's but it's below the knee because it's still a little bit swollen.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: And then he said, No, just do some squats, squats, squats, squats, squats, squats, squats, squat, squat squats.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_02: SWAT squats.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_02: Swat squad.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_02: So I've just been doing some goblet squats, some hack squats, some leg extension, and calf raises.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_00: Very good.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, very good indeed.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_05: That's well behaved of you, Xavier.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_05: It's really well behaved of you.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: I was just checking his notifications.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_05: No, someone might be arriving shortly looking for me.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_05: Um the SWAT squad.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_05: But yeah, uh how are you feeling about it?
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_05: A bit more positive now the brace is off.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_02: I've been positive all the time, to be honest.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's it was a weird one.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: I was chatting to my chatting to my mates last night over a Nando's.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's a Nando's gorgeous.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_02: Which one?
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: Tumridge Wells.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_02: I don't like Nando's.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_05: You weren't there then.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_05: Bringing down the vibe.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_05: Legend.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_05: I don't I I kind of like I like it, but I don't get what the rave is about.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_00: Guy, you don't like hot drinks either, so I don't think we really trust you.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like Nando's, I don't like hot drinks.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_05: I know I don't dislike it.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_05: I just don't get why everyone goes mad for it.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's just it's just a good stand, like it's just you get the same thing every time, right?
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's like kind of like a waggers, like it's nothing crazy special, but you know that you're gonna get a pretty much standard each time.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_00: Safety, isn't it?
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_05: It's just safety now.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_05: Safety.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_05: But sorry, continue.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_05: You were with your friends and they were measuring your leg.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they were measuring my leg in a nando's.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um, no, that's why that's definitely that's the actual reason that why I don't invite you.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's because you start measuring my leg in public.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh no, how did I feel?
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I was chatting to them about it, and um I mean I it it goes back to the expectations, is I don't have any expectations of outcome in this process.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I have full trust in the physio to do what I need to do.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: And the first couple of weeks it's just like, right, recover, get my nutrition sorted, it's just doing things and making sure I'm just chilling out.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_02: And then now it's just making sure I'm doing all the strength work.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: And when the brace comes off, like if they said to me, Oh, something's happened, you need to be on the in the brace for another 10 weeks, now I'd be absolutely fine with that.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: That's a process.
• 40:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like I've had quite a lot of uncertainty last couple of years, and so I'd never really anchor myself too much towards a certain date.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and also, to be honest, I've just been really enjoying all the training and all the rehab.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: I've been enjoying the ski urg.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: Which now I'm back on the bike.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: You enjoying the bike?
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it was it was nice to be on the bike.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_02: So that's the other that's the flip side.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: It's like I'm absolutely I've got a deep kind of level of acceptance of the uncertainty, but also it doesn't mean that I don't enjoy it when I can then progress.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_02: So like being able to walk around is a really nice feeling, and not taking my crutches into the gym, or not taking my knee brace into the gym, and getting on the bike for 15 minutes and just peddling.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_02: Because for me, that's then because the association I've got with those movements is closer to being pain-free and healthy, I then have that more like connection to having a pain-free body.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: Solid outlook, mate.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_02: And so that and that's kind of what's what it's gonna unfold with, you know, touch wood over the next couple of months, is that it's just unlocking things that are closer to the main thing, which is getting back running.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_05: What about like an elliptical is your progression?
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_05: Will that is that a viable option yet?
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's at the moment, all of it's about chord strength.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_02: And also it's a balance between strengthening the quads and uh making sure that the swelling goes down on the knee because the thing that's preventing range of motion and proper quad activation is the swelling.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_02: So it's making sure in the sessions that the swelling is at a decent level so I can do the exercises.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: So it's still a balance of healing and like and loading.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_02: So elliptical, you know, will I get much uh uh quad work out of it?
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_02: Probably not.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_00: Takes a lot of resistance out of your legs, really.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and then would I get a lot of like swelling from it?
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_02: Probably yes.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so it's I think the bike's a good place to be.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, the 15 minutes yesterday, I'll probably build up.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, Alex said to me, he was like, You there's not a limit really on what you can do on the bike.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's just over the next couple of weeks, it's like just keep it easy to moderate, don't be hammering sessions.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so keep the resistance low, doesn't it?
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think it's gonna be a bit of a um a bit of an experiment because obviously if I want to build leg strength, I'll probably go heavier resistance, but for just getting it getting used to the mo like movement, because my leg still feels pretty stiff doing it.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um it's just gonna be a natural like just adjust it experiment.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_02: But it doesn't mean that for my hard sessions I'm I'm going back on the ski og that ski og is not I'm not leaving it yet.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_05: You're not done with that bar.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_02: No, not the I'm not throwing throwing away the uh the stick that used to guide me.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_05: Love that.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_05: What does that stick look like?
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_05: Um six inches?
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_04: You've thrown me there hanging on a guy's antlers.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_05: Wouldn't you like to know, weather boy?
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_05: Well what what sort of stick would what sort of walking stick would you wield?
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_05: A wooden one.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_05: A wooden yeah.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_05: What shape would it be?
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_05: A wooden one.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_05: A curly would like the curly one.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_05: Do you have a like a big pearl at the top of it?
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_05: A candy cane.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_05: No.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_05: No, like a big diamond at the top or like a big gemstone put into the wood.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_00: Moonstone.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_05: That'd be pretty cool.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_02: I would have a C at the bottom that is like metal, so I can heat it up and then brand people with it.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_00: Just a aggressive approach.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: Just in case they try and steal the ski though.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_05: Where would that be?
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_05: Would that be right on the bottom or would that be on the side?
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, depends how many times you keep touching my legs.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_05: No, Charlie, are you talking about branding me?
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_00: You naughty boy.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, no, a good it's nothing like a good walking stick, eh, Charles?
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe you might need one at some point in your life.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe I'll have to get you one.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_04: Alright, thanks.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_04: Well, my birthday's next month, so do you know what I've been looking at?
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_05: Go on.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_05: Forging a sword.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_05: Forging a sword.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: It'd be a very fun thing to do.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_05: I know, right?
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_05: They do it up in um Herefordshire.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_05: They have a forge there, and you go in and it I didn't I thought it was pretty reasonable.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_05: It's to create your own sword, right?
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_05: And you'd spend the day there working with the metal workers and they're showing you how to do it all uh for 450 quid and you'd get to create your complete own sword, they do tutorials, they take you through it, and you get to hit the hot metal and whatnot.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: Alan did something like that, but I think he made a knife and maybe a uh axe.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, you have the options to do whatever.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_05: But I said, you know, it's got to be a sword, right?
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_05: But how cool is that?
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_05: That is pretty cool.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know This is my sword I made earlier.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_05: Sword comes back, it's like I'm gonna put it, I'm gonna put it above my bed.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh, that falls all the knife up on his head.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_05: Well that's that's a bad moment.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_05: I'll probably I'd probably severely messed up in life if that happened.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_04: Don't put it over your bed.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_05: Because then if someone comes into the barn.
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, get out of my house.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_05: Englishman.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_05: Proper Englishman.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_05: Grabs the dildo, grabs the sword.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, accidentally grab the the big the big dildo instead of the uh the sword.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_05: That would throw it at him.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_05: Distraction, grab the sword.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_04: Someone's broken into your house.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_04: Stop wiggling it.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_04: I think I'd be more afraid of the dildo than the sword.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, grab some leaf, grab the dildo, get back.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_05: I don't think people okay, like this is just not any normal dildo for the listeners today.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_00: Dildo baggins are right with us.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_05: I gifted it about oh gosh, about four years ago.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's about 14 inches.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_05: Like it's massive black dildo, and it's it's I've got some deer antlers and up on the on the top of my wooden beam, and it's mounted on top of the antlers.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_05: Um and it's quite blatantly obvious when you walk into my house that there's uh antlers with a big big dildo on there.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but it's quite intimidating for people.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: Great for consultations, yeah.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_05: Especially if I have to bring people up into my house for a consultation.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_00: Mind the dildo hanging off those antlers there.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I promise I'm saying.
• 46:28
  SPEAKER_05: Sometimes it is like, do I tell them, do I not?
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_05: Do I hope they don't see it?
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_05: But it's it's there in their face.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_05: And your eyes are drawn, you naturally look around the room and think, oh, there's some antlers there.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, there's a massive dildo on those antlers.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, nice to meet you for the first time, Trick.
• 46:41
  SPEAKER_00: There's a flying pig hanging off the beam.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_05: Well, the flying pig's good luck.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, flying pigs have always been good luck to me.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_05: I don't know why.
• 46:50
  SPEAKER_05: Well, I do know why, because pigs can't fly, but that pig flies.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_02: You know what the funniest thing is is that you'd probably be able to go through either your or my Instagrams and the face-to-face videos that we'd record in your living room in the background, you'd probably be able to see the dildo.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_02: And all the podcasts.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_02: No, the podcast crops it out.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: Does it?
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, the podcast crops it out too low.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_02: But there's an Easter egg for any of you that are now listening, if you haven't turned off already.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_00: Instead of where's Wally, where's the black dildo?
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: Well, yeah.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: We could play that.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_05: We could get it hanging out here next time.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_05: Gong.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_05: We can get it to whack the gong.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_05: We can use it to measure Charlie's thigh.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: Wrap it around there.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_05: Well, on on other news, Charlotte.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_05: Tell us about your training at the moment.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_05: You've been training with the the Oh God.
• 47:46
  SPEAKER_00: Uh my training's yeah, my training's fine.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_00: My training's just fine.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's just the same as it was, just big old off season.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_00: Let's get the legs bigger.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_00: Bigger and bigger.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: Are they getting bigger?
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_00: I think so.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_05: Have you measured them?
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_00: I haven't.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_00: I probably should.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_05: When was the last time you did measurements?
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I've got some measurements in my notes, so I could just get the the tape out and do them again tonight.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_05: I could do that for you.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_05: I'm quite good at measuring things.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's quite handy by like 10 centimetres.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_05: No, no, five.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_02: No, no.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_05: And the second time I was bang on.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_05: Alright.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_05: So you have a 50% chance of me.
• 48:27
  unknown: Okay.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_05: I'm quite good at guessing the weight of someone.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_05: Over the years.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_05: I've had to see a lot of people of all shapes and sizes.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_00: Guess my weight right now.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_05: You.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_05: You stand up.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_05: Um come here.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_05: Probably probably like 72, 73.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_00: Bosh.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_00: 73.1 this morning.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_05: Um right, stand up, Charlie.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_05: Stop that.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_05: Right, come here.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_05: Let me have a grope.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_00: Let me have a grope.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, you're probably about 10 kilos heavier than I've 82, 83.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think I'm 83.
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm about eighty.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_05: Eighty?
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_03: Pathetic.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_03: 80.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_05: Alright.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_05: It was.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_05: Do you know what it was?
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_05: It was the thickness of this.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay, and not the thickness of what the Charlotte's wearing.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_02: The same thing.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_05: 8283.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_05: So you know we go up in 10 kilo intervals.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_02: That's fun.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: You're 92, 93, oh yeah.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_02: 103?
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_02: So Well, we were just about to Charlotte, talk to us more about your training.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_00: Oh God.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_05: Are they thicking up nicely?
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_00: I hope what?
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_05: Your quads.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I hope so.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_05: They look pretty strong.
• 49:53
  SPEAKER_05: Surely, so so how much of it is.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_00: You still look jacked a couple of weeks ago.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_05: No, I am saying you look jacked, but how much of it is like arguably, right?
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_05: You have enough muscle mass to go on stage now, but isn't isn't it for you basically in your cut not losing as much muscle next time?
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, definitely.
• 50:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think I it's hard because when you're an actual athlete, like when you do get to that point, you do just end up losing muscle.
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like I I was looking at pictures at the end right at the end of my prep, and I actually preferred my look on my third show.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think I lost I think I lost a bit of muscle from like the start of the show to the end, yeah.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because I needed to get more condition, but it's just getting that fine line, and you know, my coach did it really well, but just you do just lose a bit.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um and yeah, to try not to so it's kind of gaining more muscle, so then if I do lose a bit, I still look bigger.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_05: From out from outside of a bodybuilding perspective, though, I thought you probably looked your best about six to eight weeks out.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_05: But what I always notice with natural bodybuilders is when they so for men, when they get down to about that a true 12%, not like a fake 12% mark, they still got a decent amount of muscle mass, but when they make that jump from 12 down to about eight percent to get stage ready, it's not just 4% of their body weight they lose.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_05: They probably lose a further 10% of their body weight, and a lot a lot of it is muscle, so although they get that leaner look, they get that kind of skinnier look.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_00: Their legs start to look a little bit spindly sometimes.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, and it's it seems just to be a lot of weight kind of goes off in muscle mass as well, making when you start to get really low.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_05: Did you find I mean do you have friends that notice that as well?
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: I I g I mean I guess so.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_00: I I I couldn't really like if I was looking at people that I competed with, I couldn't really I don't know, I can't really think of someone who lost like a significant amount more.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um but I just know near the end of mine, I was looking at my legs, I was like, do I am I a bikini competitor?
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_00: Like am I in the wrong category?
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um but you just always go a little bit blind when you're like at that point anyway.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I I yeah, I like I still really like what I'm doing.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_00: I still like the kind of routine that it gives me.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_00: I definitely wanna I would basically my goal is to try and go pro next year in a natural pro qualifier.
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um I wouldn't try to win a pro qualifier unassisted.
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_00: That just yeah.
• 52:29
  SPEAKER_00: So go for the natural natural ones.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_00: That'd be cool.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_00: It'd be cool to do that.
• 52:33
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I mean, but how how many people within the natural shows do you think are actually taking stuff?
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_05: How strict is the testing?
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_05: Because it's what, one piss test?
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's interesting actually.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's very interesting when you ask that because you pay different so I did two different federations last year.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna call them out, but you pay for the testing, right?
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_00: They only test you if you win if you win your class, or if you win like the overall.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_00: So with one of the feds, they only tested you if you won the overall.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_00: So there could have been loads of people that were assisted, and also the problem is as well, you get people who might potentially might be an assisted in the past and then they've gone off assistance, and yes, they might not have any, I'm not gonna specify with your stuff, but any of that running in their blood, but because they've been on it in the past, they've gained that muscle in the past, so it's easier for them to gain that muscle again.
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's that muscle memory thing.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_00: So when your body's used to a slightly higher muscle mass, you can still gain that muscle mass back.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I think there's I there's probably are unfortunately, there probably are a lot of people cheating.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I think last year as well, there was actually a big scandal with one of the one of the biggest prep coaches, arguably, in the UK, entering assisted girls into an assist uh on a natural competition through one of the biggest federations.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_00: It was cooked because he was sponsoring it.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_05: Let's just say it how it is, they're taking steroids, right?
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_05: They're taking performance enhancing drugs.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, performance enhancing drugs, it could be fat burners as well.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_00: So like Clem Bouterol, which is like an asthma medication.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_05: But are they are they able to test for like retitutide and azempic and major?
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_05: Like, is that now a performance hand?
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_00: No, that's that's yeah, that's a that's a performance enhancing drug because it's illegal.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like you you if you are using that unless you were I think if you have proof of being a prescribed it from a doctor because you were a beast or something, I think maybe you're doing a bodybuilding show and it's only claiming that you're not gonna be able to do that.
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_00: Also, retitrutidide, you can like there's been so many, like there's like a time and a place for it, and it actually can make you hold on to like a fluid, so actually can make your physique look a little bit washed out.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've spoken to quite a few people about it, and I person I just just make the make hard work great again.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know what I mean?
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like one of the one of the biggest coaches, Callum Pro coach, did a post the other day about that.
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like, why are people scared of the grind?
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it was always like that before, and now again, it's as soon as you get that you know that option to you know take the blue pill.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_00: Do you know what I mean?
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_00: God, that always sounds like I'm talking about fire anchor.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_00: But is it the red pill or the blue pill?
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_00: Is that matrix?
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it is.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so yeah, you get a b but you want to go for that blue one that limitless pill, it's just like people just hop on it because they want to make their prep easier.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_00: But like, you know, if you're assisted and you're already taking stuff, cool, do what you want to do.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_00: But if you're natural and you're just because you're a bit hungry, like, bro, you just you've got to accept that you're gonna be hungry.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_00: Your body's in an unnatural position, right?
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what's I'm quite interested, you said about uh not losing as much muscle mass.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_02: How do you go about how do you go about that?
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think the best approach if you're ever doing a bodybuilding prep to not lose or like to minimize the catabolic effect of really hard dieting is you have to do it really slowly.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_00: You have to really trickle down those calories so you can still train at an intensity where you're trying to you know maintain sometimes people even can it's a rare occasion, but can gain a bit of muscle at the start of the prep because you're still training hard, still pushing hard, you keep your protein super high.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I think uh you sometimes see it where a coach will rush their client and get them peeled too early, and then they've still got like say like 12 weeks, right?
• 56:07
  SPEAKER_00: And they're super super peeled and they're knackered because they've just been doing loads of cardio and that can that can cause you to lose muscle mass, I think.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 56:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then also the the client just looks knackered by the end of it.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_02: So how how much difference would you slow the process down of uh cutting, how much longer are you saying would make a significant difference?
• 56:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think usually it also depends how much weight the person's got to lose, but I mean you can usually see obviously nice.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_00: You can usually see like I mean the kind of bog standard uh time for like someone doing especially doing a first prep um is about like 20 20 weeks plus like 23 weeks.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_00: Is like it's a nice slow prep and it just makes that the transition into it easier as well if like they haven't kind of been on plan like in their off season, like it just makes that transition of kind of making sure you're eating the same foods easier because it's just a nice long process of doing that, but then there's kind of constat as well, right?
• 57:08
  SPEAKER_00: But it just it all depends on where your body fat is at the start of prep because some people are just naturally leaner as well.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like my friend Shauna, her prep was like 14 or 16 weeks till she did her first show, which you know that's quite a considerable amount less than some other people.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_00: Some people some pros with like a 12-week prep.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_05: But that does that depend on how much gate they weigh sorry weight they gained in the bulk.
• 57:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, yeah.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_00: If you if you're starting a lot softer, like it's always that like my coach always to me, what you gain is gonna have to come off again.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_00: So it it's like with off season, like people use the word bulking.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_00: We spoke about this before, I think.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like to, especially with like female clients, I think specifically.
• 57:47
  SPEAKER_00: It it just depends how people what people's outlook is on stuff.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_00: But I think if you like if you have an like it can I feel like bulking can come with a bit of a negative connotation, right?
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_00: So using the the words like improvement phase or a growth phase can be a little bit better for some people.
• 58:04
  SPEAKER_00: So and so some people will go, oh I'm bulking so I can eat this.
• 58:07
  SPEAKER_00: I'm bulking so I can eat.
• 58:08
  SPEAKER_00: I was literally having this conversation with my client last night.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um it can be really easy to kind of switch your mindset and then you end up overeating in your office season because you think, okay, well, I you know, I'm I need to grow so I'm gonna eat this muffin, but that's not gonna help you grow muscle, really.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_00: Might give you energy, but if you you wanna grow, you want to grow and be in a surplus, like a smart surplus, where it's not just a load of crap food.
• 58:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um yeah.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_05: Bodybuilding 101.
• 58:34
  SPEAKER_05: Body bodybuilding is a I've never chose to compete in it just yet.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe at one point in my life I will, but it's an interesting thing.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I think it it it for me appeals to me more so the discipline, but I I I just because it is a sport littered with performance-enhancing drugs, there's it it it for me if I was to ever do it, it would all be about just myself and seeing what I could do because it's just so hard to tell like people taking you know, even if it is just a a a small fat burner or they have done steroids the you know the year before and they've come off that's running tests, and it just gives people unfair advantages, and it's it's such a yeah, it's such a weird sport.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_05: I've you know I've watched it my whole life and I've always been just fascinated by the mass monsters uh in the open at the Olympia.
• 59:23
  SPEAKER_05: Saw the Arnolds the other day, yeah, and you know, and you look at Andrew Jacked, and he's like 140 kilos stage, six foot six, and it just like wow, yeah, just what a freaking nature.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_05: Like you it's uh it almost reminds me of Ronnie Coleman.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's so impressive, but it is it is it is an interesting I mean I love it, but I also love other things, but I think that's why it's nice that we've got like us three doing different things.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's nice that we've got that variety to talk about on here.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_05: But it's it's it's such a controversial sport as well.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, so many people hate it.
• 59:57
  SPEAKER_05: Because it's just I mean, like it's subjective, right?
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_05: And yes, they're judging who's the leanest and who has the biggest muscles and who has the biggest the best flow of their physique and the best posing routine.
• 1:00:07
  SPEAKER_05: But then when everything is just such fine margins, it really kind of comes down to subjectively who was the best according to the judges, and yeah, it can it can lead to quite a lot of disappointment.
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_00: You have to have thick skin, yeah.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_00: Because the judges don't care about your nan dying two days before your show, or you know, it's crap that happened to you, or how hard your prep was, they just care about how you look on the stage.
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_00: And you have to that's I think that's why I I actually really like it because I can be quite hard on myself, and I think it taught me to just like you know, I it's hard for me to say this because I had a pretty successful season, but like I think if I got on stage, you know, I still I didn't get like an overall at any of my competitions, so I won my classes, but I never got an overall, and I was still a bit gutted by that, but then that like I just it made me just hungry for more, and I just also you accept that okay the judges just preferred the look of that person that day, right?
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_00: Or so it it teaches you to kind of just give yourself grace and you know also just be proud of yourself, as you said, for like how far you managed to take it because it is a really extreme thing to do, yeah, and that discipline you gain a lot of respect for yourself, so it is cool in that aspect, but yeah, I I I just really did it again, like you were saying, just to kind of prove to myself I could do it, and actually I just fell in love with the other aspects of it as well, so that's why I've stuck with it.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_00: But I do, you know, I've enjoyed other sports before as well, and I think that's again why I've gone onto it because I've I've done quite a lot of other stuff, so let's try this one out.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_02: Is there any part of is there any aesthetic that you have that the in the competition is preferred to actually how you would choose it?
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_02: So let's say, you know, um like a size of a particular muscle or a certain way in your physique that you have to play towards the game of what the judges want.
• 1:02:00
  SPEAKER_02: Like if you had it your way, would you shape yourself different, would you build differently in the process?
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_00: Uh what do you oh what like for example so for my category, yeah.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_00: So with my category, if there's one thing I'd definitely say I miss, so I do my category is wellness, and it's basically about having a much denser lower body, so it's out of proportion to your upper.
• 1:02:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you still have to have a super developed upper, arguably, I mean just as developed as a bikini girl, but then your lower has to be more dense.
• 1:02:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I really do like that look.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I also used to really, really love training upper to the point where I think it would be a little bit too big for wellness if I trained it as consistently as I used to, especially my back.
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like I love training my back, but I've got a pretty strong back.
• 1:02:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I used to really love doing pull-ups, and I can't I can do like four pull-ups now.
• 1:02:55
  SPEAKER_00: I used to be able to do ten unassisted, and I loved that, and it made me feel really strong, but now I can't really do that because it just it just grows up my back too much.
• 1:03:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I need because I you know I need to have that imbalance because my upper body is developed, I don't want it to kind of look like an equal to my lower, so I look like almost just like a bigger bikini girl.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because then I have to get if my upper body gets bigger, I have to work even harder with my legs, and my legs are already fatigued as they are training them a lot.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that's one thing I definitely say I'd miss like kind of training up a how I used to, and like doing bench press and like pull-ups and training my bicep like bicep curls and stuff that you don't want your biceps to be massive because then it makes your shoulder caps look smaller.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_00: So it's little things like that, little details.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_00: But I prefer how I look now.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_00: I just miss doing pull-ups.
• 1:03:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, fair.
• 1:03:43
  SPEAKER_05: So if you get pro next year, what it so do you see bodybuilding now as like long-term, next five, six years?
• 1:03:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think it really depends on how next year's season goes and if I enjoy that prep again, because it is a hard thing, and I think especially I I was gonna say, like, with us kind of doing it, you know, we have a pretty physical job anyway.
• 1:04:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I do remember at the end of my prep last year, like it I was so tired, and I'd be coaching classes and I couldn't even demonstrate stuff.
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_00: And luckily the members here are amazing, and they all kind of accepted me just sitting in the box being like, guys, you you know what you're doing, don't you?
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_00: Or I'd get someone to do like a demonstration or something or pick up a weight.
• 1:04:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that's the only thing that I find quite challenging.
• 1:04:26
  SPEAKER_00: So as long as I can still navigate that and it doesn't get harder or anything, or you know, yeah, I do I do really like, and I think also I really like like posing, I find that really fun.
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so doing that, but yeah, it just it really depends.
• 1:04:39
  SPEAKER_00: If I went pro, it'd be amazing.
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_00: But again, I don't see myself hopping on assistance.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_00: So if you do go pro, you know, if you're competing in an unassisted, like you you can have there are a lot of natural athletes that have much better physiques than some of these assisted people, and I will back that till the cows come home.
• 1:04:56
  SPEAKER_00: But um, you know, if you're wanting to go to the Olympia, the only way as a natural athlete you can get in there with like a fair game against other natural athletes is if you do the Ben Weeder, which is like it's one competition, right?
• 1:05:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um all the other competitions leading to the Olympia, all assistants are you up against people who've got flat burners, who've got you know this, that and whatever.
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it's quite hard.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_00: Um you can do it, there's a natural girl in the Olympia this year, but yeah, it's just harder.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know if it I'd want to kind of push to that extent.
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_00: We've just got to see how I've developed from this year, right?
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, because it's only really your second year doing it.
• 1:05:35
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, exactly.
• 1:05:36
  SPEAKER_00: I've only done I've only done one season, like I did a lot of shows, but uh yeah, I only did one season, so Yeah.
• 1:05:42
  SPEAKER_00: But I do like it.
• 1:05:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's fun.
• 1:05:44
  SPEAKER_05: Xavier What where do you see yourself at the end of this summer?
• 1:05:50
  SPEAKER_02: Who knows?
• 1:05:51
  SPEAKER_00: The Olympic team.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
• 1:05:53
  SPEAKER_05: The Olympic team.
• 1:05:54
  SPEAKER_02: The Olympics in twenty twenty six.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 1:05:56
  SPEAKER_02: I'm bringing it forward two years.
• 1:05:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um army, who knows?
• 1:05:59
  SPEAKER_02: Who knows?
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um I gotta say, I can't my my horizons are pretty close to me in terms of what I'm doing.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um and I don't know, I don't even know when I'll be able to run because it's kind of like let the bone heal six weeks' time, and then as long as I've got strength and can do pliers and stuff, then I'll be able to return to run.
• 1:06:18
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not I'm not racing to get back to do anything this summer.
• 1:06:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm not putting a stake in the ground and say I want to get back and do a race on the track.
• 1:06:28
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it'll I'll take it as it comes.
• 1:06:30
  SPEAKER_00: Just being able to enjoy running again, right?
• 1:06:32
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's it, and I and I don't I think it's gonna be really difficult for me to forget that.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh previously, if I've had injuries and still been in the in that kind of environment where it makes sense for me to let's say the injury comes around and it's I'm back in get back training in January, so I can have a little bit of a build into summer, I'm still in that phase of just like training and competing.
• 1:06:56
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas this time round, I think that's what's gonna be quite nice affording myself a whole year build-up, is that I can just go up to London and catch up with mates and go for a run or see what all these silly run clubs are about, and just do it for like do it for the sake of it.
• 1:07:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, and I and that is the good thing about this whole process is like I enjoy I enjoy running without the competition.
• 1:07:17
  SPEAKER_02: There will be things in the competition that I have absolutely forgotten, like the buzz and the nerves and the just the rush of winning, running fast, running quicker than you ever run, and like prep for competition, tapering, and even just training with a group.
• 1:07:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I mean, our group at the moment is just like honestly.
• 1:07:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's going crazy.
• 1:07:39
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, Jack, Jack Higgins, and it's funny saying like our our group, like I haven't trained with them for a good couple of years, um, but you know, the group that I'll then go back into, Jack's just been selected for the world indoor champs.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_02: He's just run, yeah, he just ran the world qualifying time of 335 for a 1500.
• 1:07:57
  SPEAKER_02: So sick.
• 1:07:58
  SPEAKER_02: His brother Ted acted as an extra pacer in that race, sacrificed his own race, could have won a grand at podium 5k up in Battersea, could have won that cleanly.
• 1:08:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's fair.
• 1:08:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like it wasn't the fastest race, got some good athletes there, but Ted is in such good shape at the moment.
• 1:08:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, that yeah, he sacrificed that race.
• 1:08:20
  SPEAKER_02: He then went up to Glasgow and paced his brother around and pretty much jogged the last 200 because he paced him to 1300 metres.
• 1:08:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um and so he's kind of an unsung hero in that in that case.
• 1:08:35
  SPEAKER_05: Would there be so let's say if you were pacing and then you actually noticed, oh my goodness, I might get my personal best here.
• 1:08:43
  SPEAKER_05: Would you keep going?
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it depends what kind of race it is.
• 1:08:47
  SPEAKER_00: You got on Strava, you're getting give you kudos.
• 1:08:50
  SPEAKER_02: The way yeah, the way the way that the pacing works is that for the most part, you'll be pacing more than one race.
• 1:08:57
  SPEAKER_02: So you're getting paid to run multiple races.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_02: So if there's a whole evening of open meets, I might be pacing, let's say I pace the A race, right?
• 1:09:06
  SPEAKER_02: Where I'm going through in a certain time, let's say I run through 51 seconds or 50 seconds through 400 metres.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_02: Let's say for some reason I get to 600 metres and I'm still feeling good.
• 1:09:15
  SPEAKER_02: I probably wouldn't get to 600 because I'll drop out at 500 and let the race go.
• 1:09:20
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you're very unlikely, unless it is a singular race, or let's say that and how long would sorry, how much percent of the race would you pace for?
• 1:09:28
  SPEAKER_02: Uh probably you're looking at about sixty percent.
• 1:09:32
  SPEAKER_02: You're looking probably about two-thirds if you can.
• 1:09:35
  SPEAKER_02: A really good pacer.
• 1:09:36
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it it helps so much.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like in an 800, you can't underestimate once you go through the the bell, so once you go through one lap, that next 200 meters can make or break your time for the whole race.
• 1:09:48
  SPEAKER_02: Because naturally you hit the bell, you've gone out pretty hard, you then settle into a rhythm, and naturally, as soon as you settle into a rhythm, you actually start slowing down, and then people start to queue up and wait for a kick.
• 1:09:59
  SPEAKER_02: And if they want to win the race, then it could turn into a tactical one.
• 1:10:01
  SPEAKER_05: So if you were to pace at 800 metres, you would want to do 600 meters of that paste?
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_02: Naturally, you'll go to 400 if you can, and someone might specifically request it, go to 500.
• 1:10:16
  SPEAKER_02: Once you get to 500, you don't want to impact the tactics of the race.
• 1:10:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:10:20
  SPEAKER_02: That's another thing.
• 1:10:20
  SPEAKER_02: Like, if if someone wants to make a move down the back straight, you're thinking 500 metres is normally where the the hammer throw is on that that bend.
• 1:10:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like coming into the back straight, there are people that are going to want to make moves.
• 1:10:32
  SPEAKER_02: There are some people that will kick late, there are some that will kick early.
• 1:10:35
  SPEAKER_02: You don't really want to disrupt the race going on.
• 1:10:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you're not the hero of the race as a pacer, you're not, you know, you're kind of pacing it because you might for the most part.
• 1:10:45
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, Ted is an exception because he's basically sacrificed a previous, a different race to go and get Jack round a world standard.
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_02: Is if I was good enough, it is most likely that I would be in the race myself.
• 1:10:58
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 1:10:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and yeah, there might be the odd chance that I might come back after a while and down at like Tambra Athletics Club, there might be an open meet that someone, let's say, wants to break 150.
• 1:11:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like me, yeah.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like you.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:11:12
  SPEAKER_02: So if you come down, you want to break you want to break 150, yeah, I'll say, yeah, I'll pace you round to 600, because I know that I'm capable of going round in you know 121, let's say.
• 1:11:23
  SPEAKER_00: The pressure to be a pacer, actually.
• 1:11:25
  SPEAKER_00: It is a little bit, yeah.
• 1:11:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but I could take you through like I if I don't enter as there've been people also that have entered, and this is a bit of an interesting one, especially for getting women's qualifying times in open meets where it's a mixed open meet.
• 1:11:41
  SPEAKER_02: So you'll have let's say women might be your your fastest female athlete, might be in the middle of the field with a bunch of male athletes, but they're running like an unbelievable standard for over like let's say 1500.
• 1:11:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I've had it where um this girl was going to run uh some sort of qualifying time, her boyfriend paced her round, but they're in the middle of the race, but he's just entered the race normally.
• 1:12:11
  SPEAKER_02: So he's entered the race with her with her time.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_02: You put down a time and you get matched against people of a similar time in a lot of like open meets, and then he's just in the middle of the race pacing her, and then he'll run and run the whole race with her, kind of thing.
• 1:12:27
  SPEAKER_02: And it's an interesting, like, kind of exception to a natural pacing is that you know she might be in the third fastest race of the day, and then in the middle of the pack, but obviously the maybe the fastest female athlete on the day and run a time that she needs to qualify for a certain event.
• 1:12:43
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but but yeah, pacing can be nerve-wracking.
• 1:12:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like you're you're there, and and this is the whole thing about like you've got to be spot on with the timings.
• 1:12:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like if you're out, and this is a big contentious thing in the 800 meters, because you know, if you're out by half a second or a second, it really messes up the race, especially if you go off too quick.
• 1:13:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then there's a secondary thing, which is like you'll be given a time to go through 400 meters, let's say it's 51 seconds, exactly.
• 1:13:13
  SPEAKER_02: Let's say, you'll get a lot of paces will be 400 meter runners, not 800 meter runners.
• 1:13:19
  SPEAKER_02: And the way that you run a 400 meters is you go out pretty hard and you've got a really good first 100, 150 meters, and then you run a significantly slower second half of your race, right?
• 1:13:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're heavily like positive split that in an 800, because the guys aren't because 800 you're running two laps, there's no point in going out really hard for the first 200, you're just gonna build up too much lactic, and then negative splitting uh positive splitting the next 200 meters, so let's say running 23 seconds, then 28 seconds, you're averaging 25 and a half, but you've just dropped a 28 second, 200, lost all momentum, you then need to pick it up again.
• 1:14:02
  SPEAKER_02: So it doesn't benefit some 400 meter runners pacing it because they go out way too hard, they run through 400 in the right time, but they're really not helping the race at all, they're just running it for the sake of it.
• 1:14:12
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 1:14:13
  SPEAKER_02: You want to be a good pacer, is you know, half a second in front of the field, dragging it around, having a check behind, making sure that people are willing to go with you.
• 1:14:23
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes, especially if there's prize money involved, they'll just like all make it a tactical race, and then the pacers out there like 30 metres in front going, what the fuck's the point of this?
• 1:14:35
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 1:14:36
  SPEAKER_02: So it's so is it you want to make it as consistent as possible, you want to go as far as possible, but naturally, let's say that if I were to, and this could be a real possibility, if I wanted to pace some races and just get back on the track for the feel of it, I might do three or four in the evening of different types of levels of races at these big, big British Open Meets.
• 1:14:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I might do I might do a you know a women's 1500 metre C race, a men's 800 metre B race, I might do, you know, a women's 3000 A race, most most likely not to be fair.
• 1:15:12
  SPEAKER_02: I've probably had to run quite far.
• 1:15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's not a long race.
• 1:15:15
  SPEAKER_02: But like, you know, you have we do multiple races, so they probably wouldn't be very happy if I and the people that I'm end up pacing a couple races later, I turn around and go, Sorry, mate, uh, can't take us through in that pace because I decided to run the whole race back then and then blew up.
• 1:15:32
  SPEAKER_05: So as an 800-meter runner, though, okay, this is this is a little bit off topic, but how many miles are you running in a week?
• 1:15:40
  SPEAKER_02: Personally, yeah, as an ideal week, obviously.
• 1:15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I've ranged from probably 30 to 50 miles a week across my career, with the peak, me probably being in the best shape of my life before I went out to the US at 50 miles a week in winter.
• 1:16:00
  SPEAKER_05: Were you fastest?
• 1:16:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:16:03
  SPEAKER_05: But that so for non-runners, that probably seems a bit mad because you're only having to run 800 metres.
• 1:16:09
  SPEAKER_05: Can you explain to us why 50 mile weeks are beneficial for you running 800 metres?
• 1:16:14
  SPEAKER_02: Well, for me personally, 50 miles is probably the most I I can handle, let's say, before you sacrifice like quality.
• 1:16:24
  SPEAKER_02: But if you look at the 800 meters of race and you look at the systems that you need to that you use in it, it's taking just under two minutes.
• 1:16:31
  SPEAKER_02: So it's in between that anaerobic and aerobic systems.
• 1:16:35
  SPEAKER_02: So the some of the the best times that I've run for 800 meters, I've actually been very aerobically strong.
• 1:16:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I've got a really good engine and a really good like aerobic system.
• 1:16:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you do get a lot of people, so the more that I can, the better I can run a 1500 meters, the better I can run a 5k, the better I'll run an 800.
• 1:16:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'll go kind of over distance for that stuff, and then closer to the race, that's the bulk of my training.
• 1:17:01
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, if I was gonna plan next winter, let's say that I can I start in September really building up the mileage, making sure over the summer I've got the capacity to run it.
• 1:17:12
  SPEAKER_02: I would be on high mileage, probably doing maybe some road races, maybe even just dabble in a bit of cross country, really get strong over September till December.
• 1:17:24
  SPEAKER_02: If I wanted to do an indoor season, probably only tune up and do some speed work for three or four weeks.
• 1:17:31
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 1:17:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and but still continue the aerobic work throughout that indoor season.
• 1:17:36
  SPEAKER_02: Have a little maybe a week break, just mental reset, physical reset in around probably this time in March.
• 1:17:43
  SPEAKER_02: This is maybe the you know the week that you kind of do it, and then it's building up that mileage again, and then in the summer, probably about six weeks out from my first race, I'll then introduce some speed work and some some races, and I probably wouldn't touch race pace, like getting down to 53, 54 seconds for a 400.
• 1:18:02
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't touch that until a few weeks out from the first race of the season.
• 1:18:06
  SPEAKER_02: So that's so the the bulk really is building up an aerobic engine because it takes so much longer to build up your aerobic side than it does your speed side, and it's why introducing intervals too soon is probably a detriment because you also need to build load like and capacity within the tendons and the joints, which take a lot longer, and that's what I've made mistakes in the past, and this is this is why I'm not trying to get back for the summer, even if let's say I can run at the end of April, it takes two months for me to build up the mileage.
• 1:18:37
  SPEAKER_02: I could be get by July, and I'm like, oh, I could get around an 800 metres, but I I would want to make sure that my load management after having a couple of years out of running is absolutely fine and safe to go.
• 1:18:48
  SPEAKER_02: So the 800 I think is just the best, I think it's the best event because there's way too there's so many variables, and there's so many different ways you can do it in the race and in the training.
• 1:18:58
  SPEAKER_00: It also doesn't last too long as well.
• 1:18:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's like the perfect that's I used to love running the 800.
• 1:19:02
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a and it's a proper race, like you're you're only in lanes for a little bit, you then cut in.
• 1:19:06
  SPEAKER_02: There's tactics, there are slow ways you can run it, fast ways you can run it.
• 1:19:09
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, the world record, David Rodish's world record, he just front run the whole one and just no one touched him and he ran fast.
• 1:19:18
  SPEAKER_02: And that was insane.
• 1:19:20
  SPEAKER_02: Superman.
• 1:19:20
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, you'll have people that are really quick over the 400 that have got a decent aerobic base that can go up to the eight, but would struggle over the mile.
• 1:19:28
  SPEAKER_02: And then you've got lads like Jack and Ted.
• 1:19:31
  SPEAKER_02: You know, Ted's running, he ran 1337 over 5k.
• 1:19:36
  SPEAKER_00: He's run Jesus Christ, man.
• 1:19:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, Jack Jack's that's outrageous.
• 1:19:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's nuts.
• 1:19:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's really nuts.
• 1:19:43
  SPEAKER_02: What kilometre pace is that?
• 1:19:45
  SPEAKER_02: That is you're looking at two what is that?
• 1:19:51
  SPEAKER_02: 240s would give you 1320.
• 1:19:57
  SPEAKER_02: I think you're like 245s.
• 1:20:00
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe something like that.
• 1:20:01
  SPEAKER_05: 245s for 5k.
• 1:20:02
  SPEAKER_05: That's mental.
• 1:20:04
  SPEAKER_02: That is just so.
• 1:20:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, 1345.
• 1:20:06
  SPEAKER_02: So it's quicker than that.
• 1:20:08
  SPEAKER_02: It's quicker than that.
• 1:20:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um but yeah, I mean I mean the the most reason the you see the half marathon world record got broken at the weekend.
• 1:20:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, 57 minutes.
• 1:20:17
  SPEAKER_02: 5720.
• 1:20:18
  SPEAKER_02: Now that's 423 for the mile.
• 1:20:20
  SPEAKER_00: What the hell?
• 1:20:21
  SPEAKER_02: Which is 243 per K.
• 1:20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Which is mad.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_02: Brother.
• 1:20:28
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, the 800 is a perfect blend.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you get people, it's it's on that fast twitch and slow twitch kind of uh threshold as well.
• 1:20:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's just that it's just the threshold of of different training systems, like physically and and kind of energy systems as well, which means there's a lot of ways you can attack it.
• 1:20:45
  SPEAKER_02: You see a lot of different body types, you see some sprinter builds, you see some proper kind of like bean poles and lanky boys, um, and and then it and then there's a tactical sense as well.
• 1:20:57
  SPEAKER_02: Like you've got to be switched on, you gotta be like automatic.
• 1:21:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so it's but it's good.
• 1:21:03
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, the bet the best way to do it though is for most of most of it is don't touch speed too early.
• 1:21:10
  SPEAKER_02: Get really good.
• 1:21:11
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, if I could run a decent 5k, if I could get to under 15 minutes for a 5k, bizarrely, that would tell me that I would be in great shape over the 800 when it comes to it.
• 1:21:24
  SPEAKER_02: So watch out for that.
• 1:21:26
  SPEAKER_05: I'm gonna race you when you get back to it, Charlie.
• 1:21:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm gonna race you too, Charlie.
• 1:21:30
  SPEAKER_00: Love a race.
• 1:21:33
  SPEAKER_05: I'm gonna take the pod to the athletics track and I'm gonna whoop your ass.
• 1:21:36
  SPEAKER_00: That'd be actually some really funny content, can you imagine?
• 1:21:39
  SPEAKER_05: And then in about a month's training after that, you'll whoop my ass by about 30 seconds.
• 1:21:44
  SPEAKER_05: You've got to pick me at the right time.
• 1:21:45
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, you gotta pick me up.
• 1:21:47
  SPEAKER_05: I want to pick you when you're wonderful and start touching your legs before it.
• 1:21:52
  SPEAKER_04: Too excited.
• 1:21:53
  SPEAKER_00: So my good little boy.
• 1:21:56
  SPEAKER_05: We give it a little boy.
• 1:21:57
  SPEAKER_05: Right on that note.
• 1:21:58
  SPEAKER_05: On that note.
• 1:21:59
  SPEAKER_00: We should probably clock out.
• 1:22:01
  SPEAKER_00: Ben's been changing batteries.
• 1:22:03
  SPEAKER_00: The cameras are getting too hot.
• 1:22:05
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you very much for for listening in today, guys.
• 1:22:08
  SPEAKER_05: I'll catch you on the next one.
• 1:22:13
  SPEAKER_05: Not Charlotte and Charlie, they won't be with Barn Jim any longer.
• 1:22:16
  SPEAKER_00: Charlie's actually firing us off the chat.
• 1:22:19
  SPEAKER_00: You've been seeing too many numbers.
• 1:22:22
  SPEAKER_05: I need to talk to them.