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MT25.7 The Mask of Agamemnon · The Downing Arts Podcast

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  Welcome to the Downing Arts Podcast.
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  It's week six and the end of term is coming ever closer.
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  This week we've had plenty of jazz as well as some lovely performances in
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  the Freshers recital last night. There's lots still to come with attention turning
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  to the DDS performance opening tonight. This week's
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  guest is Demetrius Flaudas, who is going to talk to us about something a little
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  bit different. Welcome, Demetrius. Hello. It is a pleasure to be with you.
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  Luisa. Excellent. So can you just tell us, before we start, a little bit about
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  your role in college? Yes, I am a visiting
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  scholar since the beginning of this calendar
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  year, so since January. I am a lawyer.
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  I have an affiliate chair at Immanuel Kant
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  Baltic Federal University in Killining Roads.
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  Former Koenigsberg, now in Russia. I'm a fellow
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  of the Hellenic Institute of International and Foreign Law, and until a
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  few months ago, I was policy lead at the Foreign Office here
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  in London, in Whitehall. I am a visitor in Downing,
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  but I have to say that I feel pretty
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  well settled in now and the welcome has been tremendous.
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  I. Oh, that's what we like to hear. Great. It's certainly been lovely having you
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  around college and sort of chatting to you a bit over lunch and so on.
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  And you're also a very loyal supporter of Evensong,
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  which is great. Brilliant that you feel. So. The college
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  Evensong is one of the best ones in Cambridge,
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  I feel. Ah, fantastic. It's very nice of you to say.
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  I mean, Downing is obviously the best college. We're not going to dispute that.
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  So. Yeah, no, it's great to have you with us. So what
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  are you going to talk about today? It's something a little bit different. Yes,
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  a little bit different. Because, you see, I was
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  trying to think about a single artistic expression
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  that could spark our conversation further.
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  Something that would bring together history and
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  archeology, which I love,
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  and art. And of course, you did mention,
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  well, whatever inspires you as regards any art
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  expression. So I thought about, well, something that
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  would have myth and human nature. So one piece eventually
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  came to my mind and that was the Mask of Agamemnon.
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  It is steeped in myth,
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  in mystery, in it has sparked scholarly debates and has
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  certainly given us personal fascination for generations.
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  It is currently housed in the National Archaeological
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  Museum in Athens, and it was discovered in
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  the autumn of 1876, but by
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  no other than the famous or infamous Heinrich Schliemann.
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  For the ones who want a reminder,
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  Schliemann was a millionaire. He was a businessman
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  who had turned archaeologists. He taught himself
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  several about 10 languages,
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  ancient and modern ones. And he had one
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  lifelong obsession. These were Homer's epics, the Iliad
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  and the Odyssey. At the time, these epics
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  were considered to be almost completely fictitious,
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  just myths, just nice little,
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  well, nice big poems that were certainly
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  were there for entertainment and
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  also artistic pleasure and of course,
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  with a huge ideological impact, but with
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  very little truth behind them. For some reason,
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  Schliemann grew up believing, ever since
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  he was a child reading the Homeric epics, that there
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  was truth behind them and not just a little bit of truth, but they
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  reflected almost reality. Yes, of course, if you
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  take out the constant interventions
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  of the gods themselves and all that.
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  So he did believe that the heroes of ancient Greece were rooted
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  in this historical fact, and he set out to prove
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  it very famously. The first thing that he did is he
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  went straight to the bottom line.
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  So he went to ancient Troy and excavated.
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  Now, no one knew that at the time that was ancient Troy.
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  This was just a, a tall mound
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  where some ancient relics had
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  been found. And there was nothing prehistoric about it
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  because the, the top parts were classical
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  and Roman, in fact,
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  archaeologically. But he did find
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  some. He did find a settlement which
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  existed on several levels
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  and has, and was going back all the way to
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  3000 BC and which almost
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  unanimously now is identified to be
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  Troy. So Troy existed and he,
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  it was Schliemann who promised, who actually proved
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  that this was not some kind of myth.
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  Wow. So where did you first come across this, this treasure,
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  this mask of Agamemnon? So, yes, going now to the mask of Agamemnon.
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  Schliemann then has done, he has done the
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  first stage in Troy and then he moves to the next obvious
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  destination, and that was Mycenae, because this is where
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  the enemies of the Trojans, the people who actually,
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  who seized and destroyed Troy, the Mycenaean
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  Greeks came, and that was the capital. And there,
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  according to what we know, the leader of all
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  the Greek cities that launched the thousand ships and
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  so on was King Agamemnon. And King
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  Agamemnon is a figure that we see not only in
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  Homer, but also in tragedy.
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  Aeschylus has written the Oresteia,
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  which deals with the death of Agamemnon after
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  he returns from Troy, whereby his own wife,
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  Clytemnistra, who is Helen of Sparta's sister,
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  by the way, she killed him in his bath. So this
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  is all quite interesting and fascinating, convoluted, but we will
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  go now to the mask. So Schliemann was looking for Agamemnon
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  in particular. So he goes into that grave circle starts
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  digging and amongst other things, he unearthes
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  a series of shaft graves which are filled with treasures,
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  absolutely filled. And within it,
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  these shaft graves he finds five gold
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  masks. And the one of them which
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  is the most evocative ends,
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  the prettiest and best worked is attached to
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  what Schliemann said was a quite well preserved
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  body. And as Agamemnon pulled it from
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  the face, actually he saw
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  for a moment the remains of
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  that face before it started disintegrating.
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  And of course remember that at the time there were precious
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  few facilities to actually to preserve
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  biological remains. So only the
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  skeleton remains after that. So Schliemann
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  being who he was, he telegraphs the king of
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  Greece and says, I have gazed upon the face of Agamemnon.
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  Hence the famous mask
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  of Agamemnon, so called, is now in the museum,
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  the National Archaeological Museum in Greece. And to answer
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  the question, I first saw it when I was 10,
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  I believe, and it was a school excursion since
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  I grew up in Greece. School excursion at the National Museum.
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  And I have to tell you that even for Rhodey schoolboys
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  that at 10 have everything else on their minds
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  and certainly not looking at museums,
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  this is something that we all gathered around. Perhaps it
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  was the gold, the glinting gold, perhaps it was, it was mythical,
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  it was Agamemnon who went to Troy. And of course every 10 year
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  old knows that in the western world and is
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  fascinating perhaps because also as a piece of art it
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  is very evocative. And I remember we were standing around looking at
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  it. That was my very first memory. Wow. And why has
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  it stuck with you? I mean, you've talked about the, the awe I guess that
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  you felt when you saw it. But is it, is it that that's made it
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  stick with you as opposed to other things? It is a number
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  of things and as I, as I said,
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  it is one of the most famous
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  archaeological finds ever. Although at the time, when you're 10,
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  you don't realize it and you cannot really compare,
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  even if you don't know the details, once you see
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  this golden face, very intense, staring out
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  from a textbook or a poster,
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  you do not forget it. And of course, as it usually happens
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  with the real life item,
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  it's even more magical.
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  Now mind you, very interestingly, this is
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  not the actual mask of Agamemnon.
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  Not because it's doubtful whether Agamemnon
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  existed or not, whether he is mythical or, or he's
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  a base in reality, but for the simple reason that it
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  is three centuries older than what
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  we expect that Agamemnon lived around. So in
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  fact, it dates back to around the 16th century, which is a
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  good 300 year centuries. Yeah. 300 years earlier
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  than the Trojan War described by Homer.
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  Wow. It's. It's amazing when you come across something like that that's just.
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  Yeah. Has so much. Well, so much history attached to it.
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  I mean, I know there are some pieces in the British Museum.
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  They do. They do inspire a certain. They sort of make you just.
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  Just stop. Yeah. It causes you to pause.
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  It's a potent symbol, of course, as you very well say,
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  that's a bridge between the world of myth and.
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  Which is so romantic but shadowy. And this is tangible
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  reality of the past. And even though it is not Agamemnon,
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  as we said, because it is 300 years too early for
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  it, it does actually verify Homer's stories
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  that says Mycenae was very
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  rich in gold and well built with massive
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  walls. And yes, you go to. To Mycenae, you see
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  the Cyclopean walls, you see the lion gate, and of
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  course, you go to the museum in Athens and you can see the
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  gold masks, which are obviously a dynasty.
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  And there are two grave circles in Mycenae.
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  This is grave circle A, where the five
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  masks that we're talking about as a group with Agamemnon's,
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  so called Agamemnon's mask, were found. Now, towards the
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  end of the Mycenaean period,
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  before the destruction of the palaces, we know
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  that the Cyclopean wall was extended to
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  include within the citadel this grave circle A.
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  But they did not do that for another
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  grave circle, which we called grave circle B and
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  which is even more ancient. Therefore, we assume,
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  we understand the leading theory for that is that the
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  dynasty that was reigning in Mycenae at
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  the very end, which is right about the time of the Trojan War,
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  was the same dynasty which is buried in the grave
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  circle with the golden masks. And that is why they chose to protect it
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  with the Cyclopean walls and bring it inside the citadel,
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  lest the. The enemy loots it or desecrates
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  it. So even if it's not a Gameon, it's very interesting to
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  think that it is one of his forefathers, his great,
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  great, great grandfather going 300 years back.
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  So you do have a touch of the mythical
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  reality, if we can say something like that there. Wow. Well,
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  I think that's probably an excellent place to end on. Yeah. So everyone who's not
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  seen this mask, go and have a look at it. Great. Thank you very much.
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  Demetrius it's lovely to speak to you.
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  As mentioned earlier this week, the Dramatic Society are putting on
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  their show An Evening with Chekhov in the theatre at 7:30pm tonight,
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  tomorrow and on Saturday. Here to tell us a bit about it is one of
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  the directors, Isadora. Welcome, Isadora. Hello. Thank you for having me.
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  That's a pleasure. Do you want to tell us what is An Evening with Chekhov?
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  Because it's not just one play, is it? No, it's not.
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  Essentially we've got six of his one act plays putting on
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  all six of them and each of those plays directed by a different director.
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  Wow. And how's that working with rehearsal logistics and so on?
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  It's a lot because we've got some of the actors are in multiple of the
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  plays, so logistically it's quite hard to figure out. I think they've got
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  a lot of work to do, but it's been really enjoyable, especially figuring
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  out how to move between each of the players, how they work in different orders.
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  Wow. And did it take a lot of experimenting before you settled on exactly
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  how you were going to do it? Yeah, it did a bit. We had a
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  meeting. We just discussed, especially logistically because actors are being in
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  multiple things and costume changes. So there's both the logistics side and the
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  more artistic side, considering the different orders. Gosh. And do each of
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  you directors have different approaches? I mean, how's that been working? Yeah,
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  it's been interesting. It's hard because you're not. You can't be
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  there for every rehearsal. But it's been interesting to see the ways people are taking
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  different approaches to it, of the comedy of it. Some people going more
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  for the realistic, naturalistic, some people going more for over the top melodramatic
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  acting. And yes, in the different takes people have. Does that affect
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  the actors? I mean, how do they find working with different directors and perhaps different
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  approaches and so on? Is that has that been been a problem or has it
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  been a really creative and exhilarating experience? It's an interesting question.
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  I think. I don't know. I think for the actors, acting is all about to
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  play. So if you think about just the word play and having fun with it,
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  I think having this experience of the different directors and different techniques allows them to
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  really play with their acting and yeah, it allows for more creativity, I think,
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  in an enjoyable way. Brilliant. And what are you reading? What subject are
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  you doing, Downing? I'm doing English. Okay, so there's a sort of direct link,
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  I guess. Yeah. And have you done lots of directing and acting
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  and things before? No, I've only acted. I've done a lot of acting, but never
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  directing, so this is my first time. Oh, wow. And do you find that your
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  studies of the English tripos feed into what you do in the theatre and the
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  other way around? Yeah, I think so, definitely.
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  In terms of. I think more the other way, more the drama
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  that I've done feeding into English, especially if we're looking at discussing
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  plays, having that perspective of plays being on stage, it's something
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  different to just seeing it as a text more than the other way around,
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  taking English into drama. But yeah, it's been enjoyable. I think directing,
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  as somebody who's only ever acted has been fun as well. But I'm always wary
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  of stepping on the actor's toes a bit too much. Like I don't want to
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  just order them around because I know how that feels being on the other side.
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  So it's always good to have see it from both sides. Yeah.
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  Great. And are there any highlights that an audience should watch out for?
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  Do you have a particular favorite play? Ooh, I don't know.
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  I can't. I think they're all very funny. I think Chekhov so often is seen
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  as being the sort of awkward formal language. That's how people might see
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  it. It's like this Russian realism, these domestic stories that might be quite
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  often exploring. People think like sad, quite tragic topics
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  of loneliness and sadness and stuff. But there is so much comedy
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  in the center of them. Even as big plays like the Seagull
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  and stuff. What makes them so human is the bits of comedy. And then these
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  plays were putting on are his vaudevilles. So they're little one act
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  players and they're very funny. They're just showing how human beings are very.
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  You can laugh at them a lot of the time. We do very funny things.
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  We make fools of ourselves all the time. And just finding the humanity and humor
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  in that. Wow. Well, it all sounds very exciting. Yeah, it is. It's really cool.
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  How can people get tickets? Is there a link somewhere? There is a link.
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  The Eventbrite link. I don't know how you can access that.
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  Actually. I will put it in the show notes. No problem. Thank you. Great.
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  Well, looking forward to it. And thank you for coming on the show. My pleasure.
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  This week in College, An Evening With Chekhov opens tonight
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  in the Howard Theatre, running until Saturday evening. See the show notes for details on
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  where to get your tickets. Also this evening at 6 o', clock, the chapel choir
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  are heading over the road to sing a joint Eucharist with the choir at Emmanuel
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  College through featuring Longlei's Mess Solonelle as well as music by Saintson.
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  On Sunday, we are looking forward to welcoming back former organ scholar Carl
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  Jackson, who has had an illustrious career, most recently as director of music of the
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  Chapel Royal, Hampton Court. Carl will be playing a short recital at 5:30pm
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  after which we'll have our terminally choral Eucharist.
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  On Monday at 5pm There's a talk from visual artist and filmmaker
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  Jerusha West. See the show Notes for details. Sessions for beginner
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  singers continue on Monday at six in my office. Everyone welcome. There are
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  two exhibitions currently open in college. A Gap in the Clouds continues in the Heon
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  Gallery, and in the library you can view archive material exploring the impact of
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  the Second World War on the college and its members. Plenty to get stuck into
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  this week. Thanks for listening.