Latest / TV Pilot’s License / Breaking Bad: Our 200th Episode, Bryan Cranston, New York Times Best TV Shows

Transcript

Breaking Bad: Our 200th Episode, Bryan Cranston, New York Times Best TV Shows · TV Pilot’s License

0:01
Hello, passengers, and welcome aboard the TV Pilot's License
0:05
with service to Breaking Bad and our 200th flight.
0:09
We ask that you please fasten your headphones, secure your podcasting device,
0:13
and remember that whether this is your first flight or your
0:17
200th, thanks for joining. Buckle up and booyah!
0:21
Welcome to the TV Pilot's License. My name is Jeff
0:24
Kerbis, joined by Max Singer and Rich Inman.
0:28
How are you boys doing today? I got us all Pontiac Aztecs to celebrate 200
0:33
episodes. Hell yeah. I've never wanted something more. That's the best gift
0:36
ever. Rich, are you getting me a Pontiac Aztec?
0:40
Uh, well, I just want to peel the curtain back a little bit and let
0:44
everybody know that we actually record all of our episodes in one day. So it's
0:48
been a long day, guys. I'm so glad that we're done.
0:51
Well, uh, folks, this week for our 200th
0:56
episode. We are going to be talking about Breaking Bad,
1:00
which we're going to be talking about a little bit earlier than we normally do
1:03
for some fun news that just came out this morning. But Max,
1:07
for folks who are here maybe for the first time, maybe for the 200th
1:11
time, what is this podcast all about? Here at
1:15
TV Pilot's License, we break down and analyze the pilot episodes of some of
1:18
TV's most famous, or in some cases infamous, shows. We learned more
1:22
about how these shows came to be and were originally made, if they're effective pilot
1:25
episodes, and making us want to watch more if they can be made today.
1:28
Go back and stream 199 other episodes from wherever you listen to podcasts.
1:32
Check us out on YouTube and TikTok to see our smiling faces. And if
1:37
it is your first time flying with us, then welcome aboard. They're all good.
1:40
All 200 of them. They're all super good. No stinkers whatsoever.
1:44
Never mind. I just scrolled— I scrolled back and we made
1:47
Irene talk about Uh, Kitchen Confidential for an hour
1:51
and 23 minutes. You know what? And it was a blast. And Irene,
1:55
you were the best. Um, you know, gentlemen, before we
1:59
dive too deeply into Breaking Bad, let's talk a little bit about
2:02
Breaking Bad, because this morning as we are recording
2:06
this, the New York Times released their final list
2:10
or final grouping of shows as they rate the best 100
2:15
shows of of the 21st century. There was some voting,
2:19
all that fun stuff, but they decided that this
2:22
is the list. And would you have it, number 1
2:27
was Breaking Bad. And 1, was I very happy
2:30
about our timing? Yes. 2, did I feel blessed that I
2:34
chose that we do this? Also yes. But 3,
2:38
Max, you had a good question. What's the 101st show
2:42
that didn't get the love it deserves on this list? I mean, there's, there's gotta
2:46
be some good honorable mentions. I mean, only 100 shows. How do you whittle
2:50
it down? I, I have to imagine that just
2:54
left on the cutting room floor, just one vote shy of the
2:58
editors putting on the list. Bad Girls Club was NBC's
3:03
CGI primetime comedy,
3:06
Father of the Pride with John Goodman.
3:11
About the Lions of Siegfried and Roy and
3:15
all of their antics and capers when they're not performing. That one
3:20
season smash that has way larger of
3:24
a following than I ever expected thanks to this podcast.
3:27
That has to be 101. Easily.
3:31
Rick, what's 101 for you? Well, you know,
3:36
after perusing that list of 100 shows, I noticed that there's not so many stories
3:41
about our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. And what if,
3:45
what if he happened to come back to a little beachside
3:49
town outside of San Diego and
3:52
he went by John, but he was really from Cincinnati?
3:58
And I have to give it up to what was clearly what had to have
4:02
been the AP Coaches Poll 26th
4:07
pick basically for this show. I think it was
4:11
just an accounting error, Rich. I have to think so many
4:15
people said, why? You know what? JCF for
4:19
at least top 10 on their list. Why have
4:23
more seasons when one season does the trick? We've done 2
4:28
David Milch shows on this podcast and neither of them
4:32
are NYPD Blue. We've done— and neither
4:36
of them are— We haven't done Deadwood. We haven't done NYPD Blue. Our 2 David
4:40
Milch shows are John from Cincinnati and Luck. Yeah. You know what?
4:44
This is what's keeping people listening. 'Cause if we do all the good shows at,
4:47
at once, like, uh, we'll no longer be a New York Times culture podcast.
4:52
Well, gentlemen, I, yeah. What you got for
4:55
us, Jeff? I have 2 that I'm just going back and forth and I'm gonna
4:58
give you both. 101A. Yeah. You, you have, uh, you know, I think
5:02
one of the most important things that we're not talking about
5:06
right now is we're not talking about honoring.
5:10
You know, I looked at that list and I said, we're not talking about
5:15
how wild and crazy everyday life is as
5:20
some of LA's greatest and finest,
5:23
those first responders. We're not talking enough about
5:28
911. We are not talking enough about
5:31
Ryan Murphy Saying, what if there
5:35
was a volcano that went up in the middle of Los Angeles?
5:39
And what if there was a giant tsunami that happened?
5:43
What if we somehow made 2
5:47
first responders go to space with evil version
5:51
or eviler version of Jeff Bezos? I beg of
5:55
you, why is this not on this list? The tagline
5:58
for this season of Lava Land is maybe the single
6:02
greatest bit of writing ever conceived. I just
6:07
want to have a freestanding invite to anyone who writes or
6:11
showruns 9-1-1 to come on the show.
6:17
We will desperately love to pick your brain.
6:21
Look, they flushed a baby down the toilet in
6:24
the first 20 minutes of the pilot. It's only going uphill from there.
6:29
But I have to talk about The 102nd,
6:33
right? Because we, we have 101, but we have to talk about
6:36
the 102nd. A show that is almost
6:40
as good as 911. That, that is almost as good as 911.
6:45
912. Don't call
6:48
it. What if I said 911 Lone Star and was just like, yeah, let's,
6:52
let's talk about that. They're separate. And cut the break.
6:55
No. We're, we're not talking about a show that revolutionized
7:00
the idea of people taking down walls by
7:04
putting them in fact in between us with Love Is
7:08
Blind. We are not talking about the idea that
7:12
Love Is Blind said, what if we flew everyone
7:15
to a studio in the middle of Los Angeles and didn't
7:19
let them eat, forced them to drink way too much alcohol,
7:23
and then said, hey, you should get engaged and see what
7:27
the consequences are. Because my dear God, if there
7:30
is a show that— if there's a season on,
7:34
I'm watching it. I'm watching it. And then I'm just yelling at the people
7:38
on the screen. And I know we don't do reality TV show other than one
7:41
time on here, but I think that
7:44
show deserves the Pulitzer for just the work it
7:48
has done in journalism and expanding our bounds. I, we can't
7:53
possibly root for another writer's strike, but,
7:56
but if we, if we do, I guess we'll cover
8:01
Love Is Blind then. I can't wait for Love Is Blind Albuquerque because
8:04
boy, is that gonna pop up if we are there. But gentlemen,
8:08
um, yeah, by the way, by the way, Max, if we did do 912,
8:12
that would be about Savannah, Georgia. I just looked that up. Oh,
8:15
okay. Well, good to know.
8:18
Before we dive deep or too deep
8:21
into New York Times number 1 of
8:25
the 21st century, Breaking Bad, a quick word from our sponsor.
8:34
Well, let's talk a little bit more about Breaking Bad, and we're going
8:38
to start off with a quick synopsis. A chemistry teacher diagnosed
8:42
with inoperable lung cancer turns to manufacturing and selling methamphetamine
8:47
with a former student to secure his family's future.
8:51
Talk about spoilers. But Max, can you tell us a little bit more about
8:55
how this show got made? Oh, there's definitely a lot of spoilers
8:59
in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Wow.
9:02
Today we're talking about— today
9:06
we're talking about the pilot episode of Breaking Bad, which originally aired on
9:10
January 20th, 2008 on AMC. And the show's creator, Vince Gilligan,
9:14
We've only briefly talked about Vince Gilligan on this podcast for
9:18
his work as a writer executive producer on The X-Files.
9:22
Gilligan studies film production at NYU, where one of his scripts,
9:25
Home Fries, wins the Virginia Governor's Screenwriting Award
9:28
back in his home state in 1989. Nearly a decade later, Home Fries
9:32
would make it to the silver screen starring Luke Wilson and Drew Barrymore.
9:36
Gilligan joins the writing staff at The X-Files in season 2 after writing a spec
9:40
script, which would end up being used as the episode Soft Light that season.
9:43
He co-created the spin-off The Lone Gunman with X-Files creator Chris
9:47
Carter in 2001. Gilligan begins work on a concept for a new
9:51
series, wanting to turn the descent of a protagonist into its antagonist,
9:55
or as he describes it, turn him from Mr. Chips into Scarface.
9:59
While searching for a gig post-X-Files, Gilligan and a fellow writer
10:03
joked about solutions for their unemployment, pitching the idea of cooking
10:06
meth in an RV and driving around the country. This joke would turn into
10:10
something incredibly consequential in Gilligan's
10:15
career. He pitches his concept to Sony Pictures Television, who are
10:19
interested in the idea and work to help Gilligan find a home for his series.
10:22
First pitched to Showtime, they pass because they felt the show was
10:25
too similar to Weeds. TNT passes because
10:29
of the crystal meth content and network censors, and HBO passes for unknown
10:32
reasons. Eventually the pilot picks up steam at FX, who make the
10:36
decision to pass on the series in favor of another
10:40
pilot being developed called Dirt with Courteney Cox, feeling they
10:44
need a woman-led series to accompany 3 male-driven shows currently on the air.
10:49
Dirt also comes up in its cancellation being what allows Cougar
10:53
Town to be made. So it's a show that we've— it's a show we've never
10:56
done but has a lot of lore in other TVPL episodes,
10:59
oddly enough. The team eventually meets with AMC,
11:03
still in the process of preparing to shift into original scripted series with a show
11:07
called Mad Men. Slated to debut soon. While AMC is eager to invest in
11:11
the series and provide a generous budget for the pilot's proof of concept, the rights
11:15
remained at FX. A year later, rights were secured
11:19
and production could finally begin. Originally ordered for 9 episodes, the first
11:24
season would only end up allowing for 7 after the WGA writers' strike. The shortened
11:28
season ended up being a blessing, allowing the team to slow down time and assess
11:32
the pace and arc of the series. The pilot was filmed in March of 2007.
11:36
While planned to be centered around Riverside, California, the series shifted
11:40
to New Mexico for filming tax incentives.
11:43
Filming on location with 35mm cameras and frequent time-lapse photography
11:47
led to a cost of approximately $3 million per episode
11:51
for season 1. Casting. Gilligan knew of Bryan Cranston's
11:55
work from his guest appearances on The X-Files, but the network was resistant due to
11:59
his fame in slapstick comedy, most notably coming off of Malcolm in the Middle.
12:03
Reports say the role was offered to both Matthew Broderick and John Cusack before
12:07
Cranston was ultimately offered the role by network executives. Although both— truly,
12:13
although both Gilligan and Cusack deny an offer ever being made. For the
12:17
role of Jesse Pinkman, which eventually go to Aaron Paul, names to audition include Penn
12:21
Badgley, Colin Hanks, and Reid Scott of Veep fame.
12:24
Nice. In addition to creating and writing the series, today's pilot is also directed
12:28
by Vince Gilligan, who earned an Emmy nomination for his work.
12:32
All right. Very nice. So I, I just have to ask because
12:36
we're talking about all these networks passing on this show,
12:39
right? AMC is, it seems like the last place that
12:43
they wanted to pitch it. But Rich, I have a really dumb
12:47
question that I hope you have a great answer for. Specifically for me? Yeah,
12:51
just for you. So TNT didn't like that it was meth.
12:54
What do you think they suggested they replace it with so that they could
12:57
show it on their network? This is a Cookie Monster situation.
13:01
He was clearly addicted to sweets. They're just cooking.
13:04
Bryan Cranston is— Bryan Cranston runs the,
13:08
uh, Albuquerque's most, uh, most illegal bake
13:12
sale. Max, did you have one? Yeah. So, um, for TNT,
13:16
instead of, uh, crystal meth, it's about basketball. And instead
13:20
of Walter White and Jesse Pinkman, it's Ernie Johnson, Shaquille O'Neal,
13:23
Charles Barkley, and Kenny Smith. And it's called— it's a 50K.
13:32
How do we— hey yo, Chuck, pass me that beaker.
13:38
Chuck can't even fit in that RV. How are we gonna get in there?
13:42
This, this beaker is 500 milliliters. Well, it looks even smaller in
13:45
your hands. Well,
13:48
gentlemen, let's dive into Breaking Bad
13:52
and let's start off with establishing that we
13:56
are in fact in New Mexico. It is very clear with a
14:00
man that is pantsless driving an RV with
14:05
a gas mask on his face. Jeff, excuse me, it's actually New America now.
14:09
Oh my God. But what do you think,
14:13
Max, of our chaotic intro to a man that we find
14:17
out turns out to be Walter White? The most cinematic shot
14:21
of a pair of Dockers khakis flapping in the wind I ever did see.
14:25
Hell yeah. So we, we open on an RV
14:28
being driven across the desert by a nearly naked man in a gas mask.
14:33
He crashes and the figure emerges, and in the distance we hear sirens.
14:37
And then we get 2 back-to-back amazing reveals of
14:41
a first slumped-over dead body cutting to a
14:45
second body on the floor. And not even knowing who this
14:49
character is, he takes cash and a gun off
14:53
of the dead body, tucks the gun into the waistband of his tighty-whities,
14:58
and I'm just like, I need to know who this person is. We are on
15:01
page 1, no dialogue has been spoken, and I,
15:05
I need to know who we're dealing with here because there are so many questions.
15:10
The disparity between what we are seeing
15:13
in this person's appearance versus the actions that they're doing— I'm so fascinated
15:18
by what kind of person this could entail. Yeah,
15:22
go for it, go for it. So he, he goes and he grabs a camcorder
15:27
which, uh, which belongs to a colleague of his, which we'll find out,
15:31
um, and says, my name is Walter White and I
15:34
live at, you know, whatever his address was in Albuquerque, New Mexico,
15:38
or, uh, something Arroyo, Mexico, New Mexico. And,
15:42
uh, essentially leaves a video message,
15:46
not like a will, but like a video message for his wife and son.
15:50
Yeah, it says there There will be some things you'll come to learn about
15:54
me in the next few days. And that is completely insane.
15:59
This is— I think this is maybe the best cold
16:03
open for a TV show I've ever seen. Yeah, the lines of, this is not
16:06
an admission of guilt. There's some things you'll come to learn about me. And as
16:10
an audience member, that's what you need. If you're
16:14
writing a pilot, you want to get someone reading it to buy into this.
16:18
That's how you do it. Like, that's what gets you to turn a page.
16:21
That's what gets you past a commercial break. Just say,
16:24
like, this is the story we're about to enter. Like, all of this will
16:28
make sense in time. And it just— it works.
16:31
And it's so simple in how it's executed.
16:35
It's also incredible that, you know, the studio at this
16:40
time, Max, as you told us, they were hesitant to give Bryan Cranston this
16:44
role. But you have that single shot of him in
16:47
the center of the road. If you said, hey, Bryan Cranston is
16:51
in his underwear in the center of the road and
16:54
he has a loaded gun just pointing at nothing.
16:59
Yes, he is waiting for something. All you hear is sirens.
17:03
You hear sirens. That is the moment that I say,
17:06
holy shit, this is the baddest motherfucker
17:10
He does not care what happens next.
17:13
He knows what he's going to do next. Look, I don't care
17:18
that film is expensive. I see him in white
17:21
underwear, lime green shirt,
17:24
perfect blue sky, the terracotta desert landscape
17:29
around him, looking down that road. The way he's framed, he's just
17:33
slightly to the right of the screen, looking right down the middle of the
17:37
road. You as an audience member can follow his sightline to center
17:40
the road. I'm like, this is impeccably framed.
17:44
This is such a well-composed shot.
17:48
Get film. To see this from 2008 compared to all
17:53
of the backlit,
17:55
overexposed stuff nowadays, it just looks incredible.
18:00
It looks every bit of its budget. It's just such a pretty
18:04
shot to hit. What's incredible though,
18:06
from this moment is that we have all this tension
18:10
built up, and then we get hit
18:14
with the 3 weeks earlier to send
18:18
us back in time to build us to this moment. Now it's very much delivering
18:21
the, you're probably wondering how I got here,
18:25
sort of scratch off and point of the gun. Could you imagine if Bryan
18:29
Cranston did a voiceover? They had a cut where Bryan Cranston just voiced
18:32
over it like it's Malcolm in the Middle.
18:36
But it is that pressure valve release though, of just when
18:40
you're like, I gotta know, I gotta know, I gotta know. It's like we,
18:43
we suck you back in. And we've seen— how many times have
18:47
we seen this now where it's like we tease you a
18:51
story in a future day and then we wind it back and
18:55
then we're gonna get back to that new present day? Like, nothing that they're doing
18:58
here feels revolutionary. It's just taking
19:02
simple, like, tropes and simple plot and
19:07
storytelling devices and just executing them at a really high level. It's the
19:10
best hamburger that you've ever had, right? Like, hamburger isn't
19:14
revolutionary, but when— oh, he hasn't brought up that metaphor in a while.
19:18
200, baby! Yeah, welcome back,
19:21
baby. We're going after the hits. It, it is though, because when you
19:25
release that pressure and you bring us back to a What
19:29
I would call— what I love about this performance from
19:33
Bryan Cranston is we see a man who is— why
19:37
is today different? Walter White is turning 50,
19:41
but Walter White lives the most— that's not all— miserable
19:46
existence for some man. For a man that
19:50
we get small hints and clues had the potential
19:54
to have a very, very different life. When we see
19:57
like these hints of, oh, he was part of a group that did Nobel
20:01
Peace Prize research, right? And he's living
20:04
in this house where he is being told what to
20:08
eat, what to do. He can't afford
20:12
the life that he's living. Yeah. And he has no respect
20:17
from, it appears, anyone in his life.
20:20
And Rich, as we story build the background of
20:24
Walter White other than being like, holy shit, this guy's life
20:27
fucking sucks, right? I'm curious about your thoughts on
20:31
seeing Bryan Cranston switch from the biggest badass
20:35
in the world to maybe the meekest man you have ever seen. Yeah,
20:39
I, I think it's interesting that they, um, and, and frankly good
20:43
script writing that they did not— that this
20:47
whole script takes place over those 3 weeks, that 3 weeks later. If it— if
20:50
they tried to milk that out for the whole season and they started with how
20:54
the season and ends in that particular moment? No, absolutely not. You have to,
20:58
you have to build that goodwill, but you have to be
21:01
able to push this character of Walter White to a
21:06
point where, you know,
21:09
ultimately what he's going to do is make meth with, uh, and,
21:13
you know, if there is a particular moment that,
21:17
uh, that is inciting this, it has to be multiple things at once. It has
21:21
to be he's not a fan of how his life is going. He's not a
21:23
fan of how much money he's making. He has to have a second job.
21:26
He's working at the car wash in addition to being a chemistry teacher. And to
21:30
be fair, a pretty damn good chemistry teacher. He looks like fun. I would
21:34
be like, oh, I hope, I hope Mr. White's doing well, basically. Like,
21:38
if that's— I would love to have him as a chemistry teacher.
21:41
That said, you have to get him to the point where he's okay
21:45
making meth, which you would assume would go against his moral code
21:49
that he has for himself. Yeah, I, I mean,
21:52
Max, for you, as you start to see
21:56
Walter get— go through a terrible birthday—
22:00
I think we can all agree this is an awful birthday. Like, no, no one
22:04
here would be like, oh, sign me up for Walter White's 50th
22:08
for my own experience. But as you're seeing the life
22:12
he has, the characters that surround him Are
22:16
you starting to feel the pressure start to build up?
22:19
Well, I think about a— this sounds
22:23
so obnoxious, I'm so sorry. There's that concept of like
22:26
the unlived life. I think it's like a Carl Jung psychology
22:31
idea where it's like there's parts of your personality that get repressed
22:36
and never get to develop because of like things you
22:40
don't get to do in your life because of like societal expectation and things like
22:43
that. And Walter White is a man who's living a
22:46
life of unfulfilled prophecy
22:51
and unfulfilled living. He is someone who solemnly
22:55
steps on his little StairMaster while staring at awards that were given
23:00
to other people for research he did. He is enthusiastic
23:03
and a good teacher, but unfulfilled
23:08
and not respected. He is disrespected at his second
23:11
job that he does to provide for his family. And as
23:15
you push 50, the veggie bacon feels floppier
23:20
and the looks from your class feel worse. And something that I feel
23:24
like we see throughout this pilot as, as it unravels
23:27
and as the game reveals itself and as we get into what
23:31
Breaking Bad is, we see little flashes of
23:34
that life, of that potential come out in various
23:38
scenes. Even before he fully breaks bad,
23:42
as we come to learn, we see just little glimpses
23:45
of what is lying under the surface of Walter. And I feel like those
23:49
moments are so key to establishing that
23:53
idea of the unlived life in this protagonist. So I'm
23:58
curious for the two of you, we talk about the idea
24:02
of life-changing moments, a single moment that changes
24:06
your entire trajectory. And I'm curious
24:10
for the two of you, Walt gets a diagnosis of that
24:14
he has inoperable cancer,
24:17
um, that he— we are told with treatment
24:21
he has months to live, maybe years to
24:24
live, but we are never told, hey, if you don't treat this, this is
24:27
what the situation is, right? I think this is the first
24:32
time we've seen this as our why is today different in 200 episodes
24:36
and getting cancer. Yeah. Well, yeah. Not only getting cancer, we haven't done
24:40
the big C yet. Uh, so maybe that's in the next 200 episodes.
24:44
But I'm curious for you seeing Bryan
24:48
Cranston be told this and it
24:52
almost acting as not only why is today different, but it's the
24:56
second part of this show. It feels like, it feels like it
25:00
is the beginning of our act 2. Of sorts?
25:03
And how do you like that as a device and a tool? It's a
25:07
ticking clock in the background. It's a, it's a plot device
25:11
that, you know, there's a race against time. There is something lingering
25:14
in the background that is going to dictate every decision that
25:19
this character makes and why they choose to act in certain ways.
25:22
Um, it's his given circumstances, and it's also a thing that's going to
25:26
impact the time in which he has to do things. And I love that in
25:31
the face of that, all Walter could do is acknowledge the spot
25:35
of deli mustard on the lab coat of the doctor who addresses that
25:39
news to him. How numb he is to it,
25:43
how dead on the inside he is, that even in the
25:47
face of this, he could only muster up like, yeah, you are, you are unkempt.
25:51
You have— you are telling me this and you have mustard on you. That's a
25:54
very fascinating thing for this character to notice. Yeah, it's also tapping
25:58
into this kind of like— I want to say this is like a TV or
26:02
movie trope in general, and it feels kind of similar to like,
26:05
you know, uh, I guess John Wick, where you're like, it's a— it's someone
26:09
who is pushed to the brink of, uh,
26:14
of, you know, their patience is gone. They're,
26:17
um, you know, all Walter has left is to provide
26:21
for his family and try to get some, uh, like, uh, months and/or
26:25
years of comfort and you know, some help with his diagnosis because
26:30
he can't keep living this way. Uh, it's once again like it's adding
26:34
yet another burner to the— to that, like, you know,
26:38
uh, that pot that's going to bubble over. Like, how do you— how do you
26:41
ultimately get him to be John Wick at this particular moment?
26:46
Well, let's talk about the building of an
26:49
anti-hero, right? And like any person who's interested
26:54
in a new career You gotta do your research, isn't that right? So why
26:58
not take advantage of your brother-in-law who happens
27:02
to be part of the DEA and has offered to give you a
27:05
ride-along? But I don't want to talk about the ride-along as
27:09
much as I want to talk about one of the greatest
27:13
intros we've ever seen to a character in this show,
27:17
in the introduction of Pinkman.
27:21
And Max, I'm curious, there's a lot of ways we've seen characters
27:24
introed in over 200 episodes, but what
27:28
do you think of seeing a man just fall out of a window with
27:33
a topless woman throwing his clothes at him? It is such
27:37
a fun misdirection. It's such a rug pull because the entire time you are
27:41
focused truly as an audience member on one perspective.
27:46
His brother-in-law Hank and the DEA agents getting ready to enter this
27:50
house and do a drug raid at a meth lab. And that's what you
27:53
are focused on. That is what you are looking towards. You are literally focused on
27:57
this one house. And then we shift and there
28:00
is something much shinier happening on the second floor of
28:04
that house. And to do it in a way
28:08
that you don't even know that these two things are connected,
28:11
that it could just be Walt is distracted
28:15
and daydreaming and catches this other thing out the corner of his eye.
28:19
And then as it pieces together how they're all connected, you're like, oh,
28:24
this is where this show succeeds and how all of these threads do come
28:28
together. I love this though, the, the leap out
28:32
of the room, the pants being thrown from the window.
28:35
Pants flying through the air are a very important part of Breaking Bad.
28:40
Huge visual theme. To then establish
28:43
everything we need to know with one word, the question of
28:47
Pinkman, that tells you everything.
28:50
That's all you need to know. And again, it's like, and I need to know
28:53
more. They just managed to keep dropping these crumbs you
28:56
want to follow while doing so little.
29:00
Like, they maximize every moment of these little asides.
29:05
Yeah. And, and It, it's kind of— they set
29:09
this up in kind of like a Jenga tower situation of like, okay, uh,
29:13
you know, Walt doesn't get all this goodwill from his brother-in-law
29:17
unless he's like good to, good to his sister.
29:20
And, um, he doesn't get the reputation of a,
29:25
um, of a good chemistry teacher, uh, for Pinkman
29:29
and keep that recognition without like being good at
29:32
his job ultimately. And there are like certain levels
29:36
of trust that he's built up within his little world that allow him to have
29:40
this amount of access. And I
29:44
mean, you can't ask for anything better. Like, you know, Pinkman was,
29:47
you know, he's a meth user and maker.
29:50
When Walter follows, like finds him at his house,
29:55
there is a level of distrust and paranoia that uh,
30:00
Jesse obviously has toward, you know,
30:03
uh, going to jail, or I think, you know, knowing that
30:07
his brother-in-law is a DEA agent and stuff like that, you know.
30:11
But ultimately, it's the trust that he had from his former life,
30:15
or like current/former life, that gets him into all these locations,
30:19
you know. It's like, hey, if, if he was shifty in any
30:23
way, if he wasn't, you know, Mr. Rogers Like,
30:26
would, would he have access to go on a ride-along to see what a drug
30:30
den looks like? Absolutely not. But now he understands exactly
30:34
what you need to make meth and, and ends up with
30:38
a former student as his assistant because he's such a
30:42
good teacher and, and because he was such a hard-ass to all of
30:45
his students. But, but to that point of like him needing to be so clean-cut
30:49
and such a good guy to get the access that allows him to Break Bad
30:53
when they're at the birthday party and, and Hank is playing with the gun and
30:57
talking about DEA cases and mentions that there was a drug bust
31:00
and they confiscated $750,000. And there's
31:04
a look on Walter's face of realizing
31:08
what the money in this is. And there's
31:12
no follow-ups, there's nothing that's blatantly said, but you as the audience,
31:15
like, oh, something about that intrigued Walter White.
31:19
There's a reason why after his cancer diagnosis he then
31:23
takes Hank up on his offer to get to know it a little
31:27
bit more, why he wants to go inside to see it. And you as an
31:30
audience are like, oh, I know what we're getting to. But Gilligan never
31:34
feels like he has to bluntly say it. There's— it
31:38
truly is, we're always showing it until we get to a point
31:42
like halfway through where Walt can finally clearly
31:47
boldly say it to Jesse.
31:50
But we just— we show it, we show it, we show it,
31:53
and once we're, we're teetering on the brink, then we finally say
31:58
it. Yeah, I, I do love the idea that we have this scene
32:02
with Jesse where Walt goes to his house, right?
32:05
Walt confronts him face to face, and we see
32:10
the beginnings of how ruthless Walt is
32:13
willing to be with a man who has nothing to lose.
32:17
We get to have Bryan Cranston almost—
32:22
not that I think Jesse Pinkman, as we've been told, is— that was
32:25
the best student who loved Walt, but we get to see a,
32:29
a teacher, a person who could have been a mentor, betray that
32:34
trust to say, fuck it, this is for me, and I will
32:38
take you down if you don't agree to what I'm doing. And it's,
32:42
it's such a fun— like, we're talking about when this
32:46
show came out, this is the beginning of like anti-hero TV, right?
32:50
And this is one of those first instances where I think not only
32:55
us watching this see Bryan Cranston turn into the villain,
32:58
but the audience, America, when they're watching this are like, what the
33:02
fuck is going on, right, in that moment? And I think there's 3 moments
33:07
in this pilot that for me really hit on that idea of like the other
33:11
unrealized personality from the unlived life. It's this
33:14
moment here where he blackmails Jesse. It's a little bit
33:18
later on when he fights a high school
33:21
bully who picks on his son. And then it's at the, the very,
33:25
very end, which we'll get to later, where I think we see things
33:30
that are antithetical to what we believe Walter
33:34
White is based on first impressions and beginning to live that unlived life
33:38
personality. Yeah, for, for this, you know, the,
33:41
the very famous, like, uh, uh, description of the show,
33:45
like, that Max said in the, um,
33:48
how it got made, was, I'm gonna take, like, this character
33:52
from Mr. Chips to Scarface. Yeah. And what
33:56
you see— and I, you know, it's been a while since I've watched the show
34:00
Um, is that it happens really quickly. He starts violating his
34:04
normal character moral code almost immediately. As soon as, as soon
34:08
as that switch flips in him, as soon as he's like, I'm gonna
34:12
die, I gotta provide for my family, it has to— it,
34:15
it just changes so rapidly to,
34:19
oh, I'm okay killing people. Oh, I'm okay blackmailing a former student.
34:23
Oh, I'm like okay making meth. Like, this is It is
34:27
pretty rapid how quickly this, like, uh, this narrative changes
34:31
for, for Walter. And like, it's just, you know,
34:35
I, I don't know how like realistic
34:39
that is. Uh, you know, I personally don't know anyone who has lived
34:42
this life. Uh, but I'm, I'm curious like how long it
34:46
takes for someone to end up in a situation like this. It is very like,
34:50
um, oh, how— okay. Uh, you know,
34:54
seeing a story on the news and imagining the person who perpetrated it, and you're
34:58
like, how on earth did someone get themselves in this mess? That kind of thing.
35:01
And well, yeah, I want to take us to this Act 3,
35:05
right? Because as soon as we meet Pinkman,
35:08
we're brought into, all right,
35:11
we have an agreement, we have what this business will be
35:15
of, you know the business and I know the chemistry,
35:18
but Let's see how successful, because there
35:23
are 2 ways this could go. Even though we have this very good chemistry teacher,
35:26
he might suck at this, right? He might have no idea what he's
35:30
actually doing. But we get the— Rich,
35:33
one of your favorite things in the history of this podcast. We get to see
35:37
someone be good at their job. Oh, buddy. If you think I don't have
35:41
specifically in my notes, you know I did.
35:44
I said, what do you want to see when someone is amazing at making meth?
35:48
You want to watch them make some meth. And boy,
35:51
and boy, do you. That got— there's beakers, there's fires,
35:55
there's people, there's measuring. It's got all the things you want
35:59
to watch someone make good meth. And there's the right beakers. We get a hilarious
36:03
scene where Jesse's choice of glass is
36:06
criticized by Walt for not being optimal for
36:10
doing like the heat distribution to make crystal
36:13
meth. And that's the thing too. It's like, he, he is, he's good at his
36:17
job. He's not even good at just the recipe for formulating meth. He's good
36:21
at knowing which science tools to use. He's good
36:25
at making sure there's an eye washing station and proper sanitation
36:29
gear. All of those things are hilarious
36:32
and provide some brevity in this, but show that
36:36
he is good and he is skilled. And I also just— I, I love
36:40
that we get jokes about the glassware and things like
36:44
Jesse calling bards cow houses that just
36:48
kind of like ease. Again, it's the pressure valve thing. It's just
36:52
like we, we take a little bit out just to
36:56
like lower it so we can ramp up to that next point.
37:00
And when those jokes hit, they're not, they're not frequent,
37:03
but when they do, they're really good and they're really well placed
37:08
in this script. Yeah, well, Max, you talked a little bit about the pressure valve.
37:12
We need to have some adversity in this pilot, and we have it
37:15
Oh, is the cancer not enough? No, the cancer is not enough.
37:19
We need physical representations of adversity, even though cancer
37:22
is physical. We have cancer and now a gun.
37:25
There's cancer and there's Krazy-8 and there's Emilio. And I,
37:30
I think that this is such a great tool of continuing to push
37:34
Walt further into the descent of an anti-hero,
37:38
because when this partner of his is
37:42
being threatened, when his own life is being threatened Walt
37:46
has one thing that all of these people don't have. He is
37:50
so much smarter than everyone
37:54
in that room. And Rich, how did you like this
37:58
scene of— you, you love to see Walt cook meth, but what
38:02
if he very intentionally— what if he cooked humans too? Yeah, what if
38:06
he cooks humans from the inside with gas? So in the same way
38:10
that a lot of The path of Walter
38:14
White getting to this place is built on his good reputation of
38:18
being a good teacher, a good husband, yada yada,
38:21
a trustworthy person. What ends up happening is that we try to— we
38:25
learn that Jesse doesn't have that great of a reputation with the people he's
38:29
doing business with. And while he's trying to go,
38:33
I guess, is it— can you call it legit while you're selling meth?
38:37
Um, uh, he has a great product, but now people don't trust
38:41
him. And what happens when you— when, uh, you're making drugs for people who don't
38:45
trust you? They point guns at you and, uh, or sic a dog on
38:49
you. And, uh, so they're back out in the desert,
38:52
and, uh, and now Jesse has brought Krazy-8 and what's the
38:56
other guy's name? Emilio. Emilio, um, who, uh, went to
39:00
jail for a little bit, uh, because the cops were looking for Jesse.
39:04
And now we're in the desert with guns drawn at both
39:07
of our odd protagonists. And now we
39:12
got to— now he's got to get himself out of this situation. Jeff brought up
39:16
the metaphor of a really good hamburger earlier, so I'm going back to the TVL
39:20
archives when I bring this one back. At the end of the day, this show
39:23
is just The Odd Couple.
39:26
This plot and this character relationship could boil down to Walt and
39:31
Jesse are so fundamentally different that how are they going to learn to work
39:34
together? And that they're going to have to play off
39:38
of each other to survive. Because Jesse brings
39:43
them to the desert, they recognize Walt from the DEA bust,
39:46
but Walter can provide something, which is, you could,
39:51
you could give a man crystal meth and feed him for a day,
39:55
or I could teach you to make the crystal meth and feed him for a
39:59
lifetime. And Walt is able to use that bit
40:02
of information, that knowledge, as power
40:07
to keep himself alive in that moment. It's the survival instinct kicking
40:10
in where if I could just get them to believe me that I will teach
40:15
them, I could buy myself enough time to figure out what my next
40:19
move is, which is, uh, a phosphorus
40:24
bomb inside, inside the RV. It's about poisoning people.
40:29
Yeah. Look, if you're writing a hero's journey
40:34
and the protagonist is exceptional at making pancakes,
40:38
by God, you're going to kill an adversary with pancakes. And he's got
40:42
to kill people with chemistry. It's just how it goes. That's TV
40:46
writing 101. What I love though, is we talked about how
40:50
entranced we were at the beginning of this pilot.
40:53
Right where we saw this man in his underwear with a gas
40:57
mask on driving an RV with 2 bodies in the
41:01
back and a masked man in the front who slumped over.
41:06
And we're brought back to the exact moment that we left,
41:10
which is a man standing in the street with the sickest
41:15
transition shot I've ever— I know, it's crazy. We cut
41:19
back into present day transitioning through the barrel of the gun. Are you
41:23
kidding me, Vince Gilligan? I know, it was like a— it
41:27
was like a— the, the movie Snatch but on TV.
41:31
And we get to see the twist
41:35
that we were maybe hoping for in our inside, is Walt
41:39
gets another day. Instead of shooting at cops,
41:42
it's fire trucks. He tried to kill himself Um,
41:47
yeah, that was insane, which was the quickest I think
41:51
I'm gonna kill myself oopsie daisy, like I don't actually mean to,
41:54
that I think we've ever seen. Uh-huh. But yeah,
41:57
uh, his, his pointing the gun at himself like
42:01
while the sirens just like get closer and closer and
42:05
closer and closer and closer, and then, you know, thankfully the safety is on.
42:08
Um, and then, you know, for as good as chemistry as he is,
42:11
he He doesn't really quite understand how guns work. And that, you know,
42:15
he'll— that's fine. He'll get better. He'll get better. No spoilers.
42:19
He's gonna— he— this man, this man is a learner.
42:23
This man is a learner for life. He's a man of science.
42:26
He loves— he loves figuring how things work.
42:29
He's like, let me— let me write this down really quick. The variable
42:33
is, uh, does seem to be the safety of this gun. So test number 2,
42:37
like But as Walt
42:41
finds out that he gets to live another day, as Pinkman
42:45
wakes up from getting the shit beat out of him,
42:49
we find our protagonist finding
42:52
himself back at home with his wife,
42:56
being asked a very important question while
42:59
he embraces his wife. Walt, is that you?
43:03
And then again, compared to the 50th birthday and the saddest
43:08
handjob while Skyler, who we haven't
43:12
talked about much in this, is on her laptop the entire time.
43:16
This is the 3rd Carl Jung moment of
43:20
he has now cooked crystal meth, he has killed multiple
43:25
people, and he is a, uh,
43:28
dashing and ravenous lover who is not timid
43:33
in bed. And makes sweet love
43:37
to his wife following his 50th birthday
43:42
in a way that we have not seen him do before.
43:45
Yeah, it is suddenly, uh, there is a sharp ticking clock
43:50
on this man's life and he has changed personality. Um,
43:53
yeah, fantastic end of the pilot, gentlemen.
43:57
That's our pilot. But I wanna— we, we definitely didn't talk
44:00
about all of the characters in this pilot. We didn't talk about
44:03
everything that we saw. So I want to give you the opportunity.
44:07
What were some things that you loved about this pilot that you want to give
44:10
some more shine? There, there's pretty endless discourse
44:14
on like how much Skyler
44:18
is like a good partner to Walt. And,
44:22
uh, I, I think it's just rooted in misogyny.
44:26
Like, bro, like Skyler does not seem like a bad partner to Walt at all.
44:29
They're just busy adults. Like, that's basically it.
44:33
And, you know, we're all, uh, we're all like dealing with
44:37
our own life circumstances and stuff like that. But like, Skyler is not— justice
44:41
for her. There's a, you know, there's a lot of lying that happens to her,
44:45
like, in a very rapid succession, like a truly
44:48
tremendous amount that would push anyone to divorce.
44:51
And, um, you know, ultimately Walter
44:55
doesn't feel comfortable telling her his diagnosis right away,
44:59
which like screams there are some like pretty horrifying secrets.
45:02
And, and right before she says the, um, Walt, is that you thing,
45:06
there's also like the— it's like, I'm okay as long as you are
45:10
like bringing— yeah, talking to me. Yeah, don't shut me
45:14
out is what she says. Yeah, yeah, don't shut me out. Thank you so much.
45:17
It was just like, I— they
45:21
may— I think this is just like rooted in online misogyny, but like Skyler is
45:25
still a good partner there. Max, I'm curious about yourself.
45:30
I've got to go with what I think is the funniest sequence in this entire
45:33
pilot, which is after Jesse comes to in the
45:37
desert. Walter explains the chemical reaction that
45:40
caused the explosion that killed Krazy-8 and Emilio,
45:44
and then immediately doubles over and vomits profusely,
45:50
and then gets his composure and goes We've got to clean this up.
45:54
And then we— and then we cut away. We don't see anything else. I think—
45:57
I think those 3 beats of explaining
46:01
the weapon, vomiting,
46:04
all right, let's clean it up— like, that to me is just such
46:08
a funny 1, 2, 3. And again,
46:11
it's— the jokes are not aplenty
46:15
in this pilot, but when they are they are so
46:19
well placed and they give you such a release
46:23
valve on it, and they do hit so hard. And I will take
46:28
a show that doesn't necessarily have the most jokes
46:32
but knows how to make the ones they have count so well. And I think
46:36
that this pilot makes every laugh line count.
46:39
It's, it's that, it's that one offside
46:44
remark at a funeral. It's like that one thing that's
46:48
like a little bit like just like takes the pressure off of everybody and like
46:52
gets that big laugh. It's like I— and I could see why they went
46:56
with Bryan Cranston coming off of playing Hal on
47:00
Malcolm in the Middle. And it really is— it's
47:05
really just a testament to how good his physical comedy is in general.
47:08
It's like they would not be able to play that part You know, I,
47:12
I, you know, I haven't seen John Cusack in anything in quite a long time,
47:15
but like, I don't think you get the same, uh, you don't get the same
47:18
laughs or the release with that. You might with Broderick,
47:21
but like, I've been racking my brain over Broderick because I'm just like,
47:25
what do you mean he's playing Walt White? Like, I, I can't— I mean,
47:29
he's a comedy actor, I get it. Yeah, like, uh, but yeah, I don't think,
47:33
I don't think he like can hit that sad sack kind of
47:36
thing that That, uh, that Bryan Cranston kid. Yeah,
47:39
I can't believe they cut the scene where Walter White is in Chicago
47:43
in a parade, you know? Like, I, I really— I think that that
47:47
was definitely a part of the pilot I needed. Oh no, Mr.
47:50
Bueller taking jobs from— taking jobs from Ben Stein.
47:54
Um, for myself, I love when we
47:58
are given a character that I think everyone instantaneously
48:03
is supposed to hate. And they give us no redeemable reason to
48:07
like them. And that is Hank Schrader. I think that the performance
48:12
that, uh, Dean Joseph Norris gives in this is so
48:16
despicable that it put a taste in our
48:20
mouth of, fuck this guy. Yeah, this is the— this is the
48:23
worst guy to show up at someone else's birthday party, make it all about himself.
48:28
Hockey racist. And then being a racist in,
48:31
uh, in addition to that. Yeah, just, it is such
48:35
a good— I, I think it gives us all someone
48:39
to root against. Yeah, well, we are.
48:42
And especially making them a cop as well, because then we are
48:46
literally rooting against the cop to root for the drug dealer
48:50
in this show. And it is that performance and the writing
48:54
of this show that allows that to be possible. And it's just,
48:58
it's well done. It sets us up for a season where we're like Yeah,
49:01
fuck this guy. I will celebrate if he meets a terrible end.
49:05
And, uh, who knows? We just watched the pilot. So, uh, I do want to
49:09
give you guys, uh, an opportunity for wait-a-minute moments,
49:13
things that caused you pause about this show.
49:16
I have one. I will go last, but I want you two to take
49:20
your opportunity. Yeah, just, just lightning quick. I'm gonna say the
49:23
DEA agents betting on the race of the perps
49:27
in the meth bust. Just that, that little gross
49:31
bit of racism in doing their job. I think
49:35
it's effective in setting up, as you mentioned, Jeff, that the repugnance, you know,
49:38
uh, Dean is— Dean Norris, Hank Schrader, is going to
49:42
be this sort of villain but
49:46
also working on the right side of the law. But for our purposes, the villain
49:50
who is, you know, with Walt
49:54
right under his nose the entire time that he'll never be able to catch.
49:56
I think that's setting up such a fantastic dynamic there, keeping the
50:00
family. But it's, it's a gross line. It's a, it's a gross joke to make.
50:04
And, uh, and the giggles they get off of learning
50:07
that it's a guy named Emilio but having a surprisingly,
50:11
uh, Japanese last name. I don't know. It's just, uh, they're, they're,
50:14
they're bad people. Rich, what about yourself?
50:18
Um, I was pretty struggling hard. I was struggling hard to find
50:22
anything that was like it in the
50:25
same sense that like, yeah, You have characters who are throwing the F-slur around.
50:29
You have characters who are racist. Like,
50:32
ultimately it does feed
50:36
into the emotions you want to get out of your audience,
50:39
which are, oh my God, that cop is such a piece of shit.
50:42
Oh my God, Jesse is such a loser. Like it
50:46
is, you know, they are all,
50:49
they're all like, I don't know.
50:53
Like, even, even the moments that feel bad are done
50:56
with a purpose. So I don't, I don't think I— yeah,
50:58
yeah, nothing stands out. Um, but you know
51:02
what did stand out in this show was whatever
51:06
happened to the Pontiac Aztek is the— is what this show left me
51:11
wondering. That is my wait-a-minute moment. You're telling me that more people don't
51:15
have use for a car that can also act as a tent Uh,
51:18
yes, when I saw the Pontiac Aztek featured in that
51:22
episode of Survivor, I said, wow, we've done it, we've made the
51:27
perfect vehicle. And to see this car in this show put
51:32
a smile on my face. And did I look up if there's any Pontiac Azteks
51:36
near me that are available? There are. And am I currently
51:40
trying to convince my wife we need a 3rd car?
51:43
Potentially. Uh, but Pontiac Aztek does look like
51:46
the car that you drew in second grade. You know what I mean? Exactly.
51:50
Produced by General Motors from 2000 to 2004.
51:54
It survived exactly the first Bush term.
51:58
It's the Pontiac Aztek and the FJ
52:02
Cruiser that both look like your kid drew them. And I want
52:05
them both in my garage. Yep. But gentlemen,
52:09
We do have one more question. We actually have
52:13
a lot of questions because for our 200th episode, we went
52:17
to you, the frequent flyers, the listeners, the people who make this possible,
52:22
to ask what questions do you have? It can be about Breaking
52:25
Bad, it can be about anything TV or even
52:29
personal. Uh, so we've compiled a few of them and we're gonna— and none
52:32
of them are about Breaking Bad. Yeah, none of them are break— about
52:36
your Breaking Bad opinions. But we do
52:40
want to make sure that we go through a few of these. So the first
52:44
one that I have is from frequent flyer Lauren.
52:48
And Lauren asked, if the 3 of you wrote a pilot together,
52:52
what would the pitch be? So Max, I'm curious.
52:56
Do you think we would hit that deadline? Can you think of— start
53:00
us off on a pitch and Rich and I will join in? Yeah, a secret
53:04
new division of young recruits at Langley.
53:07
Oh, rich. Uh, who are
53:11
all coming from the same Romanian clown school,
53:15
and one of them is young Sheldon. Uh, I think,
53:19
I think we've got it. I think we nailed it. Uh, yeah, put us
53:22
on, put us on your improv festival lineup. Jesus,
53:26
I think we absolutely are going to be getting calls so many
53:31
producers. Short form is back.
53:35
Um, and then we, we got a second question that, uh,
53:39
very personal because it came from my home. My wife, uh, Alex in
53:43
Minnesota asked, what is your least favorite
53:46
show you have ever done? We've done 200
53:50
of them. You can even include the shows that you watched for the shows that
53:54
were canceled in the season. So I'm curious
53:58
What is your least favorite show that you have done? Rich, what is yours?
54:02
Oh boy. Um, all right, for me there were a couple options
54:06
here because I have unfortunately lost my shit on several
54:10
episodes. Uh, I, it's not— I can't blame me
54:14
not being on medication because I'm not on medication now. Uh,
54:19
uh, so I would say, uh,
54:22
top of the list so far has been Spinning Out. Hangin' with
54:26
Mr. Cooper, which everybody knows I lost my shit at. Um, uh,
54:30
Bad Girls Club, which, uh, with my lovely friend Dylan
54:35
did not watch the episode before that, which became
54:38
blatantly obvious. Yeah, Dylan, come back
54:42
on the show and, and I will explain to you more of what the,
54:45
what the show is. And then, uh, but number one has to
54:49
be my all-time largest spin-out had to have been Laguna Beach. Uh, I got so
54:53
mad that they were filming children for the, for the
54:56
purpose of entertainment and unscripted on top
55:00
of that. I felt so angry the entire time and rightfully so. I have
55:04
been vindicated. Laguna Beach, fuck that show.
55:08
Fuck every adult that was involved with that show or let it happen.
55:12
Screw that. Yeah. So I was
55:15
vindicated. I'm right. Max, what about yourself?
55:18
I'm going to go with the only show that we've done whose commonly used acronym
55:23
sounds like a pharmaceutical. Uh, My OB, AKA Make
55:27
It or Break It, the, the ABC
55:32
Family gymnast drama that drove me to my breaking
55:36
point. The way that these poor teenage
55:40
girls are, are treated and the way they treat each other.
55:43
I was just so absolutely frustrated
55:48
watching this pilot. And it's just, look,
55:52
I, I am a sucker for some ABC Family in the context
55:56
of this podcast, and, and that one I don't even think was fun for me
56:00
to sink my teeth into. Yeah, for myself,
56:03
it's one that is currently on the air that we've done very
56:08
recently in Animal Control. Um, I,
56:11
I genuinely, genuinely had a
56:15
hard time watching that show. I, I don't think I could tell you a plot
56:19
point that recently happened on that show. I have erased it from my brain.
56:23
And that is not the thing that sucks about saying that is I like
56:27
everyone who's on that show. I just think, hey,
56:31
you know what? That was 20 minutes and
56:35
that's 20 minutes I won't be getting back. But you know
56:38
what is only 45 minutes and I could watch is 9-1-1.
56:43
But thank you, Alex, for that question.
56:46
Another question from Drew in St. Louis.
56:50
Which TV show that is not The Simpsons would you blind
56:53
commit to watching the first 200 episodes for?
56:57
So I know you two are both Simpsons heads. Mm-hmm. Uh,
57:01
very easy. There's a lot more than 200 episodes that you could choose from.
57:04
Yeah. Uh, what is the show that, and I will let you,
57:08
you, we can have watched the pilot, we could have included it in the 200
57:12
episodes that we have watched so far. Is there one that you're saying, hey,
57:16
I want to watch 200 more. I'm committing to that as my next show.
57:19
Max, what are you thinking? Uh, I am going with Murder,
57:23
She Wrote. I'm giving 200+ episodes
57:27
to Jessica Fletcher. That dude, that show's got guest
57:30
stars galore, including Bryan Cranston, who we covered today,
57:34
including George Clooney, including people like Leslie Nielsen
57:38
and Bette Davis and Tony Curtis. I, I gotta see what Jessica Fletcher's getting up
57:42
to, and I gotta all those guest stars. Nice. Rich, what about you?
57:45
Um, okay, so there's a couple other shows above 200
57:49
episodes that I have seen almost every episode of. Um, that includes like Frasier,
57:53
and, uh, you know, I, I feel like I've seen most
57:56
of the episodes of Friends. Um, but I gotta go with M*A*S*H.
58:00
I think M*A*S*H is my number one. Um, I have not watched
58:04
really any of the show at all, but I know it's been on my list
58:07
for such a long time. Um, and I know that it's been so beloved,
58:12
um, and it's, and it's one of the first shows to like really speak
58:16
openly and candidly about the horrors of war in a way that
58:20
is like not just entertaining but relatable. And yeah,
58:23
I would just, uh, I would give that a go. Yeah. And for myself,
58:28
I'm going back to the show we did for our 150th,
58:31
150th episode, which is Cheers.
58:34
Uh, there are plenty of episodes there.
58:37
There's something so fun about people starting their careers,
58:41
if that makes sense. Yeah. And getting to see— very similar to Murder,
58:44
She Wrote, where you get to see someone in one of their first acting gigs
58:47
and you're like, holy shit, that's a baby version of them.
58:51
Um, so I think I'm gonna— I, I genuinely think I might actually
58:55
commit to watching 200 episodes of Cheers, and I will let you two
58:59
know how it goes. Uh, because that is, uh, it's not as
59:02
much time as you think, but I think I got it. There were, so there
59:06
were 270-something episodes of Cheers and then 261
59:10
episodes of Frasier. So I'm curious, uh, that has to
59:14
be one of the longest running single characters on TV for sure, right?
59:18
Like, uh, there has to, that has to be, it's gotta be up there for
59:22
sure. Uh, well, we have one more question that we're gonna
59:26
be doing today. And that is from Chris Alexander
59:30
on Instagram. And Chris asked a question that is
59:34
open-ended that I am not going to allow to be open-ended. And that is,
59:38
who is the best character in TV history and why is
59:43
it Alf? So I need you two to come to the plate and explain
59:46
why Alf is the best character in TV history.
59:50
Max, you are ready to go. You're talking about my main
59:53
man Gordon Shumway? I mean, come on.
59:56
What, what other characters in the '80s had
1:00:00
their own novelty rock singles that were given away
1:00:04
as a Burger King kids meal toy?
1:00:07
ALF's contribution to pop culture as
1:00:11
a whole has outlasted the run of that show.
1:00:15
What ALF represents is so much bigger than the series
1:00:19
itself that you could create something that surpasses
1:00:24
the confines from which it was created for.
1:00:28
He is delightful. He is a smart aleck.
1:00:31
He played with the format of what that type of a, like a multicam
1:00:35
sitcom could be in the '80s. He's fantastic.
1:00:41
And to add on to that, and speaking of big,
1:00:45
I think having the puppeteer of Alf create a second
1:00:49
floor of all the stages that they had to use so
1:00:53
Alf could be controlled from below instead of doing it marionette or
1:00:57
hand puppet style is a— is the crazy artist,
1:01:01
uh, I need running my TV show. There is no reason
1:01:05
that they had to do that, and I fucking love it because they— I love
1:01:09
when people take giant chances or giant swings and,
1:01:12
uh, create rules for themselves that no one else can explain.
1:01:17
I, and I love a fish out of water story. You know, we,
1:01:21
we have Alf being a fish out of water,
1:01:24
an alien on Earth, uh, an alien on Earth that eats
1:01:28
cats and also is a little bit perverted. Uh, boy,
1:01:32
sign me up. An alien that is on Earth that eats cats,
1:01:36
that's a little bit perverted, that also makes fun of
1:01:40
a child. Sign me up. Because that is what Alf is.
1:01:43
Alf does everything that you've ever had as a Uh,
1:01:47
thought that has creeped into your brain and you say, what would happen if
1:01:51
that happens? And you get to see it on TV. And I
1:01:55
think there's something beautiful about that. It's a drunk uncle from space.
1:01:59
So Chris, fuck yourself. We all showed you why
1:02:03
Alf is the best character on TV. Yeah. What's up? We,
1:02:06
we think you're correct. We, we think you're right and fuck you.
1:02:10
Uh, but you know what? And if you wanna see how far this podcast has
1:02:14
come, that's like episode 7 of this show. Go back.
1:02:18
Very different looking, uh, podcast and very
1:02:21
different sounding podcast back then. But if you want to
1:02:25
be like Chris, Drew, Alex, or Lauren and
1:02:29
submit an in-flight question for some of our upcoming episodes, you can
1:02:33
leave us a voicemail at 213-290-1713. You can also go
1:02:37
to tvpilotslicense.com and fill out the form, and we'll take episode
1:02:40
suggestions or We will even take questions for the upcoming shows
1:02:44
that we have. But before we talk about the legacy
1:02:48
of Breaking Bad, a quick word from our sponsor.
1:02:55
Well, let's talk about the history of this show. This show had 5 seasons,
1:02:59
62 episodes, a movie, and a spin-off series
1:03:02
called Better Call Saul. Who— we didn't meet a Saul in this pilot.
1:03:06
I wonder who he is. Uh, all 5 seasons were on
1:03:10
AMC, but you can watch this today on Netflix. Shout out
1:03:14
to Dave Porter, who did the score for this entire show,
1:03:18
uh, in assistance with Thomas Golubic as music supervisor,
1:03:22
because I thought the music for the show was so fun. I know we didn't
1:03:26
talk about it, but there's something about the height of the wow movement.
1:03:31
Uh, this is like Deadwood. So yeah, I want
1:03:35
to show big wows. I want to shout out a name that no one talked
1:03:39
about, but Donna Nelson. And you might be like, who is Donna
1:03:43
Nelson? Donna Nelson was brought on to this show for scientific
1:03:47
accuracy as an organic chemistry professor at the
1:03:51
University of Oklahoma. So she reviewed every single
1:03:55
script that the show ever did, which is such a fun,
1:03:59
uh, consulting role, I bet, to be like to do this.
1:04:02
This is so much better than the nerd that they got to do all the,
1:04:06
the scientific corrections for the, the Big Bang Theory whiteboards.
1:04:10
I'm like, no dude, you want to know how to accurately make the best
1:04:14
meth on the planet? Don is going to teach me about meth. Let me show
1:04:17
you. Um, so I want to talk about something that was super unique
1:04:22
about this show. We're going to talk about the ratings for this show. So the
1:04:25
first season of this show on AMC, which is a cable network,
1:04:28
had 1.23 million viewers. The second season had
1:04:32
1.3. The third season had 1.52.
1:04:36
The fourth season, 1.87.
1:04:40
The fifth season of the show, the final season of the show,
1:04:43
4.32 million viewers. Goddamn. It's because they,
1:04:48
are you gonna say it? Yeah. They put it on Netflix in the interim there.
1:04:52
Yeah. That's, that's when it hit streamers. Yeah. So after it
1:04:56
hit streamers, everyone was caught up and joined. And then the season finale of
1:05:00
this show was the most watched episode of this series. I believe that's 10.28
1:05:05
million viewers. That's me. I watched this.
1:05:09
I watched this show laying on my bed in college,
1:05:13
watching it on a laptop. Like, that's how I watched Breaking Bad.
1:05:18
Until season 5, I didn't, I didn't know you could watch it on
1:05:21
a TV. Watching this pilot for this podcast,
1:05:25
sitting upright on a couch, watching the TV across the
1:05:29
room. Revolutionary. I'm back in college, baby. Orange is the
1:05:33
New Black. How about oof, my back? But no.
1:05:36
All right. Well, thank you so much for tuning in to the
1:05:40
absolute final episode of TPPL. You cannot find us
1:05:44
anywhere on social. We're deleting the entire account after published.
1:05:50
Uh, so there were DVDs made for every season as well
1:05:55
as a series, uh, complete set. There was actually a writers reunion,
1:05:59
uh, recently hosted by Variety that I highly recommend everyone check
1:06:03
out. It was a lot of fun hearing from that writers room. Uh,
1:06:07
the New Mexico Law Review actually did a
1:06:11
series of publications where they had local lawyers
1:06:15
review legal issues in the show in the magazine,
1:06:19
which it was like an 8-part series. Very, very cool. That was around
1:06:22
2015. This show did a lot for the city of
1:06:26
Albuquerque. It increased tourism. It had,
1:06:30
you know, that's so crazy. It's just like the most dangerous
1:06:34
show on TV. That's like saying that The Wire increased tourism to
1:06:38
Baltimore. Like, just to give some examples. Because I have a,
1:06:42
I have a few of them. There was, for the series finale,
1:06:45
finale, uh, there was a certain character that died. Someone published
1:06:49
an obituary and paid for an obituary in the local newspaper.
1:06:54
Oh boy. Uh, there is a bronze statue of Jesse Pinkman and Walter
1:06:57
White in the Albuquerque Convention Center.
1:07:01
There also is the house that is featured that is
1:07:04
Walter's. Walter White still gets pizzas thrown on the roof
1:07:09
every single week. Please don't do that, fans.
1:07:12
Um, so, uh, it's a waste of pizza. It is
1:07:16
a very big waste of pizza. But I do want to talk about the awards
1:07:20
for the show, so buckle up, buckaroos.
1:07:23
340 nominations and 92 wins. This is a
1:07:27
big list. That's a good batting average. I'm gonna talk through it really quickly.
1:07:31
5 American Film Institute TV Program of
1:07:35
the Year wins. Not just nomination,
1:07:37
wins. Uh, 4 Creative Arts Emmys, 6 Critics' Choice Awards,
1:07:41
2 Director Guilds, 2 Golden Globes, a People's
1:07:45
Choice Award. 12 Emmys were won by this show, including Bryan
1:07:50
Cranston winning Lead Actor in a Drama for 4 of the 5
1:07:54
seasons, including the pilot being the first one he won it
1:07:57
for. The only season he did not win it for was in 2012
1:08:02
he lost to Damian Lewis in Homeland, which was supposedly
1:08:06
very controversial. A lot of people were upset about that, and I feel
1:08:10
bad for Damian Lewis. He probably was very excited about winning.
1:08:14
This show also won multiple SAGs and 6 WGAs.
1:08:18
But surprisingly, while appropriate— and I actually very much
1:08:22
endorse this— this show did not receive a single nomination for
1:08:26
a Team Choice Award or a single surfboard, which— no
1:08:30
surfboards for Aaron Paul. No surfboards for meth dealers.
1:08:34
Uh, but gentlemen, I think Aaron Paul has plenty of surfboards.
1:08:38
Yeah, he definitely won one on The Price is Right. But gentlemen,
1:08:42
that is the history of this show.
1:08:45
Um, before we end this 200th
1:08:49
episode, I have 2 questions for you, as I do on
1:08:52
every episode of TVPL. And the first is based off the pilot and the pilot
1:08:57
alone. Would you watch more of Breaking Bad?
1:09:00
Max watched it from his couch. Is he gonna maybe watch it again based
1:09:05
off of— from a better couch, from a new couch? Uh, but the
1:09:09
second— it would be so funny if we were like, from the same couch.
1:09:12
He found it, that's where he's going.
1:09:15
But the second, uh, question that I have for you is,
1:09:18
we are 200 episodes into this podcast.
1:09:23
And hopefully there are many, many more to come. But do you
1:09:27
have any wishes, thoughts, or well wishes to the folks who make
1:09:30
this possible? And Rich, as always, I'm gonna start with
1:09:34
you. Uh, so I, I think I'm gonna
1:09:38
speak for all of us when I say that, yeah, we're watching more of the
1:09:40
show. Um, it is number one on— it's the number one show in the—
1:09:44
in, in— I, I mean, I would put it up there on Uh,
1:09:48
both centuries that TV has existed. Um,
1:09:52
there, even, even though it's just like the
1:09:56
list was only for the 21st century, for sure this is like the one of
1:09:59
the best shows ever made, if not the best. Um,
1:10:02
and you— and it starts from a truly like
1:10:06
nearly perfect pilot. Um, uh, as it goes for,
1:10:11
uh, our 200th episode, I just want to thank everyone who's listened along the
1:10:15
way, who found us, who doesn't know us personally.
1:10:19
And a lot of thanks to people who do know us personally because it is
1:10:22
like, you know, sometimes it's a little cringy to like listen to
1:10:25
your friends do shit. And, and, you know, for the people who have
1:10:29
like reached out to us who are like, oh my God, I love this particular
1:10:34
episode that you just did and we're friends with them. And it's like, I didn't
1:10:37
even know you listened to the podcast. Our— my boss has listened to this podcast
1:10:41
and has seen clips of this. Um, uh, it's, it's very
1:10:45
nice. It's, it's extremely nice that you guys are tuning in. Um,
1:10:49
I mean, keep sharing it with your friends if you can. We love to keep
1:10:52
expanding. We love to keep bringing guests on, um, like Rosie
1:10:55
and Carl and, uh, Kurama and, and so many more.
1:10:59
And, um, you know, I, I thank you guys
1:11:04
so much for even continuing to listen at this point. It feels great.
1:11:07
Max, what about yourself? Uh, I'm excited to go back
1:11:12
and now watch this sitting slightly more upright and not on an 11-inch MacBook
1:11:16
screen, uh, because it looks really good. It looks really good
1:11:20
on a big TV. Um, just thank you
1:11:24
to everyone who's liked, subscribed, listened, shared clips of ours,
1:11:27
reached out. Uh, as Rich said, people being fans
1:11:31
of the show who are not in our immediate orbits and have followed
1:11:35
along for this ride. It does mean a lot.
1:11:39
Um, and we're not asking for much, but if you just want
1:11:43
to like, I don't know, invite us to an event— like, we don't, we don't
1:11:46
need to cover anything, but if you just like, I don't know, let, let us
1:11:50
be in the room for like an FYC event or something like that, we would
1:11:54
do that. Oh yeah, yeah, media passes, baby. Let's just let us—
1:11:58
we'll listen to people gab, we'll sit quietly, we'll behave. I'll, I'll come to your—
1:12:02
we'll come to your, uh, your launch for your pilot. That sounds great.
1:12:05
We'll consider if you let us FYC, we will consider. If you
1:12:09
send me, uh, you know, an episode for consideration, I will
1:12:13
watch it and maybe we'll talk about it on this podcast even.
1:12:17
Um, yeah, for myself. Uh, yeah, no shit.
1:12:20
I'm watching more of the show. Are you fucking kidding me? Whoa,
1:12:24
whoa, whoa. The thing about this show
1:12:28
that I think is so fun is This is a show that I found
1:12:32
later because there are very few shows that my parents were like,
1:12:35
hey, you can't watch this. This was one of them where I
1:12:39
was not allowed to watch this while this was on TV. And Jeff was 7.
1:12:43
Yeah, no, no, I am Gen Z.
1:12:46
Yeah, um, but I, I think
1:12:49
that this is just such a special show and it just shows like
1:12:53
when you give someone the funds to make really
1:12:57
good TV and they're not taking shortcuts to do it,
1:13:00
it, it makes something really, really pretty. And then as far as the
1:13:04
show, I want to thank a few people really quickly. I want to thank each
1:13:08
of our partners, um, for supporting us and doing this,
1:13:11
because absolutely it does take a village, uh,
1:13:15
to make something and, uh, to pursue hobbies
1:13:19
and pursue things that we Uh, enjoy doing.
1:13:22
I want to thank each of you two for agreeing to this very
1:13:26
dumb idea that I had. And 200 episodes later,
1:13:30
we are still here. And that's fucking awesome. Until my contract
1:13:34
renewal. Yeah, exactly. I, Rich, it's in your inbox.
1:13:38
I just need the, the e-sign. I swear. Uh,
1:13:41
player strike. Uh, but the, yeah, wait till we bring
1:13:45
in Banana Ball to replace you too. Oh my
1:13:49
God, can you imagine if they created the Savannah bananas just to be strikebreakers?
1:13:55
But then the third group that— or second to last
1:13:59
group, thanks to all of our guests. Rich thanked a few of
1:14:03
them, a few more. Thanks to Dylan, thanks to JW, thanks to Irene
1:14:06
for being one of our first guests on this podcast. And then the
1:14:10
final group is to the people who listen. It's so
1:14:15
silly to say this, but to see just a few listens on that
1:14:19
first episode, and now we're talking about we get like hundreds
1:14:23
of people listening to this show is bonkers,
1:14:27
like truly a bonkers feeling. And I can't
1:14:30
wait to keep on creating stuff for you guys to listen to.
1:14:34
Support your friends who create content. Um,
1:14:37
because yeah, it makes my day every single day and it's something that's
1:14:40
so much fun, but gentlemen, That is our 200th flight.
1:14:44
And as this flight has come to a land, I wanna make sure
1:14:48
that folks can find you outside of this podcast, wherever you wanna be found.
1:14:52
So Rich, where can folks find you? Uh, you can find
1:14:55
me taking my shirt and pants off to do some work, and then you can
1:14:58
also find me on Instagram at Damn, That's Rich. You can find original sketch
1:15:02
comedy from Max and myself over at Dad Wagon Comedy on TikTok.
1:15:06
Max? You can catch me trying on skinny jeans like the skateboarders
1:15:10
wear and on all things social media @MaxwellSig.
1:15:13
And you can find me on Max's couch watching Breaking Bad
1:15:17
on an 11-inch MacBook.
1:15:20
Yeah, that's sub iPad size.
1:15:24
Yeah, exactly. But if you're looking for me on social
1:15:28
media, you can find me @RunJeffRun. If you're looking for the TV Pilot's License,
1:15:31
you can find us anywhere you listen to podcasts. Make sure to follow us
1:15:35
on social media, on TikTok and Instagram.
1:15:38
We also are going to be— I am really excited to announce starting
1:15:41
a Substack. So look out for that. We're going to be sharing it on socials
1:15:45
soon. If you have a question for the podcast, maybe an in-flight
1:15:50
question, make sure to submit those in voicemail at 213-290-1713,
1:15:54
or you can submit those at tppilotslicense.com.
1:15:58
If Oh, excuse me. Make sure to watch out
1:16:02
for some of the stuff that we have coming up. We always like to
1:16:05
make sure that we give sneak previews as well. But with the plane landed
1:16:09
and the seatbelt sign off, we look forward to flying the bright skies of the
1:16:13
TV world with you again soon. Until next time, keep your eyes on
1:16:16
the skies, your fingers on the dial, and thank you for listening.
1:16:21
Fuck yeah, Mr. White.