Latest / It's Time for Success: The Business Insights Podcast / Making HR Human: Hiring, Culture, and Clarity with Lyndsay Seafoot

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Making HR Human: Hiring, Culture, and Clarity with Lyndsay Seafoot · It's Time for Success: The Business Insights Podcast

• Sharon: [00:00:17] Today, we're talking about one of the biggest pain points for entrepreneurs and that is HR. From retention to recruitment to reality checks, my guest today brings both expertise and honesty to the conversation. Lyndsay is the founder of Curbridge, an HR consulting company, and Stand Out Staff, a digital resume platform that turns resumes into personal web pages. And we're going to talk a bit more about that, because I was actually doing some research this morning and it's pretty genius. She's passionate about making HR simple, (good luck with that) human, and impactful and helping business owners thrive while doing it. Lyndsay, can you explain to myself and our listeners a bit about Curbridge, their services, and then dive into a bit more about the standout platform, please? Lyndsay: [00:01:02] Sure. So Curbridge is our kind of main company. It's got a few things under its umbrella now, but Curbridge is an HR consulting company built for small-to medium-sized businesses who don't have HR or don't need an HR department and a big salary. We are outsourced. We… What we do is we make a list of deliverables that the clients need to get implemented into their business, and then we are their on-call, their builder, their… We bring everything in and make it exist in their business. Sharon: [00:01:34] I was just going to say that you used the phrase you need to implement and being a small business owner myself, I didn't even know what HR was. So like for me, knowing that HR is a thing and I've heard the term, but I don't even know what it involves. So I think that somebody like me reaching out to you, who do know that and getting us up there because you give us a list of what should be implemented into these small businesses to get go. Lyndsay: [00:01:57] Exactly. We… I like to say that people call us and tell us what their problem is, or what they think they need. But our job is to tell them what they actually need to make a difference. Like, we're not going to charge you for something because you ask for it. And we don't think that's going to actually impact your life or your business at all. Our job is to do the assessment and figure out what you need. And plenty of people, my elevator pitch has been one of the harder things for me to nail down, because people don't really know what HR is, right or what you do. So an example of that would be a business that has ten employees, they've never really done performance reviews. They don't have an employee handbook. And kind of day by day they are making up the rules on the fly. They don't know what to pay people, that sort of stuff. So what we would say to that person is, you're going to work with us for six months. We're going to build you a handbook, an income plan for your employees, a performance review process to help retain your good staff. And then you can call us anytime you want as problems come up in that period, by the end of the six months or five months or whatever we decide it is, you should have these things implemented, not just built, but implemented, explained to your staff in process, in your business. And then you should be able to, you know, you're on the phone with us kind of constantly talking through the issues that you're facing. That is a sample of what that would look like. Sharon: [00:03:10] I truly believe that people need to do that before they need it. Lyndsay: [00:03:13] I know, and the problem with HR is that it often comes as the, as the aftermath. You have a hard experience and you realize like, oh, there's some things we can do. Sharon: [00:03:22] Yes, because it's going to happen, it's going to happen, it's going to happen. So it'd be easier to get that employee handbook, employee handbook is probably my lifesaver. Or even sometimes, if that's all documented, I'm part of WPO and it says, like one of the ladies there says that paperwork is your friend. Lyndsay: [00:03:38] Yes it is. Sharon: [00:03:39] There's no guessing. It's written down. You're not doubting something. They're not doubting something. It's written down. Paperwork is your friend. Lyndsay: [00:03:44] It is your friend. And the only way that, you know the best way we can help you is if you can show us something that was written down. And we know that most people from the get go, they don't have that. It’s just the way it is. They just don't have it and that's completely fine. We want to help the person who is trying to manage their business. And they're also kind of an operator in their business. We just want to take that HR piece and build it so they don't have to lose sleep about it. They know exactly what to do and when to do it. And if they don't, because things happen, then they can call us. And they don't have to worry about knowing the rules, or worry about liability, or worry about employment standards coming to find them. Right? Take all that off your plate. Sharon: [00:04:20] Love it. Okay, let's talk a little bit more about the Stand Out Staff platform. Lyndsay: [00:04:24] Certainly. So Stand Out Staff was built out of my own frustrations for receiving resumes, and they're terrible. Okay, I'm just going to be straight up about this when I post job postings on sites like Indeed, or even LinkedIn or those places, they're all set up to make it as easy as possible for the employee to submit their resume and do it fast. So people don't read the whole job description. They just see a title like director, and then you're getting a thousand resumes that don't suit at all what the job is. And so I don't understand why it's on the employer to sort through and sift through the garbage. The employees are able to just like, send ten resumes in 14 seconds and the employer's got to deal with it. So Stand Out Staff, it was my idea because I couldn't handle getting all those resumes and sifting through garbage. I cannot read ten different templates where people are trying to make their resume fancy, and the information's in 14 different places. I need a standard look of a resume, and I need to know that the information I need is inputted in there. So I created Stand Out Staff because it gives the employer back control in their process of hiring. So what it is, is employees log in, they fill in the template that's provided for them. It goes step by step and page by page. And when they hit the submit button, it creates, automatically for them, a web page. Lyndsay: [00:05:47] And that web page has all the information the employer needs, in the same order for every person whose page they're looking at, and it's interactive and interesting. So you can upload a video to explain why you want to work for someone. And the employer can watch that. And if they're interested, they can continue on and read more about your education and so on. And maybe they don't want to. Maybe they just want to watch everyone's video and then, you know, make their own process. But what it does, is it just takes out the garbage of paper. Like in a world where we do everything digitally, we are applying for jobs with attachments that are paper-based. Blows my mind that we're still doing that. Our platform has links to people's professional social media pages and LinkedIn. They can attach their driver's abstract, their, you know, certain certificates, all of that right in one place. So an employer should have a comprehensive starting point so that they don't go into interviews and waste an hour of their life because the resume looked good and that's all they had, was some well-spelled words that AI made for them. Right? It takes away that, it adds the human back in, and it helps the employer understand who am I evaluating for this job? Sharon: [00:06:56] I love the human back-end phrase. Thank you for that because that is… it is a thing. Also, I'd like to add because I was on there this morning, as I mentioned, it's very professional as well. So the look is very super professional. So when you fill out your resume and create that website and when you're submitting that, you're already above, you're already above, I can tell by looking at it. So what happens if somebody wanted to do this with their resume as of right now, at this moment, what does it cost them? Lyndsay: [00:07:22] Nothing. Zero. This… I know it's hilarious, I need to, I keep telling people every time I present on this, I say it's free for now until I figure out how to monetize it. So basically, I built the platform again. I was telling you this already, Sharon, I built the platform when I was a solopreneur in my business and it is an incredible option. I have a couple of other businesses that I'm building, and Stand Out Staff has been out there in the world and a free resource for people because I just honestly think it's needed. There will be a day where we figure out how to monetize it, and we develop that. For now, if you are looking for a job, go on standout staff and make a profile. You are going to have to put in the work to type in the answers. But when you send a potential employer a link to that web page you are going to look, you're going to be noticed. You're going to look a heck of a lot better than all of the Indeed template making things that other people are doing. And employers, you can ask people to do a Stand Out Staff resume. If you read the first round of paper resumes even, you can email those few people and say, I've got half of what I need. Send me a Stand Out Staff profile. Sharon: [00:08:31] Well, we're hiring right now and we don't have that on to our hiring list. So guess what I'm going to be adding right away. Lyndsay: [00:08:37] Stand Out Staff, please send them in. Sharon: [00:08:38] That's genius. One thing I did notice on there too, because people are some papers so you can print the resume still, too. So that's really cool too. It's still on there. You're still able to print stuff if you're like that, as well. Well, sometimes you have to review it or make notes. So I like the fact that you got both, the best of both worlds there. Lyndsay: [00:08:54] Absolutely. And you can do Word or PDF. So if you generate your paper doc, because there's a lot of like hiring systems that will only let you upload a paper document. And we didn't want to take those people out of the running. So you can download it. But the magic is your link is right at the top. So even when someone's looking at that on their computer, they can click to go right to your web page. So you always, we're always circling them back to that better option. I think that there is such a disconnect between the really great employees who are out there and the employers who constantly tell me “my biggest struggle is finding good people.” And one, there's a number of ways we need to fix that problem, but one is we need better assessments of the people out there. We have to stop wasting employers time with junk and give them something they can really evaluate their candidates from. It should start you on third base instead of like in the dugout. Sharon: [00:09:44] Yeah, and sometimes that exactly happens. You start there and the interview goes great. And then after three months you think, okay, well, maybe I can still pull this off and then you're at six months, like, I can't pull this off. I just wasted six months of my time. I just wasted six months financially. I just, you know, double-dipped because you're taking another employee away to help train, right? So it's definitely a thing. So if that helps that, that's a that's a win right there. Okay. Let's go back to HR. Yeah I know from experience because I am this person. I've been in business for almost 20 years. But I used to think that HR is needed for larger companies. I didn't think that my company at my scale needed HR. So why is that incorrect? Tell us a little bit about… because everybody's like me. Lyndsay: [00:10:26] I know, everybody is like you. That's very true. What I always say, people say the word to me, I don't need HR. And I would say back as soon as you have one employee, you have HR, you have humans who are your resource. That's what HR is. It's humans as a resource. They do work for you for a paycheck. The management of human resources is what you don't have. But you've hired someone, so you have a human… You have human resources in your business. You have someone who you've made an agreement with to pay them a certain amount, to give them a certain amount of holidays, to have them complete a certain job, etc. That is human resources. So managing it is what's missing. And small businesses, do they need it? I mean, I would argue that they need it as much as the big ones, because if you start with the right foundations, your growth is a heck of a lot easier if you've got your key principles outlined and you get to bring people into that system, you don't have employees building your system for you because you're behind the eight ball. Sharon: [00:11:24] I like that because also I feel when you are recruiting, if there's an employee handbook in place or those systems are in place, you just leveled up. Your business has leveled up. Lyndsay: [00:11:36] The experience that employees have with your business starts from the time that they come for an interview or the first invitation they get to an interview. And it goes on forever from there if they get hired. Key points that employers miss in that process is a really good interview experience. And then following that, a really good offer. That is not talking about money. I'm talking about a contract that looks professional and makes me feel safe. Like you’ve got your stuff together so I want to work with you. And those missing those opportunities, you know, they all ball together to be like, why did someone go and work for that big corp instead of staying with me at my 10-man business? And a lot of it is because you look disorganized and you look chaotic, and that doesn't make people feel safe. It makes them feel nervous about what this experience is going to be. So leveling up your business like that, so important. Sharon: [00:12:28] And often we said when it looked like you're unorganized and you look, I've been there and it was a fact, I was unorganized. It really does help because you get all these questions and sometimes, like I'm the opposite, I'd like to give, give, give give. So sometimes and as we grow, because now we're up to a staff of, I don't know, 15 or 16. So as you grow, I can't keep giving, giving, giving. So it actually and you can't do favouritism, of course, I always tell my kids I have certain favourite children kind of like that scenario. So it keeps everything level. It keeps everything accountable, including myself. There's no questions asked. It's simple. Lyndsay: [00:13:03] Yes, exactly. Simple is, like you laughed and you said making HR simple because that's how people feel. They're like, yeah, right. You're gonna make HR simple for me. Like, let me see it. Sure. But half of it is that the kind of mess that's made over time of not having things in place is what makes it not simple. Believe it or not, we like it and we can come in there and fix that pretty quick. So I think, you know, worrying too much about the details, like one phone call with us, one discovery call with us, we can pretty much tell you exactly what's going to happen and how long it's going to take. Sharon: [00:13:38] And have you ever dealt with a small business? And I'm talking, you know, maybe 5 to 25 employees that didn't have HR but reached out to you too late. Can you give us a couple situations where if they had HR implemented through your company, that it could have prevented a couple pain points, and what would those be? Lyndsay: [00:13:58] Absolutely. This is really common. We work with a lot of businesses of that size, and the things that we see, the most common ones, are really high turnover. They're just like, all I do is hire and interview people. Sometimes they don't even show back up, sometimes they leave right away, etc. That's one of the main things that happens at the beginning. The others are being taken to the labour board because they didn't pay properly or terminate properly. Anything that falls into that category. We have seen, this is a little bit less official, but like community reputation, there is like bad vibes in the community about a business because they haven't gotten their stuff together before they started hiring. We see that all the time. The worst ones that we have seen are complaints that weren't dealt with, that went to the Human Rights Commission's complaints against a company for things like, I don't know, anything. Gosh, the most common ones are sexual harassment, honestly, and that's sad to say. But sometimes employers’ actions or employees at a business, doesn't have to be the employer, people who are employed at a business, sometimes their actions are not intended to be what they are received as. So a bad joke gets… lands you in, you know, a place you don't want to be. And sometimes it's not even you saying it. It's your employees like saying it and the other ones that the really. So in those cases, what often happens is the owner is somewhat aware but they have a rock star producer, someone who like does everything they're supposed to do but is not behaving in a really appropriate way, or like doing things that cause people a lot of harm. Lyndsay: [00:15:31] That's the most common situation we walk into. And then from there we find there's no employment contract, there's no handbook. The employer is kind of mad because now they’ve got to let somebody go with a lot of pay that's been doing some bad stuff, but they didn't deal with it before. So when you're a small business and you think, I'm not going to land there. What you have to be aware of is there is liability circling you at all times when you're an employer. It's the risks of owning a business, and there's financial risks and there's all kinds of other risks. But one of the main risks that you inherit when you become a business owner is the risk of employee behaviour kind of destroying your functioning business. And if you don't have good HR in place to get you out of those situations, then they can suck up a whole lot of money and a whole lot of time, not just in legal complaints, but in, like you said, paying someone for a long time who's actually destructing things. And that is a really long answer to your question. I just want people to really understand that the liability is with the employer. I have watched Employment Standards force payouts on people. The misconduct was huge, but, oh the poor employee, we have to look at them as the one who's losing their job and who has less cash than the business owner. And so you have to be airtight with your stuff, because as soon as you hire someone, you have liability. Inherently you have liability. Does that make sense? Sharon: [00:16:58] It does. It's a lot. So a couple of things I wrote down listening to you, and I believe it's changed over the years. But employees have more rights as than us employers. Yeah. That's how I feel right now. Am I right or am I wrong? Lyndsay: [00:17:12] Yeah. I mean, I guess like legally-wise, if you listed them, you know, get it down to the books, probably it's similar. The problem is the rights, it’s interpretation of it. If someone has an employment contract and they have all the reasons to do things right, but you haven't documented it enough in employment standards eyes, you haven't given them enough chances, they can say like, ah, you gotta pay them. You know, or those kinds of rules. Like it's just open to interpretation. And this… you start on the losing side of that scale. Sharon: [00:17:44] Gotcha. One thing, too, over the years, as I've morphed into business, we talked about paperwork as your friend and you said documenting those situations. And I've learned that that's very, very important. So if somebody comes to you wanting an employee handbook, needing help with their HR, is that something you teach them about documenting those awkward conversations? Is that part of the platform or how does all that work? Lyndsay: [00:18:08] Yep, certainly. So you can come to, you can preemptively come to us and we'll give you the forms and the policies so that when something does go wrong, you just pull out the right one and you write things down. You can come to us when you're in a turmoil situation and we will walk you through. Sharon: [00:18:22] Walk you through the proper procedure. Gotcha. So if they're, if you're in there right now, then reach out. If you want to do preventative, which you should because not, if you're not doing it now it will be when. So reach out. Either way, we reach out. Okay. One thing you mentioned too, and I really think you talked about bad vibes, and so you're talking about employer… employees being hired and then going out and badmouthing that company. Is that kind of what you're I would be devastated. I would be, absolutely. Because your reputation is everything. Lyndsay: [00:18:53] Agree. Yeah. If you see, like I often say, like employer brand is something that employers forget about. And employer brand is not only when people leave, what do they say, but what are people going home and saying to their spouse, to their friends, to their family at Thanksgiving? That's your employer brand. And if they're having, you know, a really poor experience, it's going to, it's going to get out there. And when they leave, that they also tell people. When you hire somebody, they start their job. They've probably like found, you know, told their friends, told their parents, told their spouse whatever. They, sometimes they buy new clothes. They do all kinds of things when they're excited for a new job. When that person comes in and doesn't have a good experience, whatever they did before they arrived is amplified and told to everybody about what their experience is being there at your business. So it puts a lot of pressure on employers, and I totally get that. But good leadership, the most important thing when you're talking about employer’s brand out in a community and employer of choice is something that we strive to get all of our clients to. We want to get, we want to see your problems and help you fix them and get you to an employer of choice. Meaning, when you post a job, people see it and go, oh, I've heard that's a great place to work. I'm going to share this with someone. I'm going to send someone that way. And when people in HR go looking for employees and try to headhunt them into your business, if we can honestly say this is a great place to work, your chances of getting the better hires is paramount. I mean, it makes all the difference. So employers need to be aware of their employer brand and that is so connected to HR. Sharon: [00:20:28] I think it's, for me, it's huge. Like if some like, even if there was one person in here that's not representing or not helping our customers to our standards, it just doesn't work. It's not who I want. I have a quick little story. I had a new girl move into our area. She was just out of college and she was dating a guy in this area. And so her future mother-in-law had said to her, she's driving by It’s Time, and she says, if this place ever comes up wanting somebody to hire, you get in there. And I thought, you know, that's so cool. And we hired her a few months later because the job came up. So that was pretty cool. Lyndsay: [00:20:59] That is very cool. And that tells you so much about what you're doing, who’s working for you, all that matters. Sharon: [00:21:06] It's very important. Okay. So you would work... So say, for example, people are having high turnaround right now. They do have that bad rep or a little bit of a bad rep or something they got to focus on. That's where you guys can help them as well. Not just… okay. So let's see. HR I thought was like numbers. Like I thought it was all boring stuff. Lyndsay: [00:21:27] Yeah. No. It is really… Thank you for clarifying this. The… HR is anything to do with your employees and their work, their experience, and their work for your business. So we want you to be an employer of choice. We want you to have good systems, good leaders, you know, competitive job opportunities. But also, we want you to handle the problems so the good employees aren't, you know, having to deal with the bad employee who you're scared to talk to or any of those little things. Culture is your daily decisions, your actions in the day-to-day. And that builds up to be what your culture is. And that is all part of what we do. It doesn't mean that you buy one thing from us and then you're like, we fixed it. We put a handbook in place. That's a huge part of it. But, you know, when someone, if someone's having high turnover and they don't know why or if they're having trouble hiring really good people and they don't know why, like, I need to talk to them because I can again, to the diagnosis. It's like going to the doctor's office. Like, I can probably ask you a few questions and figure out where is the problem really stemming from? Sharon: [00:22:31] Right. Interesting. Okay. So that was a lot of clarity for me because like the whole word HR as you, as I laughed at the beginning because HR to me is just like I feel that you would have the worst job on the planet. Lyndsay: [00:22:44] We get that all the time. In fact, we have a culture deck here at Curbridge, and so a culture deck is like, it's a bit of a marketing tool in some ways to get employees in. It just explains who you are, what your values are, what's important to you. And in our culture deck, we say that, you know, HR has the reputation of a Karen in a bad pantsuit. If you could have a visual for that. And we know that and we think like, you know, people, people are either scared of us or they think we're the fun police or any of that, and none of that is true. The last thing we want to do is come in and take away all the joy and jokes and fun of your business, and make you follow some rules and all of that. Employers need to think of us as almost like their insurance, their protection layer. We're going to help you see what you can't see, and help you make people happier at your workplace, and make you more attractive to people who aren't there yet. Sharon: [00:23:39] That's brilliant. And even so, you talked about all that kind of stuff. And I know for a fact when you start focusing and you start investing in that, that will reflect on your bottom line. Lyndsay: [00:23:48] Absolutely. The most expensive thing on most people's, the words, like their spreadsheets, with all their accounting numbers, all of those numbers add up to whatever your, you know, your profits are. The most expensive line on most people's is their wages. Sharon: [00:24:04] Yes. Lyndsay: [00:24:04] So why are we not getting the most out of those dollars? Sharon: [00:24:08] Aha, a light bulb just went off on my head. Lyndsay: [00:24:12] The way you get the most out of those dollars is by making your environment a place that people want to be. And when people want to be with you, working for you, they are faster. They're more efficient. They're easier to be around. And when you set your system up and the water that everybody swims in is kind of toxic and not great, and you don't have good HR, then, you know, you're paying a lot of money for not a lot of production or not people's best production. Sharon: [00:24:39] So yeah, I can definitely, yeah, it definitely focuses on that. Sometimes when as an entrepreneur too, we don't have the cash flow. You know, the cash flow is kind of tight sometimes and you have to make that leap and trust. But you can also reach out and ask those questions first. Right? So I imagine you have like different levels of payscale for what you're doing. Is that kind of the, am I picking up that correctly? Yeah. Lyndsay: [00:25:03] Yeah. I again, I talked at the beginning about deliverables. The easiest way to explain this is that Curbridge has a list of services that we do. You could pick as many of those or as few of those as you want. And, you know, we'll tell you how long it'll take to make that come to life. And that costs whatever it costs. So an example is an employee handbook is around $5,000. You'll buy that one time and then you'll have, you know, we'll email you every year with legislation changes so you can keep it up to date. Sharon: [00:25:30] Oh, very cool. Lyndsay: [00:25:31] Yeah. So that's how that works. Now, if you tell me that you want a handbook and you want to look at the pay scales and how competitive you are, and your onboarding system is terrible. We'll take all those three things and divide them by probably three months of work. And then at the end of the three months those things will be in place. That's how it works to work with us. And while you're working with us, you can call us anytime. Sharon: [00:25:54] Mhm. Love it. Okay, so we talked in depth about employees. And so we'll talk a little bit more about retention. And we talked about culture. So right now what's changing in how people choose where they work? Because I feel that that's part of it. Right? So people are choosing those places when they're driving by the road, you know, apply there if it comes in. Like what else do you see is the trending thing? Because in… hiring employees is tough. Lyndsay: [00:26:18] It's tough. It's so tough. So just so I'm clear on the question, it's like, what are people looking for? Sharon: [00:26:26] Yeah. Because I feel like right now, I feel that employees are hiring us. I know that sounds crazy because. Because they can go anywhere. Because everybody's scrambling for workers, right? So it seems to be the new, kind of the local pandemic around here, anyways. So they're almost hiring for us. So the question is, what, as a business owner, besides those things we just talked about, is there anything else that we're missing to get the right people in our door, the right seats on the bus filled? Lyndsay: [00:26:54] Yeah, the right seats on the bus. Okay. You’ve got to really know what the seat is, first of all. That's the first thing you got to know. And then when you go out looking for someone to fill that seat, you're… I get that there's not a lot of employees out there, and we're all looking for the same, like, you know, the same really good person. If you are willing to take some time to do… We call this an avatar. You write down the skills of the job, but you also write down the characteristics of the personality. And I usually say to people, take your A player. Who's your A player? What about them makes them an A player? It's not just the things that they can execute, it's the person that they are and the way they approach the job and the way they connect with you. That's what you want to replicate. So answer the questions what is, what are the best things about my A player? And then you have to go and interview for those characteristics. You are looking for good people in a market that's tight. That's true. It's no different than like everyone wants houses and there's only a couple for sale, right? I get that. It is the same right now with employees. However, I think that you have to control what you can control. We can't control how many people are out there looking for jobs. Lyndsay: [00:28:08] What you can control is employer brand, which we've already talked about. And then you can control how good your sieve is for the people that come through and who gets through and who doesn't. And I and people often say to me, I just need, I just need like a heartbeat. You know, I just need somebody here to do the job. Okay. You… if that's your approach to it, that, you're going to be in a constant state of turnover and problem. So you’ve got to tighten the process, really nail down… anytime. So Kara, she's my absolute rock star. My number two, I call her my number two because she's like my me next me right? Yeah. I write down her characteristics. What is it that makes her so good? She can, like, see what I want before I actually have it. I write down what that sounds like, and then I go out and I ask the next people, how do you approach this situation? How are you going to know what I, you know, what we need to create? How do you look into the future and see things? I ask questions that are very specific to what I want from the personality, and you’ve just got to be willing to hire slow. I know that's not a great answer, but hire slow. Sharon: [00:29:11] Hire slow, fire fast. Lyndsay: [00:29:12] Yeah, yeah. Hiring fast. Hire fast, fire fast is what some people say lately. That's going to suck up some time and resources you probably don't have anyway. There isn't a good answer to this question. You’ve just got to control what you can control. And you, really, employers have to be willing to hire slow and just to know who they need. Sharon: [00:29:37] So do your homework first. I always say for me and this, I can train almost anything. I can train. My team’s great. They’re... We have systems in place. We can probably train almost anything. But what I can't train is common sense and give a shit. Those are my two requirements, and they're hard to find. Lyndsay: [00:29:54] The give a shit is hard to find. Sharon: [00:29:56] It's hard to find. Common sense is another one. It's a lacking skill these days. Lyndsay: [00:30:01] I think there is a lot of people saying, you know, generationally we need these things. And sure, you know, every, every generation before us has said that. They said it about us and you know, all that. But I do think that we have to understand the generation that we are faced with hiring right now. People are really worried about these younger employees having a lot of entitlement. They enter wanting a big position. They enter thinking they know everything. They enter like… that is the state of it. Honestly, it's just true. Sharon: [00:30:30] Yeah. Lyndsay: [00:30:31] Entitlement is managed by good leadership and really good communication. So breaking it down I find really helpful is like three month chunks. Like you're gonna do this for three months and if I see the results I want, then we're gonna let you have your work-from-home Tuesdays or whatever the heck it is that they think that they're entitled to, and really good leadership communicating that I have to see the work, I have to see the work, I have to see the work. And people rise to where you kind of help bring them to. And the hard conversation there is often being able to sit people down and say, I know that you think you know, but I need you to learn from me. Sharon: [00:31:08] Love it. Yeah. So entitlement is definitely a thing. So we just gotta… And that's what I always think for myself. Like I have to shift. I'm always shifting my mindset because I have to shift my mindset to what's current and what's happening out there. I can't… I'm not going to change anything that's not, do I need to change it? No, it's just me needs to change it to understand it. Lyndsay: [00:31:27] Mhm. Certainly I agree with that. Sharon: [00:31:30] So we talked about like choice workplace. So I think everything that you had mentioned about, you know, your brand name out there having, you know, working with these this newer generation I'm going to call it. I don't know if that's the right words. Let's turn around. But I think that if a small business is incorporating everything that we just chatted about, you can compete with the bigger companies. Lyndsay: [00:31:56] I agree, and in fact, you have an advantage because a lot of the especially younger generation doesn't want to do corporate ladder climbing. They want to work in a more chill environment with less red tape and easier access to the executives and that kind of stuff. So you do have the option, if you have your things organized and it still feels safe and isn't corporate, I think that's a really big advantage right now. They want that option. Sharon: [00:32:21] Family feel almost sometimes. I think some people need that little bit of, because as we know, we're going through that right, right now. Another thing like the whole… I feel that this is my take on life. This is my I'm going to tell you and you can tell me if I'm wrong. My take on life, because I know mental health is a big thing. Everybody knows mental health is a big thing. And I don't understand the new word of the day is anxiety. Everybody's got anxiety and like I for me, anxiety means stepping outside your comfort zone, as far as I'm concerned. And growth doesn't happen until you step outside your comfort zone. I have to understand it as a business owner, okay, you’ve got anxiety. I have to understand it. On the other side of my fence is like, well, take the leap and you'll get better at it, right? So I got to be very, very, very careful of that, how I portray it. But I feel that as a smaller business owner and if you got all those places, those things in place where they feel comfortable coming to work and you feel, or confident, I should say the word is like all the things that you had mentioned. I really do believe if they're happy at work, if they're happy with their, you know, their people that they work with, if they leave work feeling accomplished, if they leave work feeling proud, that really helps. It really, super helps. And as a business owner, we're able to help some of that. I feel that we're able to help some of that. Lyndsay: [00:33:35] Yeah, I agree completely. So the, all of that stuff you say about being proud and connected to the work and all that. God it’s a broken record but it comes back to that leadership thing. Like, are we telling people what they need to do to be successful, or are we having the hard conversation? Or are we just going home and complaining about all the things they did that day, like giving… So I had a boss that, she was incredible. I adore her, she told me when I was working in my first HR job at a construction company, she told me that I'm a fart and emit. Which in her mind meant all over the place, not really doing much. Not super useful, but everywhere. And that kind of feedback, I needed to know that. And if you can imagine that somebody out there needs to be told, what is it that they could be more productive at? You're helping them by telling them that. And when we avoid the tough convos and we don't do the things we're supposed to do and we don't have a, you know, everybody's kind of grumpy and they have to show up because they have to show up, blah, blah, blah. When that's your your vibe, you don't have people rising to the challenge. You have people kind of falling to the performance of the lowest person, and they have studies that show that. If you sit next to a low performer, you don't… you… they don't go up, you go down. Sharon: [00:34:51] Mhm. Lyndsay: [00:34:52] So yeah all of that connects. Sharon: [00:34:55] Yep. Yep. Surround yourself with the right people. And I feel that if you create that business for those people they can rise up as well. I agree. If somebody's starting up they want to reach out to HR. What's the first thing that they should focus on? They might not have the finances right now, but what's the main thing, first step that they should focus on to incorporate into their business? Lyndsay: [00:35:14] Oh, boy. Okay. Tough question. My gut answer to that, though, is their own development as a leader. Sharon: [00:35:22] Oh. You threw me off on that. I was thinking like an employee handbook. I was thinking… Lyndsay: [00:35:26] I know that was the second thing I thought was like, huh? Maybe I should try to sell handbooks. No, that is not the right answer. The answer? The true and honest. I mean, we have a leadership training program, so sure it counts. It doesn't matter where you live. There is so many free resources. You don't have to pay for anything. What is going to make the biggest difference in your success is if you're if you're someone that people want to work for. In early stages, you have got to figure out being a good leader. If you are a plumber today and you are opening a plumbing business and you are going to have plumbers working for you, they have to want to work for you. Because the plumbing job is going to be the same at your business and at Bob's Plumbing, and at whatever other ones are out there. You have got to be someone people want to work for, and you don't know everything about how to do that. And you’ve got to kind of admit that to yourself. You know how to do plumbing. Okay, the second thing I would say to that is you really have to have the reality in your mind that a big part of your day is going to be talking to employees, learning what they like and don't like. Lyndsay: [00:36:26] You’ve got to incorporate some natural HR and communication right from the hop. If you, I'm talking about the person who doesn't have budget, you have to understand what people like. And I don't know if anyone out there knows who Gary Vaynerchuk is, but he says that an entrepreneur is two jobs are 50% marketing and 50% employee time. Hanging out with your employees, figuring out what they like, what they don't like, and the other half is figuring out how to get customers in. So if you're listening to this and you're an entrepreneur, I think there's something really important about the reality we're all facing being operators in our own business. Like, you've got to do the plumbing, I get that, but the faster you can get yourself out of doing the plumbing and actually doing the marketing and the people management part of your business, the more successful your business will be. So don't dip out on those things. Sharon: [00:37:12] Okay. So going back to leadership because I 100% agree. Um, so you do offer leadership training at Curbridge, right? That's a part of it. Okay. That's awesome. And then can you tell me, Gary who again? Sorry. Lyndsay: [00:37:25] Gary Vaynerchuk. Sharon: [00:37:26] Vaynerchuk. Lyndsay: [00:37:27] Vaynerchuk. Gary Vee, you can find him everywhere as Gary Vee. Gary V-E-E. Good person to listen to. Sharon: [00:37:36] And he's on, he's focused on leadership. Lyndsay: [00:37:38] He is a, actually he's a marketing whiz and he's built a bazillion businesses and he's like multi-million dollar blah, blah, blah. His whole thing is on building like kindness, culture, and how he built big businesses with, by treating employees well. So it's a combo of marketing and HR, which is so helpful for any business owner. It's the two things that we struggle. I mean, we struggled with this. Sharon: [00:38:02] Okay. Well, I really appreciate that. That's my key takeaway because I'm a huge, I love to learn and I'm always reading and always listening. So that's fantastic. One of the, one for me, my leadership book is John C Maxwell. I love John C Maxwell. Yep. Okay. So perfect okay. So we're going to talk about, you literally run two companies. You have Curbridge and Stand Out Staff. Lyndsay: [00:38:26] Actually three. We have a new one called Director's Desk which I can give you the two second. Sharon: [00:38:33] Give me it. Let's do it. Lyndsay: [00:38:34] Director’s Desk is an HR program for childcare. So we built this custom portal access point full of documents, full of resources with a line to a HR consultant and a line to training. And it's all inside this online portal. And we built that because the childcare industry has zero for HR support. And you have these directors who are incredible with children and then are asked to manage 50 staff and it's insanity. So yeah, that's what we built. That'll launch in April. Sharon: [00:39:06] Holy. So I feel like so you're talking about managing staff, but I think when you're dealing with childcare, you're also managing parents. Lyndsay: [00:39:14] Parents and board. Yeah, it's a lot. They have a lot on their plate. And I think they have been like a hidden... I don't even know what you call it. No one pays attention to them. They're not given the same accolades as schools and educators and all these other things, even though that's what they're doing with their days, and they are running these facilities. And it's so much that… and it's an integral service, like, how are they under the radar? No one's paying attention to them at all, so… Sharon: [00:39:39] They're raising your children. They're raising your future. Lyndsay: [00:39:42] Yeah, literally. And then as soon as you… Yeah, I mean, it's something that is really close to my heart and my company. And it's going to be an annual subscription fee. And you get access to everything that we would create custom. We're just taking that to the masses by making it online and in this integrated platform that is for child care. It's not buying templates from some company that's giving you the same ones they gave the retail store. It’s specifically for child care. Sharon: [00:40:08] So this is mostly for five and under child care. Is that? Or does it matter? Lyndsay: [00:40:12] No, it doesn't matter because lots of centers will go before and after school. Most centers go to 12 years old. Sharon: [00:40:17] Gotcha. Okay. Lyndsay: [00:40:18] Yeah. Lots, lots. And so it's Manitoba only right now because we've built it with the Manitoba employment standards in it. So that's an important note. Our plan is to expand it across Canada. Sharon: [00:40:30] Interesting. Well I can't wait to see how that goes. Maybe we'll have to redo this when that launches, we'll do another one, because that's exciting. How do they complement each other in helping business owners hire smarter? Lyndsay: [00:40:41] Oh gosh. Totally related. Everything in Director's Desk portal is, you know, there's a whole section on hiring and then Stand Up Staff itself is all about better quality hires and better use of owner's time, managers time. And then Curbridge itself. Curbridge is all of the HR access that people need to have better hires, better retention. So they just totally all keep sprouting off of each other. It's like… it's having babies of its own. Sharon: [00:41:09] Okay, so somebody out there, one of your businesses want to hire? They've been listening to this podcast, they want to hire a consultant, they think. When do you think they should manage it internally? Is there some situations that can be managed internally, or do you think that we should just put it on paper because we talked about paperwork being our friend? Lyndsay: [00:41:27] Yeah, I think most people, unless you have someone who's educated in HR in your business, then use that person. I think it's like anything we do in our business, like I don't do my own books because that is a waste of my time and I don't need to know all of that. I need to know pieces enough to make decisions, right? HR is the same. If you've got a resource and a person in your business, use them. Otherwise, outsourcing is going to be cheaper and faster and you get an expert right away. You don't have to bring someone up to speed but them… I don't want to be on your benefits plan. It's easy. So that's what we're built for. They say the rule of thumb is like, around 60 to 70 employees, depending on your business, is when you probably need internal full-time. Sharon: [00:42:08] Gotcha. I always wondered about that. Okay. Thank you for that. So somebody reaching out for an HR consultant or coach, which I feel that you're both, what are some red flags if they're reaching out? What are some red flags that they should watch for? Lyndsay: [00:42:21] Like when they're reaching out to other consultants or inside? Oh, yeah. Sharon: [00:42:25] Outside consultants? Yes. Lyndsay: [00:42:28] I have myself had my share of bad consultants as a business owner. So I can answer this question from the perspective that as a service business, it is really important to us that we deliver value. I know what it's like to pay for something and not get value, right? So again, I said it before, we want you to know that you can ask us for something, but we're not going to sell you it unless we know you need it. I have, I've told many people, no, I can't. You're going to come back and be angry at me that you paid for that. So I think you need to watch for yes men versus people who tell you what is the right answer. I also think you need to watch for professionalism. Like, do they have a good contract in place? Don't just make a handshake agreement. Have deliverables with deadlines. It's like managing employees. You've got to know what you're getting. We try really hard to give those things to our clients. And your red flags are… they’re just disorganization. They're overpromising and they're yes men. So there's a lot of consultants out there who just want to drop a handbook on your doorstep for $7,000 and then take off. You want to ask about implementation. You want to ask about edits. How many times do you get to edit? What if a change happens in six months? Like ask so many questions. You'll be able to tell from the way they answer, if they have an answer, or if they're making it up for you. Sharon: [00:43:46] Interesting. Yes. Okay. I feel like even, like going to a car salesman. Salesman scare me, like I'm terrified of salesmen. I know it sounds crazy because I'm literally in sales. I don't go out and do sales. People come to me. But regardless, everybody's a salesperson, right? Whether that be… But I am terrified of people being that person and overselling me. So again, but it goes down to your brand. It goes back to your integrity. It goes back to what we talked about earlier, about, you know, the whole company outlook, what do we call it? Like basically how you're seeing. Lyndsay: [00:44:22] The employer brand? Sharon: [00:44:22] The community, right? Yes. Lyndsay: [00:44:24] Yes it does. It all goes back to that. Yeah. If you've paid for something and not gotten anything out of it, you know what that feels like. And I think we just get smarter as business owners, being able to say what we want and need and make better choices. Sharon: [00:44:36] Absolutely. Okay, what's one small practical HR change or business… that a business could make this week that would have an impact? One thing that they can do this week. Lyndsay: [00:44:45] Go recognize some employees, say thank you. Say thank you and tell them why their work matters. You could go and do that right now. Recognition. People love recognition. They operate better. There's a whole bunch of studies behind this. But I'll tell you the nutshell is that seven days is how long they kind of stay on the high of, like, feeling really good that their boss recognized them. And most people don't do enough of it. It's not just thank you, thank you, thank you. If someone walks out the door, it's thank you Sharon, because you did that, tomorrow is going to be so much easier for me. And I, you know, I can tackle this project that's important to me. Sharon: [00:45:20] And they go home feeling a little bit prouder. We're going to go into some rapid fire questions because I kept you on here long enough, because I feel like I can talk to you forever. Your favourite leadership book? Lyndsay: [00:45:28] Oh, Start with Why by Simon Sinek. Sharon: [00:45:32] Start with Why. I don't think I read that one either. Jeepers, I got some… Lyndsay: [00:45:36] Kind of a business book. But kind of HR. Yeah. Sharon: [00:45:39] Yeah. Love it. The best advice you've ever been given as a business owner? Lyndsay: [00:45:44] Ooh, what a good question. You know what? It's a little bit of a weird one, but I think the best thing that's made the biggest impact for me is a gal who I love and adore told me that all of those ideas you have that swirl around and pop into your head in the middle of the night and all that stuff. Write them all down because there is something behind these things that comes to fruition eventually. And I think that has helped us recognize opportunities that we otherwise would have just kind of blown by. So I think that's probably the best advice. I'm gonna also just add to this. The thing I would say, advice wise, for anyone trying to grow a business is kind of what you said before, Sharon, is like, you're gonna be uncomfortable and you need to get used to being uncomfortable if you want your business to grow and excel. So someone did tell me that early, and I have really found that to be true. So anyone in an HR seat like or an HR seat, sorry, or an entrepreneurship seat, if something scares you, then you should absolutely 1,000% do it. Sharon: [00:46:44] I believe 100%. Sometimes I look for that kind of stuff just to make sure and keep going. Yeah. Is there anything else, Lyndsay, that you would like to add to our listeners before we sign off here? Lyndsay: [00:46:54] No, I don't think so. I mean, if you find yourself complaining about your employees or worrying about liability, just book a call. We'll talk about it. We'll figure out if we're the right partners for you or what you can do next. You shouldn't have to live in that zone of fear and worry about employees. So that's all I would say. Sharon: [00:47:17] Perfect. Okay. So just quickly, again, just tell us your website or how to get ahold of you. I know that they will be in the notes below because we'll always share the contact notes. But just maybe quickly tell us how we get ahold of you. Lyndsay: [00:47:29] Yeah. curbridge.ca. There's a contact form there. There's an email there. Hello@curbridge.ca You can also send a note. You will find, that will go right to my inbox. Sharon: [00:47:42] Perfect. Thank you. And if you are looking to hire, use the… What's it called, Stand Out Staff platform. So it is available to all of you entrepreneurs out there. You can send it. You can incorporate it into your hiring process. So that's something that and for now, as of this session, which is what, November 19th, 2025, it is free. For a limited time offer. So take advantage of that. Okay, Lyndsay, this has been packed with wisdom and practical advice. You're helping business owners see that HR isn't just about policies and paperwork, which is what I always thought it was. It's about people, connection, and culture. Thank you for joining me and for showing us that when we make HR human, everything in our business gets a little bit stronger. And yeah, thank you for joining me today. Lyndsay: [00:48:27] Thank you for having me.