Latest / Breakdown Besties | Bollywood Screenwriting Podcast / E29: Your LOVE story needs HATE. Veer-Zaara shows you why
Transcript
- Ananya: I blame Sharukh Khan for the state of Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: my dating life. Akshay: I actually even mapped the hero's journey from Rani Mukherjee's point of view Ananya: the fact that he's old, disheveled and in jail only lands the way it Akshay: Mm-hmm. Ananya: does is because you've seen him young and happy. Akshay: a lot of the conflicts come from the fact that the boy is from India and the girl is from Pakistan. Ananya: it all seems like Shah Rukh Khan is going to do like an extraction of sort, and then he shows up front and center Your thematic character is not Veer, it is Zara. Rain is almost calling in a godly force into your films Akshay: Yeah, Ananya: we have more than 14 years of experience writing for shows like Mismatched, Rana Naidu, Inside Edge, Yearning is an essential... element in all romance films but especially in this romance film which is built on 22 years of yearning Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of the Breakdown Besties Podcast. I'm Ananya. Akshay: I'm Akshay. Ananya: And we are your breakdown besties. Combined, we have more than 14 years of experience writing for shows like Mismatched, Wedding.con, Rana Naidu, Ishq in the Air, Inside Edge, Grahan, and a host of others that have gotten stuck in development help, but will see the light of day one day. With the Breakdown Besties podcast, our goal is to give you a film school experience where what you do is watch some of Bollywood's most phenomenal films, understand what makes them work. And what makes them tick at the scene level, at the dialogue level, at every other level, break it down, take it apart, dissect that all, and then put that together to create your own scripts and phenomenal Bollywood films. The movie that we are gonna be breaking down is an epic, epic romance. One that you know... you grow up on movies like this, Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: and then. Like you see Veer go to jail for twenty-two years for Zara. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: And then you date dudes who say shit like, I am emotionally unwell, and then disappear in a puff of smoke. How are we supposed to reconcile Akshay: And they go still, yeah. Ananya: these two realities? Like Akshay: Well... Ananya: I blame Sharukh Khan for the state of my dating life. Yeah. Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. You should write a book. what was that book? Understanding Shah Rukh Khan. Ananya: Desperately Seeking Shah Rukh. Akshay: You should be like desperately blaming Shah Rukh Khan. Ananya: What are those eyes? What do you mean you'll cry and laugh at the same time and fall deeply in love with me and do exactly what's right for me? Like stop, Akshay: Ha ha ha! Ananya: stop painting my fucking kinks and fantasies at this point, because that's all they are. Okay. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So anyway, the film is Veer-Zaara. Screenplay, story, dialogues, all by Aditya Chopra. And yeah, I have nothing more to add. So other than that little spiel I gave about my dating life, which is everything I have to say about this movie. But going from the art to the craft. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Let's dive right into the log line, shall we? Akshay: Yeah, let's do it. Ananya: What is your log line? Your log line is your film's guiding light, or as we decided in one of our episodes prior, it is your film's helicopter, whatever Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: you want to call it. Essentially, when you're writing your script, you're on page number 56, and you can't see the forest for the trees, you're lost, and you're like, why am I writing this? This is when you get a bird's eye view of the point of your film through the length of your log line. It takes you up and you can see it from a million feet high. Why is a log line so effective at giving you this perspective? Because it contains four essential elements, which every sequence, scene, even strings and lines of dialogue should contain in order to give your film the feel it's supposed to have. What are these four elements? The first is your flaw, limitation, block, or wound. This is essentially a trait within the character, usually a negative trait or a limitation, which is holding them back, which is keeping them trapped in their current life circumstances because of which they haven't progressed or even decided to chase after element number two, which is their goal. The goal is the whole promise of the film, it's the point of it. It's the reason your audience is sitting in their seats because they want to see your character go after a particular goal and achieve it or not achieve it, but still be taken on an interesting journey in the meantime. And how do you create this journey? It is with element number three, which is your main story engine, your conflict. Your conflict is an external manifestation of your internal flaw, block, limitation, or wound. For example, if your limitation is that you're a coward, the external manifestation of that is going to be a lion. You're gonna have to keep facing the lion until you have finally overcome your cowardice and become brave. That lion is your conflict in your path. And then finally, you have stakes. Stakes are what your character will lose should they not achieve their goal. It is not simply not achieving their goal, it is taking it one level lower. Right? Okay, so let me read out my log line of Veer Zaara. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: When an Indian Air Force pilot falls in love with the daughter of a Pakistani politician, he must prepare to face the consequences of chasing after his love for her. I'll state out the four elements. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: The first is your limitation or block in this case, which in Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: Veer's case he is an Indian. Essentially, that is holding him back from achieving his goal, which is chasing after the love of Zara. Akshay: Huh. Huh. Ananya: The conflict is that she is the daughter of a Pakistani politician. So the fact that he's Indian is his limitation and he's going to have to constantly face it in the form of someone from Pakistan. How do you go after them? Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: And the stakes are prepare to face the consequences. We don't know what those consequences are in this log line, right? If I were pitching Akshay: Hmm, yeah. Ananya: this to the studio, it would obviously be a very different log line. This is definitely an internal guiding light. So Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: that there's always an element of, you Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: know, even if he's not gone to jail yet, which he does in the movie. The movie opens like that, of course. But still, you know, you need to constantly hint at the consequences of chasing after her. So whether Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: it's going in a bus to go to Pakistan, whether it Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: is just trying to find her on the day of her engagement. You know, Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: all of this is our consequences. Later, the final consequence is the way it manifests of him going to jail, being put Akshay: Huh. Ananya: into jail. But you need to know that even before he's gone into jail, your stakes have to be totally pushed forward in this manner. But if I were pitching this to a studio, I would obviously open very differently. Like a man, an Indian man goes to jail for 22 years over chasing the love of his life, and he is finally given one shot in a court case to find to redeem his identity, you know, like something like that. You'd be a lot more dramatic. Akshay: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Ananya: Right. But for your writing guidance perspective, I would say that just know that every scene when especially when he's chasing this goal needs to be imbued with stakes of this level. Akshay: And essentially the genre of the film, right? The genre of the film is romance. So your log line has to be in tandem with your genre, right? Like, sure, we're using the court case and everything as a device to like Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: open the story up in a more interesting way. But majority Ananya: Hm. Akshay: chunk of your film is this loving relationship. So it fully tracks with what Ananya: Absolutely. Akshay: you said about the log line. Ananya: Definitely. Cool. Perfect. Let's go into the hero's journey next. Your hero's journey is the structural spine of your film. Whenever anyone, be it a character in your film or you yourself, decide to go achieve a goal, do something new, you embark on this hero's journey. Yes, this is a journey of going after your goal, but essentially it is a journey of transformation. Where you become the person who is able to achieve this goal. It is the process of overcoming the flaw which we have in your log line by facing the conflict repeatedly in order to finally become the person who is able to get what they want to get. And on this journey, you will have many phases. You will meet people who will help you, you will have tests that'll challenge you, you'll have moments when you can't believe you can go any further. You'll almost get what you want and then you lose everything. In life, this happens not so cohesively, up and down. But because your film needs to be a structured, cohesive experience delivered ideally within two to two and a half hours, your audience is expecting a certain ride. And following this codified hero's journey ensures that you take them on this ride. You lift them up, you bring them down, and there are all the loops and swirls that they are expecting on this roller coaster. So let's get into the first phase of your hero's journey. This is your ordinary world. In the ordinary world, you see your characters for who they are and why they haven't been able to achieve their goals so far. You see their flaw, you see where they are, who they are, what are their circumstances, why they are the way they are. In this film, the ordinary world, we see Veer, he is an Air Force Rescue pilot, and you see Zara, you realize that she's a girl from privilege, she's in Pakistan. She is about to be engaged to someone, her grandmom is dying, and her grandmom was originally from India. And she says that, you know, when I die, please go and spread my ashes in India. Then you have the call to action. Your call to action is when your hero is told, Come, come, achieve your goal. You've not done it so far, but now we're giving you a chance to do so. Now, as we analyze this hero's journey, I'm gonna analyze it from the point of view of this relationship, not of one or two characters, because your Akshay: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Ananya: central relationship is well, Veer-Zaara, right? So in this, it is for-- There are, as we've discussed in several films before, several calls to action. Right? Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So your first call to action comes when the bus in which Zara was coming to India falls off the cliff and Veer rescues her. Akshay: Huh. Huh. Ananya: You also have a simultaneous refusal of the call. Refusal is when either you or someone around you says, No, you won't be able to go on this mission, don't do it. Or you yourself, stop yourself from doing it because you doubt your abilities. So over here it happens in the form of his instant attraction of Zara, like goes for a toss when she jeopardizes the rescue mission to go save her bag, which has fallen off her shoulder as they were being pulled up by the rescue helicopter. Then you have another call to action where they see each other at like a trucker's sort of camp where they're both Akshay: The dhaba. Ananya: staying for the night. Yeah. The dhaba, and she says, and Zara explains that those were actually her grandmom's ashes, and she wanted to rescue them. And then the final call to action comes when Zara is boarding a bus to go later on to deeper parts of India, and Veer is on that bus too because he's going home for on break to see his family. And Zara doesn't get a seat on the bus, so she is relegated to the roof. Now, another refusal to the call first comes where we see Zara and he's like, whatever, let her do her thing. Akshay: yeah. Ananya: But then There is no meeting the mentor. Meeting the mentor is when you meet Akshay: No. Yeah. Ananya: someone on your journey who has been where you're going to go and says, Here are the tools to do what you want to do. But in this story, Veer needs no mentor. He has agency. So there is no mentor in this situation. And Veer crosses the threshold by going up to the roof. Crossing the threshold is when you take one decisive action into the new world and say, I am going to pursue my goal. The door behind you shuts. You can't go back into your old world, and you are now going to go ahead. Yes or yes, you don't have a choice. So he goes onto the roof and then he then the whole song starts, yeah, right? That is the whole crossing the threshold sequence where he takes her around, shows her India, all of that. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: Then you have tests, allies, and enemies. This is the phase where you get a lay of the new land. You see what tests and obstacles you're going to face, who your allies are going to be, and who your enemies are. This is when they go and they go to the Gurudvara. They are able to scatter her ashes. And Akshay: I'm Ananya: then Veer says, and Zara's really grateful. So she's like, you know, what can I do for you? He's like, just give me one day of your life. And in this one day of her life, he takes her home, he introduces her to like his family. They celebrate. Lohri, I think, is the Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Lohri, right? Yeah. And he obviously falls in love with her, his family falls in love with her. Zara effects social change by saying by saying Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: that the girls of the village deserve to study too. So Veer's dad then and there decides to open a school for village girls. Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: That and then his dad is just like bruh, I know, Amitabh is we know you're in love with her, stop her from leaving. And the next day, Veer is taking Zara to the train station to drop her so that she can go back to Pakistan, and over there, enter fiance from Pakistan coming to get Zara. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: All of Veer's hopes are dashed, and yet you have the approach to the innermost cave, begin there. Right? Your approach to the innermost cave is when your hero is going to really go after their goal. For example, if the goal is to slay the dragon, they are now going to approach the cave in which the dragon lives. They are going to make the first advance towards it. So over here, as Zara is set to leave, Veer confesses his love to her. Akshay: Fuck. Ananya: And she goes away, like bye, and leaves. But then the approach to the innermost cave continues because as she is going to get married, she realizes that her fiance will never love her in the way that Veer loves her. And he'd die for her, unlike her fiance. So then her maid maid in waiting, what do you call it? Like her Akshay: Ha, hand maiden. Ananya: What's the fancy word for it? Hand maiden? Hand maiden? Ladies maid? Anyway, one of those things. Yeah, she is Shabbo. Akshay: Yeah. Shabbo. Ananya: Yeah, Shabbo is essentially realizes that Zara is truly in love with Veer, and she calls Veer and she's like, Come, come get her. So Veer goes, he quits his job as an Air Force pilot, and he's like, I am going to do what I need to do to go get Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: Zara. And over there on the day of her engagement, he makes himself known. And Zara gives him a hug. That is him approaching his innermost cave. Right? Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Ananya: And then immediately the ordeal begins. The ordeal is when you have slain the dragon, but now the dragon's men, the dragon's Akshay: I'm after you. Ananya: parents, I don't know, everyone is gonna come after you. So this is when Kirron Kher speaks to Veer and she's like, please don't do this. Look, because of the stunt you pulled, my husband is now on his deathbed. So Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: you obviously like cannot marry Zara. And Veer is just like, you think I would have married Zara without asking for your permission and I would never put her in this situation. And then Veer and Zara decide that look, we can't get married because if we do, your dad will die. Of Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: god knows what, but yes. So he's like, okay, cool. This was great. I will remember you forever. Heartbreak scene. He is about to leave. But the ordeal continues. He is then pulled in by some Pakistani police officers and accused of being an agent, a spy, an Indian spy looking for dirt on Pakistan. Akshay: Mm. Ananya: Turns out this is actually the fiance who wants Akshay: Huh. Ananya: to punish Veer for his actions. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So Veer knows that he can take Zara's name and get out of this situation. But that would malign Zara's reputation. I don't know why I'm saying it all like this in this like sarcastic tone, because I really enjoyed it. I really think it's an epic love story. But it's so hard. Yeah. Akshay: It is. Yeah. Ananya: Yeah, I think I'm just a cynic who doesn't believe in love anymore. So. Veer decides not to malign Zara's reputation, obviously, and he says that, okay, I'm a Pakistani spy, put me in jail. His ordeal continues for 22 years until in present day he gets his reward, which is in the shape of the fact that his case has been chosen and Rani Mukherjee has been assigned his lawyer. She is gonna fight for him. The reward is when you eventually get a moment with your prize. You get rewarded for the ordeal you have suffered through so bravely. And this is it in Shah Ruh Khan's case. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: But then you have the way back. You still have to walk your way home. There are going to be thieves trying to steal your reward and everything from you. And you need to fight them. This takes place in the shape of the court case. Where it seems like the odds are completely stacked against Shah Rukh Khan. There is no way to confirm that he is not a spy. And he is stuck essentially. He doesn't know what else to do. So he is at his lowest there. There is no Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: hope for him. That is when Rani Mukherjee decides to go to India and gather physical proof of his identity. And Akshay: Huh. Ananya: over there, who does she find? If not Zara! Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: She finds Zara in the school that Veer's father had started on her asking. And turns out that after she had learned that Veer had supposedly died on the bus back to India, she realized how much she loved him and she couldn't marry this dude. And their engagement broke off, and she went to India, and you know, all of that. Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Ananya: So So Rani Mukherjee brings Zara back to Pakistan and that is Veer and Zara's resurrection. Veer is let out of jail and they then you have the return with the elixir in which they are in their old world but now they are new people, they are together, they finally get to be together. So such Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: a clear hero's journey. I really enjoyed it. I love mapping it. Akshay: Yeah, yeah. I actually even mapped the hero's journey from Rani Mukherjee's point of view because I Ananya: wow, okay. Akshay: thought obviously this Veer and Zara's hero's journey is important because that will give you the whole relationship track but because you're constructing the movie from Rani's point of view like a third person's point of view I thought let's try and see if we can do it and I could map it actually so I quickly Ananya: Mm yeah. Okay. Akshay: run you through it The first is the ordinary world where you realize that Rani Mukherjee's character Samia Siddiqui is a newly graduated lawyer. It's her first case today. She's at her father's grave saying that, wish me luck. Thank you for making me a lawyer. So and so and so. Second is the call to action. Now this is the first time she meets her client which is Shah Rukh Khan's character in jail. So this is her call to action, that this is the goal she is going to pursue. The refusal of the call comes from Shahrukh's character because he refuses to speak to her. So she wants to pursue this goal, but she is told by the world that there is no goal, you can't achieve this and you're not going to pursue this. So refusal happens. Fourth is the meeting the mentor. Again, doesn't have a direct mentor, but her... speech to Shah Rukh that you know my father worked so hard to make me a lawyer, you have to respect that please talk to me and so that like her father sort of became like an inherent mentor for this portion Ananya: Mm. Akshay: because this actually gives Shah Rukh Khan's character the push that okay I can trust her with my story and he starts talking to her that becomes your crossing the threshold because now she is fully in the game, she is going to pursue the goal, There's no way to come back for her. Now, Ananya: Mm. Akshay: everything which is Veer-Zaara's story forms part of your test allies and enemies, which is essentially like she comes to know like what was the story, what was the relationship like, and at same time she also starts forming a bond with Shah Rukh Khan's character, she gets him like laddoos from her own house and It continues till the point where she meets her, what do you call, opponent lawyer. Now we have the approach to the inmost cave where the actual fight for the dragon towards the dragon starts. So this is when your first case begins. And it continues. And the approach to the most cave and ordeal is pretty much in the same case, whereby the end of this ordeal, every witness is against their favor. She doesn't know how to prove him innocent. And in continuing to that, Shah Rukh Khan adds, is no chance you can name Zara's character. So this part Ananya: Mm-hmm. Akshay: becomes part of your ordeal. Now, Ananya: No ideal here. Akshay: she goes to try and find documentation about him from India. And there she discovers Zara. So this becomes your reward. Ananya: Devote. Yeah. Akshay: Now, once she meets Zara and she also sees Shabbo there, she hears Zara's backstory. So essentially what she first did with Veer, now she does that with Zara. So this becomes her road back. She comes Ananya: Hmm. Hmm. Akshay: to know what really happened with her side of the story now. Now, there's a moment where in her journey where like you don't know if she's going to arrive at this case or not. And like it's almost like if she doesn't show up, you're going to lose this case. Ananya: No. Akshay: So you are at the lowest in this journey. And that's Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: when resurrection happens that she turns up Ananya: Mm. Akshay: with Zara essentially proving that this is what my client has done and Ananya: Mm. Akshay: deserves to be free. And the return with the elixir is when she actually wins the case. and they do it in multiple scenes which is like Anupam Kher's character like graciously accepts defeat. He says this was my last case because you've shown me how to ethically fight for cases then I have no moral standing now so I will give up my entire practice and Veer and Zara sort of reunite and she happily sends them off to India. So again very clean hero's journey. I thought Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: this was slightly important because This will give you scene work and this will help you Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: construct screenplay of the films, like Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: more than the story. So I think they both have to go sort of hand in hand. Otherwise, like constructing a film like this can be very tricky. How much you reveal to the lawyer, how much you keep for the audience. Ananya: Mm. Akshay: So it's a safe way to practice this so that like it's... It's a good tool for you to have to construct your screenplay. Ananya: Perfect. Yeah, yeah. Very well done. Yeah. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Cool. Akshay: But again, clean. I like that. It's very clean. Ananya: Clean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Perfect. Let's go into theme next. What is your theme? Your theme is the whole reason you're an artist, you're a writer, you're a filmmaker. It is your unique point of view in the world. It is what you think you want to go climb onto rooftops and scream and say, hey world, listen, what you're doing is wrong. Can we do things this way, please? This is why we're all artists, so that we can scream our point of view through the medium of our art. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: And in our films, it is often posed as a dramatic question because a point of view that is screamed is a point of view that is ignored. A point of view, to be proven, has to be won. It's almost like fighting a court case for it through your film. Through the entire film, you have characters which are for that point of view, you have characters which are against that point of view. And at the end of the day, the choice your protagonist makes, the goal they achieve, they will all tell you whether that point of view is valid or not. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: Now, what does that look like in practical terms? In this film, the theme, the question, the dramatic question that is asked is: how long should one inconvenience and sacrifice themselves for the for their love? For those that they love, right? Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: And the answer is forever. Akshay: Forever. Yeah. Ananya: So I want to talk about thematic scene. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: This is a scene which is pivotal to your films. Where your theme is stated either in not so many words directly. I mean, either in not so many words or directly. Right? Over here, the thematic scene is one with Rani Mukherjee and Sharuk Khan during the ordeal. When she is trying to convince Sharuk that look, you have suffered Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: for 22 years, you know, like just take Zara's name now, you know, tell her story. Say that you came to like take her back because you had fallen in love with her. And free yourself, you know, this will work in your favor. And SRK is like, I didn't suffer for 22 years just to come this far and then out her. My love for her will prevail forever. I was ready to suffer forever since the moment I said that you know I will go to jail. And Akshay: Mm-hmm. Ananya: those I'm not like gonna let those 22 years go to waste. Time has changed nothing about how I feel about Zara. Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: And I want to protect her forever, even if it means inconveniencing myself forever. Akshay: Huh. Huh. Ananya: So I thought that was a very strong declaration of theme. Right? Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: Now I want to talk about a thematic character. Your thematic character is a character that learns this lesson, essentially. It Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: is a character that probably wouldn't have lived this life earlier on. They're probably the character who is on the side of your audience. They're like, "who even does this?!" Akshay: Huh. Ananya: But then through the story, they learn it and they become the most the biggest advocate for your theme. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: Because they have said that, okay, if I can learn this lesson and I didn't believe in this, that means you as an audience can too. You automatically are inclined to believe that this change is a possibility. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: And over here, that character is not Veer, it is Zara. So Zara is someone who doesn't believe that she can have Veer's love. She believes she is too weak. She is essentially being used as a political pawn. There is no saving her. Right? And so she also decides that I'm not going to pursue this. I'm not going to chase after him. I will not. She essentially gives up on her agency or she doesn't find it within herself to find agency. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: But then once she believes that Veer has died, that is when she's just like, damn, like Akshay: Uh-huh. Ananya: this was wrong and he lost his life trying to do what's right by me when Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: he could have chased me. So now I am going to spend the rest of my life trying to fix what I broke, what I didn't have the courage to do and you know, go back to India, fulfill his parents dreams, live with them, stay at the school. Akshay: Mmm. Mmm. Ananya: Now from a practical point of view, I obviously think this is der aaye aur durust bhi nahi aaye. Like, Akshay: Huh. Ananya: this is pointless. Okay, you... What's the point of repenting once the person is dead? He wasn't dead, that's a separate story. But twenty years even, she ended up living in like hell Akshay: Huh. Ananya: because she realized that love is worth inconveniencing yourself for. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: So practical standpoint doesn't stand, but thematically, as a message, I understand it. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: And from Veer's side, he's not a thematic character because you never once question whether he's going to do right by her or not. There is no question. So, Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Ananya: Zaara is your thematic character. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Do you want to go into genre tropes next? Akshay: Yes, let's do genre tropes. Ananya: Okay, the first genre trope I want to talk about is forced proximity or transgressive touch. This is when your characters haven't earned any sort of touch close to each other. But you want to give your audience that spark. You want them to say that, okay, they are going to be touching each other. You want them to get close. So you construct a situation where they will have to do this. Over here, this comes the moment Veer is rescuing Zara. This Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: is their first meeting. It is a transgressive touch where, yes, obviously he's physically close to her and he pulls her up like he's got Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: her on the harness. They're being pulled up, but he moves the hair away from her face and Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: that is not earned, but in the moment he does it and that Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: is transgressive touch. Ideally transgressive touch has to be through a more contrived situation. In this it Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: comes from character that Veer can't help himself because he's looking at her and he's like, my god, so pretty. And he Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: does it. But that is transgressive touch. Akshay: Even one more way of transgressive touch to force proximity in this film was when he has to sit next to her at the top of the bus, right? In the sense that they don't have a seat, now they have to sit at the top of the bus, but they're just close to each other. So another creating a situation Ananya: Yeah Akshay: to propel this trope further. Ananya: Yes, perfect. Yeah. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Another one is your meet cute. Necessary in all though this is a romance film. It's not a rom-com but Akshay: Yeah, yeah. Ananya: because Shah Rukh Khan's character is like initially someone who's... Akshay: Huh. Ananya: takes things very lightly. He is a laughy fun Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: character. It does have a meet cute sense to it. Now, what Akshay: Yeah, yeah. Ananya: is your meet cute? Your meet cute is the first time your two characters meet. And there is something cute, they're attracted to each other, there is fun, is like, you know, like all the nice things, all the good qualities, but there is also conflict. The conflict Akshay: Huh. Ananya: shows the distance between the two characters and the difference between them. It highlights how they're two different people and they get started on the wrong foot. Because Akshay: Huh. Ananya: when they're started off on the wrong foot, then they have a journey to complete towards their romance. Something has to Akshay: Huh. Ananya: go wrong. If they get Akshay: Huh. Ananya: together right from the get-go, you don't have a story. Over here, it is two scenes which are split apart. The Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Ananya: first is when Zara's bag falls as he's rescuing her and Akshay: Huh. Ananya: she wants to retrieve it no matter what. Like, it jeopardizes the rescue mission and Akshay: Yeah Ananya: he's really mad at her. He's like, what do you think you're doing? You know, this is so risky, etc, etc. And he storms away from them. Then later that night, he meets her at the dhaba. And she tells him that look, this bag had my grandmom's ashes and I couldn't let it go. So if you find it in your heart, please forgive me. And Shah Rukh Khan is left like contemplating his harsh reaction. So that is your meet cute. Akshay: Hmm. Good act. Yeah. Ananya: Then I want to talk about this trope which you mentioned in Yeh Jawani, which is common task where Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: the two characters need to essentially do something together. This is again a more contrived situation, which is created organically enough within your story so that they are not doesn't seem contrived where they get together and do a common task. And that essentially provides like a rich field for bonding. It's their bonding ground. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: And over here, it is the whole mission of going and helping the Preity Zinta's character put the ashes in the water. So that mission together is that common task that allows them to spend time together, get to know each other and then fall in love with each other and it also kind of extends later on when Shah Rukh Khan calls her home and they have the Holi celebration something for them to do but the Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: first part really is that it is that trope in action. Akshay: the common task. Yeah, correct. Ananya: Yeah. Then we have also the genre trope of fantasy versus reality. So this is obviously used many times in the film. This is when Zara is getting engaged and all her wedding prep is going on. She is thinking of Vir here, there, he's everywhere, he's coming to get her, but he is nowhere in the picture. He's far away in India while she's in Pakistan. This is created A, to show the distance, how much gap they have to close, how much conflict is yet to be faced, and B, to create the emotion of yearning. Yearning is an essential... element in all romance films but especially in this romance film which is built on yearning 22 years of yearning while being in jail yearning for her. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So yearning is an emotion that has to be underscored in every scene here and reality Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: versus fantasy really does that. And this Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: also happens in another scene later on where Shah Rukh Khan is in court and everything in court is going against him. There is Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: no chance he's going to win. He's going to pushed into a corner. But over there, he is dreaming of him, Zara, in a plane, together. And you're like, damn dude, so far, you're so far from that reality. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: One more romance trope is rain. We've Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: spoken about this in films like Hum Tum, where rain is essentially an emotion amplifier of what your characters Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: are feeling. Sometimes it also works to push them closer. For example, if it's raining and they, you know, crouch under an umbrella. But other than that, if your characters are sad or feeling something strongly, the rain, Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: the sound of rain, the way it's falling, how harsh it's falling, all of that amplifies your emotion. There are ambiental ways of adding to the scene and taking your emotion up to the next level in a way, humans can't. It's kind of like almost nature concurring with you. It's your way of saying Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: that greater forces are aligning to agree or disagree with whatever is going on. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So Rain is almost calling in a godly force into your films and saying there is Akshay: Yeah, yeah Ananya: more to this than just human interaction. So this happens in the film where Veer goes to find Zara in Pakistan and he makes himself known, he makes his presence known to the family. And Zara comes running to him and the two of them finally hug in front of all the family members witnessing and it is raining down hard, coming down. And it is the force of their emotions, it is the force of what the family around them is feeling, it's the gravity of the situation which the rain is trying to convey. Akshay: Hmm, yeah. I have one more trope, which is meeting the parents. Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: It is a romance trope, romance trope where one of the parties would meet the other people's family members and sort of start having a bond with them. You'll come to know about like the other one's childhood. it sort of makes you feel vulnerable early on. Generally in the nature of Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: a relationship, like once you've developed the love and relationship, you'll introduce your family. But the fact of introducing the family earlier is that you can get down and dirty immediately. It's like you'll come to know the ugly Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: side of them, the sides they hide, the side they have like left behind, all of that. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: So in, and it happens a little bit with both of them that he is helping her with her grandmom's ashes so she says also like you come like put your hand when we're doing this because you've earned the right to do that and Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: and now when she goes to meet his family they're very welcoming to her he like she comes to Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: know that he lost his parents very early on in their life they're actually his tawji and taiji so Ananya: Mm-hmm. Akshay: This sort of also creates a sense of connection that, I know you more Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: as a person, and I see you, and yeah, I probably like you in spite of all of this. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: So I remember this example from the movie Friends with Benefits, because he Ananya: Mm-hmm. Akshay: invites her over to come see his family. And there she sees that his father has depression. So like this floozy, flimsy guy who I'm having sex with. But it's actually like he has more layers. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: So, there must be more films, but this came to my mind for meeting your parents. Ananya: Yeah, The Porposal! Sandra Bullock is thrown front and centre into his family like that is the whole yeah and Akshay: Yeah, Emily. Correct. Premise of it. Yeah. Ananya: exactly and what I also think this does this trope is it raises the stakes. So Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: now when you are going to have your ordeal where you're all are going to separate, you're not just losing one connection, you're losing several connections because you've bonded Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: with the family too now. So your heart breaks more. Akshay: For sure, for sure. Ananya: Shall we go into scenes and sequences next? Akshay: Let's do it. Ananya: Great. I want to talk just from the opening sequence. The opening sequence is a happy song where they're in the fields Shah Rukh Khan, Preeti Zinta. You don't even see Preeti Zinta really, or her face. Akshay: Ugh. Ananya: You see Shah Rukh Khan, he's going through the sunflower field, all of that. It's Akshay: Bye Ananya: very happy. And then you, he's young, he's full of life. And you immediately cut after that to Shah Rukh Khan, old, disheveled, in jail. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: And the fact that he's old, disheveled and in jail only lands the way it Akshay: Mm-hmm. Ananya: does is because you've seen him young and happy. Contrast. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Always use it to create change. Use it well, use it smartly, but use it in order to deliver an emotional impact that lands like that. Akshay: Yeah, totally. Ananya: I also want to talk about exposition as a Akshay: Huh. Ananya: technique of giving information. Exposition Akshay: Huh. Ananya: is essentially frowned upon usually because it is giving information that the characters already know which is not real within the world of your film. If your characters already know something they shouldn't be talking about it. But sometimes your audience and your characters are the same level of information or you it is ideal to create a character who doesn't have the same amount of It doesn't have information the same way your audience doesn't. And as you introduce your character to that information, your audience is also acquainted to it without feeling like this is coming out in a very contrived way or inorganic to the characters. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: This is when Shah Rukh Khan is being told that, listen, you're being given this opportunity to like fight your case and be freed from jail. So not only Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Ananya: Shah Rukh Khan receiving the information, the audience is receiving the information too. So it is maintaining that at the same level. Another technique of Akshay: Can I, sorry, stop you because we spoke about this. I had this question which I couldn't figure out why, which was that level of information, like I've always told you, I struggle with this, right? Like I can't Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: decide how much information to give to your characters vis-a-vis to the audience. Now, Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: early on in this movie, we come to know that Zara is gonna get married to somebody else and engaged to somebody else, right? Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: So, that information is told early on. She even tells Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: her mother that you know, I'm not even asking you who I'm getting married to, like I don't care, like you know, but whoever Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: you chose for me, I'm agreeing to do this. But I want to go on this goal of doing the last wish of Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: my grandmother. Now, it's never used as conflict so far in the first half, right? Like it's Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: never like even when she like is with him, she doesn't even realize she likes him or none of those moments happen, right? Ananya: Hmm. Yeah. Akshay: The love and relationship lens is from his point of view. Now, when he comes to drop her to see her off, that's when he comes to know for the first time that, she's engaged to this character, this somebody else. I couldn't grasp why they didn't just tell us that at that time. Like, why did they have to set her character like that where we know she's already engaged to somebody? Because they haven't milked it for conflict. Huh. Ananya: I'll tell you why. Because, see, if it had come there, would be too jarring for us, right, Akshay: Sure, yeah. Ananya: as an audience. But the nature of your film is such is that it's a visual medium, right? So Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: there's always a difference between, like you say in filmmaking, show don't tell. So they have told us that Zara is getting engaged, but they have never shown us anything to do with her engagement. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: So while there is dialogue about it, it's not as strongly established in your brain as a fact. Plus, Akshay: Huh. Ananya: they have shown it in conjunction with her saying that I don't care about this, I'm happy as I am, you know, all of that. So in your head, it has kind of been relegated as a secondary matter because visually it hasn't been cemented. But had Akshay: Hmmmm Ananya: they not set that up at all, you would have felt kind of cheated the way Shah Akshay: Peter. Ananya: Rukh Khan's character feels cheated. But that Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: is the correct emotion for your character but not for your audience. So we Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: have to be like, damn, this is actually a reality. So also when Zara is at the train station, she says that, I kind of forgot that, you know, I was to tell you that I'm engaged. But in this meantime, the audience has also kind of forgotten that she is engaged. Akshay: Mm-hmm. Ananya: So have to get them on the same page to kind of justify Zara not telling him. Because otherwise you'll also be like, okay, how can you forget such a big fact about your life? But if you as an audience have forgotten, how can you question Zara? So I Akshay: date yeah Ananya: think there's a lot of like thought behind that. They must have gone back and forth in just the same way as we have. Akshay: Of course! Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: There's another technique which I just coined while watching this film called trigger mounting. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: So this is when Rani Mukherjee is sitting with Veer in jail for the first time and she's trying Akshay: Mm. Ananya: to get him to talk and he is super stoic, super laconic. He is not willing to say anything. And to finally get him to talk, they have mounted several triggers. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: The first is Rani calling him by his name and not a number. Right? Which is new so it's like okay someone it's new someone caught me by my name I'm a little motivated to answer but he doesn't answer. Then Rani emotionally blackmailing him by saying the story of my father blah blah blah which is I found damn stupid but okay Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: And then I'm like, why are you making this about yourself bro? Like he's just met you. Why would feel sorry for you. Like I'd be like, go away. Like sexism Akshay: Yeah, the mice are in jail man. Yeah Ananya: is not like his top of mind problem right now. Akshay: Yeah, yeah. Ananya: And then finally it's the plane, Air Force plane in the window outside tearing out into the sky like. So all these three things together come to finally make Shah Rukh Khan talk. So this is trigger mounting. So when Akshay: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: you have a character who you really need to break, you need to mount Akshay: Mmm. Ananya: one thing after another after another in a scene in order to break them. Akshay: Hmm, interesting. Ananya: Then I want to talk about the technique of a ticking clock. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: So a ticking clock is a device that you use to create tension. This is said that it is established once and once a time is established in the audience's mind, it's always there at the back of your mind. You can bring attention back to it every so often, but the way the human mind functions is that once you've set a deadline, it is constantly nagging you. It's like when Akshay: Huh. Ananya: you have to catch a plane early, and you've set an alarm but you still keep waking up every one hour to check the time that you haven't missed Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: it. That's the function a ticking clock serves. So over here, there are two very important ticking clocks. Akshay: Mm. Ananya: One is when Zara goes to immerse her grandmom's ashes in India, her dad is not yet home and they say, so you have to come back before that. So that is Akshay: before that. Ananya: your ticking clock. It's a race against the clock. And the second one is when Rani Mukherjee has to go to India to gather proof of Veer's real identity. And there's a week between court cases. So she only Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: has one week to do this. If she doesn't, then they're screwed. So this Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: is automatically like, my God, will they do it? Will they do it? Will they do it? A very easy way of adding tension to your scenes. Akshay: tension yeah even the fact that she's gonna get married soon in the next few days and he Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: and shabbo has to go all the way to like call him he has to come to pakistan all this is the ticking time bomb because she's going to get married the day after tomorrow. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: To do it as fast as you can and hence the whole sequence is like filled with tension again Ananya: Yeah, yeah, exactly. So, I want to talk about the trope of subverting expectations. Now, this is the scene where Shah Rukh Khan has come to Pakistan to take Preity Zinta to India or he wants to marry her, declare his love for her, whatever it is. Now, over here, the way the scene is constructed is that the way the music is, the way it is shot, it all seems like Shah Rukh Khan is going to do like an extraction of sort, the way he's dressed. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: It's like he's trying to blend into the crowd. Something Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: is going to happen there. But instead, after setting up all those expectations, he comes clean and stands in the center and says that, nope, I am going to do this openly. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: And that, sure, it sets up his character, but it's Shah Rukh Khan's character. So, you know, there are no questions there. But... the fact that they played it out as it's almost going to be like the secret extraction and then he shows up front and center completely subverting Akshay: Huh. Ananya: audience expectations. So this keeps things engaging, unpredictable, makes your audience like sit at the edge of their seat wondering, my God, what's going to happen next? Akshay: Huh. Ananya: Right? And saying that, I also want to talk about pushing your character against a wall or making it as difficult for them as possible. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: So when Shah Rukh Khan has to come for Preity Zinta, it is on the day of her engagement. So Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: this creates many conflicts. One, as you said, it's a ticking clock So he has Akshay: Huh. Ananya: to do this within a certain amount of time. B, she is the bride. So all eyes are on her. So it's not going to be easy to take her away. And Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: the third is he is only one man, but there they have two families and friends. How is he going to pull this off? Right? Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: So... That's when you think, my God, he's gonna use his AirForce gills, guiles, wiles, you know, extract her. But instead it is, no, it is, I am gonna stand there clean and do what I have to do. So they've Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: pushed him against the wall and this is how he slithers out of it, by subverting expectations. Akshay: Hmm. Yeah, nice. Ananya: And then I wanna talk about the technique of moral choice. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: Moral choice is a technique where your character essentially has to choose between doing what is easy and doing what is right. And whichever their choices, tells us who they are as a person who because character reveals themselves in hard circumstances. Strength of character in difficult times really reveals who you are. So over here, the most obvious moral choice is Shah Rukh Khan. Should he free himself by, Akshay: Huh. Ananya: you know, ruining Preeti's and as reputation or should he do what is right and suffer the consequences himself. This happens twice. One when he is just put into jail and he has the option of taking Zara's name or suffering forever and he chooses to suffer forever. And the next is in the ordeal where again he is presented with the same choice and he is still the same person and he chooses not to go ahead with this. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Out though, yeah. Ananya: They've also done this for Rani Mukherjee's character when she's arguing with Anupam Kher. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: And he Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: said that, you you wanted to fight for humanitarian causes. And she's just like, look, that guy, I wasn't going to defend like a bad dude. And he's like, lawyers don't care about good or bad. They care about winning. And she's like, no, but I don't. So she could have done what is easy and fought and kept her job. But she did what's right and chose not to fight for, not to defend the perpetrator. And Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: so we establish her character that she's someone who does what is right, not what is easy. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: Strength of character in hard times. Akshay: Yeah, nice. Ananya: And then misdirection. Misdirection is a very important technique as long as it is rooted in logic. It is leading your audience to believe something in one direction which is plausible, which is true, which 100 % could happen. Only to later Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: reveal that it didn't happen that way. Which is Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: also plausible and also true but you want Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: them to believe one so then when you reveal the other one it lands. Right? Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: Over here, is when Shah Rukh Khan is given the choice in the ordeal that just out, you know, Preity Zinta's character. And he's Akshay: Huh. Ananya: like, no, dude, she's been married for 22 years now. I'm sure she has two kids, a 21 year old daughter, a 19 year old son. And he really builds up the story of what her life must be right now, you know, Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: only for us to later see that she's living as a single woman in India. So they have built up that one expectation misdirected you to believe something Akshay: Hello? Ananya: only to later reveal that no, this is not happening again. Maximum emotional impact, creating contrast, keeping it engaging and unpredictable, but still Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: rooted in your logic. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: And finally, I want to talk about two callbacks. A callback is either a piece of dialogue or a visual prop, which is brought up or referenced in one instance and then referenced later on in another instance by the same characters or in one way or a different way, which establishes whether the relationship is the same or different. Over here, one callback is when... there is the anklet of Rani, of Preeti Zanta which as they're crossing the bridge her leg falls into a hole and he removes the anklet and she says you keep it and it's like okay and 22 years later when they meet he returns that pile he still has it that relationship Akshay: Yeah. Yeah. Ananya: of love of keeping things safe for her I will keep you hasn't changed right Akshay: Yeah, sweet. Ananya: and it's very sweet And the second one is of the thread that Kiran Kher Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: gives Shah Rukh Khan. You reference Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: this very well in what do you call it? Rang de Basanti. Yeah. Where it kind of fits Akshay: Changde Basanti. Yeah, the Tavis. Ananya: Amulet. It's culturally rooted. It'll keep you protected. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: And Shah Rukh Khan had that amulet. And at first you almost think it doesn't work. So it's a bit of a misdirection that you think Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: he's going to be safe now, but Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: instead he gets thrown into jail. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: But later on you realize it actually worked because he Akshay: Huh. Ananya: was not on the bus where he would have died. And Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: because it kept him safe all these years, he now gives it to Rani Mukherjee and says this is yours. So it Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: is saying that his relationship essentially with that amulet is the same. That he believes Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: in power, he believes in protection, he believes in hope. His relationship Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: with hope hasn't changed. And that Akshay: Yeah, yeah. Ananya: is what it says very clearly. Let's go into world next. Akshay: Yeah. There is a very interesting choice of where this world is set, which is the backdrop of relations between India and Pakistan. So now we know already, like, there is a constant animosity. It runs like centuries old now almost, which is that not centuries old, decades old, we can say. But we know this like the relations between these two countries are not cordial. And there is a very conscious effort on this filmmaker to prove and to reinstill the information that there can be cordial relations like and because we didn't start from hate. So this doesn't have to lead to hate essentially right. Yash Chopra did come from Lahore. So he has a close bond with this land okay so a lot of the conflicts and smaller moments and like catalysts in the movie come from the fact that the boy is from India and the girl is from Pakistan. Firstly the very premise of the film that is derived from the world that you know how you you think how can a guy from India fall in love with this woman from Pakistan so that's enough conflict for the entire movie the enough story engine but there are lots of smaller moments lot of smaller instances. Indian man in Pakistani jail. Again, the conflict is how will he ever come out of there, right? Now, this Pakistani girl has to come to India to spread ashes of her grandmother. Again, rooted in the world because she comes to know that her grandmother came from India. And this is what essentially her big goal is at the beginning of the film. A Pakistani woman rescued by an Indian Air Force pilot. She says that this is my duty as a Pakistani woman. I'm giving you my promise that whatever you want in return for this, I will do it. So again, Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: the fact that it comes back to like my reputation of my country. So again, this is the backdrop of a lot of the incidents in the film. I have a lot of more like when he gets home and he tells that she is from Pakistan. His father is like, that's so great. You gave me a chance to like host somebody from another country. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: Again, this could have gone the other way around, but it's a conscious choice on the filmmaker Ananya: All right. Akshay: to show this world in a positive light. And but the biggest conflict which comes is that he can be labeled as a spy. So again, very true to the world of what Indian Pakistani relationships are, very casually you can say, yeh toh gaddar hai, yeh toh spy hai. So this is the big world of the film, which is about the relationship between India and Pakistan. So yeah, that's my thing about the world that the movie sails a lot because of the world they have built and the world they're trying to show. Ananya: Hmm. Do you want to go into character creation next? Yeah. I first want to talk about Preeti Zinta's character. Her character is largely introduced to us through the song, Hum Toh Jaise Hai Waise Hi Rahenge. Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: So what I love about that introduction is it essentially sets her up as someone who is a rebel. She doesn't care about other people's expectations, she likes to be herself. And we like characters who like themselves. It entrusts sort of like self-belief that we want to embody in our lives. So great way of creating a character we admire and relate to. Second is she's super playful. We like characters who are playful, who are fun, because they keep things light. You don't like like a negative Nancy all the time. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Then she's also dutiful. She is dutiful in the sense that when her grandmom is dying, she's like what do you need? How can I help you? She takes her to the Gurudwara, all of that. So while she's playful, she also is like someone who cares deeply about the people in her life. But they've not stopped there. They've also deepened her character. While she Akshay: Huh. Ananya: says that I am who I am, I'm not gonna change, blah blah blah, know, like marriage, whatever, who cares about that, I don't care. She says that you know, I am going to get married and my life is going to be futile after that. The one good thing I can do with my life is go to India and, you know, pour my grandmom's ashes in the Ganga and give her soul what she wanted. So that Akshay: Huh. Ananya: shows us that while she has this fun, playful, you know, duty bound girl, she has a depth of thinking. She's not actually this woman who's illusion who lives in her illusions. She actually is very well aware of the reality of her life and her circumstances Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: and that is a solid like character deepening technique to show Akshay: Huh. Ananya: that there is more to her than meets the Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: I also want to talk about Kiran Kher's character in terms of creating a deep character. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: And a deep character, just like we mentioned with Preeti Zenta is one where there's more than meets the eye. And over here, this does meet the eye in the way she does it, but it's also true to a very mum character, you know? So when Preeti Zenta is in India and they're not able to get hold of her, her mum is freaking out. She's like... I am so scared. What have you done? know, sab ko dara ke rakha tha. We have not eaten. I've been crying. You know, typical mom drama. But the moment Preeti Zinta says, you know, I am going and I am going to put these ashes there, her mom says, don't feel scared. Saari Akshay: Move it. Ananya: duaayi mere tumhare saath hai. So Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: that shows that while I am scared, you know, like you be brave, it is the complexity of being a parent that I will take Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: all that fear for you. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: But you have to be brave. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: So another great way of deepening your character by thinking about the different roles they play in their life. She plays the role Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: of a mother. But what is a mother's duty? You know, it is natural Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: for a mother to feel scared. But it is also a mother can't pass that fear down onto the child because that is Akshay: Yeah, yeah. Ananya: not how you want to raise them. So it is holding the duality of emotions, holding these two emotions at the same time that makes her a deep complex character. Akshay: Even later on, Kiran Kher's character does great Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: justice to this because once she comes to know that Shah Rukh Khan has come to see Zaara and all the way from India to Pakistan, she comes to see him in anger, firstly, that Ananya: Hmm. Akshay: what is this? But immediately she starts almost like pleading him that please don't take my daughter away. My Ananya: Yeah. Yeah. Akshay: husband will die if you do that, you know. Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: And when they reconcile she sort of sees the depth Shah Rukh Khan's character carries so she also goes one step forward and says when you go back I will pray for you that nothing happens to you and I'm giving you this amulet, yeah Ananya: And that in every lifetime, Zara Teri Ho. Akshay: yeah imagine like such again Ananya: Yeah. Akshay: such duality that in this life I'm not I don't want that Ananya: Yeah, not in this life, no, because you can't mess this up. But Akshay: Yeah, yeah Ananya: in our next life, I hope that... Yeah. Akshay: Yeah, you do get this and again beautiful moment, right? Like so so layered. I love that. Ananya: And I also but... a little bit like, you know, trying to make herself kind of seem nice. That in this life, I'm sorry, I can't do anything for you. But you know, Akshay: Yeah, yeah Ananya: to redeem myself, no, no, next life, sure, I'll be on your side. But next Akshay: Shot. Ananya: life, if you also have a husband who's dying, then what? I don't believe her. Akshay: She's hoping next let yeah Ananya: it's... lands cinematically, but... Akshay: But again, like... Yeah. Ananya: Of course, it's all there but I'm just like you just want him to think you're a nice woman but you're not. Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: Then another character deepening technique was used with Rani Mukherjee's character. Throughout the film, you see her as very strong, standing up to all the men. You know, even if she's nervous, she's not asking for protection, but she's never like feeling less than, nothing. Akshay: Huh. Ananya: But the night before the court case, she's sitting alone in the courtroom. Akshay: Hmm. Hmm. Ananya: I don't know if that's legal or not, but she is nervously like repeating. all her lines going on, okay, your honor, like, yes, your honor. And you see that, this woman is actually scared, like, it is her Akshay: Hmm. Ananya: first court case, it's, there is more than meets the eye. You Akshay: Yeah. Ananya: know, she's not all strong and I've got this and I'll fight you. She's a little girl who's also scared. Okay, that is all I have on Veer Zara. How about you? Akshay: Yeah, same. That's all I have on Veer Zara. Ananya: Well great, we hope you can go back and watch this epic love story and we hope this epic love finds you in your lifetime. That is meri dua aap sab ke liye. And yeah, Akshay: Yeah. But I hope nobody has to go to jail. Ananya: nobody has to go to But if you have to, like we'll make a movie about you. Write to us from jail. In reverse fan mail. Or like fan mail. Yeah. Like we'll... Akshay: Yeah, yeah, we might not be able to fight your code case, but we can display it. Ananya: Yeah, And you know the drill, we would love to hear from you. We are leaving a pinned comment where you can leave any suggestions that you might have about which movies you might want to break down. And you know, if you have any questions, anything, just leave them down in the comments and we are here for you. And we will see you next week on another episode of the Breakdown Besties podcast. Bye. Akshay: Bye. Akshay Jhunjhunwala: Hi again, bestie. for our next episode, we are breaking down the film Bhavesh Shochi Superhero. Yeah. It's a really fun superhero vigilante film that we're doing for the first time. so yeah, watch the film before the episode comes out so that when we break it down, you're breaking it down along with us. Bye, see you next week.