Latest / Blind Guys Chat / #109: Jan's doing Dublin!

Transcript

#109: Jan's doing Dublin! · Blind Guys Chat

• 0:15
  And hello. Yeah. Dam welcome of days special outstanding from Dingu Jet. And it is.
• 0:23
  Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Does orange speak Dutch now? I mean, I'm understanding you don't.
• 0:29
  Yeah. Or in orange. Breakthrough. And what you about to mo. Yeah, he's speaking a little bit. Yeah, yeah. And. And I learned also.
• 0:41
  Excuse me. Say, hey, Stewart came back. I came back. Guys came back for a while. The office looks different. Jan, you've painted the office.
• 0:52
  Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry. Yeah, yeah.
• 0:54
  I haven't been here since January.
• 0:55
  He kept running into the walls and that's why.
• 0:59
  Yeah, that's why. They're very bright.
• 1:00
  That's true. That's true.
• 1:02
  Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:03
  We had some parties also in the. In the recent. Yeah, yeah, you see that.
• 1:08
  But could have cleaned the place up.
• 1:10
  Yeah, yeah, I think so too.
• 1:12
  We don't see the problem.
• 1:16
  We can smell something, you know, but this.
• 1:19
  We don't see it.
• 1:19
  Yeah. Hey, but. But anyway, you know, in Dutch. But. But everything. Yeah, you're back to. And we are here in. In a different situation. And that's why. Yeah, we miss a guy. Yeah, that's also. But. But yeah, he is not feeling well, Mr. Oren. But the show must go on.
• 1:40
  We'll be back. The show. That's it. That's it. And you know something? I got a call to say when I come back. I signed a contract for a couple of weeks. Huge money. So I came back.
• 1:48
  Really?
• 1:48
  Yeah.
• 1:49
  So you made friends with Hector again?
• 1:51
  Hector? I was chatting to him tonight before we started, and he just gave me a big check with my contract.
• 1:57
  I need to talk to him as well.
• 1:59
  No, he's. He's gone home and then he's going on a cruise.
• 2:02
  What's this about money? I have to pay.
• 2:04
  I don't know. Even. I don't know. Well, he's always complaining, this guy Stuart.
• 2:10
  You know, and to be fair to Mo, I mean, he's a mo. You're an occasional host or guest host. You should have a separate contract for guest hosts.
• 2:19
  I think so. Yeah. Yeah.
• 2:21
  So definitely see Hector.
• 2:22
  All negotiations going on. Yeah. No, yeah, we will contact Hector again then. It would be nice to speak to him.
• 2:28
  Yeah.
• 2:29
  Hey, but. But anyways, guys, thanks very much for joining me in this night. Yeah. Episode 109. It's already 109.
• 2:38
  You know, I have to say because it's been quite a few episodes since I've been here, Jan. And I've been listening to every episode. I noticed in a few of them you threw Me under the bus for various things.
• 2:46
  Yeah, so do you.
• 2:47
  But I loved your episode 100, I think the whole 100. That was brilliant. Yeah, that was very good. When you went back through all the. All the bits and pieces.
• 2:56
  Yeah. And it's amazing. We have such a history already. Yeah.
• 3:00
  And I just want to clarify, Jan, because since I left and somebody else said it to me, I was at an event during the summer. I mean, I actually thought people knew about this at this stage. But a lady came over to me and said, I heard you've climbed Kilimanjaro. And I had to tell her. I said, look, I didn't. It was a bit of a joke at the time, but. And she was guttering. So it was still going on a year later. So I just for the record, I did not climb Kilimanjaro.
• 3:24
  No.
• 3:25
  I'm devastated. What is this?
• 3:28
  I know, I know.
• 3:30
  Is this the new way also politics would go feel, you know, be honest with the situation.
• 3:37
  It feels like that here. It's like, we're going to do this. No, we're not going to do it. Anyway reasons.
• 3:44
  Yeah, but. But the weather here is just like in Kenya at this stage, you know? It is. We were tipping on I 20 degrees in this.
• 3:56
  Miles over here, too sunny and like this this afternoon between, like work hours. So around 1:00, I sat in my balcony and just luxuriated in the sun. It was so great.
• 4:09
  Yeah, I like the way.
• 4:11
  I like the way you stressed between work hours just in case anybody was listening and thought you weren't doing your job, Mo.
• 4:16
  Well, you know, you see, I mean, maybe people are listening and it's like I sat in the balcony in the afternoon, I said, isn't this guy working? What's he doing? Yeah, no, no, I'm working. It was between work. I'm up in my break time.
• 4:29
  In your break. That's fair enough because you could be on the balcony with your computer, I suppose.
• 4:33
  Exactly.
• 4:34
  It's been really. It's been really warm here, too. Well, it's been really mild here. It's 16, 17 degrees. It's been kind of damp, though. Bit of rain, but yeah, definitely there's no cold. And Jan, when you come on the zip line to Dublin and we love that later in the show.
• 4:49
  Yeah, we will, we will, because we need to check on Oren as well. And we have this. The trip already scheduled. Yeah, so. So we will go. But what can we expect then next week? Will it be in.
• 5:01
  It's going to be nice for you. Guys, and I know you're doing a couple of trips and actually it'll be really interesting to hear on the next show your thoughts on just visiting Ireland and the accessibility and anything that, you know, you, you, you liked or indeed that you disliked.
• 5:13
  I thought on the quality of the beer, but.
• 5:15
  Well, we will talk about that as well.
• 5:17
  Yeah, I've never been to Ireland, but I would love to come someday as well.
• 5:22
  Yeah, I think we need. Because this is also my first time that I will go there and we'll see. So, yeah, everything is not yet packed and scheduled, but we are almost there.
• 5:36
  Well, we're looking forward to seeing you and we'll hear more about that later on the show. I was going to chat to you guys because I've been looking a little bit lately at this braille 200. They're doing 200 years of braille celebrations all over the world. The rnib in the UK have a big thing about Braille 200 over the next year and they're going to loads of different public libraries around the UK promoting Braille. But it just made me think of what. And maybe it might be something we can ask our listeners to send in emails. What are other countries doing as part of Braille 200? You know, because it's a big, kind of a big thing 200 years since the code was invented. Are you guys. Are they doing much in the Netherlands or have you guys.
• 6:18
  Yeah, we are. We are doing something, but I'm going to a symposium in Antwerp on 22 November also for, for, for Braille. So we will be there and I don't know about the. All the details. Do you know more about it, Mo? I don't.
• 6:36
  Unfortunately not. I, I haven't heard much about it. I will be at a, at a convention in Utrecht later.
• 6:43
  Yeah. Next week.
• 6:44
  This week. Next week. Yeah. So on Friday. And I'm curious what's, what's going to happen there. But, but no, I've not heard anything special about Braille, honestly. Also, I don't really follow the Dutch Braille authority or anything like that. I probably should at some point, but since I'm such a brill noob, I just take baby steps because.
• 7:03
  Fair enough.
• 7:04
  Just started. So.
• 7:05
  Yeah. Are you still also a member of this Braille reading club, Stuart, where Oren.
• 7:13
  Yeah, so I'm one of the, what they call us moderators. So I. Oh yeah. Responsible for getting people in and out of the rooms. And I see Oren there religiously every week. He's there with his Braille Really? Yeah. So I. I do.
• 7:25
  He's making some progress also. Throw him for the bus, you know, a little bit.
• 7:29
  I. I think he's doing okay, to be honest. I'd say we could really throw him under the bus and get him to read on one of the shows when.
• 7:36
  Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 7:36
  Oh, yeah. Interesting. But no, it's. It's really good. And that whole book club thing, it's because it's nice because. And I think we talked about it before on the show a long time ago. There's very. There's various different rooms and there' levels of Braille, so you can go at your own pace and your own comfort, which is good. I wondered, would there be. I think it was 2009 when they celebrated the 200 years since Louis Braille was born. A friend of mine gave me a lovely keyring. She was at this Braille thing in Paris at the time. There was some Braille event which I wasn't at, but they had these Louis Braille keyrings and in Braille it said Louis Braille 1809. I still have it. It's a really nice key ring. So maybe they'll do some, some of those kind of things as well.
• 8:19
  Oh, yeah. We'll keep everyone posted and if the listeners have something to share, you know, it's always good to get information from. From. From. From you. Let me see. Also, then we go, I think, to a big event also in the UK. That's in London side Village this time, the November 5th. And hey, you will be there, Stuart there with Sight and Sound.
• 8:43
  I will. With my Sight and Sand T shirt. Bit sad this year, though, Jan, because you won't be.
• 8:49
  No, no, it's sad. You know, we are. We are not traveling that. That much in that way. But. But my colleagues will be there from Optelec, so they will. So you can always give a shout out there. But our, you know, Mo, we had a nice interview with one of the new innovations, in a way. Yeah. And they.
• 9:09
  Absolutely.
• 9:10
  And they are there. Can you tell who is there? What we mean with this?
• 9:15
  So, yeah, it's. Glidance will be there with our Glide device and I tried this thing at the NFB conference in the us. It's intriguing. Let me put it that way. It's intriguing. There are several, I think, developments right now going on that will make mobility, I hope, significantly easier. One of them is the smart glasses. Of course. We've been talking about the Meta Ray Bans all the time.
• 9:40
  Yeah.
• 9:40
  And all that and all that. But there is More going on in the smart glasses space. However, there's also this. Yeah. And there's also n. Celeste. And there's also this thing that's called an envision, obviously. There's also this thing called. Called the Glide. And the Glide is not a smart glass device. It's actually. It looks like a Dyson vacuum cleaner.
• 10:02
  Yeah.
• 10:03
  And you walk around with it and it all sounds very silly up until you feel how well it works. It. It basically guides you around obstacles. And now I don't think this is the end all and be all of travel because there'll be more. I suspect that if you want the best experience, you might want to combine the two. But that's. Yeah.
• 10:25
  How did it feel? I'm curious, Mo, you know, as someone who has tried it, how did you feel using it? Did it make you think, gosh, I would trust this to use it on its own without my cane? Or would you still have felt you needed the security of another mobility aid with you?
• 10:42
  No, no. So I would trust it without my cane. But I will say that the only reason why I would is because I've got. And I don't like to brag. It's not in the Dutch nature. But I'm. I'm. I'm. My roots. My roots are Moroccan, so I can brag. That is in our nature. So I have, I think myself and some ability instructors have told me the same. I have very good hearing, or at least I can place things very well through hearing. And so because of that, I feel a lot more secure. I also feel very secure when I walk with a sighted guide, even when they don't speak to me. So they don't speak to me. Someone comes our way and I can hear that and go walk behind that person so that we don't bump into anything. I sometimes even have that with trees when there's enough noise going on, like the wind or something. I know when something is coming.
• 11:37
  Yeah.
• 11:38
  Sound, chance. And.
• 11:39
  Yeah.
• 11:39
  And that's between you and me. I can share a secret. I recently bumped into a tree who didn't want to go away or move out of my. Yeah, it's just a shame. Yeah. I was there walking. Sorry.
• 11:54
  Criminal. We should.
• 11:55
  Yeah.
• 11:55
  I should go to the police.
• 11:56
  Yeah. This is on my list still to do. But. But Chef, you know, he was walking a little bit free, you know, on us on a night walk, and then was chatting around a little bit. And, you know, then you walk out of track and then those trees, my God, you know, they. They can really. Well, it Hurts.
• 12:17
  They can hurt if you don't expect them. It's like a lamppost. The lamp post can also hurt quite a lot.
• 12:24
  That's the. And of course, when you don't expect them or when this happens, you might be miles away in your own world and suddenly you get.
• 12:30
  Yeah, that's true.
• 12:32
  Right.
• 12:32
  Well, you are back in the world in one second again, you know.
• 12:37
  But one of the things, I spoke to a guy called Mike May who used to work with Sendero. In fact, he founded Sendero and he was involved in Glide, and he still might be. He was one of the beta testers. But he told me that at least the primary audience were people who might never get out and about with a cane or a guide dog, that this might give them a little bit more confidence. Now, that doesn't mean other people wouldn't use it, but I think that was the primary target audience.
• 13:07
  Yeah. So, yes, it might be that you have to walk a little bit slower and all that stuff. The reason why I think someone who's experienced might also benefit from this. And I want to stress, though, that this is all unproven tech. Nothing has been released yet. Nobody's using it in the wild other than the developers of Glide. And it's very promising, but it's all very unproven as well, still. So take whatever we say with a grain of salt, because we don't actually know. We just surmise from what we've seen and felt and tried out, but that's very limited. So that said, though, the reason why I think it might help even an experienced cane user who's not afraid of walking around outside is because a cane can be. Can sometimes be very annoying when you are walking around. And for example, I'm walking sometimes on a park path. And the problem with that is that you have to use the grass as your guideline.
• 14:05
  Yeah.
• 14:06
  But the grass is relatively high there.
• 14:08
  Yeah.
• 14:08
  And so my cane gets stuck all the time. And so I get. I even get, like, trouble with my wrist sometimes because I'm a fast walker.
• 14:17
  Yeah. And so when you get stuck with your cane, you know, it can bump in your. Into your stomach as well.
• 14:24
  Yeah, yeah.
• 14:26
  Or you have to pull it out, you walk past it, and then you get. And then you hit something anyway.
• 14:30
  Annoying.
• 14:31
  It's very annoying. And so this device might actually help you. Might actually help you walk around without needing that guideline because it can steer you and it can make sure that you stay on the path. And I think that already takes away so much mental load that you know, it might already be worth it for that. And this thing ain't going to be cheap. It's going to be, it's going to be a very expensive smartphone, one of those folding phones.
• 14:59
  But it's really interesting. Right. I know about three or four people between here and the UK who've signed up for the Pre, you know, the special offer.
• 15:09
  Yeah, the Pre order, it's still there.
• 15:11
  Who've spent a fair bit of money already on it, you know, so. And they're not going to get it till next September I think is the, is the go live for those people. I think it'd be really interesting. They're going to be, I think, very popular at Site Village. And if you're coming to Site Village you get a chance to try the Glide. I'm definitely going to have.
• 15:29
  And also there is a Demo Day at November 4th just ahead of.
• 15:35
  So that's the day before it's been hosted by the Thomas Pocklington Trust. They have very limited spaces available. So go to the Glide website. It's all on the website. But if you can still get in, that's going to be hosted in Thomas Parklington, which is also in London.
• 15:51
  Yeah, okay. No, but looking forward to it. And since also he was contemplating on our show whether to go or not. He is, we are happy that he made the decision and jump over.
• 16:03
  Well, I want to commend him anyway because what he's building is a very difficult product. Even if it doesn't pan out, which is very possible because this is, this is almost self driving car tech that he's building in here and he has to make sure that everybody stays safe. It's very difficult. It's a very risky product and I really want to commend him on taking the leap, trying it out, even if it becomes nothing. I'm pretty sure that we'll learn quite a lot from it. But I really do hope the guy succeeds because it takes guts to try something like this. And I, it's really, it's, it's awesome to see this.
• 16:36
  So do I. And, and it's funny, one of the people I was talking to who has put some money, who has, who has pre ordered it is somebody who had a guide dog who, whose dog has retired and who has decided, I think for health reasons they're not getting another, another guide dog. But she's not comfortable with the cane and she, she sees this as the possible solution. The other thing I wanted to mention very briefly because you mentioned on one of the shows was it the last one or the one before iOS 18 and you were saying how completely underwhelmed you were with the update, you know, that it wasn't that exciting. And I would agree, I guess, with the exception of Braille screen input, which is definitely an awful lot better.
• 17:20
  And also I must come because the last previous time I didn't know the command, but it is with three finger swipe up is to do the enter.
• 17:28
  Oh, to the enter. Yeah, I think I told you that one, didn't I?
• 17:31
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I couldn't remember it the last time.
• 17:34
  Three finger swipe up to send and.
• 17:36
  Three fingers swipe down. You have then the control mode again.
• 17:40
  Exactly. It's really useful. One of the, One of the issues I've had, one of the annoyances I've had lately is my calendar view has changed.
• 17:49
  Oh.
• 17:49
  So I used to have the days of the week going across the screen, or rather it's in month view, I think the days of the month, you tap a day and then across the bottom of the screen you just see the appointments for that day. But now when I tap a day, I see every hour, so I have to flick through the hours and then the appointments are listed. If there's an appointment in that hour, it speaks the appointment as well. So I'm desperately trying to get my view switched back to that, to the way I had it, and I cannot work out how to do it. You know, it should be straightforward, but I can't.
• 18:19
  If you have some listeners, anyone knows, please.
• 18:22
  Blindguyschatgmail.com I really, really need to know.
• 18:25
  That I can hear the bus coming, but I don't know the answer right now.
• 18:29
  No, no, no, no, no. Hey. But your bus is now coming because you had some really news about ChatGPT, Mr. Mo.
• 18:37
  Yes, yes, correct. So I, I don't think this was available actually in Ireland before, but it was in the uk in the US and other English speaking regions. But right now in the EU, they've actually released the new advanced voice mode for ChatGPT and you have access to this if you're a ChatGPT plus subscriber. For now. So you have to pay for ChatGPT plus, otherwise you don't get it yet.
• 19:02
  Okay.
• 19:03
  They might release it to the rest of the public, but not yet. So what this allows you to do is it allows you to enter into an advanced voice mode. You can of course, always already talk to ChatGPT, but now you can do more. So you can interrupt it and it will stop talking and Listen to what you have to say. So if it goes off the rails, you can say, no, no, that's not what I meant. Can you please go back to on topic? It can show a little bit more emotion. So it can sound scared, it can sound happy, it can laugh, actually and make other like human sound effects and noises, not real sound effects, but you know, with the voice, like woo and all that.
• 19:42
  Intonations and intonations.
• 19:44
  Expressions, etc.
• 19:46
  Expressions, yeah. And it can whisper. I asked it to tell me a joke and it told me a joke where it needed to whisper and it whispered. That's pretty cool.
• 19:56
  How does that feel talking to AI? And it laughs. Is it. What's the. Is it feel strange or is it kind of just for you?
• 20:04
  Well, so I am an engineer by training and so the way I deal with this sort of stuff is just by putting on my technical head and thinking about it. Like I'm very impressed with what it can do and so I don't really think about the human side effects yet. That will come. It'll come as I use it more because it'll start feel normal to me and then I'll start thinking about it. But for now, I'm the tech geek who's just looking at this and thinking, yeah, wow, this is very important.
• 20:32
  Looking at the potential.
• 20:33
  Yeah, looking at the potential and all that stuff. And of course, product. I build products myself and so I'm thinking like, oh, how can we use this? How would this be useful in other products? So, yeah, that's what I'm thinking about right now.
• 20:48
  At the risk of throwing you under the bus, would there be any chance you could do a demo for us for the next show?
• 20:55
  That's a high risk of throwing. I can hear the bus coming. It's really close now, but yes, I see if I can do. I can see.
• 21:02
  You did already great with your previous.
• 21:06
  Yeah, your jaws. Yeah.
• 21:09
  Because are you still on schedule mo for the end of October with 2025? I think so.
• 21:16
  Absolutely.
• 21:17
  Yes.
• 21:18
  We want to release in the end of October and of course FSCompanion is a really useful feature and I hope you all enjoyed the demo that I did.
• 21:27
  It was a great demo.
• 21:28
  Yeah. And then next month we have Shark Fember and it's also in the famous Freedom Scientific Month, or to become now had a second time in a row and it will continue, of course, but I don't know if the closing time has reached.
• 21:46
  It has passed. It was October 16th. You could enter your idea in a.
• 21:51
  Video, but next year But I am proud to mention also that Stuart and me and Sight and Sound and the Blind Guys chat. We will also participate in the Shark Fender Mo.
• 22:05
  We're really excited about this actually.
• 22:07
  Yeah. We are having a webinar together with our lovely colleagues from Fish Pero, Rachel and Lisa.
• 22:14
  Oh, they're so nice, aren't they, ladies?
• 22:16
  You guys are so lucky.
• 22:18
  Yeah, that's true, that's true.
• 22:20
  You're hanging out with the cool kids now.
• 22:22
  Yes, yes, they're brilliant at November 6th we have a webinar about teams using teams and really a hands on practical one and it's really a nice. We are still in the preparations but it's going.
• 22:36
  Yeah, those ladies are very good at doing training. They do the Freedom Scientific webinar over in the state every month and they do a fantastic job.
• 22:43
  Brilliant. And they're really good at. And if you want to. If anybody who is listening wants to register, wants to attend that, you can find information on sightingsound.co.uk I also believe it's on vispero on their upcoming events. So there's lots of places to find out information and there's a link to register as well.
• 23:00
  Yeah. And it's also, to be honest, it was in 2020, it was the start of Blind Guys Jet. That was how it started.
• 23:11
  Yeah. We all came together to do a webina and then I remember talking to Oren afterwards and saying, why don't we do a podcast? And the rest is history, as they say.
• 23:19
  The rest is history. Yeah.
• 23:21
  You did it 109 times already.
• 23:23
  Yeah. And more to come. In a way.
• 23:25
  More to come.
• 23:26
  Absolutely. I want to thank you all guys for this term already of the site, of the podcast and then I think join me and hop on the zipline to Dublin.
• 23:38
  Oh, there he goes, There he goes.
• 23:40
  And look at us now. We are here in Dublin. Hey. And I'm in the pub setting and of course you meet nice people in the pub who are sitting here next to me. Stuart, you're here as well.
• 23:51
  I'm here, Jan, it's great to see you in the flesh with your lovely family. Yeah. We have Chantelle, we have Rosalie, we have Zico, and you have your brother Jade as well.
• 24:01
  Hey, Jade, how are you? Hey, Chantal, how are you?
• 24:06
  Fine, thank you.
• 24:07
  Yay. Good. And Tiko, Rosalie, how are you? Good, good, Rosalie. Yeah, good.
• 24:16
  So, Jan, we have to ask you, how has Dublin been? You've been here two days. What's been like for you?
• 24:21
  I've learned one thing, that we are lucky because we have got nice sunny days, mild temperatures, and not so many rain. So it was excellent. I would say.
• 24:31
  We're absolutely delighted that you've come over. You definitely have brought the weather with you.
• 24:36
  Yep.
• 24:37
  You've been in the lovely village for people outside of Ireland. Listen to the podcast. You've been in Glendalough.
• 24:41
  Yeah, we've been to. Yeah. With the bus driver, and he managed to get out of town due to the marathon.
• 24:49
  Bus driver. Yeah. You were driving the bus yourself.
• 24:51
  Yeah, Chef was applying for a. For the driver's seat. Yeah. But no, he was kicked out to the boot of the. No, not to the wood, but. Well, at the back seat of the. Of the bus. So we were sitting there and. But we had a nice walk there, and it was amazing. We had a nice walk there. Yeah. With the different lakes, the upper lake and the lower lake. Is that true? Yeah, and music in the bus. Oh, yeah. And music in the bus.
• 25:21
  Okay.
• 25:22
  I think it was a Dubliners, but also. And we had some nice. Yeah. Nice evenings and we did some shopping and we went to Trinity College. And of course, we are now here in. In the pub. What is the name of this p.
• 25:39
  So we're in Brannigan's Club on Cathedral street, if anyone knows. It's a nice place. We've been trying some Irish local brood I met there.
• 25:47
  Oh, Harris now.
• 25:50
  Yeah. And we're. We're checking in with our podcast listeners.
• 25:55
  Good. So, yeah, So I would say, you know, we will meet Oren soon in a way, because he is a little bit. Well. Or not well in that way, but we will meet him soon. And then we are going back to the Netherlands on Wednesday again. So.
• 26:14
  So we're back in two weeks.
• 26:16
  Yeah. Yep.
• 26:16
  You're back in two weeks. I may or may not be here. My contract still hasn't arrived in the post. Oh, my God. You can ask a question. Yeah.
• 26:23
  Have you remembered your Irish. Oh, my God. You travel.
• 26:27
  That was back in the episode about Jane's Choice.
• 26:29
  Oh, my God. Where I read a piece from Ulysses.
• 26:32
  That made sure you want to throw up. Yeah, that's right.
• 26:34
  That was the whiskey. Yeah. Oh, my God. Oh, you need to whisper it in again.
• 26:41
  Oh, that's a shame.
• 26:47
  But I'm more into the.
• 26:48
  Okay, well, we leave our listeners as we drink our beer. Jan, we'll catch up with you in two weeks.
• 26:59
  Thanks very much.
• 27:00
  Thanks for listening, everybody. And we keep in touch.
• 27:02
  See you in two weeks time.
• 27:03
  Email us@blind chat gmail.com.
• 27:06
  All right, bye.