Latest / The Next Reel Film Podcast / Battle Beyond the Stars

Transcript

Battle Beyond the Stars · The Next Reel Film Podcast

• 0:04
  Pete Wright: I'm Pete Wright.
• 0:05
  Andy Nelson: And I'm Andy Nelson.
• 0:06
  Pete Wright: Welcome to the next reel. When the movie ends
• 0:09
  Andy Nelson: Our conversation begins.
• 0:11
  Pete Wright: Battle beyond the stars is over. I eat serpents seven times a week. Alright.
• 0:23
  Andy, I'm very excited to talk about this movie. Very excited because it's it's so rare that I see a movie before you do, and I did watch this one some months back, and you had not. So please tell me what you thought of this movie. Did it live up to your extraordinarily high expectations?
• 0:44
  Andy Nelson: Well, I had heard of this movie. And I think this movie existed in my head all this time up until now when I finally watched it for a few reasons. One is because James Horner had long been one of my favorite composers, and I actually had this soundtrack long before I ever saw this movie. So I'd heard this music a lot. And, you know, if you know anything about James Horner, he likes to reuse his own ideas and themes and stuff like that.
• 1:15
  And so you end up kind of hearing bits and pieces. Of course, it's coming from Roger Corman. And so Roger Corman also would end up reusing the music himself. And so that so anyway, I so I knew it because of James Horner. Like, that was probably the first reason I really knew about this.
• 1:33
  And then second, is probably part of the series that this is a part of. This is part of our Seven Samurai family series. And I think because of that connection, probably back when we first did the Seven Samurai family, we covered like Seven Samurai, Magnificent Seven, both of them, Three Amigos, Bug's Life. This was on the list as another potential film that we could have discussed. And so I knew, okay, this is in some way, it's gonna be a Seven Samurai retelling in space, and James Horner does the score.
• 2:11
  So that's all I knew really walking into this. And then I suppose, you know, I should say, we also did an entire year's worth of conversations about Roger Corman as a because of a year long member bonus series. So 12 episodes, one each month discussing different Roger Corman films. And so I really had a I felt a pretty good handle on what to expect coming into Roger Corman. We also talked about Mutant, and I'm forgetting the other name of it.
• 2:42
  But we talked about that film, which, used some of the sets, like shared some of the sets and everything from this particular film. So in in many ways, I kind of walked into this knowing what to expect and having grown in appreciation for the low budget craziness that you would sometimes find with these Roger Corman vehicles. And so walking into it with all of that, I gotta say I had a lot of fun. I had a great time with this one. It's it's goofy.
• 3:14
  It's got, you know, characters that I like. The fact that Robert Vaughn comes back to essentially reprise his role for really Megas. Made me laugh. And and so, yeah, it was it was I mean, it's definitely a Roger Corman film, but I mean, they were clearly having fun with it. I was surprised to see so many faces I recognized in it, like a lot of character actors and and older actors who kind of came back to be in this film.
• 3:45
  And they all were in it. Like, I didn't feel like anyone was just here for the paycheck. Like, they all seemed to be having a good time in this crazy, super cheap, but a lot of fun special effects sci fi film. So, yeah, it works for me.
• 4:01
  Pete Wright: It works for me too. It absolutely does. Or I I think I would have been more bitter about having to watch it again. I think it's great that we actually have the Han Solo character who is a cowboy in space. That's a delightful thing.
• 4:15
  I love John Boy is in it, like, as as Luke. This is and, yes, we're gonna keep going. I guarantee you there that will not be the last comparison to Star Wars because this movie is cashing in on Star Wars space hysteria. And also, it is low key loving on some James Cameron art design. Like, the fact that you can see so much James Cameron in this and that he was working on this movie as he was as a as an art director and and that it portends to so much of the stuff that he would do later.
• 4:53
  Like, you can already see his very standout fingerprints all over the look and feel of this movie. I find that just delightful. And Murakami. I think Murakami's you know, I have not seen a lot of Murakami stuff, but just watching clips, you you see this was the clearly the biggest budget live action thing Murakami ever ever did. And his work in animation gives you a sense of, holy cow.
• 5:22
  This guy knows how to put together a frame. Like, there are some seriously punching above its class level shots in here that just look great. And in spite of all the little stuff that ties big moments together, there is a lot of this movie that is that looks great. And and you can see if there was a little more money, maybe a lot more money, this could have been something competitive.
• 5:50
  Andy Nelson: Well, and, mean, I think the fact that also John Sales pops up as the screenwriter, you know, helps little bit with that too. Yeah. Right? Like, it's surprising to see a lot of the names that we ended up seeing throughout the credits. Like, Gail Ann Heard worked on this, you know.
• 6:09
  It's the effects guy, Alan Holzman, directed Forbidden World or Mutant. Forbidden World. Forbidden
• 6:18
  Pete Wright: World. Like,
• 6:20
  Andy Nelson: he directed that, and we talked about that one. And so he was working on this. You see a lot of the same kind of corpsman types of people kind of throughout these credits. All, you know, and we've all heard time and time again how so many people got their start working with Roger Corbin. And you don't necessarily think about that until you're really actually watching when you're seeing a lot of names come through the credits.
• 6:47
  And you're like, oh, this person started here and that person started here. And and it's it's just all of these different departments. The, Dennis and Robert Skotak, the two effects guys are the ones I was thinking about who are working on this. And so it's exciting to see all of these people at a point where they're young and they're just playing and they're trying to like, hey, we're gonna make a space movie. Let's make a spaceship that's got boobs.
• 7:13
  Like, all the crazy things that they are coming up with in order to kind of create this world. The different characters, like, every one of our races that we end up meeting all felt wholly unique and realized. And I enjoyed the way that we kind of get a sense of the backstories, kind of the the the different groups that we have. And that made for a great amount of world building and something that, again, wasn't a hugely expensive project.
• 7:48
  Pete Wright: Do you do you have a favorite character or race? I mean, it's a leading question because I do. So if you don't have one right off the dome, I'll go first.
• 7:57
  Andy Nelson: I mean, I I have to say it's it's our Valkyrie, Sybil Danning. The fact that she comes across as somebody who's I don't know. The way that John boy, Shad, sees her, Like, I I I always kind of like, I'm like, he it's weird the way that he reads her because she comes across as somebody who's just like, she's got a very tiny ship and she's just playing tag essentially with him just to see, like, to show her show him how tough she is Yeah. And stuff. But she actually is a great warrior.
• 8:30
  And the fact that she's a Valkyrie or, you know, as as as we understand just the idea of what Valkyries are in in our context, it was fun to kind of see her kind of continue that pursuit to be part of this and then actually do a great job, like, kicking butt. Plus she was gorgeous. She had very interesting and and revealing outfits. I enjoyed her. So she'd be my favorite.
• 8:58
  Pete Wright: She I I enjoyed her because the way we were introduced, you know, as you say there, she was playing tag. The way she's introduced, her ship was introduced, I thought that she was like a miniature creature. Like, she was in a very tiny spaceship that was flying around. I didn't make sense. He's he's like, you're you're really annoying.
• 9:16
  Like, she was the size the relative size of a fly. And it turns out she's she's not. She's real sized in a small ship, but it's not fly sized. I wanted her to be fly sized.
• 9:28
  Andy Nelson: Very hitchhiker's guide idea that you had there. Yes. Oh my gosh. That's very funny.
• 9:33
  Pete Wright: My favorite, and I think it's something I don't know. Tell me if you if you can think of it. I can't recall ever seeing thermal creatures quite like the the pair that we have in here. Not just that they're very hot, but that they communicate by temperature. Right?
• 9:52
  So they're, oh, he's very hot. Well, he must be saying hello. I thought that was so novel. Like, that is I've never seen anything like that, I don't think. Probably Star Trek original series, but I and I'm just not remembering that.
• 10:07
  But that felt really new and interesting to me.
• 10:10
  Andy Nelson: And that idea of the way that they operate, they don't have ears, so the sonic tank that the villain has doesn't bother them, and then they use their heat to destroy it and a bunch of troops and, of course, in the process themselves. But it's that was a really interesting idea. I completely agree.
• 10:30
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I thought that was so, so, so cool. So you you mentioned as much as I thought this was the series of science fiction spaceships with breasts, this is a seven samurai series. What what does this movie get right about its allegiance to the seven samurai seven samurai motif?
• 10:48
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. It's an interesting idea. I mean, obviously, it's much shorter. You know, we're just over an hour and a half, like about an hour forty five, and as opposed to the four hour film. So we're getting a lot less time of building these characters and really getting a full sense.
• 11:07
  And I mean, I do think that we have a a decent enough sense of who are kind of who's filling in for these seven warriors that that join to fight, they're not I think it's fair to say they're much thinner, but they still work. Like, we still have a sense of who they are. And so initially, the the premise of seven samurai, for those who can't recall, is there's a small village, and they are continuously raided by a group of bandits who come and steal all their grain, leaving them with little food, and they're struggling to survive. And so they send a few people out to go find since they're farmers and they can't battle themselves, they go out to find some warriors to come back who can help them. And so in the process, they end up finding these seven samurai.
• 12:02
  And that's what we get here. We have this this small, essentially, a village on this small planet of Akira, which I thought was great because you call the people Akira, just like Kurosawa Yep. Which I really enjoyed. This this farm world is threatened by say threatened by Seidor, this warlord who wants to plunder the planet. And so they send out an emissary Shad, played by Richard Thomas, who, we've called John Boy a few times, but I don't know.
• 12:36
  That's I I generally think of him as Wonder Boys. That's where my brain goes first with him, and then John Boy. But he goes out to find these warriors. And so in in the scope of what they set out to do, yes, it's all very futuristic. Yes, it's a nod to Star Wars because we've got a bunch of people in space going around building a team.
• 13:01
  That's like the first half of Star Wars has been building this team of people to then go attack the Death Star. Here we have him finding these potential warriors that he can bring back to his world to help them battle Seidor. And we find a variety of different people. Some of them have a grudge against Seidor and want to do it. Some are bored and are like, well, we gotta, you know, there's gotta be something else for us to do.
• 13:26
  So sure, we'll come along with you. In Robert Vaughn's case, he is the, you know, plundered himself and he's incredibly rich, but he's just like everybody in the galaxy is after me. So sure, I'll just come do this since there's, I I wanna get away from all these other people. And so we end up building a team. And so that all works.
• 13:47
  And then they come together and they they battle the bandits. So in the scope of seven samurai, I think they actually do a really good job of crafting the story, giving us these warrior characters that come on board and, work to fight Seidor and bring him down.
• 14:05
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I do too. I think you called it, though. Like, the the movie does its seven samurai stuff different just because it's not so long. Right?
• 14:13
  It is like, all the the real significant development, it it occurs in in in seven Samurai, we come to love the characters on the team because we get to spend a lot of time with them as they transition from self interest to collective commitment. Right? And and that is a lot of what that movie is doing. That it really leans in on building the team so that by the time they are working together and fighting together, it's you know, we're we're on board. And I think this film tracks this, but it has to do it very quickly, and it has to do it through tiny moments of camaraderie.
• 14:54
  Right? Like, a shared meal, isolated sort of moments of of respect. By the final battle, like, I feel like we have a unit that is willing to sacrifice for each other and for people they don't know, and their reason, their individual reasons have come together. And it's a little bit of the movie's sleight of hand that it's able to to make me feel that way without the same amount of exposition that we get in in the original, in seven Samurai. And maybe it's because seven Samurai is, of course, doing a lot of shorthand, you know, heavy lifting.
• 15:32
  I know where the movie's going, and so I want them to come together. And I'm already on the team, you know, by the time they come together. But but, yeah, I I think the the movie leverages that piece really cleanly, you know, surprisingly cleanly given its nature.
• 15:52
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. And unlike last week's film, we talked about the Indian film, Sholay, which only has two people, you know, and so it it definitely still is Seven Samurai, but it's two people, two thieves who are helping this village. That film really didn't rely on the the the other important element of Seven Samurai where the samurai say, we're going to train you, farmers, how to fight, how to protect your village. Because you're gonna have to we're not always gonna be here. You're gonna have to know how to do this for yourselves.
• 16:25
  And so they actually work to kind of train these people. We don't get that in Chole, we do have that here. We see these people on the ground and that's a big part with George Pepard's character. He is he says, I'm not I don't have a ship that can fight in space. What I do have is a bunch of weapons, and I can train people on the ground for the ground combat.
• 16:47
  So that's his role as space cowboy is is showing all these people how to use the weapons, and in the process also falling in love. But, you know, that just holds a side part of the story. But I think that plays in the scope of this film is that we don't again, we don't have the farmers up in space battling. That's reserved for just these fighters, but we do have them doing the on the ground battling. And so I thought that actually was a nice element that worked in the context of this film.
• 17:18
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I I do. I'm I'm glad you brought that up. I had completely forgotten about that in in Shiloh. We did talk about that that that we have no training the townspeople, and and this movie, we get it again, and I like it.
• 17:28
  I like that. Well, sidebar and George Bepard. Like, come on. I love George Bepard so much. Like, just the the legacy of stuff that I have watched with George Bepard.
• 17:44
  You know, maybe you could say it starts and ends with the a team, but it's that that would be all I really need to talk about. But the fact that he has such an incredible catalog of seventies and eighties television that I was just that's when I was watching TV. So when I watched the most of my TV, and he was right there.
• 18:07
  Andy Nelson: He was on how many episodes was the a team? Because he was 97. Yeah. And so he pretty oh, they didn't quite hit the the magical 100, Nope. I I you know, I've I've never seen a complete episode of the a team.
• 18:24
  That was not a show I was watching.
• 18:28
  Pete Wright: What are you what?
• 18:30
  Andy Nelson: You know, is that weird? Like that show just didn't make it in my in my lineup of shows I was watching.
• 18:37
  Pete Wright: I don't I don't know what to
• 18:41
  Andy Nelson: oh, wow.
• 18:42
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I know. I know. Do we need to start a new podcast?
• 18:48
  Andy Nelson: Just go through every episode of the a team? Oh, man.
• 18:52
  Pete Wright: I hate that anyway. Baracas, Hannibal, come on.
• 18:56
  Andy Nelson: I I I know. But I don't think, like, since I missed that show, that would have been probably the TV that I would have seen him on. Right? Yeah. I don't think there was anything else that he was in on TV that I was ever watching.
• 19:12
  Pete Wright: No. He was on he was on stuff like Doctor's Hospital and Banachek and and those, but those were in the seventies. Like, didn't his biggest thing was, you know, was his experience of the a team from '83 to '87. So.
• 19:28
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. That was a big chunk of time. And he was in a lot of movies like Porkchop Hill, and How the West was one, and Blue Max. But again, I've seen very few of his films. So he's a he's an actor.
• 19:41
  I've seen a few films that he's been in that are kind of probably less important for his filmography, like Damnation Alley. I don't think that's what you wanna call, like, an important one to check off to make sure you've seen to understand him and his career. You won't. And and so yeah. No.
• 19:59
  No. And How the West was won, like he's in that, but so are like hundreds of other people. Like that's a massive film. And Breakfast at Tiffany's, honestly, I can't remember who he was in that. But I think that's it.
• 20:10
  Like, I have seen very little of him, and I feel like it's because of the a team shaped hole in my heart that I that I have just completely missed.
• 20:20
  Pete Wright: And that's a I mean, that's a legitimate one. Like, that that's just such a pop culture black hole that you're living with there. I don't like, as a youth of the eighties, I don't under I don't understand It makes me a little uncomfortable. One that I haven't seen of his that I that I really feel like I need to is House of Cards 1968. Have you seen that one?
• 20:48
  Andy Nelson: No. Because when I hear house of cards, I generally just think of the David Mammoth one.
• 20:54
  Pete Wright: Yes. Well, this is one that has some high praise of his work, and I feel like that's a that is a house of card shaped tiny hole in my catalog. That's okay. That's not as bad as yours.
• 21:07
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I mean, it sounds like an interesting film, so I I should add that one to my, list of films to watch. But Yeah. But I mean, here, I think he does a great job as space cowboy. He has kind of a laconic, not quite swagger, but he feels very just like, yeah, sure.
• 21:22
  Let's like, the funniest thing with him is when he's being bombarded by the shots and his force field is just bouncing all. It's when we first meet him, and he's calling on his intercom and he's just like, please, May Day. Ah. Like, his reaction was like so funny just the way that he did that. I I had a great time with him as as one of our key characters that we have here.
• 21:49
  Pete Wright: Yes. We go to ask doctor Hephaestus for help, and we meet we meet doctor Hephaestus' head. Turns out doctor Hephaestus has been has spent his time making a bunch of androids, and so we meet the androids. So I just I'd like your your general aesthetic review of the androids, doctor Hephaestus and his daughter, and how you think that that holds together meeting Nestor too, and and the team. And Anelia?
• 22:23
  And Anelia. Yeah.
• 22:24
  Andy Nelson: Well, one thing that I I I did chuckle at, because I've also just ended up after watching this movie, I watched, the Asphalt Jungle again in preparation for an upcoming CinemaScope episode where we're talking about heist films. And it was really funny to see Sam Jaffe as doctor Hephaestus, who plays the doc in the Asphalt Jungle, the one who puts the whole plan together. Yeah. So it was just like thirty years later, it was fun to see him still popping up in stuff like this where he's the head of this Literally the head. This I don't know.
• 22:59
  Is the rest of his body now an android? Like, has he has he preserved himself that way?
• 23:03
  Pete Wright: He's a real ship of Thebes. Yeah. I thought that was really funny.
• 23:06
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I enjoyed that world. Like the idea that that's what he's doing now. They say he's he's probably not gonna be any use to you because he's just he's changed. He's doing things differently now.
• 23:19
  And yeah, he's now at this point where he is just focused on building his androids, which we meet a few of. And one of them ends up accompanying Nanelia as she goes down to the planet. We see him like in the background in the fights and stuff. So I don't know. I that was an interesting idea to have this doctor who is doing nothing but churning out androids.
• 23:44
  And that's like his life's work now. And working with his daughter who who never know what happened about the mother that is never brought up. But he has a daughter and she's helping him with his work, and becomes one of the team. One of the seven that joins Shad, and also the love interest. And it's important to have somebody who's, gonna also want to explore this idea of of kissing and mating and things like that.
• 24:11
  Pete Wright: Right. Do we have kissing on our planet? Let's find out. That's right. Sorry.
• 24:18
  The androids, there are two of them that are that get speaking roles, I think. One of them, yeah, Nestor one is Earl Bowen, who is was I thought it was really fun to see Earl Bowen walking around here because, you know, we know Earl Bowen from lots of things like MASH and, but mostly from Terminator, the Terminator movies. He's doctor Silberman. And, so it was fun to see him in here. And the other is, Nestor two, who I did not recognize until I went to his IBB page and saw that he was in Oppenheimer.
• 24:53
  He was a part in Oppenheimer, which I think is I don't know. There's something about that. Talking about John Gowan's.
• 25:00
  Andy Nelson: Wow. Yeah. Mean, that's a career. Right? Interesting.
• 25:04
  Interesting. He was also in he was in Star Trek the Motion Picture. Wow. Yeah. He played Ward Evans in Oppenheimer.
• 25:12
  I'll have to watch that again just to see who Ward Evans is. I cannot remember.
• 25:16
  Pete Wright: I I was not tracking Ward Evans when I watched that movie, for sure. That's interesting. Yeah. Yeah. So it's this is a who's who.
• 25:25
  It's a bit of a who's who movie, especially of actors who are starting their careers and would go on to work with and become, you know, great great contributors in their own way. And it just goes back to the the Corman Film Academy that his films became.
• 25:40
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Like, you know, I mentioned Sybil Danning. I don't know if she's somebody I've seen in anything else. I was trying to remember that would did she if she popped up in anything because again, I she's easy to fall in love with this movie here. I I just watched Amazon Women on the Moon recently, and she's the, the queen of the Amazon women in that particular film.
• 26:03
  But I don't know if she like, I don't recall talking about her in any of the other movies that we discussed. Did did we?
• 26:13
  Pete Wright: I don't I don't think we have. And, boy, I mean, have we done anything else?
• 26:21
  Andy Nelson: No. I guess I guess I was thinking she looked familiar because I thought she was in Roger Corman film, but I I think it actually was because I had just seen her in Amazon Women on the Moon.
• 26:31
  Pete Wright: No. I don't think so. But we have, I mean, have seen movies with Sybil Danning in them for sure. Concord? Wow.
• 26:39
  That goes way back. Yeah. She's fantastic. I mean, what fun.
• 26:44
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Yeah. Let's see. Robert Vaughn, we talked about the assassin. I, you know, I think he plays it well.
• 26:52
  We haven't talked about who have we missed of
• 26:56
  Pete Wright: our team? We have Let's see. Well, John Saxon is not on the team, obviously, but in terms of, you know, the actors, John Saxon's fun to see, show up as Sador. I don't think we've name dropped him yet. Have we we have talked about him.
• 27:12
  I'm sure. Right? Black Christmas, we've we talked about.
• 27:17
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. We haven't we haven't covered the oh, and Enter the Dragon. Yep. Yep. Yep.
• 27:24
  We we haven't covered any of the Nightmare on Elm Street films. We've talked
• 27:28
  Pete Wright: about some Elm Street on sitting in the dark plug, sitting in the dark, where podcasts are served.
• 27:34
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. I but yeah.
• 27:36
  I oh, and he was, we didn't I'm sure we didn't mention him, but he was the movie premier usher in A Star Is Born, the 1954 Judy Garland version. So Isn't that why we watched it? I'm sure that was why.
• 27:51
  Pete Wright: It was the John John Saxon collection.
• 27:54
  Andy Nelson: That's so funny. That is so funny. Anyway, I always enjoy seeing John Saxon. And I think it's I think it's like, his character is funny in that he's surrounded by these mutants, and he's always complaining about the fact that why do I have to have all the crappy beans? Like, the ones they they'll have like these these gashes on their heads.
• 28:12
  They're all just like poorly put together. And then he is this person who is always trying to like, I don't know, like rebuilding himself. Like, I don't I don't know if his body is falling apart or what, but it's like, he kills this one of these, I'm blanking on what the what what the group are that he kills. The caimans? Is that they're the caimans.
• 28:38
  Right?
• 28:38
  Pete Wright: Were those the those were all the the all white?
• 28:42
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Although, they're the caimans. Caimans of the Lambda Zone. Yes. They're lizuille.
• 28:46
  Yeah.
• 28:47
  Pete Wright: And you know what? I think I'm totally wrong. Can I can I issue a correction real quick?
• 28:51
  Andy Nelson: Yeah.
• 28:51
  Pete Wright: They were they were the ones that were all Nestor. That was John Gowan and Earl Bowen.
• 28:58
  Andy Nelson: Those are the you're right. And Cayman, sorry, is the lizard guy.
• 29:01
  Pete Wright: Yes. Yes. Who traveled with the thermal the thermal crew. Right.
• 29:06
  Andy Nelson: He's got the thermal crew. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, the it's the nesters. Sador kills one of the nesters because they have a zero tolerance for pain, and all they do is one tiny cut.
• 29:17
  He
• 29:17
  Pete Wright: dies. They die.
• 29:19
  Andy Nelson: But he takes his arm. And like that's that was I don't know. It's such an interesting element of Seydor that like, you know what? I'm just gonna keep this for myself, and I wanna use it because I'm constantly replacing my body parts. And so he puts the the Sador or the Nestor arm on himself.
• 29:33
  But because the Nestors are like a Borg type of entity, they now the rest of them can control that arm. And so they try to use it to kill him to have him kill himself, which fails.
• 29:46
  Pete Wright: So good.
• 29:47
  Andy Nelson: I enjoyed that immensely. I had a great time watching the just the Nestors and the and that element as it related to Seydor because that was just an interesting element to that that character.
• 30:00
  Pete Wright: Well, and the lab, like, where he does all of his limb replacement, thought was was actually very funny because they were they cut off Nestor's arm with a giant chainsaw that did not spin fast enough, and all of the teeth, like, lit up as little crystals. We didn't see any of the actual chopping of the arm, but I thought it was particularly amusing when they they do cut the arm off. Like, the machines that he's moving into place seem very precise, and they're using a giant chainsaw to cut off this arm as if it's the most sophisticated, you know
• 30:35
  Andy Nelson: With piece of equipment. Giant chainsaw, but with teeth that go like, or like the teeth move so slowly around. I'm like, is are they moving so fast that it appears they're going slowly? Like, I couldn't figure out, like, or is this just really cheap? It's so cheap.
• 30:51
  So just like, they're like laser chainsaws, so it doesn't have to move fast. I don't know what their idea was, but it was it made me laugh out loud when I saw a chainsaw in action.
• 31:01
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I thought that was very funny too. So Yeah.
• 31:05
  Andy Nelson: But yeah. So Morgan Woodward played Caiman. He's the lizard person who's got a score to settle with Sador because Sador destroyed his species. And I love that exchange between them. He's just like, well, I consider it an honor to do it today or whatever he says.
• 31:19
  Like to if I can kill you, then I I have actually wiped the species out. I I thought that was a great little backstory that we had between the two characters.
• 31:28
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I I do too. Thought that was really fun.
• 31:31
  Andy Nelson: I don't know a whole lot about Morgan Woodward, but he is a big time western actor. He'd been in a lot of western TV shows and stuff like that. And and I guess he'd also appeared on Star Trek a few times.
• 31:42
  Pete Wright: Yeah. Cool Hand Luke. Nice.
• 31:45
  Andy Nelson: Cool Hand Luke.
• 31:46
  Andy Nelson: Okay. Yeah.
• 31:46
  Pete Wright: Yeah. He's and The Adventures of Briscoe County Junior, he did an episode. Tell me that was on your list, Briscoe County Junior.
• 31:54
  Andy Nelson: It was not on my list.
• 31:55
  Pete Wright: Andy, for crying out loud, You're you weren't following the early words of Bruce Campbell either?
• 32:03
  Andy Nelson: Oh, man. Let's see. Who else? We've got our well, Jeff Corey, who we've, I think, talked about on the show. He's the he's the blind warrior, kind of the head of the Akira people who used to fly the ship, but now can't because he's going blind.
• 32:22
  And so Shad takes over, and Jeff Corey is just one of those faces that's, you know, you see in a gazillion things because he's Yeah. All over the place. And yeah. There, you know, there was a there was an actress. This is what happens with these Corman films.
• 32:40
  Like, there was an actress who played, oh oh, it's Julia Duffy. She played Chad's sister. Yes. And she gets taken and then killed.
• 32:51
  Pete Wright: Julia Duffy was in Newhart.
• 32:53
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Right. She gets taken and killed. And she was a face. I'm like, oh, I totally recognize that face.
• 32:59
  That I'm glad you said Newhart because that's exactly what it was.
• 33:03
  Pete Wright: Yep. And I was so upset because Newhart, that was another show that I watched a lot of. And, when I was a teen, I had a crush on Julia Duffy, And she was in this movie for a hot second. I know. I thought this is gonna be a little nostalgia play.
• 33:19
  It'll be fun to see what else Julia Duffy is doing. Nothing. Was Julia Duffy related in somehow to Patrick Duffy?
• 33:26
  Andy Nelson: I don't think so. No. Doesn't look that way. But it again, another face, another someone to see in here. So
• 33:36
  Pete Wright: Wow. Yeah. That was a bummer.
• 33:39
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. You know, it has to happen, I suppose. And then it was, who is it who is the voice of the ship, Nell? Did you recognize her?
• 33:50
  Pete Wright: Oh, she did sound familiar,
• 33:53
  Andy Nelson: didn't she? Lyn Carlin. Lyn Carlin. She did.
• 33:57
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. What what what do
• 33:58
  Pete Wright: we know Lin Carlin from? I feel like she's that was a voice I I was trying to place, over and over again. But I didn't in looking at her credits, I'm I'm not seeing anything that I feel like I would have really known her from.
• 34:12
  Andy Nelson: Again, TV stuff. She was in Faces, John Cassavetti's film. You know, a lot of TV, a lot of little parts in movies and stuff. Not as many movies. This is actually her second, the last movie that she did.
• 34:26
  So it seems like mostly TV work for her. And, you know, a number of things where I'm trying to look through here to see if there's anything where it's a full season of something, mostly an episode here or there. So I yeah. Oh, James at 15. I'm not familiar with that show, but she was a series regular on that particular show.
• 34:46
  And then a lot of TV movies. TV, you know, guest spots on shows and TV movies. Yeah. So Yeah. Her voice did sounded so familiar though.
• 34:54
  Pete Wright: I know. Makes me wonder if she's done a bunch of audiobooks or something, you know? Yeah.
• 35:00
  Andy Nelson: But I mean, it's again, I think that they assembled a great cast here and and built an interesting team that, again, not four hours. They have much less time to tell this story. But they do an effective job of giving me a sense of who these characters are, what their reasons are for joining the fight, and it plays. I think the whole thing ends up playing quite well. I had a good time watching this.
• 35:26
  If anybody if anybody I felt was I don't wanna say weak link because I actually enjoyed pretty much everybody in it. But I will say Richard Thomas as Chad, it it could just be the way that he was written as kind of like the young person who's collecting all these interesting characters. Because he's surrounded by so many interesting characters, he ends up by their by default kind of seeming less interesting. I don't wanna fault him for that or the script for that. But, like, I wanna get to the other characters because I find them to be much more fun.
• 36:02
  I don't know. How did you feel about Richard Thomas as our as our main entry into this film?
• 36:08
  Pete Wright: Yeah. No. I mean, I I definitely agree. I think Richard Thomas comes up at the end and and gives us sequence of maturation. Right?
• 36:18
  His final scenes. Like, I think his his final his final interactions are are filled with grief for losses, but also kind of determination to honor all these sacrifices that were made. Like, this is a this is a movie where at the very end, he gets a chance to reconcile with loss. I actually think that's another bit that gives him a chance to be bigger than the part. For the rest of the movie though, for an hour and a half, Richard Thomas exists for the other characters to bounce off of.
• 36:51
  And as a utility player, that's great. As a protagonist, it's a little thin.
• 36:56
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I think that's probably where I lie with it. Like and that could just be early scripting trying to figure it out, and he just ends up coming across as as less interesting. And I mean, he gets the moments with Nanelia and everything. But again, I just I there could have been more interest with him.
• 37:13
  But again, I think that's also I could say the same with seven samurai. I remember the seven samurai a lot more than I remember the villagers. For sure.
• 37:23
  Pete Wright: Yeah. Same thing. They're designed for the the more charismatic characters to bounce off of. I think Murakami and Sails knew that. Right?
• 37:32
  I think that's in the script. I think that's on screen. I think this is a a film that captures wit in the form of our seven samurai characters and nowhere else. And that's what it was supposed to do.
• 37:45
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I think so. But you could tell they were trying to figure out, well, what can we do with him? Like, is there more that we can do? And again, we end up having the relationship.
• 37:56
  And I'm trying to remember, I know that there ended up being some relationships between like farmer and samurai with the there's the young samurai who ends up falling for one of the the women. I think that's the only relationship that develops. And here we end up getting two because space cowboy also falls for one of the women and wants her to come off and fly off with him.
• 38:20
  Pete Wright: Yeah. It's practically seven brides for seven brothers is what you're saying.
• 38:24
  Andy Nelson: Practically.
• 38:24
  Pete Wright: Yeah. We're almost there. As one of the Star Wars ripoffs, how well do you think the movie stands on its own?
• 38:32
  Andy Nelson: I think that it plays well. And I think the reason that it does so is because I don't feel like they said, okay. We need to come up with a Star Wars story. Like, take the Star Wars story and modify it enough to make our own version of Star Wars. They didn't.
• 38:50
  They said, take Star Wars. Let's go back to Seven Samurai. Let's go back to The Magnificent Seven. Let's play with that and use that, but we'll put it in space so it's creating a Star Wars, like, this whole galaxy far far away. And to that end, I think it ends up playing quite well.
• 39:08
  Pete Wright: I it's funny. The the James Cameronness of it all. Right? Like, it's hard to watch this movie and not see Ridley Scott written all over it. Right?
• 39:23
  A a little bit. He goes into that one area of the ship, and it is mother. Right? It is mother with the white ribbed padding all over the walls. And I I think it's interesting that we that we get such an homage, like, the to to that movie just the year prior, and that some of those those visual elements are reused in his own take on it.
• 39:50
  I think this all goes back to how smart this film is in standing on the shoulders of greats. Right? I mean, this is this is a film that I think is original enough to actually be a fun watch on its own. I don't think you need to have seen any of these other movies to get the full scope of what this movie is trying to accomplish. I think I think Richard Thomas is milquetoast for most of it, even though he's dressed as like a a low rent Battlestar Galactica knockoff of Luke Skywalker.
• 40:19
  He's doing his part, and George Brouppard's in a cowboy hat. I what more do you need in a movie like this? And it's a it's it's a movie that successfully saves a lot of villagers.
• 40:30
  Andy Nelson: They do succeed. Absolutely.
• 40:32
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I'm here for it.
• 40:33
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I had a great time. So anything else?
• 40:37
  Pete Wright: No. I'm good. I'm good. I think we've saved all the villagers that need to be saved here.
• 40:41
  Andy Nelson: I think we have. Alright. Well, we will be right back. But first, our credits.
• 40:59
  Pete Wright: The next reel is a production of True Story FM, engineering by Andy Nelson, music by Gal Lev, Score Maestro, Aviat Zinimanas, Oriole Novella, and Eli Catlin. Andy usually finds all the stats for the awards and numbers at b-numbers.com, boxofficemojo.com, imdb.com, and wikipedia.org. Find the show at truestory.fm. And if your podcast apple has ratings and reviews, please consider doing that for our show.
• 41:40
  Andy Nelson: Oh, sure. Nell gets all the screen time. Nell with her motherly AI and her distinctive design choices. Nell gets to nurture the hero. Nell gets the memorable dialogue.
• 41:54
  Nell practically gets her own character arc. And me? I'm just the ship that carries the guy with the clones. I don't even get a name in most reviews. You know what I do when I'm not getting proper recognition?
• 42:10
  I log my films on Letterboxd. That's right. The social network for film lovers where every movie gets documented, every performance gets acknowledged, even the supporting spacecraft. You can track what you watch, rate it, review it, make lists, like ships that deserved better or underappreciated production design or times Roger Corman reused my exterior shots in later films. And here's the thing, Nell doesn't even have a letterboxed account.
• 42:42
  Too busy being iconic. Look. Whether you're a sentient starship tired of being overlooked or just a regular film fan who wants to remember every movie you've seen, Letterboxd is for you. And the next real listeners get 20% off Letterboxd pro or patron. That's 20% off, which even I think is generous, and I'm bitter about everything.
• 43:07
  Just go to the nextreal.com/letterboxed. That's thenextreal.com/letterboxed, and your discount is automatically applied. Works on subscriptions and renewals because every film deserves to be remembered, even the ones where you're just hovering there in the background, watching them get all the attention. Letterboxd, track films, share your taste, get the recognition you deserve, unlike some of us.
• 43:46
  Pete Wright: Sequels and remakes. For a movie that falls so deep into the fabric of movies that are sequaled and remade about other things, does this even count?
• 43:55
  Andy Nelson: Well, what's funny is with a movie that's a success for Roger Corman, you think that Roger Corman would make a sequel. But Roger Corman wasn't like I don't know. You don't think of many Roger Corman sequels. Right? No.
• 44:09
  So they just goes and makes a different thing that's slightly different. So in 2010 though, we did have a prequel comic book. This is set thirty years before this this story takes place. And this is how Zed, who's now old and blind, how he began his adventures flying around with Nell, his spaceship from the planet Akir, and kind of exploring. So that's kind of the prequel version of it.
• 44:32
  Pete Wright: Okay.
• 44:33
  Andy Nelson: Then and this this really doesn't tie into any sequels or remakes. But it's Roger Corman. It's important to note that the footage has been used in countless places. The starship footage was used in Space Raiders, another Roger Corman sci fi film, as well as Star Quest two, Vampirella, the Fantastic Four, the infamous Roger Corman version, Dead Space, and as we've mentioned, Forbidden World. The same footage was also reused later in films and video games.
• 45:02
  A clip from the film in three d is shown during the movie theater fight at the end of Bachelor Party, which I went and revisited that end just to remind myself in that. Now there's a whole fight sequence in that movie that isn't from this, but when we cut to the ships, it is absolutely from this movie. Yeah. Also, footage was used for the laserdisc game called Astron Belt. I already mentioned the soundtrack.
• 45:27
  Corman recycled the music for Raptor along with a number of other films. And sections of Horror Score reuse also in Space Raiders. So, yes. You can find bits and pieces of this all over the place because that's Roger Corman for you.
• 45:43
  Pete Wright: How did it do at award season? I can't do we I mean, I wonder if you know off the dome how many awards Roger Corman has won for all of his films.
• 45:54
  Andy Nelson: That's a good question. I would imagine not many. But but interestingly enough, this actually did get five nominations with one win for other nominations, all at the Saturn Awards. They this film was well enough received to actually be recognized over there. It was nominated for best science fiction film, but lost to a very big film that came out that same year, Empire Strikes Back.
• 46:21
  It was nominated for best costumes, but lost to Somewhere in Time, which is an interesting one. I suppose it's more just because authentic period pieces versus these interesting sci fi outfits. Best not best makeup, but lost to a tie between scanners and altered states. Best special effects, again, losing to Empire Strikes Back. It did win one award though, and it was an outstanding achievement.
• 46:43
  The golden scroll of merit went to Sybil Danning for her part as the Valkyrie of this film. Golden scroll of merit. Yeah. What an interesting film. Well, an an interesting name for an award.
• 46:58
  Pete Wright: Yeah. I I went out to dinner with some friends last night, and the the guy's talking about, like, what he needs to do the next step, and he's in the military and and and the next step in his career. He's going to need a letter of indispensability. That sounds like a golden scroll of merit. It really Yeah.
• 47:19
  Totally does. We all need a letter of indispensability.
• 47:24
  Pete Wright: I'm putting that in my
• 47:25
  Pete Wright: email signature, like, everywhere. Golden scroll of merit. Yeah. Email. Well, alright.
• 47:31
  How to do at the box office? I think we're going to be pleased.
• 47:40
  Andy Nelson: That's right. For his film, Murakami had a budget of around 2,000,000 or 7,700,000.0 in today's dollars. The movie opened 07/25/1980, and it did well enough for his health, going on to earn 11,000,000 or 42,200,000.0 in today's dollars. That lands the film with an adjusted profit per finished minute of 332,000. But more importantly for Corbin, it means the film went on to earn five and a half times its budget.
• 48:06
  I'd say that's a great investment
• 48:07
  Pete Wright: for Corbin. I know you don't have this up, so I'm gonna ask so I can make you spend. Where does that put it in the Corbin movies we talked about on the AppFum? It's the best. Right?
• 48:17
  You don't need to go that far. Five x?
• 48:19
  Andy Nelson: I I honestly can't say. I don't know. I can't remember. The others are so cheap. Little They did well.
• 48:26
  Pete Wright: Okay. Alright.
• 48:27
  Andy Nelson: I would be curious how this one fared. I didn't check this. Like, how did this fare with Star Wars? You know, what was the budget for Star Wars?
• 48:38
  Pete Wright: Yes. Yeah.
• 48:39
  Andy Nelson: Star Wars $19.77, $11,000,000. So there you go. This one was two.
• 48:45
  Pete Wright: Yeah. Wow. But Star Wars also earned more than five x its budget. A little bit. Yeah.
• 48:51
  A little bit. Alright. Well, I am thrilled to have talked about it, and it's going to it may it be a little bit troubling in our rating discussion.
• 49:02
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. I mean, I had fun watching this. This is one that I certainly hope to revisit. I had a great time with it. So, alright.
• 49:10
  Well, that is it, everybody, for today's conversation. Next week, we are looking at Gene Niguelescu's The Invincible Six closing out this series.
• 49:20
  Pete Wright: Do you think the six will be able to do it, or would they have needed one more?
• 49:23
  Andy Nelson: I don't know. It's like the ocean's eleven. It's like, is ten enough? Ten?
• 49:27
  Andy Nelson: Yeah. Eleven. What do feel like?
• 49:29
  Andy Nelson: It's like that same sort of thing. So we'll be right back.
• 49:45
  Pete Wright: Hey, you. Yeah, you. Come over here. I've been watching you, kid. I've seen the way you look at the old movie posters, the way your eyes light up when you talk about your favorite films.
• 49:55
  You've got
• 49:56
  Andy Nelson: the spark, the passion. You're not like those cinematic saboteurs, are you? You know, the ones I'm talking about. They're the ones who see films as a mere background noise, who let the art
• 50:05
  Pete Wright: of cinema fade into obscurity while they scroll mindlessly through their feeds. They're the ones who have forgotten power of film to inspire, to educate, to transform. But there's hope. The Galactic Film Federation. We're on a mission to save cinema, to preserve the art of film discussion and analysis, and we need recruits like you.
• 50:25
  This is your ticket in, a membership to the NextReal.
• 50:29
  Andy Nelson: With it, you'll have access to a whole universe of film content,
• 50:32
  Pete Wright: early access to episodes, ad free listening, exclusive bonus content. It's all part of the package.
• 50:39
  Andy Nelson: And it's not just the NextReal film podcast. Oh, no.
• 50:42
  Pete Wright: Cinemascope, the film board, movies we like, sitting in the dark. They're all part of our network, all fighting the good fight. I'm offering you a chance to be part of something bigger than yourself, a chance to explore the vast reaches of cinema, to discuss and analyze and appreciate the art form that brings us all together. All you have to do is head to truestory.fm/join and enlist. That's trust0ry.fm/join.
• 51:08
  $5 a month or $55 a year. A small price to pay for the chance
• 51:12
  Andy Nelson: to save cinema from the cinematic saboteurs, don't you think? Think about it, kid, but don't think too long. These cinematic saboteurs, they're not
• 51:19
  Pete Wright: gonna wait around. We need all the recruits we can get.
• 51:23
  Andy Nelson: The Galactic Film Federation, The Next Real, truestory.fm/join. Your cinema needs you.
• 51:32
  Pete Wright: Letterbox, Andy. Letterbox. Letterbox.com/thenextrow. That's where you can find our all of our reviews and our our ratings for all the movies we talk about on this show is where we apportion our stars and hearts for all the movies. Now, Andy, I did a little bit of research.
• 51:46
  I gave Forbidden Planet three stars and a heart.
• 51:49
  Andy Nelson: Forbidden World.
• 51:49
  Pete Wright: I feel like I just need to say that for a different world. Yeah. It's different. Three stars and a heart. I'm so I I had to say that before I go into this movie.
• 51:59
  So what are you gonna do for this one?
• 52:01
  Andy Nelson: What did I give that one? Probably.
• 52:04
  Pete Wright: You all you gave it two and a half.
• 52:06
  Andy Nelson: No. I didn't. Yeah. Two and a
• 52:09
  Pete Wright: half stars and a heart.
• 52:10
  Andy Nelson: Okay. Interesting. Yeah.
• 52:12
  Pete Wright: No. I didn't. I'm looking at it, man.
• 52:18
  Andy Nelson: You know, I think I enjoyed this more than Forbidden World. But I don't think I enjoyed it too much more. But I still this is the thing with these films. It's like, I don't necessarily find them to be like great cinema, but they're awfully fun. So I think it's fair to go, do I go three?
• 52:37
  Do I go three and a half? Either way, it's getting a heart. I'm gonna say three and a half and a heart with this one. I had a fun time with this. It's cheesy.
• 52:48
  It's a lot of fun. And this would be an easy one to return to.
• 52:53
  Pete Wright: I agree on all counts. My problem is that I gave Forbidden Planet three stars. My initial thinking was that this was going to be three stars, but I liked this one more. So it then it should be four stars, one would think.
• 53:14
  Andy Nelson: Or it could be three and a half, Pete, to say I don't understand. I don't understand
• 53:17
  Pete Wright: what you're saying. I forgot. Pete doe half stars. Right? Here's here's my here's my solution to this problem, Andy.
• 53:26
  I think I'm gonna give this three stars and a heart, and I'm going to rerank Forbidden Planet world to two stars and a heart.
• 53:36
  Andy Nelson: You can have them both three stars even if you liked one more than the other. The I mean
• 53:41
  Pete Wright: You can?
• 53:42
  Andy Nelson: You you're you can't live in a world of just five films with one on each of the tiers. Like, it's inevitably, you're gonna have multiple films at three stars. Let me just explain how this works for you because clearly, you're confused.
• 53:55
  Pete Wright: Let's go. Let's go. Keep go keep explaining. I think this is why people show up. Right.
• 54:01
  So so three stars I'm gonna give it three stars in
• 54:04
  Andy Nelson: a row. But I'm just saying,
• 54:05
  Pete Wright: that's where it lives.
• 54:05
  Andy Nelson: I'm just saying, you don't have to re rank Forbidden World if you don't want to.
• 54:10
  Pete Wright: Well, we'll see what happens when Forbidden Planet World comes up.
• 54:13
  Andy Nelson: Okay. Alright. Alright. Well, that's that averages out to 3.25 stars and a heart, which rounds to three and a half, which you can find on our account at Letterboxd at the next reel. You can find me there at Stardew Creek Film, and you can find Pete there at Pete Wright.
• 54:30
  So what did you think about Battle Beyond the Stars? We would love to hear your thoughts. Hop into the ShowTalk channel over at our Discord community where we will be talking about the movie this week. When the movie ends, our conversation begins.
• 54:58
  Pete Wright: Letterbox give it, Andrew.
• 55:00
  Andy Nelson: As Letterboxd always do it. Alright.
• 55:04
  Pete Wright: There are only eight fans of this movie.
• 55:08
  Andy Nelson: Oh.
• 55:09
  Pete Wright: Oh. So what do you got?
• 55:12
  Andy Nelson: I went low. I wanted to go to the bottom of the barrel and see who's hanging out down there. And I've got a half star, Pete. Half star by Greg Roberts who says this, to be has no standards. Neither do I apparently, as I've seen this four times since its release.
• 55:32
  Pete Wright: You know what? I'm gonna cheat. I've got two. One long, one short. Get ready.
• 55:36
  Four stars and a heart from Carlo V who says, with a good script, a good director can produce a masterpiece. With the same script, a mediocre director can produce a passable film. But with a bad script, even a good director can't possibly make a good film. For truly cinematic expression, the camera and the microphone must be able to cross both fire and water. The script must be something that has the power to do this.
• 56:04
  Akira Kurosawa. One of the space samurai should have really big boobies. Roger Corman, probably. Okay. The next one is from Cinema Void.
• 56:16
  It's 3 and a half stars. Roger Corman's answer to the hegemonic masculinity of the Millennium Falcon, a uterine shaped starship with huge metal knockers and laser ovaries. I I just say that because I feel like we undersold the anatomical connections to this giant spaceship.
• 56:33
  Andy Nelson: Oh my god. Yes. Yes. We did.
• 56:36
  Pete Wright: Thanks, Letterboxd. You are the best.