Latest / The You Project / #1833 The Terror Of Stand-Up - Bobby Cappuccio

Transcript

#1833 The Terror Of Stand-Up - Bobby Cappuccio · The You Project

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I'll get a welcome to you know what it is.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: I don't even know why I say it anymore. Fuck
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: it just I'm not even going to say where you're
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: out or what you're listening to. I'm just going to
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: say Hi. I'm going to start with the lady in
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: the room, lady, and the lady looks around. You're a lady.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: You know you're a lady, but you're pretty much I mean,
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: you do declare that you're thirty percent dude, but you're
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: at least seventy percent lady.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: That's a lot too, isn't it. That's the majority? Good?
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like you are? You are pretty much yep, three quarterswoman.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Which part of you is more dude than do that?
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: Maybe my biceps and my mouth, my language, you.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Do have a body mouth. I don't know how much
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: of that I want to take credit for, but either way,
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: I'm proud.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: Thanks for the influence.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're welcome. Hi, Bobby. Hey, what's going on over there? Well?
• 1:07
  Speaker 4: I'm on a podcast, obviously, Yeah that's good.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: How's it going?
• 1:11
  Speaker 5: So I'm gonna say where I am or what it is,
• 1:13
  Speaker 5: because we're not doing that this episode.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: Apparently, no, no, no, or.
• 1:17
  Speaker 5: Trying to calculate, like what percentage doude I am? I
• 1:20
  Speaker 5: don't know, Like what are you reading in this get up?
• 1:23
  Speaker 5: It's kind of hard to tell.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: In it it is were you wearing something that looks
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: like a cross between a cardigan and a vest and
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: a shawl? What is that?
• 1:33
  Speaker 5: It's it's very it's ambiguous. I'm not even sure just myself.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to speculate some kind of well color
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: would you call that tiff burgundy? What would you call
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: that item of clothing that he's got over him?
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: Peculiar?
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: What would you call it? Me?
• 1:59
  Speaker 5: I don't know, like something like like a colorful version
• 2:02
  Speaker 5: a Fiddler on the Roof. A friend of mine actually said, like,
• 2:04
  Speaker 5: I look like Fiddler on the roofs, Just like do
• 2:06
  Speaker 5: you realize you dress exactly like.
• 2:09
  Speaker 4: You're just like doing a play on Fiddler on the Roof.
• 2:11
  Speaker 5: And I never noticed that before, but yeah, now that
• 2:15
  Speaker 5: I look, I look in the mirror before I go out,
• 2:16
  Speaker 5: and I'm like very wavy, like a lot of layers
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: and long things and usually like something.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: What's what's a temperature where you're at? What's the typical
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: temperature where you're at at at the minute, Like day
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: to day.
• 2:29
  Speaker 4: Oh, it's been it's been different. Like today, it's really great.
• 2:32
  Speaker 5: Today it's been about I would say, nineteen degrees, but
• 2:35
  Speaker 5: it's been it's been like seven eight degrees for the
• 2:38
  Speaker 5: whole week, like a windy, rainy seven eight degrees.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: We're just coming towards the end of out our warm spot.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: So it's I think it's going to be about thirty
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: degrees today, but I reckon in the next week or
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: two that's kind of plummet. But ah, dear, how's work mate?
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: Are you doing well? Are you loving life? Are you
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: peaks and troughs like a normal human?
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: Like a normal human.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: I wanted to talk today, which you two know because
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: I ran it by you and you were both underwhelmingly enthusiastic.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: So see if you can fucking turn up the volume
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: a little bit now that we're actually recording the idea.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: I was thinking to myself about the amount of conversations
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: I've had with people who want to do something but
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: they're never ready, Like they want to whatever, build a business,
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: build a brand, do a course, you know, whatever it is,
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: but whenever I talk to them, it's not the right time.
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: Like a lot a lot of people it's not now,
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: but it's soon. And some people you talk to twenty
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: five times, and no matter which of the twenty five
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: times you talk to them, it's never the time. It's
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: always coming. It's always a Monday, or it's always January.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: It's always when the kids are on holidays or not
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: on holidays, or when you know they reach this number,
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: of this threshold. But and so I was talking about
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: the idea of essentially starting before you're ready, in inverted commas,
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: or starting scared, or starting insecure, or starting you know,
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: just just starting knowing that like when you look back
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: at Tiff, like when you look back at your first
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: ever recorded podcast that you did of your show, and
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: you know how much now you didn't know then. Not
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: that you wouldn't have started, but you realize that you
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: can't get the skill and knowledge and understanding. You've got
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: nearly a thousand episodes in of yours and probably a
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: thousand of mine, so probably two thousand plus episodes without
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: all the fuck ups and without the good episodes and
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: bad episodes, and without all the lessons.
• 4:50
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember pledging at the beginning, I'll never not
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: put an episode up because I wanted to learn from
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: every episode I recorded.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: And I did.
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: I didn't want my own insecurities to get in the
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: way of putting things up because sometimes we record and
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: we think we're shit. And if you don't put things
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: into the world and get the practice, you don't you
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: don't get the feedback, you don't get the lessons, you
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: don't get the improvement.
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. When I started UNI the first time, I
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: was thirty six, so day one university. It was two thousand.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: I was sitting at ACU in the city. In my
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: first ever lecture was in a computer lab. I didn't
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: know how to use a computer and they tell me
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: to log on using my student ID code. I don't
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: know what that means. So I asked this seventeen year
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: old next to me, can you help me? And they
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: look at me like I'm some kind of fucking know,
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: unintelligent dinosaur, which essentially compared to her, I was. I
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: couldn't even I couldn't and I'm like, where do I
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: find that? And she's like, it's on that thing around
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: your neck. I had land right, I go oh, and
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: then I look down there's a student ID number. I'm like, ah,
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: that I mean, I was so not ready for university.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: I was so I didn't understand the language. I hadn't
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: been to school for eighteen years. And then when I
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: was at school, I didn't really do any work. You know,
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: it's a whole new culture, it's a whole new environment.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: I was literally double everyone's age, and I definitely wasn't
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: ready in terms of practically and you know, technically, but
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: you just learn. And the first semester I was so
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: inept and so ill equipped. But you just start and
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: then the things that you need to develop and understand
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: and learn you do. But like, how would you ever
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: be ready for university without going to university?
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: It's a mindset, isn't it being ready?
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, I think so.
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: It's not even in a place because by the time
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: you're where you once thought was ready, you've moved that goalpost.
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: It's what the success goalpost.
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: It's like, well on this now, but there's better and
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: I'm not there yet.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: Do you remember a moment in time, Bobby, where you
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: did something for the first time and then you looked
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: back and realized how ill equipped or ill prepared or
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: unqualified you were, but it ended up okay eventually.
• 7:29
  Speaker 5: That's about eighty percent of the things I've done, and
• 7:31
  Speaker 5: that's just for the first time, like on one hundred
• 7:33
  Speaker 5: and first time.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: That's where I landed.
• 7:35
  Speaker 5: So like being that we're talking about being inept and
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: this whole thing about getting ready to get ready. Last week,
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: I gave a very important presentation and it completely bombed.
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: And I'm only saying that because several of the participants
• 7:49
  Speaker 5: told me you completely bombed, so I believe them, but
• 7:54
  Speaker 5: I did not. Oh, it was bad. It was really bad.
• 7:58
  Speaker 5: Actually I had to get cut off because I thought
• 8:00
  Speaker 5: I had double the amount of time that I did,
• 8:02
  Speaker 5: so I had to like actually cut me and have
• 8:05
  Speaker 5: somebody jump in and take over for me. It's like stop, Bobby, Like, ah, okay, wait,
• 8:11
  Speaker 5: so I'm not supposed to be talking anymore. I think
• 8:12
  Speaker 5: they cut my mic. So yeah, it's just not one
• 8:15
  Speaker 5: of not one of my better performances, but to be fair,
• 8:19
  Speaker 5: by far not my worst. And one of the things
• 8:23
  Speaker 5: that we were talking about, or I was talking about
• 8:27
  Speaker 5: for a very long period of time apparently, was dimensions
• 8:30
  Speaker 5: of well being and how we utilize eight dimensions of
• 8:33
  Speaker 5: well being. And you know, there are obvious reasons for that.
• 8:37
  Speaker 5: One being well being is not about one thing. It
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: is a highly integrated dynamic state. But when you take
• 8:46
  Speaker 5: a look at eight different dimensions, if you want to
• 8:49
  Speaker 5: identify where somebody is within their level of readiness, since
• 8:52
  Speaker 5: we're talking about readiness, and you pull from like James
• 8:56
  Speaker 5: Petraska in the trance theoretical model of change, you can
• 8:59
  Speaker 5: kind of all most determine where their level of readiness
• 9:04
  Speaker 5: is by where? Importance right, like how much do I
• 9:08
  Speaker 5: what's by why? And confidence? Do I have the skills
• 9:12
  Speaker 5: to engage in the how where do they intersect? And
• 9:16
  Speaker 5: another variable is readiness? Right, So yes, I'm confident it's important,
• 9:22
  Speaker 5: but am I ready? And if you look if you
• 9:26
  Speaker 5: look at those dimensions, given the context of what's happening
• 9:30
  Speaker 5: in someone's life at any given moment, one of them
• 9:33
  Speaker 5: is going to have a very high degree of importance
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: or readiness or confidence versus the others.
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: But the most important.
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: Variable, like if you look at motivational interviewing, and like
• 9:48
  Speaker 5: decisional balance sheets and like okay, resolving ambivalence. When you
• 9:52
  Speaker 5: want two things that are in conflict, what drives behavior most?
• 9:57
  Speaker 5: Is it is it mitigating the content sequences of doing
• 10:01
  Speaker 5: something the things you fear? Or is it the positives?
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: Is it the benefits that you're going to gain?
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: Now?
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: I used to think, because of the negativity bias that
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: all human beings have, it's mitigating consequences, But I was
• 10:15
  Speaker 5: dead wrong. The research shows it's how many benefits? How
• 10:18
  Speaker 5: many reasons do you have for doing what you're doing?
• 10:22
  Speaker 5: The deeper your why, the more resolute you're going to
• 10:24
  Speaker 5: be in a house. So I think a lot of
• 10:26
  Speaker 5: times when people set out to do something, why are
• 10:29
  Speaker 5: you doing it? There's usually an outcome out there and
• 10:33
  Speaker 5: that's what, Oh my god, what if I fail? What
• 10:35
  Speaker 5: if nobody likes this? What if nobody buys this? What
• 10:39
  Speaker 5: about your intrinsic reasons? Like why are you doing what
• 10:43
  Speaker 5: you're doing? Because sometimes getting started requires you doing something
• 10:49
  Speaker 5: for the sake of doing it in and of itself.
• 10:51
  Speaker 5: And like TIV said, when you start doing things like
• 10:54
  Speaker 5: that and you start putting things out, not necessarily because
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: you're attached to the outcome, but because you want that feedback,
• 11:03
  Speaker 5: like how did I do? And it's like people tell
• 11:05
  Speaker 5: you like, oh that was amazing or I really like
• 11:07
  Speaker 5: this or this was complete shit. Yeah that might hurt,
• 11:10
  Speaker 5: but that's essential. That's essential for growth. It I don't
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: think it's even possible on a neurobiological level to learn
• 11:20
  Speaker 5: and to grow without a level of frustration, without a
• 11:24
  Speaker 5: level of pain. Now now, too much you develop anxiety,
• 11:27
  Speaker 5: you just completely frustrate.
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: I think we talked about this a couple of weeks ago.
• 11:31
  Speaker 5: Too little, you're just not going to have the level
• 11:36
  Speaker 5: of dopamine or epinephrine to facilitate learning and growing. So
• 11:41
  Speaker 5: if you're frustrated, if you're if you're scared, I mean,
• 11:44
  Speaker 5: if you're absolutely terrified, maybe scale back on the audaciousness
• 11:49
  Speaker 5: of the first step. But if you're not scared at all,
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: that's troublesome because how are you going.
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: To get into flow states?
• 11:54
  Speaker 5: How are you really going to get into a zone
• 11:57
  Speaker 5: where you're getting better and you're struggling because you stay
• 12:00
  Speaker 5: there for a little bit. It's like going for a run,
• 12:02
  Speaker 5: Like the first like I would ever go for a run,
• 12:06
  Speaker 5: but I've heard for people who have gone for runs,
• 12:08
  Speaker 5: first ten to fifteen minutes just suck. After that, it's amazing,
• 12:13
  Speaker 5: it's so engaging, it's like it sets you up for
• 12:15
  Speaker 5: the rest of the day. And I think it's like
• 12:16
  Speaker 5: that with any endeavor, you've got to be willing to
• 12:19
  Speaker 5: go into the suck and embrace what you don't know
• 12:22
  Speaker 5: if you're ever going to get enjoyment out of it,
• 12:24
  Speaker 5: because if you're not getting any level of enjoyment and fulfillment,
• 12:27
  Speaker 5: you're probably not going to get very very good and
• 12:30
  Speaker 5: you're probably not going to facilitate the exact outcome you.
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: Would want in the first place.
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: So it's like, I think it's those stages of this
• 12:37
  Speaker 5: shit sucks engagement. I didn't even realize I was engaged
• 12:41
  Speaker 5: because I was too engaged to realize I was engaged.
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: But after the fact, Wow, that felt good.
• 12:46
  Speaker 5: And then putting that stuff out there and seeing what
• 12:49
  Speaker 5: the reaction is and learning and growing and moving forward.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: I love it. I feel like there's different I think too.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: When some people say I'm not ready, they're really talking
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: about psychologically or you know, emotionally, and they're saying, I'm scared.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: I'm not ready. I'm scared. So there's that kind of
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: not ready, But then there's the I'm not ready because
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: I don't have the skills or the knowledge or the
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: understanding or the practical tools or resources. And I feel
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: like when I started UNI, I was ready mentally and
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: emotionally but in terms of how to do it, I
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: was completely ill prepared, like practically, and I should have
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: done Look looking back, I could have really prepped myself
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: much better. But at the time, I had three three gyms,
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: I was working full time, and I just showed up
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: on day one. And while I absolutely didn't expect that
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: I would be a superstar academic by any means, I
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: realized by the end of this literally lecture one, what
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: a steep learning it was going to be and how
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: unlikely it was that I would even get through one semester.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: And that was just because I don't even understand these words.
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: I don't know how to Like. I was literally looking
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: at a keyboard, pressing my left index finger on each letter.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: It would take me a minute to write four words.
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: And then I'm sitting next seventeen year olds that are
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: just writing I don't know, sixty seventy words a minute,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: not even looking at their fingers. I'm like, that's fucking voodoo,
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: that's magic. How are they doing this? You know? But
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: that was the starting point, and I think there's that,
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: you know, being able to Like. When I wrote my
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: first book, I was so riddled with insecurity and self
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: doubt and imposter syndrome because clearly I could never write
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: a book, and clearly no one will publish this, and
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: clearly no one will read it or buy it. And
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: then you start with a draft and you go, well,
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: it's terrible, but I can make it better. And then
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: by the tenth version it's it's less terrible again. Then
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: by the time I wrote book number four or five,
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: there's a level of it. And it's not that I
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: had innately more talent, but I just had more skill
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: and more understanding. And so now you go into it
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: with a level of preparedness and readiness that you couldn't
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: have had without doing Book one with all your ineptitude.
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: Right, well, I don't know.
• 15:22
  Speaker 5: Like my first book, I had absolutely zero and pastor syndrome.
• 15:26
  Speaker 5: I was really engaged and I was confident. It was
• 15:29
  Speaker 5: after I read it, when it was published, then I
• 15:31
  Speaker 5: had it pasta centdrome. I was like, yeah, this is
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: this is pretty bad. So it happened in reverse for me.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: But you're an idiot.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: So I just wrote a chapter for a collaboration book
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: and I agreed to that. When I got back from
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: the Humalayas, I was invited to do it, and I
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: sat down one day and I did some writing and
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: I ended up writing I think it was about three
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: and a half thousand words, so it's just a small chapter.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: Wrote it all out. I thought, I'll come back to that,
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: I'll do some more work on it.
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: And then it got to this got to some deadlines looming,
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: and I just emailed and said I'm going to step
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: out of this, thanks guys, because I'm not feeling it.
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: And I hadn't even gone back and read it. I
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: was like, what I wrote was a bit shit, So
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to do it. And Susan said, can
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: I change your mind? I picked you for a reason,
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: and so we had a quick chat and I said,
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: all right, i'll go revise what I wrote. I'll do
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: some writing, I'll figure it out. I basically just sent
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: through what I had written and she loved it. So
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: it's getting published. But and I was like, you know,
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: I'll probably read it at some point and go that
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: was shit. But it was like I almost did what
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: I tell people not to do and just pulled the
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: pin on something i'd already done the work on because
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: of imposter syndrome.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but you can't care better at what you're not.
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: Doing right, So exactly, you know, next time.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: You write a chapter or a book or whatever, it'll
• 16:58
  Speaker 1: be better. You'll start from a different you know. It's
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: like you and you're boxing. The first time you started boxing,
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: you probably got punched in the face or the equivalent.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Then eventually, you know, it's like that changes because there
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: was a first time that you did it where you
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: were scared, where you're incompetent, where you're insecure, where you
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: are unprepared, but there was still a first time. That's
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: my point. It's like, I feel a little bit like
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: we we sometimes won't do anything if we think we
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: might not be good at it, or we might look silly,
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: or we might fail, or we might not measure up
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: or as be as good as the others. Well, that's
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: literally where we start with everything, isn't it.
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: Imagine how many incredible books are available now that mightn't
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: have been available, Or imagine how many amazing manuscripts are
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: sitting in someone's been because they've decided what I just did,
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: but now they've gone on to become an incredible author
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: that's written life.
• 18:00
  Speaker 3: Changing books, not saying well I'm going to do that,
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: but you know, like there'd be so many people that
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: did what I did.
• 18:06
  Speaker 5: Yeah, Stephen King, Steve, I don't know what it was,
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: but his first book, Ease Me, supposedly like he had
• 18:15
  Speaker 5: he had sent it out and got so many rejections
• 18:18
  Speaker 5: from so many publishers that he had he had just
• 18:22
  Speaker 5: thrown it in the bin, the manuscript, and it was his
• 18:25
  Speaker 5: wife who took it out and sent it to one
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: more publisher and that started his career. I mean, your
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: brain is an asshole. I'm not talking to either of you.
• 18:34
  Speaker 5: I'm speaking in general. Where like lou Wit Tim said,
• 18:37
  Speaker 5: it's like I almost did what I encourage people not
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: to do, and she wrote, this is like, nah, I'm
• 18:43
  Speaker 5: just my head's not in this sent it out and
• 18:47
  Speaker 5: somebody else appraised it as this is exactly what I
• 18:50
  Speaker 5: was looking for.
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: This is brilliant.
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: We're not objective, like we tell ourselves a story constantly,
• 18:57
  Speaker 5: it's probably not a true story. Like Martin Sullig, this
• 19:01
  Speaker 5: guy is the father of positive psychology, is the head
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: of the American Psychological Association for years, and he was
• 19:09
  Speaker 5: talking about like we have such expectations of what something
• 19:13
  Speaker 5: should feel like, going back to what your earlier points Greig,
• 19:17
  Speaker 5: it's like, you know, sometimes it's like that's the worst strategy.
• 19:20
  Speaker 5: He was talking about fighter pilots and snipers, and just like, okay,
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: if you're trained to be a fire pilot, you've got
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: an instructor there, and they're gonna send that plane into
• 19:31
  Speaker 5: a nosedive until the trainee is terrified. And in that
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: point when they're terrified, they're going to learn how to
• 19:39
  Speaker 5: pull that nose up because you're going to be sleep deprived,
• 19:43
  Speaker 5: you're going to be under so much stress, things happening
• 19:46
  Speaker 5: so quickly, and you're gonna be shitting yourself and you've
• 19:49
  Speaker 5: got to keep that under control and be able to
• 19:50
  Speaker 5: handle that plane if you want to be able to
• 19:53
  Speaker 5: come back home. And he's like, well, if you if
• 19:55
  Speaker 5: you talk to like a lot of people today, they'll
• 19:57
  Speaker 5: be like, okay, well, oh jeez, you know you're tired.
• 20:00
  Speaker 5: Put them on medaphanel and you know, maybe do a
• 20:02
  Speaker 5: gratitude journal before you hop into the plane.
• 20:04
  Speaker 4: You're going to die.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: It's maybe bring your mum and you'll be all right.
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: You'll be all right. Have you had breakfast?
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: You know, talking yourself out of something.
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: I think also conversely, what about the people who are
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: smarter and more talented than us three, which is a
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: billion people, I'm sure, no disrespect to you too, but
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: who were super smart, super talented, got such incredible potential,
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: but never actually pressed the button, you know, because of whatever.
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: And that, you know, those people that could have written
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: that best seller, or could have built a billion dollar brand,
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: or could have started a charity and done incredible things
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: or could have, you know, but because of fear or
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: because of self doubt or you know, they never did.
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: That's that's kind of sad as well. I think, you know,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: what's that saying don't die with your music still in you?
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: You know, I think that just being able to I
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: think part of it for me anyway, is saying, look,
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: I'm going to try this and I could fail, and
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: that's okay. I'm going to try this. It could suck,
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: that's okay, I could be shitted it. That's okay, because
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: that's a practical reality of the human experience.
• 21:23
  Speaker 5: Right Well, Graig, what do you think, what if somebody
• 21:31
  Speaker 5: doesn't know because a lot of people don't know how
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: to do what they do before they've done it. What
• 21:36
  Speaker 5: if somebody doesn't know exactly what it is they want
• 21:39
  Speaker 5: to do, Like how powerful is the why?
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: Like, what do you do?
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: I know there's something I love and there's contextually something
• 21:48
  Speaker 5: I want to do, but I'm not really sure exactly
• 21:50
  Speaker 5: what that is.
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: What are your thoughts about?
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a great question. I mean a couple
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: of things come to mind. The first thing is, I
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: think I used to do this thing. I don't do
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: it much anymore because it's I'm working with a slightly
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: different capacity. Bit when I would work with people and
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: they knew that where they were wasn't where they wanted
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: to be, but they didn't know exactly literally or metaphorically,
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: they didn't know really exactly where they wanted to be.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: So we would do this reverse goal setting process where
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: you just go, all right, do you want to work
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: in an office? No? Do you want to put on
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: a suit every day? I do not. Do you want
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: to work a nine to five I do not. Do
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: you want to?
• 22:32
  Speaker 5: You know?
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden you eliminate a million jobs,
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: you know, So you start to get clear about the
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: things that you don't want. And even if we reverse
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: engineer things or we use that same protocol with things
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: like do you want high blood pressure? No? Do you
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: want to be out of do you want to be poor?
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: Do you want to be whatever? You know you can go?
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: All right? Well, then well then if you don't want
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: to saw back and you don't want to high blood pressure,
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: and you don't want you know, a shitty immune system,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: and you don't want to be predisposed to disease because
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: you have a crappy lifestyle or crappy habits or behaviors,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: then let's put in place of protocol with aligns with
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: which aligns with that, you know. So I think there's that,
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: But also I just think, you know, like, even though
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: I'm kind of doing you know, my researchers or science based,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: I actually think I'm more naturally creative than I am
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: academic and scientific. You know. For me, creativity I find easy,
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: not that I'm brilliant at it, but I find it
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: much more like creating things and being funny and telling
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: stories and coming up with an idea and turning the
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: idea into a thing and having a concept in my
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: head that becomes a real thing outside my head. That's
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: a creative process. I find that my more my natural
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: habitat than me writing academic papers. Like for me, that
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: is me doing a hard thing that it's not something
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: I'm great at, it's not my natural habitat, you know.
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: So I think if you can get clear about the
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: things where like where do you feel the best, what's
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: your you know, what is like for you your version
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: of your natural habitat where you feel like you most belong,
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: but also maybe you can do the most good, Like
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: I feel even with this podcast, while we share lots
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: of stories and ideas and information and research and that
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: I still over the top of that. My My priority
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: is that we create an experience that firstly is just
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: really good to listen to, Like is this an interesting conversation?
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: Are these good stories? Is this relevant?
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: You know?
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: So for me it's like I guess trying to help
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: people find that part of maybe what they haven't found,
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: versus I've got to have a job and I've got
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: to pay the bills.
• 24:57
  Speaker 5: That resonates with me, like what do you really not
• 25:00
  Speaker 5: want and what's on the other side of that. Yeah,
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: I don't even think you have to have a correct answer.
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: It's not like this lightning bolt hits you. It's oh,
• 25:08
  Speaker 5: it's clear. I think there's also an element of go
• 25:11
  Speaker 5: out and play with that like we talk about like
• 25:15
  Speaker 5: carving out a path and stick to.
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: Itiveness and all of this is very important, but.
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: Mammals human let's talk human beings dedicate a good portion
• 25:27
  Speaker 5: of our life to play. Like Stuart Brown in his
• 25:30
  Speaker 5: book Play, he poses a question.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: Why would we do that?
• 25:34
  Speaker 5: Because that's such a crazy thing for a human being
• 25:38
  Speaker 5: to do, or any primate to do. Because the time
• 25:40
  Speaker 5: that you're playing, you're not hunting, you're not vigilant for
• 25:44
  Speaker 5: threats and predators. It's kind of dangerous because it helps
• 25:49
  Speaker 5: create that creativity. It helps us imagine and test out
• 25:53
  Speaker 5: scenarios that are going to make a difference when we're
• 25:57
  Speaker 5: in real life survival situations, and most important, create socialization,
• 26:01
  Speaker 5: like how do we work together to survive and then thrive.
• 26:05
  Speaker 5: Go out and play with shit, because you know, you
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: might not have to rate that next book. Maybe it's
• 26:09
  Speaker 5: about playing that next instrument for you or I don't know,
• 26:12
  Speaker 5: maybe you want to be a forest ranger. I don't
• 26:14
  Speaker 5: know where that came from, but I forest Rangers's like
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: a pretty cool job. But play with shit and be
• 26:20
  Speaker 5: okay with like, hey this isn't for me, but oh man,
• 26:24
  Speaker 5: there's some elements, there's some elements of this that I
• 26:27
  Speaker 5: really like.
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: It's like, oh God, what is that? How do I
• 26:31
  Speaker 4: dissect that?
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, when I when I started working, I figured
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: out which I've shared many times here, so apologies, but
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: it's relevant to this chat. I figured out quite quickly
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: that I didn't want a job. In inverted comments, like
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: I wanted to work, but I didn't want a job.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to work for someone else necessarily not.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: My bosses weren't terrible, but it wasn't an inspirational relationship.
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: They didn't I couldn't learn a lot from them. I
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: felt like I was stagnating and turning up at a
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: certain time and going at a certain time and doing
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: a set to do list of things and like I
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: could do it, and I did it, and I did
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: kind of eight years of that before I opened my
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: first business. But yeah, I was really clear by the
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: time I was about twenty or twenty one that me
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: having a job was not a thing that I wanted
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: for my entire adult life. I wanted to work. I
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: wanted to create. I wanted to make money. I wanted
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: to take ideas in my head and turn them into
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: actual things in the world. I wanted to build my
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: own team. I wanted to learn, you know, all that
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: stuff that I would learn outside of that other kind
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: of environment and that other model of work. And it's
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: not that the other model of work, the standard or
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: the typical model, is a bad model, but it is
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: for me. And I think this is one of the
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: other challenges, is trying to figure out not what's good
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: for Bobby or Tip or Craig, not what's good globally
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: or not what's the standard protocol or what are the
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: three or four steps too, but rather for me, the listener,
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: the individual, with my personality and my outlook and my
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: passion and my purpose and the things that like my fire,
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: what's optimal for me, because what's optimal for even us
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: three is not the same, and we're probably quite similar
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: in a way, you know. But and then that trying
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: to and that's one of the tough things about being coached,
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: I think, is that you know, whoever coaches you, like
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: it or not, they're going to have said ideas. We've
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: all got said ideas. I think hopefully we're open minded,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: but at the same time, I'm always looking through the
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Craig lens at the world and you two are looking
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: through your lens, and it's trying to it's trying to
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: help people to understand themselves so that they can understand
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: for them what's the best door to open for you?
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Because you're best or will be my worst door.
• 29:03
  Speaker 5: I think this is why, no matter what we're talking about,
• 29:07
  Speaker 5: whether it's writing that next book, pursuing your dreams, self
• 29:11
  Speaker 5: awareness is the key to of the lock on any
• 29:13
  Speaker 5: forward mobility in your life.
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: Like what what am I really about?
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: What am I? What am I afraid of?
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: Like? Why am I different than someone else? Like for me,
• 29:24
  Speaker 5: I know I didn't really care if I worked for
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: somebody or if I did my own thing.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: I've done both.
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: But the thing that the thing that for me has
• 29:32
  Speaker 5: been crushing about and not always, but there have been
• 29:36
  Speaker 5: times where I had very specific ideas within an organization.
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: I saw the world in a certain way and the
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: organization did not see the world that way, and I
• 29:46
  Speaker 5: was like, Okay, my ideas are going to have to
• 29:49
  Speaker 5: either be repressed or are they're going to die because
• 29:52
  Speaker 5: this is just not the environment. We're not here right now,
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: We're not going in that direction. And now, when you
• 29:58
  Speaker 5: love something and you can't and express it. It hurts,
• 30:02
  Speaker 5: and I think.
• 30:03
  Speaker 4: It dampens you. It's like a dimmer switch on your brain.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And also I think, like why could or not
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: want it or not? Most of us live in a
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: kind of a collective mindset and culture where certain things
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: are the things to do and you need to you know, like,
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: you get married, you have a kid or two, you
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: might get divorced, you might get remarried, you have a job,
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: you have a car, you have a you know, there's
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: you know, you get an education. Of course I get it.
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: But like, for example, I couldn't actually tell you how many,
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: but it would be well over a hundred times people
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: have said to me what is wrong with you? As
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: in what's wrong with me? I don't get it. They're like,
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: I don't get it, what's wrong with you? Why are
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: you not married? Like? Which is? I get it? And
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: that doesn't really hurt me. But it's a really fucking
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: offensive thing to say, right, and because they think and
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: that's cool, I'm I'm not at all anti marriage. In fact,
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: I think for most people marriage is a great choice,
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: or at least it's the right choice, you know. But
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: but for me, I never did and it wasn't a
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: goal that wasn't something I set out to do or
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: not do. It was not part of my to do list.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: If it happened, it did, but as it turns out,
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: it didn't. Not good or bad, that's just my journey.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: But yeah, people when you don't do the thing that
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: they think you should do, Like literally, people say you,
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: But I don't get it. You're like, you're so normal, though,
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: and you seem so It's like they're trying to figure
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: out what's wrong with me or what's broken about me
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: that I wouldn't be married, and you know, without trying
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: to over explain yourself or without trying to rationalize or justify,
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: I really don't get into it. But I'm amused how
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: with things like that, how judgmental people can be without
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: even remotely thinking they're being judgmental. Like, I'm like, that
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: is so fucking rude, And you don't even know you're
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: being rude because you're you're essentially insulting how I live
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: and how I've chosen to be.
• 32:22
  Speaker 5: I'm curious why it's so important to someone else that
• 32:27
  Speaker 5: you're not married. Yeah, like, are you living next door
• 32:32
  Speaker 5: to them and their cheating spouse? Is that what the
• 32:35
  Speaker 5: concern is, I mean, what, how does it affect their
• 32:39
  Speaker 5: life if you're not married?
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 32:42
  Speaker 4: So I think.
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: I was going to say, tif do you get any
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: of that? Sorry?
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, of course?
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: How old are you now? Forty two?
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: Forty two in May? But you keep putting me there
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: far earlier?
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: What day in May? So we can all start saving
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: first of May?
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: May day, May day, May day.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: May day? Does it bother you or do you get
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: it often? Or how do you deal with it?
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: It doesn't bother me. I just tell people I've got
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: a lot of issues.
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, do you tell people you've got three blokes on
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: the go? I'm doing all right.
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: Sometimes I wish I could just say I was gay
• 33:20
  Speaker 3: so that people would, you know, so blokes would just
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: leave me alone.
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: Well, you're thirty percent dudes. So I don't know why
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: I said that. I don't think that makes any difference
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: at all.
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's interesting, but I guess people are just a
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: lot of people that have followed that same that path
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: are around people that have all done this. You know,
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: they've grown up, they've done the same thing. They've It's
• 33:50
  Speaker 3: just an expectation. It's interesting and it's not something we
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: think we're choosing. When we follow the herd, we just
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: do what people are doing.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think that's why I think it is.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: What's that.
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: I don't think people are doing things for their own
• 34:08
  Speaker 5: intrinsic reasons.
• 34:09
  Speaker 4: I think they're doing them.
• 34:10
  Speaker 5: And I'm not saying in general a lot of people
• 34:12
  Speaker 5: are doing I'm not saying if you're married, you didn't
• 34:14
  Speaker 5: marry your spouse for intrinsic reasons.
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: But this.
• 34:18
  Speaker 5: Obsession with everybody doing the same thing that I do, Like,
• 34:21
  Speaker 5: oh my god, are you married?
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: No?
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: Why aren't you married? Oh you're married? You have kids?
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: What?
• 34:25
  Speaker 4: No kids?
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: Why?
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: What's wrong? What's the matter? If you think about the.
• 34:33
  Speaker 5: Most fulfilling thing you've ever done in your life, yes,
• 34:37
  Speaker 5: you want to bring other people into it, but you're
• 34:40
  Speaker 5: not overly obsessed and preoccupied with who's doing exactly what
• 34:44
  Speaker 5: I'm doing and who's not because you're doing your thing.
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: So I wonder how much confidence we have in the
• 34:51
  Speaker 5: things we do if we insist that everybody's got to
• 34:54
  Speaker 5: be exactly like us.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I actually you think that most people like I
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: personally think this is not a broad thing. But for me,
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: most of the things that I do that work for
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: me I would not recommend for other people because I
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: think for a lot of people the stuff that I do,
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: they wouldn't like, they wouldn't enjoy it, they wouldn't be
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: living their best life. It wouldn't work for them because
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: they're not like me, not better, not worse, you know,
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: just not me different, And so the shit that works
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: for me, especially by the time you get to my age,
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: when you've lived by yourself for decades and decades and decades, right, well,
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: you just you have a certain operating system and you
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: know what works. And looking through someone else's lens at
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: your behavior, they could go, you're weird, and that doesn't
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: bother me. I would say, by your standards, I'm weird
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: and I get it that and you know, and by
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: my standards, you might be weird, and it's all good.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: And we don't all need to as you were inferring
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: mate will need to be on the same team or
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: doing the same thing. But I think like ultimately, this
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: idea that there is a single best way to do
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: pretty much anything is a pretty flawed. You know, there's
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: the best way to eat, No, there's not. There's the
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: best way to have a relationship. Nope, there isn't there's
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: the best way to build a business. Nope, there are
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: a million great ways to do a million different things right,
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: and it's trying to find out what is the optimal
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: protocol for that individual based on a myriad of variables.
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: It's not about you want to get to be well.
• 36:33
  Speaker 1: The way that you get to be is these three steps.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: But I think that this is the idea that we
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: get sold a lot in our culture is that there
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: are you know, that there is a best diet, that
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: there is a best business model, that there is a
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: best podcast, whatever, there's the best podcast in the world. No,
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: it's not. But some people, some people love this show.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: Some people listen for four minutes and go, this is
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: fucking bullsh I don't blame them, you know, it's like
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: but for some people it's inspirational, it resonates, it's a
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: bit amusing, and for those people it is it literally
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: is that experience, and for other people it's not. So
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: we're not trying to be all things for all people.
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: And we realize that, you know, there is no I guess,
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: universal process that fits or serves every person.
• 37:26
  Speaker 4: What the tyranny of homogeny?
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: Why do you think people because the Comedy's Festival's on
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: on what I'm doing a lot of watching reels and stuff.
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: Why do you think people get so angry and expressive
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: when they don't find a comedian funny? Like, there's been
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: a few clips of Dave Hughes on different things lately,
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: and I always look the comments and so many people
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: are like, he's not even funny, he's not even funny,
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: but they're so angry about it, And I'm like, well,
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: he makes his money from his humor, and people are
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: buying tickets to see him, and people are laughing at him,
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: and people are enjoying what he does.
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: So why are you so.
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: Angry that someone you don't find funny is having success?
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: And why do you want to bring them down?
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: That's a good question. That's a good question. I think
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: I love that the truth. The truth is, it's like, well,
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: he's not funny for me. Yeah, to me, Comma, he's
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: not funny, But you don't speak on behalf of everyone,
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: So shut the fuck up. Just preface everything you're going
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: to say with in my opinion, and maybe we'll listen.
• 38:38
  Speaker 5: Yeah, there's a type of person that I see emerging
• 38:43
  Speaker 5: more frequently, and to me, I think it's because things.
• 38:48
  Speaker 4: Are disruptive and what we're talking about with lack.
• 38:50
  Speaker 5: Of predictability, you have a harder time grappling with adversity.
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: I mean, to me, I'm thinking, one, if I got
• 38:59
  Speaker 5: to see a comedian and I reserve the night out
• 39:02
  Speaker 5: paid money and comedians not funny, all right, that sucks
• 39:05
  Speaker 5: because I could have grabbed the.
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: Curry instead and just like stay at home.
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: But there's if I'm watching a YouTube video, it's a
• 39:13
  Speaker 5: very different story is and I what I'm seeing is
• 39:17
  Speaker 5: that comedian is not funny. It's almost like they don't
• 39:20
  Speaker 5: deserve their success. I deserve success because I'm a real person,
• 39:26
  Speaker 5: working a real job, making a real contribution. Yeah, because
• 39:30
  Speaker 5: like what the fucking thought leaders and comedians ever contributed
• 39:34
  Speaker 5: to society?
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: Like get over yourself.
• 39:37
  Speaker 5: And it's like and if I'm not living my dream
• 39:41
  Speaker 5: doing real work, why should somebody who is an entertainer
• 39:46
  Speaker 5: who just tells jokes for a living, why should they have.
• 39:49
  Speaker 4: All that success?
• 39:50
  Speaker 5: And it's like, wow, what is that contributing to your
• 39:55
  Speaker 5: life or anybody else's Because this person's living their dream, right,
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: this person's contributing. I think comedians are people who turn
• 40:04
  Speaker 5: a mirror and have us look at ourselves as individuals
• 40:07
  Speaker 5: and society, and they frame it through humor in a
• 40:11
  Speaker 5: way where it's palatable, where I don't automatically reject it,
• 40:15
  Speaker 5: because there's a common, undeniable truth there, which is what
• 40:19
  Speaker 5: makes it funny.
• 40:20
  Speaker 4: So I think comedians are one of the most valuable
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: people in society.
• 40:25
  Speaker 5: Not saying they are, I'm just saying from my perspective,
• 40:29
  Speaker 5: that's how I see it.
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: I wonder I wonder that, like, why would that because
• 40:34
  Speaker 4: it's the question you asked. I think that all the time.
• 40:36
  Speaker 5: Why are you so angry about you not finding someone funny?
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: What do you think is because you know, if these
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: people jump on and bag Dive Hughes for example, like
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: tiff was, by the way, I love Dive Hughes. I
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: know him quite well. I've trained him a dozen times
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: and you know we've done shows with him, and he
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: is a rock solid human. May not find him funny
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: or you may either way. That's okay. But obviously when
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: someone jumps in this little online platform and they're just
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: screaming fucking venom and whatever, you're like, okay, but we
• 41:15
  Speaker 1: know that it's not going to change anything. It's not
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: like anyone's going to change what they're doing because you're
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: saying this, right, I wonder what the motivation is. And
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: I think, like, I think of all the things that
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: you could be doing today with your time and your
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: potential and your brain and your ability to type and
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: to pay attention to things. Of all the things that
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: you could do, this is what you're choosing to do
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: to write this horrible, hurtful you know. And it's not
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: even I mean, it's just an opinion of a person.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: It's not like we're even talking about some global issue.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: Like what's the reason for that? Do people just want
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: attention or validation? What do they want? Bobby?
• 42:00
  Speaker 5: No, But you're right, I should probably stop doing that.
• 42:03
  Speaker 5: He did so much time spew and vanom on the internet.
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you should maybe wind back on that. Like, there's
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: a dude out the moment. I'm not going to say
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: his name, but he's been on a lot of podcasts
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: I've listened to, and I find him he seems like
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: a really nice guy, really likable, bit lovable, bit of
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: a lad. But I find his stand up unfunny, which
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: is why I'm not going to say his name. But
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: he's got a new thing out at the moment, and
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: I wish he was funny, And I'm sure people do
• 42:37
  Speaker 1: find him funny, but I look at him, you know,
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: when you really want someone to be good, but to you,
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: they're not hits like that. For me, I want this
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: guy to be funny because he's a good guy and
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: I like him, and he's got some good stories. But
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: when he walks out on stage and does stand up
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: to me, it's completely unfunny. But I would never write that,
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: or I would never And at the same time, I
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: don't like. I literally look at it and I go,
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: I don't know how you get ten thousand people in
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: a room. I don't know how he does it. But
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: there's no jealousy and no resentment. It's like, I'm like,
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: you're fucking amazing. You're amazing that you've got this ability
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: to do this, you know. But that's the thing, is
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: like someone else would look at him and go, no,
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: he's a comedic genius. You don't get it.
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: What about how much I used to dislike for no reason,
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: Jimmy Carr. Now I can't get enough of him. I
• 43:29
  Speaker 3: binge him all the time. He's very full on, very controversial,
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: at times.
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: But now he's one of my favorites.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: Wow, and only because I listened to his podcast on
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: Dirivis Ceo heard him as a human went oh, you're
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: very smart and very good.
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: Well that's the thing I love about him too, is that.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: And while he can be fucking a lot politically incorrect
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: as anything, but yeah, he's to me anyway, he's super
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: intelligent and he thinks things through, and he he's not
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: a sheep. He's not living in the fucking the ideological
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: echo chimber at all. He's got his own little space
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: and if people like it or don't like it, he's
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: okay with that.
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:16
  Speaker 5: I mean, you make a living observing the world and
• 44:20
  Speaker 5: extracting insights and delivering it in the way that's humorous.
• 44:23
  Speaker 5: You have to be highly intelligent. What I love about
• 44:26
  Speaker 5: Jimmy kar is and I like his comedy a lot,
• 44:30
  Speaker 5: but a lot of times I'm sure the two of
• 44:32
  Speaker 5: you have done the same thing. Where I'm not watching
• 44:35
  Speaker 5: someone presents something, I'm studying them. His delivery, his timing
• 44:41
  Speaker 5: is exquisite. Like if you had if you had a
• 44:45
  Speaker 5: script and you memorized everything that Jimmy Krr said in
• 44:50
  Speaker 5: one of his shows and you got up in front
• 44:52
  Speaker 5: of a room of people and you said the same
• 44:54
  Speaker 5: exact thing.
• 44:55
  Speaker 4: One you're plagiarizing. Shame on you, two.
• 44:59
  Speaker 5: It would be it wouldn't be funny at all because
• 45:02
  Speaker 5: you wouldn't have his cadence, you wouldn't have his rhythm
• 45:04
  Speaker 5: and timing. It's just so damn precise and his brain's
• 45:08
  Speaker 5: working that quick. Because one of my favorite things about
• 45:11
  Speaker 5: Jimmy Carr is he'll rock up and probably know exactly
• 45:15
  Speaker 5: what he's going to say, he's rehearsed at a hundred times,
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: but then he'll open up the audience to heckle him.
• 45:20
  Speaker 5: He has no idea what's coming, but he has certain
• 45:22
  Speaker 5: patterns of thought. It's almost like a chess master. It's
• 45:25
  Speaker 5: like they don't think fifty steps ahead of the average person.
• 45:28
  Speaker 5: They just recognize patterns easily. So he's gonna have a
• 45:31
  Speaker 5: comeback and it's going to be on point nine out
• 45:34
  Speaker 5: of ten times. To me, Wow, that's even more impressive
• 45:37
  Speaker 5: to me.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: And then you get some jourius in the audience who
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: thinks he's gonna fucking decimate Jimmy Carr, who's a tenth
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: then verbal black belt. It's like, yeah, good luck, Champ,
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: you fucking good luck, good luck. Do your best, but
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: do that I mean for hecklers. Yeah, it's kind of stupid,
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: isn't it. But in that environment, like do they really think?
• 46:00
  Speaker 5: Or is that just part of the fun because he's
• 46:01
  Speaker 5: opened up to the audience like, you do your worst
• 46:04
  Speaker 5: and we're all going to have fun.
• 46:05
  Speaker 4: And I have to laugh at your expense a little bit.
• 46:08
  Speaker 4: But no, how I'm done.
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I think people who can do comedy and
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: you know, recognized as being very funny. Ah, yeah, it's
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: a different people. Don't people underestimate what kind of intelligence
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: that takes and situational awareness and social intelligence and emotional
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: intelligence and timing and skill and memory, you know, to
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: stand up there and make ten thousand people laugh. That
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: is that. I'm jealous of comics because I would like
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: to be, But I'm too terrified. If you said you've
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: got to talk, You've got to do a corporate speech
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: to three thousand people, I'm like, no worries. If they
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: said you've got to do three minutes of stand up
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: to five people, I'm not showing up. I'm too scared.
• 46:55
  Speaker 5: I've done it. It is brutal how'd you go horribly?
• 47:02
  Speaker 5: Because the very first time I did stand up, I
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: did it a few times, and the very first time
• 47:07
  Speaker 5: I did stand up, I got what I thought now
• 47:11
  Speaker 5: in retrospect, I didn't realize that then it was the
• 47:14
  Speaker 5: worst possible response because people were laughing. I mean, they
• 47:19
  Speaker 5: weren't like laughing, like if there was a real comedian
• 47:21
  Speaker 5: up there, but for someone who was doing an open
• 47:23
  Speaker 5: mic night. There were quite a few juggles within the
• 47:27
  Speaker 5: five minutes, and I got this thought in my head, Oh,
• 47:32
  Speaker 5: I could do this, and then you come out on
• 47:35
  Speaker 5: thet I'm the next big thing. No, I'm not that delusional,
• 47:39
  Speaker 5: but I was like, I could do open mic night
• 47:41
  Speaker 5: just for a laugh, and if I work on it,
• 47:44
  Speaker 5: I'll get much better. And I could carry this in
• 47:47
  Speaker 5: into my day job. And then you get up a
• 47:49
  Speaker 5: couple of more times, and what happens in those evenings
• 47:53
  Speaker 5: with those audiences is what should have happened the first time,
• 47:56
  Speaker 5: where man, you're.
• 47:58
  Speaker 4: It's just silence.
• 48:00
  Speaker 5: You bomb so bad and it hurts, it hurts you
• 48:04
  Speaker 5: feel I don't care. I don't care how resilient you are,
• 48:07
  Speaker 5: I don't care how thick skinned you are. It really
• 48:10
  Speaker 5: hurts I remember the second time I got up at
• 48:12
  Speaker 5: this show and you can't see anybody because it's like
• 48:16
  Speaker 5: just lights and it's just blackness, but you see the
• 48:18
  Speaker 5: front row.
• 48:19
  Speaker 4: The only response I got from the.
• 48:21
  Speaker 5: Audience was this old guy giving me the middle finger
• 48:25
  Speaker 5: and running his finger across his throat, like saying something
• 48:28
  Speaker 5: to the effect of get the fuck off the stage.
• 48:31
  Speaker 5: And I was so grateful for that guy because that
• 48:33
  Speaker 5: was the one person that was willing to engage with me.
• 48:36
  Speaker 4: He made me feel like I was alive.
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: I would in my fantasy, like other life, I would
• 48:44
  Speaker 5: have liked to be a comedian.
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: The only problem is, like I'm not that funny.
• 48:48
  Speaker 5: I mean, I'm funny, but after you get over my
• 48:52
  Speaker 5: physical appearance, that's only going to take me a minute
• 48:54
  Speaker 5: or two.
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: So you gotta have material beyond that.
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: Stop it, stop it. It's our jomp to put you down.
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: You stop that. This has been a hotchpotch of a conversation.
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: This has been a fucking fruit salad, a verbal fruit salad.
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure how we got where we got, but
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: it's always good to catch up with both you, Bobby.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: How can people find you, listen to you, connect with you?
• 49:21
  Speaker 5: They can find me on the self ubantidote dot com.
• 49:24
  Speaker 5: They could find me on Robert Capuccio dot com. They
• 49:28
  Speaker 5: could find me on Tiff show. I'm there quite a bit.
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: Haven't been in a while, haven't been invaded, to be.
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: Fair, have you been invited so much?
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: What?
• 49:38
  Speaker 4: When?
• 49:38
  Speaker 3: Oh?
• 49:38
  Speaker 4: This was last time. Okay, that's a fair point. So
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: you can find.
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it when you two have a fight
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: on my show about your shows, Jiff. We'll say goodbye
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: for us three.
• 49:51
  Speaker 4: But thank you Tiff, thank you, thank you Tiff, Thank you.
• 49:55
  Speaker 4: Craig