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Chef Life: Surviving the Kitchen Chaos with Eduardo & Elizabeth Espiritu · Chef's PSA Podcast

• 0:00
  Hello chefs, this is Chefs PSA. I'm your host Andre Natera.
• 0:03
  Today I'm joined by Eduardo and Elizabeth Espirito, a husband
• 0:07
  and wife chef team who've learned how to work together in
• 0:09
  and out of the kitchen. We talked about surviving
• 0:12
  chaotic services, the highs and lows of working as a couple, and
• 0:15
  what really happens behind the line.
• 0:17
  It's hilarious, intense, and packed with lessons for anyone
• 0:20
  living the chef life. Stay tuned.
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• 1:34
  Chefs. Good to see you.
• 1:35
  Good to see you. How was dinner last night, by
• 1:37
  the way? Dinner was fabulous.
• 1:39
  So people I don't know, where did you go?
• 1:41
  It's a Arlo Grey. Arlo Grey, Yeah.
• 1:44
  Kristen. Kristen Kish's new place.
• 1:45
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:46
  How was it? Man, it was crazy.
• 1:48
  They roll out the red carpet. For you, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:50
  It did Bananas. So they had this.
• 1:53
  You posted something like bananas.
• 1:55
  It like literally bananas. Right.
• 1:57
  Yeah, it was. They made a banana gas streak on
• 2:00
  a like some kind of pumpkin with a mole.
• 2:03
  I was like, you can make a gas streak out of bananas or like
• 2:08
  that is some like, never heard of it before, which is great
• 2:10
  witchcraft. Yeah.
• 2:12
  Yeah, there's so much there's this is going to be a fun
• 2:16
  episode because there's so much I want to talk.
• 2:18
  I mean, there's so much I want to talk shit about with, with
• 2:21
  you, but let's, you told me a crazy story one time about like
• 2:28
  a disastrous service. And like we, we, we, we talked
• 2:31
  about how sometimes chefs need to like if you're going to lead,
• 2:34
  lead and if you're going to, if you're going to screw up on it,
• 2:37
  right? I want you to tell that story
• 2:39
  because it's wild. Well, 2019 New Year's Eve to
• 2:42
  into 2020, it was a crazy New Year's Eve.
• 2:45
  We sold out the tickets to the hotel.
• 2:47
  Hotels got closed. It was only for tickets, only
• 2:50
  some kind of like Speakeasy cola.
• 2:55
  So we were like, ready to go. The team's ready to go.
• 2:57
  Ordered about $10,000 worth of food and seafood, short ribs,
• 3:03
  vegetables and what have you. Right?
• 3:04
  Like, yeah, I got this, holidays made, I got the line, RDS is
• 3:07
  coming, blah Dee blah, chef. What position are you in at the
• 3:11
  time? I was a sous.
• 3:12
  Chef, you're a sous chef. Were you guys working together?
• 3:14
  Yeah, yeah. OK, that.
• 3:15
  Was a line cook. You're a line cook.
• 3:17
  You're the sous chef. Yeah, wow, Charlie Palmer was
• 3:19
  like crazy at the time. So around 7:30, Yo, chef, I only
• 3:24
  have 4 short ribs and four vegetables.
• 3:26
  What are you talking about? We got to make this last until
• 3:28
  like 9:00. Like, OK, I'm running around my
• 3:31
  heads like, oh man, I got to get this thing thing.
• 3:33
  I got a 2 frozen, 2 frozen tendon.
• 3:36
  I'm cutting it to pieces. Like what am I doing?
• 3:38
  Trying to make the tendon look like short ribs.
• 3:39
  Exactly. I'm I'm we had this, we have
• 3:43
  this freaking steamer and we had the auto sham Halo.
• 3:47
  Put that in the steamer still frozen.
• 3:48
  Fuck it, just put it in the freaking fryer.
• 3:51
  Then I get the the Arju in the back.
• 3:53
  Put some put some corn starch in there.
• 3:56
  May thick it up. Put that thing in there.
• 3:58
  Good vegetables, shrub shop steam and just like and then RO
• 4:02
  DS are coming and like this is the dumbest thing ever.
• 4:04
  I need another person here next year.
• 4:06
  But we made it happen. You know, I'm saying it's one of
• 4:10
  those things that people pay $200 for.
• 4:12
  And then on top of all that, we had a rooftop restaurant they
• 4:16
  were calling. Yo, we don't have any more
• 4:18
  seafood. Like, what do you mean?
• 4:19
  I ordered 2000 pieces of freaking oysters.
• 4:22
  Yeah, Chef. You ordered them all pre Shuck.
• 4:24
  No, we shucked them. We had, we had.
• 4:26
  God, man, I love my team upstairs.
• 4:28
  She was working up there. You ever seen a commercial that
• 4:31
  cartoon like Looney Tunes back in the day?
• 4:34
  The oysters. We gave them the tray and then
• 4:37
  people were just coming up getting the oysters.
• 4:39
  I saw it happy. Yeah, yeah.
• 4:40
  It was just boom boom. Boom.
• 4:41
  Yeah, but it's time to get to the ice sculpture.
• 4:43
  It was all going and like they were shucking oysters to and by
• 4:47
  the time like 2:00 hits, their hands were like shook.
• 4:49
  We had to we had to shook oysters like to order like we
• 4:53
  can't keep up. It was, I think that was the
• 4:55
  that was the last New Year's Eve until COVID happened three years
• 4:59
  months later, but. Oyster shucking parties, man.
• 5:02
  Man, it was it was fun because it it pulls all your ideas and
• 5:08
  your techniques as a chef. You know the four basic thing.
• 5:12
  Heat, saute, fryer. And and and problem mitigation,
• 5:16
  yeah, that's that's what a lot of people don't know about chefs
• 5:18
  is like the problem comes in and it's like, you got to solve it
• 5:21
  quick. How how quick are you on your
• 5:23
  feet? Like we're out of we're out of
• 5:25
  state. What are you where are you going
• 5:27
  to pull some out of your ass? You got to figure it out.
• 5:29
  But the problem was New Year's Eve on that day was on a
• 5:33
  Saturday. So we have to think how we're
• 5:35
  going to do service next week. I mean tomorrow morning we had a
• 5:37
  brunch and service. Thank God we only had 20 covers.
• 5:40
  I want, I want to ask you this, I've been thinking, I'm writing
• 5:43
  a book right now. I'm writing.
• 5:44
  I'm writing two books right now. I'm writing.
• 5:46
  I did this podcast, The 48 Laws of Power for Chefs.
• 5:49
  I'm writing the companion to that.
• 5:50
  That that's the one I want, right?
• 5:52
  I'm halfway done. I should honestly, it'll be, I
• 5:55
  promise you, it'll probably be out before this episode's out.
• 5:58
  And then I'm writing another book that's a little bit more
• 6:00
  serious, but it's it's there's a lot of thought in this other
• 6:02
  book. But I was, I was driving into
• 6:04
  work and I was like, I want to write a children's book about
• 6:08
  why mommy and daddy hate brunch. I was like, I should write this
• 6:13
  kids book. Like, like that way.
• 6:15
  That way all these chefs could just give it to your kids.
• 6:17
  Like, I'm not leaving you on Sunday because I don't love.
• 6:19
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mommy and daddy hate brunch.
• 6:21
  Yeah. That'll be a great one, yeah.
• 6:24
  What's the worst service you've ever seen?
• 6:27
  Worst service I've ever seen. There's a couple, so one that
• 6:31
  sticks out a lot in my mind is a little closer is when there was
• 6:36
  like a blackout in the city of Napa and our hotel was the only
• 6:40
  one that had like power because we were on the generator for the
• 6:43
  Police Department and the fire department for.
• 6:45
  People that know you were an exec chef at A at a hotel in
• 6:47
  Napa, Iowa. Yeah, for 70 years, yeah.
• 6:52
  And, and I was upstairs on the rooftop and everybody comes to
• 6:57
  the hotel trying to charge their iPhones, their computers,
• 7:00
  workstations, and then just everybody's hungry for lunch.
• 7:04
  And we just got murdered. And upstairs we have more of
• 7:08
  like bar food, so the chicken wings and burgers and sliders
• 7:13
  and sandwiches and oysters. And unfortunately, I was
• 7:17
  probably the only cook there. And as he was downstairs getting
• 7:20
  ready for dinner service, I was just laying away 300 covers by
• 7:25
  yourself, by myself. And then finally I was like, I
• 7:28
  can't do this anymore. Like I needed like a restroom
• 7:30
  break or something. Is this like where the tickets
• 7:31
  are to the floor? The servers are like panicked.
• 7:35
  Yeah, pretty much it was. And he sent some some relief for
• 7:38
  me and we just, you know, banged it out and, you know, we got it
• 7:42
  done. And I was like can we please
• 7:43
  hold the door? Like can you, can you pull the
• 7:45
  door? Like give me like at least a 10
• 7:47
  minutes like if. You don't.
• 7:49
  You might not have a cook here. Yeah.
• 7:51
  And that those moments where we would put like a wait, a wait
• 7:54
  time or they would put the ticket, the ticket stanchions
• 7:57
  up. So there was like lines to get
• 8:01
  in because of Max capacity was only a certain amount of people.
• 8:05
  But it's wild. Like I always think sometimes
• 8:08
  during those services, it's like, I don't know how we did
• 8:10
  it, but we did it. What's the wildest story you
• 8:12
  got? So you know the on threads, so
• 8:15
  like not Instagram, but threads, yeah.
• 8:18
  So Cambro, they have kind of a funny account.
• 8:21
  I don't know if you follow Cambro.
• 8:22
  Yeah, I do. I yeah, they got, they got a
• 8:24
  funny account. So they posted the other day.
• 8:26
  What's the worst thing that's that you've ever experienced
• 8:29
  during service, right. And I was like, I, I got a crazy
• 8:32
  cuz everyone's like, oh, we ran out of this.
• 8:34
  We ran out. I was like, I got a crazy story
• 8:36
  and I, I typed it up. But The funny thing is, is I
• 8:39
  think my story was so crazy. Instagram hit it.
• 8:42
  So I don't think anyone saw the story that I typed up.
• 8:44
  I was like, fuck it. I'm just, you know, with my two
• 8:46
  fingers, you know, just let's go at it.
• 8:48
  But this is a crazy story where you know, we have these VI PS,
• 8:52
  this is what our chef, I won't say we're because I don't get
• 8:54
  anyone trouble, but we had these VI PS and what they call a fam
• 8:58
  trip for people that have worked as a chef in a hotel, they might
• 9:00
  know what I'm talking about. Fam trip is a familiar
• 9:03
  familiarization trip where they're bringing their high
• 9:06
  profile clients and they're going to wine and dine them.
• 9:09
  This is an important one. It's a reception.
• 9:11
  We got the stations, we got the beef Wellington and got the chef
• 9:14
  there with that tall hat, you know, real proper, the carving
• 9:17
  set we got over here, we got the salmon Kubiak, we got the cheese
• 9:20
  and wine station, you know, the little the Messe station, the
• 9:25
  charcuterie and all that right then.
• 9:27
  And it's like PX or, you know, VIP and 15 minutes before, you
• 9:32
  know, the general manager of the hotel is walking around making
• 9:35
  sure everything is good, you're good, you're good, everyone's
• 9:38
  good. Everything looks button up your
• 9:39
  your name tags a little Askew. Like, everyone just think
• 9:43
  everything has to just be perfect.
• 9:46
  It just has to look great. And there's something wrong with
• 9:50
  the lighting. And so they say, hey, to the
• 9:53
  engineer, the maintenance guy, and he's an older gentleman.
• 9:58
  And they say, hey, go, go fix that.
• 10:00
  And so he jumps over the, you know, over the banister to go
• 10:05
  fix whatever needed to be fixed. Little did he know that it was a
• 10:08
  false ceiling. And so as he stepped on it, we
• 10:13
  just hear boom, boom. And we're like, and I'm like,
• 10:15
  what the hell was that noise? Everyone's like trying to figure
• 10:17
  out what that was. And someone of the other chefs
• 10:20
  runs over and says, I don't remember what the guy's name Jim
• 10:22
  for story say Jim just fell through the roof.
• 10:25
  And we're like, oh, shit. So we, we go look and I run
• 10:29
  downstairs and what below the, the reception room that we were
• 10:33
  at was the, the bar, you know, the, the hotel bar.
• 10:38
  And the gentleman fell through, landed on the bar.
• 10:43
  And I go down there and you know, there's blood everywhere
• 10:46
  that I'm thinking this guy is dead.
• 10:48
  And all these people start coming down, you know, all the
• 10:51
  other cooks and servers. And I'm like, you don't want to
• 10:54
  see that call 911. Like I'm just like leadership
• 10:58
  panic mode kicks in. I'm like, you don't want to see
• 11:00
  that. Can't Unsee it.
• 11:02
  This might be a dead body like the, the gentleman, like I said,
• 11:06
  was older. And so they call 911, this,
• 11:10
  that, and the other ambulance is coming downstairs.
• 11:13
  The GM of the hotel. I go up and I was like, hey,
• 11:17
  this guy might be dead. He fell through the roof trying
• 11:19
  to fix the lighting. And he says, yeah, but these
• 11:22
  guys appear in 15 minutes. They can't roll back on their
• 11:26
  we. Gotta go.
• 11:26
  We gotta. Go Long story short, the guy did
• 11:30
  not die. The guy, no, thank God.
• 11:32
  The guy, he was out. He broke several bones and I'm
• 11:35
  sure there was a lawsuit somewhere.
• 11:36
  But yeah, he didn't die. But I just remember thinking
• 11:40
  like all the cooks are just shocked because they just saw
• 11:43
  one of their Co workers potentially dead.
• 11:46
  And I was like, oh, would you like some beef?
• 11:48
  Well, each other, Right. Yeah, yeah.
• 11:50
  Stories are wild. You know, I was, I was just
• 11:54
  texting with another chef when I was driving up here.
• 11:56
  And we're talking about like the nostalgia of cooking.
• 11:59
  And in today's days, there's so much modern cooking, whether
• 12:02
  it's trying to reinvent your own style or but I also feel like
• 12:05
  chefs are kind of missing out that didn't grow up with the
• 12:08
  classics. Like you're robbing yourself of
• 12:09
  your culinary history when you when you neglect, you know, the,
• 12:15
  the traditions, right? What do you guys do?
• 12:18
  Like, how do you how do you guys feel about the current
• 12:24
  generation of chefs? Like the job interviews, if you
• 12:28
  had advice for them, like if you're preparing for an
• 12:29
  interview, if you're preparing to come into into the kitchen,
• 12:32
  your workstation, your shoes, your knives.
• 12:34
  Like what are, and I'm gonna ask you first, what are some of
• 12:37
  those things that you would advise to young cooks when
• 12:39
  they're coming in? I would advise them to be on
• 12:43
  time or early. I would advise them to have
• 12:46
  clean shoes on. That's one.
• 12:49
  That's one thing I always look at is the, the appearance,
• 12:52
  whether they're in slacks or jeans or a button upper polo,
• 12:57
  just to be professional. I remember one of my stashes I
• 13:01
  had when I when I got hired on as a you're the stash.
• 13:04
  I was the Stash and I was staging for Marine Circle, which
• 13:08
  is in South Cedo, and it was a Michelin star restaurant.
• 13:12
  And my knives weren't sharp. And the the cook at the end of
• 13:17
  the night was like, if you get this job, make sure your knives
• 13:20
  are sharp. And I was like a chef.
• 13:22
  I got the job. But again, my knives were sharp
• 13:27
  and have been sharp ever since. But it's like those are the
• 13:30
  things that like, if your knives aren't sharp, your herbs are
• 13:32
  going to be trash. Yeah.
• 13:34
  Like but you know. Don't get on those charms right.
• 13:36
  I, you know, it's hard because I, it's so different after the
• 13:40
  pandemic, looking at resumes because it looks good on paper,
• 13:44
  but how, how good are you in the kitchen?
• 13:47
  How good are you under stress, problem solving, your
• 13:51
  leadership, or even just teamwork in general?
• 13:54
  Do you do you put a lot of weight on resumes?
• 13:57
  Hey everyone, I'm going to interrupt this podcast very
• 13:59
  briefly for a special message from the James Beard Foundation
• 14:02
  and Chef Elizabeth Faulkner. Hi, it's Elizabeth Faulkner, and
• 14:06
  I'm a chef, cookbook author, former restaurateur, and I'm the
• 14:12
  chair of the James Beard Award Committee.
• 14:15
  And I happen to be on a culinary cycling trip in Sardinia.
• 14:17
  So hence the background. And I just want to say I'm
• 14:20
  thrilled to announce the 2026 open call for entries is open
• 14:24
  for the James Beard Awards. You know the James Beard
• 14:27
  Foundation celebrates. The.
• 14:29
  All ends of the culinary spectrum and we are celebrating
• 14:34
  40 years of the James Beard Foundation this next year.
• 14:38
  So open call for entries means if you're a chef or you know
• 14:43
  some or a bar manager or cookbook, you can nominate
• 14:46
  yourself. You can other people can
• 14:47
  nominate who they think deserves or who is worthy of a James
• 14:50
  Beard award. I was a nominee in 2005.
• 14:54
  And you never know where the culinary world is going to take
• 14:57
  you even far in places like Sardinia.
• 15:00
  So if you want more information, go to the James Beard website,
• 15:04
  jamesbeard.org/awards and nominate somebody.
• 15:10
  Not as much as I should. I probably should do more
• 15:13
  background checks or like reference checks, like Hey, how
• 15:16
  did you or are you in, in our industry?
• 15:19
  There's you just make one phone call and be like, hey, I this,
• 15:21
  do you know this name? And like, yeah, I know that
• 15:23
  name. Do they show up on time?
• 15:24
  Do they call out? It does it.
• 15:26
  That's what people don't realize is like you put and the worst
• 15:28
  thing is, and you see this all the time now is like it'll say
• 15:31
  sous chef app. And then you're like, I know the
• 15:33
  chef there and you call them like was so and so your sous
• 15:35
  chef like, no, they were a line cook.
• 15:37
  They they were a line cook. And I fired them.
• 15:39
  Yeah, and you're like, damn. That's too late.
• 15:42
  He's already hired. What a lot of young cooks don't
• 15:45
  understand and and it's a it's a mindset thing because when
• 15:47
  you're a young cook, then you go to culinary school, you maybe
• 15:50
  know like 20 people in the industry.
• 15:53
  OK, if every year you meet 20 to 30 people, imagine your chef
• 15:56
  that's been doing it for 10 years.
• 15:57
  He knows 300 people. Yeah, right.
• 15:59
  So his network is much or her network is much larger.
• 16:02
  So it's easy to pick up the phone and say, you know,
• 16:04
  somebody like people lying on your resume.
• 16:06
  It's like don't do that. Yeah.
• 16:08
  It's more credible to your tender how long you've been
• 16:11
  there. If you see somebody that's been
• 16:12
  there for three months or less, it's like why?
• 16:14
  Like, why were you lined up for three months?
• 16:16
  So in the old days, we would say like you don't want to be in
• 16:18
  position less than 18 months or two years, right.
• 16:20
  So it would be like we're going to invest in you for six months
• 16:23
  when and then the next six months or the next year, is your
• 16:26
  ROI paying us back? Because your first six months
• 16:28
  you didn't know what you were doing.
• 16:29
  But nowadays people switch jobs much quicker.
• 16:32
  What what do you guys think about that?
• 16:35
  I feel, you know, it depends on the person in the in the
• 16:38
  position and the environment. If you go into a kitchen and you
• 16:43
  don't feel it, if you don't feel like it's your place to be, then
• 16:46
  I think you should be able to go in and find somewhere where you
• 16:49
  can connect with the chef and in the environment and the food.
• 16:53
  If it speaks to you, if it doesn't speak to you're not
• 16:56
  going to be happy in the long run and longevity that
• 16:59
  restaurant is only going to sacrifice or it's only going to,
• 17:04
  you're not going to get anything out of it.
• 17:06
  But don't you think it's a red flag when someone, and by the
• 17:08
  way, I agree with you, so I don't, I'm not, I'm not trying
• 17:10
  to disagree with what you're saying.
• 17:11
  If you go into a kitchen, it's not the right fit.
• 17:13
  The sooner you figure that out, the sooner you'll be happy.
• 17:15
  But then you realize someone has not the right fit, not the right
• 17:18
  fit, not the right fit. And then you start to wonder
• 17:20
  maybe. It's not you knew, it's not
• 17:22
  them. It's you.
• 17:22
  Maybe it's you, right? Yeah.
• 17:24
  Interesting. What about you, chef man?
• 17:28
  Your your resume's not. No, not really.
• 17:31
  I'm I'm I'm the guy that really likes to see see how you talk in
• 17:36
  interviews, how you dress, you know, if you're gonna come in
• 17:39
  with Nikes and T-shirts and you just come up for work, OK, you
• 17:42
  just come up for work, just kind of dress for the job, you know,
• 17:46
  at least look nice. Are.
• 17:48
  You still a chef coat person If if if you have a magic wand.
• 17:51
  Do you want to wear a chef coat in the kitchen still or you want
• 17:53
  to wear AT shirt? I want AT shirt you want to wear
• 17:55
  T-shirt like they got new T-shirts now I want to wear.
• 17:57
  A chef coat. If it's like 100° wear AT shirt.
• 18:00
  But it depends on the service of the day.
• 18:03
  If you got to be outside touching tables, yeah put in a
• 18:05
  chef coat. But nowadays speaking chef chef
• 18:08
  Forks has AT shirt chef. Just BSA.
• 18:10
  I got plenty of T-shirts, by the way.
• 18:13
  It's one of those things that you got to be more comfortable
• 18:15
  than it is because we all work in those days that chef coats
• 18:19
  were heavy. They're in a back drawer and
• 18:21
  it's like those plastic buttons, like everything is it's it's
• 18:26
  changing now. Yeah, there's, there's a,
• 18:27
  there's a, a page don't eat before reading this.
• 18:31
  I, I like this YouTube or Instagram YouTube page and they
• 18:34
  always show like the old days and the, you know, with get the
• 18:36
  check pants and the, you know, the, the old, yeah, flimsy apron
• 18:40
  and the Macon stock and the flop.
• 18:41
  Some of them have floppy chef had some of the tall white
• 18:44
  tokes. I love that era of cooking
• 18:46
  because it was so, it was so comfortable.
• 18:49
  You know, it was like everyone, everyone.
• 18:50
  It was like those baggy pants. Oh yeah, the chili pepper pants
• 18:54
  were so comfortable. Oh man, I would never be caught
• 18:56
  that enum. Now I had, I had, I had seven of
• 18:59
  them when I was with PF tanks. Do you have the little fish on?
• 19:01
  Them I had the fish, I had the fish, I had the fish, the the
• 19:06
  fish ones, the whisk ones, the torque ones, the black and white
• 19:11
  ones. Man, it's it was crazy.
• 19:14
  What kind of like what when you're when you're working out?
• 19:17
  Like if you had to advise cooks coming into your kitchen, we
• 19:21
  were talking about knives earlier.
• 19:22
  Like you said, get these knives. What What are the What are the
• 19:24
  basic knives that you think every cook should have before
• 19:26
  they come in to day one? A petty or a paring knife, your
• 19:32
  utility knife, which is for me, I like a six inch knife or an 8
• 19:36
  inch knife, But you know, I was never into like the, you know,
• 19:41
  the Japanese knives or the those the name brands of knives.
• 19:46
  You know, I think he was so funny.
• 19:48
  Like sometimes you see cooks like wearing like holding like
• 19:50
  Rachel Ray knives and you're like, yeah, where'd you get that
• 19:53
  at They hit target. Like I asked my one of my cooks
• 19:55
  the other day. I was like, this is a really
• 19:56
  sharp knife. Or did you get Amazon?
• 19:58
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 19:59
  But that's a better question for for this Sir.
• 20:02
  What do you say, Chef? I say just have a chef knife, a
• 20:07
  boning knife and a petty and that's it.
• 20:10
  Yeah, Serrated, serrated, whatever.
• 20:12
  Yeah. Something don't don't be coming
• 20:13
  in in my kitchen with, you know, the buckets in this in the CIA
• 20:18
  freaking you don't need Nets. You don't need all the knives.
• 20:22
  Yo, it's like my kitchen is small and I have all the cooks
• 20:25
  with their San Francisco. My cooks will come in in the
• 20:30
  plastic wrap with towels and had three knives and they're like.
• 20:34
  You really only need 3. That's it.
• 20:36
  You know what I mean? Like that's it.
• 20:37
  It was, it's like, and then all these this cooking school grads
• 20:40
  coming in with their freaking knife bags and we're going to
• 20:43
  put that, yo, I'm like, we gotta get served.
• 20:44
  You know what the worst is when you culinary school students
• 20:47
  that are listening, please stop getting on public transportation
• 20:50
  in your uniform. Yeah, I.
• 20:51
  I like I I hate seeing like like bring AT shirt something.
• 20:56
  I Yeah. Yeah, you're wearing like full
• 20:59
  apron chef hat. Yeah, but there you go.
• 21:01
  Yeah, ready to. Go I did that I shouldn't
• 21:04
  they're. Like, yeah.
• 21:06
  And then you, you're working a train, you know, that disease
• 21:08
  and all, especially in San Francisco when we went to school
• 21:11
  there. It's crazy.
• 21:12
  I remember one time and I lived in Portland, I remember because
• 21:15
  I was that kid. I'm I'm knocking them when I was
• 21:17
  doing the same show, I was dressed up in my fucking whites
• 21:19
  and you know, I had my my cravat tied on or whatever, right?
• 21:21
  And I had my knife toolbox, because back then we would have
• 21:24
  toolbox, you know, And I remember I got surrounded by
• 21:28
  these criminals. They they on the bus, right?
• 21:32
  They surrounded, they come back to me and they're like, what do
• 21:36
  you got in? What do you got in that toolbox?
• 21:39
  And I was like, damn, I don't want to, I'm about to get
• 21:42
  murdered with my own. I was like, I was so scared.
• 21:48
  There's like, there's like for story sake, there's probably
• 21:50
  like 5 of them. And it's just me sitting in the
• 21:52
  back of the bus and I'm like, what?
• 21:54
  Like what do you got in the what do you got?
• 21:56
  Hey, you go to school? I was like, yeah, I go to cook
• 21:59
  in school and like, what do you got in that?
• 22:04
  And I was like, I had to think fast.
• 22:05
  It was like, it's my dirty laundry.
• 22:07
  Yeah, it's like, it's my, it's my dirty apron and stuff like
• 22:09
  that. And they're like, and I was
• 22:11
  like, these guys are gonna like, what was I gonna do?
• 22:14
  I was like, the last thing I want to do is get stabbed on the
• 22:16
  bus with my own chef knife, right?
• 22:18
  Yeah. So anyway, kids listening don't
• 22:20
  wear that shit. Yeah, don't wear Cognito be be
• 22:23
  be safe out there, especially nowadays.
• 22:25
  Yeah, What do you, what do you feel about stages today?
• 22:29
  You. Want to start this off all
• 22:33
  right, Well, as I talked to many chefs about going to stars, just
• 22:37
  have your five basic that you're good at.
• 22:41
  Don't do nothing all crazy off the wall.
• 22:43
  You know what I mean? If you saw something on
• 22:44
  Instagram, you never had, if you had the time, if you had the
• 22:47
  talented technique to see something on the on Instagram
• 22:51
  and you want to do it fine, but don't do it on the in the stars.
• 22:55
  Just stick to your basic. They want temperatures, they
• 22:57
  want flavors and they want colorful.
• 22:59
  You know what I mean? You know, don't do crystal bread
• 23:03
  that takes about an hour and a half to do, which is crazy to do
• 23:07
  to stick to the basic fundamentals of cooking.
• 23:10
  And they want to see the good sear.
• 23:12
  They want a good see the good temperatures on it and the
• 23:14
  flavors that has to be and colorful people, as you say back
• 23:18
  in the day, people eat with their eyes, yes, but also people
• 23:22
  eat with their mouths. If that thing doesn't taste
• 23:24
  good, then you know I'm sorry for you.
• 23:27
  What's the worst stars you've ever seen or cooking interview?
• 23:33
  You don't have to call the person out.
• 23:34
  By name there's there's not too many like bad ones that have
• 23:42
  ever come through our kitchens. But I have broken, broken
• 23:47
  Brennaise sauce. You're like, what is this like?
• 23:50
  Or just their techniques. I I despise when people make
• 23:54
  Brennaise in a in a. In a blender?
• 23:57
  In a blender? Why?
• 23:59
  I do because I don't know how to.
• 24:03
  I'm like, why? Because and I was taught how to
• 24:05
  do it over the boiler and this one over here in my ear.
• 24:09
  You got to get the you got to get the sound of the train with
• 24:11
  the eggs. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 24:13
  But you know, I whatever, there's always, there's always
• 24:16
  more than one road to get to the the end result, right.
• 24:19
  So if they have a faster and better technique that tastes and
• 24:22
  looks the same and more power to them, you know, it's like the
• 24:24
  rest. It's like the grocery stores who
• 24:27
  I see sell like hollandaise and Bernays and bags for their
• 24:31
  asparagus. You're just like, oh, yeah, like
• 24:34
  what? Or a powder that you, all you
• 24:36
  have to do is add water to it and it's like powder Bernays or
• 24:38
  hollandaise. You're just like, this is wild.
• 24:42
  Bad, bad sashes. Or bad cooking interviews?
• 24:46
  Do you have like a standard cooking interview that you give
• 24:48
  people when you hire them? I what I look for, I don't have
• 24:52
  a standard, but what I look for is organization, cleaning this
• 24:55
  and if they're going to throw away or we call it orca, they're
• 25:02
  scraps like they're composables. What?
• 25:05
  What do you mean Torca? That's a like a brand or company
• 25:08
  that except while you're your compostable foods instead of
• 25:12
  just throwing in the trash. But you know, California's very
• 25:16
  green. Yeah, it is.
• 25:17
  That's what we're about. Yeah, so.
• 25:19
  California's very green. Very green.
• 25:21
  So oh, I gotta ask you this. Someone told me this.
• 25:23
  I don't know if it's true but I figured.
• 25:26
  So a friend of mine is a chef in San Francisco and he called me
• 25:29
  up the other day and he's like, we have till I think 20-30 to
• 25:33
  change to electric. Yep.
• 25:34
  Is that true? That's true.
• 25:36
  Berkeley, CA started it two years ago.
• 25:38
  New restaurants that's going to open on new houses.
• 25:41
  It's going to be full electric, no more gas.
• 25:42
  Just going to start off in Berkeley, CA.
• 25:46
  But all restaurants? No, all new restaurants.
• 25:49
  What about existing? Restaurants, they are just so
• 25:51
  fine or they have to convert. So by 20-30 let let's just say
• 25:56
  you are, I'm trying to think what's the the San Francisco
• 25:59
  Marriott Moscone. There's like 1000 room plus
• 26:02
  hotel that has 10 kitchens. They got to convert all their
• 26:05
  kitchens to electric. They don't want to get fine.
• 26:07
  I don't know, but all of mommy and pops is great.
• 26:10
  I mean, if people in London can do the.
• 26:14
  Someone needs to jump in the comments.
• 26:15
  And straighten us out because. I need to know about this
• 26:17
  someone because my friend just told me this.
• 26:19
  Sounds like you got to be kidding me.
• 26:20
  How expensive is that going to be?
• 26:22
  In Berkeley, they passed that like five years ago and new
• 26:26
  restaurants are going to open or convert to electric, you know,
• 26:30
  stove top and those induction burners that we all ate.
• 26:32
  For people that are listening, don't take my word for it.
• 26:35
  Yeah, I'm confused and I'm trying to get unconfused, so if
• 26:38
  someone knows, let me know. Yeah, you haven't heard that.
• 26:41
  No, I. Haven't heard of that.
• 26:43
  If that's crazy, if it's true, because that's that's a mass.
• 26:45
  I mean, that might be that might be the difference between a
• 26:48
  restaurant staying open or closing.
• 26:49
  Yeah. Small independent one, right.
• 26:51
  Yeah. Should California's Wildman.
• 26:54
  You guys got crazy labor laws too.
• 26:55
  Oh my God. Crazy.
• 26:56
  Crazy labor laws. Like double time.
• 27:00
  Pay time and a half you can. Where I work at now if they want
• 27:05
  to wave their their first meal break they can.
• 27:07
  Which is wild to. Me so for people that are
• 27:09
  listening that haven't worked in California, what are some of and
• 27:11
  by the way, I get it like I'm all for the employee, but it's
• 27:15
  almost to the point of like you can't run a business yeah like
• 27:18
  it's it it there's a there's a balance like I want my people to
• 27:20
  make more money, but I also need to keep the doors open Where's
• 27:24
  the where's the balance? But for people listening, So
• 27:27
  what are some of the the unique labor laws that are in
• 27:29
  California? You must take a break after
• 27:33
  before your 5th hour or you'll get a meal break penalty.
• 27:36
  And if you and if you do get a meal break penalty, and I can't
• 27:40
  say, hey, go take a break, they have to do it on their own.
• 27:43
  It's like, or I could schedule a meal break for them.
• 27:47
  And if they don't take it between those that time, I can
• 27:50
  technically discipline them. But who wants to discipline
• 27:53
  somebody there? Yeah.
• 27:54
  And especially in the kitchen, you don't ever really know when
• 27:57
  the appropriate time is unless we have it down in my kitchen
• 27:59
  where we where I work at, where they just one by one just go and
• 28:04
  I'm there. I'm glad that I don't the
• 28:05
  babysit and watch hold their hand on that.
• 28:08
  But it there's times where you're probably going to have to
• 28:10
  because if you they don't take a break before the 5th hour, they
• 28:13
  get a meal penalty in California or the hotel or the restaurant
• 28:17
  or the business has to pay them time and a half if it's called
• 28:22
  what I call a six and out. So if you don't, if you go home
• 28:25
  before the six hour, you don't have to take a break.
• 28:28
  OK, that's different one. If you're under 18, you only can
• 28:32
  work you can only work up until 10:00 PM.
• 28:37
  You can't work with certain machines like a slicer or you
• 28:41
  can't clean a slicer. Yeah, it's.
• 28:42
  Probably for good reason. It's it's probably.
• 28:44
  When I was 14, when I was 16, yeah, I was cleaning slicers and
• 28:47
  I was like I. Was 16 or like these 16 year
• 28:49
  olds? Though I was like what?
• 28:51
  And I should. I wish I would have known that
• 28:53
  law back then. That thing scared me.
• 28:55
  What about and then there's like overtime after 8 hours?
• 28:58
  Overtime after 8. Hours.
• 28:59
  So overtime is a is accrued daily.
• 29:02
  Yes. And you could get double time.
• 29:04
  What after 12, Is that right? Yes, It's been a long time since
• 29:07
  I worked in California. It's double time after 12 and
• 29:10
  then after 14 is triple. But triple time, yeah.
• 29:14
  There's there's a paid holiday. So no matter what, if you are
• 29:17
  working or you're not working, you get the 8 hours on top of
• 29:19
  your hours. So say you work Christmas, this
• 29:21
  is on a Wednesday. You already get 8 hours for that
• 29:23
  shift automatically. So if you come in for Christmas
• 29:26
  and you work another 8 hours, it's 16 hours.
• 29:28
  So 8 of it is overtime. It's it's wild.
• 29:31
  So. So if you're a cook, it's great
• 29:33
  to be a cook. Right.
• 29:34
  No, it's not. It's not.
• 29:35
  Why not? No, because people don't
• 29:36
  understand and you go up to a higher tax record, those
• 29:40
  overtime will get taxed half no matter what.
• 29:43
  Yeah. California has really a.
• 29:44
  Hard. So if you think you're going to
• 29:46
  make double, great. I tell the guys if you're going
• 29:49
  to push overtime, just push 10 hours.
• 29:51
  Anything 12131415 you're just making breaking even is not even
• 29:57
  worth 13 hours or 14 hours. I hope nobody works more than 15
• 30:00
  hours a day but. Yeah, but 10-10 hours, that's
• 30:04
  all my hey, 10 hours, That's all I want you to do.
• 30:06
  Whatever the rest, I figure it out because if I have you work
• 30:10
  12 hours a day and we pay overtime, it's it's going to be
• 30:13
  crazy because you're going to get text.
• 30:16
  And I don't want you to get text.
• 30:18
  If you get text, you'd be like, Chef, I told you, you know what
• 30:21
  I'm saying? If you get paid $1000 in
• 30:23
  overtime, $600.00 of that is going to go to taxes and you're
• 30:27
  only going to be paid 450. That's wild.
• 30:29
  Yeah, yeah, California taxes. California is wacky with a lot
• 30:34
  of things like electrics, like electrics and gas.
• 30:37
  That's going to be like for restaurants, that's tough.
• 30:39
  The labor laws are tough. It's hard to say.
• 30:41
  I want to open up a restaurant. I did this conference where I
• 30:45
  was AI was a guest speaker. So I'm I got to be careful, but
• 30:48
  there was one of the keynote speakers was the CEO investor.
• 30:54
  I got to be careful how the story I share, But they were
• 30:56
  talking about opening up properties and and businesses
• 30:59
  and he's saying, I don't recommend to open up businesses
• 31:02
  in California anymore just because it's so difficult now.
• 31:05
  It's so it's so expensive and you know, they're they're taking
• 31:09
  their businesses and and by the way, this conference was in
• 31:12
  California. It was in California when I was
• 31:16
  when I was speaking, but just because of how some of the laws
• 31:20
  are are just it's a disadvantage to to a business, yeah, to try
• 31:26
  to try and make any profit. It's California, it's more
• 31:28
  towards the employee than the purveyors.
• 31:31
  It up and. If you're an employee, great.
• 31:33
  Great, but for for your blind Cokes is greater.
• 31:35
  But for us like chef, can I take a mental health day today?
• 31:41
  I drank too much liquor yesterday.
• 31:43
  My mind's like can't work great, but it's a Saturday night and we
• 31:47
  have 250. You're the Saute guy.
• 31:49
  You know what I mean? Who's going to work Saute?
• 31:51
  I can't work saute. I'm that's well, like so you
• 31:54
  know, I'm like, ha, great. Can't.
• 31:55
  Ask questions again. We can't ask questions like
• 31:57
  sure, no problem. Yeah, yeah.
• 31:59
  I mean, it's tough. It's it's very tough.
• 32:01
  I remember when I was working in California, I had a guy that he,
• 32:07
  he killed his son. So he comes into work one day
• 32:12
  and he says, hey, you know, he's down.
• 32:14
  It's like my son died and I don't have enough money to bury
• 32:17
  him in Mexico. And he's got this tragic story.
• 32:21
  And I mean, we all felt terrible.
• 32:24
  So me as the chef, you know, one of the chefs, we, we, we got
• 32:29
  together and like, we organized everyone collecting money for
• 32:33
  him to like bury his son, go to Mexico and bury his son.
• 32:39
  And I don't remember how much money we collected from, but he
• 32:41
  was so, so grateful And turned out his son was alive.
• 32:45
  He just wanted, he just wanted a vacation there.
• 32:49
  He wanted to go. To go fund.
• 32:52
  Me, yeah. He just.
• 32:52
  He's like, yeah, I just wanted money to go.
• 32:54
  It was like this, this motherfucker.
• 32:57
  Oh. My.
• 32:58
  God, yeah, I wasn't, I wasn't wise to some of the scams this
• 33:01
  my early chefing days, unfortunately, because I I got,
• 33:05
  I got, you know, that was just one situation where I was taken
• 33:08
  advantage of. But there's been multiple as
• 33:09
  yeah, it kind of hardened me to the point where a lot of chefs
• 33:13
  are. I'm.
• 33:14
  I'm curious if you're the same way where you've you've been
• 33:17
  burned so many times by lies that sometimes you don't believe
• 33:20
  the truth anymore. Yeah, Yeah, right.
• 33:22
  When someone's really sick, you're like, now you're you're
• 33:25
  faking it. Yeah.
• 33:26
  Because, you know, the nine people before that were faking
• 33:29
  their son's death buried over Mexico.
• 33:31
  Does that happen to you? Not lies, but I'm such a
• 33:38
  gullible person and I, I like to see the good in people.
• 33:41
  So, yeah, you know, if they've lied to me about, you know,
• 33:45
  their kid being sick or, you know, my mom's in the hospital,
• 33:49
  you know, having you know what? My cat, my dog.
• 33:53
  I'm like, OK, Just like, take what?
• 33:55
  Take the time you need and do it and we'll figure it out.
• 33:57
  The show go on without you like it has before every other
• 34:01
  Saturday. But when we have those patterns
• 34:03
  is when people will start to like, you know, my boss will be
• 34:06
  like, hey, there's a pattern. Look at the attendance record,
• 34:09
  the attendance tracker. Every Saturday this person's
• 34:12
  calling out. We need to figure out why or sit
• 34:14
  them down and say, hey, what's going on.
• 34:16
  But I'm very, I don't like to push and pry, just give the
• 34:20
  people respect. But I've never been taken
• 34:22
  advantage of as far as like money.
• 34:26
  This one is very giving his his love language is gifts.
• 34:30
  And so he would he would give his all checked if somebody if
• 34:33
  he if he, if they asked him. But you know, that's it's
• 34:36
  nothing wrong with that. We that's kind of like the
• 34:39
  reason why we're in this business, right, Is the
• 34:41
  hospitality business to take care of others, to make people
• 34:43
  happy with food, but with other things too, I guess who's there?
• 34:47
  So I have a question. So people that don't know, and
• 34:49
  you touched on this a little bit earlier, like you were working
• 34:52
  as a line cook and he was a sous chef, but later on you're the
• 34:55
  executive chef and he's a sous chef.
• 34:57
  How is it working together as a couple?
• 35:00
  And, and a lot of couples do work together, but a lot of
• 35:03
  times they're open up a business together.
• 35:05
  This is you guys have worked together in a place where you
• 35:07
  are not the business owner, which sometimes makes the
• 35:10
  dynamic more interesting. Yeah.
• 35:13
  Yeah. I want to ask you first, what
• 35:15
  was it like? First of all, what was it like
• 35:17
  being under in a subordinate position?
• 35:20
  And then how was that when you transitioned to being, you know,
• 35:23
  the boss? So when I met him 13 years ago,
• 35:28
  I was hired on as a lead line cook and he was a sous chef and
• 35:32
  we were platonic and we weren't. We were just coworkers and that
• 35:36
  was it. We work really well together.
• 35:39
  We some people call it dancing in the kitchen.
• 35:43
  Like we really have a groove and we really can understand each
• 35:46
  other without even words having to be spoken.
• 35:50
  I think it's the love for our passion for the, the culinary
• 35:54
  industry and our food and our just of the business in general.
• 35:58
  When he left and I moved on to, that's when we became, that's
• 36:06
  why that's when we became in a relationship.
• 36:09
  Yeah. Situationship.
• 36:11
  Yeah. And.
• 36:13
  Situationship. Yeah, it's a good.
• 36:15
  Work so and that's when our relationship began and we
• 36:19
  worked, we worked together for a couple years and then at the
• 36:24
  Archer, they needed help in pastry.
• 36:27
  And so I said, sure, I'll help for a night.
• 36:29
  And then they asked that after that end of the night, they
• 36:31
  asked me to if I wanted a job there.
• 36:35
  And I was like, sure. So I really wasn't working like
• 36:38
  directly with him, like I was just in a different department.
• 36:40
  But then moving around in the kitchen, being a lead line cook,
• 36:44
  being being on the line, he was my superior.
• 36:48
  He was my boss. I have no problem listening to
• 36:52
  him and and taking directions from him.
• 36:54
  If it was the other way around, I would have other words for you
• 36:58
  to. I love, I love working with him.
• 37:00
  He has so much passion and so much love for his team and his
• 37:04
  and his associates or the the crew he had.
• 37:07
  He works with that. He is he, is he difficult to
• 37:11
  manage? Yes, that's great.
• 37:18
  Does he, does he push back? Which, by the way, don't do
• 37:20
  that. Oh no, no, we, you know, we, we
• 37:25
  fight. We don't fight.
• 37:26
  We fight in a way is about food. Yeah.
• 37:31
  No, this is the first. But do do the the the employees
• 37:34
  see it? The employees see it.
• 37:35
  We were like freakies, like days are alive, no.
• 37:37
  Well, at first nobody knew we were married.
• 37:39
  Yeah, no. One was married first.
• 37:41
  Nobody knew we were married. People were like, I think they
• 37:43
  got something going on. Well, the management knew if.
• 37:46
  People are saying if they're not, they should hook up 'cause
• 37:47
  the way they fight. A lot of the well, the
• 37:50
  management knew, but like a lot of the like the the servers or
• 37:53
  the like the cooks, they didn't know we were married for a long
• 37:56
  time and. But it's it's to the point that
• 38:00
  we just argue about food, you know what I mean?
• 38:04
  It's like. But you guys do this in front of
• 38:06
  the staff. Yeah, that, I mean, that's
• 38:07
  probably not good, I would imagine.
• 38:09
  I know it's not good for. The staff, it wasn't.
• 38:11
  When I go, mom and Dad's fine again.
• 38:13
  That's going to be a long day because.
• 38:14
  You think about how they're viewing it like, oh, they're
• 38:16
  caught in the middle, right? Yeah, we heard that so many
• 38:18
  times, so many times. Somebody and then get in the
• 38:20
  office and have a conversation. Eddie, Liz, you can't be doing
• 38:23
  this. People are uncomfortable when
• 38:25
  you guys are arguing. People don't like the attention.
• 38:29
  You know, it doesn't look good when when you're being
• 38:31
  disappointed into her and she's your boss.
• 38:33
  And that was the biggest. My biggest problem is that.
• 38:35
  Because then it says to to the team they could do it too.
• 38:38
  Yeah, that. Well, he doesn't listen to her.
• 38:40
  So why do I have to listen to her?
• 38:41
  Yeah, right. And I'm very I say that I'm
• 38:45
  stern, but I'm fair. I'm very fair and I was and I've
• 38:48
  been through my leadership in my managing.
• 38:50
  I'm I'm fair to the point you've and not fair anymore.
• 38:55
  Like, and so some people are always like afraid to go into my
• 38:59
  office to be like, Oh, I'm going to get in trouble.
• 39:01
  But then I need to have that open door, open door policy
• 39:03
  where they were so comfortable coming to me with any kind of
• 39:07
  thing, personal or any situation that we're having at work.
• 39:10
  Or you should if I like, I dropped all those pans of, you
• 39:13
  know, seafood on the floor and now we don't have our halibut
• 39:15
  for tonight. It's OK.
• 39:16
  Let me make a phone call. I got you.
• 39:19
  Like, don't worry. It's not the end of the world.
• 39:20
  I always say, you know, we're not saving lives.
• 39:22
  We're just cooking food, so calm down.
• 39:24
  But with him, you know, it was so much.
• 39:28
  It is so much fun. And I miss working with him but
• 39:30
  it was very stressful at times. Yeah, well, I mean, look, I'm
• 39:33
  not here to play intervention, but I will say that when couples
• 39:37
  are working together and the second that they see the
• 39:41
  arguing, it does make it difficult for the people below.
• 39:44
  You guys know that, But also if you don't support her or you
• 39:47
  don't support him. However, however, it it gives
• 39:51
  them the right and it becomes an HR it's like HR fuel.
• 39:54
  Yeah, right. It's like, Oh, I got to I I saw
• 39:57
  this or I got to get out of jail free card now, because I could
• 40:00
  say that it's it's a, it's a very to work together in a, in a
• 40:05
  setting that where you're not the owners.
• 40:08
  I think is very, very difficult. Yeah, on paper, I was executive
• 40:12
  chef. I had an executive sous chef who
• 40:14
  managed him. God bless her soul.
• 40:17
  She's one of my best friends. But there was times where I
• 40:21
  would send him home because he was just being rude or not
• 40:25
  listening, and we would just bicker.
• 40:26
  And I was like, not today. Just if you can't, if you can't
• 40:29
  pull it together, then go home. Because I don't need that
• 40:31
  attitude or that negativity here because it just sets the tone
• 40:33
  for the kitchen for the night. The presidents of of of no
• 40:37
  listening, it's like I need you to listen.
• 40:39
  And so there's been, there was times where I had to send him.
• 40:41
  Home. Slap him around.
• 40:43
  Behind close to. That how how was it for you like
• 40:46
  what's the experience like from and I'm genuinely curious what
• 40:50
  goes like through your mind and the emotions of being the boss
• 40:57
  for her right to later on being subordinate.
• 41:01
  How did that? How did that feel if then also
• 41:03
  being in a relationship? I mean, I love work.
• 41:06
  Relationship. The situationship yeah it's I
• 41:09
  love it you know cuz in the world that we live in you don't
• 41:13
  find it a person like her or a person just you see her everyday
• 41:17
  I see her in the morning work and night.
• 41:20
  The reason why I argue with her because you know how many times
• 41:23
  Sammy in a bowl and a freaking John Gotti yell at each other
• 41:27
  like I'm the boss? Well, I'm the boss, So what the
• 41:29
  fuck we're going to do, right? It's one of those things like I
• 41:33
  want to see the passion or like, you know, what do you think is
• 41:35
  this stupid? It's a horrible idea.
• 41:37
  Who's going to do this? Who's going to do that?
• 41:39
  You know, I, I know I'm not the nicest person in the world, but
• 41:43
  I will tell you the truth. If that hurts your feelings, I'm
• 41:46
  sorry, but this is the way I wanted to do.
• 41:48
  If this is not, I'm going to fight for that itch.
• 41:50
  I'm going to fight for that dish.
• 41:52
  I'm going to fight for that Jew at 9:00.
• 41:54
  If I have to get sent home, fuck it, I want it right there.
• 41:57
  Eddie, go home, buy a piece of mouth.
• 42:00
  And I always want to be hurt cuz in the kitchen I grew up in,
• 42:04
  it's hard to put your voice in the plate cuz there's so many
• 42:07
  guys in the kitchen. And that's the reason why I
• 42:10
  always fight for that one item in a dish.
• 42:13
  We're not fight because we don't love each other.
• 42:15
  We fight for the food to make it look good.
• 42:17
  Passion. Passion that you know.
• 42:19
  I do believe that he was proud of me and that he never thought
• 42:23
  like that he deserved it more than me.
• 42:26
  I knew how to play the politics of the kitchen and I and I just
• 42:29
  it's. All politics, yeah.
• 42:31
  That's the one thing I still. Got is the the chef that I took
• 42:33
  he was he was really good and he's a good friend of mine still
• 42:37
  too. But I learned what not to do and
• 42:42
  I just kind of like shadowed him.
• 42:44
  And if you call a mentor, he mentored me and I kind of did
• 42:50
  what he did. And then when he moved on, they
• 42:53
  they could have hired another executive chef, but they said,
• 42:55
  hey, Liz, you know, you've already been here for so long.
• 42:58
  You know, the insurance and outs of this property.
• 43:00
  You've already been doing it for the last six months.
• 43:03
  Do you want, you know, are you interested in taking the
• 43:05
  position? And it's absolutely, it was a
• 43:07
  title move that I never had. And I think it gave me a chance
• 43:12
  to grow as as a as a chef and as a woman in the kitchen to show
• 43:17
  the other woman in the kitchen that they could do it too.
• 43:20
  It's very powerful when a female is a leader.
• 43:24
  It's it's important, I think. Question if if you had to give
• 43:30
  advice to people that were because you've been in two
• 43:33
  worlds, you've been in the very hotel world and you've been in
• 43:36
  the restaurant independent world.
• 43:38
  And to survive in both of those is slightly different,
• 43:41
  especially when you're a new cook and, and especially if you
• 43:44
  go from like independent restaurants to hotels or vice
• 43:46
  versa. The rules, the rules of
• 43:48
  engagement are a little bit different in both of those.
• 43:50
  If you had to give a new person going into hospitality culinary,
• 43:56
  specifically in a hotel, what are some of the things that you
• 43:58
  would advise them on that are probably key differences from
• 44:01
  independent restaurants? Can you repeat the question one
• 44:07
  more time? Yeah.
• 44:09
  How if you were giving advice to a new person in a hotel that
• 44:14
  that's in the culinary that had never worked in a hotel, had
• 44:18
  only worked in independent restaurants, but there's there's
• 44:22
  different survival skills that you need in a hotel than you do
• 44:24
  in an independent restaurant. What are some of those things
• 44:26
  that you would advise them on? That's a really good question
• 44:29
  because you are absolutely right.
• 44:31
  It's two different worlds. A hotel, they have to be ready
• 44:37
  to pivot any minute. I feel like being in a hotel
• 44:41
  you're you're a hotel chef, you know, you're not a line cook or
• 44:48
  a garmugee cook or saute cook in an independent restaurant where
• 44:52
  I feel like in a hotel it's all hands on deck no matter where
• 44:54
  you're at, like where no, no matter where you're needed.
• 44:57
  So giving advice to somebody that is going to be coming from
• 45:02
  an independent restaurant to a hotel, they just have to be
• 45:06
  ready to run. They just have to be ready to to
• 45:09
  say yes, chef or be and go into it with an open mind of wanting
• 45:14
  to learn. Other departments, banquets,
• 45:18
  interim dining, the three meal specialty, whatever the outlet
• 45:24
  is at the hotel. Mm hmm.
• 45:27
  And I would, I would advise people also, you know, if I
• 45:29
  could add on to that, it's like there's all levels of food in
• 45:32
  the hotel because you know what I'm talking about.
• 45:35
  Like you might be picking up hot wings while plating the foie
• 45:38
  gras. Yeah, you know what I mean?
• 45:40
  Like you're doing the fine because they're coming off the
• 45:42
  same line. And a lot of times you got to be
• 45:44
  able to switch mines to be like, OK, I'm doing hot wings and
• 45:47
  French fries and then next thing right next to me, I got to be
• 45:50
  plating up the fine dining dish. And then that when we're done,
• 45:53
  we got to go help them cut fruit.
• 45:55
  Right. Or do a 20 or do a 25 dinner
• 45:58
  plate up in the back prep tables.
• 46:00
  Right, right you got you got to be well versed in multiple
• 46:03
  skills and be able to switch on a on a dime.
• 46:05
  Yeah, yeah, that's for sure. Yeah, what about the chef?
• 46:08
  So what about the opposite? Someone that was coming from a
• 46:12
  hotel and going into an independent restaurant.
• 46:15
  Oh man. What would you tell them?
• 46:16
  Like, hey, this ain't a hotel. Here are the new rules of the
• 46:19
  game. We don't have HR like 3 leader.
• 46:24
  Probably maybe the most important thing that they need
• 46:27
  to know. Yeah, like there is no HR.
• 46:29
  You're looking, you're looking at HR.
• 46:31
  There's only a Gray area. I can like look away, but you
• 46:34
  know, yeah, it's, it's hotels, more structure and these rules.
• 46:38
  I work in both both worlds and going from a hotel to
• 46:42
  independent is like, there's our margins small, our labor is
• 46:47
  small. I need you to be there seven
• 46:49
  days a week, you know, six hours and 16 hours a day if you need
• 46:52
  to, But you know, it's, it's, it's crazy because no HR, no
• 46:57
  mental health day or whatever. If they do, that means they're
• 47:01
  making big money. If you're small, if you're a
• 47:03
  small mommy and pop, you know, hey, I pay you, you know,
• 47:07
  $80,000 to help me run. You call me out sick on your
• 47:10
  freaking second day. Hell no.
• 47:12
  I need you to be here. I'm paying you good money if not
• 47:16
  your 24 hour notice and I will work the line until I find
• 47:19
  someone. You know, I'm a cuss you out
• 47:21
  plenty of times. You know, I'm saying that's the
• 47:24
  independent restaurant. You know, it's like it's, it's
• 47:27
  just like you said, anything between the handshake and the
• 47:30
  handshake, anything between those two, it's just service,
• 47:34
  you know, I mean, you leave it on the line, that's it.
• 47:36
  But I, I do think, and we, and we talked about this last night
• 47:40
  a little bit like a part of the book that I'm writing right now
• 47:43
  is that the chef of post 2020 and the chef pre 2020, it's a
• 47:47
  different chef post 2020. I think you, you have to figure
• 47:54
  out new leadership skills because some of the old
• 47:57
  leadership skills don't translate anymore because you're
• 47:59
  dealing with a different generation of, of, of people.
• 48:02
  Just like if you had a time machine and you went back 50
• 48:05
  years, you might need some new leadership skills because it
• 48:08
  was, you know, you're dealing with different times.
• 48:11
  Yeah, I do think that there is an evolving style of management
• 48:15
  now that is different from what it was.
• 48:17
  And like I said, I think 2020 is like a perfect marker point.
• 48:21
  Like you could see what? You could clearly see the way
• 48:23
  kitchens were run before that and the way kitchens are now
• 48:25
  being run after that. True that.
• 48:27
  Yeah, you think that? Yeah, absolutely, pre COVID.
• 48:32
  Oh man, we, we, we. Had a chef throw a hot saute pen
• 48:36
  in him. That's an oil and I got to just
• 48:38
  stand there and take it. I'm like, this is a lawsuit.
• 48:41
  But you know what? I grew up in these generations.
• 48:43
  Like, go ahead. And like then I show up the
• 48:45
  following day. But I think that's what kind of
• 48:46
  like molded me into the leader that I am today to leave with
• 48:51
  compassion and and it really taught me patience.
• 48:54
  It really has taught me not to scream and not you know, I I was
• 49:00
  that chef before to on the past. Where is my food or how when I
• 49:06
  say how long right now, it's not a is a time I need I need a
• 49:09
  time. Yeah.
• 49:10
  How long on this I? Used to.
• 49:11
  I used to say a quantifiable unit of time.
• 49:14
  How long it takes light to cross the width of the electron is how
• 49:18
  specific I need you to be, Yeah. I I sometimes today like to this
• 49:22
  day, like I was telling him the other night, like, man, I want
• 49:25
  to get back there sometimes and just be like, get off a barrel.
• 49:27
  I'll show you how it was done. Like mark your stakes, like come
• 49:30
  on, let's go. But it's like right now, Chef,
• 49:33
  if it's not a time, 3 minutes, 5 minutes, 10 minutes, just tell
• 49:35
  me a time. Yeah, but.
• 49:37
  Almost chef working hard. But I have, I hate that I have
• 49:41
  my watch. I look at the time, I look at
• 49:42
  the tick. I used to work at Palomino when
• 49:45
  I was 16 and they had a ticket stamper.
• 49:47
  So every time we put the salad in the window, it would stamp
• 49:50
  your ticket and they would see like, you know, OK, well, it
• 49:54
  took her 7 minutes, 5 minutes to make the salad.
• 49:57
  I wish that would come back. I would be like so a.
• 50:00
  Lot of people are using the KDS systems.
• 50:03
  Yeah, Aaron Bluedorn told me about them, and I was like, I
• 50:08
  gotta look into it. And then after that, once he
• 50:10
  said that on the show, a lot of chefs started messaging me and
• 50:12
  said this is a game changer, The KDS systems.
• 50:15
  It is. I've never used one, but
• 50:16
  apparently it's like better than the time stamped.
• 50:19
  Yeah, when I when I'm in the Expo Line, it's like after first
• 50:22
  course goes out, I have a habit of writing the time like 33
• 50:26
  circle it. So I know at 10:33 that first
• 50:29
  course walked. So how long from that to when
• 50:31
  the second course is fired, how long it's been or whatever.
• 50:35
  But that time that I remember that, that ticket puncher to
• 50:39
  show you the time, I've never forget that, Yeah.
• 50:42
  In California right now, are they doing?
• 50:44
  I just had this. We were talking about cannabis
• 50:48
  dinners. I'm just wondering a lot of
• 50:49
  restaurants now because I, I know last time I was in San
• 50:51
  Francisco, you go to like the little shop over here where they
• 50:54
  serve whatever, but is that, is that becoming more popular like
• 50:57
  in everyday restaurants? No.
• 50:59
  Not that I know, but there is there's a cannabis tasting menu
• 51:03
  in Oakland, CA and that's and it was printed in the newspaper, in
• 51:07
  the blog, but it it hasn't like transformed to hit that head.
• 51:14
  Yet it hasn't taken off. You know, a long time ago, like
• 51:18
  that was like something that I was interested in too, like like
• 51:21
  infused butters and things like that, like cooking with it like,
• 51:26
  but it never took off. I mean, back in the day, I mean,
• 51:29
  you had the I was joking on the podcast, I do.
• 51:32
  And I was like, we're gonna have cocaine dinner soon.
• 51:34
  Yeah. But then he said no, we'll eat.
• 51:36
  But it was wild because back in the days like the, the amount of
• 51:42
  drug use that goes on in kitchens and I, and I don't
• 51:46
  think it's as bad now, but I could be wrong because I'm not
• 51:49
  in kitchens anymore. But I mean, it was wild.
• 51:53
  I mean, especially like when I was coming up in the 90s, you'd
• 51:56
  see crazy shit. I'll tell you a story.
• 51:59
  I was, I was, I was a cook. And I remember it was one of the
• 52:03
  chef's weddings, daughter's wedding.
• 52:05
  And we go and I knock on the door.
• 52:08
  They're like come to the after party or whatever, right?
• 52:10
  So I go and knock on the door and they're like, who is it?
• 52:14
  Who is it? And they're like, oh, it's
• 52:17
  Andre. He's cool.
• 52:17
  Wait a minute. So I go in and it was like the
• 52:20
  chef, the exact zoo, the Sioux. And they're just like there's
• 52:23
  lines of blow everywhere. And, and I, I, I don't do that
• 52:26
  because I was like, I was athletic.
• 52:28
  I was, you know, doing Muay Thai a lot back then.
• 52:30
  So I was like, I don't do that. But I remember looking around
• 52:32
  and like, you want someone like, Nah, I'm cool.
• 52:34
  And I just remember thinking, I got you all I got you bitches.
• 52:37
  I got like, I'm never getting fired now.
• 52:40
  But it was wild. It was the that era of of
• 52:44
  chefing was wild. Oh yeah, it was that's crazy.
• 52:48
  It's it's crazy like going up going up there in the same
• 52:52
  generation like 10 years later. Man, those days I'll if you seen
• 52:58
  waiting, because I experienced that one would opening team and
• 53:02
  there's one restaurant I work right.
• 53:03
  I'm not going to name name names, but they know what to
• 53:06
  talk about. But we were we will go to a
• 53:09
  party client cooks, servers and there were so many drugs.
• 53:13
  I was sick. I was in my Hennessy J days.
• 53:16
  So I bring up fit the Henny because of that cocaine.
• 53:20
  This is my first time saying crystal.
• 53:22
  I'm like showing up to work like yo, let's go.
• 53:25
  I'm like, and he's just like, I got to, I got to quit this job.
• 53:28
  Yeah, I can't. I can't do this in the weekend.
• 53:31
  Yeah, and, and, you know, all joking aside, there's a lot of
• 53:33
  resources out there now for people that need help.
• 53:35
  And Ben's Friends is really good.
• 53:39
  The 86 Club is also doing a lot of really positive things for
• 53:42
  for chefs now. And I think I did a, a
• 53:45
  presentation the other day when I was talking about like 10
• 53:48
  things chefs need to look for in the in the 2026 and beyond.
• 53:53
  And one of the things that I had in my presentation, I, I should
• 53:55
  probably do this for the chef's PSA, but I, I haven't done it.
• 53:58
  One of the things that I did in the the speaking event, one of
• 54:01
  the things that I said at the speaking event was being healthy
• 54:05
  is the new Swanier like being being healthy like people.
• 54:09
  That is that is the new cool. Where before, I think in the
• 54:12
  early days it was like, let's go party, let's get fucked up,
• 54:14
  let's go out from after work, blah, blah, blah.
• 54:16
  And now I think it's like who's going to work out after work?
• 54:18
  Who's going to go run in the morning?
• 54:21
  And it's shifted, which is so positive for the industry 100%.
• 54:25
  When we start wrapping up the show, we get to some of the very
• 54:28
  important questions. So let's see if you guys agree
• 54:32
  or disagree on some certain things.
• 54:34
  We're talking salt in the kitchen, OK?
• 54:36
  Is it Diamond crystal? Is it Morton's Kosher Diamonds?
• 54:40
  Diamond. Right about now, Cisco, which is
• 54:43
  technically the version of Mortons.
• 54:44
  Mortons, Yeah. Would you have a preference for
• 54:47
  you? Crystal diamond, crystal today,
• 54:49
  like everybody, we have Mortons at home and I just figure out
• 54:53
  like because salt here it's much more sorry, I like it's the same
• 54:57
  salt I've been picking up with freaking diamond and like holy,
• 55:02
  maybe it's too much heavy content on the salt because.
• 55:06
  I like the crystals are cut a little different too, yeah.
• 55:08
  Yeah, you're lighter. Yeah, what about tape?
• 55:10
  You green tape, Blue tape? No tape.
• 55:14
  Cut the tape. I'm green green.
• 55:16
  Green I don't cut it though. You RIP it.
• 55:20
  Please don't tell me you RIP it. But I have a green.
• 55:24
  Tape. Why don't you get the tape
• 55:25
  cutters and just. Yeah, we we had blue in the
• 55:29
  restaurant I'm at now. And then when the new chef came,
• 55:31
  he go into those labels was like use by how many days?
• 55:36
  Label date Label date I. Don't like those?
• 55:37
  Ones that, yeah, like Ecolab one or whatever.
• 55:40
  Yeah. Oh, you.
• 55:41
  Can't I miss the tape, even if it's the Scotch tape?
• 55:44
  OK, what about like finishing acid?
• 55:47
  Like lemon vinegar? What do you prefer?
• 55:49
  Lemon, Lemon. Lemon cheeks.
• 55:51
  Lemon cheeks. Yeah, I like lemon cheeks too.
• 55:53
  What? What is something that you guys
• 55:55
  do in the kitchen that you think a lot of people don't do that
• 55:57
  people could learn from? Like is there a culinary tip?
• 56:00
  Like maybe or like it's a maybe it's the way you cook a steak or
• 56:02
  something like that? I mean, you guys have cooked a
• 56:06
  lot of steaks. I'll cook a lot of steaks just
• 56:08
  like temper. You got to temper your steak.
• 56:11
  If you go from Stone Cold Steve Austin for the lowboy to the
• 56:15
  steak said no, no, you got to pull that out like that out.
• 56:19
  Chill for like 1520 minutes at the room temperature.
• 56:21
  Get in there because if you're cooking 8 oz steaks and you put
• 56:24
  in a Montague Yugo or whatever, that's going to be we I've been
• 56:29
  cooking Montague steaks, the ball double brawler.
• 56:31
  It's you got all that steaks, Temporary room 10.
• 56:34
  Yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm learning how to use and this is horrible
• 56:38
  to say a rationale combi oven. So it's like, you know, use it.
• 56:42
  If you have that large piece of equipment that's $24,000, why
• 56:47
  don't you use it the right way or at least learn how to use it.
• 56:50
  Utilize it when you need it, especially for banquets or for
• 56:53
  big parties or you. Guys, you guys do re therm
• 56:56
  banquets? What's that?
• 56:58
  Will the whole. Card in.
• 56:59
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. The Queen Mary's and everything.
• 57:03
  But especially on big days, we have really big days where we
• 57:06
  have large groups in house for lunch.
• 57:08
  So I'm like, I tell the team like, you know, fire 35 chicken
• 57:11
  breasts for add chickens on your Caesar salads.
• 57:14
  They just stick it in there, put a probe in it 1 you know, 160
• 57:17
  and let it let it rest. It's crazy.
• 57:19
  So when I used to manage a large banquet operation and you have
• 57:23
  to factor that in, like, OK, the guarantee for the banquet is
• 57:26
  1000 people. But let we you know, they don't
• 57:29
  really say it's like we prep up to, I don't know, like 5% some
• 57:33
  some months of like we, we do more than 5% of the guarantee
• 57:36
  we'll be ready for. It's like what you got to
• 57:38
  calculate how what percentage is going to be vegetarians?
• 57:40
  What percentage are going to be add chickens, what percentage
• 57:42
  are going to be gluten free? And like you have set plates
• 57:44
  ready to go so you can just switch out shit really quick.
• 57:47
  I forgot about the stuff I don't think about anymore.
• 57:49
  I don't have, I don't have nightmares about that anymore.
• 57:52
  Crazy, crazy to remember that you're bringing back bad
• 57:55
  memories. If you got so Mount Rushmore
• 57:58
  chefs, I'm gonna ask you guys both.
• 57:59
  If you had a Mount Rushmore chefs, I'll start with you.
• 58:02
  If you had four chefs to go on there, who would they be?
• 58:04
  And then I'm gonna ask you the same thing.
• 58:07
  First and foremost to be Tyler will be Charlie Palmer.
• 58:10
  Charlie Palmer. #2 will be Tyler Florence #3 I think this chef
• 58:15
  never got the never got the flowers that he deserved because
• 58:20
  he's been doing it for a long time, is still doing it.
• 58:24
  Mr. Martin Yan, OH. Yeah, Legend, right?
• 58:27
  Legend. With the knife.
• 58:28
  With the butcher knife. 88 second, 88 second chicken.
• 58:31
  Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Cleaver cleaver take.
• 58:35
  It If Martin Yan can't cook, so can you.
• 58:37
  Yeah, You know what I mean? And you know, And Alice Waters
• 58:40
  from California. Yeah, those 4.
• 58:43
  What about you, Chef? Julia Child Yeah, Martha
• 58:47
  Stewart. Some people say she's on a shelf
• 58:49
  but I feel like. She has a catering company,
• 58:51
  right? That's what she got her start.
• 58:52
  She's a entertainer and she loves, you know, the mother the
• 58:57
  the, the intubator of the moms, I guess, you know, making the
• 59:00
  cupcakes and stuff. Anthony Bourdain.
• 59:05
  Yep, A. Legend.
• 59:06
  You know, some misfit like all of us and Charlie Palmer.
• 59:11
  Charlie Palmer. Well, where can people find you?
• 59:14
  On Instagram On Instagram Elizabeth dot Spirit, 283.
• 59:18
  Chef Ed Live, 78, at Instagram. And for people, your Instagram's
• 59:23
  hilarious. Yeah.
• 59:24
  Yeah, it's comedy. It's comedy.
• 59:27
  It's pure comedy. Well thank you all, this is fun.
• 59:29
  Thank you so much, chef. Thank you, chef.
• 59:32
  I hope you enjoyed the episode. If you wanna support Chef's PSA,
• 59:34
  here are some things that you can do.
• 59:36
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• 59:39
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• 59:45
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• 59:49
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• 59:59
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• 1:00:10
  We'll see you next week at the Porno Music, no?
• 1:00:13
  Small Andre in the kitchen mixing drop a chef knowledge, no
• 1:00:17
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  classes in session.