Latest / The You Project / #1565 Australia's Phantom - Josh Piterman

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#1565 Australia's Phantom - Josh Piterman · The You Project

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I got a grouvers Craig, Anthony Hearper, Tiffany and Cook, Josh,
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Brian Kevin, Patrick Pittman, Tif Cookie. This is I'm feeling
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: a bit of deja vous right now.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Feels what we've been here before, doesn't.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: I feel, I don't know, there's a familiarity about this
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: moment in time really similar.
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: Did I dream this last night? Guys?
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah? You did? You did? Josh? Why do we all?
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: Have we been in the matrix? Are we coming out?
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: What the fuck is going on?
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: Hey, I'm sorry for sending you guys that macro doos
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: of mushrooms in the mail. They really trip things out
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: a bit.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Well, if a little bit of psilocybin and LSD is
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: a great way to get the get the show started
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: now if you're wondering what the fuck we're talking about? Everybody,
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: Josh and Tip and I started about five minutes ago
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: and we had a few tech issues. So this is
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: take two and hopefully it's the last take before we
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: talk to Josh officially. Tiff Good morning.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Good morning Harps Again.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: You've been up since the crack of Sparrow's fart. You
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: told us first time around, what were you doing up
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: so early.
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: I'm all ways up early up really yelling at people
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: and making them live their best lives.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: Mm and punching them in the face with love.
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, precisely.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: Hey, speaking of nothing to our well, hunters and collectors,
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Mark Seymour's hunters, collectors, who's hunters and collectors? Who's just
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: Mark Seymour? Now? For those who've been living under rock.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: His new album is called The Boxer. The Boxer on
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: the front of the album is our very own Tiffany
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: and Cook, Who's who's been very shy and quiet about that?
• 1:50
  Speaker 4: Is the album selling? And how is your star pupil mate?
• 1:53
  Speaker 4: It is selling like hotcakes. I'm trying to find They
• 1:56
  Speaker 4: put up a post the other day and I'm trying
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: to find what it says. There was a quote on it.
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: Let me see, Well, here we go, ready. The Boxer
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: is a fight for love and the finest music of
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: Seymour's career. And that was written in Stack magazine just
• 2:11
  Speaker 4: saying the finest record of his career.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Wow. Do you think that that's because the title song
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: was about you?
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: Most definitely? Could there be any other reason?
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Well, Josh, I think you need to write a song
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: about Tip I think that's the take home message here.
• 2:30
  Speaker 5: Oh mate, I could rifferbout it. I could just get it.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: There's our promo, there's our promo, You're.
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: Welcome promo classic.
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: Sorry, where's is all mine?
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: Josh, don't worry, that's gone.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: It's a boxing thing. I should have gone with. Have
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: a Bissosh, Why why the dick?
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: Joe's terrible, straight up, straight up.
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: Awful.
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: People would be like, remember that the moment that Josh
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: kind of tumbled into obscurity, Remember that when his career
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: came crashing down. I think it was on the You
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: project or some yeah. Yeah, when he said that that
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: horrible thing to that woman who fucking loved it and
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: then used it on her socials as a primer. That
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: definitely is going to be on her Instagram and on
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: her Facebook.
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: Oh god, it's going to go viral. I'm going to
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: go viraly downhill. Yeah. Anyway, if that was terrible, that
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: was my worst songwriting. That's that's what happens when you
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: get a singer who's not a songwriter onto the chap.
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: Do you know what, mate, if we're not allowed to
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: have fun, then I'm fucking hanging it up. And that
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: was having fun.
• 3:53
  Speaker 3: That was pretty fun.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 3:54
  Speaker 3: Also at eleven eleven for our time and you know
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: that's it's a time you make a wish. So maybe
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: that was Tip's squish to get a filthy rendition of
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: a personal song.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there it is. You could. I mean, he might
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: write a stage show about you ors even though he's
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: not a right, he's a singer. Welcome to the show, mate,
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: How are you?
• 4:15
  Speaker 3: I'm extremely well. How are you mate?
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: I'm good. I'm not going to ask the question I
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: asked you first time around. Fuck it, let's just move on.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Where are you today? What state slash suburb city area
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: do we find you in?
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: We find me in Hawthorne of Melbourne, Victoria.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: Oh cool? Is this where you're based? Down here? This
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: is your permanent when you're not traveling the world singing
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: to audiences.
• 4:41
  Speaker 3: This is yeah, where I live with my partner, Georgia
• 4:44
  Speaker 3: and her dog that is now my dog. I'm a
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: step father. Although found dad Argo, who's a beautiful gsp
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: German shorthead pointer and jeez, have you ever come across
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: one of them?
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: I have not, Yes, I think I have. Are they
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: They kind of quite smart dogs?
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: Extremely smart but very vocal. So he joins me for
• 5:14
  Speaker 3: more months. He's doing all that sort of sounds constantly. Yeah,
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: and it's really that he just wants food, he wants
• 5:22
  Speaker 3: to go outside, he wants to have a bone, he
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: wants to take a ship, and he communicates that with words.
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: When you want to when.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: You want to take a ship, do you do similar
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: to your partnerge.
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: The titlet doors open? You don't have to task permission.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Oh god, you missed your calling. Fuck musical theater, do comedy.
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: Dude, Ah sure, sure, I'll throw that in.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, No, I do want to go back
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: a little bit because you said some beautiful stuff before
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: we had our tech issues. So just I mean, obviously,
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: you're a singer, you're part of the ten Tenors, you're
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: in West Side Story, Hairspray, Phantom of the Opera, Lame Is,
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: And as I said to you before we went we
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: went live, you're a big deal. I know you don't
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: think you're a big deal, but tell us my audience
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: a little bit about you personally and professionally to give
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: us a bit of an insight into Josh Pitterman.
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah. When people ask, oh, yes, so who's Josh Pittman,
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: I just hate reeling off my bio because it really
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: doesn't sum me up. So yeah, I just sort of
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: my values are that I'm intensely passionate. I'm a very
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: affectionate person. I have a very big open heart. I'm
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: a sensitive person, so lots of love and that's maybe
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: why I chose to be on stage to share it
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: and receive it. I am very very curious. I'm kind
• 7:02
  Speaker 3: as much as I can possibly be kind, and truth teller,
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: a storyteller, and I think that sort of that sort
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: of sums me up. I'm very disciplined, very dedicated to
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: what I want to create in the world. And yeah,
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: so so storytelling is where I found myself. And whether
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: that's on stage you know, as the Phantom or John
• 7:26
  Speaker 3: Valjohn and Lamers are, or whether that's writing, or whether
• 7:30
  Speaker 3: that's singing concerts, or whether that's doing a podcast or
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: whether whatever that is. I my purpose is to share
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: stories and to give people an opportunity to really feel,
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: you know, that the depths of humanity and that that
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: comes that might be really hardship and uncomfortable feelings. So
• 7:49
  Speaker 3: that might just be to have a laugh, but I
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: want people to feel fully and I want to be
• 7:53
  Speaker 3: a vehicle for that.
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's beautiful, man, seriously, and thanks for being so real, real,
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: honest and vol straight up. It's fantastic. Hey, I'm interested
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: in so my background, which we haven't even spoken, but
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: is in high performance, in sport, in exercise, physiology and
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: blah blah blah and working with teams and athletes and
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: Victoria police and the military a bit. And so I'm
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: really interested in high performance. But also part of that
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: is discipline. And you spoke about you are very disciplined.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: What is the discipline that is required for you to
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: be at the top of your game. What are some
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: of the things that we might not think about that
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: are required for you know, we all know it's more
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: than get on stage and sing because you can sing.
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: What's the ship We might not think about that, the
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: jigsaw puzzle pieces that go into the excellence.
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so great question. And I think if you're operating
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: in high performance on any level, there are so many
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: things that people don't see that a tribute to your success,
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: no matter what the field. So for a musical theater
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: performer who's doing eight shows a week, and I don't
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: know any sport that does game day eight times a week,
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: like it's ludicrous to go out there like that eight
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: times a week. Sure you know what you're doing, And
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: in sport, let's say you don't know what's necessarily coming
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: at you, and you have to be a bit more
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: spontaneous and reactive. But still to be able to perform
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: at that high level in front of thousands of people
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: that time, many times a week, requires a mental fortitude
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: and resilience that's unlike many things. So you need to
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: have your wits about you. In terms of dedicating to routine,
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: and routine for me, I'm going to go with what
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: happens when I finish a show. So go out, finish
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: a show, and I will have a cold shower and
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: wash off that character. Especially when I was playing Phantom.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: Here's such a sort of dark, you know, miserable individual.
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: By the end of it, he's so broken, he's so raw,
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: and I don't want to carry that between the stage,
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: my dressing room and the public who are greeting me
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: at stage door. So a shower to wash that off,
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: and that took me a while to work out that's
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: what I needed, and a bit of a warm down
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: in my dressing room. Vocally, So a warm down for
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: me is, you know, you've gone up singing really high.
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: You want to bring the voice back down to a
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: human level speaking voice, So just humming back down to
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: a normal sort of register. And then go and say
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: today and thank all the people who supported me that
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: night and give them the love that they deserve. Then
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: I go home, and I first thing I do is
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: I normally get a little wheat pack and I heat
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: that up in the microwave, put it around my neck
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: and I start. Then I boil the kettle, and I
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: have a steamer that has a little straw in it
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: that I then steam my voice for a good twenty minutes.
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: Now normally watch some idiot TV like some Seinfeld or something,
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: just something that's got nothing to do with dark, depressing,
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: hard or shit. Then when I wake up, meditate probably
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: the first thing I do when I wake up, and
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: I don't always get that right. Sometimes I'm you know,
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: hop onto an email or social media or whatever. But
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: meditate with in the first half an hour of getting up,
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: do some riding, you know. And then it's about what
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: food goes in and how the body moves. So food
• 11:30
  Speaker 3: plays a huge part in affecting what comes back up.
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: We don't realize it, but everyone has little bits of
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: acid reflux and this and that, and you want to
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: protect that. As a singer, you don't want dairy or
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: acidic foods and stuff that are going to get up
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: and get in the way of you being able to
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: sing properly. So I have a pretty clean diet when
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: I'm performing that many times a week, do some exercise,
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: whether that's yoga or a bit of gym, or just
• 11:53
  Speaker 3: going for a walk and getting some sun or whatever.
• 11:56
  Speaker 3: If it's a mattin a day, I'm in the theater
• 11:58
  Speaker 3: by eleven thirty. If it's an evening performance, I'm in
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: the theater by five o'clock and stretch, warm up again,
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: sing again. I probably would have sung during the day
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: once if it was a late show. Don't need to
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: do that if there's two shows on the one day,
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: and then get out there and do the whole thing
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: again and then rewind. So it's what goes into my
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: mouth vocally, warming out, physical warm up, mental preparation, writing
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: with journaling, getting rid of any toxic thoughts that are
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: in my head. And that's how you roll, and you
• 12:32
  Speaker 3: do it over and over again. Hundreds and hundreds and
• 12:34
  Speaker 3: hundreds of times.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: That is I find that fascinating, Like what I I
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: love the idea that and the awareness that you realize
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: that playing a dark character like that psychological and emotional
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: immersion that you need to go through has a physical consequence, right. Absolutely,
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: your body doesn't know the difference between role playing or
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: belief and what is. You know, if you are truly
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: committed to that character and you're opening some dark doors
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: and you're going down some dark corridors, that that's going
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: to show up on a cellular level.
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: Up and for you to and it has and it right,
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: and I've had to you know, when I first started
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: playing Phantom, after about three months start to lose my voice.
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: I was feeling really dark and depressed at times, and
• 13:35
  Speaker 3: you know, my libido had totally gone, and I'm going,
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: what the fuck is going on? And so I went
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: to the MT and he's like, I don't think this
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: is a vocal issue, mate, I think this is a
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: psychological issue. Would you like to see someone? And I said, sure,
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: I'm such an open book. I think you've got to
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: go into as many conversations as you can with the
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: feeling that your mind could be blown or your mind
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: or something could inform you in a way that you're
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: not aware of. So I went and saw this psych
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: life coach woman. Her name was Jake, and one of
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: the first things we did was a bit of hypno,
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: and she asked me what the nucleus of the character
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: was of the phantom for me, and I said, oh,
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: that's easy. It stems from an abandoned boy and that's
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: my and she said, okay, like just gave me that laugh,
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: like there's going to be something here. And we did
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: a bit of hypno and she took me back to
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: a time where I didn't even realize. It was after
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: school care, and after schoolcare finishes at about five thirty
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: or something or six o'clock, whatever it was. My parents
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: were like forty five minutes late to pick me up,
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: and it was just me there with the guy who
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: runs out aftercare, sitting on a table looking out the
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: window on the road, waiting for my mom and dad
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: to picking up. And I couldn't have felt more abandoned
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: or unbloke in that in that moment, and that's what
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: I was bringing up. And I cried and cried and
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: cried the fuck out of that moment and released that
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: finally after clearly decades, and I never had that same fatigue,
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: libido problem, vocal issues like I was getting everything felt easy.
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: I was struggling to do eight performances a week, and
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: for the maintaining great rest of the season that I performed,
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: I think I missed about three shows and it was
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: because of the mental shit that was going on.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Like we talk about this a lot on this show.
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: You know that nothing operates in isolation. It's not like, oh,
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: there's your body over there, and there's your emotions over there,
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: and there's your mind over there, and you know, but
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: in research and in medicine and health stuff, usually we
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: look at things in isolation. Oh, Western medicine, it's an Yeah,
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: it's an into a good point. It's an integrated system
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: that's fucking great. And so in terms of figuring out,
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: you know, your own protocol, like I finish and then
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: I do I have my shower and it's a cold
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: share And did you have any direction or help or
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: mentoring on that or is that something that you figured
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: out yourself.
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: Some of it was myself and some of it was
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: seeking out you know, the right gurus. And I think
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: we all need, you know, on the hero's journeys of
• 16:31
  Speaker 3: our lives, we all meet a Yoda, or we all
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: meet some multiple people who mentor you in a way.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: So when COVID hit, like i'd seen that woman Jake.
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: But when COVID hit and I was sort of left,
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: you know, searching a little bit because I was out
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: of a job and I was playing the Phantom then
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: in London and sort of going, you know, the rug
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: was pulled under, so to speak. And you know, I
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: wasn't alone. Every the artist was in the same position.
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: But I felt like I hit a pinnacle and it
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: was really shit after those six or seven months going
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: to hell. So I wouldn't say go into the darkest hole,
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: but I was certainly questioning a lot, and I knew
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: there was a descent that needed to happen in some description.
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: And so the two people I sought out was guy
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: called Asher Pacman, who's a close man. He runs something
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: called the Fifth Direction. If we've got north, south, east west,
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: the fifth one is inwards and it's a men's program
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: and it's fantastic and we did some really deep men's work.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: And the other person I saw it out, well, I
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: got linked in with through a mutual friend was Ben Crow,
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: who's a really well known mindset coach, And so I
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: would say that Asher does the sole work and Ben
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: does the mind work, and between the two of them,
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: I mean, I'm probably somewhere in the middle doing the
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: heart work. And they were instrumental in just guiding me
• 18:00
  Speaker 3: and giving me tools and wisdoms that I then would
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: run down the path of what they the path of
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: that we was showing me, you know, or walk down it.
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: But specific things like get into the cold shower. No,
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: I've done plenty of cold therapy and wim Hof stuff
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: for many years. I went, well, I know what that
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: shifts for me, Well, maybe you'll shift it after a show.
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: But other specific things, they were instrumental those men.
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: So I have a really big background working with athletes
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and teams, and a lot of them are very superstitious.
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: Not a lot, but a percentage. I would say ten
• 18:35
  Speaker 1: to twenty percent of athletes that I've worked with somewhere
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: between a little bit superstitious and a lot like they
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: have these non negotiable rituals and if you get in
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: the way of those rituals, you're in trouble. What sort
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: of things are like, well, okay, so I worked at
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: for years. I'll tell you who off air. So I
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: worked at an AFL club for four years, and a
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: bunch of other places, but the one, very well known, famous, famous,
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: famous player, one of the most top ten, most famous
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: players in the history of the AFL. He had this
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: bag that was so fucked it was falling apart. It's stunk.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: It was disgusting, and the club, obviously the club has
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: got an endless supply of new sports bags. He wouldn't
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: he wouldn't use any other bag. He would wear similar.
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: He'd wear the same socks till they were basically just
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: four threads, like especially if he played a great game,
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: then he would want to replicate whatever he did that
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: week the next week. So a lot of them, a
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: lot of them. And yeah, guys, girls, individual athletes, team athletes.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: But anyway, I was wondering if you have any either
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: superstitions or kind of hard and fast protocols other than
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: the you know, the obvious, the warming up and all
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: of that, But is there anything else that you do
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: that gets you in the right place space.
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: No superstitions. I used to be a bit like that,
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: and I worked out that you can confine things and
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: confine and confine them, can fine them so hard that
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: it actually gives you no scope for freedom.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: And I.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: I'm sort of so what's the word academic in a
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: way or analytical? Within my mind and have been for
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: so many years that what I wanted to do was
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: work out how to get out of my mind, not
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: staying in it, and superstitions only add to the mind
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: fuckery for me. So yes, I'm going how do I
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: lead with from a soul point of view? How do
• 21:00
  Speaker 3: I leave from a heart point of view? How do
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: I do the technical work? And that's what I'm doing
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: in preparation for the show, and that's all the technical work.
• 21:07
  Speaker 3: And then you go, all right, accept as much as
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: I've done except where I'm at, and go out and
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: celebrate what I'm doing. And let's go out and share
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: with the audience. And you know, I'm the tour guy.
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: Go out and take them on a sick as fuck
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: tour through the life of Jean Valjean or the Pantom's
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: That's that's what I'm doing. It's got to be free
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: within the confines of the direction of the show. So
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: I don't make the super decision.
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well that makes sense because in some ways, if
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: there are really hard, fast, non negotiable, emotion based rituals,
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: and it's almost like you're building yourself in a prison,
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: you know, or an addiction, because if the conditions aren't perfect,
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: you're fucked. But in reality, you need to be adaptable
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: and flexible, right, otherwise we all do.
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's physical things that are sort of non
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: negotial For me, I do that that's serious of stretches.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: I do that series of warm ups and whatever, and
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: also acknowledge that, you know, show six or seven of
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: the week, my voice isn't going to feel the same
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: as show one.
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just not.
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: It hasn't had a day off, and it's fucking tired,
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: and it's just trying to get through. So yeah, there's
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: got to be a lot of self compassion in this
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: game too, of going you know what I'm and it's
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: taken me a long time to learn it. Jean Valjean
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: was a great role for learning it because it's so
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: impossible to get it perfect that the idea of perfectionism
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: took me a long time to leave my system as
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: much as possible. Obviously, there's that inner critic that's always
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: saying it be perfectly, be perfect, your little bitch. But
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: that's how he speaks. He's always got a very style
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: American accent, and so just you know, allowing the compassionate
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: side of myself to let them go. You know what,
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: they don't know what you're perfec fifties out there. They
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: they're going to accept your eighty percent or your seventy
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: five percent if you can give one hundred percent of
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: that seventy five or eighty percent, And that's what you've
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: got to give. But that's what you've got to give. Like,
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: that's it.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: Like either way, you're in a critic sounds like a
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: gangster from a nineteen thirties movie. But it's fun. He'p
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: be shit, do better, do better, better, get up? Fuck,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: you'll do it better. So you are also were in Cats,
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: for which you won a Green Room Award. Congratulations made.
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: I'm never doing that show again, never ever going to
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: be in a onesie like or unitard ever again. We're
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: just oh as much as fun as some things were.
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: That's that show. Lee's is sweaty and stinky.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what about what did you do when you're wearing
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: the licra the one piece and I'm disappointed you're not
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: wearing it today.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: But how did you do it?
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: What did you do with the package? Uh?
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: What package? Mate? Let's be honest, you know, like really
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: did you just pack it all? So you wear dance
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: you wear dance support, which is the nice way of
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: saying you're wearing a g string that holds everything together?
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: Does it?
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: Though?
• 24:24
  Speaker 3: It does? It does enough? I mean, these things are
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: worn in the ballet, and if they're worn in the ballet,
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: you know the best, the best of keeping everything attack.
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: So if they are when I'm running around being a
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: cat then and honestly, as fun as it was, there
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: were really fun times. There were times that you're literally
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: on stage. There's one song where it's actually about dogs,
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: and so you put like a big top giant shoe
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: on your head and you're sort of doing things to
• 24:53
  Speaker 3: make your cat like a dog because it's all based
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: in a junkyard and you're just going, I'm a human
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: getting paid to be dressed up as a cat. Who's
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: been dressed up as a dog?
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: What are you finding a dog?
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: What is my Wednesday afternoon? Like? How did this become
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: my Wednesday afternoon?
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: Or even better. People pay me for this. This is
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: fucking great.
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: Maybe, and then you do get hit with that you're like,
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: what am I doing? Oh tomorrow is Thursday? That's pay day?
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: But there were times was awesome and I did win
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: an award for it, and it was because you know, really,
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: cats for me is like, yes, it's got some sort
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: of storyline, but it's I sort of treat it as
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: like cats doing idol, like pop idol or Australian idol,
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: and they're all just going out there with their best song,
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: right or what they've gotten. So my character sort of
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: had twenty minutes at the top of act two is
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: actually the oldest cat there. So for the rest of
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: it I was in the ensemble, and then at the
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: interval I turned into this sort of old cat and
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: they remake up me, and so do all my old acting,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: and I love doing that. I love transforming into interesting characters.
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: And he was a cat who wanted to be I mean,
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: it's a human who wanted to be a star in
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: the theater and sort of regales about all his wonderful
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: things he's done, but he's really never made it. And
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: it's those people who who tell you about you know
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: Regale for half an hour about you know, the Frankston
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: art Player's version of My Fair Lady where they played
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: Henry Higgins and you know, so it's that sort of
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: thing and he could have been the greatest of all
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: time and that that sort of thing. But it's it's
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: Ian McKellen, who's a famous British actor. Played it as
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: in No Show, not Bush as in Gandolf. Yes play
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: he played in the movie. And it's a beautiful role
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: to play, a really beautiful role to play. So I enjoyed.
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: I really enjoyed that part of it, yeah, because it
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: was so transformative, Like I was twenty nine when I
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: did it, so to player that sort of eyeing old
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: man effectively was beautiful.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: If have you ever seen it?
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: No, I haven't. I'm homework now.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: I reckon You and I might be the only two
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: people in Australia. Everyone I know has seen it, so
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: you and I are shit.
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: It is amazing, Like to watch the physical form of
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: a human being transform into a cat and then dance
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: like that. It's sort of amazing, But then you're going
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: what the hell is going on up there? As well?
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: Because it sort of the sense of plot is sort
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: of mysterious, and really it comes down to like pop
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: idol song choice and the one who's and sob story.
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: So the one who's got the darkest, hardest past also
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: has the best song and she wins.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, and winning.
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: Means you go up to what's called the heavy side layer,
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: which is where a cat gets another life, you know,
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: the whole nine life thing. Somewhere. There's a plot, but
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: it's pretty it's pretty loose. I don't know, Andreiloid Webber,
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: they were all on one. I'm reckon when they were
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: doing that.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: Can you dance?
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: Bro? I've trained that out of myself.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: No.
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: I was never a great dancer, let's be honest. I've
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: had to in different things. Cats a little bit. I've
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: had to tap a little bit. But singing and acting
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: were my things at college and and dancing was always
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: a third. And you know, you work it up physically,
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: you work up your flexibility. Some of it has learnt
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: skill with a bit of innate movement. I don't know,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: but I wasn't never a dancer. Can you dance?
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's probably my best thing. Yeah yeah, okay,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: Hips don't yeah, hips don't lie. I mean me and Curry.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: You know, just so we've got you've got.
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: The terms, Tiff, what about you?
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: No, no, only in the boxing ring, mate, I dance
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: in the boxing ring, that is.
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: Eat yeah, yeah, like a butterfly. Well that's it. Yeah,
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: but you've got to be sort of like I think so.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: I thought so.
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: And once I went and did hip hop Class's absolute beginner,
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: and within four steps of instruction, I was seeding at
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: the back, not moving and just so angry that even
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: the instructor want to make eye contact with me. So
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: it didn't translate, okay, like doing the like create the
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: box and then duck under it side of thing.
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: I have a theory. And I was talking to somebody
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: about this recently because the new Dancing with the Stars
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: in Melbourne, I guess around Australia is coming on and
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: Ben Cousins and another Ben Cousins ex West Coast Eagle
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: footballer and Richmond Football Club fuller, footballer, Brownlie medalist, fucking
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: superstar and another football whose name escares me. But I
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: was talking to someone and they went out. They'll probably
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: be great, you know, because I go No, it's funny,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: how like Tiff is very coordinated as a boxer, very coordinated, skilled, power,
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: speed of jill, the coordination balance, but how much that
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: doesn't translate to our dance, Like there are so many
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: athletes who are fucking horrible dancers because they can't feel
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: the music. And it's a different kind of movement.
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: Right, yeah, because there's art in it, and that's the
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: missing that you can have all the athletic profile, but
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: it's actually the artistry and feeling music and that there's
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: a lot of isolation that's technical to dancing like you are.
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: You know, you look at popping and moping guys and
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: they're all isolating stuff, but when you're dancing jazz and like,
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: it's just another craft altogether, so it doesn't translate. And
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: so like you look at a male ballet dancer or
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: a ballerina and they are so flexible and they can
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: jump so high, but that doesn't mean they're going to
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: take mark of the year. You know, Like there's a
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: whole other craft there, so you know, yeah, yeah.
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: It's very sports slash art slash skills specifics. I get, Hey,
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: speaking of cats, did you ever see that this is
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: going to seem like a stretch at first? But I'll
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: bring it back. Did you ever see that ted talk
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: by Sir Ken Robertson Robinson called our schools killing creativity?
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: Did you ever see that talk?
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: No? But they are at times.
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: So I'm not trying to throw schools or teachers under
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: the bus. But anyway, there was this brilliant talk. It's
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: one of the most watched fewed Sir Ken Robinson, who
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: was a British academic, brilliant but also funny as fuck,
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: which is rare for an academic. Anyway, he did that
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: talk and in that talk he told this story about
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: Gillian Lynn, who you know who that is?
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she was our choreographer, that's right. So the genius
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: like that coats.
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: So they spoke. He told this story about how when
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: she was a young girl, the parents were called in.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: The teachers called the parents in, and this like specialist
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: because they thought that their daughter, they thought that this student.
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: So the parents' daughter was kind of special needs for
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: one of a better term, intellectually handicapped. And they sat
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: down they're all talking, and the guy who was like
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: the specialist, ed specialist or whatever, he said, do you
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: mind if we all get out of this room. So
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: they got out of the room and he put on
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: what was then the radio and he just put on
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: some music which was in this office, and they all
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: got out into the hallway or that, yeah, and they
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: could see through the window. And as soon as they
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: got out and they were talking in the hallway, Jillian
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: Lynn got out of the chest. She's like five or
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: six years old, and she started dancing, and the special
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: ads guy said, she's not handicapped. She's a dancer, right,
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: And that was like, so even though she was academically
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: challenged in some ways, or she didn't have that kind
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: of not that she was clearly not that she was
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: lacking intelligence, but she wasn't. She didn't excel at that,
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: but obviously she ended up being not only was she
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: not handicapped, she was literally a genius who did some
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: incredible shit. How amazing is that story.
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: That's a beautiful story. And I know that story very
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: very well, so smiling all the way through it because
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: having you tell it is really special because I know
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: that's not a story that's mainstream. It's also not a
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: story that sits in the world of sports and high
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: performance sport a lot. But the fact that you've done
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: some research and found that story, I love that and
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: it makes me think of that great Einstein couoe that
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: I'll paraphrase, which is that everyone's a genius, but if
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: you're trying to a pitch of goldfish how to climb trees,
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: it'll spend its whole life thinking it's a full And
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: we don't have a system that is about exploring the
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: unique gift or the unique get genius withinside a young
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: person and then helping them expand that unique gift or
• 34:18
  Speaker 3: that genius. That's not the system. The system, although it's
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: getting better, and I've spoken to different principles of different
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: colleges or whatever in the recent recent past, you know,
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: we still have a system that says that there's four
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: digits at the end of year twelve that you need
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: to try and get the highest ones, and that's that's it.
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: And subjects like theater or drama or dance are actually
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: marked down. They're saying, hey, you know they're easy, so
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: we're going to mark them down. But you try and
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: get that physics specialist, maths major person you know reciting
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: in Shakespeare in monol or doing a jazz ballet routine.
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: They don't know how to do it, so yes, like
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: and similarly that ballet dancer, that beautiful actor may not,
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: you know, be able to land that physics equation, but
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: that's it doesn't make them smarter or dumb. It just
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: makes them unique and different. We should be exploring that
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: uniqueness within every individual and trying to expand that as
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: much as possible. But you know, yeah, or whatever, the
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: system doesn't like it, Does it create lemmings? Does it?
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: No? Definitely not, definitely not. I put up a post
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: recently you like this on on Instagram and there's a
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: couple of slides. First slide is what are the following
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: people have in common?
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: So?
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: Albert Einstein, Leonardo da Vinci, Richard Brandtson, Tom Cruise, Steven Spielberg,
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: Orlando Bloom, Jamie Oliver, Pablo Picasso, Sr. Salmahayak, John Lennon.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: What do you reckon they all have in common?
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: I reckon that they all didn't finish fun of your school.
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: They're all dyslexic, all dyslexic.
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, how wonderful, how amazing, how wonderful.
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: And listen to this, Josh. In an attempt to learn
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: more about the minds of millionaires, a team of psychologists
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: and business experts spend a day testing a group of
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: entrepreneurial millionaires. They were put through a series of tests,
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: and forty percent of the three hundred millionaires who participated
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: in the comprehensive study had been diagnosed with dyslexia. That's like,
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: in other words, if you want to succeed hocking, be dyslexic,
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: you're actually smarter, not dumber.
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And we confine those people into a certain philosophy
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: about how we feel or think, and we treat them
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: in a certain way as we do. You know, people
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: of all sort of neurodiverse I don't call them issues
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: standing and I mean, yeah, I just think we've got
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: so far to go as a as a human species,
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: so far to go.
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: I think we're getting better, We're getting better. But I'm
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: with you, and it's like understanding that I think. Like
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: I was doing a gig recently and someone asked me about,
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: you know, essentially about intelligence, and I said, intelligence isn't
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: a thing. It's many things, and it's context. You put
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: me in some rooms, I'm pretty smart, you put me
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: in other rooms. I'm a fucking idiot, right.
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: You know all of us?
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, you get me to try and do certain
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: tasks or skills I'm a one out of ten. Right,
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: you get somebody with an IQ of three hundred, which
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: doesn't he let's say an IQ of one p fifty
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: to try and have an organic conversation on a podcast
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: with a stranger. They might really struggle. They might not,
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: but a lot might. You know, when I first started
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: my PhD, trying to read an academic paper, it was
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: like reading fucking German, Russian and something like. I had
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: no idea what was going on. But I'm not dumb,
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: but I just couldn't do it. I'm like, who writes
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: like this? This is fucking incomprehensible. But three, four, five
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: years down the track, you're like, okay, you just learn
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: another language. But many times in my life I've felt
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: like a fucking idiot.
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: And there's only times we felt like an absolute genius.
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: How far into your PhDa or you've done?
• 38:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: No, no, I've got about six months to go so
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: this doctor, Oh yeah, doctor Fatty Harps, So November one
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: will be five years.
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: Wow, I'm about six, I think, Yeah.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: It takes a while. It depends what you're doing. I'm
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: doing neuropsychology, so it's not like I'm doing a PhD
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: in sampit or plasticcene. So there's a bit of work
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: in there.
• 39:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Wow, now that that is super super interesting. What
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: is the part of neuropsychology and just neuroscience in a
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: way that interests you the most? Like what is it
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: about the human mind and how that plays out that
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: interests you the most?
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: So many things, but you know, and I apologize to
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: my listeners. I get a few listeners, go fact, stop
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: talking about the same shit. But it's hard when you
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: have a conversation with a new person who doesn't know you.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: But for me, understanding the potential possibility and powers of
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: our power of our mind and realizing that your mind
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: is essentially your operational headquarters, like it's u HQ and
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: your mind is the filter through which you view, understand
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: and process the world. Right, So you know, you, me
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: and Tiff are in the same podcast at the same time,
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: but we're not in the same experience. So I'm interested
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: in where does that experience come from. Is it possible
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: that Josh is having a good time, TIFFs having a
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: bad time, and Craig somewhere in the middle, And the
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: answer is yes, And then it's like, what is that about?
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: So understanding the mind and understanding not just that mind,
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: but my mind in comparison to yours or TIFFs. And
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: then so my PhD is on a thing called metaperception,
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: which is really my ability to understand how you experience
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: me in real time. So that's the question at the
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: core of my research is what's the Craig experience like
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: for Josh or Tiff or my audience. And if you
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: wind that back one level, then you go, what's the
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: Josh experience like me trying to understand your version of
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: right now? So that's called theory of mind. Now, if
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: I can understand or at least have an insight into
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: your in the moment, right now experience, that is a
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: kind of social emotional awareness intelligence. If I can understand you,
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: then I can connect with you. I can develop rapport
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: and trust and respect with you because I get you.
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: But if I've got a high IQ but a low
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: social and or emotional intelligence, I might be saying things
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: that are technically true while creating more disconnection than connection
• 41:25
  Speaker 1: with you and not even knowing it exactly.
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: And so how much do you feel of that connection
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: is pure mind related and how much of it is
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: for want of a better term, beyond the space in
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: which the mind lives. And I'll give you a sort
• 41:48
  Speaker 3: of indigenous Australian expression is that we actually have three brains,
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: and that's down here in the gut the brain and
• 42:00
  Speaker 3: of intuition. Yeah, And here in the heart the brain
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: of passion and an emotional biplane of love and whatever,
• 42:10
  Speaker 3: and here the brain of analysis. And how much is
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: that capacity being able to tap into those different parts
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: because we don't you know, we don't say things like
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: I love them with all my heart or I had
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: a gut feeling without that stemming from an actual Like
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: those cliche phrases a cliche for a reason, they stem
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: from a certain level of truth in a paradigm that
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: people might understand if they're willing to understand.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the end, Well, I don't know. I can't give
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: you a percentage, but I'm with you. I think that
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: that intelligence lives not only in the heart and the
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: gut bio microbiome, and of course the mind slash brain,
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: but our body is its own form of intelligent So, yeah,
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: that is a really great question because sometimes that you know,
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: sometimes our thinking is the gift and sometimes our thinking
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: is the problem. Right, So you can think yourself into
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: better health. Literally, there's vast research on place ebos. You
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: can also think yourself into immune systems suppression and illness.
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: In fact, funny you bring this up because I'm doing
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: a podcast on it soon. But you know, like, think
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: about this the moment that you have a negative thought.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: Let's say you're thinking something bad, but the bad thing
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: that you're thinking isn't actually going to happen, and so
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: it's not true. It's just a construct of your mind,
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: but you're thinking about it. So your mind is there. Now,
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: your emotions are there because you're feeling fear and anxiety,
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: and now your body is there right, So now it's
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: a full kind of Josh experience that self created. That also,
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: by the way, is unnecessary because now there is no
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: threat danger and your safe, but your body doesn't know that,
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: So your body will produce qurtizole, adrenaline, bunch of other things.
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: Quartzole is what we call a catabolic hormone, not an
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: anabolic hormone. It breaks things down, so it creates inflammation,
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: It destroys muscle over time, it suppresses immune system function,
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: it impacts cognition. Now all now this is just one
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: little component this is just one fucking factor. So for me,
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: and I've still got mail plates on despite the fact
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: that I'm five years into a PhD. Of all there
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: is to know, You know, if the ocean is the knowledge,
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: then I understand a drop of water, right, But fucking
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: fascinated with essentially what you just asked. And the truth
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: is nobody in the world really knows. Like we have
• 44:54
  Speaker 1: insights and snicklets, but to go, it's this much this,
• 44:58
  Speaker 1: and that's that much that. But and there's also that
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: you know what what like think about? And I know
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: we're digressing, and I'll shut up after this, but I
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: think you'll be on board. How the fuck do dogs
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: know how to do the shit they do? And cats?
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: And like, it's not like anyone taught them. You know,
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: when a dog's sick it goes and finds certain stuff
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: or a cat? Is that a cat or a dog?
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: I should know. I did the fucking musical.
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: But animals, animals do stuff that instinctively they just know
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: to do right, so that it's not like they thought critically,
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: they made a decision, they did some research, and they
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: arrived at this conclusion.
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, your dog will smell your cancer before you even
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: know you had hun't upset.
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: And so I believe that humans are animals. Yes, we're
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: slightly more evolved, maybe maybe not, maybe not. I think
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: octopus and fucking dolphins have got us covered, and dogs,
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: But anyway, we think we're the smartest species. I'll put
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: an asterisk there. But I also think that over the
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: last one hundred or two hundred years, we have really
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: disconnected from that innate wisdom. Yes, and we're too intellectual
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: and not instinctive and organic enough.
• 46:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And that has a lot to do with what
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: I'm talking about earlier, about the education systems, about applauding
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: or beatifying one variance of intelligence and diminishing another, and
• 46:28
  Speaker 3: going to all sorts of reasons why. But I think
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: that's a big part of it, because as an artist,
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: I am, as I said earlier, I'm constantly trying to
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: get out of here because I don't need the analysis.
• 46:39
  Speaker 3: The analysis and the technical work is done. Now let
• 46:43
  Speaker 3: go of that and lead with the heart, or lead
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: with the gut instinct, or lead from a soul place,
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: or go into the depths of the feelings of the banker,
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: feelings and emotions and experiences I've had and recreate a
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: version of them to enable another to feel. That doesn't
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: require me to analyze, that just requires me to be
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: open and free enough to let that out. On your
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: conversation about the catastrophic nature of the mind and how
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: that produces cortisol and whatever, this is certainly something I'd
• 47:18
  Speaker 3: experienced a lot, and why I started meditating ten years
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: ago was really to sort of help me with my
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: incessant anxiety. But what I realized was that, hold up,
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: I've just got so much power here if I learn
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: the art of sitting in my awareness or consciousness or
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: whatever it is and being able to see those thoughts
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: play out like a movie in front of me and go,
• 47:46
  Speaker 3: you know what, I don't need to go down that path.
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: I can stop that that thought might come out, because
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: I've got fucking sixty thousand of them a day. But
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: how where I choose to take that or what path
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: I choose to go down, is actually up to me.
• 47:58
  Speaker 3: Like my awareness is my home, and any thoughts, feelings, emotions,
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: or whatever are just visitors that come and then I
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: get to kick them out when I want to kick
• 48:10
  Speaker 3: him out. They don't have to stay overnight. So that's
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: so that is something. That's why I am such a
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: big advocate for people meditating and people going I'm doing
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: breath work instand I'm like, sure that breath work is
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: might have a more immediate effect, but we have a
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: society obsessed with immediacy. Meditation is a discipline and a practice,
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: and it's a practice to expanding your sense of self
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: awareness and that once you've and that's unending, but once
• 48:39
  Speaker 3: you have a capacity to sit in that space, that
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: need for that breath work to shift that thing really
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: quickly may not be there as much because you actually
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: didn't get to a space where you were so unnecessarily
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: anxious about shit that didn't you didn't need to be
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: anxious about because it was just a project of your
• 49:00
  Speaker 3: future negative self.
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So for meditation. The other thing I want to discuss,
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: because you know, I'm really into the topic you're talking
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: about about this different experience that we had, is the
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: idea of coalescence or symbiosis or the shared experience that
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: we're all having, Like, could you talk a bit about that.
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to pick your brain because I think
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: it's interesting. Well, I mean, there's the there's a oneness too,
• 49:28
  Speaker 3: there must be a oneness in the separation. There must
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: be a juxtaposition to the separation.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: Well even right now we us three are not in
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: the same place, but there's an energetic commonality. There's an
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: energetic exchange, right, So there's separation, but there's there's inclusion.
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: And separation is like a mirage really, you know, because
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: we think things are all physical. So there's stuff happening,
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: you know, and and stuff is, but it isn't, you know,
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: So there's this It can be a deep level of psychological, sociological, emotional,
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: and energetic connection even when people are not in the
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: same place.
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: You know, and people or people and.
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: I believe I believe people in nature. I believe people
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: and animals. I truly believe that.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: And the like we are, I mean, we are nature,
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: but society has taught us that we're separate from but
• 50:25
  Speaker 3: we are nature like because.
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't have to go to nature because you
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: are nature, but you can, you can go back to
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: where you're from. And you know, it's like we all
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: end up in the ground, and we all end up
• 50:39
  Speaker 1: becoming the fucking ground. You know. You put me in
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: a box in the ground and you come back in
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: one hundred years, I will be the ground.
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 50:47
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it's it's a circle and a cycle. But
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: you know, you think about this, like somebody like Tiff,
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: I love dogs. Tiff loves dogs. You love dogs. We
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: know that if you are a dog lover and you
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: lie on the floor with your dog, that is doing
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: good things to your body. You don't even have to
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: think about it. You don't even have to be strategic
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: about it. You don't even have to know that it's
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: going on or understand it. But it's actually producing biochemical
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: changes in your body that are good for your brain,
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: good for your heart, good for your immune system. And
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: it's also good for the dog because the dog loves you. Right,
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: So there's all this awesome shit happening all the time.
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: But so too we need to be and this is
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: the self awareness piece. So somebody who hates dogs who
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: does the same thing will have a negative physiological consequence.
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: So like, for example, I've been riding motorbikes since I
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: was five. I've never stopped. I have four motorbikes I ride.
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: Most of my communing is on a bike. I can
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: be on the front of a motorbike having the best time,
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: and my body is in a good state biochemically, and
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: I'm producing dopamine and all these great fucking things. Somebody
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: who is on the back for the first time. So
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: same bike, same day, same trip, but having the worst
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: experience literally of all time. But it's not about the
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: bike or the trip, or it's about what that represents
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: to you. It's about your thinking about that. It's about
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: your interaction. It's about that interaction between you and that stimulus.
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: You know, an idea that the next level, you should
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: do it this.
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: Way, or you should do it you know what, you
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: know what would work for you doing it? Like doing
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: it basically say doing what I do.
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: It's never right, that's that's right. I mean if you
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: took if you said to me and Tiff, because we're
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: quite similar, Hey, I'm going to take you guys through
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: a ten minutes meditation, she'd be punching you in the
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: face at about two minutes. Hey, and all that.
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: I'm under weekly meditations, bro, and tonight is the night.
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: That's right. I forgot. But until recently you couldn't cope.
• 53:03
  Speaker 4: Right, I do struggle. I need to be, but I
• 53:06
  Speaker 4: need to be in that shared environment. Brings you back
• 53:08
  Speaker 4: to what Josh said, before. There's an energy inside that
• 53:12
  Speaker 4: room when everybody's in that and I access that really deeply.
• 53:20
  Speaker 1: Will you come back, yeah, because we've got to wind up,
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: but I don't want to wind up. But I feel
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: like I've got two hours left with you.
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I know. Maybe we just need to hang out,
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: or we can flip it and you can come on
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: my potty.
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: Well I wanted to plug because you've got a potty,
• 53:38
  Speaker 1: a new one, brand new everyone called behind the mask yep,
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: So tune into that, subscribe to that, give him a
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: little bit of love, give him some support. Will you
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: have forgot guys? Exactly three listeners, give him that chop out.
• 53:54
  Speaker 3: Deep dive deep dive chats like this. But basically there's
• 53:56
  Speaker 3: always a two on one experience. So two people from
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: the sack to what we're talking about now, two people
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: from the same field with that's sports, arts, politics, journalism,
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: whatever it is, who have a very different experience or
• 54:08
  Speaker 3: have very different experience of living in that field and
• 54:11
  Speaker 3: what's behind the mask that they project out into the
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: world of their careers and what's actually going on inside
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: of inside of them. So there's probably similarities between what
• 54:20
  Speaker 3: we're on the past that we've gone down today and
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: some of the stuff are behind the mask.
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that? All right? How can people find you?
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: Follow you, connect with you my friend?
• 54:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, at Josh Pittman on Instagram is the easiest place.
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: One T and one N in Pittman and you can
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: listen to all sorts of songs and some any links
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: and stuff to behind the Mask are also in there.
• 54:42
  Speaker 3: So I reckon that's the easiest place. Wowan you so
• 54:47
  Speaker 3: much for having me on. What a fucking great chat?
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: Hey make Can we be friends?
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah? You're in Melbourne, aren't you? Yeah, yeah, let's do it.
• 54:55
  Speaker 3: I think we need to have a lunch mate. I
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: feel like it's only a again, what's that Conway's?
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: Is that Chrissy Vines or I don't know who the
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: fuck that is? But yeah, all right, this is the
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: start of something beautiful and Tiff you need to get
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: him on your show as well.
• 55:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, and quickly.
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: Can we thank mister Tommy Jacket for bringing us all
• 55:18
  Speaker 3: together and jackim Bug because great people bring people together
• 55:23
  Speaker 3: and Tommy is such a great connector and a beautiful
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: man and a great dad and so thanks.
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: Tommy, Thanks thanks Jack. A good point, mate, that's an
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: oversight on my part. He's my adopted son, Tommy as
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: I've been negligent. So thank god you're here. We love
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: you too, Jay Mate, Well say goodbye a fair but
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: for a moment, for the moment, you're a superstar. Thanks
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: for being on the You project.
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. You're a superstar
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: as our utif. Sorry once again about talking about just
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: the stiff.
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: Part, straight up, straight up into the dick jokes.
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, terrible.