Latest / The Inspired Stories Podcast / From Tour Bus to C-Suite: Building The Ōnin Group's People-First Culture | Staffing Series

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From Tour Bus to C-Suite: Building The Ōnin Group's People-First Culture | Staffing Series · The Inspired Stories Podcast

0:04
Welcome to another edition of Inspired Stories where leaders
0:07
share their experiences so we can learn from their successes,
0:10
how they've overcome adversity, and explore current challenges
0:13
they're facing. Welcome to another edition of
0:18
the Inspired Stories podcast where leaders share their
0:20
experiences so we can learn from their successes and be inspired
0:24
by how they've overcome adversity.
0:26
My name is Anthony Kotaspodi and today's guest is Jim Weaver, the
0:29
CEO of the Onan Group, A Birmingham based group of
0:33
companies focused on staffing and recruiting.
0:36
They make a real difference in people's lives by connecting
0:38
workers with jobs that matter and providing them with life
0:42
changing tools to thrive. They're experts in the light
0:45
industrial staffing sector and they rank as one of the largest
0:48
staffing firms in the US. Jim's professional journey at
0:52
The Onan Group has been 1 of exponential growth for both
0:55
himself and the company. Beginning as a salesperson in
0:59
2001, Jim worked his way up to become the CEO earlier this
1:03
year. Over the past two decades, he's
1:05
played a vital role in building a strong performance based
1:08
culture that has resulted in 100 X growth and recognition as one
1:14
of the nation's best staffing firms to work for, for four
1:17
consecutive years. As CEO, he is focused on
1:20
creating opportunity and empowering leaders at every
1:23
level of the organization, who in turn do the same for their
1:26
team mates, clients and communities on an ever
1:29
increasing scale. Now before we get into all that
1:32
good stuff, today's episode is brought to you by my company,
1:35
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Add Back benefitsagency.com. All right now back to our guest
2:02
today, the CEO of the Onan Group, Jim Weaver.
2:05
I appreciate you making the time to Share your story today.
2:08
Yeah, good to be here. So, Jim, before we talk about
2:11
your time at the Onan Group, I'd like to hear about what first
2:15
drew you to the staffing industry in general.
2:20
I would say desperation, needing to eat drew me to the staffing
2:27
industry before I became a a corporate weenie.
2:32
I was a road musician and I was living in Nashville had had
2:37
finally made it onto a a tour bus with a country artist, Kevin
2:40
Sharp. He had a couple hits in the 90s
2:43
and and so 99 and then 2000. Late in 2000, he just cleaned
2:48
house, just fired his entire band except for one guy he was
2:52
close with and pretty devastating for me.
2:56
And you don't get severance in that world.
2:59
And as I licked my wounds, I looked at my wife and we said,
3:03
wow, we need to pay the rent and eat.
3:06
So I went into and own an office.
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It was one of four at the time in the country in Nashville.
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I knew Lisa, the manager there, and I, I was looking for a
3:17
warehouse job or whatever just to pay the bills.
3:20
And she looked at me and she said, hey, we have a sales
3:22
opening, you shouldn't interview for that job, you'd be great at
3:24
it. And I did and got the gig, took
3:30
the job thinking I would just do it until I got my next Rd. gig.
3:35
And here we are 2323 years later.
3:40
So that's kind of the way life happens.
3:41
But it really was not by design that I got into this business at
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all. So your first role in a staffing
3:49
business was with Onan as a salesperson?
3:53
First role like on the team in staffing I had, I had been a
3:57
temp for some of the big staffing companies I used to
4:01
augment my my spotty musicians income doing doing temp work for
4:09
some of the big guys. But but yeah, this, this was my
4:12
first step being on the team of a staffing company, the internal
4:16
team, yeah. And what is it that you think
4:19
your friend saw in you that said no, no, no, no, not the
4:22
warehouse job for you. I see you in a sales role.
4:27
You know, I, I think I've always been able to connect with
4:31
people, maybe a little lacking in IQ, but EQ is, is probably a,
4:37
a strength of mine. So I, I think that's probably
4:40
what it was. So lacking in IQ, is it safe to
4:46
say that you maybe weren't the best student in the world?
4:49
I, yeah, I, I don't necessarily want to yeah, I, I, I was, you
4:56
know, lower 50% of my high school class and I got into
4:59
college, but I had to really, really work at least the first
5:04
go around. I took a couple shots at, at, at
5:07
college and definitely was not the top of the top of the class.
5:12
Although I think for some reason, I think in my mid 20s or
5:16
30s, maybe a part of my brain downloaded that wasn't there
5:20
early on. And I, I, I think I got smarter
5:23
over time or maybe I just play in the long game and have never
5:26
stopped. Actually, I think that's
5:28
probably what it is. I, I, I really am curious and
5:32
like to learn and I think a lot of people that do really well in
5:35
school, maybe they, they just kind of stop growing, stop
5:39
learning after, after they're, after they graduate.
5:42
And, and maybe that's the difference.
5:43
I've played more of the long game with it.
5:46
You know, that's something I've got two young boys, they're 8:00
5:48
and 10:00 and it's something that I, I try to drill into
5:51
their heads all the time is that, you know, if you're doing
5:54
it right, you're, you never stop learning because they, they
5:57
can't wait till when they get to the end of school so they can be
5:59
done, you know, learning. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no.
6:02
Like, yeah, I want to open your eyes to a whole new world.
6:06
And it kind of like with you, like, you know, I went through
6:08
high school, I went through college, but man, it was after
6:11
college that my eyes really opened up.
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And I'm like, learning is amazing.
6:15
Like when I can choose the things that I want to dive into,
6:19
Yes, it opens a whole new passion.
6:21
Yeah, and that's maybe the thing, you know, high school and
6:24
then my first go around a college, I wasn't necessarily
6:26
interested in most of what I was learning and I was more
6:29
interested in my social life. I played sports, I was in the
6:35
music I like. I worked very hard at those
6:36
things. And school is just not that
6:40
appealing to me. But you're right, once you latch
6:43
on to something that is actually interesting, man, there's
6:48
there's nothing better. Yeah.
6:50
So what was it that was so appealing about the Onan group
6:54
that went from just, you know, thinking OK this is until I find
6:57
my next Rd. gig to now being there over 20 years?
7:03
It was, it was a gradual process.
7:07
I was honestly probably a little just just in a bad place about
7:16
not being on the road anymore. I kind of kind of begrudged
7:19
that. But I started to have a little
7:21
success and Keith and Hugh, the founders saw something in me and
7:28
they were very quick to empower me to run with things and and
7:34
success. We got more success and then my
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wife and I had our first child and and it got to be, you know,
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winning is fun. Making money for the first time
7:45
in my life. It was was nice to not just be
7:50
living hand to mouth and and then as time went on, maybe
7:59
maybe about 10 years in it, it struck me, I was I was in my
8:03
40s, early 40s and I was like, man, you know, if you want to
8:07
have an impact with your life, this is actually a really cool
8:11
business to be in. Like the number of lives we
8:14
touch with our internal employees onanites, we call them
8:19
with teammates. That's a contingent workforce,
8:22
10s of thousands of those every year and then our client
8:26
relationships. If you want to have an impact,
8:29
if done right, the staffing industry really can fulfill that
8:36
that desire to to have some meaning with what what we're
8:40
spending our day on. So let's talk a little bit about
8:43
the owning group because there's now several brands under the
8:46
umbrella. Can you kind of give us a little
8:48
bit of an overview? Our flagship brand is owning
8:52
staffing and then we have some niche brands.
8:57
Owner staffing is probably 85% of our revenue, something like
9:02
that. And then we have niche brands,
9:04
we have AIT and engineering. We actually have two IT brands
9:09
and we have a aerospace brand that is really taken off not no
9:18
pun intended I guess, but that is really been grown explosively
9:23
in the last three years. And then as a we have a
9:27
factoring company which is it was way initially for us to put
9:32
our cash to work. We're we're buying receivables
9:38
in advancing our customers percentage of that.
9:42
And when we get paid, then we, we're, we're charging them
9:46
interest. It's way to keep them in the
9:48
game. We, we started in the energy
9:52
sector with that. And you'd have a big oil company
9:55
that had some, somebody clearing right of ways for them.
9:59
And they'd have 120 day terms. And these guys are running crews
10:03
of 15 people. And they'd run out of money
10:07
halfway through the project. And BP or whoever was good for
10:11
the money. It just, they had to wait for
10:13
it. So then they'd stop and they
10:14
have to bring somebody else in. So what we do is we bridge that
10:17
gap with them. We've expanded now beyond that
10:21
into transportation and we even factor some staffing companies
10:26
ironically. So I think like 85% of our of
10:30
our industry factors payroll. So to give you a sense of our
10:34
financial strength, we have a factoring company.
10:38
You saw so much opportunity there, not only in a revenue
10:41
stream for you, but as a way to support your client base that
10:43
you're like, hey, that you know, there there are lots of stand
10:47
alone factoring companies, but you guys said, hey, let's, let's
10:49
do this in house. We've got the strength and the
10:51
need for. It.
10:54
Now, Jim, there are lots of people who've worked at Onan
10:59
over the years, but you've got kind of a special story.
11:03
I mean, you're the one who kind of started at the bottom and
11:06
then you've worked your way all the way up to CEO.
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What what do you think it is about Jim Weaver that's allowed
11:14
you to ascend the ranks? Say, genetics, good upbringing?
11:19
Do you just have a personality for it?
11:23
I, I think, I definitely, I think there are things you can
11:30
do to increase your return on luck or good or good fortune or
11:36
Providence or whatever you want to.
11:39
And I certainly have been blessed to be in this company.
11:43
And I, I know it could have gone a different way had I not been
11:50
here or in a place like this. I mean, Keith and Hugh have just
11:53
been incredibly gracious to, to give me.
12:00
They saw something. They saw like, OK, this guy is
12:03
could do some stuff and they just open it up man, and let me
12:07
run. So that's been cool.
12:08
But I, I'm a constant learner. I am a hard but smart worker.
12:20
I think I'm, I'm always thinking about, OK, what is my highest
12:30
value activity that I can be doing right now and everything
12:33
else I want to build a system or hire somebody to take care of
12:36
it. So in that way, I've been able
12:38
to scale from an 8 million, you know, leading an $8 million
12:42
company when I started to 750 million or so now.
12:46
That's how I've been able to been able to scale.
12:50
People have always been the priority for me and, and I'm
12:54
really I, I'm, I have a very intense hiring process.
13:02
I'm always recruiting. Our team is, is who has gotten
13:07
us here. So I know that if I can, if I
13:10
can be really diligent at the top of the funnel and hire the
13:13
right people and empower those people within our organization,
13:17
create an ecosystem where great people are attracted, great
13:21
people can do great things and great people are rewarded better
13:26
than they'd be awarded elsewhere.
13:29
That's the type of environment where where good things happen.
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So I don't know, that was a little bit all over the place.
13:36
I think those are kind of the, the main factors for me.
13:42
I'm a real planner too. I'm a, I'm a learner and, and,
13:46
and I'm a planner. I'm very diligent about target
13:50
setting and setting priorities and and visualizing where we
13:54
need to go, communicating that that's so critical to think that
14:02
way, you know, leading a organization.
14:05
You know, to your point, years ago I worked with a business
14:07
coach that taught me something very similar to what you just
14:11
mentioned there, which is think about the task that you do
14:15
throughout the day. Which ones are $10.00 an hour
14:17
test, $100.00 an hour test, $1000 an hour, $10,000 an hour
14:21
test. You don't want to be doing the
14:24
$10.00 an hour test. You want to hire that out or you
14:26
want to build a system to automate it, maybe some
14:28
technology or software. OK, now you get to $100.00 an
14:31
hour task. You know, you kind of get the,
14:34
the level of the thinking you want to be spending your time
14:37
more and more on those $10,000 an hour ideas.
14:41
And for those lower value of things you, you want to be, you
14:45
know, finding good teammates that can take over those for
14:48
you. Or like you said, you're
14:49
building some system, some software, some processes that,
14:52
that automate those. So it's it's out of your mind
14:55
and you don't have to expend any mental energy.
14:58
You know, you know, it's interesting too as, as if you're
15:00
in a rapidly growing company and you're in leadership in a
15:03
rapidly growing company, you're always find yourself in new
15:06
territory and you you question whether OK, is this, am I moving
15:11
beyond my operating range here? Like is this the end of the
15:14
runway for me? And a question I would ask
15:17
myself and I it would need to be adapted for each individual.
15:21
But a question I've been asking myself for years is how would
15:27
the C OK, maybe, maybe I am out of my depth here, but how would
15:32
if, if I were a billion CEO of a billion dollar company, how
15:36
would I think about this problem?
15:38
How would I approach it? And that little exercise of, of
15:43
opening that up, well, I might not think about, but billion
15:48
dollar CEO, they would think about it this way.
15:49
And, and, and over the like, that's it hasn't quite
15:54
manifested yet. But you know, that's been a,
15:56
that's been a question I've, I've asked myself along the way
15:59
to continue to try to elevate and, and, and be able to
16:04
navigate new, new territory. Almost inviting yourself to step
16:08
into a different persona. Yeah.
16:11
Do you ever, is there one particular or a couple of
16:15
particular business owners that you will visualize when you sort
16:19
of think about what would a billion dollar the CEO of a
16:22
billion dollar company do or is it more of a generic thing?
16:28
Well, it it, it probably shifts and changes based on who I'm
16:33
listening to or thinking about right now.
16:35
I mean, I, there's a guy who I've gotten to be friends with.
16:39
He was actually on my podcast, Bill Kennedy.
16:42
He's CEO of a, of a roughly $3 billion, he's APE company CEO.
16:50
So he comes in, he looks to unlock value.
16:53
It's a three to five year run and then he goes and does the
16:55
next one. But he's a fascinating way of,
16:57
of dissecting a business and looking from the outside.
17:00
And he's a great book that I, I kind of, I, I found myself
17:05
thinking what would Bill do in the last year?
17:09
And then, you know, I, I just finished Elon's biography a
17:14
couple months ago. I mean, that guy is just
17:18
superhuman. It's beyond, it's a trillion
17:22
dollar CEO, right, But. I think I saw an article just
17:26
this morning that said he's the first person to hit a net worth
17:30
of $400 billion. Unbelievable personal net worth
17:35
and then his company's. Yeah, certainly.
17:37
Don't even have a house, it's just amazing.
17:42
So tell me, you know, what is it that you got?
17:45
Well, actually, before we go there, you just mentioned your
17:48
podcast. And so I want to give a shout
17:50
out to it. Tell tell us the name and where
17:51
people can find it. Yeah, real leadership and we're
17:56
giving a voice to leaders in the real economy, companies that
18:00
make, move and process things. I don't think there's been
18:03
enough attention given to them. That's our client base, that's
18:06
our love that space. And so we have C level
18:12
executives from those companies on we, we put out, you know, a
18:16
couple, we try to put out a couple episodes a month.
18:18
We've had some great guests on. You can find them on all on all
18:21
the major platforms. So real leadership podcast,
18:24
Spotify, Apple, any of the major platforms, we're putting that
18:28
out. You can go to my LinkedIn page
18:30
too. And I, I always post when, when
18:32
we're releasing a episode, but it's been a lot of fun.
18:35
It's been a lot of fun to get to know for me personally, to get
18:37
to know these folks at a level. It's very hard to maybe some of
18:41
the motivation for you to do what you do that we wouldn't,
18:45
it's conversations you wouldn't have otherwise.
18:47
So it's been been fun for me. Yeah.
18:49
And we'll include links to Jim's LinkedIn page as well as to his
18:53
podcast in the show notes, folks.
18:55
Thank you. So what is it that sets you guys
18:59
apart? What are you guys doing that's
19:00
different that has allowed for such incredible growth?
19:04
Well, you know, we have two groups that we serve in our in
19:10
our business. You know, we have two prior 2
19:13
primary kind of constituents. You have the client base and
19:17
then you have our contingent workforce.
19:19
We call them teammates. So and there's differentiators
19:22
for both of them. They are interrelated, but with
19:25
our continued workforce, they choose us.
19:27
I think because of two clear differentiators.
19:29
First onanites, that's our internal team.
19:32
We're we're really connected to our purpose, create opportunity,
19:37
empower people. We we're locked in our values.
19:41
One of our values is service is a really critical value.
19:45
And because of those things, that connection to our purpose,
19:49
I think generally we just as hokey as it sound, we're which
19:53
is nicer to people that walk into our branch.
19:56
And you know, honestly, that goes a long way, especially with
20:02
the entry level worker who maybe is not getting served in that
20:08
way. Typically, that's human.
20:11
Beings treat them as. Human beings, yeah.
20:13
Yeah, exactly. Treat them as how you want to
20:15
be. Treated yeah, it's it's like it
20:17
should be a no brainer, but it's not for a lot of but but it
20:23
really is front and Center for us.
20:25
And so the and then the other perhaps more objective
20:28
differentiator for our team mates is our life changing
20:31
benefits. You mentioned it in the intro,
20:34
you know, all staffing companies have some sort of benefits and I
20:36
know you're a, a staffing, you know, benefit or you're a
20:39
benefit company, which is which is great.
20:43
Here's the differentiator with with what we offer, ours are
20:47
usable and affordable. And I would say the litmus test
20:52
of whether benefits are valuable to the workforce is enrollment
20:57
rate. And you will be hard pressed to
21:00
find a staffing company with more than 5% enrollment and
21:03
health benefits. We have over 70% enrollment in
21:09
our health benefits. It's a proprietary program, so
21:13
I'm not competing with you on it.
21:17
That that we built and managed. We started a workforce, their
21:20
health profile, how long they they're typically with us as a
21:23
teammate, what they'll want to use while with us.
21:26
Then we went to work and we cut out one of our partners has a
21:29
buddy who's a broker kind of gave us the insider game and we
21:33
cut out every single third party who's mooching off the system
21:37
and we built the plan from there.
21:39
So for less than $18.00 a week, we provide our teammates with
21:43
medical, dental, vision, Teladoc, EAP, legal support.
21:51
If they're with us long enough, you know, enrollment rates not
21:53
as high in our four O 1K, but they can, they have access to
21:56
our four O 1K. So it's, it's beyond what any of
22:00
our competitors are doing. And, and the, the impact we we
22:04
found was in the year that we introduced it, our, our
22:07
retention metric that we use is average length of deployment.
22:10
That number went from 97 days to 129 days.
22:14
It's a 33% increase in retention the year that we introduced it.
22:18
So very, very impactful and that kind of naturally leads me to
22:24
why our customers choose us, our clients, they don't want a
22:31
commodity staffing relationship. Our clients tend to maybe be a
22:37
little more concerned about the human side of things.
22:39
They want their continued workforce taken care of.
22:43
And then there's also a benefit, there's a business benefit to
22:46
that too. Our relationship with the
22:48
workforce means when they have, when they put their foot on the
22:52
gas and they need us to deliver, we can deliver better because we
22:57
have better relationships generally with with the
23:01
workforce. You know, of course.
23:03
And on top of that, we, you know, we have, we're on the
23:07
leading edge of technology and, and we have a great marketing
23:10
team and, and we have some really innovative recruiting
23:13
retention programs. But, but I would say those are
23:17
technology is an accelerator, right?
23:19
It's not, it's not differentiated, it's accelerator
23:22
what you have going on. Novel programs are great, but
23:25
we're in the people business and any staffing program thrives or
23:29
fails based on the engagement of the local team.
23:33
And we've built an award-winning meritocracy where every single
23:36
Onanite has a long term development plan.
23:39
We call it a tour of duty where we deliberately connect their
23:43
career progression to them delivering for our clients and
23:47
impacting our workforce. And the deal with every single
23:51
Onanite is you help us grow and prosper, we'll help you grow and
23:55
prosper. And we formalize this as a as a
23:58
document, as an agreement, as a three to five year plan
24:01
typically. And we've operated like that and
24:04
we've built a kind of ownership mindset by operating like that
24:07
for almost 30 years now. But last year we took that
24:13
ownership thing to the next level by becoming an ESOP.
24:15
So we are an employee owned company now.
24:19
We're making Onanite's literal partners in the business and big
24:23
picture, the engagement of our team really I think is the the
24:27
secret sauce in terms of why our customers are choosing us.
24:35
It it translates to us delivering and you take care of
24:39
your people that take care of your customers.
24:41
Couple of follow up questions for you there.
24:42
Jim. What does it look like in in
24:45
practical terms when you're talking about that three to five
24:50
year plan that you do with your employees?
24:53
Can you walk me through maybe a specific example without using
24:56
anybody's name? Sure.
24:58
Well, the, the question is if you're really so this is based
25:03
on AI read a book by Reid Huffman called The Alliance,
25:08
which is totally, it's one of the best, best, most impactful
25:13
books I ever read. And it, you know, when you read
25:16
a book and it and it just sort of gives a language and a
25:19
framework to the way you already think about something, it's
25:21
like, OK, yeah, but that book is what we we built this around.
25:25
And the, the, the initial question is, what do you want to
25:30
do next? What are you working toward?
25:32
Whether that's with us or with somebody else?
25:37
And, and, and we we sit down, we talk through what do you want to
25:41
do next? What are you working toward?
25:44
And and then we look at what we have available and we say, well,
25:48
if you want to come work with us as you're getting out of college
25:51
and you have an HR degree, but you can't get a job and human
25:55
resources because you don't have any experience.
25:56
So give us three years as a recruiter and you'll learn this,
26:01
this, this, this and this. And through that, you'll gain
26:06
this experience and you'll be in a position where you can land
26:10
that entry level human resource job.
26:13
Or perhaps you'll want to be with, stay with us and become an
26:17
on site manager or a staffing supervisor or a branch manager,
26:21
a business manager with us. So we, we, it's like, where are
26:24
you going? Here's where we're going.
26:27
If there's enough overlap there, then that's the basis of that.
26:32
You help us grow and prosper. We'll help you grow and prosper.
26:35
So, and we'll give, we'll frame out like a current state of the
26:39
business or the position. We'll frame out our goals for
26:43
that business unit and how their, what their specific
26:48
contribution would be to that. And then we frame out these are
26:52
the things you're going to get from this and the opportunities
26:55
that could open up. So it's a, it's a, you know, 2
27:00
1/2 page, a three page document that we, we, we walk through.
27:05
You mentioned before that you've got a pretty intense hiring
27:08
process. You're always recruiting.
27:10
What does that process look like?
27:14
The so the alliance is the first book.
27:17
The second book is top grading or who was the follow up to that
27:22
by by Bradford Smart. But I've been a top grader for
27:26
many, many years and. Explain what that means.
27:31
Jim Top. Grading is the the partners here
27:37
call it Jim's adoption process. The concept with top grading is
27:44
you want to methodically uncover patterns, trajectory.
27:53
You methodically uncover patterns because you you want
27:55
to. You want to know with reasonable
27:58
certainty what you're getting. Nobody's perfect, but instead of
28:02
kind of these voodoo hiring practices of, you know, tell me
28:06
about your sock drawer or you know, that that kind of crap,
28:09
you know, we it's you're methodically looking for
28:12
patterns of the types of environments they thrived in,
28:16
the types of managers they've worked well in.
28:19
If they've had conflict, where's that been?
28:28
If it, it's amazing if you'll ask these same, you know,
28:32
biggest wins in retrospect, what would you do differently if you
28:36
could do it over again? You know, you're looking for,
28:38
and I preface it with like, I'm looking for self-awareness so
28:42
you can identify a growth mindset and you walk
28:46
methodically through their career path, every job.
28:51
And it's remarkable. You ask those same questions.
28:54
You dig the patterns that will emerge.
28:56
It's like it, it's so, so I because that's, that's our best
29:01
indicator of what somebody's going to do next.
29:02
And then so that's the first phase walking through that.
29:06
Then we'll do a personality profile and we have kind of
29:10
benchmark profiles for our position.
29:13
And you look where maybe they're out and you take that, that gap
29:18
and maybe where they're out of the stereotype doesn't mean it's
29:20
a done, it's a it kills the deal.
29:22
But well, then we'll come back for a behavioral interview that
29:27
fills in the gaps of concern from the story interview, you
29:31
call it. That's that uncovering patterns
29:33
interview couples that with the how their profile matched up
29:37
with the position. And then there's a reference
29:42
process that is super effective and then and then higher.
29:48
So it's a pretty involved process.
29:49
We don't that's for management roles that we go management
29:53
roles and up sales roles. It's a pretty in depth process.
29:56
It's very in depth. Yeah, yeah, I'll spend a lot of
29:58
time with someone, but I'm hiring for the next level
30:03
reporting up to me. So obviously, you know, the,
30:06
the, the bigger the role, the more time you have to invest.
30:10
But uncovering patterns man, I think is the biggest key to
30:13
hiring well. And you do that through the
30:16
series of the questionnaires and the personality test and the in
30:19
person behavioral assessment, all of that sort of combines.
30:22
Yeah, yeah. There's an intake form that you
30:28
ask questions about each of their each of their jobs.
30:31
You couple that with the resume and then there's a there's,
30:34
there's questions you ask about each the same questions you're
30:36
asking about each job to uncover those patterns.
30:39
Yeah. I want to talk a little bit more
30:42
about the decision to go ESOP the employee with the employee
30:46
ownership. Some people may not be familiar
30:50
with those. Obviously.
30:52
I think at least part of what you were going after there is
30:55
how do we get our team members more involved, more invested in
31:00
the process. We, you know, we want them to
31:03
truly feel like this is theirs. Beyond that, what was part of
31:09
the the decision making process? What?
31:12
Why did you feel like this was a good move?
31:14
Well, you know, the, the founders, truly Keith and Hugh,
31:19
great guys, still very involved in the business and they truly
31:26
have a heart. They didn't, they're not like
31:30
more more, more guys. You know, they, they love to
31:32
grow, you know, they're very passionate about about growth
31:37
and expanding and they love seeing people's careers blossom
31:45
with us. I think that's a huge motivator
31:47
for them. But now they're getting, but
31:50
they've never taken anything out of the business for years.
31:54
I mean, they paid themselves so little.
31:56
I've paid more in the business than they have up to this up
31:59
till, up till we did the East Side.
32:01
That was true. But for them to start for them
32:05
to, they wanted to be able to take some money out of the
32:08
business, but didn't want to sell to an outside group.
32:12
So it was. And we've, we've got some second
32:14
generation folks that are that are in that are doing very well.
32:17
And, and we want, they wanted to send a message like, Hey, we're
32:25
in this for the 50 year long haul.
32:30
This is the transition plan. We want to keep this thing going
32:34
and we want to bring you guys into the partnership.
32:37
And, and it was a way for them to then get, get some money out
32:43
of the out of the business, reap, reap some of their
32:47
harvest. They could have made a lot more
32:52
money going to market. They could have sold for a lot
32:54
more than what they've taken. But it's that balance for them
32:58
of, of wanting to do right by the people that built this thing
33:03
with them and but still wanting to, you know.
33:08
It's an. It's an admirable approach for
33:10
sure. It's cool too.
33:13
The tax, the, the, the tax sheltering, you know, so the
33:17
ESOP, the percentage of the ESOP, the, the, the net income
33:22
that is the Esop's, the percentage owners, you don't pay
33:26
income tax on that, which is, which is kind of cool too.
33:28
So the overall liability of the, the company, the government,
33:32
it's a really, it's one of the coolest programs.
33:34
I think the government's set up. It's, it's pretty neat.
33:37
You know, they really wanted to create a, a good incentive for
33:41
companies to go this way. And there's some great companies
33:43
that are, that are Esop's. We're the biggest staffing
33:45
company I know of that's an ESOP.
33:48
And so the income tax isn't realized until it's passed along
33:52
to. The ESOP doesn't pay income tax.
33:57
But when those when those distributions go out to the
34:01
employees? Then it's personal, then it's
34:02
yes, yes, yes. As it goes out, yeah.
34:04
When they, when they retire, they leave.
34:06
Yeah, yeah, it's paid. It's paid then.
34:08
So it grows. It grows tax deferred and
34:12
reduces the tax liability for the for the company.
34:16
Yeah, that's a pretty cool approach.
34:17
You know, the other thing that really strikes me if, if my
34:21
research here is correct, the, the owning group has maintained
34:25
a debt free status for a long time.
34:28
And considering the incredible growth that you guys have
34:33
experienced as well as being able to offer factoring to your
34:39
clients and to others. I, I mean, it, it, it seems like
34:43
a little bit of magic. What what's going on there
34:46
behind the scenes that you guys are able to?
34:48
It's discipline, man. It's discipline.
34:53
Well, live on less than what you make.
34:57
It's just like personal finance and, and, and credit to Keith
35:04
and Hugh. I mean, they, they early on a
35:12
lot of owners milk their companies early on.
35:15
They left, they just plowed it back in every year they plowed
35:18
it back in and we grew as an LLC.
35:20
So the, the way the taxes work on an LLC, as long as you, you
35:24
can, you can do a cash method. So as long as you, when you're
35:28
growing like that, the tax liabilities deferred because
35:32
your AR is always a step behind what your output is.
35:35
So you have all this output in cost of running your business
35:41
and your if your cash method, your, your tax liability is, is
35:47
deferred. So that that is helpful too.
35:50
The problem is in most companies, so they were putting
35:53
back money to pay the taxes. The piper eventually, because it
35:56
comes due and it comes due when the economy downturns.
35:59
Because when your revenue drops, then all your AR comes in from
36:04
the year before and then you have this huge gap between
36:06
expenses and the money you have in the house.
36:10
And then you have this. But, but so they, they were able
36:12
to use that strategy and not take, not take money out in, in
36:19
the early years and just built up.
36:21
And then we, we invest in the factoring companies a way that
36:25
we invest as well. So we've been really disciplined
36:29
about, about how we do that. And it's a very liberating
36:32
thing, very liberating. We can play the long game, you
36:36
know, in a down economy like this.
36:38
We're looking for opportunity because we have dry powder for
36:41
acquisitions, talent acquisition to go into new markets.
36:45
We always come out of a down economy like a rocket because
36:52
we're ready. You've been financially
36:54
responsible, you've built those cash reserves and so the real
36:58
opportunities come right when there are downturns.
37:00
I've talked with a number of staffing agencies.
37:02
I'm going to guess your story, you know, coming out of, you
37:06
know, post COVID is, is probably similar.
37:08
You've seen, you know, a downturn, but you know, rather
37:11
than it for you guys being a a time of stress and worry, it's
37:16
like, hey, you know, this, this is going to open up some doors
37:18
for us. It's no fun to be down.
37:24
We're still beating the industry by about 10%, but like, so we'll
37:30
be down 3% this year. The industry deep down I think
37:32
about 14, but it doesn't feel good.
37:37
We're not used to it. But you're right, we're not
37:39
losing sleep over making payroll.
37:42
You know, that's that's for sure.
37:45
Innovation is one of the core values for the Onan Group.
37:48
We've talked about some things you guys have done already with
37:52
the ESOP and you know, the benefits program that you guys
37:54
have built internally. Anything else that comes to mind
37:59
that would be fun to share? I think the coolest thing we
38:03
have going right now is our own in Flex program.
38:06
And I tell you, if the Trump administration is as aggressive
38:13
on immigration as their posturing, I think it's going to
38:18
be really a critical tool just to get more of the workforce off
38:25
the sidelines. But we work with what we do is
38:28
we work with our customers. And we'll set out a set number
38:31
of shifts by position or maybe a department to be build by people
38:36
that want to work part time on demand.
38:40
And we'll build out a flex talent pool who's vetted for
38:44
that particular client, those particular positions.
38:46
Typically it's about four times as many people as we have
38:51
openings. And then every week we load the
38:55
shift openings into our our software into our app Flex
39:01
workers go in, they pick their pick the shifts and and we we're
39:07
in a position to pay the next day, which is is nice.
39:09
It's really quick cash for them. And really the big shocker with
39:14
it was the caliber of employee that we're drawing.
39:21
You know, we're getting stay at home parents, students, side
39:26
hustlers, all of them want flexibility.
39:29
And that flexibility is probably worth, I don't know, this is not
39:34
scientific, but like 4 or $5.00 an hour in.
39:37
In other words, like if you have a position that's open for 19
39:41
bucks an hour, you're able to get someone whose market value
39:44
is like 24 bucks an hour because they value that flexibility.
39:49
It works with their lifestyle. And that has just become more
39:53
and more popular. It's become more and more
39:57
something that the workforce is, is demanding.
39:59
And for our clients, the reduction in overtime cost, the
40:04
reduction in turnover cost, it's been massive.
40:07
We have a food production client, rural rural part of the
40:11
country who was running over 45% turnover monthly.
40:16
And we introduced Flex program, we took like 100 shifts that we
40:21
dedicated to Flex open up that workforce.
40:24
We were able to 'cause they had a core group that was showing up
40:27
consistently. It was like the, the, the
40:31
turning, the the turn was all in.
40:33
It was, it was 45% turnover, about only 15% of the positions,
40:38
you know they. Were turned over a.
40:39
Lot yeah, yeah. And so we did was we said OK,
40:42
let's just make those flex positions.
40:43
We open up this entire workforce forum.
40:47
And because their regular team was no longer taxed with having
40:53
to cover for these knuckleheads that weren't showing up and
40:57
walking off the job, the overtime demand went down,
41:00
burnout went down, the supervisors had better
41:04
disposition and within a couple months our turnover went from 45
41:08
to single digits Oh my gosh yeah, it was.
41:11
And we've seen that in several sites.
41:14
That was the most pointed one. But it's a pretty, it's a pretty
41:18
cool innovation. And I really think in the next
41:23
year it's going to be a major part of the arsenal for us.
41:27
So I want to dig into this a little bit deeper and understand
41:29
it because as you're describing it, my first thought is it kind
41:32
of reminds me of like Uber and Lyft, right?
41:35
Like I talked to a lot of the Uber and Lyft drivers when I get
41:38
a ride and what they like about it is the flexibility and they
41:44
can decide, you know, when they're going to work.
41:46
And this might be a good day for them to work 12 hours straight
41:49
or, you know, tomorrow they may only have a couple hours to
41:52
kill. And you know, but whatever kind
41:55
of fits into their schedule and what other side jobs or family
41:57
obligations that they have. Cool thing with this is you're
42:00
not putting mileage on your car. I mean so many of those jobs
42:03
you're you're using your vehicle to run food or whatever.
42:07
But yeah, it's. Do you feel like you're tapping
42:10
into maybe some of the same? It's the same group.
42:13
It's the same group. And, and so the, the
42:16
breakthrough here is in the approach #1 but I'm going to
42:21
guess there's probably a layer of technology that needed to be
42:24
built in order to enable this kind of a thing, right?
42:28
Because in the past, tell me if I'm wrong, but in a, in a, a
42:32
contract staffing environment, you know, somebody is, they're
42:36
supposed to go there 40 hours a week for, you know, X number of
42:39
weeks in a row. And if you don't fit that 40
42:43
hour a week model, then, well, you're you're just don't work.
42:46
Well, yes, or the alternative to that used to be day labor, like
42:51
the labor halls, like labor ready where you got guys,
42:56
they're hanging out outside the door early, typically sleeping
43:00
off a hangover and they they go in and OK, how many, you know,
43:04
and they put them on a van. And so, and that was our
43:08
resistance to doing this. Honestly, like we don't want to
43:10
get into day labor. It's a different it's a
43:12
different game than when when somebody can wait a week to get
43:17
paid. But but this has the the tech
43:20
enablement of it has that is the thing that's kind of levelled it
43:25
up to where it's really the the gig economy as opposed to a day
43:29
labor scenario. So yeah, it's the the tech has
43:33
unlocked it for sure. Are there particular types of
43:37
work environments where this works better than others?
43:43
We haven't. We've we've, we haven't come
43:49
across somebody where this doesn't.
43:50
Work Yeah yeah as long as the the the client is willing to
43:56
have the flexibility we're we're so it's a lot of companies try
44:00
to do this with just the tech and you really can't you know we
44:04
have an on site presence. We, we've, we've got to be hands
44:08
on coordinating, building the pool, like driving people into
44:12
the talent pool. Still, we're hands on vetting
44:15
the talent. We're on site.
44:18
We're, we're talking to the supervisors and out there
44:22
solving problems and making sure people are in the right spot.
44:24
So it's not a, it's, it's tech enabled, but the tech alone is
44:29
not enough. So as long as, you know, we're
44:33
doing that and we have a customer who's willing to look
44:36
at things a little differently and kind of get out of, get out
44:41
of their habit of how they look at, you know, shifts and, and we
44:46
can bring back, it's a lot of the same people that we're
44:49
bringing back. I guess if it's too, if, if the
44:52
job is, if it takes too long for them to learn the job, if it's.
44:57
A highly skilled job? It's probably you.
44:59
Can't. You can't do it there.
45:00
Say more about what you guys are doing on the ground there in
45:04
person, Well, we with the flex program.
45:08
Yeah, we, we love to have, I mean it's just part of our on
45:11
site solution. Our largest clients we're gonna,
45:14
we're gonna have a on site manager supervise in some cases
45:18
multiple representatives on site.
45:21
So they are, you know, dealing with punch issues, you know,
45:29
with, with clocking in, clocking out issues, helping people get
45:32
to the right spot. I'll tell you, we, we have a, we
45:36
have a thing we say it's another difference.
45:38
You know, every client has a recruiting plan and a retention
45:42
plan. Our on site managers carry a lot
45:47
of that retention responsibility.
45:50
So we're checking in with people, we're checking in with
45:53
managers, supervisors, we want to catch problems when they're
45:57
just little buds as opposed to big, you know, weeds and, and
46:03
the managers ready to let them go.
46:05
We're going to counsel folks. I mean, the, the reality is in
46:10
entry level roles, we've, we got to, in many cases, we've got to
46:18
help people understand what an employer expects of them, you
46:25
know, and they've just never gotten that maybe at home.
46:30
In some cases they just have never got it.
46:32
So we're, we're pretty, pretty patient in doing that.
46:36
And our, our clients don't have time to mess with it.
46:40
They got lines to run and, but we can, it's our job.
46:45
That's a part of our value add where we can get in there and,
46:49
and help bring folks along and, and help understand like, hey,
46:54
we need to sit down and have a discussion between you 2 instead
46:57
of why instead of you walking off or, or whatever.
47:01
Or hey, if you got a transportation issue, let's talk
47:04
about it. Let's figure it out, you know,
47:05
instead of not showing up or whatever.
47:07
So a lot of it's just real practical coaching opportunity
47:15
for our onsites. Want to shift gears for a
47:18
moment, Jim, and be curious to hear about a serious challenge
47:21
that you've worked through, either personal or professional,
47:24
and some lessons that you've learned going through that.
47:30
I probably go back to that day walking into the Onan office up
47:38
in Nashville, you know, 24 years ago, 23 years ago, you know, I
47:44
had put everything into my dream was to be a professional
47:49
musician and I was, I was not some Stoner bonehead, you know,
47:57
I was a serious like I, I really worked very hard at it.
48:01
Lived out of a lived out of a van for three years and played
48:06
any and and would spend 6 to 8 hours a day in the woodshed, you
48:11
know, practicing and I'd finally made it onto a tour bus.
48:19
I my wife and I were. This is why I aligned with the
48:22
whole living and less than what you make thing with the
48:25
business. I aligned real well because my
48:26
wife and I were just buried in high interest debt early on.
48:31
Got on the whole Dave Ramsey program and and when I got fired
48:36
from that gig, we were up to our necks in debt.
48:40
My resume looked awful and it was just a, you know, I had, I
48:48
had kind of climbed the mountain only to have the ground crumbled
48:54
beneath my feet and, and, and slide back down, you know, 1000
49:00
feet or whatever. And it really was for something
49:04
I had poured myself into that much.
49:06
It was, it was absolutely, it was just, it was devastating for
49:10
me. It's not like a, a death or
49:11
something, but it was a death of a dream.
49:14
And but I'm, I'll tell you I'm, I'm thankful for it now.
49:20
You know, a lot of my buddies from back then will call me and
49:25
they want to make a career change now in their 50s.
49:27
It's like, man, I don't know, man.
49:31
It, it's, that's a tough one. So that was like my favorite, if
49:38
it's a favorite failure, that that's probably my favorite
49:40
failure, getting getting fired from that, that road gate
49:44
because it it led to a completely different, different
49:48
path. And I think I have a honestly
49:51
probably have an opportunity for more impact with my role.
49:56
Certainly I'm happily married and have great kids and and
50:02
that's almost impossible. The music business.
50:04
So feel like that was good. At the end of the day, I, I, I
50:11
viewed it, I viewed music as an unrequited lover early on.
50:14
I mean, just, I just was heartbroken.
50:17
But now, 23 years later, man, what a what a blessing getting
50:22
fired from that gig. Yeah, I want to spend just a
50:25
moment more with this story because I think you've hit on
50:27
some really important things that don't get discussed a lot.
50:30
So in your case, it was yeah, you had worked so hard for this
50:34
dream to become a professional musician.
50:37
You know, in some cases, I've heard the stories of, you know,
50:40
people working so hard at a particular sport and this was
50:44
going to be their path interview.
50:46
A lot of business owners have a lot of friends who have been
50:49
through this where the business was that core piece of their
50:53
identity. And then something happens to
50:56
where it all goes away, sometimes slowly, sometimes very
51:00
quickly, like in your case and, you know, use use the word
51:04
devastating. And I, and I feel like it may
51:08
not be a strong enough word because it it's destabilizing
51:13
and disorienting to people, right?
51:14
This was it was not only. My identity.
51:17
It was my identity, yes. That's exactly the point, is
51:20
that not only was it a dream, it it was who you were.
51:24
It's how you identified yourself.
51:26
And now all of a sudden this is gone.
51:28
This thing that Jim Weaver identified himself as, it
51:32
doesn't exist anymore. And now who am I and how do I
51:35
fit into this world? Yeah, yeah, I think Ryan, I
51:39
think it was Ryan Holiday wrote a book or had a saying the
51:43
obstacle is the way. That's a, you know, stoic idea.
51:48
But man, it is so true. And I I, I mean that really,
51:54
that really hit home for me. You know, early on I would get
51:59
pissed about the obstacle and the pain and the and the and
52:05
man, it is empowering to OK, I'm I'm feeling resistance.
52:10
I've there's an obstacle. This actually is the way
52:13
forward. It marks the way forward.
52:15
There is there is something in this that that will navigate me
52:21
for there's an opportunity in this and every time there is
52:28
every time. So for somebody who's listening
52:31
and they're facing their own obstacle right now, that seems
52:34
insurmountable. What advice can you give how to
52:40
see that way? How to stop seeing it as the the
52:43
roadblock that it it seems like it is, and see it for the
52:48
opportunity that it can become? You know, the way you can hear a
52:55
truth and you can sort of ascribe to it logically or you
53:02
can say, OK, yeah. But to connect emotionally with
53:06
it, it's. I wish I could wave a wand and
53:12
and do that for folks. I guess you just got to take it
53:21
from me and everybody else who says it.
53:23
I mean, you listen to anybody who has done anything and they
53:30
will Amen what I'm saying. Tony Robbins likes to say this
53:36
didn't it's not happening to you, it's happening for you.
53:39
And and I think sometimes it takes just meditating on that
53:44
and and really telling yourself that over and over, always going
53:49
back obstacles, the way this is happening to me, this is
53:52
happening for me or, you know, I'm a I'm a I'm a Christian.
53:55
So Romans 812. He's working all things together
54:00
for the good of those God is working all things together for
54:03
the good of those who love him and call it Courtney was
54:05
purpose. So whatever that touchstone
54:08
needs to be, that is a reality. And if you want something
54:13
somebody's got, you do what they did to get what they got.
54:15
And if enough people are saying things like that, you look at
54:19
enough lives, everybody, you know, we are we're forged in
54:24
trial. And you know, you think that I
54:27
heard Jordan Peterson talk about this, how every every biblical
54:34
character, so much of the mythological characters, they're
54:40
all called to adventure. They have a trial that happens
54:44
that calls them into an adventure.
54:46
So I think thinking about it as the adventure, the challenge,
54:51
it's a much more empowering way to think about these things than
54:56
than what was me or how am I going to do this?
55:01
Jim, what's something fun or interesting that most people
55:04
wouldn't know about you? I've had I've had some weird,
55:12
you know, weird jobs for sure. I've dug graves and I've been in
55:19
the circus. So those are probably the two.
55:22
So circus was drumming. I was play, I played drums in
55:25
the circus. That's how I got out East.
55:27
I I was going to school in in Wisconsin was a music.
55:33
I was a business major, but I really wanted to play music and
55:37
I got an opportunity to do a summer gig at an amusement park
55:40
playing with a circus. And then I met this rock'n'roll
55:42
band, dropped out of school, and that's kind of how I went down
55:44
that path. The grave digging came when I
55:49
was a kid. My my parents are really hard
55:51
workers. My dad ended up doing doing real
55:54
well as a financial planner, but early on we were scraping by.
55:57
It was the Carter years and we're our church, their grave
56:01
digger for whatever reason stopped digging graves and and
56:06
it was a farmer that was do we. There was country church up in
56:09
Wisconsin and the guy would used to dig graves with a tractor,
56:13
which is a lot easier. My dad, he's like we need the
56:16
money. It's 150 bucks to dig a grave.
56:19
We'll dig it with pick and shovel and I'll bring Jimmy out,
56:23
you know, with me. And I mean, he paid me 20 bucks
56:25
to help him out. But I'm telling you, dig in.
56:28
AI think it's like 8 foot by 5 foot by 6 foot hole, especially
56:33
in the winter, man, that's some work.
56:36
You're that's that's some work. And we always say, like, more
56:41
people died that year in the church than any year in the and
56:45
we're like, well, God provided, you know.
56:50
I've never dug a grave before, but I have had to dig holes for
56:54
landscaping purposes and whatnot and it's incredible how much
56:59
work that is to work. Like I see people doing it like
57:02
on a movie or ATV scene, I'm like they're going to be there
57:04
for hours. This is not like a 5 minute
57:06
thing. Right.
57:07
It's all day. End of the night.
57:09
We would be digging. Yeah, yeah.
57:12
So Jim, I've just got one more question for you.
57:13
But before I ask it, I want to do 2 things.
57:15
Everybody listening today, I know that you love today's
57:17
content. Hit the like share subscribe
57:19
button on your favorite podcast app.
57:21
Jim. I also want to let people know
57:23
the best way to get in touch with you.
57:24
What would that be? Linkedin's a good spot.
57:28
That's a real good spot. Instagram X would probably be in
57:35
that order from there and can certainly, certainly e-mail me.
57:40
We could put that in the show notes.
57:41
I don't, I don't mind. And our our company website
57:48
www.owninggroup.com and you can you can branch out to all the
57:54
different areas of our business that way and see what we're up
57:57
to. Great.
57:58
Last question for you, Jim. How do you see your business
58:01
evolving in the next couple of years?
58:03
What do you think the big changes are that are coming?
58:11
I think I, I've really settled into the reality that we are in
58:18
a time of a lot of change and we just like, like trying to even
58:27
try to predict that is very difficult.
58:29
I do think with I, I, I think that immigration policy is going
58:37
to tighten up the labor market pretty significantly.
58:40
I think they'll be, again, a lot more demand for what we do, but
58:43
labor is going to be tough to come by.
58:45
I think our flex program is going to be really critical to
58:48
that. I think government policy that
58:50
gets people off the sideline is, you know, we got, I forget what
58:54
the labor participation rate in Alabama is.
58:56
It's like 62%. I mean, it's, we got to get
58:58
people off the sidelines and productive.
59:02
I do think that manufacturing is coming back to the US.
59:06
So that's, that's exciting. That's, that's hopeful.
59:11
We're just going to keep rocking and rolling.
59:14
We're we're real focused right now on growing our existing
59:20
branches, our our branch footprint, not as aggressively
59:26
opening branches. We are pushing into Ohio next
59:29
year and we're looking for acquisition opportunity as well.
59:32
But we're super focused on just executing on the fundamentals.
59:38
We're, we've done a recent shift where we've sort of rebranded
59:43
our branch manager, we call them business managers now and, and
59:46
have taken their empowerment level.
59:49
We're, we're pushing the caliber of person running our branch.
59:54
We've, we've given them a lot of tools and a lot of empowerment
59:58
and, and a higher expectation of, of really running a business
1:00:02
within our business that aligns with the, with the ESOP.
1:00:05
I think that's going to unlock a lot of great, great things.
1:00:09
I want I want 110 branches. Marching forward lockstep,
1:00:16
spreading the love, increasing our our our impact.
1:00:20
The the reality is the contingent workforce is a better
1:00:25
off in their life working with us than anybody else.
1:00:30
And when we have a true partnership relationship with
1:00:34
our clients, we are making their businesses better and so we feel
1:00:42
like we have a moral mandate to grow.
1:00:46
Jim, I want to be the first one to thank you for sharing both
1:00:49
your time and your story with us today.
1:00:51
I really appreciate it. Man, it was my pleasure.
1:00:54
You were very generous with the with the time.
1:00:56
Hopefully, hopefully folks enjoyed it.
1:00:59
Folks, that's the wrap on another episode of the Inspired
1:01:02
Stories podcast. Thanks for learning with us
1:01:04
today.